Is Jon a top 5 swordsman in the show canon? Is he approaching a Selmy or Dayne level of skill and legend?
If so do you believe that to be book canon as well?
But he always just barely wins.
>>71062231
Still better track record than the other "greatest swordsmen" in the show.
There wasn't really anything artful about his swordsmanship in last night's episode. He was just trying not to die, like most people in battle are.
>>71062449
Was there anything artful in the way Barry and Arthur Dayne got cut down? Jon was cut through niggers like butter with some pretty impressive cuts.
Kit Harrington has always displayed some of the best sword choreography in the show. He's gone toe to toe with deadly fighters, and as of now, has the highest killcount in the show. Even Ramsay noted that Jon has developed a reputation for being a fucking beast in combat. It's also worth noting that since coming to the Wall, Jon has taken part in 3 major battles.
At the rate he's going, Jon will probably go down in history as being one of the legendary fighters. Unfortunately he doesn't have the power of Feminism, so he's not unbeatable like Brienne.
>>71062635
He just slashed left and right and his ultra stronk fantasy steel did the rest.
>>71062692
jon is literally the most unbeatable character in this anime
i will remind you to when he was resurrected earlier this season because "muh god needs you"
>>71063408
>anime
>>71063450
He is one of the best for sure.
He has fought not only men, but White Walkers, and won.
>>71063503
me on the left
He was getting his ass kicked by the fookin legend.
>>71063503
The cheerleader effect really doesn't work on men
>>71062089
well all other guys stayed dead when they got stabbed
>>71063503
me as the future rape victim
>>71062231
Beats just barely losing like Dayne and Selmy
>>71063542
To be fair, the White Wankers walked around the north whacking other people's swords and weapons off.
They have probably become very careless fighters due to this.
>>71063542
The Others are fucking shite at combat mate.
As long as you have valyrian steel even fucking Olly could destroy them.
>>71062089
>Undead Mountain
>Arthur Dayne
>Barristan Selmy
>Brienne
>Prime Jaime
>Jon/Hound
>>71063795
Daily reminder that even fatass NEET and starving little girl can kill White Walkers.
>>71063821
is the mountain really that good? i mean sure he wrecks shit hard but any time he's not fighting a shitter he loses
>loras
>hound
>viper
>>71063912
He never fought Loras, they were jousting, and Loras cheated to boot. He would fucking destroy him in an actual fight.
he also didn't lose against sandor, though he probably would've
>>71063912
Lorass is just a pretty show pony. He rapes at tourneys sure, but he's not gonna be the one you want at your back when shit starts getting muddy and bloody.
Loras is like a shit tier version of Rhegar in that regard.
>>71063912
what he did against viper is losing? okay man
>>71063912
>the mountain
>losing to the viper
Pick one
>>71064144
He ended up so dead that they had to resurrect him with shady maester necromancy.
Sounds like a draw at best.
>>71064144
>>71064195
he died , so a draw
>>71064049
>>71064136
Loras is as good as Jaime in his prime, he's not a pretty boy.
The only reason the Mountain almost kills him was because he threw hem off his horse, unarmed and when he was distracted.
And he already fought a real battle and did well at it.
>>71062089
>Is Jon a top 5 swordsman in the show canon?
>DUDE WHO IS SUPER SAYIAN LEVEL 9 WITH APOWER LEVEL OVER 9 TRILLION?!!!!!!!!!!
>>71064267
>Loras is as good as Jaime in his prime, he's not a pretty boy.
No he's not. He's done nothing even close.
>And he already fought a real battle and did well at it.
He's decent, but he's not great. He's not even the best Tyrell.
>>71062089
He has a shitload of endurance, i'll give him that. Or maybe like... tree shitloads of endurance. The way he just kept going in that battle was really impressive, what a fuckin' beast.
I really want a Jon vs a human top tier fighter 1v1. I just can't think of a person left alive and whole enough on the side of his enemies that he could face.
I feel like he needs a fight like that to happen for people to unequivocally agree that Jon is perhaps the top tier of his Era. I'm just getting nervous that it won't happen since he'll most likely be stuck fucking with the others for the rest of the show.
>>71064313
>No he's not. He's done nothing even close.
Jaime himself said that.
>>71062231
wins are wins bruv
>>71064365
Jaime said he reminded him of himself. He never literally said "Loras is just as good as I was".
>>71064255
The mountain killed the viper
The poison killed the mountain
>>71064392
Yeah because he was handsome, cocky and fucking good at the sword.
>>71064295
What are you on about niggot?
>>71064359
Seems like got has really stepped its anime game on
>>71064434
Yes. Loras is good. He's not "Jaime in his prime" good.
He's not even top 5.
>>71064425
if we're talking about swordsmanship, Oberyn clearly beat the Mountain in a straight up fight. If not for Oberyn being retarded he would still be alive, but that's irrelevant when talking about their combat skills.
that karl mutineer would've killed him
>>71064469
He's easily top 5 swordsmen alive right now.
>>71064434
>good on a horse with a lance
OR
>good in bed with a Lance
Ftfy
>>71064549
>being a showfag
>>71064533
In no specific order
>Selmy
>Garlan
>Mountain
>Hound
>Jaime
If you want to use the logic that Jaime doesn't count because of his hand, keep in mind that Loras is currently on the brink of death and covered in burn wounds. He can't even stand.
>>71064482
Keeping your head in the fight until it's over and not letting your guard down is more than half of your skill level. Letting anger, fear, fatigue or any other thing cloud your judgement is the mark of a non top tier scrapper.
Sean Bean and Kit Harrington are the best stage fencers who have been on the show. It's so weird to hear that Jaime is supposed to be the best swordsman in the world when his actor clearly has no idea what he's doing. The choreographer can only do so much with the people he's got
>>71064482
I think it is good possible that a guy like mountain never truly learned to fight. I somewhat can't imagine how he has enough patience to get reached anything. He probably only has learned some crude sword fighting basics and the rest is his size. I am quiet sure that it is never mentioned, he achieved something big in any battle.
He really good for sure but he's not legendary. I don't think he could beat Jaime or Dayne anyone like. I imagine he could beat Ramsay pretty easily but the Hound or maybe Brienne would probably take him.
>>71064623
Tell me where in the book it says anything about Lords having tip tier sword skills. He's a tourney whore, nothing more.
Fucking thread and wiki fans disgust me. You think you know things based on the opinions of others and assumptions and have the balls to call book readers showfags because of your false sense of knowledge.
>>71064722
>old
>who
>dead
>irrelevant
>maimed
>implying those wounds are not a Tyrell ruse
>>71064854
another anon and I can't cite a certain event or passage, but I am quiet sure it was hinted in the books, that he is an extremely goos fighter
>>71064919
It's never really hinted that much at all desu.
He's just good at jousting. Garlan is the top tier Tyrell fighter.
>>71062089
Fookin Legend > Jon. Only reason Jon is alive is because Fookin Legend got Dayne'd.
>>71064854
Multiple times people praised highly his skill with the sword.
So you're not a showfag but a fastreader, I don't even know what's worse.
>>71063912
Pedro was extremely good and trained himself to counter traditional knights, nothing bad about losing against him.
>>71062231
Better than being deader than
>Selmy,
>Dwayne Sword of the Morningstar Johnson
Better to be lucky than dead
>>71064979
I don't recall anybody praising his skill with a sword.
I remember Jaime said he reminded him of himself, but that was more due to his general personality than any feats.
>>71064195
>>71064144
>Being a good fighter involves letting the other beat you almost to death and hoping he happens to walk by your body on a victory lap so you can trip him and kill him
>>71064743
The Mountain didn't do that either though. He just got lucky Oberyn walked too close to him.
>>71064425
Nasty way to go. Ser Gregor was poisoned by his enemies.
>>71064722
>Killed by rich ponces with kitchen knives
>Literally who
>Killed by a bisexual 1/3rd his size
>Beaten by a woman
>Can't even wank without getting tetanus
>>71065183
talking about the books
in the show loras does nothing but sick dick and get fucked by ISIS
>>71065183
>Killed by a swarm of like 50 rich ponces with kitchen knives in a tight ally
Sometimes you don't get to kite your way out to live
>ok
>poison and specific anti-Mountain style
>power of feminism and hulk
>i assume it was prime jaime, otherwise ok
>>71065038
Then perhaps you should read them again.
>>71065183
Loras also got beaten by the same woman though.
He wasn't even wounded like The Hound was.
>>71064425
Poison confirmed best swordsman
>>71065285
I've probably read them more than you m8.
But if you want to link a passage to prove me wrong go ahead.
Nah, it's all about the sword he's carrying. He's not that good.
>>71065283
The poison didn't have effect in that combat.
>anti-Mountain style
You mean not being a fucking retard and fighting with a spear against an enemy that outranges you with the sword?
>>71062089
> Jon a top 5 swordsman
>>71064482
>swordsmanship
u wot m8
>>71065417
Swordsmanship refers to the skills of a swordsman, a person versed in the art of the sword. The term is modern, and as such was mainly used to refer to smallsword fencing, but by extension it can also be applied to any martial art involving the use of a sword. The formation of the English word "swordsman" is parallel to the Latin word gladiator,[1] a term for the professional fighters who fought against each other and a variety of other foes for the entertainment of spectators in the Roman Empire. The word gladiator itself comes from the Latin word gladius, meaning "sword".
>>71065462
but oberyn used a spear
>>71063912
The mountain is a shit fighter. He's just tough as fuck and has Hulk level strength and endurance.
Even GURRM said he thought Gimli would be the Mountain 1v1.
>>71064979
Sauce
I'm asking for one time some person said anything resembling
"Damn that little highgarden faggot sure can swing a sword better than 99% of the known world"
I'll wait
>>71065494
on a scale of anime to my little pony, how autistic are you?
>>71065559
I dunno but you're still wrong. Oberyn was smarter than the mountain not a better swordsman
>>71065089
I would not consider the mountain to be a top tier swordsman. He is a freak that intimidates and overwhelms his opponents with strength, the viper Is similar in the way he uses intensity and speed.
The great warrior swordsmen like Jamie, Selmy, Dayne and others used their various levels of strength, speed, toughness and skill together with brains. I think Jon is in that class
>>71065547
Sure, wait here while I go find a quote out of the thousands of pages for your autistic and oblivious ass.
>>71065412
whos that?
I don't know about the book but in the show it would probably be more or less
Oberyn (didn't even break a sweat beating Clegane)
Zombi Clegane
Hound
Bronn
Jon
Dayne doesn't count IMO
>>71065757
Either that or be considered wrong wikiboi
Let me guess though... you don't even care anymore?
For future reference don't think Loras is a great swordsman if you wanna play the part of a bookfag it will blow your cover.
He grew up in a castle with top-notch martial instruction, he knew for years that he wanted to join the Night's Watch and become a ranger and was therefore training for that, and since joining the Watch he's performed well in plenty of actual combat.
He's not on Dayne's level, but top 5 isn't at all unreasonable.
>>71065982
Daily reminder that Oberon didn't beat The Mountain, he got his skull crushed.
Guys, I know it sucks, but Selmy is dead.
>>71066139
And so is Stannis...
>>71066177
Well yes, but if we're talking about the top 5 living swordsmen in game of thrones, we can't exactly count either of them.
Personally I think Bronn is pretty high up.
>>71065412
>>71065922
>>71066177
And Ramsay, never forgetthi
DUNKMAN THE TALL
>>71062692
>Brienne is unbeatable
The unfortunate truth. I hate that big bitch. The writers made her goddamn invincible
Was Jaime even that great of a swordsman before he lost his hand? I always had the impression that he was quite talented, but his feared reputation came mostly from killing Aerys and his actual skill was somewhat exaggerated.
>>71066128
He did indeed loose. But he whooped that ass too
>>71065982
Mentions Bronn....
Doesn't mention Syrio Forel
>>71066313
No, he was literally the best swordsman in the books.
Either him or Dayne, or Selmy in his prime.
>>71062089
Do the undead count towards his k/d ratio?
>>71066239
>implying I watch game of faggots
she caught my eye while browsing the first page. just give me the name of the actress so I can wank off already
>>71066352
>mentioning the guy that got killed by Meryn FUCKING Trant
okay lmao
>>71065250
Oh, I was confused since we were on the TV board, not the BOOK board.
>>71066128
Doesn't matter that he died. We're talking about best fighters. Dayne also died and he was the best one by far.
>>71066352
Lost to three shitty Knightsguards. Pff
Jon Snow is a completely average swordsman in the books saved by his Valyrian steel. I have no idea what the fuck is going on with this fanfic making every central character a nuclear bomb in power levels.
>>71066728
Show runners are just catering to normies that want wish fulfillment at this point. Why do you think they had jon snow walk up to him slowly and then punch Ramsay into submission when clearly the smart and right move at that point is to order the archerers to riddle his body with arrows. Why do you think they had sansa be there to witness Ramsay getting eaten alive by his dogs?
>>71066312
The worst part is the actress...she always looks like she's crying when she fights. It was so hard to watch her thrash around and sob as she beat the Hound, easily the stupidest scene in the show.
>>71067079
Yeah it's pretty cheap. There is a certain appeal in the books that the main characters aren't great swordsmen or fighters. They're actually quite average and thus in great danger when facing greater enemies. None of the Stark children are good swordsmen. Neither was Ned. But fuck if you're making a capeshit-derived fantasy then the main characters must be the best and strongest.
Don't let me even start on Daenerys. Turning her into a feminist icon shows everything wrong with the show and how hard Hack&Hack have misinterpreted the purpose of the story.
>>71062089
He's taken down:
>the half hand
>mad wildlings
>White Walker
>Karl Tanner (albeit without 7 silvers)
>Magnar of the thenns
>Olley, Thorne, Slynt
>Samwell
>Mad Bolton Men
>Ramsey
HE IS THE GOAT
>>71067081
Do not bully mai waifu.
>>71067195
>misinterpreted the purpose of the story.
I think they interpreted it just fine, it's not exactly complicated. They simply did not give a shit. Wish fulfillment makes them more money.
>>71066312
>>71067081
> I am so threatened by women that I see everything as a SJW conspiracy.
Is it really so inconceivable that a freakishly large and presumably physically strong woman who has been training to fight since childhood, with one of the best swords, with some of the best armor; is actually good at fighting?
I don't generally like SJW pandering but /tv/ is just as paranoid and vindictive as the SJW crowd. It's a fantasy universe. Not everything is a conspiracy. She's a cool character with cool fights and interesting dialog. I'm sorry your oneitis broke up with/rejected you but maybe your childish inability to drop any issue, however small, was a contribution to that.
Stop projecting, watch the show or don't.
He's as good as the script needs him to be.
>>71067673
The token female warrior trope isn't even a new thing, I have no idea how people can just see SJW shit in everything. She's the classic brutish woman fighting alongside men. Even with her skill and her status, the men treat her like shit because of her vag and she's rarely ever taken seriously.
Also people say she's unbeatable, but Jon's plot armor shields him through entire battles and deadly encounters. It took a large group of his own men to kill him, and they brought the fucker back to life. Brienne has nothing on this.
>>71067673
>Is it really so inconceivable that a freakishly large and presumably physically strong woman who has been training to fight since childhood, with one of the best swords, with some of the best armor; is actually good at fighting?
I think the problem they have with her is that her character was killed off books ago and she was a tragic character that was a true knight. Meanwhile show Brienne teleports all over the place to meet people that she's searching for at the perfect time even when it makes completely no sense.
>>71067195
>Neither was Ned
sure, ned wasnt in the top 10 fighter ranking.
But if you have a top 20 rank then ned would have been in it.
>>71067822
Wait wut. Brienne is dead in the books?
>>71067881
She's as dead as show Stannis. She gets hanged by lady stoneheart.
>>71067814
Oh the roles were reversed /tv/ would explode. Fact is; the Vikings, Chinese, pre-Rome UK, Prussians, and tons of old tribes used female warriors. It's really not that crazy of an idea that a few became good at it
>>71067937
Did she? I thought it ended before we see if she was actually hung.
>>71067195
>>71067877
Ned was pretty average swordsman
>>71067970
>I thought it ended before we see if she was actually hung.
Like I said. She's as dead as show stannis
>>71067987
above average, below great.
he survived too many battles to be "average"
>>71067937
>>71067970
That dude is a retard. Lady Stoneheart let her go. She chose to kill Jamie.
>>71067877
Even then, I'd doubt it. He wasn't a fighter. He only managed to survive against Arthur Dayne because they outnumbered the Kingsguard, he had Ice and Howland Reed to cover him. Ned isn't a fighter. He doesn't particularly care about fighting.
He was however one of the top commanders of Westeros. He would've pushed Tywin's shit in on the field.
>>71067822
> perfect time
> Oh look! River run is being sieged! Perfect timing!
In the amount of time it took her to get to the river lands, Jonsa travelled all over the north (the largest of the 7 kingdoms) and march an army on winterfell. For all the logical loopholes shitposters love to point out, they don't think very logically
>>71067937
Nah, LSH let her go. Brienne meets Jaime in ADWD and led him to a trap.
>>71062089
Nah
>Sandor
>Loras
>Bronn
>Daario
>Brienne
Would all fuck him up. He's better than your average cuck, but nothing spectacular
>>71068089
>implying anybody is talking about her trip to riverun
>implying i'm not talking about her stumbling across stannis for a 1 on 1 meeting in a forest next to a fucking battlefield
>imply i'm not talking about her then stumbling onto sansa and Theon in the same day as they were about tto be captured
>implying i'm not talking about her stumbling onto arya and the hound
But you're right. I'm totally just talking about river run and that's all.
HI PEOPLE DONT FORGET THAT JOHN ASS WAS BEATEN IN A TRAINNING BY LORD OF BONES
>>71068224
Has show Loras ever beaten anybody ever?
what about Drogo?
>>71067673
Yes, it is biologically inconceivable. As physically large as she is, almost any male character would be stronger that her.
JON SNOW IS ARTHUR DAYNE'S SON.
>>71068230
> I sure hope this fictional show isn't full of dramatic suprises!
I swear /tv/ could write this show and, unmitigated financial disaster aside, you'd all still shitpost about it still. It's fantasy fiction anon, it's supposed to be unrealistic
>>71068445
No, but he's still famous for being a great swordsman.
>>71067673
She was beatan by two good man at Riverlands.
She is good, but she is not that good.
>>71068445
Only Renly
>>71068478
and we all know how nature always follows the rules
>>71068569
Not saying she is the best. Just that in context of her background it's not crazy to think that she could be a good fight, maybe even better than some men
>>71067673
lulz women can't fight. they don't have any strength. she'd get rekt in a real fight.
>>71068669
Better than most of man, but in the show she is MUH FEMINISM XENA REBORN
There is difference in protraing good woman like Joanna and make radfem fanfic like D&D are doing
>>71063634
>He was getting his ass kicked by the fookin legend.
The "good" swordsmen in GOT seem to struggle with dirty fighters. Top tier knights will beat other knights who use the same fighting style but the dirty fighters always seem to catch them off guard.
Daario, Bronn, and even the legend of Jin Alley fight without honor. They use speed and dirty tricks to come out on top. Formally trained swordsmen and knights don't seem to be able to cope with this well.
>>71068749
But the fookin legend fight was retarded because Jon had the advantage of range.
When your opponent only has two tiny daggers all you have to do is swing your longsword and not let him close.
>>71065036
>Jon Better than Selmy
Selmy was cut down as an old man 30 years well out of his prime... Old enough to be Jon's grandfather/great grandfather .. And even then, took down 20+ Harpy assassins before he succumbed to
>>71068727
There's that projection I was talking about.
>>71068714
Flawless logic
>>71066638
Thinking that Syrio is actually dead....
>>71068876
>he thinks women can fight
hahahahahahahaha!
>>71066638
that's not fair he didn't have a sword
>>71062089
Sandor Clegane would bootyblast Jon Snow.
>>71068669
Most men don't have an armor like her, a valyrian steel sword and the training she has.
She's a good fighter, but she shouldn't be such a good fighter as the show makes her up to be.
>>71068069
In the show he was holding his own against younger, prime Jaime. Did Ned really carry Ice into battle? If so he must have been pretty fucking strong
>>71067079
This thread confuses me... Even more so after watching the latest episode.
What I saw and what I have seen Jon Snu excel at is not skill but just a mix of luck and bravery.
The Battle of the Bastards scene following Jon as he trudged around featured multiple gags in which he clearly should have died and was un-ironically rescued by dumb luck.
His kill count is high, but a lot of his kills have been complete "barely justs" and near-miss aversions either by luck or maybe his flight instinct knowing when to duck.
If the show-runners are trying to show him as an exceptionally great skilled fighter, they aren't doing a good job of it.
I think they're just showing a guy with absolutely no fear or hesitation going into suicidal situations and coming out on top because of the plot armor.
As the Dragons arrive, and shit hits the fan, Jon Snow will get a major amory and weapon upgrade to make him the undoubted number 1.
>>71069234
Nah, I think it's said Ice is more like a ceremonial sword, even if valyran steel is much lighter, it must still be darn fucking clumsy to use it.
>>71065982
Oberyn didn't use a sword
>>71062089
No.
>In the show
Got rekt by Karl Tanner
>in the books
Got rekt by Mance
>>71069234
Valyrian steel is supposedly very light. In the books, his horse fell over him before going up against Jaime. Jaime would've destroyed Ned in that scenario though.
He's like Ned, a solid enough fighter but not close to the top tier
>>71068976
In a fantasy universe, I would be willing to suspend disbelief. Your fear of women it showing btw
>>71069314
Fuck it, I'm deciding to imagine Ned wielding it one handed like Ike while Robert swings around his 7 foot double sided death-on-a-stick
>>71069428
it's not really a fantasy universe. she's not a fucking elf. she's just a normal woman. and women couldn't fight and never have.
>>71068984
Please.
>any boy whore with a sword
>5 Meryn Traunts
>1 Meryn Traunt
>Syrio Forel = any boy whore without a sword
>>71068714
>lulz women can't fight. they don't have any strength. she'd get rekt in a real fight.
The show literally has a dude strong enough to crush a man's skull with his hands. It's fine
The Viper could easily beat all of them in a fight if does go all autistic like he did against the mountains.
>>71069493
She's not a normal woman, she has the physique of a beast.
That's the only reason she's barely competent on the books.
>>71067673
I like the character in the book, but the actress has probably the worst delivery of any major character in the show and it completely kills any interest I have in her scenes
>>71069360
>Got rekt by Karl Tanner
>implying that any mortal man could ever defeat The Fooking Legend alone
>>71068599
pretty much
daily reminder that world champion women's sports teams are regularly beaten by high school men's sports team. A strong woman vs a weak man? Sure. But a strong woman could never ever beat a strong man without some trickery.
>>71069493
Are you really nitpicking whether or not the show is fantasy? you must have been rejected by women an awful lot
>>71069545
He's literally the strongest person in that universe. >>71069579
Of course she's a normal woman. Look at her. She's just tall. In any fight in a real life scenario she would get killed in seconds.
>>71069650
and were we talking about real life? Those are some shifty goal posts anon
>>71063542
>He has fought not only men, but White Walkers, and won
You mean like Sam?
>>71069749
Lol so it's ok The Mountain has physically impossible strength, but you're furious that a single woman can hang with some men? Whilst wielding Valyrian steel?
Brienne isn't "just tall" by the way, she's a descendant of Ser Duncan the Tall, who was Mountain tier monster strong and big
>>71069852
Ducan was like 7 feet tall. Mountain is reportedly above 8.
>>71069852
>mountain tier
no?
duncan was about 7', slightly taller than sandor, who is thoroughly outclassed by his brother.
>>71069899
>>71069915
So slightly smaller.
The point is, Brienne isn't just a "tall woman".
Complaining about Brienne being able to hang with men (especially when wielding Valyrian steel) is dumb as fuck when you're willing to accept a dude with literally superhuman strength
>>71070025
>7' is "slightly" smaller than 8'
are you retarded lmao
here's a maths lesson for you. as an organism is scaled up, its size increases by a square of the increase in size and its volume increases by a cube of the increase in size.
Gregor in real life would be something like 200 pounds heavier than Duncan.
So we can accept a woman who can walk through fire and a 8 foot tall giant zombie but not a fucking large woman being a good swordsman?
>>71070139
Human beings don't have the strength to crush skulls, simple as
>>71070025
+ magic + dragons + ice zombies + ressurections
The autism here is strong
>>71069749
What about Strong Belwas? The Mountain and Brianne should get together and make more giants.
>>71062089
He's definitely not in book canon. He spars with rattleshirt with a steel sword and gets owned, the valyrian steel sword is what makes him so good
>>71070229
It's not rattleshirt though.
>>71070145
m-muh beminism agenda
Before Brienne had any combat training she broke her betrothed's ribs because he said she needed to be more ladylike.
She would slaughter pigs to get over that womanly need to protect life.
She is a man in my eyes, and big, dickless man
>>71070181
Human beings don't grow to 8 feet tall without genetic disorders. Game of Thrones is a fantasy universe
>>71070145
That's different in my opinion. I can accept elves being strong, or vampires, or werewolves because I know they're supposed to be strong. But she's just a woman. She can't defeat a wet rock without help. My girlfriend needs help opening stuff for fuck's sake.
Arya's probably pretty good by now. Maybe not "kill 25 niggas and keep fighting" good, but good nonetheless.
>>71069579
>She's not a normal woman, she has the physique of a beast.
None of the stronk women who can 'fight' in this series has put any effort into their physique.
e.g. Yara, Brienne, Sneks, Waif, Arya
>>71070313
SHE FUCKING 1V1 BEAT THE HOUND
IN THE BOOKS TOO
>>71070313
Mate how do you think George rr martin would have gotten the jews to make his books into a tv show without having some liberal propaganda?
>>71070313
>But she's just a woman.
No she's not, she's built like a man. She a freak of nature like the mountain.
>>71062089
1. The mountain
2. Brienne of Tarth
3. The Hound
4. Tormund Giantsbane
5. Daario Naharis
6. Jon Snow
>>71068749
no shit, that's literally the major point of the show.
>>71070292
>Human beings don't grow to 8 feet tall without genetic disorders. Game of Thrones is a fantasy universe
Exactly, which is why I can accept that Brienne with her valyrian sword can hang with the dudes
>>71070416
>No she's not, she's built like a man.
Not in the show she's not. In the show she's built like the actress who plays her.
>>71070429
>Tormund Giantsbane
I wouldn't put him above Daario or Jon.
>>71070390
Fan fiction bullshit. >>71070416
I'm not even sure if she works out. She looks like a fat lady. My point is that it could work in the books because you have to imagine it. In the show it doesn't work because you see she's a weakling.
>>71070590
Daario doesn't use a sword and Jon is still young. He's got quite a bit to go before he reaches the potential of a man in his prime.
>>71062089
Alright my negros, it's time to vote.
http://www.strawpoll.me/10539271
>>71070457
The part where Bronn took Jaimie's metal hand and clubbed him with it was a definitive moment.
Jaimie was like 'what the fuck just happened?" and the concept of such a dirty move even existing in swordfight was beyond his comprehension.
>>71062089
It's not book canon. Jon gets embarrassed by mance in the books.
>>71068749
I agree, but Jon has learned his lesson. After all, you see the Hound do a bunch of cool shit like one punch people and grab his opponents sword, and he was formally trained.
>>71070665
You don't need a sword if you're an assassin.
Talking about assassins, pic related would probably beat anyone in a fight. Not in terms of swords but with magic and skill.
>>71067195
>>71062089
Both of his parents are natural warriors (albiet untrained), and he's still young. Mountain, Prime Jaime, Selmy, Hound etc. are all older and experienced.
For example, he's definitely at Jaime's level (if not better) when he was his age, based on Jaime recounting his younger exploits.
At this point in the show, he's near legendary tier.. if not there already.
>>71070588
>>71070644
She's one of the tallest people in the show. Why can you accept her being a freak of nature but can accept elf's being super stronge?
>>71068823
They mention in the featurette of the episode that Jon was at a disadvantage with a longsword because the room was small and full of shit in the way.
>>71070941
>puts on magic plastic surgery mask
>teleports behind you
>"pppssssh nothing personal kid"
>>71069749
Brienne is a descendant of Dunk the Tall, who was one of the best fighters of his era, if not the best.
>>71067987
Your mother was pretty average swordsman.
Jon Snow is definitely among the best swordsmen of the North.
The entire world though? I'm not so sure.
It was established that Jon was easily one of the best swordsmen of the nights watch, due to his upbringing and training. Now that other skilled swordsmen like ned stark, Robb, Lord commander mormont, Karl tanner, etc. are dead, I can't think of anyone who would defeat Jon Snow in a 1vs1 fight.
I think he wouldn't stand a chance against the hound, maybe not even bronn and jorah mormont, maybe not brienne either. They were all shown to be very skilled. Jon is definitely among the most famous though. After the wars are over, nobody will remember bronn, but people will remember the 998th Lord commander of the night's watch, defeater of white walkers, peace maker with the wildlings, and warden of the North.
>>71071198
Because elves aren't human. I know how weak women are in real life.
>>71068846
jon took out like 50 real soldiers instead of some fags with masks
>>71071506
Women are weaker, she's probably at average man level because she's huge.. but she dedicated her life to training.. and she would have had access to the best in Westeros because grandpa was LC of the kingsguard.
>>71071506
She's not normal, that's the whole point. She's the female mountain.
>>71070685
Fixed your strawpoll
http://www.strawpoll.me/10539545
>>71063503
>Mismatched top and bottom
Why do women do this?
>>71071711
>she's probably at average man level because she's huge
Women aren't even at weak man level.
>>71071953
Ask one
Show power levels (current and living)
1. Brianne + Gurlpower
2. Bronn
3. Mountain
4. Jon
5. Hound
Book power levels (current and living)
1. Robert Strong
2. Victarion + Godhand
3. Strong Belwas
4. Barry Stan
5. Dark Star
>>71062231
That's how you level up senpai.
>>71065250
Yup. Two entirely different characters, no point even pretending they might follow the same story arc.
Loras killed the rest of the Rainbow Brigade in the books, failed to kill a girl in the show.
Was the only competent member of the Kingsguard and started teaching Tommen to fight, couldn't overpower a hobo with a stick in the show.
Led a charge through the gates and secured a major victory and sacrificing himself in the process, cried for mercy from bruises and mean words in the show.
Show Loras doesn't even rank as a competent swordsman.
>>71070494
I agree, I wasn't the other guy you were arguing with
>>71062231
High luck stats.
>>71066312
Book Brienne is likable.
She's actually made out to be somewhat gullible and naive.
>>71068555
no he isn't
>>71070025
Guy has giantism. He's basically an evil Andre the giant as he's continuing to grow as he ages and it's painfull and drives him insane, he can't even sleep without using opium that would kill a horse to sleep.
Not like he was raised to be a nice guy to begin with, but the Mountain, is the mountain, beause his father was a dog breeder and applied that logic to breeding strong kids and unlocked giantism
>implying Jon would have stood a chance if Ramsay had time to take his shirt off
>>71070292
Yeah, the Mountain has giantism, just like Tyrion has Dwarfism a genetic disorder and is not some typical fantasy dwarf from Warhammer.
>>71062089
dude took down like 45 guys at the battle
he's pretty good
>>71062089
He has no fighting style. He just do cinematic moves, and since he's the main character, somehow there is always someone waiting at the right spot to be killed by him.
You almost expect him to dash forward like your average anime-ish hack'n'slash character.
>>71062089
Jon seemed to have gotten a massive boost in the show. In the books he seems better than average but gets his shit pushed in hard by Mance in a 1v1. The show has also cut out all the top tier Ironoborn fighters, Garlan Tyrell, and lots of others so at this point given that all the great swordsman are dead or maimed than probably but no book Jon isn't a legend and honestly at 16 would get wrecked in a 1v1 by 13 year old Jaime . Show Jon though is clearly a different thing at this point when it comes to skills and is among the best alive atm but he is no where near to being top 5 in westeros history. Top 5 since the Blackfrye rebellion are.
1.Dayne
2.Aemon
3.Daemon Blackfrye
4.Selmy
5.Jaime
Jon would be a long ways away from any of those men in their primes.
>>71074860
Isn't book Jon barely in his teens?
>>71066313
GRRM flat out said that Jaime is among the greatest swordsman who has ever lived in the history of Westeros. Which sucks cause we hardly seem him fight but him not fighting is a massive part of his arc so it makes sense. He went from among the best to have ever lived to a man who can't even wipe his own ass.
>>71062089
Best swordsman left in the north after years of war. I doubt he'd be too much of a threat to any of the major swordmasters down in the south
>>71071033
Nigger are you serious? Jaime won his first melee tourney at the age of 13. Jaime at 15 fought the mountain of his generation to a standstill. Jaime was a freak of nature.
>>71071712
but the point is that a female mountain is still only a slightly above average man
I'm not even trying to be edgy here
Serena Williams is a freak of nature and she's still probably only like the 100th best Tennis player in the world
Brittney Griner destroys the WNBA but probably couldn't cut it in a top level AAU team
>>71074915
I think he is 16 or 17 but age works differently in the books at least that's what I tell myself cause some shit doesn't make sense like Jaime and Maegor winning a tourney at 13 years old. Best thing about the show is how they aged up the characters. Adults got aged by 10 years and the kids seemed to have gotten aged by 5.
>>71068036
>>71068126
She was hanged and then brought back by Thoros.
When Jaime meets her again it looks like she's aged 10 years. Also she has an ugly scar around her neck. How more obvious can it be?
>>71075208
It certainly justifies Jon's competence upgrade, since him being older means he's had a few more years training with a master at arms
Seems like his skill points were reset after he was resurrected and he opted for a min-maxed melee build with shitty WIS and INT instead of his previous balanced hybrid build with decent command ability.
He has a godly rolls against missile weapons now, though.
>>71066550
Cordelia Hill
>>71071953
I agree. It's so dumb. What was she thinking?
>>71075331
>>71066550
DELETE THIS
>>71074860
>Dayne 2 ranks above Selmy
GERM said that if they fought, Dayne would win a slight majority of the time because his sword, but they're extremely close.
Also why Daemon? All we have to go on is that he beat a Kingsguard in a big duel, and people said he was really good.
The Hound is now the best fighter in the land.
He's a trained knight, but now he's learned the way of dirty tactics like Bronn.
He has the strength, height and now the scumbaggery. Brienne only won because she was a girl and his interior reptilian brain had been programmed not to hit a lady.
But he's past that now. If they ever fought again she's lose real fucking quick as he shoves a sword right up her cunt without any questions.
and you fags act like you don't like this shit
>>71075561
>Brienne only won because she was a girl and his interior reptilian brain had been programmed not to hit a lady.
and the festering injuries, don't forget them
>>71075740
you have to realise that /got/ isn't keeping discussion contained from /tv/, it's keeping the /got/ autists away from /tv/.
People don't create new threads for redundancy's sake, they do it because going to the general is utterly pointless
>>71075528
Dayne with Dawn>Selmy, Dayne without Dawn=Selmy
Anyways the top 3 are they way they are due to their special swords that they have. I actually think all 5 are about the same skill wise as it's not like GRRM to have just one sword fighter clearly be better than the others but with each given their standard equipment then Dayne with Dawn, Daemon with Blackfrye and Aemon with Dark Sister are going to be the best among them. Selmy and Jaime aren't lucky enough to have Valyrian Steel or in the case of Dayne something that is just as good or maybe even better. Daemon gets his mentioned because he is considered to be a legendary fighter. Kind of like Aemon. In fact it seems like GRRM never shows feats for the best just look at Jaime. Jaime was the best fighter alive by the first book but yet we literally never see him fight once in it. Sure he fights but it's away from the pov so we never get to see it. We don't have a lot of feats but the reputation for Daemon carries a lot of weight.
>>71064195
>>71064144
You faggots know damn well that Oberyn only lost because he decided to be arrogant and monologue. He easily chopped down the mountain.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsnaiuPPNr4
bookfags, who are the top ten swordsman to ever exist in the universe? dead or alive?
Dayne
Jaime
Selmy
Dunk the Tall
who else?
>>71075866
Oh, I definitely don't question Aemon, I just think I'd swap Daemon and Barristan.
While your top three do have an edge in Valyrian steel, it's not necessarily a make or break unless it's a very extended duel. When Dayne fought the Smiling Knight for example, they fought until the knight's sword broke on Dawn.
While I think Aemon and Dayne could potentially either beat Barristan outright or the duel would last long enough for their superior weapon to really start coming into play, I think Barristan would beat Daemon before that based on his own impressive reputation and feats.
Other than that, agree.
>>71064425
>>a fucking viper
>>poison so it doesn't matter
You do realize that poison is the only reason vipers are dangerous, right?
Is his kill count already over 100? Must have killed a couple dozen shits during the battle
>>71076078
Off the top of my head...
Dead:
Aemon the Dragonknight
Daemon Blackfyre
Gerold Hightower(>Jaime by admittance)
Alive:
Garlan Tyrell
Greatjon Umber
It also depends on if you're making it exclusively swordsmen, because others such as Robert at his prime are definitely in the top 10, but he used a warhammer for example.
