>Hey dad, there are 5 kings currently claiming rulership over various parts of Westeros, how do you feel about committing our house and thousands of lives we're responsible for to Renly, who has the least viable claim out of all of them? By the way I'm sucking his dick and he has no sisters I could create an heir with after the war
Technically Robb and Balon just wanted independence for their kingdoms.
And Renly was the most popular. Plus Mace and Olenna knew the two fags loved eachother and wanted to use Renly as a pawn to de facto rule Westeros.
>>70919649
>implying Loras had anything to do with that
>implying Loras wasn't sent in to seduce Renly to gain the family political power
>>70919691
>Technically Robb and Balon just wanted independence for their kingdoms.
Nah mon, Robb wanted revenge, and IIRC he also wants to bring his papa body back to home. Nothing else.Sansa will be QUEENINDANORF.
>>70919794
That was before his bannermen named him DAKININDANORF.
>>70919809
If he hadn't done that Stannis would have sided with them and they would have won.
>>70919830
Yes, it was a very stupid strategic move. He should have struck a deal to have some kind of autonomy within the Seven Kingdoms without being de facto independent.
>>70919649
He had an army of 100k men parked near Kings Landing
Strong claim
>>70919649
>least viable claim
He had the second most viable claim after Stannis
>>70919649
>Hey dad, if we're one of the wealthiest houses in Westeros why did we outsource our armor department to the Warcraft guys?
>>70919649
Biggest army was his claim
>>70919649
and he was a good friend
I like how the actor stayed skinnyfat throughout the show even though he played a knight.
>>70919649
Is there a worse character in all of game of thrones and the books than renly
>hey big brother, you are a battle hardened warrior and the legitimate heir to the throne
>BUT FUCK YOU I'M MORE POPULAR NOBODY EVEN LIKES YOU I WANNA BE KING I WANNA I WANNA
his assblasted bannermen are even worse
>HOLY SHIT YOU KILLED RENLY WITH A SHADOW MONSTER? HOW COULD YOU KILL YOUR OWN BROTHER YOU SCUMBAG?!?!?
>he was usurping the throne and creating an uncessecary war that would eventually lead to thousands of death because he was a little bitchy priss
>KINSLAYER KINSLAYER!!!
>>70919935
>one's a highly skilled knight
>the other one is a pompous fop that's probably never actually really fought in a battle in his life - faffing about in his tent while his army fought Robert Baratheon, then faffing about in his tent while his army laid seige to dragonstone
>>70919794
Robb literally did want independence for his kingdom. That's the reason he didn't side with Stannis, and the reason Stannis tried to kill him with blood magic. Did you not watch season 2 and 3?
>>70919994
Yes there's a worse character.
Show-Renly.
>>70920000
Checked
>>70919869
Pretty much what Dorne has had.
>>70919994
Daenerys.
>>70919649
Actually, Renly was the best choice as to whom to support for the Tyrells. Renlu was loved by the commoners and nobles, had the support of a shitload of houses, was smart enough and good enough to be a decent king, and had a knack for diplomacy. Plus, Margaery wanted to be Queen, and Joffrey was still betrothed to Sansa. Balon Greyjoy was the king of a pile of rocks, Robb Stark just wanted to avenge his father, and fuck back off to the North (so he wasn't ambitious enough for Margaery, Stannis was married and had even less support than Balon Greyjoy. I don't see how supporting Renly was a bad idea.
>>70919994
Stannis was a butthurt faggot throwing a hissy fit. For all his talk about justice and honor, he cheated his way out of a battle with his brother.
>>70920000
That's really bad logic, even if hes a shitty fighter why would he not want good armor? Are you suggesting his blacksmiths / himself chose to give himself shitty armor?
>>70919649
Let's examine the 5 kings alliegance
> the thrones, Contender : joeffrey promised to sansa
> the greyjoy, promised to nobody, will just fuck the shit up
> stannis already married, already with an heir, strange faith, hand of the king has no noblecred at all
> King in da north, Married and promised to two woman, no actual claim to the seven kingdom crown, back stannis up as Ned would
> Renly, one of the biggest army, liked by the small folk, faith of the seven, second biggest claim to the throne only to stannis, noble credibility to the fullest, single, no chance of bastard since gay as fuck
They were the best choice if you wanted to further the power of your house.
>>70920000
"Fuck you Mace, incredibly wealthy lord of arguably the strongest house in the realm, you're a shitty fighter who leads from the back so you'll just get a shitty suit of armour."
Is that what the blacksmith told him when he commissioned a suit? Did they say the same thing to Tywin?
>>70919869
Fuck independance. King of da norf was just a meme that got carried away because we were salty for Ned death, they should just have allied with stannis like ned would have
>>70921126
Actually, it was forced upon the Starks by their bannermen, who are factually retards. Robb should have bitchslapped the Greatjon and called it a day instead of going along with it.
>>70921107
No but have you ever seen a rich person picking out gym clothes, same thing really
>>70919925
well, that's only if the illegitemacy of tommen, myrcella and joffrey was proven. at the time it was just stannis sending around some letters claiming that was so.
>>70919935
>that fucking wool chainmail
why did they stop caring? I mean the show is still a huge success, why not pour some effort into it
>>70919691
first post best post
There's really nothing more to think about here. Tyrell power plays from day one.
>>70921191
> MFW we learn that it was bran from the future that first started the chant, greatjon was only following him
>>70919649
Was Gerold Hightower also gay?
He looks like Loras
>>70921697
picture
>>70919830
>>70919869
>>70921126
1) Stannis wasn't pressing his claim when Robb was declared KitN. As far as they knew, Stannis was just sitting on Dragonstone, not even commanding the full power of the Stormlands, since Renly had Storm's End and a bigger presence in politics.
2) When Catelyn goes to meet with Stannis, Stannis makes 0 effort to broker an alliance. He makes his grievances with the Starks as clear as to criticize dead Ned:
>"I am sorry for your lord's death," he said, "though Eddard Stark was no friend to me."
>"He was never your enemy, my lord. When the Lords Tyrell and Redwyne held you prisoned in that castle, it was Eddard Stark who broke the siege."
>"At my brother's command, not for love of me. Lord Eddard did his duty, I will not deny it. Did I ever do less? I should have been Robert's Hand."
>"That was your brother's will. Ned never wanted it."
>"Yet he took it. That which should have been mine."
And he implicitly threatens her entire family.
>"If your children are found when I take the city, they shall be sent to you." Alive or dead, his tone implied.
>"My son reigns as King in the North, by the will of our lords and people. He bends the knee to no man, but holds out the hand of friendship to all."
>"Kings have no friends," Stannis said bluntly, "only subjects and enemies."
3) Catelyn puts it all into simple terms:
>"This is folly," Catelyn said sharply. "Lord Tywin sits at Harrenhal with twenty thousand swords. The remnants of the Kingslayer's army have regrouped at the Golden Tooth, another Lannister host gathers beneath the shadow of Casterly Rock, and Cersei and her son hold King's Landing and your precious Iron Throne. You each name yourself king, yet the kingdom bleeds, and no one lifts a sword to defend it but my son."
This is Stannis before his development: stubborn and quite selfish, putting the cart before the horse. It's only Robb that's really fighting against tyranny and for the welfare and freedom of his people.
>>70921654
Because 2 good seasons were enough to hook people, now they can slack off and budget cut into oblivion.
When you think about it, its like new restaurant, they go crazy with food quality and care they provided when they open, but when stream of regular customers is sustaining they drop in quality and go full milking mode.
Renly was in one of the best positions ever. He had strong allies, the biggest armies, and he was willing to negotiate with Robb Stark. Who cares about the "right claim" when your contenders for the throne is an abusive tyrant kid and some edgelord who tells everyone to fuck off.
Renly would have won easy if it wasn't for Stannis' bullshit magic. To be quite frank the way Renly died was very lazy and poor.
>>70919649
>Least viable claim
bastards on the throne not even Baratheon blood and then Stan Stan the man was next then Renly.
Also had more support than all the other fuckers maybe aside from Robb until he went for Western pussy and killed off his distant grand uncle.
>>70921977
Nice post anon.
They could've finished off the Lannisters so easily and either Stan or Renly could be on the throne.
So fucking retarded the small mistakes they made that got them killed.
>>70919794
>>70919809
>>70919830
>>70919869
>>70920005
Reminder that Robb landed a seriously cool alliance with Renly before he was murdered by blood magic.
They would've made westeros great.
They we too pure for their own good
Stannis was just to autistic to side with Robb
>>70921102
Robb would've backed Renly. He sent Cat to strike adeal
>>70921717
Why's his armor so dirty?
>>70921977
>Robb
>fighting for the welfare and freedom of his people
He pushed thousands into what was a personal vendetta. The North's freedom wasn't at risk and their welfare was unaffected by what was happening in King's Landing.
>>70921236
>well, that's only if the illegitemacy of tommen, myrcella and joffrey was proven. at the time it was just stannis sending around some letters claiming that was so.
In fact Stannis hadn't yet made the claim that Joffrey, Myrcella and Tommen were incest bastards, when Renly fled to the Reach and raised a rebellion against Joffrey who at the time, everybody believed was King Robert's legitimate heir to the Iron Throne.
>>70923353
>The North's freedom wasn't at risk and their welfare was unaffected by what was happening in King's Landing.
Nonsense, Joffrey had just executed Eddard without a trial and was holding Sansa and Arya hostage.
If Robb and the North were to let that slide, anything and everything could be done to them.
>>70923764
done to the starks, not the north
>>70923831
>done to the starks, not the north
If Joffrey can do that to Duke Eddard Stark, he can do it to anybody in Westeros.
>>70923905
of course he could, he's the king. Robb could fuck over the average northern nobody too, doesn't mean an uprising is in order.
>>70923955
> of course he could, he's the king. Robb could fuck over the average northern nobody too
No, both the king and the other nobility are bound by laws and while they could get away with executing some peasant, (despite the law) killing another noble is another story.
>doesn't mean an uprising is in order.
Yes, in fact it does mean an uprising is in order.
>>70921654
it's because it's such a success that they can cut corners everywhere, and people will still defend the show to the death
>>70919649
>5 kings
Joffrey: Crazy incest child, not legitimate.
Stannis: The legitimate heir, but decides to start worshiping a kooky cult.
Balon: pirate from a tiny bunch of islands who wants an excuse to "reeve", whoever wins on the mainland won't make the same mistake as Robert by being merciful
Rob: "I will start the war over my father but then betray my father's ideals by making myself king uh duh north" "execute one of my most important vassals" "I will marry a peasant because muh dick even though the fate of millions of my people depend on me making a political marriage beneficial to our success in the war"
Renly: Most of the baratheon bannermen, can form alliances because he is not a heretic, tactically flexible, potential 3some with Oberyn Martell and the promise of punishing the Lannisters. Together the Reach, Renly and Dorne would quickly subdue Stannis and together control the South, then they could ally with the remnants of the Riverlands pillaged by Gregor Clegane to push out the Lannisters and cut off King's landing from the Westerlands. Connect with Rob and the Vale and prepare for the siege of King's Landing
>>70919649
it was all about that peach, desu.
>>70924086
He's a big fruit
>>70924081
> Rob: "I will start the war over my father
Joffrey started the war by beheading Eddard with a trial.
> but then betray my father's ideals by making myself king uh duh north"
Robb’s bannermen declared him king and if he wanted to hold onto their loyalty, he had to go along with it.
Besides, with the Targaryens (and their dragons) gone, there was nothing preventing all the Seven Kingdoms from seceding, especially after Aerys II and now Joffrey.
> ”execute one of my most important vassals"
> ”I will marry a peasant because muh dick even though the fate of millions of my people depend on me making a political marriage beneficial to our success in the war"
He was magicked by Sybell Spicer. There is no way the daughter of their just defeated enemy would be allowed to care for a wounded Robb, nor would the Westerlings allow their virgin daughter to be alone with the rebel and attacker who just sacked their castle.
>>70924729
> ”execute one of my most important vassals"
(Oops, missed that one) While technically honorable, Robb should have listened to Edmure’s advice and locked up Rickard Karstark until the war was won, banishing him to the Nights Watch afterward.
>>70924729
>Lucy Flawless in Spartacus
MYYYYYY DIIIIIIICK
please someone post
>>70924086
There was no peach, mate. :^)
>>70923353
What this guy said >>70923764 >>70923905 >>70924039. In the eyes of the north and much of the realm, Joffrey violated the basic tenets of the feudal order. The ramifications are equivalent to the Red Wedding, or Renly's crown if he had taken the throne: it renders his rule completely unreliable and makes the realm unstable. Why should the vassals serve a liege who murders them? Their relationship is an exchange: order in return for service. Joffrey upended the order.
>He pushed thousands into what was a personal vendetta. The North's freedom wasn't at risk and their welfare was unaffected by what was happening in King's Landing.
A king who can murder the highest lord of a region - the highest lord in the realm, since he was Hand - can kill anyone in the realm, at any time. This is untenable for obvious reasons. Also, if it's a "personal vendetta", it's so for every man in the North. Robb doesn't march them by force: he calls the banners, and they answer (example of someone who doesn't: Walder Frey. Great company). What Joffrey did to the Starks, he did to all their vassals. Literally - the uprising wasn't just fighting the people who imprisoned Ned, it was fighting the people who were spreading fire across the riverlands and killing smallfolk.
For an indication of why they had to rebel, look at Aerys:
1, sabotaged diplomatic and economic deals.
2, harrassed the wives of his followers
3, imprisoned his own wife.
4, had people tortured and murdered on false charges.
5, abused his own wife.
6, imprisoned several vassals in response to a lord demanding justice for his kidnapped sister
7, murdered several lords, brutally, without trial.
8, demanded the heads of their family.
9, when refused, he waged war on them.
10, when defeated, he ordered the annihilation of King's Landing.
That's what happens if you let a tyrant rule with impugnity.
>>70925316
For comparison, look at the Lannisters' track record.
1, attempt to murder a child (Bran)
2, murder a child (Mycah)
3, burn and pillage the riverlands and kill thousands of innocents
4, assassinate the king
5, ignore the king's law and seize the throne by force
6, murder Ned (who has showed mercy and surrendered in good faith)
7, murder several more children (Robert's bastards)
8, impose their completely illegitimate rule knowing it will tear the realm apart and can only be defended with violence
9, do it in a way as to explicitly, flagrantly put House Lannister first, not even the Baratheon crown
10, wanton, cruelties: abuse of captives, murder of smallfolk
11, war crimes: torture, internment and enslavement of smallfolk
12, silencing: murder high- and lowborn alike who have incriminating information
13, plot and enable the Red Wedding, thus breaking the FUNDAMENTAL LAW of Westeros, the last and only means of brokering peace.
14, post-war, carry out a campaign for false peace by subjugation, telling people to lay down their arms or they will (literally) kill their babies.
The Lannisters have already far superseded Aerys' tyranny. They arguably started off worse than him, thanks to Tywin and the Rains of Castamere. Tywin, Joffrey, Cersei, Jaime, Tyrion, Kevan, and more, every one of them is responsible for at least one of the actions on that list.
>>70925316
Aerys is such a fucking madman I really hope Dany goes as crazy when she lands in Westeros
>>70919794
Robb only wanted to secure the Riverlands because his mom came from there, Tywin wasn't helping the situation actually by deciding to fuck up Tully's over his kidnapped wife's son
>>70919649
>implying Loras masterminded it
House Tyrell just wanted to marry into the crown, and Renly was a charismatic leader who could get people to rally behind him
They didn't foresee Stannis using shadow magic to cheat
