So, /tv/? Is the role of the creator to act as a standalone force against the wrath and ignorance of man and bring hope to the masses?
DUDE TARKOVSKY
>to act as a force against the wrath and ignorance of man
can you elaborate?
>>68916757
>Is the role of the creator to act as a standalone force against the wrath and ignorance of man and bring hope to the masses?
Not really, that's very subjective. The role of a creator should be, in the most basic level, to create something that pleases and satisfies what he wants. Creations arise from the need to express, and it almost works as a device to get rid of your own frustrations. And besides, it's not like a skilled creator isn't ignorant in other mediums.
I loved the cinematography in this, but I don't think that it's as good as Ivan's Childhood and Solaris.
>>68916975
Medieval Rus' was whack, yo
>>68916975
OP here. I interpreted the film's ending (the building of the bell by the lone bellmaker after massive destruction) to be a creative response to the basically apocalyptic scenario that we'd been seeing the whole film. While Tartars and Princes were killing and looting, Andrei chose to create an image of happiness (The Feast) instead of one of fear (The Last Judgement). He was a sort of lone wolf artist creating beauty in spite of all the destruction around him.
>>68917067
Bogatyr head smash was such an op attack
>>68917036
In an authoritarian and destructive society, isn't it almost a duty of artists to create great works?
Litterally what was that movie about?
>>68917416
The exploration of seven cardinal vices as viewed or partaken in, and subsequent supplication to God, by Andrei Rublev.
It was quite good.
>>68917556
Best thing to come out of Estonia in years
What did Rublev even do to deserve the title?
Seems like it should have been called Bell Boy: Origins.
>>68917352
Yeah, before they get killed and/or censored. And in a destructive society, yeah, I suppose that you can see it as a "duty" of sorts, but the idea of one great artist changing the vacuous ideals of many is romantic at best and naive at worst.
Not saying that propaganda can't be beautiful, though - just look at Goebbels' propaganda.
>>68917665
He took up 5/6 of the movie and it is mostly about his development. The bell scene just makes the message a little more obvious. Rublev was an icon painter who created the Russian style of icon painting (as opposed to the Byzantine). It seems unimportant, but for Russians it's a huge part of their cultural identity.
>>68917612
>andrei rublev filename
>seventh seal screencap
what
>>68917746
I don't think the artist is supposed to change anything. It's made very clear in the film that all of this violence may well be the work of God, providing a small apocalypse. The artist's job, as far as Tarkovsky is concerned, is at least attempting to find meaning in the hardship.
>>68917790
It's a meme.
>>68917864
I was talking about what drives artists in general, not about the film.
I actually got a different message from the film, and that is that the artist may find his own meaning, and that sometimes the search for that meaning can become the meaning itself. But as a whole, I think that the movie is quite cynical about it and the prologue is proof of that IMO.
>>68917556
Seven cardinal vices? I looked at it more like it was the seven seals in revelation. I think I see where you're coming from, though. What vices are you thinking of?
>>68917985
Ah, fair enough.
>>68918090
Lust=The Feast
Pride=The Last Judgment
Envy=Theophanes the Greek
Gluttony=The Passion According to Andrei
Greed=The Jester
Sloth=The Silence
Wrath=The Raid
And finally, acceptance of faith=The Bell
Gluttony is the only one that I'm a little shaky on, but I think Foma represents it pretty well.
Andrei himself takes part in wrath--the brutal vengeance on that soldier; sloth--not painting/being a lazy fuck; pride--he's acting extremely haughty during this segment.
Skomorokh would be greed--he is not keen on sharing resources and is a general dick about it.
Kirill is envy--He goes mad because he wasn't chosen to the apprenticeship.
Lust is pretty obviously the pagans.
I'm not even religious, but I can't not see it that way.
The prologue is about overreaching one's bounds and crashing hard if you try. Andrei crashes hard at the end, but finally gets his shit together after hearing the bell's music.
>>68918434
Yeah, gluttony was the only reason I wasn't sure about that. WOW, I can't believe I missed that. I was so caught up in the apocalypse thing.
>>68918675
And just to elaborate on that last line, the seven deadly sins exist because they suggest upstaging God.
I could be completely missing the point, but Tarkovsky was a deeply religious person, and like I siad, I just can't unsee it. I haven't read anything on articles in the like that have a similar take, but oh well.
>>68918805
No, I think you're on to something. My interpretation revolves entirely around religion as well. Andrei's own faith and understanding is questioned at the beginning of the film, so its definitely something to keep in mind. It makes sense that his sort of tacit sinning would be emphasized by the burning of his icons and him committing a blatant sin. I think this also coincides with my idea of the apocalypse. All of his sinning takes place in the midst of apocalyptic events and symbols, which culminate in the 7th seal (silence). He wallows in himself until he sees Boriska make a perfect bell without even knowing how. The tolling of the bell is the voice of the Lord that comes after the 7th seal, signifying peace. After hearing the bell and discovering that Boriska did it with no knowledge of bellmaking (presumably guided by the hand of God), Andrei finally achieves humility and understands suffering and God well enough to depict it through his icons.
How did the atheist Soviet Union manage to make better religious films than the supposedly Christian United States?
>>68919181
Yeah, maybe so. They could be compatible in that regard!
I really enjoy that rare 5% of flick/movie/film/cinema/AБCOЛЮTE КИHOГPAФЫ discussion this board plays host to.
>>68919697
Because American Christianity is born from Puritanism which saw worship via aesthetics pursuits as art and music as sinful. You'll notice that American Catholics have made plenty of good films.
>>68919697
That's one director, Tarkovsky.
Scorsese is probably the most famous Catholic director in the states, despite the violence.
Abroad, no doubt the two biggest religious directors are Bresson and Dreyer.
>>68919697
That's actually a major theme in the film. Perhaps you need to see what a world seemingly without God is in order to understand him well enougg to portray him. Also Russian Orthodoxy makes a bigger deal out of symbols than Protestantism and lends itself to self-referential art.
