Did anyone else dislike this movie?
I felt like it tried too hard to be unique. The perfect black and white film quality in 2013, the at times mediocre humour, cliche go to Paris to find yourself crap.
Anyone?
>>66802519
You are 100% correct and that is why I didn't like it. It was also unfunny and contrived with useless side characters that are fairly interchangeable. And Baumbach denying his blatant Carax plagiarism (not even calling it homage) really left a bad taste in my mouth. I'm glad he went back to the funny with While We're Young and Mistress America. Those are FAR superior to Frances Ha.
>>66802671
Agreed.
>>66802519
I don't understand. The whole point of the Paris sequence is that it's mocking the character for following the cliche to go to Paris and find yourself. I mean she goes and has a terrible trip and just ends up wasting a lot of money. How can you be so thick as to misinterpret that scene?
And how does it try too hard to be unique? Baumbach has made a bunch of movies, he clearly felt the black and white aesthetic was the best choice for this particular movie. It's a great movie
>>66802519
I'm biased against Baumbach since he cucked JJL.
But his movies I've seen seem way too preachy and quirky.
>>66802785
preachy? how do you mean?
>>66802746
>You're an asshole because you don't like what I like!
I don't like the fact that they even threw Paris in there as an option. The whole movie shot in black and white in this day and age is pathetic and retarded. We're not in the 50's anymore. Barely anyone besides hipster assholes shoot in black and white.
>It's a great movie
In your opinion. Do you cry each time someone disagrees with you? Grow up.
>>66802785
>Preachy and quirky
Exactly. That's a good way t describe it.
>>66802886
where have I once said that you were an asshole?
it seems like you're getting pretty upset because I pointed out to you something that you pretty blatantly missed due to your obvious lack of any knowledge of how movies work
that thought was confirmed by your absolute retardation in saying things like "hipster assholes shoot in black and white." you watched a real movie and were confused. it's okay.
>>66802856
Imma be honest with you, I've only seen Margot at the Wedding. Preachy probably wasn't the right word. I thought the characters spoke too directly to one another (especially in the climax) and the whole thing was just a sluggish progression.
But that's only one movie of his I've seen and I wasn't really in the mood for it, I only saw it for JJL.
I'll probably checkout Greenberg next.
Armond White thinks Baumbach is an asshole and a bad person. But he's great at sticking to his artistic vision, no matter how cynical.
>>66802938
You didn't literally call me an asshole, but insulted me nonetheless because I don't like your shitty taste in film. I'm not upset, here we are having a civil discussion and you need to rage in here with your autism because someone criticizes your taste in film. The Paris sequence is moronic and "preachy and quirky" is the best way to describe it. If you think "Frances Ha" is a real movie you're an idiot. It's no where near a real movie. If you want to see a real funny, Romantic lack and white film watch Bringing Up Baby which actually is a good film.
You're definitely one of those types who think your independent shitty film taste makes you superior, but it does not, and you're a moron.
>>66803039
Margot is objectively his worst. I think he lost himself in petty conflicts at that point in his career. Greenberg is one of his best.
>>66803096
black*
>>66803096
The fact that you can even compare Frances Ha to Bringing up Baby, 2 films which have nothing in common, makes you look like a cretin.
>>66803110
People should just watch Squid.
I think ultimately Baumbach is an absolute hack but Squid had a really honest energy and rhythm to it.
While We're Young is almost the exact opposite movie that Squid is.
>>66803110
Hey I loved Margot at the Wedding. Jack Black was a despicable character and he played it so well.
What exactly is "preachy" about this film? I would love for someone to actually try to make that argument and utterly fail.
>>66803096
you sound like a very angry little person. Bringing Up Baby is great but I actually think I prefer Frances Ha. Is it because you didn't understand the Proust/Woolf jokes? It is true that you actually need to be fairly literate in order to like some of Baumbach's humour, which is certainly a justifiable thing to complain about. I think Frances Ha is hilarious and affecting though. Also, how on earth is the Paris scene preachy? And you guys should know that "quirky" isn't a criticism. At least come up with some proper criticisms if you're going to critique a movie. You can barely even describe what you dislike about it without resorting to buzz words. Does this have to do with the lack of reading in your life?
Please stop raging out though mate.
>>66803039
Margot at the Wedding is one of his absolute worst movies.
How come you're watching his mid-tier to shit-tier movies before the good stuff?
I'd recommend checking out Kicking and Screaming and Squid and the Whale before moving further. Greenberg is solid but it's not near the quality of the two I just mentioned, or Frances Ha for that matter. His career is a mixed bag for sure but some of his movies are truly great.
>>66802519
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gt2KlkBUgXA
>>66802519
I'm not sure what you mean it was trying too hard to be unique. Explain what parts of the movie are like that.
The cliche of going to Paris was done for a joke, you know that, right? She just goes to Paris to be more spontaneous and experienced but just wastes her money and sleeps all day there.
The movie is just a series of vignettes of a girl who's tries to succeed and fails a lot but still keeps her head up.
>>66802519
>>66802671
These exactly
>>66802519
I don't understand how a normal human being can watch this movie and not completely love the Frances Ha character.
>>66803607
I'll give you my explanation.
I used to be in love with the movie but as I've grown older I've come to realize that almost all of his movies are dishonest and are exploring characters he only understands on a shallow level.
Frances Ha is not a real person. It's just this gen xer trying to make sense of the 21st century to help justify all of his unearned wealth in life.
As I said above, Squid is his only genuine film.
>>66803387
I'm saying it is a far better classic film. Something like Frances Ha does fit in this century. It tries to bring back the "retro" aspect but utterly fails.
>>66803459
I'm not the one who raged and started insulting others based on their film taste. Maybe you should take a dose of your own medicine. The thing with people like you is that you've actually convinced yourself you are "intelligent" because you jerk each other off while yapping about how superior your taste in independent lesser known film is.
Frances Ha is a shitty, cliche film about some dumb broad whose going nowhere in life, and tries too hard to be something it can never be.
Do you so vehemently defend this film because of how the protagonist resonated with you?
>>66803434
I think it came out the same year as Rachel Getting Married which completely wiped the floor with it as a contained family drama. all I remember after watching it is how much more I liked RGM.
>>66803685
>no quixotic stylisation allowed
you're no fun.
>>66803696
Well I guess I missed the boat because I never watched Rachel Getting Married. Heard it was pretty good though. Thanks for the rec.
>>66803689
All of your comments about black and white films being "retro" suggest that you don't really know much about film at all. Is Bela Tarr also trying to be retro?
Also, where in my first post did I insult you at all? I called you "thick" for missing the Paris joke which you so embarrassingly misinterpreted and I stand by that comment. Where did I insult you for your taste in movies though? So far you've raged out in this thread a bunch of times, made inane comparisons between this movie and a movie made decades ago, misinterpreted basic scenes in a simple movie, and then completely changed my words to make me sound like what you've been doing this whole thread.
Every word from you so far has just reassured me in my belief that Frances Ha is a good movie. Stop embarrassing yourself.
>>66803843
Bela Tarr usually has moods in his film to match the black and white aesthetic. What's Baumbach doing with Frances Ha other than ripping off French New Wave? Hey Kevin Smith filmed Clerks in black and white because it was cheap. What's Baumbach's excuse?
>>66803753
watch it as soon as humanly possible. It's kinda like a Dogme film if you know those? Anne Hathaway has never been better. The diagetic music is stitched in so seamlessly it's masterful. It's long but you really feel like you're part of the family by the end of it.
>>66802519
criticizing a film or filmmaker for "trying too hard" is just as infantile as calling a film or filmmaker pretentious. the film was a failure, in my view, because the narrative fell into cliche without elevating or offering any original insight.
>>66802671
what Carax plagiarism? i've never heard it before.
>>66803880
You've sold it pretty well. I watched Celebration recently which is THE Dogme film from my understanding. It was very enjoyable. I'll start searching for a good copy.
>>66802746
this obviously
These last 3 movies, a loose trilogy of sorts have been great
>>66803919
this scene https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gt2KlkBUgXA
>>66803727
I don't mind that as long as it is coming from a positive attitude.
Frances Ha is all about shitting on dumb, white, poor, millennials that he doesn't actually understand or relate with.
It's all a way to justify his own fortunes from afar.
I used to LOVE Noah until I saw While We're Young and really put all the pieces together about who he really is.
Squid properly tells his story.
He's a fraud that doesn't understand his father.
It's such a great little movie.
>>66803843
The "Paris Joke" is exactly why I hate the movie, along with all the other "I want to be an artist but my boss is holding me back" crap. Most of the characters are insufferable. Just face it, your taste in film sucks if you think this is a good movie.
I'm trying to imagine these posts being an IRL conversation and laughing wondering who you all are.
Loved the movie, only film aside from Annie Hall Ive seen more than once in the past few years.
>>66804040
>I'm trying to imagine these posts being an IRL conversation and laughing wondering who you all are.
It's a depressing image for sure.
>>66803929
yes! exactly. it's kinda like the American Festen.
Also watch After The Wedding if you want another good wedding Dogme. based Mads Mikkelsen is in it. All You Need Is Love is also great but it's sort of like a chick flick Dogme.
>>66803685
Of course she's not a real person. No movie character is ever a real person. Travis Bickle is not a real person. John Travolta's character in Blow out is not a real person...etc...etc..
>>66804126
whoops I meant "Love Is All You Need". Susanne Bier did both that and After The Wedding.
>>66803875
I'm sure there are any number of reasons for making that choice. For one Baumbach is clearly emulating Woody Allen's Manhattan and liked its aesthetic and he felt his movie should have a similar one. By the way, what was Woody Allen's excuse for filming Manhattan in black and white?
Also, seriously, that's your justification of Tarr's aesthetic? Okay, then I too will say Frances Ha's black and white is to capture different moods, which I do actually believe is the case.
>>66804135
Right, I get what you're saying.
My point is that the director is trying to showcase a real stereotype in today's culture, but instead of really understanding that person for what they are, he's just projecting his own insecurities to make up for it.
The reason I don't like any of his other films besides Squid is that they don't have any balls.
Noah is a very frightened man that makes some extremely fragile movies that are intellectually and emotionally equivalent to junk food.
Like yeah, they're cute, but ultimately causes more harm to society than good.
>>66804214
Frances Ha's black and white didn't capture any mood. It was shit and it wouldn't have made a difference if it were filmed in colour.
>>66804251
I don't think he ever understood what Frances Ha was about.
To me it's about him feeling rejected by the 21st century and young women in general.
If he could have just accepted that about himself it would have been a great movie!
>>66804214
>what was Woody Allen's excuse for filming Manhattan in black and white?
there is none. Manhattan is Woody Allen's most overrated movie by far.
>>66804284
Your skills in discussion are really pretty staggering good sir.
"I have nothing to say but your taste in film is shit!"
>>66804251
>Noah is a very frightened man that makes some extremely fragile movies that are intellectually and emotionally equivalent to junk food
not that guy you replied to but this is an understandable reaction to his work I guess, though I would argue the purpose of each of his films is the opposite: he deconstructs his archetypes in every film so that they may rebuild themselves from the ground up by the end of it.
This is especially true of Greenberg, Frances, Mistress & While We Were Young. They all dismantle the protagonist's naivete in order to instill the characters with a more mature worldview.
>>66804312
incorrect
this is such a silly discussion. I mean why don't filmmakers have to justify why they filmed something in colour? it's a part of the look of the movie. it is not something that can be discussed as justifiably as choices the director made with the way the movie is actually shot, framed, etc.
>>66804251
Maybe the reason I enjoyed Frances Ha so much is because I didn't know shit about the director's personal life at the time.
>>66804354
Yeah but Squid was the only time he was brave enough to actually make the mark.
The rest of his films are far too masturbatory.
I don't know what happened to him after Squid. I guess the success just went to his head.
>>66804406
>basing enjoyment of a movie off of the director's own life
>>66804406
Or maybe it's because you didn't know enough about your own personal life.
>>66804406
Does that mean that someone watching a Polanski film for the first time now will never be able to enjoy the film for what it is.
>>66804349
Fine you fucking faggot. I'll elaborate.
Frances Ha attempts to create an atmosphere of melancholy feels throughout the film. From the breakup, to her shitty friendship, to her life going nowhere, not being able to make rent, etc. The black and white film according to you plebs is to capture and magnify these feelings, but the reality is that it fails. The reason why Frances Ha was so well received is because of how many people the protagonist can relate to.
She wants to be a dancer, but can barely make rent.
How many people out there want to be artists or musicians but instead became waitresses, baristas or bartenders living in some shitty place? It sucks but that's reality. The fan base which surrounds Frances Ha consists of people who have not achieved their dreams and have had shitty relationships. So it's easy to relate to her.
>>66804452
That's what watching movies is all about.
In this case we're talking about Noah Baumbach as a story teller. All of his movies are about himself.
>>66804544
First, why would the movie be intrinsically bad because the main character can be related to? I don't think the average person can relate to her character all that easily. Are you seriously suggesting that the average person is trying to make an artform their living and struggling with it?
Also, just saying something like "the reality is that it fails," is in absolutely no way an argument. How can you seriously tell me you're elaborating and then your only complaint about the photography is that it "fails." Do you not see how silly this looks?
Frances Ha was well-received because it is an affecting, funny look at the struggles that some people can have after they've graduated from school. It's also a touching look at what it means to be passionate about an artform in a world that is mostly driven by commerce and materialism. Frances Ha would be a good companion piece to Inside Llewyn Davis imo.
>>66804584
Nope, that's not at all what movies are about.
And even if Baumbach's movies are partly about himself, how does that matter?
You sound kinda silly.
>>66804646
Stop making movies, Noah, you're a bad person.
>>66803685
>Frances Ha is not a real person. It's just this gen xer trying to make sense of the 21st century to help justify all of his unearned wealth in life.
She reminds me a lot of my close friend in terms of personality and life, Went through a similar experience before getting her life back on track.
>>66802671
>While We're Young and Mistress America.
>romantic comedies are good
>>66804646
Listen, maybe I hate this movie so much because I don't strive to be unique and don't have to go look at low budget, modern age black and white films to look sophisticated, but maybe, just maybe you should not be such a pleb when it comes to film. The only people who like this movie are artsy faggots.
>>66804824
>Frances Ha appeals to artsy people
don't watch a lot of movies, do ya?
>>66804816
Mistress America wasn't a romantic comedy and neither was While We're Young really.
>>66804872
How does it not? Half the movie is about some borderline alcoholic bimbo (I'm also a borderline alcoholic) trying to "make it" in New York fucking City
>>66804824
Sounds like you got some issues, my friend. Frances Ha is a simple "growing up" movie told in series of connected stories. No more, no less. You seem to be projecting a lot of insecurities or something on to the movie.
>>66804975
>alcoholic bimbo
you sound like a great person and definitely the kind of person that appreciates good art
>>66804002
>"I want to be an artist but my boss is holding me back" crap.
It wasn't her boss holding her back. Her boss had politely tried to usher her to choreography numerous times because she simply wasn't a good enough dancer but she hadn't learned to accept her weaknesses and move on with her life at that point. She was wasting her life chasing a pipe dream that wouldn't happen.
>>66802519
It completely subverts the Paris trip. Back to tweeting about gamer gate faggot
>>66805113
Go be politically correct elsewhere, cuck
>>66805324
lol @ this feminist
Rich people problems: the movie.
Actually, Baumbach is pretty much Rich People Problems: the director
Basically the male equivalent to Sofia Coppola
>>66805631
THANK YOU
>>66805631
This. Also Greta Gerwig pisses me off.
>>66805631
Seems more like American middle class problems with some universal problems most people face in regards to ambition, friends, and love.
>>66805852
Noah is a rich Jew from an "intellectual" family that grew up in Park Slopes.
>>66805778
I hate her because her and Baumbach left JJL after she had a baby.
Nice movie with nice feels, although I can understand people thinking it's shallow.
Baumbach is a hack, doesn't deserve a career, fucking piece of shit
IT'S A CONSPIRACY! WHAT DO YOU THINK ALL OF THOSE BMX PARKS IN THE 90S WERE FOR? FUN? GET REAL. WE'RE ALL GOING TO HAVE GREAT CAREERS AS BMX PARK DAVE GRIGGERS. AND ANOTHER THING. THERE'S A LOT MORE TO THIS IDEA THAN YOU MIGHT THINK. THE BABY BOOMERS WERE RIGHT. THE JEWS DID GLOBAL LARPING. AND OTHER THING. I'M SO SICK OF HEARING ABOUT MY KANYE THIS MY FOUNDING FATHERS THAT. IT'S ALL GOING DOWN BROTHER. THIS SUBMARINE HAS NO STOPS
>>66805960
>I will never be a rich Jew from an "intellectual" family that grew up in Park Slopes
I'm considering suicide
>>66807919
Maybe he'll make a really insulting movie about you and the quirky hip young stereotype that all millennials commit suicide.
I'LL BE THERE FOR YOUUUUUUU
