>TFA $8m DOMESTIC TUESDAY (DOWN 73%), $13m OVERSEAS TUESDAY (DOWN 66%)
It can't keep crashing this hard.
[citation needed]
>>64553100
...Nevermind
>>64553162
http://deadline.com/2016/01/star-wars-overseas-domestic-tuesday-box-office-avatar-1201676837/
>>64553100
>it can't keep crashing
>Already passed Avatar in NA
k
>>64553100
>but muh china
The Flop Awakens
I knew China was racist but wow.
>>64553203
>domestic
>>64553100
Cameronfags are truly pathetic.
Already got BTFO domestically within 3 weeks after release which took Avatar a year to take in.
Now they are comparing their Chink money when TFA hasn't even opened in China yet.
Full damage control
>it's a Star Cucks get BTFO for the 487rd time since Dec. 18 episode
good luck beating Titanic, fags
New franchise blowing the FUCK out of Star Wars lmfao
>b-but muh domestic
>>64553497
>caring about Asia
>it still hasn't even released in China
Avatar is gonna get blown the fuck out hard. Especially when China sees how hard Finn gets rekt.
>>64553501
Worldwide BO is all it matters family
>>64553501
adjusted for inflation, Avatar sits at around 3 billion gross. that would pay off 3/4 of the Star Wars purchase cost.
TFA Gross - 1bill, cost of movie and marketing -500 mil, other costs,4bill for star wars rights
star tards
>>64553501
Avatar made $25m overseas on this Monday, and then $24.5m on Tuesday, almost without China.
TFA made $14m, and then $13m. The crash is happening.
>>64553501
it's already flopped in other Asian markets. TFA is finished.
>>64553643
>almost without China
This should read "also without China".
>>64553100
Why is everyone here personally invested in how much money a movie makes
>>64553554
>Avatar
>new franchise
Pocahontas and Dances with Wolves aren't new kiddo.
>>64553600
China will underperform in movie sales because China decided to push back the release date to January. By then rips would be out.
>>64553655
>crushed avatar in 3 weeks
>"finished"
Avatar is a shitty movie who gives a fuck, so is Titanic.
All Cameron's old 80s stuff is leagues better. With that said,
>>64553701
Hello Reddit!
>>64553685
It's a meme. You might as well ask why everyone here knows the plane scene by heart or why people argue that the prequels were good.
How much did Avatar make from merchandise sales?
>people still think they can can the cam
The man is fucking untouchable, a master of the commercial film.
>>64553685
damage control
>worldwide phenomenon vs b-b-but it's big in america!
lel, star wars fans on literal pooicide watch
>>64553701
A disingenuous fact because movies suffer exponential decay in gross. TFA has already made 80-85% of its total gross at this point.
NEVER
EVER
HE CAN'T KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH IT
>>64553454
LITERALLY THIS
RIGHT ON TIME
NEW YEAR OVER, MOVIE IS DEAD
N O L E G S
O
L
E
G
S
>TFAKUCKS THINK THEY'RE GONNA GET TO 3 BILLION
LMAO
#1 MOVIE OF ALL TIME THAT CHANGED CINEMA FOREVER = UNTOUCHABLE
> 30 replies, 18 posters
Just accept its over Jim
>>64553831
Gone with the wind > Avatar
No shit it's got more money after inflation.
>>64553878
It didn't change film forever, it was just released at the time when 3D made a comeback and was the new "it" thing.
You can bet your ass that if it released now it wouldn't make the money it did the first time. Hell fucking My Little Pony could have released first in 3D and been the top grossing movie, it didn't matter, it was "new and exciting 3D".
>>64553939
How do you explain Titanic then, friend?
The 3D boogeyman involved somehow too?
>mfw The Mary Sue Awakens won't even beat Titanic
>>64553939
Cameron practically invented the technology they used to film Avatar.
>>64553831
>re-released 11 times in times before home cinema
>>64553994
No, Titanic was a good movie that involved a true love story that women ate the fuck up. Cameron isn't a bad director by any means, but to say Avatar changed film forever or that it's anywhere near his best movie is retarded.
>>64554046
Is this shit legit?
>>64554069
>but to say Avatar changed film forever
why is every film in 3D nowadays?
>>64554046
Well if he wants to pass it he better rerelease Avatar then huh?
Forever a Bride's Made JC, never the Bride. If you aren't first, you're last.
>tfw monday and tuesday grosses are right on par with Avatar at this time after release. It's dropping HARD and possibly won't beat Jurassic World worldwide.
BOYEGAAA
>>64554074
Comparing first releases Avatar completely BTFO's gone with the wind. Yes it's legit I'll collect the data just for you my friend.
>>64554074
Probably more times actually.
>>64554106
Why was ever film in 3D in the 90s? Guess how that turned out.
Also not every film is in 3D nowadays, the majority are sure, but it's not due to Avatar, the 3D shift was coming whether Avatar happened or not.
>>64554022
He didn't, he just utilized what was already getting ready for a massive shift in the movie industry, he just used it first, hence the money Avatar made. Like I said, MLP could have done it first and been in Avatar's position right now.
>>64554022
> Cameron invented computer graphics
Ok retard
>>64554106
Because post-production 3D conversions are cheap. Actual 3D tickets being sold are way the fuck down, but its still double or more the ticket price for no extra cost on the theater side.
See also IMAX. Since most movies are upscales, rather than native, actual imax tickets sold are way down too.
Avatar in IMAX3D was the fucking shit though
Should've included more Asian characters Jew Jew.
>>64553621
>i learned hollywood math on the 4chans
id hire you to be my accountant
Where were you when disneycucks thought they could beat the man who invented cinema?
>>64554022
>Cameron invented graphics and special effects
>cameronfag damage control
>>64554259
he is talking about the 3D cameras they used.
>>64553621
>4bill for star wars rights
They'll make that back in a year just selling toys. Where the real money from the movie is made.
>>64554143
>possibly won't beat Jurassic World worldwide
oh man, this would be the funniest thing all month if Disney's Rehash Awakens can't beat Generic Jurassic Park Sequel.
>Cameron revolutionizes the industry
>b-but muh toys
>>64554284
And guess what, nobody does that anymore, so it didn't change anything. Everything is done post-production now and even then 3D sales are down ticket wise. Cameron changed nothing.
>>64553600
>money doesn't matter if its not my money
I doubt Disney agree with you on this subject
>yfw Titanic sold about 30m more tickets than Avatar in Europe 2 decades ago
>yfw TFA won't even beat Avatar in ticket sales
>>64554329
>revolutionizes
Avatar is a piece of shit. When it came out I didn't give a single fuck. Watched it on DVD when I was bored and thought it was awful. Only years later I learned it was actually the highest grossing film of all time and I couldn't believe that.
>>64554345
3D sales are down because post-production 3D looks like ass.
IMAX sales are down because imax upscales look like ass.
>>64554329
If Avatar was so great there would be toys of it that kids would eat up.
Checkmate Fruit of the Loom
Star Trek: 1
Dances with Wolves: 0
>>64554404
That's a very nice opinion you have there.
it's over. even if it doubles the estimates in china. the krauts, japs and frogs just didn't go for it.
>>64553831
>implying Cameronbros care about movies from olden times
seriously I fucking love Gone With The Wind, and it's precisely BECAUSE Cameron understands how old Hollywood movies worked that he's such a consistent box office monster. He actually learned the lessons of the old masters on how to grab a mass audience and take them whereever he wants.
The flavor of the month is over. It's out the word is out it's shit
kids are now watching the other star wars movies since they never seen them
>>64554407
And it's cheaper to do post-production. That's good business, not wasting even more money just to use 3D Cameras, the difference in gains would be less. Had Cameron done post-production he'd have gained more money assuming Avatar had made the same amount of money.
>>64554451
Why did Japan care about blue ayylmaos so much?
>lock yourself out of a market with 10 times the volume and, maybe half the yield of another market
>start pretending it doesn't matter
:^)
If TFA outsold Avatar internationally but not domestic Avatarfags would freaking out, but now they're trying to act like international is the one that really counts
>>64554482
Avatar proved, beyond all doubt, that if you spend the extra money, you'll make some more money, even if the movie is a piece of shit. As people will keep putting their asses in expensive seats if your movie is visually impressive.
>>64553939
>it was just released at the time when 3D made a comeback
Cameron literally engineered that comeback personally.
Star Wars TFA is screened in 3D today, at a higher price, because of him.
CAMERON AND AVATAR ARE LITERALLY RESPONSIBLE FOR A SHARE OF DISNEY'S PROFITS FROM STAR WARS.
Don't worry Disney, there's plenty more where that came from ;^)
>>64554528
but it is...
>>64554549
The 3D sales of TFA are non-existent, though. No one's falling for post-production 3D conversions and IMAX upscales anymore.
>>64554491
meme 3D. and they look a bit like anime characters.
>>64554491
Because Japan has shit taste, and have always had shit taste. They like Gundam SEED for god's sake.
>>64554491
because the story was well-executed and universal.
>>64554491
Well, the story was basically that of a salaryman escaping the life of a salaryman and learning how to ride dragons and mindfuck blue princesses.
>Star Wars BTFO Avatar domestic
>Avatar still king WW
>everyone in this thread damage controlling their side
>ASIANS WILL SAVE AVATAR!!
Do you guys think Avatar 2 will make the same or more than Avatar? I don't think so, nobody cares about 3D anymore, the CGI will be harder to impress since every big movie now and days has a shit ton of CGI. So the only two reasons why people originally went to see the first Avatar no longer hold true for the second. Nobody gives a shit about the character, or world, or story. Avatar was pretty much the Wii, Avatar 2 will be the Wii U
>>64554593
the 3D screenings all booked up in the opening weeks when people were desperate to see the movie in any format.
but it was post-3D. it was one of the first clear signs Disney didn't have confidence in the film that they bothered doing a 3D version.
>>64554645
Based gooks
>>64554672
Avatar 2 will break 4 billion
>>64554672
Agreed
I think it'll break a billion though, international market
>>64554633
That's what makes this thread funny to read. Autists fighting each other over which movie gets the most money from box office gross.
>>64554686
Maybe where you live. Even opening nights in my area were pretty easy to get tickets for a day in advance. 3D (and IMAX) showings didn't sell out at all, and were basically just the "didn't plan? fuck you, double price" showings.
This maymay of starwars selling out everywhere really needs to end.
>>64554630
The story is literally Pocahontas.
Cameron is a hack that can't invent his own stories.
Just wait until his next big hit "Street Sharks". It totally wont be a ripoff of TMNT at all.
>>64554404
thanks, we were all clamoring to here your reviews of Avatar. In the future, please let us know what you think about each movie you see.
>>64553761
good one! u really got me ! :)
>>64554593
>>64554549
3D is pretty much dead, and good riddance. Worst. Fad. Ever.
Meanwhile, film, both standard 35mm and large format (65/70 and horizontal IMAX) are indeed making a bit of a comeback. And thank fuck for that.
>>64554672
Avatar will make around 1.3Bil
Screencap it, I'll wait.
>>64554686
More like Disney realized the mistakes of George Lucas that characters and story-telling > Special Effects
>>64554731
Some things stay consistent
go to /v/ and watch them have threadlong battles over which console will sell more
>>64554672
>the CGI will be harder to impress since every big movie now and days has a shit ton of CGI
Avatar still looks better than any other modern blockbuster, because of how well designed, shot and directed it is. The 3D is also the best to date.
I personally wouldn't have assumed it would make as much, but given how much money TFA has made, there is likely the POTENTIAL for Avatar to make as much or more, because unlike TFA it will be able to go back to a global fan audience.
>>64554785
>>64554672
and the reason for that is people can tell the difference between post-production 3D conversions and imax upscales, despite what studios want to think.
>>64554593
It's not dead because Disney is forcing 3D and eliminating 2D seats to make people pay more. There's no IMAX 2D copies in my country.
>>64554528
no one talks about the "domestic ticket sales record." Ever.
And it's obviously much more impressive to have the world record because it has to appeal to the ENTIRE WORLD, rather than just 300 million people, among other reason Avatar's run is much more impressive.
>>64554801
Not when James Cameron has to conform to social standards and adds a black man in his story alienating the Asian Audiences and completely destroying his film's integrity.
>>64554748
in fairness my reports are based on the media, who were probably shilling the movie by exaggerating the demand.
>>64554842
That's a good thing. Digital3D looks like complete ass. Its fucking pathetic. But that still doesn't change the fact no one is falling for upscales and post-conversions anymore.
>>64554842
>pay more for 3D
What shithole do you live in. I pay the same fucking price for all my tickets regardless of where I go.
>>64554850
If nobody cares about Domestic Sales then why are there tons of articles about TFA beating Avatar domestically all over the internet, including this thread?
>>64553100
Will TFA get Titanic WW?
>>64554774
Sure family
>>64553199
>go to article
>under related articles: ‘Force Awakens’ Beats ‘Avatar’ As Highest Grossing Film Of All-Time At Domestic B.O. In Jaw-dropping 20 Days
CAMERONFAGS ON SUICIDE WATCH
OP UTTERLY BUTTNUKED
>>64554785
>3D is pretty much dead
I've been to see 5 movies in 3D since Avatar: The Hobbit films, Hugo and Titanic's conversion.
I'm still going to queue up to see Avatar 2 in whatever FPS 3D format Cameron thinks he can get cinemas to exhibit, because the first movie was that much better than anyone else's attempts.
>>64554872
They're also exaggerating the "opening" "day one" gross. As they soft-opened on the 16th and had just as many showings the two days before "opening day" as they did opening day, then rolled everything together like, somehow, theaters were showing TFA 3 times per theater.
Basically all this shit is madness.
>>64554832
That, but also I believe that true 3D is still pretty unimpressive, it gets boring after half an hour. I remember watching Avatar in 3D, for a while I was like
>oh this 3D thing is kinda kewl
and a little while later it was just
>I don't even notice the 3D anymore, but the dark screen is annoying as fuck.
3D just doesn't have any redeeming value. When sound film was introduced, it added a new value. As did color. 3D adds a value, depth, which we've been working for centuries to bring to a 2D plane. 3D just shits on centuries of evolution of the flat representation of depth, it takes more away than it adds. That's why it's not interesting as a filmmaking tool (it doesn't add anything), and it isn't interesting for the moviegoer.
Analogue film formats, on the other hand, don't really add anything nor take it away, but it's just a different medium for generating an image, with its own peculiarities, THAT is a tool which can be useful for filmmakers.
>>64554686
Avatar 2 will break 4 billion.
>>64554852
Cameron wouldn't think putting a black man would be enough. He'd want to one up criticism and put an Aborigine in there.
>>64554852
it's actually quite nice that Disney are conducting that social experiment on behalf of the rest of the industry.
I'd prefer if, you know, they had written a good Star Wars film to do it with, but Boyega is easily the best thing about TFA so at least he is getting work.
>>64554985
>but the dark screen is annoying as fuck.
That's digital3D, the non-imax 3D format. It is and was complete ass.
Doesn't TFA has like 30 weeks to make 1.2 billion to equal Avatar? Doesn't sound like that much
ATTENTION: STAR WARS FANS ON SUICIDE WATCH
TFA OVERWHELMING DESTROYED IN ALL MAJOR MARKETS EXCEPT BONGLAND AND NORTH AMERIKEK.
>>64555004
and Ep. 8 will break 5 billion. Give it up Avaturd is finished
>>64554952
Being good at 3D still doesn't make Avatar a good movie. You're like the graphics whore casuals for vidya gaems. Doesn't matter if it's a shit game as long as it looks good!
I honestly can't fathom how socially retarded you have to be to argue about TFA being a flop day in, day out...
>>64555062
Putting IMAX3D to great use makes it an extremely visually impressive movie, though. And avatar proved that as long as the story is functional, that's all you need to keep putting asses in seats.
>>64554952
I'm not saying there are no 3D films, but if you look at how many screens (regardless of what film their showing, since obviously there's going to be 3D-only films trying to push 3D on moviegoers wether they like it or not) show 3D films versus 2D, especially outside the US, you'll see that 3D projections are the exceptions, 3D productions even more so. Unlike sound or color, which were immediately seen as the next step and where adopted as fast as possible (sound was adopted in most of the world by 1930-ish, just a couple of years after The Jazz Singer, color was adopted worldwide by the late 50's-early 60's, when monopack color film became cheaply available), 3D is generally irrelevant, other than as a gimmick.
>>64555062
games are based on interaction, film is a visual medium
>>64555099
It's one of /tv/'s epik reddit maymays Anon. Gotta keep forcing those down your throat, gotta spread these epik maymays across the interwebs and be like da real /b/ 2.0.
>>64554964
There is a quote that Abrams originally only said there was going to be one trailer.
I think Disney screentested the film and realized that they needed to manufacture a huge success or Star Wars would simply become another Sci-fi movie franchise like Star Trek. the reported $300 million marketing budget is literally insane for a movie with this amount of a built-in audience.
>>64555099
it started with a four billion deficit, dog.
even toy sales are way below what disney was expecting.
>>64555032
>TFA will make > $50 million for four more weekends
>This tard has tater tots falling from his pockets
>>64555022
I haven't dared to try 48fps-3D. I'm scared it will look like a spic telenovela shot on cheap video.
>>64555032
>avatar total 2.7b
>force awaeks 1.5b
only 1.2 bill to go
>>64555062
word.
>>64555109
I don't disagree, but it proves that people will eat up anything as long as it looks good, which is damaging to the industry as a whole.
>>64555114
They're both visual mediums at this point. Nobody cares about interaction/gameplay or storytelling. It's all about how fancy it can look.
>>64555152
I'm so glad you'll never be qualified enough to make any real decisions.
>>64555016
>Cameron
>giving a fuck about commercial formula
Titanic is a 3 hour costume drama about a story everyone knew the ending of where all the main characters die. Avatar is a hippy fable about blue cat people.
boom, obvious box office gold. yeah...
>>64555143
They can manufacture all the success as they want as far as I'm concerned. I'm just kinda confused how no one is calling disney on the fact they rolled 3 days worth of screenings into one day, and tried to act like they broke records.
Episode IX: Revelation of the Jedi will be in IMAX 4D and blow all of your minds with it's 4.8 billion revenue.
>>64554074
Definitely. My mother told me she was excited when she got old enough that she could go see it - which would have been in the late 60s or early 70s (she was born in '56). With no home video, they just kept putting movies back in theaters if people would see it, and for GWTW, they would.
It's a little unfair to compare it to movies nowadays. I bet if you added in DVD sales and rentals some movies would blaze past others - Star Wars probably would be a lot higher.
Incidentally, re-releasing the OT in theaters when they made the Special Editions is another throwback to the older days when movies were re-released all the time. George Lucas fucking loves throwbacks. Maybe that's why he's never happy.
>>64555152
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-star-wars-toys-20151219-story.html
>>64555157
>arbitrary number for 4 weekends!!!
What the hell are you talking about, did you even read the chart?
>>64555224
This can't be serious.
>>64555200
Film has always been 90% spectacle. I'm not sure how delusional you'd have to be to think otherwise.
Gone with the wind isn't the highest grossing movie of all time because of it's great story, but because it was beautiful.
>>64555224
And now people want to see a heroic black man fuck a precious white princess.
Get ready for his new movie starring Morgan Freeman and Jennifer Lawrence in a beautiful tale of romance and spectacle.
>>64555032
this chart makes me ashamed to be an anglo-saxon, to be honest.
>>64555256
Destroyed
>>64555256
>on track
>3 week old story
so, what you're saying is, they didn't.
>>64555023
that's not how these things work.
Every one of the highest grossing movies of all time dropped off sharply after three weeks, making most of their money in those first three-four weeks. This is happening to TFA now. It's made most of its money already, and will only make about 10-20% more.
The exceptions to the 3-week drop off are Avatar and Titanic. They kept making money steadily for many more weeks.
>>64555256
B T F O
>>64555062
there are people who would literally never enjoy an environmentalist movie about blue alien native Americans. it could be done in any way and you'd still hate it and be unable to conceive of anyone liking it.
that's fine. it's still the most successful movie of the modern era.
>>64555282
More like because it was in theaters for years
>>64555318
Do you legitimately not understand businesses operate (projections, quarterly stats, gradual reports, etc.) or are you shitposting? Because I honestly can't tell anymore with a lot of /tv/, especially the fanatics.
>>64555320
>Every one of the highest grossing movies of all time dropped off sharply after three weeks
Except avatar
Most money in the first month is a rule for recent blockbusters.
>>64555289
>Jennifer Lawrence
Morgan Freeman is entitled to a better looking white woman than that moon-faced Sami.
>>64555318
Sales records for toys are adjusted a month later to accumulate for ya know, actual sales over a lengthy period of time to better adjust for overall volumetric data.
>>64553643
China had almost no movie theaters when ABATAB came out. Now it has thousands.
>>64555345
>it's still the most successful movie of the modern era.
Yeah and you were the ugliest kid in High School, literally who cares?
>>64555320
They just need to make $40000 a week for the next 30 weeks to equal Avatar, it doesn't sound like much money.
>>64555111
I don't disagree except with the negative connotations of the word "gimmick".
3D is just not called for for most films. but I think that doesn't mean Avatar 2 won't duplicate Avatar's success, because Cameron has established his own set of precedents. the movie WILL take full advantage of the technology and I think people will remember the first movie and give it a chance again.
>>64555377
Do you not understand how when projections don't sync up with reality, marketing firms don't exactly throw around that information?
The story is basically "we project great sales!" Which is meaningless.
>>64555390
So we won't have any actual information till next week, if we have any actual information at all.
:^)
>>64555226
its literally just the media being paid to help promote the film, and also wanting to keep the gravy train rolling because of the promotion Disney's yearly roster of films will require.
>>64555424
>>64555359
Because it kept putting asses in seats. Because it was spectacular to behold.
>>64555279
you literally don't understand what a formula is, son.
clue: it's not the same as "a movie that happened to make a lot of money". you don't get to retroactively say a film was formulaic if a shitload of things about it came totally out of left-field.
example: putting an even bigger Death Star in a Star Wars film is formula.
>>64555444
Projections are based on volumetric data which is updated daily. When this story was written three weeks ago, the launch of the TFA line was clearly well-received by the public based on factors such as wish lists, Web 2.0 mentions/searches, pre-orders, real-time orders, and so on. As with all large-scale product launches (including movie tickets, which there was so much hype around when TFA was "projected"---and actually did---to break records), these statistics are developed by complex algorithms that people and firms get paid a lot of money to ensure their accuracy.
We will see where the numbers are in a while, but it's very likely the TFA toy-line is able to make back Disney's investment on its own. I understand you're likely an adolescent caught up in fanatical shitposting to who knows what end, but the truth is Disney is doing very well, and their president is probably slurping caviar with Cameron tonight while they heartily compare their fabled lives.
>>64555385
it was a rule for blockbusters since Titanic. then it was a rule for blockbusters since Avatar.
>>64555424
Damn son...
>>64555575
>you're right, there isn't any concrete information, but let me appeal to authority anyway and call you a child
^:)
>>64555710
That's not what appeal to authority means.
There is concrete information. There are several articles which provide citations, including the aforementioned.
Daily reminder that despite all Cameron's innovations for Avatar, this is the only film that properly utilised them in 6 years.
>>64555430
it won't be in theaters for 7 months m8
>>64555385
I excepted Avatar, FaM.
>>64555430
Doesn't sound like much in theory, but you could have said the same about Jurassic World, FF7, Avengers 2, etc.
They start making low numbers after 3 or so weeks, and then they get pulled from theaters. TFA has nothing going for it to make it deviate from the same fate as JW, FF7, etc.
>>64555748
The articles are providing citations referring to models that you, yourself, describe as updated daily to accurately reflect daily yeilds, margins, and projected volume, which is functionally meaningless, but it looks good on paper and the people creating said models are being paid a pittance, so keep at it.
You then act like the fact these models are as accurate as possible is proof of their complete veracity and therefore the people who generate them are an authority, and then you appeal to that authority.
Then you adhom'd all over yourself.
So the reality is since the models are shifting, as they're designed to be, in order to minimize loss and maximize profits, their day-to-day accuracy is irrelevant and projections are ultimately meaningless. So until we have actual data on what has happened, projections of what might happen are meaningless.
>>64555710
>^:)
[triggered]
>>64553100
What's funny is that the dollar has lost so much purchasing power recently that Avatar is still ahead of TFA domestically when properly controlled.
>>64555430
>domestic
pls stahp
I love these threads
This thread has made me realize that if Avatar was screening in 3D near me I would literally go and see it right now just so I could luxuriate in how totally different to the Disney/Marvel experience it is.
>>64555894
>the people creating said models are being paid a pittance, so keep at it.
Can you cite this? For instance, one of the models used to forecast sales is developed by Fluent, a major marketing firm partnered with heavyweights such as Oracle and Experian.
>About 31% of shoppers who planned to buy "Star Wars" products as gifts for the holiday season intended it for someone 6 to 10 years old, according to a survey conducted by Fluent Inc., a brand marketing and advertising technology firm
Also, just to be clear, are you saying projections should always be taken with a grain of salt? Because that's pretty obvious and a non-argument at best. However, when it comes to a behemoth such as Disney, you have to take into account the professionalism of the launch and the buzz surrounding it, which is nothing short of the culmination of a cultural phenomenon. You can look at any bestseller list and see Star Wars merchandise on it. Here are some examples:
http://www.toysrus.com/shop/index.jsp?categoryId=10811023
http://www.brostrick.com/tech/best-toys-for-2015-2016-christmas-season/
http://www.madeformums.com/news-and-gossip/must-have-toys-for-christmas-from-the-biggest-sellers/30958.html
Again, strong initial buzz + brand "royalty" (i.e. Lego) + behemoth conglomerate + unparalleled distribution + heavyweight royalty fees (reports indicate Disney commands up to a 20% royalty clause for this launch, along with a monstrous upfront fee from all retailers indicates that the market is all-in. Such solidarity wouldn't be apparent for something that wasn't as close to a sure thing as economics allows.
>appeal to that authority
You misunderstand. I simply stated models used by Fortune500 companies are reliable. Therefore, I have confidence in Disney and its subsidiaries to reap success. This isn't an appeal to authority. This is referencing historical precedence.
1/2
>>64556239
>marketing firm
You're done.
>>64555894
>>64556239
>So the reality is since the models are shifting, as they're designed to be
Shifting occurs in the minutiae, not in long-term projections, especially not in a way that'll buck endgame trends unless something goes drastically awry. So far, nothing is there to indicate that. There is only good buzz; there are only "hotlists"; there are only optimistic (at worst) projections. What leads you to believe these models would fundamentally shift, especially in the polar direction?
> their day-to-day accuracy is irrelevant and projections are ultimately meaningless
The first part I can agree with; the second, not so much. If projections were meaningless, marketing and advertising firms, amongst others, wouldn't be such a prevalent part of the business model.
>So until we have actual data on what has happened
We have data. Would you like me to spoonfeed you?
>marketing firm
>You're done.
>mfw
>>64556342
>>64556239
You both seem to be kinda forgetting that marketing firms market themselves as valuable, first and foremost.
Cameron always wins, baby.
>>64556391
No one's forgetting this, but I'm sure Disney has other exterior and interior auditors and similar checks which make sure numbers sprouted from such firms don't make national headlines unless Disney itself is comfortable with the projections.
>>64556424
>divorced 5 times
>cast and crews hate him
>autistic
>>64556428
Marketing firm:
>hey disney, everything looks GREAT!!
Disney:
>TELL THE WORLD!!
Also I like the image you paint of massive corporate entities having a paid network of shitters trying to determine if their employer is being shitted by shittiers and marketing shitters pushing the envelope of how much shit they can shit based upon cost-benefit ratios of shit to maximize their shit to profit ratio in order to derive the most revenue from their ability to bullshit.
and by "I like" i mean it makes me want to blow my brains out.
>>64556609
That's really not how it works.
>Also I like the image you paint of massive corporate entities having a paid network of shitters trying to determine if their employer is being shitted by shittiers and marketing shitters pushing the envelope of how much shit they can shit based upon cost-benefit ratios of shit to maximize their shit to profit ratio in order to derive the most revenue from their ability to bullshit.
This makes you come across as extremely unintelligent. Why don't you try again. Try to use "shit" less than one time, though.
>and by "I like" i mean it makes me want to blow my brains out
Godspeed.
How did they get it so wrong?
>>64556424
He just has a dominant look about him. Abrams looks like a scared deer in comparison.
>>64556724
Yes, I expect the marketing firms paint their activities in much more professional and positive lights.
They are professionals, after all. According to themselves.
Starwars TFA
>based on one of the most iconic film franchises in history with decades of exposure to a wide spectrum of demographics
>the full Disney hype machine behind it with accompanied video games and merchandising as well as shilling by Disney owned media outlets
>brings back iconic characters from the canon
>hollywood 'it' director JJ Abrams
Avatar
>made by one dude cause he felt like it
DISNEY BTFO
LOL
O
L
>>64556779
I'm bewildered by the fact you think any outsourced firm can make Disney believe anything without solid evidence. I can't tell if you're cynical past the point of no return, egregiously uninformed, shitposting, or some combination of all three (the most likely).
If you were running a business, would you blindly accept what people were telling you without having a system of validation in place?
TFA 17 days
740m
Avatar 340 days
750m
>somehow tfa is a failure
tfw you have lived long enough to see contrarianism evolve to the point where people will actually defend marketing
>>64556855
I'm pretty bewildered that you're actually defending marketers/marketing.
>>64556932
What do you considering "defending" marketing? This isn't exactly a moral debate. I'm simply stating that projections from many legitimate sources, one of which happens to be a well-reputed marketing firm, forecast a massive return for Disney. I've also stated that Fortune500 companies are very obviously smart enough to be funneled the correct information, or else they wouldn't remain in their positions.
>>64556976
Sorry you feel that way.
>>64556855
>implying Disney didn't ask for the fake numbers themselves
>>64557010
I can't stop you from going down the rabbit hole. It all depends on how you choose to balance rationale and your personal world views.
>>64556469
the crew he has now is actually very loyal, it's bigger name actors who hate him.
I guess if you yell at your crew for long enough eventually you end up with people who'll put up with it.
>>64556999
The problem is the sources define their own legitimacy and repute. Because they're marketing firms. If they weren't viewed as legitimate and reputable, they wouldn't exist.
>>64556893
Avatar had a consistent average drop week after week, that is impressive while TFA is heavily front loaded and is going to significantly drop week after week.
>>64557053
what'd be really great is to stop talking about fucking Star Wars entirely, but I'm not holding my breath waiting for that to happen.
>>64557061
Again, if you honestly believe these firms are unassailable, then that's your prerogative, but it's not a popular opinion in the business world.
>>64557108
That would be nice. Why don't you start a unique thread? I'll contribute.
>>64557086
Just so you know avatar was doing way less weekly than tfa is doing now.
>new avatar movies being released
>new star wars movies being released
>battle for the box office where your film is a flop if it doesnt make a billion in a week
is this the golden age of sci fi cinema bros?
>>64554633
Only one of those two things actually matters though, and it's the worldwide gross. Only one of those things make your film the unanimous "highest-grossing film of all time"
>>64557160
>if you honestly believe these firms are unassailable
At this point it seems you're either suffering from illiteracy or experiencing cognitive dissonance. I shall attempt to explain the paradoxical nature of marketing firms in another way.
Since marketing firms live and die by reputation, it is in their best interest to ensure their reputations are as positive as possible. Since they don't actually do anything, their reputations aren't based upon anything but their track record. Since they're glorified rainmakers, they distribute their presence as much as possible in order to act responsible for when it does rain. So the bigger the firm, the more they can appear responsible for rain.
>>64557281
You're right. A multi-trillion dollar industry likes giving away tens of millions of dollars annually, for free, to marketing firms that don't actually do anything. And this multi-trillion dollar industry clearly isn't as intelligent as you, so it can't recognize the utter uselessness of said firms.
>>64553100
Still trying to desperately rationalize and spin your gay blue furry movie losing to Star Wars, eh Jimbo? Oh well, maybe with Avatar 2 you can film it in 4D and charge $20 for the tickets.
This is your karmic cummupance for shilling that awful new Terminator movie last year.
>>64556893
>le domestic
simply ebin
>>64554672
Avatar only sold well because it was the first big movie to be filmed in digital 3D. A lot of idiot normies actually thought it was the first 3D movie. The ridiculous amounts of studio hype + the expensive tickets made it an unstoppable juggernaut, but it's not enough to beat Star Wars.
>>64557468
>hey look i did a shoop
>>64557570
>but it's not enough to beat Star Wars
It already did.
>>64553100
Kike lovers on suicide watch
>>64557414
The factor you're either forgetting, ignoring, or are simply ignorant of, is how, when you have over a billion dollars in play, you basically can't fail without exerting effort to that end. Because you can distribute that wealth between a sufficiently large number of ventures (or just leave it in a bank to accrue interest and borrow meaningless amounts against it) to where it becomes a mathematical impossibility for your value to decrease.
Your own choice of wording (trillions, millions) should impress upon you the meaninglessness of the latter to the former.
So the idea here is marketers simply have to put forth the air of legitimacy and repute in order to secure funds with which they'll do the smallest amount they possibly can in order justify what amounts to a glorified ritual sacrifice.
>>64554106
Because they saw how much they could get money off of a film if they added shoddy 3d to it?
And Avatar was the reason this happened...
Well fuck Avatar then. Why y'all praise a shit film is simply a meme, but once the joke's over I actually hate any change its brought to the table.
>>64557743
implying a cucknadian vegan is much better
>>64557822
So you agree—these trillion-dollar industries are incapable of recognizing valuable assets from garbage, and therefore willingly hand out tens of millions due to incompetence. And this has been an ongoing tradition since the latter half of the 20th century.
Interesting how your mind works.
>>64553853
Good thing he won't.
Come Avatar 2 his reign will end.
>>64554611
>SEED is bad
>>64557916
The point is they don't need to.
>>64557916
>they have lots of money
>therefore that means they smart
:)^
>>64558033
So because it doesn't hurt them, they don't mind giving away tens of millions of dollars for free, or for a service that amounts to being an infinitesimal factor. That's what you're saying, right? Because the industry is worth trillions, they have no qualms with multi-million-dollar handouts. There are no checks in place to stop this simply because it is a mathematical impossibility for them to lose money, so they're complacent when it comes to hemorrhaging a small country's GDP.
>>64558066
>they have lots of money
>they keep expanding
>they keep making more money
>they've been around for a long time
Yeah, they're pretty smart. Capitalism doesn't really allow for legacy standings in crowded markets.
So when are we getting a board for capeshit? These Star Wars threads need to go.
>So when are we getting a board for capeshit? These Star Wars threads need to go.
>>64553100
Better than avatar's take on the same day
>>64558166
Lets put this into terms you can possibly understand.
You lose a dime.
How much do you care?
>>64558200
Just after they make a board solely for marketing.
#>>64558222
Hate to break it to you anon, but avatar made ~$8m domestic and $24m overseas on that day
>>64558231
Let me put this into terms you can possibly understand:
Tens of millions of dollars will never amount to a dime on any balance sheet.
You have no business sense. In fact, you're proven yourself to be completely clueless. I'm very happy you will never be in a position to make any real decisions.
>>64558200
This. There are about 7 capeshit movies being released this year
>>64558286
Thanks for proving your inability to understand how multi-billion dollar entities operate is founded in the fact you can't understand how a value that would be meaningful to you could be meaningless to another party.
A billion dollars in interest accruing bank accounts would generate tens of millions of dollars a year, just by existing. Multi-billion dollar industries allow for certain levels of failure/loss, because failure/loss isn't something that is completely preventable. Corporate culture is all about shifting blame and appearing competent valuable, but since very little has actual value, its all just a [trigger warning] load of shit.
>>64558486
>how a value that would be meaningful to you could be meaningless to another party
If it were meaningless, they wouldn't keep resigning contracts for annual million-dollar payouts.
Furthermore, a billion-dollar entity still has divisions, which you very clearly fail to comprehend. The moviemaking division of Disney isn't responsible for paying a marketing firm. Each division is allotted a certain amount of resources. Tens of millions a year for any one division is a lot of money, even if Disney's total net revenue is much larger than that.
>A billion dollars in interest accruing bank accounts would generate tens of millions of dollars a year, just by existing.
There's no bank in the world that has a billion dollars or more deposited. Again, absolutely clueless. Net worth doesn't mean liquid cash or bonds sitting in a safe somewhere.
> Multi-billion dollar industries allow for certain levels of failure/loss, because failure/loss isn't something that is completely preventable
Not outsourcing a marketing firm IS preventable. There's a difference between sunk cost and intentional hemorrhaging of money. There is no accountant in the world that works for a Fortune500 company that would allow for this to continue if it could be prevented while the other guys in the room can make a presentable argument for why the marketing firms aren't needed.
>Corporate culture is all about shifting blame and appearing competent valuable
Disney has nothing to shift blame for. They're having a banner year. The last part isn't English; try again.
>very little has actual value
>its all just a load of shit
Glad you went from zero business sense to nihilism in a span of ten seconds. You're a fucking mess.
>trigger warning
Shut the fuck up, you memetastic dickhead.
>>64558695
>being this pretentious
Jesus christ you're an unlikeable autist.
>>64558768
No, you're just a NEET who's trying to play businessman without having any clue about how things work. You actually think Disney would be okay with continuously signing contracts, giving away tens of millions a year for absolutely no return, when it could be easily prevented.
You are a moron. Accept this and improve yourself.
Also, I'm much more socially successful than you.
>>64558828
I'm not even that guy and don't care what you have to say, you pretentious prick.
>>64558858
Fuck you, you fat lard.
>>64558828
>>64558858
>Also, I'm much more socially successful than you.
Kek. That'd be a feat, given how oblivious you are.
>>64558768
>no response
Not him, but kek
>>64558896
I guess it's a feat, then.
>>64558932
HAHAHA
Nice comeback, fag.
>>64558965
This isn't an episode of "Yo Momma," Wilmer. Take a deep breath.
>gets BTFO after trying to prove to himself and his parents hes not a retard
>god ur so pretentious :(((
my fucking sides
>>64559315
Thanks, but I didn't really view this as an argument. I was honestly trying to make the other anon understand how flawed his thinking was. I'm assuming he understands since he isn't replying anymore.
>>64558828
>responding line by line
not even that guy but fuck off autist
>>64559745
>responding to every point is autistic
Wew, lad. The real world is gonna run you over like a truck.
>>64558695
Corporate culture: the loss is meaningless, think of the potential gains!
>>64559791
Just take out a third mortgage, bro! Think about the GAINSSSSSS!
REMINDER THAT CAMERON STOLE THE LOOK OF PANDORA FROM ROGER DEAN.
>>64559787
you can pick apart anything, budro
>>64553100
>It can't keep crashing this hard.
Last Tuesday was a school vacation week, this Tuesday was a regular working day (and bitterly cold in the Northeast). A significant drop in box office is to be expected.
>>64559881
I'm not your budro, famigo, and that is false. Well-constructed arguments are inherently unassailable. Disagreeable? Sure. Logically unsound? No.
>>64559900
>literally using the weather as an excuse
Is this a new low?
>I'm not your budro, famigo, and that is false. Well-constructed arguments are inherently unassailable. Disagreeable? Sure. Logically unsound? No.
>>64559967
Damn, look at it chug! What a well-oiled meme machine.
>>64559919
Everything is assailable.
>>64553100
True enough, but sadly Star Wars still made a shit load of dough
JimJam hasn't made a good film since True Lies. His era is over.
The era of the interracial breeding grounds begins today!
>>64560016
Not exactly. For instance, Darwin's On the Origin of Species is unassailable.
