God tier mary sue thread
Was it ever explained why he was so OP?
>>64254662
Magic blood in his veins.
>>64254662
he used to be a woman.
OP and Mary Sue aren't the same thing ffs.
Aragorn is very OP, but he's extremely conflicted, self-doubting, and doesn't desire any of the glory of his rightful station at first.
>>64254662
>fights off 5 ring wraiths by himself
he spent a lot of time training with elves
>>64254642
blood of numenor, aka magic
>>64254755
how many mitichlorians does he have?
OP apart from being a faggot does not understand what Mary Sue is
>>64254642
Aragorn wasn't the main character. him being too perfect wasn't an issue. Tolkien knew what he was doing with those hobbits.
>>64254815
Rey is conflicted too. So she's not a Mary Sue. Glad we cleared this up!!!!!!!
>>64254662
He was a member of the Master Race
>>64254891
only main characters can be mary sues.
if a secondary character is used to solve the protagonist's problems out of nowhere it is a deus ex machina, not a Mary Sue. the Ghost Army in LOTR is very much a Deus Ex Machina, that Tolkien gets away with only because Gondor surviving the siege of Pellanor doesn't wind up being very decisive in the grand scheme of things.
he's not good at pretending to like shitty foot that eowyn gave him.
>what is a numenor
go read a book sometime retard
>>64254642
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xniB5uL75Ek
>>64255031
That army was fucking stupid.
>>64254662
Because LoT is trash devoid of character development, meaningful death or engaging personal drama.
>>64255031
>>64254891
this rey faggots btfo
>>64254642
The definition of a Mary Sue is a character that makes everybody else in the story seem useless, irrelevant, or less important in comparison. Aragorn never does that. As badass as he is, he still NEEDS other people in order to succeed.
>>64255276
have you ever watched fellowship? fuck of wit ya
>>64254642
Not a Mary Sue because only strong female characters can be Mary Sues.
>>64255393
>I don't have a counter argument so I'll just imply the other person doesn't know what they are talking about
I read the trilogy+The Hobbit too. The point stands.
>>64255352
in fellowship he scared off the nazgul 5v1. THEY ARE DEAD AND HE SCARED THEM OFF. 5. ON. ONE.
>>64255352
Other people help him but he rarely actually needs them. Name one time he was in mortal danger and clearly saved by another character.
>>64254662
Fucking aragorn son of arathorn what explanation do you need nigger
>>64255500
Doesn't change the fact that without Frodo getting the Ring to Mount Doom, he would have died like everybody else.
>>64255031
>Ghost Army in LOTR
Ghost army only scares off the pirates so Aragorn and his crew can take the ships to Gondor, they didnt rekt anyone like in Hacksons movies
>>64255276
>meaningful death
le game of thrones break the internet character death :v
>>64255558
jackson didnt even want to include them, he thought they were silly
>>64255557
So if other characters exist in the story the character is not a Mary Sue?
>>64254662
He quite literally had master race of humanity blood in his veins, borderline superhuman, though not elf tier.
>>64255601
>jackson didnt even want to include them, he thought they were silly
yet he had them run around like the tazmanian devil destroying all the orcs in their path, HACKSOOOOOOOOOOON!!!
>>64255581
>Game of Thrones invented character death
Are you stupid or just a child?
>>64255538
>Name one time he was in mortal danger and clearly saved by another character.
He gets saved by Frodo+Sam just like everybody else.
>>64255558
it's still arguably a DEM in the books, it's just a more effectively disguised/minor one.
>>64255609
Look at this nigger trying his best to justify Rey. Pathetic.
>>64255558
>they didnt rekt anyone like in Hacksons movies
why not? they were obviously overpowered as fuck. the whole story should have been them going to find the ghost army so it could destroy sauron's armies. then frodo could ride to mount doom on an eagle. you shit on hackson but tolkein was a fucking retard who played the deus ex machina card only when it was convenient for his story.
>Rey's not a Mary Sue!
>(beloved character) IS A FUCKING MARY SUE!
Feminists on suicide watch
>>64255609
no. just that the main character is the one who absolutely can't be perfect because if they don't have to struggle the story has no suspense.
>>64255669
Oh ok so since Poe blew up the mega Death Star then Rey isn't a Mary Sue? Clearly if other character accomplish things to help everyone then no character can be a Mary Sue.
>>64255538
He was saved by a horse.
>>64254662
He spent his entire life preparing because he was the chosen on/last of his line
>>64255693
Nah she's a Mary Sue but so is Aragon.
>>64254642
Hello? Mary Sue speaking.
>>64255663
it was a dumb scene, but it didn't break the story like Rey's bullshit powerups broke TFA because >>64255031
>>64255719
Aragon is only "beloved" by man children. Most people care about the hobbits and don't give a shit about Edgy Ranger Secret King Magic Blood Man
>>64255753
Rey wasn't even involved in destroying the Death World, her objective, once captured, was to escape and she did that with no difficulty
>>64255753
Nope, Rey is still a Mary Sue. She made all the other characters seem less important or useless. She shoots better than Finn, flies better than Poe, and uses the Force better than Kylo. Hell, she even knows more about the Millennium Falcon's insides than Han Solo. There is no way to redeem that and make it okay.
>>64254642
I dont see it
He was the best swordman and fated to be the king but that's it
He doesnt exactly outshine his teammate in their respectives category so I feel like he was balanced
>>64255696
the ghost army is never even indicated to be capable of physically harming anyone in the book
the pirates basically just jump ship when the ghosts show up
this helps gondor survive the siege by removing the corsair reinforcements
jackson thought the ghost army was dumb in but left it in the film because it was a fairly big part of the book and he didnt want to disappoint fans
who wrote them as arriving and sweeping through sauron's armies like butter, i do not know. jackson wasnt the main screenwriter
though i imagine this part was added because an inordinant amount of time is spent on them in the film and if the army just showed up for 2 minutes to scare pirates off boats the whole subplot would seem like wasted time
in the end they serve the same purpose and without them gondor would have lost, though the book does it in a much less flashy way
>>64255719
>immortal unstoppable army that nobody cares about before or after their short intervention which vastly changes the course of a war
>doesn't break the story
>>64255500
he scared them all off but Frodo (the main character at that point although Sam becomes coprotagonist later) gets wounded and nearly dies. so he's not perfect - he only achieved a partial success.
Tolkien actually had really good instincts for this shit. like, you can tell he realized that Gandalf was inherently impossible to write suspense around, which is why he kept either sending him off to other places, separating him from the main characters or killing him. he does it all through the Hobbit, too.
>>64255538
He try to fight the Balrog
Gandalf tell him how retarded he is and grab him by the arm to force him to do the only sensible thing while Legolas cover the team by one-shotting everyone on the way
At no point I felt like Aragorn made everyone around him useless
>>64255886
And Aragon's objective was never "get the Ring to Mt. Doom."
They are both Mary Sues.
>>64254642
Mary Sue =/= Good at everything
>>64254815
This.
Mary Sue has to be an author insert while also having plot armour and being overpowered as fuck. It's not just one of these factors, it's gotta be all of them. Aragorn is just a fucking baller, and Rey is just a shittily written character.
Actual Mary Sues include the chick from Twilight and Luke Skywalker. She's the fan-fic author insert who gets to fuck vampires and werewolves and apparently gets her own powers later (I haven't seen them). Luke is the mediocre guy with a mediocre life who gets plucked from obscurity and saves the galaxy. His name was literally chosen because Luke S. = Lucas, and GL made him deliver his lines in the same way that GL would and even stand the same way. Also Wesley Crusher being Gene Roddenberry's fantasy for growing up amongst the stars.
These characters are wish-fulfillment for their writers. That's a Mary Sue.
Other terms used incorrectly all the fucking time on /tv/ include Deus ex Machina and MacGuffin. And yeah, "terms change over time, yadda, blah, etc", but the only fucking reason they change this bloody quickly is because retards on the internet use them stupidly and it spreads faster than your whore mother's legs.
>>64255974
yea that he did well. there are so many movies that have zero tension because there are no stakes
>>64256009
Of course that was his objective he even leads an army out to almost certain death to buy time for that reason.
>>64256009
>And Aragon's objective was never "get the Ring to Mt. Doom."
That was literally the entire goal of the Fellowship, which Aragorn was a part of.
>>64256017
>Luke Skywalker is a Mary Sue too!!!11
oh well it was fun having a serious discussion there for a while
>>64255974
>writes character that is too overpowered and doesn't know how to use him so he keeps having to come up with reasons for him to be away from the action
>"Wow, great insincts!"
>>64256017
>Luke is a mary sue
Every fucking time
>>64256099
I'm not seeing the contradiction, anon.
>>64256017
mary sues dont have to be author inserts
they're simply characters that lack any fault that is relevant to the plot
>>64256099
there's nothing wrong with having epic OP characters, you just need to use them sparingly. ancient myths have them in abundance.
there's a reason why fucking Zeus wasn't the main character of any of the Greek legends.
>>64254642
No matter how many threads you make, your reyfu is still shit
>>64256062
>>64256123
Except he actually is one, and there's nothing fucking wrong with him being one. Stop using "Mary Sue" as a fucking insult. It's a legitimate and successful way to build a character - imparting your own personality and fantasies into your protagonist.
Luke got his name from George Lucas, he got his speeder from George Lucas' childhood car, and he got whisked away to save the galaxy. This is a fucking staple of the technique, and it's been taught as one at universities long before dickheads on Twitter started calling Rey one.
>>64256017
>Luke Skywalker.
Luke gets saved by other people so often that he should never be on the list. Hell, he even gets saved by VADER.
>It's a reyfag defending her mary sue by pretending other well-liked characters were mary sue too
Aragorn was a poor, poor choice
You'll have better luck with Harry potter
>>64256060
And they were eventually successful but Aragon personally was never tasked with carrying the ring itself to Mordor. Just as Rey helped fight the First Order but personally was never tasked with blowing up Super Death Star.
They are both Mary Sues.
>>64256017
>luke
>gets btfo by his uncle
>gets btfo by veers
>gets btfo by a cave
>gets btfo by vader
>gets btfo by the emperor
>repeatedly requires saving by han to prevent his demise
>>64256187
>They are both Mary Sues.
Nope, only Rey.
>>64256160
Except he absolutely isnt, he's a useless farmboy for all of EP4.
Leia, Han, R2, Obiwan do all the hardwork for 90% of the movie and THEN Luke (Helped by his master, Obiwan) do one useful thing and that's the end of EP4
EP5 is him being barely useful at the start and then getting absolutely demolished everywhere else
EP6 is arguably the one where he's a Mary Sue, but there was a buildup for that to happen
And no, Mary sue isnt a legitimate way to build a character, it completely tilt the focus of the movie on ONE character, essentially killing the rest of the intrigue, that's bad writing, nothing more
>>64256180
we got sherlock holmes over here
>>64256295
Great argument, anon.
>>64256324
>They are both Mary Sues.
Great argument, anon.
>>64256187
The difference is that Aragorn doesnt carry the ring, he cant because he's not strong enough
That's kind of the opposite of a mary sue, he actually need other characters to succeed
>>64256364
Read the thread and then respond. It's not hard.
>>64256404
I've already explained why Rey is a mary sue and Aragorn isn't. Read the thread and then respond. It's not hard.
>>64256062
>>64256123
>>64256162
>>64256238
Sorry, just to clarify, I'm only speaking of the original Star Wars, not all the movies Luke appears in as well as fuck knows how much EU crap. I am referring only episode IV, where he functioned as a vessel for GL's fantasy of rescuing the princess, piloting the starship and saving the galaxy.
>>64256139
Yeah, they fucking do, actually, and have ever since the original Mary Sue in A Trekkie's Tale. (Not that she was actually the first character to function AS a Mary Sue, but she is the namesake of the term) That part of the parameter has just fallen away because, as I said, the internet is an excellent way to spread ignorance.
As it happens, though, it's also a great way to spread information, and there are actual papers on the subject you can read from various universities.
As I said here >>64256160, it's been taught this way long before people started calling Rey one, and Luke is one of the best examples you can teach.
Like, if I have fantasies of saving a kingdom, I could write a script, and my protagonist could be some teacher at a school in Medieval England. He walks, looks and and talks just like me. His students get kidnapped by an evil king and he manages to rescue them all, kill the evil king and become a hero, despite being nothing more than a teacher in a small community. This is exactly the same as Luke, except he's a farmboy instead of a teacher. That's called a Mary Sue, and I really can't think of a better way to explain it than that.
>>64256017
LoTR is literally full of Mary Sue's and Deus ex Machina you dumb cuckold faggot
>>64256576
Uh-huh. Work on your punctuation and come argue with us when you're ready.
>>64256576
Mary Sue literally means "One Character Who Consumes the Story and Makes Everybody Else Irrelevant."
If there is more than one mary sue, then that actually means that there are none.
>>64256532
>This is exactly the same as Luke, except he's a farmboy instead of a teacher. That's called a Mary Sue, and I really can't think of a better way to explain it than that.
First post in thread.
Nigger, you wrong.
A Mary/Gary stu is simply someone who can never fail inside of the story.
Take Onii-sama for example.
>>64256532
Have you even seen A New Hope
>>64256646
Mary Sue "literally" means that? Like... "literally"? Go kill yourself.
>>64256649
>A Mary/Gary stu is simply someone who can never fail inside of the story.
You're right, but it needs to be more than that.
Otherwise Mary/Marty/Gary Sue/Stu would apply to a ridiculously wide range of characters. Quicksilver in the latest X-Men film, for instance. It's frankly laughable to apply the term to that character.
>>64256772
>Mary Sue "literally" means that?
Yes.
>>64256639
That has to be the most autistic and try hard response I have seen in a long time.
>>64256786
>It's frankly laughable to apply the term to that character.
Not at all. He is one of the definitions of a Gary Stu.
Isn't he eating dinner with mumsie when all the shit hits the fan? Or was that the avengers movie, I can't keep track anymore.
>>64256825
You're right, it took a great deal of effort. I sure tried hard!
>>64256816
False
>>64256828
>one of the definitions of a Gary Stu.
And that's where you and I disagree.
You believe that there are a few different ways a character can be one, and I believe that a character must be all of those things to be one.
Which is fine, I suppose.
>>64256859
I disagree.
>>64256920
Well you're wrong, you fucking retard.
>>64256887
That would be fine, if there were a subjective quality as to what it means to be a gary/mary stu.
>>64256825
>having a good understanding of the english language = autism
Quite the opposite, I'm afraid. Get educated you uncultured swine, English isn't that hard.
>>64256941
hahaha you're from tumblr
>>64256941
But I'm actually right.
>>64257025
>Looking for any possible reason to deflect an argument you know you will lose
>Decide that the lack of one period is worthy enough
That, my friend, is what equals autism. They (you) are not very good on deciding what's socially acceptable.
>>64257085
Feel free to back it up.
>>64257182
Read the thread.
>>64256956
Well, I've explained what it is, I lecture on the subject, and I've even cited the "original" Mary Sue as an example of the term.
You can read up on it more here
https://www.google.com.au/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#tbm=bks&q=mary+sue+fiction
I recommend Enterprising Women: Television Fandom and the Creation of Popular Myth off the Harvard University press, and also The Ashgate Research Companion to Fan Cultures, off the Syracuse University press. You could also just wikipedia it, though I can't vouch for any facts on there. Check the sources.
Also, don't you think it's a little strange that you're saying an objective Mary Sue can be many things, whilst I am saying that it can only be one? A subjective view would have more definitions than an objective one, and multiple definitions is what you are advocating.
>>64257203
>4chan as a source
You're a fucking retard
>>64257203
Have you read it? Or are your 2.5 braincells overloaded now?
>why OP's example doesn't work
>>64254642
Aragorn is 80+ years old. He's been training for that fucking long you fucking moron.
I don't think you understand why people are calling Rey a Mary Sue, it is because she literally learned and mastered shit out of fucking nowhere
>>64257248
>>64257253
Rey is a mary sue, a textbook example of one, in fact. She hits all the major points.
>>64257235
>Also, don't you think it's a little strange that you're saying an objective Mary Sue can be many things
Where did I say this?
I've literally said a Mary/Gary stu is someone who cannot fail inside the story. Seems like one point to make a Mary/Gary stu to me.
>all that reading on literally a comic book tier character archetype.
Ha.
>I lecture on the subject
I am sorry, if this is the truth than jesus, I am simply sorry.
>>64255719
the desperation is palpable
>>64257263
Because Aragorn is Jesus?
>>64257313
What's it matter when you're that strong with the force? She might as well have been training for 80+ years. It's a plot device to hurry us to the action. It's fantasy. Jesus Christ you faggots are tiring.
>>64257263
Jesus is a self insert by the author.... Well, well, well.
ITT People forget Aaragon was stronger than most men because of his race anyway
People also forget he got saved numerous times.
>>64257353
>>Also, don't you think it's a little strange that you're saying an objective Mary Sue can be many things
>Where did I say this?
Back up here.... >>64256828
>Not at all. He is one of the definitions of a Gary Stu.
Did I misunderstand? It looks like you're saying there is more than one definition.
>all that reading on literally a comic book tier character archetype.
>Ha.
Well, that's fine, but you can't claim to understand the concept if you're just going off public opinion. This is how a lot of terms and even just words have their meanings bastardised over time, and the internet hugely speeds up that process.
>>I lecture on the subject
>I am sorry, if this is the truth than jesus, I am simply sorry.
And I'm sorry for your poor grasp of grammar. It's nice that we feel for each other.
>>64257429
It would be fine except it breaks the rules of the Star Wars world you fucking idiot, even Darth Vader started like shit and needed training, and then got rekt anyway, and he is supposed to be the "Chosen One"
"The force doesn't work like that" could very well apply to this whore's bs story
>>64257527
Darth Vader wasn't the chosen one. Luke was.
Please explain to me the rules of the force?
>>64257573
>Darth Vader wasn't the chosen one.
He absolutely was.
>>64257573
Rule 1: don't talk about force club
Rule 2 :fuck you, you silly cunt.
>>64257651
I didn't realize you were such a big fan of the shitty prequels.
>>64257522
>Did I misunderstand? It looks like you're saying there is more than one definition.
I am saying Quicksilver is a Gary Stu, as he doesn't fail. I am not sure though, haven't seen X-men in a while.
>Well, that's fine, but you can't claim to understand the concept if you're just going off public opinion
You are a proper idiot if you think anything matters other than public opinion.
The public opinion changes meanings of words, this is nothing new. Studying etymology you should know this. Dictionaries don't set the standard, they only try to relay the popular opinion.
Language has to evolve as humans do or what the fuck is the point of it? Speaking in an archaic olde-english tounge for the sake of it?
>>64257698
Shitty or not, they is canon.
>>64257724
Shitty or not, Rey is canon. So you might as well accept it. Everything you know about the force is now wrong.
>>64254642
>Tries to defend Frollo from ringwraiths
>Frollo gets stabbed
>Tries to lead fellowship to Mordor
>Two members die, two members captured, two members run away from him
>Only way he can save his people from COMPLETE DESTRUCTION is by calling upon the army of the dead as directed by Gandalf
How is he a Mary Sue?
>>64257750
I never said otherwise.
Was he a gary stu?
>>64257756
>scares off 5 ringwraiths
>solos a battalion of uruks
>convinces an undead army to fight for him
>solos an armored troll
>>64257826
>uses fire
>did not solo a battalion of uruks
>Gandalf lead him to this
>did not solo an armored troll
>>64257429
""Children are capable, of course, of literary belief, when the story-maker's art is good enough to produce it. That state of mind has been called "willing suspension of disbelief." But this does not seem to me a good description of what happens. What really happens is that the story-maker proves a successful "sub-creator." He makes a Secondary World which your mind can enter. Inside it, what he relates is "true": it accords with the laws of that world. You therefore believe it, while you are, as it were, inside. The moment disbelief arises, the spell is broken; the magic, or rather art, has failed. You are then out in the Primary World again, looking at the little abortive Secondary World from outside. If you are obliged, by kindliness or circumstance, to stay, then disbelief must be suspended (or stifled), otherwise listening and looking would become intolerable. But this suspension of disbelief is a substitute for the genuine thing, a subterfuge we use when condescending to games or make-believe, or when trying ... to find what virtue we can in the work of an art that has for us failed."
Quote from based Tolkien. This is what happened in TFA the suspension of belief was ruined when they violated the rules of the world of Star Wars. This is why TFA a shit and why Rey is a mary sue
>>64257779
Then quit being a faggot
>>64255903
C3PO knew more about the Falcon too.
And she's not better than Poe.
>>64257865
go watch it again
>>64257790
what do you call that one arm favoring cape thing he's wearing?
I can't find a name anywhere
and its definitely not called a sash
>>64254662
He has the blood of the fucking Dúnedain and the last of the blood of Númenor, YOU FUCKING IGNORANT URUK KEK. And that's why in Two Towers he's 87 years old.
>>64257826
>solos an armored troll
he's about to get literally crushed by the troll until frodo destroys the ring
and legolas and gimli are with him against uruks
he only gets the undead army because elrond had a sword remade for him and because elrond and gandalf convince him to go find the dead men of dunharrow
>>64257937
some poncho serape thing
>>64257937
It's a poncho
>>64257937
its just a poncho.
>>64257906
>Defeats multiple TIE fighters despite never having flown before.
>>64256772
No, it figuratively means that, you dense faggot.
mary sue the grey, riding some feathered sues
>>64256532
a mary sue by it's dictionary definition is not JUST a self insert
How about Sauron? Very Mary Sue.
>>64258176
Actually no although he was OP he was not allowed to use his powers. And his fight at the end was pretty desperate I reckon if Frodo did not destroy the ring he probably would have died like the rest.
>>64257717
>You are a proper idiot if you think anything matters other than public opinion.
>The public opinion changes meanings of words, this is nothing new.
Yeah, that's fair. And as I said earlier, the internet exacerbates this process. Someone finds out that the Final Destination deaths are very often orchestrated by a Rube Goldberg Device, so people start incorrectly calling deaths in other horror films Rube Goldberg Devices, too.
The helicarrier in AoU is a Deus ex Machina, so everyone starts calling everything that ever saves a protagonist a Deus ex Machina.
It's the same with Chekhov's Gun, with a MacGuffin, and with Gary/Marty/Mary Stu/Sue. See a similarity between a Mary Sue and another character? Must be another Mary Sue! Not so.
And it really is fine to use these terms if you're unsure of any more appropriate ones to use, especially in an informal, anonymous internet setting like this forum. But if you were start throwing them around willy-nilly in a professional or academic environment, you'd be laughed of the room. As pretentious or old-fashioned an opinion you may find it, the terms actually do still carry their specific meanings in the industry.
>>64258176
Also he was not a protag he played a Mentor figure which is supposed to be either very strong or very wise. He was the Merlin to Frodo/Aragorn's Arthur.
>>64258176
>Mary sue
>Was owned by Saruman, Sauron, Balrog and Nasgul.
>>64258234
He'd have just respawned.
>>64258206
Not once did I say it was, friendo. If you took a look at the post to which that reply was replying (see here >>64256017), you would've seen that I said the following
>Mary Sue has to be an author insert while also having plot armour and being overpowered as fuck. It's not just one of these factors, it's gotta be all of them.
>>64258240
>you'd be laughed of the room.
*laughed out of
>>64258218
Typical two-dimensional villain
>Look at me I'm so strong and dark and powerful
>Oh no I accidentally myself
>I'm still strong and powerful even after death
>>64258280
But not in the Middleearth
>>64258280
Not really if he did it would be in spirit form and since he failed and Sauron got his ring back Eru or Manwe probably would have let Middle-Earth be cucked by Sauron and not have interfered anymore. Thus Gandalf would have had to live knowing all his efforts were in vain. SO FUCKING TELL ME AGAIN HOW HE IS A MARY SUE??!!
>>64254817
Ringwraiths aren't expert fighters. Their weapon is primarily just fear.
Thing is, Aragorn doesn't afraid of them.
>>64258280
A Mary Sue in the LOTR universe would have had to be an excellent marxsman, swordsman, scout, wizard, etc. Would have no temptation of the ring. Would probably have put on the ring waltz through Moria and solo'd the Balrog and killed it then would have simply walked into mordor and bitch-slapped Sauron while Aragorn and Frodo profess their undying love for them.
Since there is no character that fits that billing then there is no Mary Sue in LOTR
>>64257750
>play in the shit with us anon
this is how low rey defenders sink to defend fanfiction
>>64257928
Nigger, I have that movie memorized. You go watch it again
>>64258280
Gandalf is esstentially what happens if god sent an angel down to heaven in human form and told him to nerf his power level signicantly. Even when he uses all his might and power (against the Balrog) he fucking dies and if not for Eru (The god of LOTR) literally rezzing him he would have stay dead
>>64258442
Cry moar you nerd
>>64258439
>Since there is no character that fits that
There is.
>>64258530
He was a retard though so he had a major fucking flaw. So nope still not a mary sue
>>64258546
>He was a retard
I don't think professor would use that word in his books, autist.
>>64258591
Does not matter dude dance'd around, sang, and was blissfully unaware of things around him. Which is pretty retarded behavior.
>>64255113
kek
>>64258439
So Aragorn?
>>64258509
>nerd
>posting on a mongolian flipbook animation image board
>>64258619
I do that too if I were super awesome. dance and sing while chopping off heads.
Cause he's the last mellon of middle earth.
Can someone explain what a Mary Sue is?
Im guessing it's a god mode character
>>64256532
Luke isnt the best at everything he ever does like the Trekkie Mary Sue you use as the archetype. Luke does however function perfectly in the heroes journey archtype which is what George Lucas set out to do. He studied Joseph Campbell and was intrigued by the heroes journey, the character of Luke even goes through many changes during development finally settling on the Luke we have now. There is some self insert in there I'll grant you. He is however flawed, unlike Mary Sue characters.
>>64255500
He scared them off for a couple of weeks tops.
>>64259557
How was Luke flawed in IV?
>>64259556
google it. this meme started when Max Landis called Rey a mary sue
>>64259681
He's naive.
He says and does some stupid shit because of this... And usually gets beaten down because of it and grows from it.
>>64258063
>>64258084
>>64258086
i guess yeah its just weird, does wearing it in that style have a name? Hard to be specific when searching for a poncho worn that way. Clint eastwood and the main guy from deadball are like the only ones I can think of off hand
>>64259929
Is he any more naive than Rey, trusting in Finn or believing her family's coming back for her?
He's a good pilot and a good shot before he leaves Tatooine, and then after he leaves he swings across chasms, out-shoots stormtroopers, guns down TIE-fighters and then makes the money shot without his targeting computer. There's maybe one moment where his character experiences any growth and that's when Obi-Wan dies - and even then, his skill doesn't grow any.
Again, only speaking on ep IV.
>>64260137
Yes, he's far more naive, because he actually gets his ass kicked regularly and constantly needs to rely on the help of other people
His attempt to rescue Leia, for example, ended up being a complete clusterfuck where he had to rely on Han, Obi Wan, and Leia (who he was supposed to be rescuing) to carry most of the weight.
>>64257500
People also forget everything went to shit after he took charge of the Fellowship. Boromir died, Merry and Pippin were taken and Frodo decided he was better off on his own
>>64257651
>>64257573
>>64257698
Rey is the chosen one
>>64254642
He wasn't a Mary Sue because in the end he isn't the hero. That's the entire point of the Lord of the Rings, that even though Legolas and Aragorn and all of the people accompanying Frodo are OP it's Frodo who is ultimately the hero because he can resist temptation and has the spirit and will of one, and that's without being a skilled or powerful warrior
There is no reason for Rey to be so OP other than lol the force says so, which doesn't even make any sense because Luke constantly got his ass kicked
>>64254642
>>64254815
>mega-powerful
>"I don't think I can do it... How could I ever...?"
>does it anyway
Mary-Sue doesn't mean someone that's a static character. In fact, most Mary-Sue's are self-doubting emos.
>>64260137
>>64260137
This isn't about Rey.
But if you like we can list some things he does.
Moaning and complaining about not being able to go off and have an adventure ( he was about to join the Imperial Academy).
He takes of the restraining bolt on R2.
He then sneaks out to go find R2 going into a known dangerous area, almost gets killed because of it.
In the Cantina he brings in the Droids.
Pisses off some bad men, almost gets killed because of it.
Gets annoyed with Han because he thinks he knows everything about piloting and could do a better job.
He is set up to be a pilot, but obviously not as knowledgeable as Han.
He flies the toy around when he's meant to be cleaning the droids, an actual spaceship is in the background of the home, the same he was playing with. Ben mentions he is a good pilot. He mentions he can fly numerous times and of course could make it into the imperial academy for pilots. In deleted scene he even flies and they talk about him piloting even more. Also later on Biggs mentions him being a great pilot to red leader.
>>64260514
What's your point if not that Rey is more of a Mary Sue? Sorry, I've obviously got you mixed up with another debate I was having in this same thread. I've been awake for quite a while.
>>64260514
you can be mary sue and make mistakes lol
>>64257429
>What's it matter when you're that strong with the force?
Because "power level" doesnt make good writing
Why are we calling Rey Mary Sue when in actuality she's just a way overpowered boring character?
A mary sue is a character that the creator wishes was them, like Harry Potter or Bella Swan or Sooki Stackhouse.
>>64254642
Boromir is a better swordsman than Aragorn you silly billies.
>>64260374
Neo is a classic hero going through the epic hero's cycle.
>>64260647
My point was Luke's not a mary sue.
>>64260690
These mistakes are due to his flaw. His Naivety, hence why he isn't a mary sue.
>>64254662
>Was it ever explained why he was so OP?
Yes, he is the direct male line descendant of BOTH houses of half elven, which also had Maiar blood, AND they said in him the Numenorean blood ran true. So basically he is descended from OP elves, OP humans and an OP "angel"...he is descended from the greatest humans and elves to walk the earth.
>>64254817
>fights off 5 ring wraiths by himself
...and Glorfindel chased off all nine by himself
>>64255276
>Because LoT is trash devoid of...meaningful death.
>Theodred's death puts Theoden into a black melancholy
>Theoden's death at Pelanor drives Eomer into destructive anger and nearly kills all the good guys
>Boromir's death drives Denathor to dispair and suicide, leaving the city to fall if not for Gandalf holding it together until Aragorn showed up
>>64257488
He literally is.
The fiction being : THE WORLD
And the author being : GOD
Lrn2 Trinity bitch.
>>64254662
Aragorn, Son of Arathorn and Gilraen, the heir of Isildur.
He's not some random schmuck who gets crowned the king due to heroic feats.
>>64264626
Oh, so he's a special snowflake. Also he's got a special sword that gets reforged and his own special elf maiden and kingdom
Sounds like a Mary Sue to me
>>64254662
If he's so OP how come Viggio Morgenstern broke his toe when he kicked that orc helmet?
>>64254662
read the books faglord
>>64264625
You are a special kind of retard.
>>64264964
I dont think you understand what a Mary Sure is, or a special snowflake fro that matter
I don't know how old Aragorn is exactly, but in the movie's it's said hes over 80 years old.
>80 years old, still in his youthful prime
>Almost 80 years of combat experience
>Fights orcs with 1 day combat experience
>Mary sue?
Yeah no
>>64256060
>le happy elf dad: You have no oath. You only have to help Frodo as long as you want to xd :^)
>>64258099
and later claims she didn't know how she did that
also! that fucking one take shot of poe annihilating several tie fighters. rey has nothing on him.
>>64254642
It's kind of funny the word Mary Sue was rarely on /tv/ before one appeared in TFA and then for some reason it became a new meme.
Pic unrelated.
>>64257906
>C3PO knew more about the Falcon too.
you mean R2D2?
>>64266719
TFA was a huge movie, for better or for worse
>>64266719
Shills
>>64266719
Max Landis called Rey a mary sue in his review and it took off as a meme
