The commentary about the lightsaber duel is stupid.>b-but how could an untrained GIRL beat him?
Alright, let's end this stupid meme talking point.1. Kylo Ren is powerful in the Force, like his mother before him. That's why he can freeze blaster bolts in the air, read minds, and basically do godly shit with his Force abilities. He is however, very untrained with the lightsaber. This is evident in the way he uses the lightsaber, in wild, hacking swings. There's no finesse or skill. It doesn't really look like he's attune to the Force when he's fighting, rather he's just hacking away like a kid with a stick. The Emperor mentions that his training only really begins when he kills Han. Also his amatuer status with a lightsaber is evident in the lightsaber itself. It's not a clean blade, it's a rusty piece of shit with a violatile blade ready to explode at any second.
2. He was injured! The movie continuously points out that he is injured in the fight. The movie also goes out of it's way to show how powerful Chewie's bowcaster is. It doesn't just kill Stormtroopers, it blows them across the room and into the wall with large holes in them. Han uses it and nearly cums his pants. Kylo Ren essentially had a giant hole in his torso before the fight with Rey ever began. Also, he keep pounding on it in an attempt to make it worse, out of some vague misinterpretation of Sith philosophy that "pain makes your connection to the dark side stronger".
>>63823870
a glib facsimile
>>63823870
he hits his wound to numb it pretty basic. and if bowcaster btfo everybody why did it only wound him and not send him flying off the bridge? he is wearing robes.
>>63823870
This and he killed his father ten minutes prior, after being conflicted about it. You kill your dad and then fight someone while wounded and see if you're up to par.
>>63823929
It hit his belt buckle through the grace of God.
>>63823929
Force powers bro
>>63823929
Well, Chewie was much further away. And also, Kylo Ren is strong with the Force.
>he hits his wound to numb it pretty basic
Nah, that's Jedi shit. Numbing pain, keeping calm, serenity, etc. Like when Rey closed her eyes in the duel.
>>63823870
What you said plus the fact that he was an emotional wreck through the whole thing.
>>63823870
It's also implied that Rey was trained before and abandoned on Jakku after Kylo's betrayal. He sees the ocean and an island in her mind, so we can assume she was with Luke before and recived proper training. It's shown that the force is strong in her and she has proper combat training (she's really good with staff).
All you faggots defending kylo ren are laughable.
Right at the very start of the end fight scene.
He force pushed Rey up and into a damn tree dazing her out.
So no, he wasn't injured enough to have a dent on his fighting capability.
Not seen the film, but I do know Wookie bowcasters are retard strong. Theyre an actual crossbow bolt with an energy field around them. If the plasma doesnt kill you, you've still got a metal barb in/through you.
>>63823870
dude, you're on /tv/, ppl here are just autist
just read the comments and kek a little
>>63824188
>He force pushed Rey up and into a damn tree dazing her out.
>So no, he wasn't injured enough to have a dent on his fighting capability.
What does one point have to do with the other?
>>63824188
Yeah, that hole in his abdomen and the fact that he was a mental wreck didn't hinder him in any way.
>>63824231
Its okay anon. That nigga just don't understand the force.
It was stupid and the Rey character is kind of OP mary sue.
When he fought Finn, it looked like he was toying with him and as soon as he took a lucky graze from Finn he absolutely rekt Finn in 2 seconds flat. Kinda like how Luke got a hit on Vader who then rekt him.
And how the fuck can we say that Kylo Ren is amateur? We know its been years since Luke disappeared and he disappeared because Kylo Ren turned and killed all the others in training. So he is obviously somewhat trained to a good level if he can kill a bunch of other Jedi and force Luke to flee.
Rey going toe to toe with him with absolutely zero training was stupid as hell, especially since a few scenes early and a few hours in movie time we saw Kylo Ren able to freeze her in place.
>>63824245
Still doesn't make up for the fact that Rey had 0
literally 0 training. She found out about the force in the morning and seemed to be in the 90th percentile of jedis by the afternoon
It was insanely silly.
Ok but what was with the lightsaber being non lethal in this movie?Kylo gets slashed in the face and looked like Rey had his hand, and Boyega gets fucking uppercut on the spine, but they just took flesh wounds?
>>63824316
but what about when ren reminds her that the force exists and she goes super sayan?
>>63824245
If you can force push someone that far and daze them out when injured.
You can do that 2 more times.
Instead of going for a protracted lightsabre duel (which a jedi should win anyway).
>amnesia explains my powers
If this cliche is being used, i will fucking laugh hard.
>>63824316
Luke trained her before sending her to Jakku, retard, and we already saw she's very skilled with melee weapons when she was beating niggas up with her staff.
>>63824400
you mean possibly trained her when she was less then 3-4 years old?
You do remember the flashback had her as a mere child crying being separated in the same planet.
>>63824454
Even if she was trained for 1 year that would be more training than Luke ever hard. And like I said she already had some skill with melee weapons.
>>63824339
He caught her off guard at first. As we see in the fight, she's more connected to the Force after that. Also he wanted to beat her with the lightsaber. Wanted to prove himself.
smhh at you all freaking out cuz a female has unlimited powah..another attempt by the patriarchy to opress females ... cys scum
>>63824316
She did have a staff. The first part of the movie where the guys try to steal bb8 demonstrates her skill with the staff. Also she's a skywalker, and frankly, it doesn't look like Ren has much training with a lightsaber either.
>>63824589
it doesn't matter if he caught her off guard. She has 0 experience with the force outside of Han Solo saying "yeah man that jedi shit exists"
I don't know how people are sitting here and defending her force usage. It was a complete joke to anyone with any knowledge of star wars. There were plenty of ways to write her without her mastering force abilities without even seeing them having anyone explain the basics to her
Why the hell is there a jedi academy if it takes less than 24 hours to become proficient in it? She should be able to beat Snoke by mid way through the next movie at the rate she was advancing.
>>63824188
kylo needs defending because hes threatening at first until the plot demands him to be beaten by there mary sue OC so they nerf him mid film and change his personality and abilitys each time he takes his mask off
>>63824042
Gott strafe Republik
>>63823870
im more bothered by the fact that lighsabers should be weightless yet it looks like they weight as much as steel sword would.
>>63824400
>>63824454
no mention of her being lukes daugter, and beging good with one weapon dosnt equal being good with all melee weapons, swords and staves and very differant
>>63824755
To be fair their weight has been inconsistent throughout all of the films. Official canon doesn't even know if they're weightless or heavy as fuck or what. It's never stated.
>>63824326
They don't always automatically cut through anything. Even in AOTC Dooku did some shallow cuts on Obi Wan without taking his whole leg/arm off.
When Luke goes apeshit on Vader in ROTJ he doesn't even cut the railing in half with his heavy swings.Finn should definitely be dead/paralyzed for life though. He got fucking murked.
>>63824316
Rey had melee experience because of her staff
Finn probably had some kind of melee training like most First Order Stormtroopers that now have their not-lightsabre-sabres
Kylo mostly uses the Force and is probably scared of lightsabre combat because his uncle and grandfather lost their hands. That's also why his sabre has a guard to prevent that from happening to him.
>>63824301
>So he is obviously somewhat trained to a good level if he can kill a bunch of other Jedi and force Luke to flee
He killed a bunch of wannabe jedi students, and he had six other guys with him. For all we know he did fuck all aside from stab that one dude from the flashback in the back and the other dudes did all the work.
And Luke probably wasn't even there. Showed up too late, and burned the bodies.
Rey, yeah, mary sue, but still
>>63823870
Kylo ren is the most inept and utterly useless "Evil guy" I have ever seen in a movie.
A random guy with no trainining whatsoever AND not force sensistive can hold his own against him in a lightsaber fight, even managing to wound him before losing
He can't deflect a bowcaster shot despite Chewbacca not being exactly subtle about it
He can't break the mind of a girl who didn't even knew she was strong in the Force
He gets his shit slapped by a girl who never held a lightsaber in her life
The kill rate of Kylo Ren in the movie amounts to two defensless old men
He loses his shit like a an edgelord teenager when things go wrong
The only reason he turned to the dark side is because he wanted to be as cool as Vader, he even wears a similar helmet even if he has no reason to do it
He offers himself as a master to rey even if she is clearly already stronger than him
Kylo Ren might be strong in the Force, but he is an utter failure both as a dark jedi and as a man.
He is just a Darth Vader fanboy who happens to have Force powers
Why didn't he just force push her into a second tree? Did getting knocked out make her a better Jedi? Then why didn't Yoda just beat Luke with rocks for 30 minutes?
>>63824339
Finn he wanted to kick the fuck out of for being a traitor.
Rey, he's meant to be capturing and bringing back to Snoke. Could he have KOd her against a tree again and dragged her off? Yeah, but he evidently wanted to have a little mid-fight chat with her and see if he could get her to defect willingly. What a nice fella
>>63824708
>She has 0 experience with the force
Obviously this isn't true. She knows about mind tricks, she knew she could call the lightsaber to her, she knew she could close the door on the monster on the Falcon. She's very experienced with the Force.
>>63824685
This. She's obviously gotten into scraps on Jaku. Her school of hard-knock-life was about equal to Kylo's upper class life and a few years of Jedi training, especially when he was injured and distracted.
>>63824979
>He can't break the mind of a girl who didn't even knew she was strong in the Force
Vader couldn't break the mind of his daughter and all the while he was unable to sense her being his daughter or having force powers while she was completely unaware of her force powers
>>63824755
If they were weightless fighting with them would be stupid. You'd just jerk your wrist around because you wouldn't need to connect with any force to do damage (unlike a real sword) and it's weightless so you don't need to put effort into moving it. End result, slap fighting basically
>>63823929
>and if bowcaster btfo everybody why did it only wound him and not send him flying off the bridge?
Hey guys does anyone have that pic of the futur 2 actress, the black one and the lesbian looking one that'l be in the next movies ? The one that makes people say Rey is going to turn lesbian and Finn'll end up with the black woman
>>63825084
Vader never used the Force on Leia, he used a torture droid
>>63824979
>He is just a Darth Vader fanboy who happens to have Force powers
No shit, this is literally all he's supposed to be
>>63825115
Can he really be called a "fanboy" when Anakin was his grandfather?
>>63825109
What is this, politically correct: the movie?
Mass Effect: the movie?
>>63825112
Why wouldn't he?
>>63825140
Yes
Duh
>>63824165
>>63824400
She was abandoned on Jakku when she was like, 5 years old. Was she training as a Jedi when she was 3? Did she magically learn how to use the force and wield a lightsaber better than Luke did for most of the OT when she was 3?
>>63824685
Her being a skywalker means jack shit. Luke was a skywalker too and he mostly got his ass whooped until much later. And a staff isn't the same as a lightsaber. Further, if she was raised in a tough environmnet where she had to learn how to fight to survive I would expect her to be cold and untrusting
>>63825160
But is aspiring to be more like one of your family members really being a fanboy?
>>63825144
Just fuck my shit up VII
Seriously tho if you have that pic I need to send it to someone
It's been said already, she knows how to fight.
Remember in the prequels qui-gon said that the force basically gives them foresight. So all she had to do was react. Given how shitty Kylo's skills with a lightsaber are it's understandable she could beat him.
Call shit out on JJs the wand chooses the wizard shit which explains the force pull.
As for the mind trick, that was just fucking Disney tier comedy. But remember Jedi mind tricks were known outside the Jedi order. Remember space jew from TPM
>>63824979
Yeah but doesn't this all add to how interesting his character is and how promising his arc will be? Rather than Rey whose just boring as shit, the only interesting thing about her, her denial of parents coming back was gotten over in like 5 seconds.
>>63824755
The Orige Trige Lucas told Mark Hamill that he needed two hands when wielding it because it was heavy like Excalibur. This was mostly to give them a sense of power and respect, and not just flailing them around.
Of course he didn't really tell anyone else so people started treating Lightsabers like toys (Because of actually having the toys) and Lucas went for spectacle in the prequels.
So basically, it's whatever makes you feel better. I prefer a world with weightier lightsabers.
>>63824708
Did you not see her eyes light up whe she heard jedi and shit where true, she probably spent her childhood hearing legends of the force.
Am I the only one that didn't mind how Kylo wielded his Lightsaber? I thought it worked quite well with the style of his lightsabre.
>>63825475
I liked it too.
Just hacking and slashing things apart instead of doing weird dance moves like the prequels had.
>>63825475
I didn't mind because it was obvious he still lacked training in lightsaber whereas he's good at the Force, people bitching he got beaten easily were expecting a Darth Maul 2.0
people who say ren was injured somehow forget that he throw rey against a fucking tree so she should be injured as well
I really don't know how so many people forget Ren got shit
>>63825189
Yes
>>63824979
> He loses his shit like a an edgelord teenager when things go wrong
That's the point. Because evil guys are usually teenagers inside. They just learn to hide it with age.
Wise grown up person will not ever fall for a boring teenage dream like "Dark Side".
>>63823870
Yeah, I figured the injury from Chewy would help even the playing field when I saw it.
Even then - I still thought he would tear Finn to shreds. It was refreshing that he actually did end up almost killing him.
>>63825561
She was unconsious for a while though, Ren didn't even get a second to sleep it off.
Also I think having a fucking hole in your body is worse than getting knocked out
>>63825394
>Orige Trige
I like this
I hope this is the right webm butFinn should really be dead
>>63825149
cuz he didn't have time for that shit
>>63823870
His chewie hole was aldo bleeding pretty bad.
not sure how many of you have had bloodloss before but you feel a tiredness, like you just ran a marathon, that immediately jumps to exhaustion as soon as try to do anything.
>>63825475
I liked the part where the little handguard bit everyone made fun of was actually useful. Like, despite how retarded it was that the fight even took place, the fight between him and Rei was actually pretty good I think.
>>63825771
He was in pretty fucken bad shape.
It looks to have run an inch or two deep, into the right half of his back , traveling from his kidney to scapula.
>>63825966
Execute 'em
Ren looked a lot like Severus Snape, nuh what I'm sayin'?
>>63826061
Yeah you nailed it. He pretty clearly gets sliced a few inches deep all the way up the right side of his back just off-center from the spine.
I guess that wouldn't be exactly fatal, but holy shit get the kid in a bacta tank fast.What confuses me is that a few anons with otherwise 100% accurate spoilers said Finn loses his right eye. I was hoping he'd get an eyepatch in later movies.
>>63825771
i like how he is like 'playnig's over', and ends it
>>63825561
Not as bad as bloodloss. Seriously, it fucks you up.
The real reason is the you can't use that lightsaber without cutting your own wrist off. Not even Obi-Wan would be able to use that shit.
>>63826109
It's poetry
It's exactly like when Luke gets that shallow cut on Vader's shoulder in ESB and then 2 seconds later Vader disarms him.
>>63826109
i wanted to write playing, but this typo is even better
>>63825771
Wtf is that shot on the lightsaber, do we really need to see it flying into the snow?
After Finn is lying on the ground you could just show it in the snow and it would become obvious it flew right in there.
It just interrupts the fight in a strange way.
>>63823929
>and if bowcaster btfo everybody why did it only wound him and not send him flying off the bridge?
same reason why Vader was able to absorb blaster shots with his hand that would kill anybody else
>inb4 that stupid EU content that Vader had Blaster-absorbing gloves
>>63826209
Its so the audience has a moment to think about how fucked finn is.
>>63823870
You forget something as well. He toyed with Finn, and couldn't kill/hurt Rey because Snoke wanted her.
>>63826103
In one episode of adventure time, dosent finn have a missing eye?
>>63823929
>>63823929
>he hits his wound to numb it pretty basic
No, you literal moron. He hits it to cause himself pain, to fuel his dark side abilities.
>>63824971
>We know its been years since Luke disappeared and he disappeared because Kylo Ren turned and killed all the others in training. So he is obviously somewhat trained to a good level if he can kill a bunch of other Jedi and force Luke to flee.
Other Jedi in training, who were probably killed by surprise. He was probably the best of a bad/unprepared bunch, so that isn't saying much.
He was falling to the dark side before ever even going to Luke, so if Luke had half a brain, he'd not have taught him anything to do with lightsaber combat or construction until after any dark was eliminated (whiich evidently never happened, and he had to build his own fucked up facsimile of a lightsaber instead). Plus he had the Knights of Ren with him.
He seems more force adept than saber adept. Then add in his injuries from Chewie's OP as fuck bowcaster, him being an emotional wreck/tempremental child/mental midget and he has all the groundwork for being incompetent in a fight.
People like you wrongly assume he's achieved lightsaber mastery just because he's been mentioned in the same breath as Luke.
>>63825179
Are you joking? We see the Jedi training toddlers in the prequels. At 10 they are considered too old.
>>63825189
Yes. It's the same how people on /pol/ fantasise about being their grandparents and fighting for Hitler instead of against.
>>63826437
Jedi just like cunny desu.
Kylo Ren needing training as a Sith doesn't mean that he was never trained at all. The movie shows that he was trained as a Jedi by his uncle Luke, who was one of the best Jedis there is. He obviously learned how to use the foce and fight with a lightsaber.
Him needing a training as a Sith just means that he needs to be better at being an edgy cunt. That's it. That's why it was important he killed his own father to really start training as a Sith. That doesn't have anything to do with expertise as a force user or lightsaber dueler. It just means right now he's too good a person still to be a proper Sith.
Take for example Anakin. He was a great Jedi MASTER, but he still lacked training as a SITH.
Just admit that the movie is inconsistent as fuck.
>>63826437
And that was a dumb idea from the prequels, what's your point?
>>63826523
>He obviously learned how to use the foce and fight with a lightsaber.
>teaching a kid that is known to be showing signs of becoming the next Vader how to use a weapon
"No"
Teaching him how to use the force to control his dark side urges, sure. Teaching him how use a weapon that can kill? Just no. Luke probably taught him Jedi lore and shit like that, then being the angsty faggot he is, wishing he was like Grandpa, got mad that he didn't learn cool shit with lightsabers and fucked off with the Knights of Ren.
>>63826611
obi wan didn't even see the signs anakin was going to be Darth Vader and he was around in a time with dozens of light side force users. There is no way Luke would be able to tell kylo was going to snap
>>63826839
Han and Leia literally say in the movie the reason they sent him to Luke was because of the Vader in him. They were well aware.
>>63826611
>Luke probably taught him Jedi lore and shit like that
Take that probably and stick it up your ass. You don't know shit. Ren was more powerful in the force usage than Anakin and Luke. He had shown plenty of expertise at lightsaber duel even if he was full of rage. He was confident in it. He was obviously trained at both the force use and lightsaber duel.
Rey was trained only in staff and not only won the fight, but managed to overpower him with physical strength alone. She did the same thing at the beginning of the movie.
Shit was inconsistent, yo. Him being hurt didn't stopped him before. Why would be such a handcap with Rey, a girl? The same girl that wnt flying against a tree moments ealier?
Fuck the defenders.
>>63826892Kylo lost because he's the real hero of this trilogy, and the hero usually loses their first fight. Rey is going to turn to the dark side because of her crazy out-of-control force powers and Kylo will turn back to the light.
>>63825788
Man, Dude's just chillin on the death star. Getting the stolen data tapes was his job. Why wouldn't he put some effort into that?
Rey won only because MUH GURL POWER. Her losing would've been contrary to the SJW narrative JJ is pushing so hard for. All this speculation and discussion over why she won is nice but just remember that it's fiction.
>>63826892
> You don't know shit. Ren was more powerful in the force usage than Anakin and Luke. He had shown plenty of expertise at lightsaber duel even if he was full of rage. He was confident in it. He was obviously trained at both the force use and lightsaber duel.
Nor do you, really. The difference is what I said fits in with his incompetence, whereas you are fanwanking about how your favoured edgelord character is the best.
He hasn't had to fight anybody of any caliber in the movie and probably hasn't done anything of note in his entire lifetime. The guy is an incompetent nonce and throws temper tantrums like a toddler. Hopefully he'll get better as the trilogy progresses.
A 14-year-old Ahsoka would have slapped his shit.
>>63827015
>The difference is what I said fits in with his incompetence, whereas you are fanwanking about how your favoured edgelord character is the best.
I'm not fanwanking. I fucking hate the stupid character. He IS better than Anakin and Luke at force usage. He did things none of them ever did in all of the previous movies. He fought really well with Finn even while injured.
He only started to get his shit pushed in when he fought Rey because the VAGINA FORCE.
>>63826942
actual best case scenario outcome for this trilogy
>>63826239
>inb4 that stupid EU content that Vader had Blaster-absorbing gloves
Do you even Tutaminis bro?
>>63824900
But then the diversity armor that stopped him from dying wouldn't exist.
>>63827116
New tricks doesn't mean better. It's like academia. Compare Sir Isaac Newton to some regular scientist now. A regular scientist has more at his disposal now and can play with more toys, but would said regular scientist have been brilliant enough to make the discoveries and formulae that Newton did? Probably not.
Ren is a modern scientist, Anakin and Luke are prodigies. Ren is playing with a few new toys, but that doesn't make him better than Anakin or Luke. Fuck, Luke may have learned those things in the interim, but unlike you, I'm open to speculation wheras you're deadset on sucking off Kylo as being a master force and lightsaber expert when he's only shown a few party tricks that barely worked.
>>63823870
If only he didn't dominate the fight until some magical moment happened at the cliff.
What the fuck is the deal with all the characters in these movies being related to each other?
Cant we just get some original characters instead of enlarging the family tree?
>>63827256
You're a goddamn retard. It wasn't the fact that he did some new tricks, it was that he was shown as really powerful. Not even Darth Vader could mind-rape people and Ben/Ren could.
Just don't fucking reply to me again. Your stupidity is annoying me.
>>63827256
That all said, Rey's sudden powerup was still Mary Sue bullshit. Too much, too soon. It would have been better if it was progressive power ups. Literally where the fuck does she go from here?
>People literally forgetting the mental damage since he killed his own father and was Basically in the verge of crying
>>63827315
> Not even Darth Vader could mind-rape people and Ben/Ren could.
Failed to mindrape Poe. Failed to mindrape Rey. Literally fucking useless.
Go suck off Ren some more, you edgy goth faggot.
Regardless of training or whatever there's no reason for Rey to be more powerful than Kyolo when he has Skywalker blood and his fucking grandfather was basically created by the force.
>>63827307
They are the new generation, figuratively and literally
Its like poetry, it rhymes
>>63827350
He mindraped Poe. Vader couldn't even mind-rape people.
>>63827349
Rey saw Finn badly injured if not dead, her adopted step father died, the world is exploding around her. She would also be badly emotionally compromised
>ITT: Why does the good guy beat the bad guy?
>goliath should of never lost to david david didnt even use a slingshot before
>>63827476
Good guy beats bad guy formula is boring as shit.
>>63827476
So if Rey defeated Ren, Snoke and the entire empire on her own in the first hour you would be ok with that?
Fucking retards in here not able to follow the plot of a very basic film and still saying Rey had no training. They could not have spelt it out more clearly that she had blocked out her traumatic memories of being the only survivor of the slaughter at the temple and her training was coming back to her in chunks as she went on.
>>63827518
No, but thats because theres 2 more movies left. I guarentee you in EP 8 Kylo will wreck her shit, in 9 he'll either be a good guy or lose for good.
>>63826942
I'd be ok with this. Whether JJ goes through with it or not is another question. He was terrified ofkilling Han Solobut since that seems to have gone down well he might get more ambitious.
We'll probably see a significant shift in Ren's character in the 2nd movie though.
If JJ wanted to go all out though he should make Finn a double agent who betrays everyone at the end of the 2nd movie because of stormtrooper conditioning.
>>63826996
'Cause Grand Moff Tarkin a shit and Vader isn't trying to be his bitchboy doing the work that they have actual droids specifically built to do.
>>63826942
Ehhh... I'd like to believe but him killing han I think ruined that
>>63827421
As someone who isn't Force sensitive. Poe resisted pretty fucking well since it took several attempts and all of his might. Force persuasion works far better. It's like he was only taught half-way and made his own bastard form of persuasion that is half as effective.
>>63827534
No where in the flashbacks did it show her training. And even if you speculated she did it still doesn't make sense for a someone who was educated as a child, who presumably forgot or had her skills atrophy for the past decade to beat someone who is powerful and has been training his whole life.
Throughout the entire movie we saw Kylo as emotionally unstable, but he was never presented as unskilled. There is no reason to believe he was some untrained loser unless you need to find some way to ironically justify a lesser trained Rey winning.
>>63827588
>make Finn a double agent who betrays everyone at the end of the 2nd movie because of stormtrooper conditioning.
Oh shit. I like that a lot.
Either that or Poe is the double agent. Maybe Kylo brainwashed him during their interrogation.
>>63827616
You think so? Nobody even seems that upset about it. Kylo is no less redeemable than Vader was.
>>63827421
Vader didn't even really try to mind rape anyone but leia. He would just intimidate people into cooperating with him
>>63827476
>ITT: Why does the good guy beat the bad guy?
That's not the problem. People are complaining about the execution.
Also, David was supposed to use a sword, but he wasn't used to it so he chose a slingshot instead.
All of this shit could have been explained in a single 5 second long scene where after force pushing Rey into the tree he tried to do the same to Finn but then grabbed at his wound in severe pain.
It would show that his would has weakened him so much he can't even use the force properly anymore and all he had left were his lightsaber skills. The battle with Finn would play out the same (rekking Finn after Finn got a lucky hit in and pissed him off) and it would set up the battle with Rey nicely given how she already has decent melee skills.
A 5 second scene. Why is J.J. such a hack?
>>63827744
That would make Kylo sympathetic to the audience, and make Rey look like a bad guy who beats up on wounded people.
>>63827638
She was there, what was she doing if not training? Cleaning? fuck off. It' also made pretty obvious she's Luke's daughter, so she'll be the main Jedi of this series and will be the most powerful.
>>63824979
Its good to see you have no deductive reasoning skills whatsoever
>>63823870
Are fanboys still in denial?
How could Ray beat him with almost no traning?
So what were Rey's flaws?
Since she seemed to be amazing at literally everything she turned her hand too.
It's like a badly written fan fiction character who shows up and is as good as all the experts at everything.
>Kilo Gram
>was trained by one of the best Jedis in existence
>was beginning his training as a Sith, but that had nothing to do with force use or lightsaber duel
>was shown as a powerful user and skilled lightsaber duelist previously before the final fight
>was injured by Chewie and emotionally unstable from killing his own father
>Ray
>is a fucking girl
>thought the Jedis were a legend hours earlier and never used a lightsaber before
>was never trained at lightsaber dueling, only staff that she never left
>was emotionally unstable from seeing Han dyeing, Finn almost dyeing, various planets exploding
>was thrown far away and hit pretty hard a tree
>she's a very thin girl, might i add
Fuck the defenders.
>>63827744
Pretty good. If Ray were so good, I would've preferred it if she weren't getting rekt before the cliff scene. The sudden turnaround after that because of a "click" scene really ruined it.
Kylo is really fucking strong at using the force but shit with a saber. During the final battle I have no idea why the fuck he didn't just throw trees or force push Rey off the fucking ledge. Makes no good damn sense. Sure the saber pull was suppose to show it didn't "want" Kylo but his general force use throughout the movie was impressive then he fights Rey without using the force once....
WHAT THE FUCK.
Instead of Rey kicking his ass it would he been so much better if she actually took some damage or lost a body part. Gets pinned down by Kylo but uses Hans blaster go end the fight on a stalemate. Disney is too fucking puss to make a scene where a pretty girl takes life threatening damage.
The movie would be a lot better without the whole lightsaber duel sequence.
I just can't believe how people defend that shit, it takes all the tension and expectations for future duels.
>>63824042
Gott mit uns!
>>63826942
100% agreed with this, except I think boyegabong will be the real hero.
>>63827897
>use Hans blaster
That would have been a great fuck you from your recently murdered dad.
>>63827838
she really wanted to go back to jakku badly for a few dozen minutes
other than that she was a perfect goody two-shoes
I really hope this was all just to set her up for an eventual role reversal between her and Kylo in a later movie
>>63825055
Raven plot twist when?
oh god, maybe she's the student who killed everyone?! it's never said that Kylo was the traitor. not even the flashback confirm it.
i know it will not be that way, because muh strong woman character who can do no wrong, but still one can dream.
>>63827897
feminist power fantasy doesn't lose to men or need help with anything.
>>63824326
Just the tip bby
>>63823870
They could have solved this
They could have prevented all this
Here I go:
>Kylo loses his footing because the ground is literally crumbling away (He is so preoccupied with his killing intent that he doesn't pay enough attention to his surroundings, pretty dark side huh?)
>he is momentarily distracted which gives wondergirl the opportunity to strike
>exactly the same stuff happens outside of that little detail.
This character along with the girl from Tomorrowland, another perfect know it all.
Has Disney been taken over by man hating women?
>>63827805
If you are Luke's daughter, the you are either training or cleaning? The only thing presented was that she was abandoned, anything else is unjustified speculation. I don't care if she becomes the most powerful as long as the development makes sense and is well presented. I wouldn't even mind if she had overpowered Ren purely through the force in some undirected way. The way she basically overpowered Ren with sudden lightsabre proficiency is what bothers me. It deflates tension if she can suddenly acquire whatever skill she needs regardless of the situation
>>63825561
it may also sign that he was unstable, because of the wound, used too much force unintentionally.
she didn't beat him
he was trying to kill her
>>63827317
It was not a powerup is was getting her emotions in check and focus.
There is no emotion, there is peace.
There is no passion, there is serenity.
There is no chaos, there is harmony.
Why Kylo was a freaking mess in the emotion department. He could not even harness his emotions like Anakin did in his fight with Obi-Wan
>>63828026
>>63828050
Pretty much. As soon as Rey was shown to be force sensitive I knew the movie was going full retard and she would be untouchable.
>>63826103
Kylo got his face wrecked, maybe he will get the eye-patch?
My friend thought the movie was shit not because of anything else but because that there was only lightsabers. He expected lightaxes, lighthammers and lightscythes.
>>63827256
>It's like academia.
Did you just go full retard? What the fuck is your post supposed to mean? Nice headcanon, cunt.
>>63828132
I'm afraid you have to put your friend down. It's for his own good.
>>63827673
I Think Kylo and Rey is the only ones in risk of changing sides. But anything can happen because of all the plot holes and essentialy completely flat characters with no motivation.
>>63827897
>During the final battle I have no idea why the fuck he didn't just throw trees or force push Rey off the fucking ledge. Makes no good damn sense
>He was trying to convince her to be his apprentice
>He was badly injured and bleeding a lot losing his focus, strenght and agility.
Rey won the duel because Kylo was injured with a wookie bowcaster. That's it.
>>63828132
L I G H T S C Y T H E S
>>63826436
it's actually good that got wrecked, so finn would stand a chance. the real problem in that scene is Rey, who pulls force powers out of her ass. seriously, JJ needs to explain how she become so overpowered in such short time. it took Luke three fucking movies to get to this level of force proficiency.
>>63828093
>Hey Rey, how do you keep calm and all that shit to control the Force? Especially while Kylo Ren is raping your ass in lightsaber combat..
>Just be yourself, Finn. :^)
>>63828144
A physicist could not come up with Einstein's theory of general relativity, but they can understand and apply it after it has been discovered. You have to be brilliant to make a discovery, you don't have to be brilliant to apply someone else's theories elsewhere.
>>63828132
Don't forget the coolest weapon... lightwhipes.
>>63828101
yep and it haf so much potential too
remember it took luke 3 seasons just to git gud with a light saber and the force and this bitch in 15 minutes is already stronger than luke at the end of ROTJ
she's a TEXTBOOK mary sue
>>63826942
that outcome would make Rey character good.
remember all those concept arts with cyborg man mirin' vaders helmet? Is that Kylo after this film? I remember he got his face slashed but i don't remember his arm getting chopped off, his lightsaber was cut in half though.
>>63828189
That's my only real beef with the fight scene. Everything else is just autists being butthurt about their edgelord faggot self-insert getting his ass beat by a girl. She becomes adept way too fucking quickly, even by Mary Skywalker standards.
>>63828192
Except Finn is not a Force-Sensitive
Do you even watched the movies? Both Sith and Jedi use emotions to get power.
>>63824979
>He offers himself as a master to rey even if she is clearly already stronger than him
>Hey, girl. You're like really good with the Force, girl.
>Oh, yeah the Force.
>closes her eyes for 5 seconds during which that edgy schmuck doesn't even try to kill her
>proceeds to push his shit in
That fucking scene.
>>63828192
Just FEEL the Force :^)
>>63828231
post pics faggot i'm not gonna search for "cyborg man mirin vaders helmet"
>>63828220
How does that even work?
>>63828155
Well, he did said he expected Star Wars to go the Gundam route and introduce mechs
>>63828246
That's not the fucking point of the post.
Why is everyone related in Start Warts?
>>63828270
Not him, but funnily enough, Googling "cyborg man mirin vader's helmet" gives exactly what he was talking about.
>>63828270
>>63828292
The fuck is up with your friend's concept of Star Wars? Mechs?
He's going to be sorely disappointed.
>>63828304
Lazy writing. It's easier to just make them related than to have to build their relationships from scratch.
>>63828054
You're a mong m8. I'll guarantee they revisit the attack on the temple by the Rens and show her fighting her way out as an 8 yer prodigy before being abandoned because Luke isn't mentally stable enough to go on training her.
>>63828292
>/m/fag
>being a fucking retard
POTTERY
>Rey won the duel because Kylo was injured with a wookie bowcaster. That's it.
Shit reason. He displayed he could easily still use the force in that wounded state. If they wanted to show him weak why show him push Rey 30 ft into a damn tree? Why not just have Finn and Rey double team him like a darth maul scene? Would have been more believable that she got out of the fight untouched because it was 2v1.
I'm alright with Rey being shown to be more powerful with using the force.
Is it so hard to show her losing in her lightsaber battle with Kylo Ren, then the two of them use force push at the same time but she overpowers him and knocks him far away as the ground splits apart?
That would make a ton more sense and build her up for the next movie where she needs to train to get good with her lightsaber skills and to become better at using the force.
While Kylo gets mad that he lost to an untrained girl by being weaker to her in force powers, pushing him to go deeper into the dark side to become stronger.
>discussing power levels when the answer isKylo just killed his fucking dad and he's tormented and shocked by what he's done
you people are so fucking autistic
If Kilo Gram was so fucked up by Chewie, why did he managed to keep his composure and fight confidently and with ease Finn?
Shouldn't he be walking like a zombie, clutching at his wound and constantly falling to his knees while trying to fight anyway he could from the ground up?
At least the choreography was better... but... why was Kylo acting like his saber is heavy?
>>63828280
Read the wiki
>>63828417
>it's okay to ignore bad writing
>if you think about it logically you're just being autistic!
>movies aren't supposed to make sense, they're just escapism!
>>63823870
Then why doesn't he just force push her into the ground and cut her into pieces?
>>63828439
Have you seen him? I'm surprised he could even lift the hilt.
>>63828393
but anon, that would be good film making.
So the suspense in the original star wars was that Vader was more powerful than Luke and it was always the underdog against the big guy. Also the rebel alliance felt genuinely small and weak vsm the empire
What suspense is their now? A literal untrained GIRL managed to beat Kylo, so what now?
>>63828391
>Kylo was injured with a wookie bowcaster
>Can stop fucking blaster projectiles with faster than light reflexes
>Gets hit by a stupid animal who hasn't learned to talk after following Han Solo around for 45 years.
>>63825947
>chewie hole
>>63828359
Fine, lets have her master every single force ability and perfect her lightsabre abilities in the first few minutes of the next film. Then have her defeat everyone single opponent she ever meets with laughable ease. And then justify it all by saying she's a prodigy.
>>63828465
I think a determined untrained brat could beat a master swordsman if that master swordsman waschronically depressed and just murdered his dad
but keep meme-hating this movie, you're just gonna change your opinion anyway when RLM says it's "pretty good" and "no better or worse than Jedi"
>>63828417
Kylo was an edgy cunt. Meanwhile Rey was shocked by the deaths of millions, was grieving Han's death and crying to tears watching Finn get his fucked.
So let me get this right. Kylo can get emotional from killing his father, but Rey can watch all these deaths and she's fine?
>>63828484
This. He froze her in fucking place on the other planet. The ending saber scene was so fucking shit.
>>63828417
Rey saw Finn badly injured or dead, she saw her adopted father figure die and she's being attacked by the fucker who did both. I'm sure that Rey is also pretty tormented at that moment.
>>63828519
>Can stop fucking blaster projectiles with faster than light reflexes
Blasters don't travel at the speed of light, you moron. They're not fucking lasers.
>>63828543
A couple of male deaths is nothing to a strong woman like her. She can shrug it all off a minute later using some Force meditation, which she just mastered.
>>63828434
if you managed to rewatch the leaked camrip webm of the scene, Kylo ren was playing around with Finn. You can pretty much see him laugh at Finn trying to hurt him using a lightsaber. "This little stormtropper wants to HURT ME? HAHAHHAHAHAHA" Then got really mad when Finn hit his shoulder and proceeded to destroy him.
>>63828543
Rey just watchedthis asshole Kylo kill one of her new friends and potentially kill another one right in front of her
if that doesnt make you want to kick someones ass and instead cry about it in the corner then you're a retard pussy bitch, which Rey definitely was not since she was a Mary Sue
Just look at howChewbacca reacted
>>63828507
the suspense is in the mystery of "why?"
>>63828561
>>63828484
because he sensed her abilities with The Force and tried to convert her.
why are you literally this autistic.
>>63826425
I was thinking he hit himself because broken ribs. I broke a couple ribs once, and to move around I kinda had to knock it back in place.
>>63828621
Thank god someone on /tv/ isn't an autist trying to compare Force™ Power-Levels™ Goku Vs Superman shit & understands there's an emotional, character aspect to these fights
>>63828535
>master swordsman
>Kylo Ren
He's like the guy who reads books about fighting but has never put it into practice outside of beating up children and dolls. The "Jedi" that he supposedly killed with the Knights of Ren were probably young and less competent than he was and the rest of the Galaxy seems to be lacking in force sensitive people at the moment.
Also the apparent cold war situation between the Republic and First Order limits combat.
Rey was probably the only half-way competent person he fought against and he got exposed hard. 14-year-old Ahsoka Tano would have slapped his shit several times over.
>>63828507
Kylo will get stronger but so will Rey. Kylo will still get his ass kicked in the sequels. He's the Char Aznable of TFA.
>>63828621
Ya that worked out so well for Vader. This dudes idol.
>>63828586
So... Kylo, who's a storm of fucking rage, just cries, but Rey, who never faced too much death, just sucks it up? Cool.
>>63828649
Oh, so he's not a master swordsman? Okay I guess it's even more believable that Rey could beat him now.
thanks for making my point even easier to make senpai
>>63826425
>>63828639
Why not both?
>inb4 the "she was trained by luke as a child xddd" meme pops up
Rey is not untrained.
She beat two guys with her metal stick back in Jakku.
>>63828697
Uh yeah? She's determined to kick this guy's ass. Just like Obi Wan was when he saw Maul kill Qui-Gon in Phantom Menace
Stop being autistic, people react to situations differently, the scene made sense. the fight made sense. And the film was pretty good.
>>63828720
STAFF =/= LIGHTSABER.
>>63828720
THIS.
I train in Taekwondo so that makes me an expert in swords which is completely different fightibg style YOU FUKING IDIOT
>>63828720
I guess Luke and Snoke must suck at teaching lightsaber combat.
>>63828720
She may have some experience in brawling random thieves, that's still some unrefined shit though
>>63828730
Obi Wan was a trained jedi.
>>63828784
[the point]
[your head]
>>63828799
The point is that anyone can beat whoever they want just because they feel like i? Okay sure
>>63828434
^This
How do we know the bolt even went through him probably just grazed him? Also
>All the mental gymnastics these Fanboys are going through to justify their Mary Sue shit character
>>63828799
She was a untrained little shit that was as emotional and injured as Ren was. She should get her shit wrecked.
>>63823929
Force stuff. Plus he put his mask-helmet in hot coal after he took it off. Probably,using dark side through pain method was something he was already doing before.
>>63828649
The only reason this speculated is as a justification of why he lost to Rey. Throughout the whole movie nothing has been suggested that he is just some un skilled loser. Han states that Snoke wants him for his power, there is nothing to suggest that the Jedi he killed were young and incompetent, the force abilities he demonstrated so far were shot in a way to look menacing and threatening. Even if there were no Jedi, he was trained by Luke and Snoke and he probably got a lot of combat experience from killing rebels. Yes these aren't ideal fighting opponents. But if you are saying that because Ren hasn't been fighting too many force users as a way to justify Rey winning, that's pretty ironic.
>>63827476
>goliath should of never lost to david david didnt even use a slingshot before
forgetting that david killed a bear and a lion before this, goliah a shit
>>63828699
Np famalam. People just think that training with Luke means that he is a master in every form of lightsaber combat and on par with Luke, Obi-Wan, Vader, Windu, etc. which he obviously isn't. He was sent to Luke by Leia and Han because it was apparent he was turning to the dark side and was showing some Vader. They hoped that Luke would fix his mental illness. He didn't.
He never got as far as to build his own lightsaber until he made his red crossguard, so it's also likely that he never got much, if any, combat training from Luke.
>>63828753
You'd still have more fighting intuition than an average person at least. There are transferable skills and you'd pick up sword fighting quicker than some chump. It still doesn't explain a Super Saiyan power up, but it's something.
just saw it,
1. Who is that old guy at the beginning with the map thing? Am I supposed to recognize him? Why does he have the map?
2. If Luke is hiding why would there be a map to find him? Why make it?
3. They need Luke because...?
4. What is that big ship Finn and Rey get sucked onto and meet Han Solo? Why is Han on it? People looking for Han are also on this ship but only find him once he goes on MF? what happened there?
5. Why did R2D2 wake up?
>>63828730
Yeah, Luke should have beat the shit out of Vader at the end of episode 4, that was piss poor writing that Luke didn't use his anger and emotions against vader in a lightsaber fight and lost instead. I mean, he didn't even need training, he really should have beaten vader just because he was determined enough.
>>63827476
>goliath should of never lost to david david didnt even use a slingshot before
forgetting that david trusted the force(god) to killed a bear and a lion before this, goliah was nathing
>>63828578
Sure thing bro. I'll take your word for it.
You know all this jedi vs Sith and power level talk got me thinking.... What if Rey doesn't pick a side and just goes rogue? She will master both the dark and light side abilities in a week and become master of the universe. The end.
>>63828586
>Just look at how Chewbacca reacted
Yelled loudly then shot at Kylo and blew everything up?
>>63828882
Don't forget, Luke was starting up Jedi schools through the galaxy and Kylo ren wasn't his only student.
There's no doubt there were skilled jedis that he had to seek out and hunt in order to wipe them all out. In essence, he would have gotten more experience fighting lightsabers than Luke ever did.
>>63828950
The fact that you can see the bolt fly through the air proves that it's not at the speed of light
What is Rey is just so strong with the force because she was trained by luke and started to go over to the dark side for some reason so he mind wiped her and she is Revan 2.0
>>63828966
Yeah, he wanted to kick that kids ass
just like Rey did
Now youre getting it
>>63824042
fuck man... i turned away for a couple months and /tv/ got genuinely well informed and funny.
>>63829002
Luke infused his saber with mitichorlians which transfered over to ray when she touch it
>>63828891
1. Just some random wise old man
2. Because Luke didn't want anyone to find him so he made a map on where to find him
3. Because Luke is like the strongest Jedi ever, they need him to stop Kylo Ren and Snoke
4. Han bought a freighter ship from all the money he got saving the republic and doing shipping jobs. They were looking for him because he's Han Solo, he probably stole money from them
5. Because R2-D2 magically woke up and decided to tell everyone where Luke is after being shut down for decades.
>>63828882
I don't disagree with you, desu. The movie is inconsistent with how it portrays Ren. In the first act, with his mask on, he seems somewhat intimidating. After he takes the mask off, he becomes a joke.
>combat experience from killing rebels.
Like an adult boxing children. You don't learn much, if anything at all, from blowing out your opponents.
>But if you are saying that because Ren hasn't been fighting too many force users as a way to justify Rey winning, that's pretty ironic.
More to do with Ren being shit, than Rey being good, imo.
>>63828988
New canon. The extent of Luke's rebuilding of the Jedi Order hasn't really been explained yet.
>>63828304
Because Star Wars is the story of the Skywalker Family
>>63828950
If blaster bolts travelled at the speed of light, they'd hit before anybody could react or move. At that range, Kylo would have been better off freezing Poe before he shot rather than after. The fact that you can see red and blue fly all over the screen as an actual projectile also goes against light speed travel.
Rey better have some amazing back story before she became a sand nigger otherwise the story is totally fucked.
>>63828292
Your friend is a fucking retarded weeaboo
>>63829148
At least jew jew isnt directing the movies after this.
The other directors and writers have to fix his mess though.
>>63828326
kek
>>63829062
i know why they were looking for him but it seemed like they were already on this ship, not just arrived.
its his freighter? so han sucked them up with the gravbeam or whatever, because it was the mf? if he could track the falcon why not just go get it in jakku?
so #2 and 5 are lolidunno? there wasnt some bs explanation i missed?
>>63829040
Thanks anon, that made my day.
Positive reinforcement on my /tv/? It's more likely than you think.
>>63829354
There was a short scene where you can see some ships docking onto Han's freighter, they were looking for him.
He didn't get the Falcon on jakku because he was looking for it I guess.
Also yeah 2 and 5, they never explained shit about it.
>>63828292
On a related note, when that alien woman called the First Order to tell them she found the droid, did anyone else hear the word she used to call the droid as Gundam?
>>63829354
His tracker on the MF didn't work until it got out of Jakku, more then once they showed that flying closer to the ground messes up the tracking system or some shit
