The Good:
>Stormtroopers finally portrayed as competent grunts and humanized to a small extent
>le funny black man that's actually pretty likable
>BB-8 wasn't that annoying
>Oscar Isaac was smooth and handsome and now replaces Fassbender in my homoerotic fantasies
>Ford actually looked like he cared and made an effort to act
>Kylo Ren was more a complex villain than anyone expected
>Nazi speech was great
>blasters left burn marks and looked like they actually did damage
The Bad:
>literally just a remake of Episode IV
>underuse of Poe
>Daisy Ridley isn't a great actress
>oddly paced
>make a badass 6'5" female storm trooper with chrome plating only to literally throw her in the trash after 5 minutes of screen time
>from the tribute director of Star Trek: Into Reference comes "Hey, isn't the original Star Wars great?"
The Ugly:
>a lot of the creature CGI looked like shit
>Carrie Fisher's face on an IMAX screen
Better than expected. 7/10, on par with Jedi, better than the prequels, haters are contrarians.
I'd like to know why the Republic and resistance are separate and why the resistance is only 10 ships.
But I reckon a lot of back story will get filled in by Luke.
>>63816111
because it's a remake of IV
>>63815992
Nazi speech was over the top,
prequel-tier over the top
Honestly I really liked that they revealed that Kylo Ren was Han's son essentially right off the bat by heavily implying it then straight out saying it 20 minutes later instead of doing a hamfisted NO HAN, I AM YOU'RE SON XDDDD scene.
>>63816220
Have you seen Hitler talk? Nazis were over-the-top themselves.
>>63815992
>Stormtroopers finally portrayed as competent grunts
Stormtroopers died in bigger droves than in any of the previous films, anon, and the only achievement that have to show for it is beating down on a fellow stormtrooper.
>>63816335
Hitler is not a Star Wars character,
you're thinking Indiana Jones
The Good
-Return of Han and Chewie. I could tell that Lawrence Kasden wrote the bulk of the dialogue in the freighter sequence re-introducing Han and Chewbacca. This was the best part of the entire movie by far. It was playful and fun with smugglers and monsters, scum and villainy.
-Maz Kanata's castle. The scene started out great, a worthy successor to Mos Eisley cantina and Jabba's Palace. I don't recall a scene like this in the prequels with a bunch of aliens hanging out in a bar-type setting, but it's a highlight of Star Wars and while this is not quite on their level it's still good.
-Seeing the broken down AT-AT Rey called home.
The Bad
-Whiny Kylo Ren. Clearly he inherited his temper tantrums from his granddaddy. God it was stupid watching him slam his lightsaber down like an angry child with a baseball bat destroying things because he didn't get a cookie. And they did the scene not once, but twice. He is not an interesting villain. The setup for his character is poor (but I'll get to that later) and his motivation is preposterous. Why did he turn to the Dark Side? Unexplained. I'm guessing Luke told him about Anakin's fall and that's who the kid decided he wanted to emulate even though his living family (Uncle Luke, Mommy Leia, and Poppa Han) triumphed over Vader and the Emperor and thus you'd think they provide a better example, but hey, this trilogy apparently needed to copy the original by having a father-son, light/dark divide and it would have really killed them to create a new character for that to happen.
>cont
>>63816474
-Starkiller Base. I have a lot of gripes about this wretchedly inane plot point but I will put them all here under a single bullet. First, I get that if you're going to make a new Death Star it has to be more powerful than the original (of course there is always the question of why you need a new Death Star, but I digress…), but how does it make any sense that instead of blowing up planets it blows up entire solar systems? The whole point of these weapons, as explained by Tarkin, is to elicit fear to keep systems in line. Why is that any scarier if it can blow up several planets instead of one planet? It's killing you either way. Second, the Starkiller apparently uses a hyperspace weapon so it can destroy planets from across the galaxy, which should be idiotic enough, but when it is used to destroy the Republic capital world(s?) (and shouldn't that have been Coruscant?), Han et al. see the laser beam from whatever planet Maz's castle is located on. If the laser beam was travelling through hyperspace, wouldn't it not be visible in regular space? But more importantly, why in the name of the Force would they see a laser beam on the other side of the galaxy from the surface of a distant planet with their naked eyes? And why did they know what it was? Finally, as I mentioned above, the attack on Starkiller Base is really boring and just replicates exactly what we have seen in previous Star Wars films. Additionally, I would add that there never felt to me a sense of danger for our heroes during the battle and I thought the sequence was poorly edited together with no good balance between the dogfights above and Han and Chewie attempting to set the detonators below.
>cont a fucking again and again since 2000 only
>>63816474
Ep II had a bar scene but the set was 80% squeaky clean CGI and all the aliens were really lame and uninspired CG shit.
>>63816501
-Rey's quick grasp of the Force. So despite having had no training and not even believing Jedi were real, Rey not only knows how to do a Jedi mind trick, but she can do it to a Stormtrooper ten feet away and not facing her? And she can fight and defeat a trained dark side acolyte in lightsaber combat (it has been argued to me that she clearly knew how to use that staff at the beginning, but I still don't buy that she can take on someone who is supposedly a powerful dark side user). Oh, and the little matter of her stealing the lightsaber in the snow from Ren really angered me. In Empire, Luke had had a little bit of Force training from Obi-Wan but when he attempted to free his lightsaber from the snowpack in the Wampa's cave, he did so with great difficulty, but here a character who has no knowledge of how to control the Force, easily swipes it and then keeps it from a powerful Force wielder. I don't buy it for a second. This leads me to my next point.
-I don't think JJ Abrams understands how the Force works. Mostly this pertains to Kylo Ren. Early on when Poe shoots at Ren, the latter holds the laser blast in the air for the remainder of the scene while he interrogates Poe. It's kind of neat until you realize that using the Force requires great concentration and Ren's focus switches to his prisoner almost immediately. My impression of the Force is that you're reaching out as if with an extra hand to move things or hold them, whatever the case may be, but you can't just hold it there forever because you're not creating a forcefield or something and using the Force is work; even Yoda has a little trouble lifting up that X-Wing and he sure doesn't hold it up for very long. When Darth Vader deflects laser bolts, he does just that, he doesn't hold the plasma in midair. Later when Ren holds Rey in the woods, I had a similar impression that he was simply doing more than the Force really allows. I don't buy this interpretation of the Force.
>>63815992
nailed it imo.
-Snoke. So wait, he's a hologram but still has to be giant? Why? Because they wanted to mimic the scene between Vader and Sidious from Empire? Or because he's over-compensating for something? My guess is that when we meet the real Snoke he will actually be tiny, like 3 inches tall or something. That would be sort of interesting, so it probably won't happen. I was also disappointed by his look. I had heard that he was going to be someone with interesting facial features, but he was basically a person with a scar, a tiny mouth, and no nose. You have all the CGI in the world at your disposal and that's the "interesting" character you devise? *yawn*
-BB-8. I known others were charmed by him, but count me among those who didn't like him at all. First of all that design makes no sense. If he's rolling around, how does he make sure the right hatch is facing where he needs it to be? Answer: he doesn't. Second, that name is awful. And third, hearing Oscar Isaac say things like "Hey BB, buddy, come here" made me sick.
Nice Star Wars you got there. Be a shame if some dutch angles found their way into the mix.
>>63816530
>>63816560
-The death ofHan Solo. I always knew this was going to happen, but one of my friends convinced me that maybe they'd go a different way because after all, if Disney wants to get people excited for this new series, killing off a beloved character at the end is probably not the way to do it. But they did. Of course the second he gave Chewie the detonator, you knew that was it for him. It was almost as if the writers knew the scene's conclusion wouldn't work if that didn't happen. I'm angry about this scene because Han goes out like a chump, killed by his own brat kid. Is having Han Solo for a dad really such a bad thing? He has the fastest space ship in the galaxy and a dog that you can talk to! He's like the best dad ever! Not good enough for this little brat though! And Han's speech to try to get Ren back is so bad. I feel pretty confident this was Abrams writing for Solo, not Kasden. I cannot see Kasden having the fast-talking Solo say something as self-defeating as "Snoke is using you for your power and once he has what he wants he is going to crush you." How exactly is insulting both your son's intelligence and his strength going to convince him to give up the dark side? This was an infuriating scene. Finally, I did not feel that Chewbacca properly mourned Han's death. These two have been inseparable for decades so I would have expected Chewie to be despondent late in the film, bu nope, he just flies away with Rey.
>>63816530
Regarding the Kylo Ren's force power:
I think Kylo is just extremely powerful and proficient with the Force, which is why he's able to do things unseen in the films. It's probably why Snoke seduced him to the dark side. He felt his power. It could even be revealed later that Kylo's pure force power is what awoke Snoke in the first place.
>>63816588
-"Bring our son home." Closely related to the last point is Leia's admonition to Han that if he sees their boy to bring him home. I'm sorry, but Kylo Ren is a war criminal and a murderer. It's not as if he dropped out of college to join a rock band. He has been killing people, lots of people. I know that Luke redeemed Darth Vader from the dark side so it's not as if this isn't a recurring theme, but Darth Vader also had to die to pay the price for the crimes he had committed. The idea that Han would bring Ben home to his mother and then go back to being a regular guy is so stupid as to be laughable if it wasn't ruining this once-proud franchise.
-The map. I get it, it's a MacGuffin, but shouldn't even a MacGuffin make sense? (Not in a JJ Abrams movie! See Star Trek and Star Trek Into Darkness.) So Luke went off into hiding, but he left a map? Why would he do that? And why did the Empire have part of the map? And if R2-D2 was so depressed that Luke had left that he couldn't get out of bed, why didn't he share the map he had with his pals? I understand that it wasn't complete, but I have to think that if they searched just that empty space, Leia probably could have used her Force magic to hone in on him.
-The final shot. Star Wars movies end with group shots of the surviving cast,not helicopter shots of Luke standing on a cliff like a moron.
>>63816501
>Why is that any scarier if it can blow up several planets instead of one planet? It's killing you either way.
It's scarier because if you make an alliance against the First Order, you would get your shit slapped immediately. It's absolutely hopeless to even try to form a resistance at that point
>>63816608
--When Darth Vader captured his friends he went to save them even though he knew it was a trap because they'd been captured on account of him. When Vader and the Emperor learned that he was on Endor, he could have run but he faced down and distracted two Sith Lords rather than abandon his friends, turning the tide of the battle as the Imperial army, without its leadership, fell into disarray. Luke Skywalker is a heroic character who would not run and hide while leaving his friends to face powerful enemies who would undoubtedly cause great harm to millions of innocent people. It cheapens the entirety of the Original Trilogy to portray Luke as someone who failed in his mission to resurrect the Jedi Order, instead choosing to quit upon the first sign of trouble
In sum, this was very much a JJ Abrams movie, and that's about the worst thing I could say about any movie.
I would never have thought that the old Expanded Universe would prove to be so much better than the first sequel film. In all seriousness, right now I have no desire to watch another new Star Wars film theatrically. (He says, knowing full well that he will go see this piece of shit once more just to be sure.)
The more I've thought about this movie since watching it, the more I hate it.
1/5
>>63816560
>If he's rolling around, how does he make sure the right hatch is facing where he needs it to be?
You literally see him move forward, then back up at an angle then move his head so the proper hatch is out when Poe puts the USB drive in him at the very end.
>>63815992
The Bad
>BB-8 tried to set one of the main characters on fire
>>63816608
They wouldn't even have to do any searching, since R2D2's map contained the fucking END LOCATION,
BB-8's part of the map was totally unnecessary
>>63816560
>You have all the CGI in the world at your disposal and that's the "interesting" character you devise? *yawn*
Considering his CG was by far the weakest in the film and hearing that they were still doing CG work in November, I think they may have changed his design last minute, kind of like why Azog looks like fucking shit in the 1st Hobbit movie, same thing happened.
Maybe his design was more interesting but they thought it didn't work.
>>63815992
>Daisy Ridley isn't a great actress
Disagree.
He might have a shit character but she did great in it.
Might be my dick talking though
>>63815992
>Kylo Ren was more a complex villain than anyone expected
He was a petulant manchild who threw a temper tantrum anytime someone gave him bad news.
>>63816111
I'm guessing the Republic and TNO are in a cold war like situation and they're waging proxy wars against each other with "rebels".
>>63816474
I despise everything about your Kylo Ren critique. Not only was his self-doubt far more interesting than the single-note assurance of Vader, in pure "it rhymes" fashion it ties him back to the early days of his grandfather. You can see his redemptive arc coming, and it's fascinating. And no, not every detail of his turn has to be articulated in the first film. We didn't really get Vader's true motivation until Episode II, but people enjoyed him for no other reason than his intimidating qualities. Kylo Ren is a 21st century villain, he's full of self-doubt, he's whiny, he's insecure, he's delusional, and he tries to cover up his flaws by seeking power over those weaker than himself. He fits the profile of people who actually go bad.
Nice fucking blog post anon, haven't seen this type of thread posted all over 4chan before
>Go in expecting the black guy to be the worst, he turns out being the only character that I SOMEWHAT care about even though he's just comic relief
>Grill turns out to be a giant fucking mary sue, somehow requires no force training or lightsaber training to do things that took Luke months to do
>Manages to beat Kylo, a sith that's trained under luke and le gaint evil alien man for at least 15 years
>Been just a scavenger all her life, yet can pilot any ship she comes across, and somehow knows how to fix anything and everything that happens with the falcon
>No characterization for Poe, he literally gets 5 lines and only gets camera time in boring EVERYTHING IS BLOWING UP LOOK LAZERS ZAP ZAP dogfights
>Deathstar 3.0 blowing up from a couple of x-wing bullets and detonators, nothing strategic like ANH
>Copies so much from the OT; desert, hopeful underdog looking for a greater purpose, death star, entire falcon scene, force persuading, force grab lightsaber from snow
>>63815992
bad:
>>>girl fu and girl powerism
>>>plot scavenging from the original 4
>>>marye sue poe
>>>weak space battles
>>>no manly clearly white protagonists
>>the score
>>the way the scenes are put together jj style
good
>>boyega is actually the funniest and most human character. Still the series needs to be more white centric
>>sword fights
>>the force powers of kylo
>>the imperial settings- no cg? Great
>>all the death and destruction
>>rey is cute at least
>underuse of Poe
While I would also have liked to have seen more of Poe, I understood why we had more of Finn and Rey. He didn't really have any sort of conflict to overcome, nothing really to give him any character development. I expect we'll see more of him in the next two films.
>>63816707
>"They've escaped"
>trashes control panel.
>"Anything else?"
>"A girl helped."
>strangles the guy, like we're supposed to think he has any reason to care about Rey yet
>>63815992
>>a lot of the creature CGI looked like shit
the CGI in general was pretty bad.
There were some explosions/effects which looked straight out of a PSX game.
Anon, stop writing a walls of text. Too verbose. Could have trimmed the fat from your posts. Brevity is the soul of wit. 2/10 posts: you put effort in them, kid, but this isn't reddit
>>63816740
>the series needs to be more white centric
go back to /pol/ you racist prick if anything there weren't enough black characters n the movie maybe you should do your star wars movie to fulfill your white supremacist fantasy oh wait no you couldn't because that would be racist af baka
Good:
>it LOOKED like a Star Wars film
>beautiful practical creature effects
>CG wasn't too offensive outside Snoke and a few sequences
>Kylo Ren is actually interesting
>Ren being Han & Leia's kid wasn't a twist, made for an interesting dynamic with Han
>Chewbacca being fucking hilarious
>BB8 wasn't annoying
>Boyongo was literally the best new character despite him looking awful in the trailers and being an urban gentleman
>Ford actually gave a shit and gave a great performance
>Stormtroopers are an actual threat
>Surprising amount of grim violence and death'
>TRAITOR TROOPER
Bad:
>Movie moves too fast, there's no breathing room its just constant action scenes
>Movie takes place over one day(?)
>Rey's acting is very hit or miss
>Hux looks like a turd
>Snoke looks just shit all around
>Snap zooms
>Rey is a total mary sue
>plot just a remake of ANH
>Phasma hyped as fuck before release yet she has 3 lines and gets bullied like a complete fucking PUSSY ASS BITCH then dies offscreen
>The diversity angle was a bit forced with every human outside the geriatric fucks in the Resistance being a minority
>>63816835
Hey there JJ, it's ok, we got point in TFA, you don't like nazis
>>63816804
>Brevity is the soul of wit.
I wonder how many of the people who quote this realize that it was spoken by Polonius, who's the idiot of the play that Hamlet makes fun of for using empty platitudes. It's also spoken in Shakespeare's longest play by far, which means that it was probably a wink to the audience.
>>63816733
You let these cancerous /r/movie cross posters post here by accepting pleb trash and /v/ meme culture.
>>63816894
I think that's what anon meant as he continued on after 2/10
tell us more /tv/
http://strawpoll.me/6306008/
>>63816608
>The idea that Han would bring Ben home to his mother and then go back to being a regular guy is so stupid as to be laughable if it wasn't ruining this once-proud franchise.
It isn't any different than Luke saying "there's still good in you, I sense it" at the end of Jedi. You're nitpicking. You're arguing about the plausibility of a fairy tale.
>make this awesome suit of armor for this awesome squadron leader who's supposed to be the next Boba Fett
>all her character does is basically allow the rebels to win
If they don't kill her next episode this First Order really fucking sucks at their job.
>>63816994
It isn't any different than Luke saying "there's still good in you, I sense it" at the end of Jedi. You're nitpicking. You're arguing about the plausibility of a fairy tale.
No, it's completely different. Did luke ever say to Leia that he will try and turn Darth Vader back to good? No, because he's a fucking murderer. He only said that to try and abuse Vader's sympathy for his son.
Hux was the absolute best part of this movie and anyone that disagrees has a shut opinion.
His enthusiastic Nazi speech was so fucking over the top that it was great. I'm glad he survived.
>the good
Nothing at all besides that talentless hack JJ isn't directing anymore
>the bad
Its a marvel movie pretending to be SW
>>63816111
The Republic demilitarized after signing a peace treaty with the Empire because they're retards. Leia formed up the Resistance as a faction of the Republic that actually armed itself because she knew the Empire wouldn't honor any disarmament agreements.
>>63815992
>>Nazi speech was great
>kike propaganda
>great
The Empire was never that dramatic or over-the-top
You could always tell they were the bad guys just by looking at them, we didn't need some overacted shitty speech scene
>>63816560
>>63816588
>>63816608
Look, if this were literary fiction I'd understand these criticism, but you're arguing for consistency and real-world logic in something that has never concerned itself with trying to be realistic. Star Wars has always been full of implausibility, inconsistency, and weird coincidences. We watch it for character interaction and the kinetic experience of the WWII-style dogfights. This just strikes me as reading Harry Potter and complaining that it isn't Proust.
>>63817000
She's already like Jango and Boba Fett in that they're there to look cool, but once the story doesn't need them anymore they're easily disposed of.
With Phasma though she's not explicitly killed and probably will come back with a vengeance.
>>63817162
>"Can you feel it Snoke? The empire we've lost. That is our menace. Our phantom menace."
Yup, he's the best.
>>63817128
I'm sure if he brought him back he'd be tried for war crimes by the Republic, but if you had a son you'd understand Han in that scene. Complaining that a father wants his son to stop being bad is flat-out ridiculous.
>>63816835
you ignored all my other points. I even admit I liked boyega, better than lando or mace windu imho. but star wars should have remained white male centric. Keep boyega and rey but also insert a couple fully white male main characters. it's that so much to ask from an historically white series?
>>63817162
He doesn't come off as a megalomaniacal military leader. He comes off as a douchenozzel.
The good
>So many well timed little scenes, BB's lighter thumbs up, referring to the Millennium Falcon as garbage before you see it on screen, you need a pilot? I need a pilot, etc
>Han Solo and Chewie amplified my enjoyment of the movie immensely
>His death was done well
>Ford cared about acting for the movie
>Chewie had some of his best moments in this movie
>BB-8 can keep up with the action, is hilarious
>Went into it thinking Luke would end up a Sith, opening crawl comes and instantly tells me otherwise
>New Order has the Empires internal conflict of Government vs Mysticism but seemingly more intensely, I hope that internal conflict is a plot point, also Hux
>Kylo is both least likable and best written character
Bad
>Rey unless they explain details that make the powerlevels in Episode 7 make more sense
>>63816894
About as many who quote it in response to anything they deem to long, regardless of whether or not "wit" was the author's aim. These fuckers would look at the US Constitution, get two lines in and say "tl;dr, brevity is the soul of wit"
>>63816707
I DON'T GET IT
why isn't this interesting?
you can't have flawed, childish characters in a good story?
WHY IS EVERYONE DOING THIS
>>63815992
>make a badass 6'5" female storm trooper with chrome plating only to literally throw her in the trash after 5 minutes of screen time
I wouldn't be surprised if she turned up again. She could have a personal agenda against Finn or something, be a physical reminder of his past.
>>63817487
people want cool badasses who can do flips and shit
>>63815992
my favorite scene might be Chewbacca's rampage when he doesn't even give a fuck about possibly getting exploded and rey and finn eventually just bail because Chewbacca doesn't give a shit about himself or them or anyone else anymore
I felt so bad for Chewbacca but I loved his rampage
>>63816737
Even the base they used looked almost exactly like the Yavin base.
>>63815992
Pretty much. The movie felt way too fast-paced, though, and the humor was overdone and a little too self-aware, like the characters knew they were in Star Wars. I feel like JJ was having so much fun making it that he forgot he was actually making a serious movie.
>>63817229
Cool. Can you remind me where that was explained in the movie?
>>63817487
I don't get it either.
If they tried to make him into just another Vader clone it would have failed miserably. At least this way it's the characters fault he isn't badass enough.
>>63816474
>>63816721
I agree, I thought the I HATE COMPUTERS tantrum was dumb at first but once you realize that he's incredibly insecure over not being Vader it snaps into focus. It's exactly what a kid aping a Big Villain would do.
Vader was a pillar of cold malice, and Kylo's just youthful anger and insecurity.
>>63816588
Honestly expected chewie to go full beastmode and start tearing storm troopers apart
Disapointed
>>63816882
Are you me? Spot on with every pro and con; this was exactly how I felt.
Overall, good film. Star Wars is definitely back.
>>63816882
fucking snap zooms
So, on the whole Mary-Sue Force power thing, just a theory here:
Remember that stupid shit in the prequels where the Force was weakening, at least the light side? For... reasons? What if for other reasons the Force is gaining strength again. Perhaps... Awakening?
That would at least explain how Rey seems to have gone from Toche-Station-to-pick-up-some-power-converters-Luke to Bespin-Luke level by the end of the first movie. It would also make Kylo's fall from grace slightly more understandable - the Dark Side, like Kylo's lightsaber, is in violent flux. Perhaps Luke failed to save him because Luke was not ready for the resurgence of Force sensitivity that followed the destruction of the Emperor.
Or maybe it's just shitty fanfic meme writing.
>>63817852
I can't tell if he's a shit villian or a great one to be honest senpai
Rey was handled so poorly because I don't think there's anything else she could possibly learn from Luke
Jokes on us when she goes full on force unleashed tier
>>63816894
It's funny because Polonious never shuts the fuck up, then says "brevity is the soul of wit." Shakespeare didn't have the windbag say the line in order to diminish the truth of the words, but because it's funny when a long-winded person says how important it is to be concise.
>>63817664
The difference between them was explained in like 10 threads last night. It should be pretty obvious what the republic and resistance are from their names alone if you have any sense of history.
>>63817379
>star wars should have remained white male centric
>it's that so much to ask from an historically white series?
lol i'm sorry about your whole deal there anon
the goodun's are just fadin' away, but keep that Dixieland music playin'
>>63816186
Yep. Literally finding a synonym for "Rebels" and calling it that.
>>63815992
>not mentioning based Craig cameo
/tv/ still disappoints me
>>63818824
>Jokes on us when she goes full on force unleashed tier
>mfw rey bringing a star destroyer down with the force could actually happen
>>63816572
There was literally zero dutch angles in this movie you dumb fucking memer. Kill yourself.
