For a 2015 blockbuster it was okay. I'm sure the hardcore fans will think this movies is the second coming of christ because it isn't absolute garbage but the movie really isn't too bad.
The problems with the movie are numerous however.
-It relies far too heavily on callbacks to the original trilogy. This really makes the film feel like a product but not as blatantly as Jurassic World.
-The FN-2187 character is useless which doesn't technically have to be a bad thing (luke was essentially useless in the original) but with Rey being the self insert/hero's journey figure, BB-8 as comic relief and Poe playing the carefree cool Han Solo role, FN seems to be playing a completely unnecessary love interest.
-The main villain is weak and has an extremely poorly defined motivation. The Darth Vader character worked because you knew little about him other than that he was exacting and decisive. The Ren character is neither, he's literally just a Vader fan boy and he has an emotional fit when someone brings this up to him. His motivation for the slaughter of people is that he thinks Darth Vader was cool. That motivation sucks. Driver's acting surprisingly isn't terrible but the temperamental teen villian seems an incredibly dumb and uninteresting way to take the story. Also, no way in hell should the film have decided to have him defeated but not killed in the first movie.
-JJ didn't watch enough Kurosawa and Ford or rather, he didn't pay attention to the right things while watching. He seems to have primarily payed attention to things like composition and camera movement, which is good but not enough to story/character presentation and pacing. To be fair to him though, I know he didn't edit or write the film. He's literally just the director and I;m sure disney can take most of the blame for that.
I'll talk with whoever more about this. I didn't hate it but there's going to be a lot of absurd gushing that will come out over the next few weeks over this and everyone just needs to calm down. It has flaws and strengths, it isn't perfect and it isn't exceptionally good. It's a 2015 blockbuster and it has a lot of the same problems that 2015 blockbusters have.
PS: I used the word "patrician" to guarantee replies. Don't get too autistic about it.
>>63769603
>thinking you're special
kek
>>63769603
To be honest, family, I thought is was MOTY and I think you're just a pretentious faggot.
>>63770018
Yeah, I mean, that's possible but I'm also just not fanboying over this because I'm not overly hyped up for the series. I basically just found out the local theater in my town wasn't sold out so I went to see the movie out of curiosity. I have watched a lot of movies and I know a lot about filmmaking. I'm just being honest with you.
>>63769603
Is this patrician view taking into account that it's meant to be a trilogy or is this from a standalone?
>>63770231
I am taking into account that this is meant to be a trilogy.
Knowing that Kylo Ren in meant to be the main villain in the Darth Vader role for instance is the reason I find it so troubling that he is almost defeat by someone without force powers that happens to hold a light saber and that he is then actually defeat by another person that learned they had force powers earlier that day. From a storytelling perspective this does not effectively build the menace of the villain.
I don't think the movie is bad, like I said, just that it isn't great or as a good as any of the films in the original trilogy. It's a 2015 blockbuster and it does some very corporate things in regard to plot to facilitate that trilogy.
Honestly the only real thing that worries me is that Colin Trevarrow is manning the next movie. Jurassic World is actually awful.
>>63770548
That's not how the force works, she always latently was using the force, the "awakening" happened when Kylo touched Rey's mind.
>>63770681
Training is important. I don't think you can reasonably expect someone that just felt the force that day to match the skill level of someone that has been trained for what must have been years.
It's been shown in all the other movies the importance of training.
>>63769603
>calling yourself a patrician to give yourself credibility
Fuck off.
>>63770821
>autism
>>63770783
Honestly it didn't seem like kylo was trained that well at fucking all to be quite honest, Rey had been collecting Jedi artifacts and understand what the force was as literature until the confirmation that it actually exists. When Kylo tried to peer into her mind her latent force abilities were unlocked, she had great force power within her. Did you think that last fight was between two force masters? Honestly? They were just swinging at eachother with no form, they were essentially padawan tier. Seriously.
>>63770018
nah Krampus is MOTY.
>>63771036
Kylo is at a rank where he is telling the Imperial military leader (who is far too young) what to do. He should reasonably be at least somewhat well trained for that level of trust and responsibility to be placed in him by the remnants of the empire. If he were just a tempermental teen with a badly made faux lightsaber then why in the hell is he given that level of responsibility?
>>63771197
Because the level of quality of force users has seriously diminished because they have been killing each other for thousands of years. Just because he is second in command doesn't mean anything, Palpatine (snoke) always has an end game and he knows that Kylo is a fucking pussy who will never live up to expectations. What he wants is Rey, to lead Rey into a trap where she has to kill him and thus can be corrupted. Think about how little Jedi/Sith there are, people think they are a myth at this point, and because of that Kylo is in second command because it's slim picking for force wielders. Any one of the older jedi if they were still alive would've stomped his ass into the ground in 5 seconds no joke.
>>63771197
>If he were just a tempermental teen with a badly made faux lightsaber then why in the hell is he given that level of responsibility
Snoke probably figures that Kylo will be able to get to Luke
>>63771321
>Any one of the older jedi if they were still alive would've stomped his ass into the ground in 5 seconds no joke.
My question for you of course is "why in the hell are you defending the decision to make him the villain?". He sucks as a villain, you seem to know this just judging by how you're speaking of him. There seems to be literally no benefit to you for defending him.
>>63769603
>Driver's acting surprisingly isn't terrible but the temperamental teen villian seems an incredibly dumb and uninteresting way to take the story.
That is why this version of the story should have been more Thrawn and less Darth Caedus.
>>63771419
I'm not defending him, it's clear they are setting him up for a redemption arc, he isn't a true villain yet until the next film, he is still halfway through that arc, I'm merely stating why he is there and why that role was chosen for him.
>>63771426
OP here, I literally have no idea who either of those people are. I'm not a die hard fan, just a person interested in filmmaking that went to see the movie. I'm evaluating it based on what I know of the original trilogy and the basis for that trilogy that inspired lucas.
>>63771471
>it's clear they are setting him up for a redemption arc
Yeah, I do get that of course but again, that's the problem. You can spot in the first 5 minutes of him being on screen that he's set up for a redemption arc because he's too weak to commit to the dark side. which means in effect that the villain doesn't exist because all we get is a hologram that says some menacing shit but whom we never see do anything.
>>63771486
Thats fine. There are two separate versions of the story: the Disney one and the one that came before. The Disney one is not much better.
One reason for this is it is obvious that the new Disney movie was made with the express purpose of rebooting the franchise to sell more movies rather then telling the story that follows ROTJ. They retconned the ending of ROTJ out of existence.
>>63771563
The villain again, is palpatine. Or snoke, which is weakened palpatine, once again the "vader archetype" is a red herring for the real villain the Emperor.
I mean, pretty much everyone who is actually a fan of film in general knew that because this was a blockbuster movie that would gross incredible, maybe record-breaking amounts of money, they would just nostalgia pander to Star Wars "fans" who hate 1-3 and think the originals are the second coming of Jesus and literally recreate IV with different characters.
The original trilogy was so ground breaking because of the technical aspects of the process of making the movie. Its strengths were never plot or dialogue or character development. This new movie has neither and is a whole lot of "Hey guys look this is Star Wars!!!!!"
Here's my comprehensive nitpick of The Force Awakens
http://letterboxd.com/dontpokethebear/film/star-wars-the-force-awakens/
I still liked it
>>63770018
>pretentious
you wanna know why your opinion is worth nothing?
>>63771617
But here's the part you're missing. Vader is a Villain. He only is redeemed at the end of the thrid movie of the original trilogy and there's no sign that he could be flipped until the end of the second. In this, you literally know his arc over the next three movies in seconds, not because he's so similar to Vader but because the plot points are that cliched.
When you go through the original trilogy for the first time. You don't know vader has the capacity to not be a villain, you only get an allusion to the man he used to be from Obi Wan.
>>63771675
> I mean, pretty much everyone who is actually a fan of film in general knew that because this was a blockbuster movie that would gross incredible, maybe record-breaking amounts of money, they would just nostalgia pander to Star Wars "fans" who hate 1-3 and think the originals are the second coming of Jesus and literally recreate IV with different characters.
Disney has a dual purpose with this movie (1) appealing to all the plebs that think the originals are the second coming of Jesus (2) starting a new EU where they don't have to pay old authors like Timothy Zahn any royalties as they release new movies every year.
>>63771781
>In this, you literally know his arc over the next three movies in seconds
yup, I touched upon that in my previously posted letterboxd review
>>63771781
In the same way Ren is a villain in the same way Vader was, only this time they are not establishing a mystery around his character and are just putting it all out there to make him more interesting as the films progress. We have no idea what's in store for Kylo at the end, even if he will get a redemption, or what Palpatine's plans for him are. He probably is using Kylo to get to Luke's daughter Rey in order to try to corrupt her. It would be cool if they could switch places where Rey becomes corrupted and Ren could be the main hero of the film. We literally don't know if that's what his character arc is going to be, even if he can be redeemed since he killed his father. Even Vader couldn't even kill his son.
>>63771892
>We have no idea what's in store for Kylo at the end, even if he will get a redemption, or what Palpatine's plans for him are.
I guarantee you that he will flip by the end of movie two and the third will see him team up and fight for the light side of the force.
cap it
GOOD
-Lightsaber battles were intense and people got fucked up
-Han sounded and acted like Han
-I thought Kylo was a good villain. Despite being a kid he had an imposing presence even with his mask off.
-Lots of emotion. Sometimes it felt forced but I'd rather have an emotional movie than a bland one
-GOAT traditional costume/make-up characters
-Callbacks that weren't forced or *winks to the audience*. Stuff like Ackbar just being there being a cool dude.
-Binary Sunset
MEH
-Leia didn't sound like Leia. Carrie Fisher was hitting the cigs a little too hard
-CGI characters were bad and won't hold up. The real deal stuff was way more convincing
-Phasma didn't do much. Not a big deal but it's like the callback to Boba Fett was in her not doing anything
-Some set-ups and payoffs but not a lot. BB-8 should have used his little lighter for something later on
-A lot of plot details unexplained. Situation with the Empire becoming the First Order and the status of the Republic not really explained
BAD
-Every memorable piece of music in the movie was not from TFA but from the other films. TFA had a lacking score, and yet wasn't also brave enough to use stuff like Duel of the Fates
-Not enough Luke. The whole crawl was about finding him and nothing about anything else going on. He should have shown up and saved Rei or something
-The movie isn't self contained. Leans too heavily on stuff coming later. I'm looking forward to the next film because it seems like it's going to be darker and will focus on things other than rehashing ANH
-Felt like a Star Wars movie but some things were missing. There was a spark of magic but it felt a bit forced. Actual reference/homage that could be used without being forced was missing (like 'Lock s-foils in attack positions')
-Didn't like the humor. It was funny, but felt kind of campy at times. Star Wars movies have had humor in them, but not constantly, and not this modern absurd-esque humor where people have funny misunderstandings
>>63772013
In order to establish true poetry they will probably make Ren turn in episode 9 and then he will Snoke.
>>63772013
I'm betting on this as well, I'm really being foolishly optimistic here and hoping that they don't just copy the OT frame for frame, they have a chance to do something interesting on this trilogy since they played it so safe with this film. Now that they got everyone invested they can take it in an interesting route.
>>63769603
>(luke was essentially useless in the original)
opinion invalidated, fuck off back to reddit
>>63770783
You can see Kylo's frustration though. My guess is that even though he seems this big foreboding character, he's mediocre at the force beyond a few tricks (he struggled really hard with force grabbing the lightsaber from the snow when it mattered most). He's the pawn of Snoke because he's from a notable bloodline, is devious, loyal, and appears menacing as fuck.
In reality, he's meh with the force. Rey, on the other hand, is Anakin-level force
>muh midiclorians
to the point where untrained Rey force > trained Kylo force
which just makes him more angry at himself and slip up more.
>>63772157
There is no way that Rey has more midiclorians then Ren though. Ren has the bloodline going for him already.
>>63772249
>Implying Rey doesn't
My only problem with the film is that R2 didn't save the day. Hopefully, he gets his moment in the next one.
>>63769625
>I used the word "patrician" to guarantee replies. Don't get too autistic about it.
There's only one autist in thread OP.
If you are white and support this piece of shit cultural marxist propaganda "film" you are a brainless brainwashed faggot ass sellout c.uckold pile of garbage.
Fuck you.
>>63772266
If Rey is a Skywalker then she has the same amount as him not more. Then she shouldn't be able to beat him.
>>63772099
This is a corporate product and they literally hired the only even more corporate director than JJ to direct the second movie. This is going to absolutely no nothing even remotely close to "risky". There are going to be no surprises my friend.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5CVsCnxyXg
>>63772318
>complains about corporate art
>posts radiohead
kill yourself
>>63772249
>>63772266
Rey is a skywalker, she is already god tier compared to Leah's son.
>>63772318
If they do there will be a backlash, people are already shitting on this film even though it was pretty good, for being a rehash of ANH, honestly I really hope they go for something different instead of just rehashing the OT frame for frame. That would be bad for their product in the long run, they would lose money if they did.
>>63769603
Main problem that is film mediocre and it still perceived as the best film ever.
>>63771426
>Thrawn
EU-fags please go
>>63772388
I mean that she's Luke's progeny and not Leah, Luke is god tier in the force, Leah is just meh and we don't even know who Rey's mother is, could be another force user.
>>63771601
>they retconned the ending of ROTJ out of existence
>implying Dark Empire didn't do that 20 years ago
>>63772361
Oh, I don't listen to radiohead.
>>63772388
Who is shitting on this movie. Every star wars manchild reviewer has been creaming themselves over this.
Just watch this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBMW3y86cpo
>>63772311
>he doesn't know cuck isn't wordfiltered anymore
faggot
>>63772448
I know people are creaming themselves over this, but if they rehash this trilogy way too hard people will be really pissed off. I think they will rehash it, but they are in a unique position where they can take some risks, and from a business standpoint I truly think that they will, because everyone is already invested in this new trilogy, so why not take some risks and make Star Wars interesting for once? Instead of muh light/dark side dichotomy.
>>63772388
>Rey is a skywalker, she is already god tier compared to Leah's son.
So is Ren. The point is she should'nt be able to beat him when he is trained.
>>63772418
>I mean that she's Luke's progeny and not Leah, Luke is god tier in the force, Leah is just meh and we don't even know who Rey's mother is, could be another force user.
The only difference is that Leia is not trained. If she was she would be equal to look. Which proves the point. An untrained Rey shouldn't be able to be a trained Ren.
>>63772596
There is a difference though, Leah obviously isn't as adept as Luke in the force considering that she never started her training even though it was foreshadowed in RoTJ. She isn't as powerful as luke, nowhere near, which would make sense that Rey, his daughter would absolutely destroy Kylo and be more naturally adept at the force.
>>63772539
>from a business standpoint I truly think that they will
That's not how businesses work. They avoid risk and without an auteur like 70s lucas at the helm with all the power, the leader will be the board room executive committee. They will look at what worked before and do that.
Sorry to disappoint you.
>>63772596
>>63772646
Guys, not to be pedantic but her name is spelled Leia.
>>63772655
I'm not disappointed at all, I never said they were going to rehash it, nor do I care. Star Trek is my favorite sci-fi series, Star Wars if fucking trash and is literally led by a black and white moral compass. I am a fan but it really is fucking garbage. All I am saying is that they are in a unique position to not completely rehash the trilogy, and if they do they can be entering backlash territory which would hurt sales and thus hurt their profit margin.
>>63772737
weren't
>>63772596
Obviously, Luke started to train her before abandoning her in the desert. She was certainly older than the younglings shown in the prequel trilogy. Also, it was heavily implied that Ren has no self-confidence and probably isn't that good at being a Jedi as a result. This lack no doubt comes from being the son of Han Solo. He probably feels that when Luke was training him, he wasn't strong/powerful enough so he looked to the dark side thinking he will be more powerful if he lets Snoke train him to be like Darth Vader.
The subtext in this movie is quite clear. Also, Abrams was involved so you know that everyone has daddy/family issues.
>>63772655
Unfortunately this. Plus most of the people who are seeing this film probably haven't seen the original trilogy, so they wouldnt know the new films are copies. Disney are in charge of the film. Think about that for a second. Disney. The company who knows how to make the best formulaic plots in history. Do you think they would ever do something artistic and interesting for a movie?
>>63772646
> There is a difference though, Leah obviously isn't as adept as Luke in the force considering that she never started her training even though it was foreshadowed in RoTJ. She isn't as powerful as luke, nowhere near, which would make sense that Rey, his daughter would absolutely destroy Kylo and be more naturally adept at the force.
I don't think it works like that, anon. Training doesn't suddenly make your children more powerful with the force.
>>63772774
> Obviously, Luke started to train her before abandoning her in the desert.
That would certainly explain it. That is like the amnesia theories.
I didn't like it
>>63772737
>and if they do they can be entering backlash territory which would hurt sales and thus hurt their profit margin.
I'm counting on precisely this for both the superhero and Star Wars movies. I want to see a market crash for this type of blockbuster trash.
Hopefully the chaos will usher in a new 1970s where people actually let directors make things they're interested in again.
>>63772888
I mean literally Luke is more powerful than Leia in the force, it's almost gender linked if you will. That is why Rey is stronger than Kylo. Leia is weak in the force and would be even with training, she just has a sense of it, not a full grasp.
>>63769603
>The main villain is weak and has an extremely poorly defined motivation
the only part I partially disagree with, Kylo's character was like a tb to the early days of Anakin as a jedi. Way too explosive and violent, he didn't even finished his training and we don't even know why he turned to the dark side. This is actually the first time we can see a Jedi and a Sith(?) at equal level, not a Jedi lvl 10 vs an elder Sith lvl 180 and loose a fucking arm.
Don't worry, this is probably the third best star wars movie we have and personally I have really high hopes for the next ones.
>>63772045
>-Callbacks that weren't forced or *winks to the audience*. Stuff like Ackbar just being there being a cool dude.
Oh, they were fucking forced.
>>63772967
>this is probably the third best star wars movie we have
I mean, no. It's factually worse than VI
>>63772939
I think it's unfair to compare the cape shit shlock to this Star Wars, I really liked it, it wasn't perfect, but it really rose Star Wars to a really great level again. Which is why I hope they take some risks.
>>63773070
>I think it's unfair to compare the cape shit shlock to this Star Wars,
I don't think its unfair at all. I think its extremely appropriate. The first Avengers movie and Iron Man 1 are both better than this from a writing, pacing and characterization standpoint.
>>63772966
> I mean literally Luke is more powerful than Leia in the force, it's almost gender linked if you will. That is why Rey is stronger than Kylo.
There is no evidence in the story that children that get their force power from a male would be more powerful then ones that it get it from a female. Leia's children should be as powerful as Lukes.
> Leia is weak in the force and would be even with training, she just has a sense of it, not a full grasp.
Leia is absolutely not weak in the force. She can sense things just as well as Luke. She is one of the most powerful force users. At Bespin at the end of empire strikes back she even sensed Luke so she knew they had to go back. With training she would be as powerful as Luke.
>>63773183
That was speculation on my part but I really think Luke is just stronger than Leia in the force, quite literally, is she force sensitive? Yes, is she as adept as Luke in the force? Hell no.
>>63773180
Oh my god you just said avengers and Iron man 1 was better than TFA, thanks for that, needed a laugh before I went to bed.
>>63773310
They are extremely similar in many very important ways.
>>63773327
Yet TFA manages to be more competent in pacing and overall character progression. Even the lame as humor in the cape shit films you said were cringe-worthy compared to the shitty humor in TFA. It has it's flaws sure, but to compare it too bottom of the barrel capeshit is just ridiculous honestly. I was actually invested in an adventure film, there was stakes and there were emotional moments that weren't exactly predictable. I'm just going to probably assume you really like Marvel or something and that's ok, but come the fuck on, seriously? Fucking kek.
>>63773282
They have equal force potential. But that is not even the point anyways. The point is that Ren is supposed to be powerful as someone who is (1) trained by Luke Skywalker himself (2) has the Skywalker bloodline. Yet he was beat by some girl who apparently wasn't trained.
>>63773065
Don't you dare. I will fight you son.
>>63773407
Kylo was weakened, obviously there was a scale that was tipped in her favor. He was conflicted as well and was literally emotionally fucked because he had just killed his father. His mind wasn't really in the fight, quite literally considering his doubt in himself was probably at it's peak due to what he had just done. He probably would've won if it hand't been for the bowcaster and fighting finn wounded first. Obviously though Rey is clearly stronger than him in the force. It isn't even a question, you can visibly see the frustration on his face from this realization. Rey is also more of a pure jedi than he is since she had no family ties and had no connection to her loved ones. She was in the perfect breeding ground for force users. Luke is LITERALLY, stronger than leia in the force, considering that she never completed her training and just has basic force sensitivity. This is literally supported by the films.
>>63769603
>FN seems to be playing a completely unnecessary love interest.
It's a Disney movie.
>The main villain is weak and has an extremely poorly defined motivation.
I like this.
Everyone is complaining that Rey is too perfect. Then everyone complains that the villain is lame? they literally can't win. If the villain was amazing and powerful and dark and scary like Vader everyone would be complaining that this powerful villain even darker than Vader just sprang up overnight in a galaxy without Jedi or Sith. Who trained him? they'd ask. How do they cheapen the Sith like that by having some randomer just as good with a lightsaber as them? They'd say.
You can't fucking win.
Otherwise I agree it's just a rehash of old crap so people can say "omg I get that reference". But that's just modern cinema for you. Better than I and II, worse than III.
>>63773534
Ep. I had better soundtrack.
>>63773534
It completely blows the fuck out of the prequels considering that it actually has.
1.Practical effects
2. Set design
3. Likable characters
4. Poignant Humour
5. Actual writing and story progression
6. And actual acting that isn't behind a green screen.
Fuck off with saying 3 is good in any way. Seriously you make me cringe. TFA wasn't perfect but it was certainly OT tier in that regard.
OP ain't far off (search your feelings, you know it to be true).
The characters were good. It was interesting to have a villain who was a fuckup and the fact that the heroes are just getting thrown into things with almost no context, let alone training, kept him a credible threat. However, the plot was a bloated mess of retreads that felt like it was written to check every item on a list of Star Wars Movie stuff and outside the main villain, the antagonists were laughably bad. Like, 90s cartoon bad.
But the action scenes were great and most of them weren't devoid of meaning, so I give it a B+. Better than the prequels, better than Michael Bay shit, not as good as Edge of Tomorrow even with its cop-out ending.
I expect the spinoff movies will suffer less under the yoke of attempting to include every reference or blatant retread and turn out to be the better movies.
>>63771197
>Kylo is at a rank where he is telling the Imperial military leader
They aren't Imperial.
Kylo isn't Sith.
They're just some random dudes who want to blow shit up. Probably offshoots of the failed former Empire. The Galaxy is a big place.
Kylo isn't Sith. He wasn't trained by generations of lightsaber wielding artists.
The big bad guy will probably pull some force mumbo jumbo and train him to be more badass in the next film, and I guess Luke will do the same with that wonder kid. then we'll have a real lightsaber battle.
Kylo couldn't even beat the black dude who has 0 force power at all. Why? Because he's not fucking Sith
Do the ships look like shit? They did in the trailer.
Why aren't they using models?
>>63773656
Are people really just clueless when it comes to Snoke? It's fucking Palpatine guys, it's fucking obvious, seriously.
>>63769603
this is the first movie of a planned trilogy
it can't explain every single motivation for every single character, while still trying to bring new people as an audience, and be technically and aesthetically pleasing as a film
i think your 'issues' are unfounded
>>63773707
This honestly, now that people are invested in the trilogy and the profit is secured they can take some risks with it. I really hope they do.
>>63773707
Yes it can, see LoTR.
>>63772157
>he's meh with the force
>stopped a blaster bolt mid-flight
>>63773668
Yes. And apparently the only weapons in the imperial arsenal are TIE fighters and a shuttle, while rebels only have X-Wings. They couldn't even be bothered coming up with any new ships, they had to be rehashes of only the most iconic fighters.
What planet was destroyed by the Starkiller base?
They mentioned a system but it wasn't courscant.
>>63773668
All I want is for John Ford to come back alive and direct one more western in monument valley.
Is that really so much to ask?
>>63773629
totally this
1/2/3 (who cares lol) >>>>>> 4/7 >5 > 6
>>63773848
It was 5 planets all at the same time and yes, one was courisant.
Seems absolutely retarded as well.
>>63773508
> Kylo was weakened, obviously there was a scale that was tipped in her favor.
She is a Mary Sue.
> Obviously though Rey is clearly stronger than him in the force.
There is no good reason for this. She shouldn't suddenly be more powerful because she is a light side user.
>Luke is LITERALLY, stronger than leia in the force, considering that she never completed her training and just has basic force sensitivity. This is literally supported by the films.
Here is an actual quote from the films which literally demonstrates that Leia has the same power as Luke:
Leia: Luke, don't talk that way! You have a power I don't understand and could never have.
Luke: You're wrong, Leia. You have that power too. In time you'll learn to use it as I have.
>>63773848
I think I ship it like this
5>4/7>6
It's really hard to rank them though.
Did they blow up Coruscant? They mentioned they were taking out the republic senate, and it looked like Coruscaunt, but there was so little emotional importance attached to the whole affair. Nobody seemed to care about it, and the action had absolutely no bearing on the rest of the story.
>>63772045
>A lot of plot details unexplained. Situation with the Empire becoming the First Order and the status of the Republic not really explained
This. I understand that they didn't want to bog the movie down with exposition but aside from a few lines not much is known about the Republic and the Empire/First order. I'm assuming Disney is doing this so they can fill it in with their new EU but its still frustrating.
>>63773908
Of course she has the power, but it doesn't literally state that she has the same potential as he does. Nothing in that quote implies that, at all. She never completed her training so obviously she isn't as strong as luke in the force. Mary sue isn't a counter argument, why she won was exactly what I said in my previous post. Spouting a buzz word doesn't make your point valid. Rey is stronger than Kylo because she is Luke's daughter, who was more powerful than her sister, and in turn was one of the most powerful jedi in the lore.
>>63771817
>Disney has a dual purpose with this movie (1) appealing to all the plebs that think the originals are the second coming of Jesus
It's not even that deep.
Modern blockbusters are just about cramming as much stuff that plebs recognise in as possible so people think it's good.
the average man on the street thinks Star Wars is a man in black with red lightsaber walking around with guys in Nazi uniforms on a Death Star that's attacked by rebels wearing red in X-wings, while our brave untrained but force powerful hero finds a lightsaber and flies around with Han Solo and Chewie in the Millenium Falcon.
So that's what this film is about too. Because people recognise it.
It's like how nu Star Trek is about the womaniser Kirk and emotionless Spock on board the Enterprise, because that;s what the public thinks Star Trek is. Then they fill the gaps with generic action.
>>63773958
Yeah, the reason there was so little build up for that is because the screenplay was either too long or just plain bad.
This isn't good filmmaking from a story standpoint or editing/pacing. Honestly though you can't blame jj a lot of the direction and individual shots were good.
>>63774015
>the average man on the street thinks Star Wars is a man in black with red lightsaber walking around with guys in Nazi uniforms
Doesn't help when the storm troopers fucking zeig heil
>>63773958
>>63774040
They said they were destroying the republic, and the republic is on coruscant. That's all the buildup it needed considering it was already established that the Senate was important to the rebels in this film.
>>63773958
It was Hosnian Prime. I thought it was Coruscaunt at first too.
Just finished watching the movie
Better than prequels so that was good enough for me.
Fin looked so out of place throughout the whole movie. Seriously what the heck is he doing?
Kylo was the typical "you just don't understand me dad!" fuccboi. And ugly as fuck. He should that mask on him.
I liked Rey
BB8 was cute
Pilot was cool but there was barely any screen time for him
Classic C3PO
Chewie was Chewie
Han relied too much on muh nostalgia
I thought captain Phasma was going to be a badass
Soundtrack was good
Visually it was great. CGI was well done and not over used.
The begging was the worst part. It dragged way too long.
Rest was fine
There were exactly 4 times when the audience had nostalgiagasms.
6.5/10
How did they end up finding the rebel base? Rey was their only hope of locating it, but she got away before it could be revealed. Did I miss something?
>>63774009
They are literally twins. We saw them at their conception. The only difference between the two is their upbringing. That is a fact. Yet you keep repeating the same bullshit argument that Luke has more force sensitivity then Leia when they are fucking twins. Give an argument that isn't nonsense if you want to prove she isn't a Mary Sue. The idea that she is a Mary Sue isn't original to me. Many here have said the same and someone else even created a whole thread about it.
I know this movie is part of a trilogy but if I would rate this movie on its own premise it would be bad.
>>63774117
>Soundtrack was good
Weakest part of the film in my opinion. There weren't any memorable scores, and the music never accentuated the action. It was more like filler between the WUBWUBWUB of starfighter engines and dialogue.
>>63774130
They didn't find it.
>>63774159
Look man just because I have been blowing you the fuck out doesn't mean you have to be angry. I get it, you're slow, you have a hard time understand children's films so let me break it down for you. People who are born twins aren't equal, some may be stronger/smarter etc. than the other. You thinking that because they are twins means they have the same force capabilities is a failure on your part to think properly, since you are a retard, and that's ok, I'll hold your hand for you.
The argument was never about Rey being a mary sure, she is, the argument was your amazement at Rey winning against kylo and being naturally stronger than Luke in the force. You are slow, and completely dull when it comes to analyzing anything obviously and it has been my pleasure holding your hand while you get blown the fuck out simultaneously.
>>63773707
>>63773742
Yup this is exactly what they've done.
Here's a new hope. But with new characters. Now that you know them in a familiar setting, let us tell you a story.
>>63774263
naturally stronger than Kylo***
>>63769603
>The Darth Vader character worked because you knew little about him
>because you knew little about him
>The Ren character is neither, he's literally just a Vader fan boy
Do you see where you went wrong
>>63774263
So what were the motivation for stopping them from firing off the weapon again? What was being targeted that was so important? Were they just going to blow up some other random planet? It seems like it would have been worthwhile to wait a while and gather some strength instead of sacrificing their X-wing fleet?
I think people exaggerate how great and charismatic Poe was, probably partially because /tv/ loves Isaac and wants his dick in their mouths. He was good but so was Finn.
I thought Finn brought a certain naivety to the movie that worked really well. Han telling him "that's not how the force works" and BB-8 giving him thumbs up were probably my favorite comical moments in it.
>>63774423
I thought they were targeting the planet that all the resistance were on.
Does it piss anyone else off that we see xwings jump to light speed? They're fucking fighters.
>>63774423
>>63774263
I thought they tracked the falcon again to the rebel base and that's how they got their target for the second firing.
>>63774423
They were just blowing up random systems remember? They just happened to guess correctly, and they were going to continue doing so until they hit them basically. Once they realized that it was coming to their vicinity they acted upon it.
>>63774478
Dude, come on, they do that in the original trilogy. Watch em again.
>>63774263
> Look man just because I have been blowing you the fuck out doesn't mean you have to be angry. I get it, you're slow, you have a hard time understand children's films so let me break it down for you. People who are born twins aren't equal, some may be stronger/smarter etc. than the other. You thinking that because they are twins means they have the same force capabilities is a failure on your part to think properly, since you are a retard, and that's ok, I'll hold your hand for you.
Your argument is that "I really think Luke is just stronger than Leia in the force" in other words you are an idiot who "thinks" that Luke is stronger then Leia in the force. Provide one piece of evidence what you "think" at some point. You didn't blow anyone out. I provided evidence that proves they are equal (1) they are twins (2) Luke literally says in the movie they have the same power. Provide some evidence other then that you "think" that Luke is more powerful.
>>63774443
>shoots down a TIE
WHOOO YA BOII!!!
>takes Phasma hostage
AYYO IM IN CHARGE NOW MUTHAFUCKA!
>>63774478
X-Wings have hyperdrives you double nigger
>>63773047
The ones that /weren't/ forced. There were plenty that were forced, I liked the ones that were just there.
SPOILERS
I felt that Han's death lacked the devastating punch that it should have had. I mean, this is a character that people have loved for 40 years. It was okay, but not deeply emotional. Perhaps a big component of this is that he really played like an extra in the film. His death should have resonated though Chewbacca more than it did. Chewy was perfectly happy to have Rey take over as pilot without any problem. Nobody carried any heaviness or loss for him. Leia felt the death, but that was for a moment. Han deserved a little more. Because of this lack of gravitas, I feel that Luke's reveal suffered as well. When I saw Luke, I felt that here's another character I loved that will be given a pastiche treatment.
Did I have a nice time at the movie? Yes! It was fine.
>>63774508
Again twins aren't born equal, you again thinking so is still a failure on your part to think critically. You are completely retarded, I've already provided responses detailing why I think Luke is stronger in the force. You keep ignoring them, because you are brain dead and keep repeating muh twins and you posted a quote out of context that didn't even help your argument. You are a fucking joke.
>>63774478
They always could. How else do you think Luke went from Hoth to Degobah then over to Bespin?
>>63774478
Dumb fuck
>>63774545
But at the end Chewbacca clearly looks sad as he accepts that he has to move on when Rey looks compassionately at him. I felt it did his character justice.
>>63774519
Poe was acting exactly the same when they escaped together, though.
PART ONE: The Audience is left to assume too many things
Just got out of it myself.
Main issues off the bat
>Pacing is fucking brutal, the whole moving feels like it's on fucking overdrive, cramming as much shit in as possible
>New Characters aren't used to their full potential in favor of callbacks to the OT and to satisfy the pacing
>Fucked up the sounds for the blasters, admittedly a minor niggle, but one that really irks me
>Plot relies too much on convenience, especially early on in the film.
>Too much quirky comedy that sometimes felt forced and often felt out of place in a star wars movie
On the positive side
>Story felt competent if a little too dense
>I actually liked the new characters a lot
>While there was generally too much action, it was all fun and exciting
>Lightsaber fight was excellent
>Harrison actually remembered he was an actor for this movie
>Effects were fantastic, an efficient blend of CG and practical effects
Overall I liked it and thought it did a good job as a film and a Star Wars film in general, it's no flawless masterpiece but then neither were the originals, but jesus fuck did it need to slow down sometimes and let the audience catch some air, I really didn't think we need like 20 different fight scenes in the movie, and it leaves the film with little time to fully establish characters and their relationship. Though, to be honest, the pacing does make the scene whereKylo Ren kills Hanreally good as the whole movie which has been moving at a lightning pace till then comes almost to a halt. Also really happy that the lightsaber combat in this felt like it had meaning and purpose rather than the prequels wild spectacle. I'd say in comparison to the rest of the saga, it's a damn sight better than the prequels, but falls just short of A New Hope, though it does lay a good foundation for the rest of the series.
>>63774593
You may be right! I'm sure I will see it again, and maybe I was projecting something onto this. I just remembered when I saw LOTR: Return of the King there were moments where I actually had to hold back tears in the theater. I didn't have that emotional response here.
>>63774731
It was just like New Hope, the emotional scenes will come in the next films, trust me on this. Return of the King is also the last one of that trilogy.
>>63774545
Really the movies not trying to focus on Han and the rest of the OT characters, Hans death is suppose to be more important to Ren, Ray, and Fin, as characters than it is to Han, Leia, or Chewie. We're looking at how they react to the loss of this father figure, and what it means to them.
>>63774545
I completely agree, it felt very brushed over. The only reason people were moved at all was because it was Han fucking Solo fucking dying, not because it was a moving scene.
>>63774553
> Again twins aren't born equal
Fraternal twins have the maximal degree of consanguinity outside of identical twins (which they are not because one is male and the other female). This degree of consanguinity implies that they have a similar midichlorian count.
> You keep ignoring them
I didn't ignore any of your responses. But you have provided no evidence so due to your lack of an argument you are resorting to insults. Insults are not an argument rather they are an example of the ad hominem fallacy.
I liked the movie. A lot.
Yeah there are some bit dumb things, and some things you just cant turn a blind eye. But what SW movie dosent? The whole franchise, including original trilogy is not whitout a sin. It is not untouchable.
I liked all the new characters. All of them are unique, not just in the move but in all SW moves. There is good acting, and amazing chemistry between all of them, Poe and Fin, Kylo and Hux, in particular.Action is probably the best in series, and humor is spot on, and deliverd right on time.
There is not too much references to old trilogy, shure it had fanservice, but it is not in your face.
Also I belived there is going to be teen movie moment, when Rey finds out that Fin lied. But there was not. It had several potential clishe moments, and all of them avoided.
And I think criticism over Fins use of lightsaber is not on place. First time he used it, he lost against stormtrooper. Also against Kylo he lost. Also he was millitary, so you know he has some combat training so he knows how to handle weapons, and there was Kylo injury. My problem with Kylo duel is the fact that Kylo never used force against him.
And yeah, Ray winning over Kylo is kinda too much, but it is not nearly too muchlike episode 6, when ewoks win over elite stormtroopers.
Is it the bighest move of the year? Yes, by far. Is it the best? No
>>63774908
>similar midichlorian count.
Didn't that get retconned out after the Episode 1 or am I retarded?
I swear I remember hearing that they got changed.
>>63772045
>-Leia didn't sound like Leia. Carrie Fisher was hitting the cigs a little too hard
Carrie Fisher did shittons of drugs in her life. She was burning her body out since the 70's. That shit fucks your body up hard, man.
>>63775026
No episode one is still canon.
>>63775026
It didn't get retconned but it did get swept under the rug and forgotten about by everyone.
>>63775056
Well yeah, but I was talking specifically about midichlorian's being a powerlevel potential measurement.
tl;dr
It was decent. Not as bad as /tv/ has said, but not amazing.
I think they wanted badly for it to not be like the prequels so they over-compensated and made it very similar to A New Hope with too many call-backs.
Still, was a decent foundation for a new trilogy. I just hope they take it in a new direction after this and not just copy the whole of the original trilogy.
>>63775099
It might not be one to one but its often argued that there is a correlation. The fact that Luke and Leia have very similar midichlorian counts implies that cannot be used to argue Luke is more force sensitive then Leia.
>>63775213
I really think the next one will be better since we've got most of OT callbacks out of the way, next episode will probably be more focused on Fin and Po fighting the First Order, with Ray getting trained in the force by Luke, and will probably follow similar path as Empire with one party needing to rescue the other.
>twins have the same force potential
Just like they have the same genitals, right?
>>63775422
Fraternal twins don't have the same genitals but identical twins do.
https://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/health/conditionsandtreatments/twins-identical-and-fraternal
But yes, they have equal force potential.They have a high degree of consanguinity and Luke himself even says with regards to his own power that Leia has that power too.
Rey was the best part. This felt like they were setting up 8 and 9, which is good, because the test of time will tell us how good this movie is based on how good 8 and 9 are. If 8 and 9 are shit, then this movie is shit, and vice versa, since it so heavily leaned on pretext for the future
>>63769603
Y did u save him
BECAUSE ITS WTIGHT
>>63772045
I agree mostly, except for the humor, I thought they were delivered excellently, though Finn was made to be a bit too hood, still funny though.
The movie is full of setups for the next sequels, the story should be overarching and well thought out, assuming the writers did a good job for the whole plot.
That said because of all the setups Rey currently looks like a Mary Sue if you contain the movie by itself, which is the main complaint of a lot of people who are dumb to think that there isn't a more profound reason for her eliteness.
>>63775026
>I swear I remember hearing that they got changed.
Han described the force as like an energy that runs through every living thing or something just like the OT. No mention of midichlorians
I felt like it was a deliberate jab at the prequels but I might be wrong
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/film/star-wars-the-force-awakens/finn-john-boyega-george-lucas-fn-2187/
What the fuck
>>63772045
>Every memorable piece of music in the movie was not from TFA but from the other films. TFA had a lacking score, and yet wasn't also brave enough to use stuff like Duel of the Fates
CAN A MOTHERFUCKER GET AN IMPERIAL MARCH UP IN HERE
No I don't care that they're defunct/transformed/replaced as an organization.
>>63769603
If anything grown up Leia is healthier then Luke who grew up on a shithole like Tatooine with low humidity. Leia haters blown out!
>>63769603
>Finn is useless
>Kylo Ren is weak and has lame motivation
Valid in the context of it just being a stand-alone movie -- the only character who has an interesting, complete plot is Han. Obviously it's because this movie is laying an enormous amount of groundwork for the new trilogy. If you want to complain about this movie just being a set-up for later movies, that's fair, complain about that.
The next movie is obviously going to play with Rey turning to the dark side and Ren turning to the light. Finn is useless now because this movie is only the very beginning of that character's plot. Something happens to Finn that drives Rey to the dark side, and either Finn will die or will have to take a more active role to not die. There is no other way that character arc can go given that this is Star Wars.
On the other hand, Kylo Ren has poor motivation because the next movie will give him sufficient motivation to turn to the light side. Again, just try to imagine this movie franchise doing ANYTHING else.
... That's all pretty obvious, but hear me out on this one. This movie foreshadows Rey and Ren's dark-side-light-side switch pretty heavily. The next movie's gonna be all about that, but they're going to try and keep audiences guessing still. The big lead-up to Episode 9 is going to pose the question "Which one is gonna be evil and which one is gonna be good." I am calling it now, screencap this NOW so you can be all like how'd he do it? in 2019 or whenever:Rey turns to the dark side, Ren goes good at the end of Ep 8 but then switches back to the dark side in Ep 9 so now they're both evil. Finn discovers Force powers, and it's him and somebody we haven't met yet vs. Rey and Ren.Also Poe betrays the Resistance and sells them out to the First Order in Episode 8.
Just a friendly reminder that Leia can't seem to sense where her brother ran off to.
She sure is force-competent you guys.
>>63772596
Her mother has the force in the comics... But still doesn.t explai the fact that she.s such a forceweilder
>>63769603
The movie was mostly action set pieces with barely any plot in between.
Keep Calm and Poe Dameron
Recycled plot that's basically just a direct rip from Episode IV, but the characters were all great. It's genuinely funny in a way that doesn't feel too Joss Whedonish
>>63776210
Because Luke was deliberately hiding for some reason (Disney reasons). But she spotted him at the end of empire strikes back which demonstrates that she does have that power.
What's the point of even posting here when you know 99% of the people here are going to be contrarian just for the sake of being fucking contrarian? We're really going to pretend the prequels were better than VII? We're really going to do that? Why? Why do you need to feel so special? Did you know that nobody gives a shit?
>>63776483
>We're really going to pretend the prequels were better than VII?
Literally no one is saying that. I think even the people who are disappointed would concede that it's better than that prequels
>>63776518
I heard someone unironically say that whilst we were walking out of the cinema.
>>63776541
Retards don't count
>>63776294
Why the fuck wasn't he in more of this movie? Wasn't he supposed to one of the new main trio? But, No. They push him off screen for like a third of the movie, and the he gets almost no time at all to interact with the rest of the cast. Hell does he even talk to Rey at all in the film? Literally a waste of a good character all because the writers are too stupid to figure out how to get Fin and Rey to bond with out him being absent.
>>63776541
7 is by no means a "great" film, but yeah, it is defintely better then the prequels.
...but my Han :(
>>63776431
My point being that for all the arguing by the Leia lover, he fails to realize this.
>>63776634
Dude, no. Seeing him return after being gone for like an hour was one of the genuinely great moments of the film. Less is often more.
>>63776701
I am the Leia lover I see what you mean. I just place more emphasis on this scene from by far the best of the movies (empire strikes back). Its an amazing scene and one of the best in Star Wars which shows Leia has force power.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xu5-hq-h_4Q
>>63776879
Well right, I totally acknowledge her ability and the scene where Luke tells her she can become powerful. I'm not really siding with the other guy.
Frankly, the issue with many of the lore critiques is that there are 30 years unaccounted for. At best, we knew that the Empire did fall and the New Republic was established, the New Jedi Order already came and went, and the loss of Han and Leia's already seemingly troubled son to the dark side tore their family (including Luke's) apart. Even then there are little details.
>>63776294
He looks like Luke Skywalker mixed with Ash from Evil Dead, and his personality is Han Solo mixed with, well, Ash from Evil Dead.
He's such a blatant bullshit fan-service character. And I bought it 100%. I hate Disney and I hate myself and I love Poe Dameron.
He's so dreamy.
>>63776518
I'll be the one to say that then.
The prequels were better. They at least had the ambition of trying to write something new, and to create compelling characters (even if it failed). The visuals were also amazing for their time, though they aged like milk.
A planet that's a big city, a planet covered in water, a planet that's all lava, all those new aliens and creatures, etc. That shit was creative.
The new one is a soulless corporate venture only out to make money. Not a single original idea has been brought into the project.
>>63776722
It's like if Wedge Antilles had had a more active role in the ot
>>63769603
But JJ literally did write the film.
He co-wrote it with Kasdan.
>>63777117
"A planet that's a big city, a planet covered in water, a planet that's all lava, all those new aliens and creatures, etc. That shit was creative."
What in the actual fuck? hahahaha
>>63776722
I'm not saying him coming back wasn't awesome, I just expected him to have more screen time and interaction with the other characters considering he was billed as a fairly major character.
>>63777214
Except Wedge wasn't suppose to be one of the main characters
>>63769603
What's up with Leia here? Were she and Luke supposed to be banging before they settled on making them siblings?
>>63769603
>poorly defined motivation
what, do you want everything spelled out for you in big bright letters?
>>63776182
Please stop. This is like all the predictions for Ep 7 where people were saying the movie will stress how the Empire was efficient despite being evil, and that the Empire would be the "good" rebels now and bla bla bla, which is why Luke would be leading them, because he's ultimately a good guy no matter what the political system.
But let's face it, these movies are never going to do anything interesting.
>>63777400
everyone liked ford 10x more than luke.
>>63777400
Yes because ANH was generic heroes tale the movie, he defeats the evil bad guys and gets the girl in the end. This was then subverted by Empire Strikes Back, which part of what makes that movie great.
>>63776518
The prequels were better. Or, if you prefer, they weer a better idea executed in a worse way. The Force Awakens is nice on a technical level but the script, the characters, the setting - it's all ass. The prequels were by no means good, but if you cut out all the bad and watch them with additional EU knowledge that adds depth to the scenes, they're way better. Palpatine is a great character.
Now, it might turn out that the same happens with this new trilogy, but I personally am not digging it so far.
>>63777438
Are you stupid? His motivation was poorly defined. He's not talking about them being subtle; he's saying they're absent which they are.
I LOVE DARTH VADER isn't a fucking motivation. You're never shown why he actually chose the dark side over the light side, why he fell in the first place, or where his conflict comes other than "muh daddy" -- which by the way sucked dick, because we had no emotional investment in their relationship.
>>63777562
>the characters,
Utter complete nonsensical bullshit. If there's anything VII does right, it's the characters. The plot is recycled, but the characters are genuinely good.
>>63777117
Look, criticize VII all you want; it has problems. But don't sit here and type out nonsense of this caliber. The prequels weren't anything new; the main plot points existed since 1983, and everything it did it did worse than Episode VII. There isn't single aspect of VII that is in any way worse than than those abortions.
>>63777623
He was being taught by Luke but switched to the dark side. The fact that it's isn't explained in this movie doesn't imply that there's no backstory. Not everything needs exposition.
>>63777782
Rey was an absolute flatline and it pissed me off
Every other character was really good and then she's just mary sue boring as fuck
![o-JJ-ABRAMS-ON-STAR-WARS-facebook[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/Z0dK8Fq.jpg "o-JJ-ABRAMS-ON-STAR-WARS-facebook[1].jpg")
>>63777950
>The fact that it's isn't explained in this movie doesn't imply that there's no backstory.
HE CAN'T KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS
So why did Rey get mind wiped of her jedi knowledge?
It seemed like such a stupid macguffin
>those legs
God bring back the 70s
>>63777971
the other characters only seemed that good because they didn't have to carry the film. they could just meme it up and crack jokes.
>>63777999
to avoid having to start the story at an earlier point
it would have helped the story in a number of ways if it hadn't started in medias res, but had started with Kylo's fall, why he hates Han, and the Jedi temple being destroyed. it could have gone into much more detail about why the New Republic sucks, etc.
but that would have required actual writing so it didn't happen.
>>63769603
I agree Kylo Ren is alot weaker although i prefer his voice way more than Darth Vader. Sounds way more menacing. Although the way they wrote his character i.e. the lines he delivers when he is speaking to Han. It is like he truly wants to be good.. so why still remain on the dark side? Exactly he is mainly a darth vader fan boy but I would have liked to hear more about why he does what he does.
In my film school, the teacher makes it very important that we need to know the antagonist's exact goals so we can see the world from his view point.
Kylo Ren calls Rey a "liar, a thief, a traitor". But he never gives the audience an example on WHY the New Order is so much better than the Rebellion.
I feel the storm trooper's goals, Kylo Ren's goal and Snoke's goal needed to be more explained. Of course this is a first parter of a 3 act movie series so more will be explained, but I just dont want to keep hearing "rebels are all scum, dark side has it all".
I want MORE political explanations into the dark siders' minds.
>>63777991
The biggest problem with VII is that like Empire it isn't a stand alone film. It feels like the first episode of a television season. I feel like we'll get more in the next film.
>they didnt just google image search the star map piece BB8 had
seriously how the fuck could they not have found out where it was
>>63778173
Exactly. It reminds me of the Dune and Children of Dune miniseries which I gotta say, is some of the best miniseries I have ever seen.
>relies far too heavily on callbacks to the original trilogy.
Agreed
>makes the film feel like a product but not as blatantly as Jurassic World.
In what way? I believe the studios of both films saw them as nothing but products, and I also believe that Trevorrow (spelling?) and Abrams cared passionately about the film. There was a lot of love in both movies - just a lot of ignorance as well.
>FN-2187 character is useless
Agreed, except for the one time he got his hands on a blaster and took out a bunch of troopers.
>FN seems to be playing a completely unnecessary love interest.
I honestly think Abrams was too scared to make a firm decision over whether Finn will be a love interest to Rey. He's leaving it up to Johnson so he doesn't have to face the Twitter controversy.
>The main villain is weak and has an extremely poorly defined motivation.
Was bothered by the weakness but not the motivation.
>Also, no way in hell should the film have decided to have him defeated but not killed in the first movie.
It would've worked if they just had Rey thump him in his wound or something towards the end of the fight. The Earthquake ex Machina was pretty retarded, though.
>JJ seems to have primarily payed attention to things like composition and camera movement, which is good but not enough to story/character presentation and pacing. To be fair to him though, I know he didn't edit or write the film. He's literally just the director
Abrams got final cut. He suffers from the same problem as Nolan in that they both think they can make a movie by themselves. He's also credited as a writer. They need to stick to direction and let other folk get in some creative input.
I'll also just add that the best part of the movie was the TIE-Fighter escape, and the worst was the sequence with the big tentacle aliens just after meeting Han and Chewbacca.
I personally gave it 7/10. It's worse than the OT and better than the prequels - and only an idiot would've expected anything different.
>>63778173
too much rehashing is kind of a bummer, but people are overreacting. like you, my biggest issue is with the fact that it barely works as a standalone movie. It shoe horned in a few awkward convos to get in back story, then it ended with no resolution, other than the newest iteration of a death star (which had no tension and really wasn't even important outside of being a location)
> FN seems to be playing a completely unnecessary love interest.
top cuck
>>63778275
Despite all of that I still think it's much better than the prequels. It's competently directed, and the characters were good for the most part.
>>63778427
The prequels requires lots of fixing up and editing to make them better.
This one, i can only think of a few camera shots that felt like they could have been held longer on the subject etc otherwise the acting was all top notch.
There was one scene when Rey is smirking at Finn when she ia talking to him not long after they first meet and I feel this should have been an outtake and that scene reshot because she begins out as a loner who first coming across the droid is bitter yet opens up way too fast to others. My opinion.
I don't like the scene where Poe Dameron fucks a baby. I get that JJ wants to disassociate himself with Lucas as much as possible, but having Oscar Isaac penetrate an infant was a bit much. In a series that gave us such classic lines as "Never tell me the odds" and "I am your father", Isaac's "I love the feeling of Youngling on my dick." just doesn't really hold up.
>>63778171
this. It's such disney bullshit to just b like "these r the bad guys hurr durr" and "these r the guud guys luv them"
nigga gotta b bad for a REASON jah feel?
>>63778544
They're fascist mass murderers.
>>63769625
>it has flaws, but that's okay
stop tolerating crappy movies, idiot.
>>63778570
people aren't just "fascist mass murderers"
especially people like kylo ren who are literally raised by fucking luke skywalker
u dont just up 1 day and think hm maybe ima kill all my jedi classmates cuz im a fascist
>>63778620
Nux at least had that speech alluding to a belief that autocracy brings more stability than republicanism before he blew up Not-Coruscant.
>>63775570
Damn son. You are retarded and didn't include the context of then
>>63777117
Are you fucking serious? Why do you think the new star wars had so much shit from the originals in it? Because people like you who are now defending the prequels trashed them for so long. They didn't do as much new shit because of the poor reception of the prequels that fans hated. You just want to be contrarian. The movie was good. End of story.
>>63771486
> not a die hard fan
Sums it all about the general opinion. Must feel good to be free of all the background created over the years. Main reason why i absolutely hated the movie. Everything in it is made for kids and laymen.
>>63775026
They've been around since the 70s. It makes sense when Like says force sensitivity has a genetic basis in Jedi.
Thanks for this review.
