Quick reminder that The Empire Strikes Back - the best movie in the franchise - was written by Lawrence Kasdan and Leigh Brackett and directed by Irvin Kershner, while George Lucas was running around being a businessman and building his company.
Lucas' original ideas and the execution of the first Star Wars were a stroke of genius (and admittedly the result of good editing), but apart from that he also provided us with such beloved memories as:
- Jabba the Binks
- the Star Wars Holiday Special
- Boba Fett being killed by accident
- Greedo shooting first
- a trilogy of kids' movies with parliamentary debates about no-confidence votes and trade agreements
- really dense frames with so much going on (i.e. sensory overload)
- Hayden Christensen force ghost
- Hayden Christensen
- "NNNOOOOOOOOOOO"
And now Disney is ruining his vision by making a movie that is NOT a revolutionary master piece!
>snokekillsluke.jpg
snoke is a pretend emperor
Get your facts straight.
Leigh Brackett's draft wasn't even used. Unfortunately, she died of cancer before the Empire's shoot. Lucas was nice enough to credit her for her efforts and gave her credit for her contributions.
Irvin Kershner? The guy that directed Robocop 2 and Never Say Never again? Oh yeah, he's the one who is solely responsible for Empire's greatness. Kasdan? If he is so brilliant, than why is Force Awakens just a rehash of Star Wars 1977?
Empire Strikes Back worked because it was a collaborative effort. This whole "Lucas isn't responsible for anything good" meme is utter bullshit. You're also forgetting about the contributions of Gary Kurtz who was instrumental in the success of Star Wars and Empire Strikes Back.
>>64190506
Did they borrow from Brackett's outline?
Kurtz had some interesting movies after Star Wars.
>>64190019
TESB.4.
October 24, 1978.
The Empire Strikes Back.
Fourth Draft by Lawrence Kasdan. Shooting Script.
Source: Bouzereau: p. 123.
A Lawrence Kasdan quote from Starlog # 51 (October 1981): “[When he accepted the Empire assignment, Kasdan was handed a second draft script to work from that George Lucas had written.] George’s draft was something that he wrote very quickly, when Leigh passed away. George had the story very well outlined […]”
>George had the story very well outlined
>>64190506
I just disregard them as RedditLetterMedia babbies.
There is a lot of Lucas dialogue in ESB, but it's suddenly infused with a real trans-Atlantic pep!
Was George influenced by film noir for ESB?
>>64190019
>Quick reminder that The Empire Strikes Back - the best movie in the franchise
stopped reading right there
>>64190506
>>64190583
This.
Fuck OP and fuck people like OP that want to sully Lucas' rep all of the sudden. George Lucas isn't perfect, but the dude was a great visionary and had brilliance. He also surrounded himself with equally talented artists, producers and writers, building Lucasfilm and ILM independtly from the ground.
One of the reasons the prequels aren't as good as they could have been is because Lucas did the writing and directing himself. Such an undertaking is quite ambitious and overwhelming, and that's just for ONE movie. Lucas made three and spent a decade creating them. He wanted other directors to come in on the prequels and direct them with their own spin (like Spielberg), but there was bad blood between Lucas and Hollywood (all the guilds hate Lucas) so it was risky for any director to partner up with him at the time.
There's really no need to shit on Lucas' legacy.
He's not perfect but he's definitely one of the greats. Don't let Generation X feed you their bullshit when they themselves have never accomplished anything worthwhile.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_HEiGiCUMw
>>64190734
So what is the best one?
>>64190841
Calm down George.
>>64190841
This. Prequel hatred does not need need to equate to hatred for Lucas. He should still be held in esteem for creating the OT.
>>64190734
nice bait
>>64190882
>He should still be held in esteem for creating the OT.
And for creating the Special Edition. And the Special DVD Edition. And the super special Blu-Ray edition.
Because every version was the ultimate Star Wars experience and the fulfillment of Lucas' vision.
>>64191122
Nope. The SEs are gigantic errors that ruined the Original Trilogy. That is valid criticism. The longer Disney waits to restore the original versions, he more we'll see the franchise degrade over time.
This basically cemented Brackett's legacy. I haven't caught her sci-fi stories however.
http://youtu.be/JR5H1KNpdcc
>>64190872
No, I won't. What do people want from me? In the 80s, I said I was done with Star Wars. Audiences and fans seemed to want more though so I decided it might be fun to revisit the universe.
I decided to make the prequels and take Star Wars in a different direction. I tried to get my buddies involved because I felt it would be refreshing to see other people's take on this beloved franchise, but none of my friends agreed and encouraged me to get back in the directors chair.
I made the movies I wanted to make and am not ashamed of them. The thing I don't understand is that people seemed to love the Phantom Menace, Attack of the Clones and Revenge of the Sith (Sith especially) when they first came out. Now people hate them.
I can take criticism, but people actually seem to hate me. When I visited Celebration V in Orlando Florida, Star Wars fans lambasted, booed and spit on me. People claim that I've ruined their lives by my movies, but all I was trying to do was give the people what they wanted. New and exciting Star Wars movies.
Then I decided to stop. I let my Lucasfilm people make pretty great cartoons and animated features. That seemed to please people and give younger audiences a new Star Wars mythos to enjoy. Then Hollywood approached me and suggested that more Star Wars films would be a good thing. For some reason they kept referring to me as "goy". I respectfully refused. I had no interest in revisiting Star Wars when everyone hated me. My friends in the industry kept telling me I should sell my legacy to Disney, that way it would live on. I reluctantly agreed.
Now it seems that's still not good enough. People still hate me and think I'm an awful, talentless hack. I regret handing it over to Disney, but thankfully it's worth it and a necessary evil since the 4 billion dollars is going to various charities.
I enjoyed my time working on Star Wars and I hope some people enjoyed what I created. I'm sorry for those for whom I disappointed.
>>64191388
I'm sorry George, for everything.
>>64191388
That's way too reasonable for him.
>>64191388
>refering to me as goy
Lost
>>64191388
Lucas posting on 4chan confirmed.
>>64190019
>a trilogy of kids' movies with parliamentary debates about no-confidence votes and trade agreements
R E D D I T
E
D
D
I
T
>>64190848
>>64190980
A New Hope
>>64191388
Come back, George. Save us from Disney. You're our only hope
>>64190841
>all the guilds hate Lucas
why?
>>64190019
>- a trilogy of kids' movies with parliamentary debates about no-confidence votes and trade agreements
I guess im in the minority of people that liked that...
>>64192328
yes you are. Stop meming about in every single thread.
>>64192428
even as a kid I liked it, that sort of world building, maybey I was too much of a nerd.
>>64191388
Star Wars fans truly are the worst people. Godspeed, George.
>>64192459
>world building
ok i get it youre autistic please just let us have movies about characters now
>>64192328
>>64192428
I thought it was pretty good too. I just find it surprising so many manchildren hate anything deeper than a simple good vs evil story.
>>64191388
Thank you George
>>64192328
The politics of TPM were central to the Queen's mission to save her planet, right? She's got to reach the Chancellor, and she needs Anakin to win a podrace in order to contact him. The plot just gets buried amid the noise of the surroundings, unfortunately. Terrence Stamp left somewhat early so they never got a scene of the Queen contacting him directly.
The point is that Palpatine used the Queen to get the previous Chancellor fired, allowing him to make a political power play.
>>64192505
>autistic
I think I might start to embrace that term
you know with the word nerd coopted by the mainstream nowadays the word autistic is starting to be used more and more toward the kind of people who would have been referred to nerds in the past.
>>64192294
Bad blood since 1977 and 1978. The Academy hates him. Things like no conventional opening title credits bothered them too.
>>64192872
>Bad blood since 1977 and 1978.
from what?
>>64192505
>plot is autistic
JJ could write characters with his eyes closed, he just needs a strongly structured plot in place.
I remember that ESB has a great performance by Carrie Fisher, which is incredibly vulnerable and neurotic, but entirely sexual. She probably does give the best character-based performance of the movie, but even her character isn't very essential to the plot of the movie, and most people might forget her role within it.
>>64192872
They hate him so much, they gave him 7 awards for ANH.
>>64193132
>JJ could write characters with his eyes closed,
then why didn't he?cause I certainly did not care for any of the characters in TFA.
>>64193179
Because he repeated it for Empire, which they despised. Look it up.
He talks trash on them as well. He just did it recently saying that the Oscars are nothing but politics.
>>64192505
>i want characters in a movie that has no reason for those characters
extroverts need to go and stay go
>>64193016
>>64193179
"To preserve the dramatic opening of the Star Wars movies, George Lucas insisted on moving all the credits to the end of the film. However, although the Writers' Guild and Directors' Guild had begrudgingly allowed this on Star Wars: Episode IV - A New Hope(1977) (because that film wasn't expected to be very successful), they resented the trend being continued on this film. First they tried to pull Empire from release, but were unsuccessful. They then fined Lucas heavily, and tried to fine Irvin Kershner, but Lucas paid all the fines himself (nearly $250,000). Lucas then bitterly dropped his membership in the Writers' Guild, Directors' Guild, and the Motion Picture Association of America, a move that has hindered his hiring choices on later films (see also Star Wars: Episode VI - Return of the Jedi (1983) and Star Wars: Episode III - Revenge of the Sith (2005))."
>>64190506
>hey no need to shit on George's work, let's just shit on anybody's else work, who was involved in Empire
Yeah Kasdan had all the brilliant ideas, look at this idea for Raiders, nothing short of poetry
>>64190841
>>64191388
Someone screencap this guy posing as George. Your dedication to him is remarkable, and I hope you get to suck on George's fat dick someday. Godspeed.
>>64193330
That anon said collaborative effort though. It wasn't all Lucas, just like it wasn't all Kasdan or Kershner.
>>64191388
It's alright George, I don't blame you for anything
>>64193347
I don't have a problem with the idea, it's a small silly thing, could be funny. Nothing wrong with throwing that out there.
What I don't like about that excerpt and the whole conversation is Spielberg and Kasdan's weird assertiveness about their spitballing. "At some point he MUST", "there HAS to be that moment", and this is for ideas off the top of their heads, snap responses to something they just heard. Meanwhile Lucas, who obviously has the best understanding of the pitch, keeps being demure and diplomatic with their suggestions while presenting a seriously compelling story and trying to keep it from going off into screwball territory.
>>64193974
>we'll have to work that part out
I can just picture Lucas rolling his eyes
>>64192017
A New Hope has some of the most absurd writing in the entire trilogy. It's fine if it's your personal favorite but it's not the best.
>Leia gets pursued by her dad
>neither of them know he's her dad
>she sends droids in an escape pod with a message for Obi-Wan
>droids conveniently land on tattooine, the home planet of Leia's brother (which is also unknown to them)
>"hello sand man. We'd like this cool looking R5D4 unit please."
>"uh, never mind. It's conveniently broken. Guess we'll take this R2 unit instead"
>Leia's brother is friends with a crazy old coot named Ben.
>coincidentally, old coot is Obi-Wan.
>coincidentally, Obi-Wan trained Luke and Leia's dad.
>how small is this fucking galaxy? And how inept is the Empire?
When you really look at the plot, it feels like it was written by a 12 year old latch key kid who is being raised by a single father.
Don't get me wrong, I love A New Hope and the rest of the OT but I can recognize it for what it is. Which is a flawed, cheesy, ridiculous 70s Sci Fi saga.
And the only problem I have with TFA is that they're keeping the ridiculous trend of parental revelation. It's a galaxy! Not the rural south! All the characters don't need to be related!
>>64194608
>ridiculous trend of parental revelation. It's a galaxy! Not the rural south! All the characters don't need to be related!
Yeah, that's a real issue with the new series. Is a parental revelation going to have any impact at this point?
>>64194918
No. TFA just set all of us up to question Rey's parentage. It's like they're forcing hype by making us speculate on who Rey's parents are. And once we find out, it's going to be more of a "SEE, I told you!" or a "I knew it" reaction. Game of Thrones has fallen into a similar rut of the plot being driven by twists and reveals rather than actual story.
