From what I've heard on /trv/, most ESL teachers return after a year or two as the pay is not that good. Based on this article the pay seems pretty good though: http://www.besudesuabroad.com/2014/06/teaching-english-in-hong-kong/
Bumping for interest
>>1060950
Your cited article is mostly bullshit, a best-case scenario with at least one significant omission. You'll notice that she claims utilities cost nothing (bullshit), spends only US$10/day on food (bullshit, unless you plan on eating the cheapest, unhealthiest crap every day), doesn't drink or go out at all (YMMV), and doesn't pay to commute (YMMV). She also conveniently ignores income tax, which does exist in Hong Kong. If you have a normal lifestyle and don't live like a monk (if you do, might as well stay home -- what's the point of going overseas and then spending all day at work/at home and never going out?) you'll probably be able to save maybe half of what she claims.
Can you do it forever? Sure, if you're OK with doing the same thing forever. As pointed out in so many of these threads, teaching English generally offers little hope for advancement (yes, there are exceptions -- rare exceptions). If you're OK with doing the same exact thing for 40 years and earning the same mediocre salary for it, help yourself. It's a fine career for people with no ambition beyond drinking or picking up local girls -- but as the years go by you'll be doing more of the former and much, much less of the latter.
Yes, you can, but if you want to make a career of it, you have to approach it with a professional mindset, as you would if you were a teacher at home. The rewards and possibilities in some ways can be greater internationally though.
So what I mean is - yes, first, jump in, get what experience you can get, even if everything about your first postings aren't great. But consider professional advancement - maybe get a proper high-level teaching (and not just TESL/TEFL) qualification in your own country later on - and when you're more experienced be discriminating about the sort of places you consider working at. ie go for good quality, respected schools (maybe but not necessarily international schools), rather than some of the more questionable fly-by-night establishments you might have to work in at first.
Short version; I've several friends who've taught English abroad, in various countries, for at least 15 years, and they've done well, - the key things to watch for, after you've done your initial bit of experience and taken some necessary shit - are the quality of employer, and also your legal status in the country you are in. (this is a euphemism, mostly, for avoiding Arab dictatorship hellholes and African beds of corruption)
>>1060950
Of course it is possible, so much so that there is even lingo within the TEFL world that deals with this. A "lifer."
>From what I've heard on /trv/, most ESL teachers return after a year or two as the pay is not that good
It's nothing to raise a family on but you can absolutely live comfortably by yourself on it. I would say most people return from doing TEFL not mainly because of the pay (although that is a factor) but because most people accept it for what it is, something to do a couple years or so in order to live abroad and make some money easily.
>You'll notice that she claims utilities cost nothing (bullshit)
How do you know? I used to teach English through the GEPIK program in Korea. In addition to a free apartment, my water bill was also free (I had to pay electricity) I'm not familiar with Hong Kong, but that could be the truth. She might have them comped. An income tax exists in Korea too naturally, but generally foreigners doing ESL jobs (at least through the govt) were exempt.
She might be lying as I do not have direct experience in Hong Kong, but drawing parallels, I am telling you in Korea I did not pay income taxes, got a pension payment refund at the end of my contract and didn't pay my water bill either.
When it was all said and done, I ended up saving about $10,000USD during my year in Korea. I paid off the rest of my student loans and still had some left over. I was not a hermit, but I wasn't a party every weekend person either. Basically go out every other weekend kind of thing.
I am in Japan now and I "teach" arts and crafts to kids at an international school and make about $25 an hour doing this. Granted it is just part time, but I supplement with private lessons and do pretty well. I will not do ESL for ever, and will probably return to the US at the end of my visa, but there are opportunities to do decently well and be comfortable with ESL. It's a pretty easy way to get paid to travel and live abroad. Really not so bad.
>>1061011
Listen to the second guy, with the exception if his Arab dictatorship hell hole. For whatever reason people who have never lived or worked in the Middle East like to shit on it, but people who actually have always love/recommend it. Saudi Arabia, and to a lesser extent Kuwait, being exceptions. Qatar, UAE, abs Bahrain are excellent places to teach with on average better students than you'll find in the USA or SEA mill and the lifestyle and pay is actually pretty great.
Ignore that first dude that says it rare TO BE ABLE to make it a career, it's only RARE that people WANT to make it a career because they have no real interest in teaching. Just living abroad for a few years. Most international schools want 2 years experience, degree, and a teaching cert. ESL is an easy way to get that experience and then go into a well paying regular teaching job. I reckon you can say ESL has no advancement, as you'd be teaching a different subject, but teaching abroad, which ESL is, definitely does. Here is another thread with answers: >>1059979
>>1061025
>it's only RARE that people WANT to make it a career because they have no real interest in teaching
So is this why most ESL teachers return to their homelands after a couple of years of teaching in another country? The only reason why they are teaching is because it allows them to work overseas for a period of time?
>>1060950
>From what I've heard on /trv/, most ESL teachers return after a year or two as the pay is not that good.
>>1061056
I'd say yes
I think most people return after a couple of years because they were using TEFL as a tool to live in a foreign country. It was never about the money in the first place.
I TEFL'd In Thailand for a year for the experience. I was never really interested in being a teacher. I could have got paid much more in Korea, but I liked Thailand better so I stayed there.
>>1060950
I Think most ESL teachers return after a year or two not because the pay is not good (which, generally, it is not, at least by international career standards, although the number of richer countries including Korea in the Middle East may offer comfortable packages of things like free housing and/or plane tickets) but because they realize they don't truly want to be teachers. For a significant majority of the sorts of people who post in these threads, teaching is a relatively accessible way for a person in his early 20s with no specific qualifications to spend a year or two in another country.
I taught in Thailand for 2.5 years right out of college. I had a great experience, but I knew almost immediately that I did not want to be an English teacher for a living. Was lucky enough to get a different job midway through my third year, and have not taught since.
But when I was teaching, I crossed paths with a number of much older people--30s, 40s, retiree-age--who were teaching as a career ( actually, in the case of the oldest people I met, it was really more of a vocation--they were elderly Mormon missionaries who taught at a university for free in exchange for being allowed to proselytize to the staff [students were off-limits, thank God]).
Only one of these people was working the same type of low-end, just out of school, no special training job that an early twentysomething might wind up with, and he was a seriously creepy guy. The others are all professional teachers. They have a sincere interest in their work, and have master's degrees or better in their subjects. So they can work in places like universities, and can achieve something resembling a real career. But most people figure out they want to do something else. So they do.
>>1061096
Apologies for the AutoCorrect typos above. Always embarrassing to talk about having been an English teacher while making what look like grammatical errors.
> *a number of richer countries including Korea and the Middle East.
>>1061098
I work for international development NGOs, in several different capacities. In practice, all of the day-to-day work mostly consists of very technical writing for international bureaucrats, along with designing surveys, managing teams to deploy the surveys, and interpreting and writing up the results.
I don't live in Thailand full-time anymore, but I go back a lot. Until recently I was based out of an office in Bangkok for about half the year, but I was traveling much of the time. I'm now a consultant instead of an in-house person, so most of my work is conducted remotely.
>>1061202
Nice. Hopefully I can find a similar gig when the time comes?
>>1061085
What about not getting used to the local culture?
>>1061217
They're around, for sure. Get the right MA or MSc and be willing to spend a couple (or more) menial/underpaid years as an intern or fellow, and my exciting life could be yours.
>In all seriousness, I love my work, but it is neither glamorous or lucrative.
>>1061228
My BS will be in Operations and Supply Chain Management. What do you suggest for a MBA? Global Supply Chain Management, Marketing, Sustainable Enterprise, Entrepreneurship, or Management Consulting?
>>1061226
I guess that's possible for some people, but in general I think most only ever intend to be a teacher for a year or two.
When I was in Thailand most people were doing it as a sort of working holiday before starting their real career back home.
I only intended to be out there for a year or two, that was before I even bought the plane ticket.
>>1060950
yeah
