Hey, /trv/, I'm wondering if anyone here has any experience or at least insights about teaching English in the Middle East? I've done the ESL thing in Korea and Japan, and I'm interested in trying it out there. I have a Bachelor's (of course) and combined 3 years of experience. Do you think it would be possible for me to get a job? At first glance it appears that most of the jobs seem to require a Master's and/or State License. Are there jobs out there for people with just a BA and experience? I have a small suspicion that the surfeit of qualifications may be a tactic to scare people off and keep the number of applications down? True or am I delusional? How about getting a TEFL cert? I have a dinky online one that the Korean ministry of Ed made me get for my job there. But I doubt that would carry much weight?
Any insights or leads are appreciated, thanks!
Feel free to ask about ESL in general. I can shed some light on Korea and Japan, at least.
Which country did you prefer? Japan or Korea?
ESL isn't as big a thing in the Middle East as just straight out teaching. Most of the people in the Gulf States speak English anyway. There is a greater demand for teachers that speak English, rather than teachers to teach English.
>>1049686
Japan for sure, although I liked Korea.
>>1049689
Sure, I can see that. Are you sure most of the NATIVE population can speak English in the Gulf States? In most cases, a majority of the population in the Gulf States are expatriates, but what about the natives? But yeah, do you think it would be possible for me to get a job at like an international school or something, not as an ESL teacher necessarily, with no master's or state cert?
>>1049695
Not a teacher myself, but have lived and visited in Kuwait, KSA, Qatar, UAE, and Bahrain and know teachers there and it's on my potential job lists when I am out of the military. The natives in Bahrain, UAE, and Kuwait all can pretty much speak English, to a lesser extent in KSA and Qatar. Lesser extend means I occasionally come across natives who can't speak English, and have never come across a native of the former three that couldn't. Because of the expats English is basically the lingua franca. Masters is not typially required, but a teaching license is. Here is a ESL job in Kuwait, but it sees in addition to ESL cert your degree has to be in English. You could still apply, I guess. https://internationalteachersplus.com/jobs/male-esl-teachers/
>>1049698
Thanks for the info. My degree is not in English. Oh well, there might be something out there. Or I could get a state license. Idk how long it would take since I already have a bachelors. Maybe 1 or 2 years tops. I think most places would just have me earn a master's degree in education perhaps.
>>1049667
How long in Korea/Japan did you teach english? Why not stay longer?
>>1049882
A year in Korea. Sweet gig but I was in the public school system and funding was cut massively. I lost my job. Japan I am actually still in. Just looking to make the move to the middle east for the money honestly. I would rather live in Japan than the Gulf.
Anyway, bumping. Please help if you can.
>>1049955
Would've helped but can't. All I know is the students are assholes in the middle east. Because they're all loaded and have no interest in learning English.
>>1049997
Nothing I can't handle or at least deal with. Given the salaries over there.
Anyone here doing ESL as a career? I'm teaching in Japan now, and realized that my resume is now mostly ESL-focused. I figure I may as well run with it, get an MTESOL, and get some of that sweet Arab oil money. Thoughts?
>>1049667
Alright, I'm in . . .
1. Yep, just started at an international school in Egypt. I started at the end of August.
1.a. I have six years ESL experience in Korea, three degrees (none of them related to teaching), and some university tutoring experience. Waaaaaay more than enough to get a job that pays more than my highest paycheque in Korea.
2. Yes, but it would be difficult now. Then again, maybe not: Term One ends in five weeks, and there's a chance schools might be looking for new teachers.
3. Yes. But expect it to be much easier than working in a hagwon (I do about fifteen hours face-to-face a week, if that) and much more full (the extra stuff you have to do at a normal school job).
4. No, wrong.
5. Not delusional, you just don't know. You can't know something unless you learn it. :)
6. That would be useless here, as it's not ESL teaching.
7. Absolutely no weight at all.
They want people who can TEACH, plain and simple. If you've got what it takes and you're not a backpacking ESL teacher looking for an easy ride to fund your holiday, you'll be fine.
Cairo is OK. I prefer it to Korea, but it's bizarre how similar and yet how different Egyptians and Koreans are.
Don't get a job in Saudi Arabia. I repeat: DO NOT GET A JOB IN SAUDI ARABIA.
As far as I'm concerned, Egypt is the Korea of the Middle East in terms of teaching jobs. That said, the quality of expat teacher here is much higher than in Korea.
>>1049955
If it's top-dollar jobs you're after, you'll need AT LEAST a teaching degree, if not Masters . . .
. . . and to live in Saudi Arabia.
As far as money is concerned and cost of living, I can't think of anywhere that beats Korea, still, after all these years. My pay is more here, but I don't tend to have as much fun as I did in Korea.
Or maybe I'm just older. :)
>>1050087
Thanks for the insights. If you know of any potential leads in Egypt feel free to let me know.
Where does one obtain a fake degree to work in the more shady and lenient countries that don't conduct thorough background checks to see if you've finished university?
>>1050128
You'd be found out in a second, be on a shocking wage to begin with, and ultimately let go.
Do you have any idea how many of you people there are trying to do this?
>>1050092
Sorry, man, I haven't made any real contacts yet.
My advice is to do a Googs for international schools in Cairo and send them a cover letter and resume. A photo doesn't hurt, but it's not as appearance-based as Korea.
In fact, not even close.
Oh, not sure of your sex, but don't come here as a white woman.
Not sure how to sugar-coat that.
>everyone talking about how there are no esl jobs in the middle east
>that everyone already speaks english
How do you think they learned the language? Middle East has such a wealth of ESL opportunities because these are the shallowest human beings on earth who don't want a native teaching english, but a foreigner because, guess what, they can afford to and a foreigner is more prestigious than a native.
>>1050241
Oh, so where do you live?
>>1050244
Like I said, brother, I'm new here.
Ignore the idiot above me.
>>1050241
The point is ESL, in it's traditional sense, is not as prevalent as actual real legit teaching jobs, whereas as ESL jobs are the only teaching jobs available for non-natives there. There are more listings for an English teacher, like teaching the subject of English, than teaching English as a language in of itself. Many times the role of the former will include the latter. Plus there are actually a lot of long term expats. Despite higher turnover in countries like KSA and Kuwait due to incompatible lifestyle. As these two are the most restrictive, especially, KSA.
>>1050246
This
>>1050241
>the shallowest human beings on earth who don't want a native teaching english, but a foreigner because, guess what, they can afford to and a foreigner is more prestigious than a native.
This thinking is why almost ALL OF THE TEACHERS period are not natives. So ESL is not a huge opportunity in of itself as teaching in general.
>>1050243
I lived in SA, but left after two years because I was miserable.
>>1050246
While agree that ESL positions are less prevalent than some Asian countries, but the number of positions far exceed those in European regions with significantly less English proficiency.
I will also admit that I taught International Trade during my stay in addition to my ESL classes, but the ad I replied to was aimed at ESL teachers, not business teachers.
Another note UK/Aus teaching credentials are the most marketable for the international schools in the Middle East. Most follow UK/AUS curriculum. Which may be why it seems a lot of educated Arabs have a British tinge to their accent when they speak English.
>>1050250
Truth.
We all use Cambridge curriculum.
>>1050249
>but the number of positions far exceed those in European regions with significantly less English proficiency.
It's rare, if ever you see anyone on this board seeking ESL employment in Europe. My comparison, though not explicit, was to Asia, since that's the background the OP has.
>>1050251
Czech Republic, Georgia; fuck, mot of Ukraine and Russia.
And it pays fair money for the cost of living.
>>1050254
And when I first spoke of the lack of ESL jobs, it was to the point you have far more options applying for teaching jobs, in general, not just ESL jobs.
>>1050256
Yep. Which you can get with ESL experience.
Exhibit A: Me.
>>1050258
I wasn't disputing that. No one has. I was disputing >>1050241
Or rather clarifying the point you missed that people were saying don't restrict yourself to just applying for ESL jobs.
We are literally arguing over nothing. Everything past that post we agreed with each other on. Let's move on from this back and forth. I'm sure the OP would love your insight. Minds is all secondary from being around teachers.
Why do you even want to teach in the Middle East? I've heard things aren't too hot there right now.
>>1050265
The salaries can be quite good, and untaxed.
>>1050263
My deepest apologies. Sorry If I were a dick.
>>1050266
Yeah, but that's nothing to lose your head over.
>>1050269
I go for lifestyle over anything.
Usually.
I have a different circumstance; but, for the most part, I'm happy in Egypt for now.
>>1050269
From what I gather, life in the Gulf States is less than thrilling, but comfortable and safe. I can deal with that for a year or so for good money. Is anyone here willing to share how much they're making specifically?
>>1050274
>>1050272
As I said, I can't speak to actual teaching, but the actual lifestyle of living in most of MENA you'd find yourself as a Western Ex-Pat is frigging Amazing. On the expensive side, if you live life to the fullest, but you're well compensated, don't pay or get reimbursed for housing in most instances, so at worst you break even, but have a lot stories.
>>1050274
No.
More than I made in Korea, but the cost of living is high.
And I was headhunted in Korea and had a decent wage.
>>1050291
Are you not being provided a free apartment?
>>1049667
The orange building looks like a condom I used once.
>>1049667
If you applied to a school in Kuwait with only a Bachelor, you'd probably get hired. Staffing situation this year is atrocious. The thing is, the kids would probably eat you alive. Everyone pussies out because behavior management is kind of hard. Teach in England, mother fuckers. Then you'll see what the real world is like.
I read a blog on someone doing teaching in the middle east who saved $300k in 5 years time(they had private tutors too) anyone know of any good teaching blogs out there?
Personally I'm 23 working in Korea making 2.4mil won. I've been here 9 months but I doubt I'll renew.
I have a dream of working my ass off making bank in savings than going on lavish and long vacations around the globe when i feel like it.
>>1050388
OP here. Ill look into it. It cannot be that bad. No way they're worse than American kids. My kids in Korea were snot noses too. They liked me and I liked them, but they were still disrespectful snot noses. Had shout sometimes but never lost my cool or had a breakdown or anything. Not To sound over confident but I really doubt some punk-ass Kuwaiti kids would "eat me alive" unless they're like the inner city kids in that movie Dangerous Minds or something they aint shit.
>>1050299
I get a housing allowance, so it's basically free.
I actually score an extra LE100 a month because my rent is under my housing allowance.
>>1050402
You get a teaching assistant here, which goes a long way.
Kids here aren't bad. They're just lazy as sin. It's Muslim culture. Sorry, but that's just how it is.
If you're terrible at classroom management, they're going to destroy you. Be a man, be a real teacher, and you'll be fine.
>>1050393
Best I've done was AU$15,000 in one year in Korea. But I barely did anything and was studying.
I could save more than that here, but I go to Thailand a bunch, so it's not going to happen.
They must've been teaching at a university in Saudi Arabia. And you know what I've said before about Saudi Arabia . . .
>>1050627
>I could save more than that here, but I go to Thailand a bunch, so it's not going to happen.
One of the best kept secrets of working in the Middle East. The cheap ass flights to elsewhere. Thailand being the most popular destination for the Muzzies, outside of the regional ones of UAE and Bahrain.
>>1050641
I have a friend who works in Bahrain as a cook for KBR and he's in Thailand every few months but has come back to the States once in the few years he's been over there. And that was recently
>>1050291
COL is high if you live like an Arab and eat out and shop all the time. Get a waifu to cook for you. Does Egypt have a bunch of Filipinas running around like GCC countries?
>>1051515
Nope. Which is a shame, because I'd love someone to come cook for me a few times a week.
>>1052644
What about Ethiopians? Egypt has those? Or a large poor Christian or secular community?
>>1052650
We have a bunch of Nigerians and Sudanese.
>>1052656
I'd take the Sudanese, but they are mostly Muslim.
