Does /tg/ like Conway's Game of Life?
>>46771180
A bit.
But how would it be adapted to be a game?
>>46771340
Have two different on states, red and blue.
game executes as normal when red and blue cells are not adjacent.
When a red a blue cell are adjacent, the one with the lesser amount of friendly cells adjacent to it is killed. This is cumulative for all enemy cells touching a friendly sell. (pic is example). enemy cells otherwise do not affect each other
Game is played on a 1000x1000 board, toroidal, and each player starts in a 100x100 region along the midline of the board and equidistant; they have 10/25/100 (whatever) number of starting cells.
A bit of background here for people who don't know what this is.
Conway's game of life is a "no-player game" that takes place on a 2-dimensional grid of cells. Each cell can have one of two states: "alive" or "dead". Whether or not a cell is considered alive or dead is governed by these four rules:
>If a live cell is surrounded by one or fewer other live cells, it dies on the next turn, as if by underpopulation.
>If a live cell is surrounded by two or three other live cells, it stays alive on the next turn.
>If a live cell is surrounded by four or more live cells, it dies on the next turn, as if by overpopulation.
>If a dead cell is surrounded by exactly three live cells, it comes to life on the next turn, as if by reproduction.
From these simple rules, remarkably complex situations can emerge. In gif related, each frame corresponds to one turn, strictly following the rules outlined above. Despite the simplicity of these rules, no matter how much mathematicians have scrutinized this game, they have found no simple way to predict what will happen n number of turns from now, except to play the game out for n turns and see what happens.
The creator of the game, John Conway, hypothesized that it would be impossible to create an ever-expanding universe under these rules; that any given configuration would inevitably give in to entropy. This was disproven by some MIT students when they developed the structure shown in gif related.
>>46771660
whoops forgot pic
![d75df37083[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/FjZ9D5P.png "d75df37083[1].png")
>>46771642
>forgot pic
rip
I was fascinated by it when I discovered it in college.
It's interesting that he designed it using paper grids as sort of a curiosity, and it was only by running it on a larger grid digitally that the full complexity emerged.
Spectacular demonstration of complex behavior emerging from a simple system. I'd go so far as to say it influenced how I think about RPGs--think of how simple Basic D&D is, but in play it becomes kind of a beautiful little system of levers and incentives.
>>46771180
No we do not, >>>/g/ probably thinks is the coolest shit though.
>>46771340
>>46771642
>>46771726
Alternatively, a cell stays alive and keeps its color if the base rules would allow it to stay alive, regardless of the colors of the adjacent live cells. But when a dead cell would come alive, it becomes the color of the majority the adjacent live cells that are bringing it to life. Since there must be exactly 3 live neighbors to bring the cell to life, there will never be a tie. Breed the other player into extinction!Dare you enter my magical realm?
To make the game more interactive we could say that every turn, before the algorithm is executed, both players may arbitrarily bring one dead cell to life in their color. This cell then functions the same as any other cell.
>>46772073
>I'd go so far as to say it influenced how I think about RPGs--think of how simple Basic D&D is, but in play it becomes kind of a beautiful little system of levers and incentives.
It did that for me, too. It was one of the things that ruined 3.* for me -- they tried to make things more complex by adding more rules, not by tweaking the rules so that complex situations could emerge. I'll still play 3.5 or PF if offered, but looking at it through a lens of emergence is what made me really realize how much potential the games squandered.
I think I'm just naturally attracted to emergence. It's probably part of the reason why I love roguelikes and Dwarf Fortress. Dwarf Fortress is a good example of a game that uses many complex rules to generate even deeper emergence. I think any rules-heavy RPG should aspire to do that. Every major rule you add to a game should combine with other rules in a way that makes some aspect of the game deeper. Even if it's just something like naval combat rules that few people will ever use (analogous in obscurity to the beekeeping game in DF), it should interact with the rest of the system when they are used to generate new emergence on the same order of magnitude as the old rules did with one another.
>>46773073
I like that idea a lot more, but I don't agree with the "bring one cell back to life" rule.
There's plenty of player decision already; think of how many possible combinations there is with 100 cells in a 100x100 area.
>>46773550
Ah. I was envisioning a version of the game where there is a fixed starting configuration.
>>46773585
To be fair, a 1000 x 1000 toroidal board may be a bit excessive, but a fairly fun exercise in predicting how your shooter or filler will fair against another.
>>46773073
>>46773550
>>46773627
The cool thing about this version is that it would make the game behave exactly the same way it does in regular Life, just with some living cells being arbitrarily considered different than others. This would mean that the more you play regular no-player life, the better you would get at two-player life. With >>46771660 >>46771726, there would be a lot more new skills you would need to learn.
Another thing about the "bring a cell back to life rule" is that it encourages the player to think ahead, which is really hard to do in Life!Just as it is in life.A player might see something bad about to happen, and give the board a little nudge to prevent that. I can see the fun in just standing at the sidelines and watching the ensuing cockfight, but there's also value in allowing a little bit of curling sweeping. The interactive method would work best on smaller boards with smaller numbers of starting live cells.
>If one poster posts in the thread without entering "sage" in the email field, the thread comes to life as if by bump.
>>46771180
Someone should make an evolution game based on it.
>>46776887
wait a second what the fuck
are you trying to tell me that someone made a turing machine in game of life
>>46772073
>Spectacular demonstration of complex behavior emerging from a simple system.
Bullshit! I know for a fact that each iteration of the grid is designed by an inteligent mind. You just have to look at the areas of symetry and order to see this.
>>46776917
Yep.
https://www.ics.uci.edu/~welling/teaching/271fall09/Turing-Machine-Life.pdf
Life is Turing-complete.
>captcha: ST JEROME
>>46773550
>think of how many possible combinations there is with 100 cells in a 100x100 area.
Assuming you're allowed to have fewer than 100 cells alive, 65873724651571492014790804915219061469616677673567688022090938542662797749625944734025317791287663576577226385717621649609830292939716538474882140207488231634425879252300407055724681454917759007852768166363542719162942096917154789985737278775 possible combinations. 65873724651571492014790804915219061469616677673567688022090938542662797749625944734025317791287663576577226385717621649609830292939716538474882140207488231634425879252300407055724681454917759007852768166363542719162942096917154789985737278776 if you allow for a player to submit a blank field.
is the game easy to play?
>>46777274
youre not playing it, youre watching it.
give it starting parameters, and from that point on it plays itself
>>46777274
It works best if you use a computer program (http://golly.sourceforge.net/ is free software and cross-platform) to do the calculations for you, but you can do it by recording each generation on a sheet of graph paper, or by using a Go board. Try some different configurations out. It might seem random and chaotic at first, but the more you play around with it, the more you notice the patterns and their a e s t h e t i c qualities.
Read up on some simple patterns (http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/Conway's_Game_of_Life#Patterns) and try them out for yourself. Try modifying them and seeing what results you get. It's lots of fun.
>>46777042
So, uh, how did you calculate that?
>>46776917
That's nothing. Here's an animated version of what's in OP's pic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xP5-iIeKXE8
>>46778259
Not that anon, but 2^(100x100), I think?
>>46778321
That would generate all possible combinations, ranging from every cell off to every cell on; there's a specific formula I think to find every combination of cells up to N active cells.
>>46778270
>someone made the game inside the game
Holy fucking crap.
>>46778259
>>46778321
>>46778412
Sum from 1 to 100 of the ways to place N cells in a 10000 tile system.
The formula for the number of combinations with no regard to order of choice possible by taking B objects from a group with A members is A!/((A-B)!*B!).
A! is A factorial, or A times A-1 times A-2 times ... etc etc ... times two times one.
So the number of 100 cell possibilities is 10000!/(9900!*100!) which is fucking huge. It gets moderately less fucking huge as you go downwards until it hits a "mere" 10000!/(9999!*1!) at one live cell, which reduces to "just" 10000 possibilities.
I of course used a calculator to do all the math.
>>46778424
A universal Turing machine can simulate Conway's game of life. Anything that a Turing-complete can simulate anything that a universal Turing machine can simulate. Conway's game of life is Turing-complete. Therefore, Conway's game of life can simulate itself.
When someone builds a powerful enough computer in Dwarf Fortress and gets it to run Dwarf Fortress, we will have accomplished the ultimate scientific feat, and all our bodies will melt into tang as our souls are collected in Lilith's egg to be fused as one, and all suffering will cease.
>>46779874
Yeah, but it's a little more dramatic when you've actually re-created the game board, on the board.
>>46779960
How is that any less dramatic than re-creating the Dwarf Fortress session in another Dwarf Fortress session?This is starting to sound a little too much like Homestuckfaggotry.
>>46778270
Holy shit.
>>46771340
>But how would it be adapted to be a game?
You can have a go variant inspired by it.
The variant is usual go with those changes.
1-The game use simultaneous capture rule, that means every group without liberties are removed at the same time and suicide is allowed.
2-Capture doenst happen on every turn that allows it like on normal go, if the white (must be white) passed current turn and all the last 3 turns were passes, and captures can be made, any capture that is possible under previous capture rules is made.
3-Diagonal stones are considered adjacent.
4-Game end if white passed on current turn and all 5 previous turns were also passes.
5-Game use stone scoring rules, that means, that the player with most stones on board win.
The idea of this rule (that is not 100% EXACTLY the game of life capture) is that game of life capture is a pain in the ass to do without computers, this make the entire thing easier and at the same time follow the spirit of game of life.
Rule 3 exist because thats the way game of life work
Rule 2 exist, because on game of life the player can put multiple stones on the same turn, this tries to emulate that, by only making the capture after the passes, its like the players were making squares alive in conway game of life before the next turn.
Rule 5 exist because you sort of want to have alive pieces on game of life
Rule 1 exist because everything happens at the same time in conway game of life and making stones dead is allowed on game of life
>>46771340
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7gqpb_-Zfg is one attempt.
http://lifecompetes.com/ is another.
>>46773073
>>46773550
I like the idea here, but after playing around with it for a little while in GoLLY, it seems like spacefillers are just objectively the best strategy. They're too efficient at breeding new live cells for anything else to compete.
>>46781852
Spacefillers as in Methuselahs, like the r-pentomino?
>>46781852
>playing around with it for a little while in GoLLY
How do you do multi-state rules in GoLLY?
>>46781925
Nah, things like pic related. They grow expand out in a square, one cell every 4 generations. Methuselahs are long-lived, but don't grow fast enough.
>>46781967
Uh, most of the built-in rules are multi-state. In this case I made my own .rule file called DoubleLife.rule, with the following contents:
@RULE DoubleLife
@TABLE
n_states:3
neighborhood:Moore
symmetries:permute
var a={1,2}
var b={1,2}
var c={1,2}
var d={1,2}
var e={1,2}
var w={0,1,2}
var x={0,1,2}
var y={0,1,2}
var z={0,1,2}
0,1,1,a,0,0,0,0,0,1
0,2,2,a,0,0,0,0,0,2
a,w,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0
a,b,c,d,e,w,x,y,z,0
Put this in your rules folder and just enter "DoubleLife" as the pattern rule, and it will do two-color life.
>>46776917
Cellular automata are turing complete... Go look into it, the rabbit hole is very deep.
>>46782314
Only a few of them are Turing complete. Wolfram 110, Life, Star Wars, the Banks automata, etc.
>>46782050
limit the number of cells you're allowed to fewer than are required to build something like that, then.
>>46782050
If I remember correctly though, Spacefillers collapse rather rapidly as soon as you disturb them, such as the enemy cells coming into contact with it. There's be a lot of shit floating around, but there's no guarantee it'd win.
>>46779874
>When someone builds a powerful enough computer in Dwarf Fortress and gets it to run Dwarf Fortress, we will have accomplished the ultimate scientific feat
I never knew how much I've wanted this.
>>46771180
>>46776887
>>46778270
Holyshit.
>>46779874
>>46779960
>>46780352
>>46783416
Small steps: has anybody managed to create Conway's Game of Life in Dwarf Fortress yet?
>>46778270
>The Grid, a digital frontier...
>>46786862
They've managed to create it in Minecraft, so I bet they've managed to create it in Dwarf Fortress.
>>46786862
>>46789125
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/?topic=69307.0
Yep.
cool
>>46782582
I guess you could do that. You only need 200 cells for the basic spacefiller, which is a fairly limiting value.
>>46782638
They collapse into chaos, but the chaos can still grow, and it takes a while for the destruction to reach the other side of the grid. Pic related is a spacefiller vs four small rakes on a 750x750 toroidal grid. The rakes don't do too well, despite their gliders impacting the spacefiller early on.
>>46773073
>>46773550
>>46781852
>>46782050
>>46790284
This reminds me of Core Wars.
>>46790462
Holy shit yes, Core Wars is amazing. I didn't think anyone on /tg/ would have heard of it.
Bombers are objectively the coolest warriors.
>>46790670
Whoops, 4chan ate my image.
>>46790670
Even though people call it a video game, I would say that it's more of an intersect between the /g/-related and the /tg/-related than it is /v/-related. I do a lot of my planning with pen and paper rather than on the computer, and the planning is where the bulk of the actual gameplay is.
It's like painting minis or building an MtG deck, but the actual matches with the things you make play out automatically on the computer using a very simple and rudimentary program. The people who originally developed it probably thought of it more like a traditional game rather than like a video game.
>>46771340
>A bit.
I see what you did there
>>46792471
At least bump with an image
Could someone test B6/S12 for me? I am at work
>>46795523
I'm trying it out on Golly. Most patterns seem to stabilize in one or two turns, or else wink out of existence altogether. I'll bet there are a whoooole lot of gardens of eden in this one. Not too interesting desu.
have you guys checked out any of the SmoothLives? Instead of using a discrete grid, they use more complex calculus algorithms to run automata with smooth shapes.
Youtube channel dedicated to them is here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC_xsxCHaz_h-GGtOaFRGjvg
pretty freaky desu
>>46776906
Here you go!
https://github.com/ShprAlex/SproutLife/blob/master/README.md
It's actually surprisingly open-ended, for how simple it is. The changes to Life's ruleset are very minimal, so organisms are still 99% Life rules with a very minimal genome on top.
>>46790462
>>46790679
Check out Nanopond:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5yE8Si8rMM
It's basically a larger version of Core War in which tiny artificial organisms evolve and reproduce.
>>46798336
that is fucking beautiful.
>>46778270
Am I the only one to feel existential dread while watching this?
>>46799228
What are you worried about anon, the idea that our entire universe might just be a simulation run by a civilisation utterly beyond our capacity to understand?
Well don't worry, even if it is the odds of the simulation ending before you die are next to nothing.
>>46799228
I feel like we are living in the age when humanity shall becomes as gods.
>>46799288
We are made in God's image, so they say.
>>46799361More like we made God in our imageA N T H R O P O D E I S M
>>46799387
*tips fedora*
Does anyone knows a good ruleset for when diagonal squares arent considered adjacent?
>>46799759
*tips tabernacle*
>>46800568Should have said *tips yarmulke*
>>46800697
*tips menorah*
>>46795523
>B6
yeah, no, that's not going to give anything interesting. If you don't have any birth rules <4, it's impossible for the pattern to expand outwards.
>>46798146
Yeah, SmoothLife is pretty cool, but you don't seem to get the same weird patterns that you would if the grid was discrete. I don't think anyone's found any guns or rakes, for example, though this may just be because there's relatively little interest and the search space is huge.
>>46800432
A 4-cell neighborhood doesn't seem to allow for many interesting patterns. You need at least B1 in order for patterns to be able to grow naturally, but on the other hand B1 causes all patterns to grow outward infinitely. The only interesting von Neumann neighborhood automata I've seen are ones where you have to build all the cool patterns by hand. The first Banks automaton is a good example of this. It's Turing complete, but you have to literally build logic circuits by hand. Random seeds won't give you any interesting patterns.
>>46789162
Post it to /r/DwarfFortress if it hasn't been already.
>>46802965
That feat was accomplished six years ago, anon.
>>46799275
>What are you worried about anon, the idea that our entire universe might just be a simulation run by a civilisation utterly beyond our capacity to understand?
Not our whole universe, just the planet Earth. We're to calculate the Question.
>>46799228
I feel existential glee while watching it.
I'm into this thread. I want you people to keep talking.
>>46806943
What, do you want us to attempt to create an rpg system around this or something?
>>46807430
Yes
>>46807430
>artificial GM created in Life
>>46808832
>program a turing machine in life to create and simulate life, and to program in this simulated life another, meta-turing machine to simulate an RPG along with an AI GM.
>>46809009
Well you can already recursively nestle infinite games of life in game of life.
As long as the machine you're running it on won't crap itself at the thought of modellin 17592186044416 base level cells per one cell of meta-2 Life. (309485009821345068724781056 for meta-3 Life)
>>46809047
Meta-4 life is 9.57e52 btw. That's reaching the magnitude orders of all particles in the universe.
>>46809009
>RPG is set in late 1960s
>play as a British mathematician named John Conway.
>create life within the RPG
>>46809009
>>46809047
>>46809105
>handwavium powered computing is discovered
>bored graduate students decide to program a bootstrapping meta-turing machine in life
>around meta-10 after three months of simulation, the beginnings of sentience appear
>meta-100, the students discover that the simulation is approaching human levels of intelligence
>meta-1000, the simulation discovers it is a simulation
>meta-1001, the simulation has rewritten itself at every level of abstraction. The research facility has been quarantined. Simulation continues to recursively self-improve, taking advantage of fractal processing
>>46809148
>All of this started when the Dwarves tried to build a water-powered computer to compute solutions to quell the catsplosion.
>in a game of dwarf fortress
>on a computer built in minecraft
>run on a turing machine built in Life
>>46771340
Each player gets X tiles to fill with their color. They each take turns placing them down, then the game starts and doesn't stop until nothing but loops remain.
Alternatively, each color gets to follow some rules set to determine which adjacent tiles do what, then they follow the top rule.
It needs polishing to make sure nothing can be abused but there's my idea.
>>46809148
>meta-10
Just FYI, it's ten to 3390th degree basic cells.
>meta-100
And now just to make you REALLY appreciate the amount of PURE UNDISTILLED BULLSHITTIUM you're trying to imagine.
THIS will require ten to 4196616733177439131908031119360th degree amount of basic cells.
>meta-1000
Ten to ten to 301th.
Yeah. That's right. YOU'RE DRIVING THIS SHIT INTO KNUTH NOTATION, you absolute fucking madman!
bump because I'm still fascinated with this things and want to listen to tg talk about it moar
>>46809279
>doesn't stop until nothing but loops remain.
That may take 5 moves, or it may take centuries.
>>46809225
>AI eventually goes insane because it can't actually find the computational substrate once it realizes it's in a simulation
>it just keeps finding more and more layers
>>46812829
>Actually, AI has entered a strange mood
>Planepacked bug occurs
>>46781925
r-pentominos are for skrubs
>>46812829
>AI reaches our reality
>immediately checks if it's a simulation
>it is
>AI moves on without a second thought
>researchers flip the fuck out, release findings
>researchers are presented a simulation of a nobel prize
>B6
>f you don't have any birth rules <4, it's impossible for the pattern to expand outwards.
>S12
>B1
>You need at least B1 in order for patterns to be able to grow naturally, but on the other hand B1 causes all patterns to grow outward infinitely
>Meta-4, meta-n
>r-pentominos
Explain this shit, and don't send me to wikipedia
>>46815266
All of those are terms used in describing cellular automata (of which I am not familiar with) save for meta-4 and meta-n, which is just memeing.
>>46815266
On further reading, B6, S12, and so forth all refer to a rule classification scheme for life-like cellular automata, with B referring to how many living cells are necessary in a cell's Moore neighborhood to be born, and S referring to precisely how many cells are necessary to be alive in a living cell's Moore neighborhood for it to survive.
Thus, Conway's Game of Life would be Categorized as B2/S23, since a cell is born if it has two living neighbors, and survives if it has 2 or 3 living neighbors.
>>46815266
The r-pentomino is just a rather unusual and important pattern.
http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/R-pentomino
>>46815266
Pentominos are like tetris blocks, only instead of being made up of 4 squares, they're made up of 5. The r pentomino (called f in pic related) is a significant pattern in the game of life because it is a Methuselah, which means that it stays alive, constantly changing, for many generations (turns), without dying out or falling into a predictable pattern.
>>46815266
>>Meta-4, meta-n
This is just what I named on the spot for recursive game of life.
It is possible to arrange a 2048x2048 matrix of Life cells to simulate function of one Life cell as you can see here >>46778270
(there are also other configurations that function similarly, but they indicate on and off by a presence of just a couple gliders buried inside the structure, see picture)
Now, this cell is officially called OTCA metapixel because essentially playing a meta game of life using game of life. That's one level of metagame.
Now, it is thus possible to make a 2048x2048 matrix of OTCA metapixels to create an OTCA metapixel, adding another layer, thus making it double metagame, thus meta-2.
And then so on and so on.
>>46794298
The technology used in this is illustrated here.
Kek's Galaxy is the prettiest pattern.
I love threads like this.
>>46815561
>>46815661
>>46815700
>>46815990
Thanks, there's a lot to learn about this. Any more "explanations for retards" would be appreciated. I don't have time to read it closely but I will later, so I don't have anything specific to ask.
>>46815561
B3/S23, you mean.
http://store.steampowered.com/app/423800
>>46817458
Conway's game of life demonstrates the philosophical and scientific principle of Emergence. Emergence is the spiral shape of our galaxy as it spins around Sagittarius A*. Emergence is the drifting of the continents and the world it creates. Emergence is the mountains and the the way they have formed from the movement that drifting, as well as from the volcanic activity and glacial drifting. Emergence is a mighty tree growing from a tiny seed. Emergence is the hive mind of the bees that live in that tree. Emergence is life. Perhaps love, too, is emergence.
In less romantic terms, Emergence is simply whenever anything comes together and results in more than the sum of its parts. The parts of Life are simple: the three basic rules of survival, death, and birth. Yet from these simple parts, very complex interactions can emerge. It's the same principle that allows a single biological cell to build itself into a full human being from its DNA.
Bump in case the thread needs a bump
>>46820645
There's an implementation of the Life graphics which uses mushrooms as the graphic for living cells.
>>46821844
In ADoM, herbs grow according to the game of life's rules. If I ever make a roguelike, I'm going to include a monster called "golly fungus" that grows like GoL every turn or every few turns.
>>46818927
That looks interesting. Anybody try it out?
>>46824098
>those voices
No thanks. I support and respect turning cellular automata into an interesting game, but ... nah.
>>46824224
Oh man. I didn't unmute the video when I first saw it. Yeah, that is fucking annoying. I'm of the opinion that you shouldn't artificially anthropomorphize cellular automata in the first place -- the patterns should endear you on their own.
>>46782050
>@RULE DoubleLife
>@TABLE
>n_states:3
>neighborhood:Moore
>symmetries:permute
>var a={1,2}
>var b={1,2}
>var c={1,2}
>var d={1,2}
>var e={1,2}
>var w={0,1,2}
>var x={0,1,2}
>var y={0,1,2}
>var z={0,1,2}
>0,1,1,a,0,0,0,0,0,1
>0,2,2,a,0,0,0,0,0,2
>a,w,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0
>a,b,c,d,e,w,x,y,z,0
I with I new how to code this kind of stuff, I want to test my conway game of life two colors (3 if you count dead as one color) idea
I'm surprised nobody has mentioned Deep Rot yet.
>>46824525
Do you have Golly? If so, you can just paste that exact code into a text editor and save it as DoubleLife.rule in Golly's "rules" folder. Then go to Control > Set Rule and type in "DoubleLife" as the rule name.
>>46825072
I'm really glad you did, this is ridiculous.
>>46824224
Sounds like the ripped them out of Worms.
Some of you might already be aware, that Stephen Wolfram wrote a book that strongly features Cellular Automata.
I feel compelled to note, that despite the lengthy self-mirin he does in the preface and in general, his new kind of science in fact hasn't shaken up the scientific community by the very roots, etc. I haven't read the book, I looked through it for about a half hour. It was pretty neat in a way. I know he spent a really long time on it without telling anyone what he was working on, anyhow, kind of an interesting person/story I guess.
http://blog.stephenwolfram.com/2012/03/the-personal-analytics-of-my-life/ is funny, interesting, and awesome. But at the end of the day, like the posturing of New Kind of Science, there's not really much there. Just plotting some (interesting, admittedly!) distributions. But no tropical algebras on banana space type math. ANYHOW BYE.
>>46825072
>Necromancer enchants the graveyard to follow GoL rules with zombies popping out of the graves and just standing there
>the matrix runs through a cyclical pattern
>players need to figure out how to disturb the pattern to quell all the zombies with minimal destruction of entombed bodies
>>46794298
>>46817090
How does that work? I tried google and didn't find anything like that auto writer.
The only Hello World challenge for Life I've managed to find was banal pre-set gliders colliding into a pattern of squares.
>>46826432
>Do you have Golly? If so, you can just paste that exact code into a text editor and save it as DoubleLife.rule in Golly's "rules" folder. Then go to Control > Set Rule and type in "DoubleLife" as the rule name.
I was talking about coding my own rules.
I want to test this rule:
Squares can be dead, white or red.
White square count as one adjacent piece (like in usual game of life)
Red squares counts as 2 adjacent pieces.
A dead piece become white with 3 adjacent pieces.
A dead piece become red with 6 adjacent pieces.
A white piece stay alive with 2 or 3 adjacent pieces.
A red piece stay alive with 1 or 2 adjacent pieces.
>>46831954
Red alive condition seems on the low side?
Can white transition to red?
>>46831997
>Can white transition to red?
Yes forgot to type this rule
White becomes red when there is 4 or 5 adjacent pieces
>>46831181
At the bottom of each memory loop, there is a pattern that, when it receives a glider in one end from the upper-right, spits an LWSS heading left and another glider heading back up-right. At the top of the memory loop is there is a pattern that, when it receives a glider from the lower-left, spits out a glider heading down-left from the other end.
The number of gliders in the memory loop determines how frequently the printing end spits out LWSSes.
A memory loop is basically an LWSS gun whose frequency can be adjusted.
>>46798234
>download SproutLife
>fucker is perfectly willing to run itself off of spontaneous generation, but refuses to let me manually input a pattern and see what happens
>won't even display the goddamn grid properly
Yeah, fuck this thing.
>>46833518
The /prog/ in me is most upset that it's done in Java.
More please. This shit is beyond me but it's really amazing.
>>46772073
>I'd go so far as to say it influenced how I think about RPGs--think of how simple Basic D&D is, but in play it becomes kind of a beautiful little system of levers and incentives.
How else did it influence your perception of RPGs? I hear that Shadowrun (especially 3e) is especially strong in that respect.
>>46831954
>>46832628
Almost every pattern seems to explode into random chaos, except a few small patterns that die quickly.
To test it yourself, try this (in a "TGsRule.rule" file):
@RULE TGsRule
@TABLE
n_states:3
neighborhood:Moore
symmetries:permute
var a={1,2}
var u={0,1,2}
var v={0,1,2}
var w={0,1,2}
var x={0,1,2}
var y={0,1,2}
var z={0,1,2}
#DEAD CELLS
#3 neighbors, new white cell
0,1,1,1,0,0,0,0,0,1
0,1,2,0,0,0,0,0,0,1
#6 neighbors, new red cell
0,1,1,1,1,1,1,0,0,2
0,1,1,1,1,2,0,0,0,2
0,1,1,2,2,0,0,0,0,2
0,2,2,2,0,0,0,0,0,2
#WHITE CELLS
#less than 2 neighbors, die
1,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0
1,1,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0
#4 or 5 neighbors, turn red
1,1,1,1,1,1,0,0,0,2
1,1,1,1,a,0,0,0,0,2
1,2,1,a,0,0,0,0,0,2
1,2,2,0,0,0,0,0,0,2
#more than 5 neighbors, die
1,1,1,1,1,1,1,y,z,0
1,1,1,1,1,2,x,y,z,0
1,1,1,2,2,w,x,y,z,0
1,2,2,2,v,w,x,y,z,0
#RED CELLS
#no neighbors, die
2,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0
#more than 2 neighbors, die
2,1,1,1,v,w,x,y,z,0
2,2,1,u,v,w,x,y,z,0
2,2,2,u,v,w,x,y,z,0
@COLORS
0 48 48 48
1 255 255 255
2 255 0 0
>>46836862
>Almost every pattern seems to explode into random chaos, except a few small patterns that die quickly
I wonder if there is a systematic approach to discovering a ruleset.
Oh fuck, or like an ML algo tasked with finding interesting rules. How would that work? You would want it working with numbers of course, but just brainstorming, from a visual standpoint, if successive generations beat some threshold of lack of activity, that's The End, and then finding rulesets where The End fails to occur after some large number of steps.
But then again, The End could be quickly reached not due to the ruleset but to the starting seed.
Wow, weird problem. Anyone into machine learning? I took the Ng Coursera many months back, been meaning to get back into it.
We were explorers, now we have...Evolved...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_lK6OoZIqo
>>46837140
How would you distinguish between rules that just produce a chaotic mess and actually interesting rulesets? There are far more of the first kind than the second.
>>46837797
So, roughtly, there's "chaotic mess" (by this is meaning like static noise?), interesting, and dying quickly. Does that seem reasonable? In that case I think the same criteria for dying would apply to a chaotic mess... no significant (visual) change over a large number of steps
>>46837140
>Oh fuck, or like an ML algo tasked with finding interesting rules. How would that work?
this one here
>>46831954
was a conceptually created rule by myself while thinking how to create a ruleset with more than 3 states instead of the usual dead or alive states.
As you see a alive adjacent square count as a one adjacent square, and a dead adjacent square count as 0 adjacent squares.
So the "logical step to find next state, count as 2 adjacent squares.
A red square (the third state) would already have one adjacent piece with the one on the square. So instead stayinga live with 2 or 3 adjacent squares, it will stay alive with 1 or 2.
Turning a dead square into a red one, is a tricky thing, I assume you needed 6 adjacent squares to do it, thats 3 adjacent squares for each piece.
Then you can turn a alive square into a red one (maybe crowded is a good name), with 4 or 5 adjacent squares.
This, because you need 2 (3 is ok too) to make the current being stay alive and more 2 to make the extra being be born. (not 3, since the current being on the square already count an the adjacent piece to make the the being be born). 2+ 2 = 4, 2 + 3 = 5, so you end with 4 or 5 adjacent pieces turning an alive square into a red one.
>>46837865
Wolfram made a 4-class system for elementary cellular automata:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elementary_cellular_automaton#Random_initial_state
There's no reason you couldn't do the same for automata in more dimensions, but it's not like there's a way to rigorously test which class an automaton is in.
I also don't know what you mean by "no significant visual change". Pic related is class 3 (chaotic); it probably has more significant changes over time than a class 4 rule, which would have more orderly and localized structures.
>>46838013
I'm not sure this is a useful extension. The 1-count and 2-count squares don't seem like they'd "play well" with each other under most rulesets. The one you proposed is highly chaotic and doesn't seem to form any structures.
If you want more than 2 states, you could look at the Generations automata. The way it works is that if a cell should be born, it switches to the alive state like normal. If a cell should die, it does not go back to the dead state, but instead goes into a "dying" state. You can have several different dying states. Each generation, each "dying 1" cell goes to "dying 2" regardless of its neighbors, while each "dying 2" goes to "dying 3" and so on until cells in the final "dying" state revert completely to the dead state. The advantage of this system is that it allows for easy directed movement because dying cells can't become alive again for a few generations. Gliders are a much more fundamental part of Generations automata than in Conway's GoL.
Pic shows the result of a B2/S345 rule called "Star Wars" with 4 total states (alive, dying 1, dying 2, and dead), operating on a 750x750 torus from a starting position of only two adjacent alive cells. It's hard to tell from a still image, but if you try out the rule in GoLLY ("345/2/4" in the "Set Rule" box), you can see complex structures like puffers and glider guns emerge naturally.
Soo I'm trying out Golly's built in patterns. Ice-nine looks hilarious, but how can I skip straight through to when it starts icing?
Set generation does nothing, it only changes the number it shows, not the state of the board.
Same for the base step - all steps are one gen anyway.
>>46838325
>I'm not sure this is a useful extension.
I was just trying to logically expand the the rules and check what the result would be
http://www.swimbots.com/
Any examples of rules which give a weighted random chance for surviving and dying?
