Paladins seem like they get a lot of flak on /tg/, generally. How about we talk about the ways to play a paladin right, and show what characters we think serve as examples of decent paladins?
Pic related, to begin.
>>46034279
>Paladins seem like they get a lot of flak on /tg/, generally
NO THEY NOT YOU MEMEING CUNTMUNCHING SHITSTAIN DOGFUCKER, HOW ABOUT YOU GO AND STUFF YOUR UGLY FACE INTO A REEKING ASSHOLE YOU PULLED THAT RETARDED STATEMENT FROM.
I think some of the trouble with paladins is that they get their powers "for nothing". Like, they have to be good or pious or whatever, but that seldom ends up being played as a big ordeal for them - or, if it is, it annoys the other players because they end up having to suffer for it as well. So either they come off as effortless special snowflakes or a burden.
Cecil is a good paladin, because we spend half the story before he becomes one, seeing him strive and struggle and regret and finally earn his magical holy goodness powers. We end up with the strong sense that he deserves his status, and that allows us to like him more.
>>46034431
That's because your average elf wafuing dipshit couldn't give a hairy hoot about things like roleplaying the tribulations of something as complex as Arthurian knightly conduct.
Or else Pendragon would be bigger than 3.5 D&D
>>46034431
That's a problem with players rather than the class.
But then, have you ever complained about the Cleric getting his powers for free? Arguably more so than the Paladin as the Cleric isn't bound by such strong oaths and instead gets powers for doing what his patron wants.
Warlocks are in a similar position too. But again this is problem with the player, not the class.
Being beholden to patrons, oaths or yourself is a massive deal and should be reflected in your character.
That said I'd be interested to see a game where Paladin levels were something that couldn't be taken at chargen but earned later on.
>>46034279
>Alexander Anderson
>decent paladin
nigga what
Paladin thread?
>Paladin thread
>>46035492
Paladin thread.
>>46034431
I think Dragon Age actually did a good job with addressing that. The Templars basically become drug addicts to get their powers and their whole life is a balancing act. Of course, Templars are as a whole Lawful Neutral rather than Lawful Good so you might not really consider them true Paladins.
I still think the best recent example of what a Paladin should be is MCU Captain America though.
Anderson is pretty cool.
Though the whole "unkillable faggot" thing doesn't seem very paladin-ish.
>>46034279
>Gygax lawful good
The only real paladin is a black and white paladin who never compromises.
>>46035563
>Lawful Neutral
>Neutral
>>46035600
Anderson is more an inquisitor than paladin.
>>46035563
Templars don't NEED to become drug addicts mind you.
Though they're not really paladins and instead anti-mage fighters.
>>46035123
>nigga what
k'nigget why not
>>46035600
>Though the whole "unkillable faggot" thing doesn't seem very paladin-ish.
He's obviously using Lay On Hands on himself, Anon.
>>46034279
Personally, I like playing my paladins in a way similar to Wolfwood from Trigun. Doesn't always know what the right answer is, and knows that sometimes there really is no happy ending to a situation, but does his best to do what he at least thinks is right.
>>46035624
A paladin follows his dogma. Being willing to compromise or break it based on the current situation would be neutral or chaotic action unless making such compromises is within that dogma.
Lawful good doesn't always mean being nice
This guys pretty much a Paladin. And he's usually stuck in a situation where he's forced to choose between a Lawful Action and a Good one.
>>46035656
They're kind of the closest things you'll find in the setting. Except maybe the Grey Wardens, but that's more of a profession than a "class". And besides, we all know how well things turned out for them.
>>46034279
Pic related is fucking evil, though.
>>46034431
I've seen the opposite problem more often, at least in 3.x and later.
Paladins have to deal with this incredibly restrictive moral code, and they end up with powers and rewards for it that are less good than what other, less-restricted classes (clerics, wizards, etc) get.
>>46035791
Killing heretics and abominations is evil?
From the his religious perspective he is lawful and paladin. Might be neutral instead of good though
Don't mind me, just posting one of the better vidya paladins
>>46035846
Killing evil is neutral. It's a practical and sensible thing to do, but it's not a Good thing to do.
>>46035846
Killing heretics is absolutely evil.
Protestants don't belong to a D&D Chaotic Evil cannibalistic murderous cult.
>>46035876
Wouldn't ignoring evil be more neutral than fighting it? Good doesn't mean nice. It's the opposite pole from evil. Balancing and coexisting between them is neutral.
>>46035846
>heretics
I don't know about you dude but I'm pretty sure killing people who belong to a slightly different religion is, in fact, pretty evil.
>>46035928
To a righteous paladin of the Church of Rome, Protestants have perverted the Word of God and lead astray the flock to eternal torment. This is an evil act.
Cannibalism is not, as the righteous must eat the flesh of Christ. Although some Protestants do this. Then it is evil cannibalism.
>>46034279
Didn't that particular paladinfell as hard as a fucking comet?
>>46035876
He also runs an orphanage.
>>46035928
>>46036028
In the manga and OVA, he's more ambiguous and a lot closer to good. Most of his talk about killing heretics is probably just him being threatening, since later he goes out of his way to save Integra, and shows clear anger at the death of (protestant) innocents.
>>46036028
Says you you crazy Protestant bastard.
>>46036087
Technically, he ascended. He became a monster, but it was a holy monster.
>>46035928
Harbouring vampires and using them to do your bidding doesn't sound exactly good either.
>>46035928
*stereotypical offhanded comment about islam.*
*References to the lower right corner of the alignment chart*
*Accusations of being a protestant fuckbucket*
Glory to the Orthodoxy
>>46036127
I guess that would work from a certain point of view, but he himself admitted that he will become a monster with that move.
>>46036028
Heretics don't even belong to a different religion.
They belong to a different version of the same religion.
>>46034333
>>46036064
>>46036178
I'm actually a practicing Catholic, but thanks.
>>46036181
He stopped being human and became something else. Humans are the ones who triumph over monsters.
>>46036189
Well, he certainly is as lawful as one can get though not quite as literally as Carrot.
>>46036232
I didn't suggest that you were or were not.
You are very welcome though.
>>46036232
The whole thing was sarcasm, Papist.
Jokes aside, Deus Vult brother.
>>46036178
Yeah because when I want to think of successful paladins, I think of one of the biggest clusterfucks of medieval history.
>>46036313
Paladins are warriors that fight for the glory of their god. Why not think of a religious war?
>>46034333
OPs seem like they get a lot of flak on /tg/, generally. How about we talk about the ways to start a thread right, and show what anons we think serve as examples of decent OPs?
Pic related, to begin
>>46036340
Well yeah but I'd prefer my paladins not to get lost and attack the Greeks instead of the muslims.
>>46034279
Bugbear was a good example of how.
>>46036493
They fell.
I find pic related to be the perfect example of a paladin:
>Always seeks justice
>Never breaks his moral code
>Can see the slightlest bit of evil sprouting in anyone's heart
>Relies on his own strength and determination
>Believes in the redemption of any and all evildoers
>Evades all kinds of tempation
>Will sacrifice himself for the greater good in a heartbeat, but not others as long as he can evade it
>Won't hesitate to kick his close friends' asses for doing what's wrong
He may be protrayed as some kind of dark guy, but he is everything a paladin is ought to be.
>>46036631
Yes. This.
>>46036631
>>Believes in the redemption of any and all evildoers
>>Evades all kinds of tempation
Nah. Bats has been a cynic for years now. He doesn't believe his criminals are fit for redemption and spends his days fucking selina/talia/random bimbos, no matter how bad of an idea it is.
So how do you go about doing Vegence Paladins or have orders of them?
I have taken it to be the case where a another type of oath paladin takes when something traumatic happens.
>>46036313
At least the crusaders did what they actually needed to do (to some degree, I blame the fucking venetians) in addition to murderfucking the byzantines.
There is of course an alternative.......
>>46036028
Honestly, we only see him acting against people that, in his opinion, harbour a fucking monstrosity and the Nazis so its hard to judge his actual true fervour, especially given his reaction to Maxwells actions.
Regardless, protestantism is pretty evil from a Catholic perspective. Its a perversion of the pure word of god that leads to the disavowment of natural order and eternal damnation.
>>46036831
I'm running a game with a Mafia Paladin. He's not taking vengeance on orcs, or goblins, or undead. He's taking vengeance upon those House Theramir fucks from the next province over and anything that empowers them or supports their side in the thousand year old feud. There was no personally traumatic event, it's just what any able young man wishing to serve his family is expected to do. As the PCs family is aligned with the state and a sort-of-decent religion, and the enemy clan uses sorcery and necromantic rites, it works out pretty well.
>>46036831
>bad thing happens
>"how can I stop bad thing/get vengeance against things that cause bad thing?"
>"hello there fellow vengeance seeker! Have you heard of (order of bad thing stoppers)? Many others have had bad thing happen, and have pooled resources to efficiently protect the land from bad thing. Sign up today and you can get a clean tabard, sharp blade and 3 meals a day to accompany your PASSION FOR JUSTICE!"
>"We also offer counseling in case you have an excess of BURNING HATE. We can help you quell that fury, but not too much. We like people with moxy."
>>46036831
If you wanted, you could make it a nationalistic thing. A nation long ago went to war against a neighbour whom turned dishonourable magics on them.
With the power of these magics, the neighbouring state practically wiped out a generation and more of the first country. Thus, the parents of said country have sworn vengeance.
They could be like guerilla paladins
![maximilien-de-robespierre-3[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/nmUomTA.jpg "maximilien-de-robespierre-3[1].jpg")
>>46036831
>So how do you go about doing Vegence Paladins
Where the founding principle of a monarchy is the desire for glory, the founding principle of a republic is virtue. A republic that is not virtuous and does not have virtuous citizens will inevitably collapse under its own weight or due to outside factors. To enforce this virtue one needs terror, for what is terror other than the swift, blind and inflexible application of justice?
>>46036532
Why was the sheet written in welsh?
>>46036532
Wait, actually. Why couldn't he refuse the duel if he fell from being a Paladin, such a long time ago?
>>46036831
Our go is a wrathful god
>>46037222
He was still beholden to the code because he believed himself to be.
Falling usually involves the paladin realising it and thus consciously abandoning the code. If you don't realise it, you stick to the code because you think you need to to have your paladin powers
>>46037144
>Paladins putting monarchist to the guillotine
Oh boy...
I suppose the main thing is I don't see Vengence paladins as something that can last very long unless what they are dealing with is equally durable such as the eradication of a certain monster (i.e. vampires). My take is they are often dangerous loners or groups that will eventually burn themselves out on their quest.
>>46037403
When you set out for vengeance, first dig 2 graves bruh.
Thats what I find makes them a dangerous force. Where other paladins might lay down their lives protecting a church or a village, vengeance paladins are the ones that run screaming, head long into a zombie horde to take out the vampire that leads it and they will not stop until they have taken the vamp down. They're essentially divinely empowered shock troopers turned into smart missiles
>>46037533
I know, that's what makes them dangerous and makes world building taking paladins in general in mind interesting.
I'm glad they have an oath for the realm which lets them be Artorias for all intents and purposes because I have a hard time imagining a few kingdoms with essentially mercenary bands of divinely powered men at arms with their own particular view of what is good and what isn't
>>46036790
>He doesn't believe his criminals are fit for redemption
Gonna have to side with you on this one. Batman doesn't seem all that interested in rehabilitating or redeeming criminals. He just beats them up and drags them to jail so they're off the street. Main reason most versions of him don't kill is he thinks playing executioner is the one thing he should leave to the system.
>spends his days fucking selina/talia/random bimbos
Can you blame him?
Not like they ever really get him to stray though. He'll bring Catwoman to bed one evening and then to jail the next if she goes far enough.
>>46034279
>and show what characters we think serve as examples of decent paladins?
This kid. Like him as a Paladin. At least he's the example I'd mention if running a game for kids or something.
Yeah I already know all the memes so you're just repeating yourself.
>>46037603
See, I usually take it that the ''orders'' of paladins only exist in a kingdom with the rulers express permission, which I like.
On the one hand, tiny weak countries become battleground filled with roving paladin bands and such whereas large, prosperous nations are more secure.
I also like to combine different oaths into the same order, centering the order around something. So you might have the Order of the Green Lake and theres the Devotion Paladins whom are devoted to protecting the lake and the people that live near it, the Ancient Paladins that are dedicated to defending it as an embodiment of natural light and the Vengeance Paladins whom prosecute campaigns against those that pollute the lake, be these campaigns military, political or legal as appropriate
>>46037705
Doesn't he usually put them in Arkham Asylum so they can get the help they need and be off the street?
>>46037719
I didn't think to have the different oaths be part of the same organization.
This makes this infinitely more interesting and much simpler to plan out.
>>46036790
>fucking selina/talia/random bimbos
implying he isn't fuckingoracleinstead
A lot of problems with Paladins are often the GMs fault. Some of them immediately go "hurr how do I make them fall" instead of thinking "cool, the party has a moral centre".
Even if there is 'falling' in the game - a Paladin chooses to fall. It's a conscious decision. You can't accidentally break your oaths by making an offhand choice.
>>46037789
Theres no reason they can't, if ya think about it.
I like to do my religious paladins like that. Say you have the god Iphion. The Knights of Iphion might constitute paladins and clerics, lets say.
In peace time, the Clerics fulfill the administrative roles. The Devotion Paladins fulfill the task of patrolling/ protecting their properties while Vengeance Paladins act as inquisitors, being dedicated to the elimination of Heretics. Both aid in training the next generation of the order.
In war, the paladins of Devotion forward the goals of the God as related to the conflict, if appropriate, and otherwise prosecute battle plans as best as is possible. Clerics provide the support and a link to the God so the Order knows its acting appropriately. The Vengeance Paladins act as a vanguard on the march and a line-breaker force in battle.
Thats assuming its a martial order, of course, but you get the idea. Devotion paladins and Clerics will almost always have a place, other paladins might depending on the nature of the deity or order.
>>46037743
Usually it depends. The Arkham series starts with him bringing the Joker into the asylum. Mostly because in that universe it's the only facility equipped for holding guys like the Joker, Killer Croc, and the Big Guy. Bruce Wayne actively campaigns against the Arkham City project though, maybe because he saw it as a perversion of actual justice.
In the Gotham TV series, Arkham is just a holding pen used for political purposes and human experimentation. Everyone knows this but they just roll with it because that show has a really dim view of Gothamites. But it's also pre-Batman, so maybe things will change.
Nolanverse Batman seems genuinely uninterested in rehabilitating people though. He seems to just view himself as a means to an end, and that end is the system getting fixed.
>>46035928
>Protestants don't belong to a D&D Chaotic Evil cannibalistic murderous cult.
>implying
>>46036347
