/btg/ is dead, long live /btg/!
Preparing for ilClan
Old Thread: >>48201500
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Combat Manuals Kurita
http://www.mediafire.com/download/l317qcmc9i81744/E-CAT35261_BattleTech_Combat_Manual_Kurita.pdf
Campaign Operations
http://www.mediafire.com/download/b7e9bgevanjxf3y/E-CAT35007_Campaign_Operations.pdf
TtS McEvedy's Folly
http://www.mediafire.com/download/0i6ldp6u1qxbfh5/E-CAT35SN209_BattleTech_Touring_the_Stars_McEvedys_Folly.pdf
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>/btg/ does a TRO:
http://builtforwar.blog(not spam)spot.com/
>How do I do this Against the Bot thing?
http://pastebin.com/pE2f7TR5
>Overview of the major factions?
http://bg.battletech.com/universe/great-houses/
http://bg.battletech.com/universe/the-clans/
http://bg.battletech.com/universe/other-powers/
>How do I find out what BattleMechs a faction has?
http://masterunitlist.info/
>Map of /btg/ players (WIP):
https://www.zeemaps.com/map?group=1116217&add=1
>BattleTech Introductory Info and PDFs
http://bg.battletech.com/?page_id=400
>Rookie guides
http://pastebin.com/HZvGKuGx
>Sarna.net - BattleTech Wiki
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Main_Page
>Megamek - computer version of BattleTech. Play with AI or other players
http://megamek.info/
Unit Designing Softwares
>SSW Mech Designer
http://www.solarisskunkwerks.com/
>MegaMek Lab
http://megameklab.sourceforge.net/
>BattleTech IRC
#battletech on irc.rizon.net
>PDF Folders
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/9q792hobnbpw3/Battletech
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/sdckg6j645z4j/Battletech
Battletech? Come on, dude. You know cool games and settings aren't allowed on /tg/.
>>48249104
Faggotry? Come on, dude. You know retarded bullshit and rampant faggotry isn't allowed in /btg/.
are you ready for 90% of this joke becoming true?
>>48249537
Wow I hope that doesn't happen. Sad thing, makes a disturbing amount of sense. Fuck, that's awful looking. Literally no faction I care about survives or does well. That's awful.
>>48249630
The part I'm surprised by is that it's Cloud Cobra and not Star Adder.
>>48249537
I for one hope this isn't true. I really do. But if it is... FINALLY the Suns get their long awaited kick to the nuts!
>>48249891
Wait, never mind, I suck cocks. Banacek is a CSA bloodname.
>>48249891
Well, yeah. That's how we know it's a hoax.
Anyone want this title-less version? :)
>>48250213
Yay, if only for a better look at the Pixie.
Them 3d renders in the book were kinda lame compared to the color pieces in CM: Mercs, and the Pixie is the worst of them.
>>48250213
Nice
>>48250286
Yeah they were a little underwhelming this time, maybe due to being rushed. They were all SPOOKY this time around, just needs some better visual focus on forms over texture.
>>48249088
Am I the only one that finds it hard to get into the Clans not involved in Revival?
They feel like the "all the rest" crew.
>>48251054
Somewhat, yeah, though there's a few potentially interesting events like the Burrock Absorption. Goliath Scorpion Seekers can be good roleplaying opportunity too.
>>48246854
>I used to be a member of VHEM
I didn't know what VHEM was before this. How can anyone be so cucked?
>>48249537
This looks like someone's shitty self-insert story.
"Ulysses Banacek" kills basically every khan in the innersphere, then kills stone, then makes Julian Davion his personal bitch.
>>48251148
It's like being the cuck of the universe.
>>48251054
I always thought Clan Cloud Cobra sounded neat... until I read operation revival. They're basically just Star Adder sidekicks.
And Goliath Scorpion and the Ravens seem mildly interesting, and they fucked right out of there.
>>48249537
This has the problem beyond everything else of just being really boring.
If what was planned of Ilclan was even remotely similar, no wonder they stopped moving towards it.
It's just incredibly dull. Clans win. Inner Sphere is over. Sad Trombone sound goes here.
Going through with that plan be financial suicide if nothing else, because people don't like playing in a dead setting, just look at what happened with Warhammer with the big climactic setting ending arc, even discounting what happened after it was a shit-show that shed a lot of die-hard fans because of the prevailing attitude of 'what's the point?'. Takes a strong will to ignore the official line and play in a dead setting and not just move on to other games, which might even be technically dead but just unsupported rather than game over dead.
>>48251860
>Clans win. Inner Sphere is over. Sad Trombone sound goes here.
Well, that's what should have happened in the first place during 3050, so I'm OK with it. Yeah, it's taken them this long to fix their initial mistake, but at least it's getting fixed.
>>48251860
M8, it's literally a joke
>>48251895
My trothkin.
>>48251928
As far as I know IlClan was supposed to be a thing, even if the document there is a joke? Certainly gets discussed enough around here anyway.
>>48251895
the Clans didn't count on getting Focht to the death.
>>48252022
tukayyid best day of life one bulldog not enough etc etc
>>48251860
Don't worry, ilkhan is never going to happen. Its going to be succession wars historicals, XTROs about succession wars, combat manuals about all the factions we already have source books on, touring the stars succession wars edition, turning points succession wars, novel reprints, you get the picture.
>>48251671
Honestly I thought the IS was just going in the "Every nation gets their own pet clan" direction (possibly with some exceptions) and they would simply get integrated into the bigger inner sphere.
Then they can standardize everyone on Clantech, and we can move the plot forward finally.
The fact that clan equipment is still magical bullshit nobody can reproduce almost 100 years later is more than a little ridiculous.
>>48252052
I was just tukayyid posting on another board earlier tonight. Fuckyeah Tokaayyid was the best day of my life.
In fact, my friends and I are ending our Tukayyid compaign in about a week and a half. Gonna butcher the pathetic remnants of Clan Nova Cat (and murder their Khan, while we're at it).
>>48252104
While I'd like that...the problem with it is that the very definition of 'IlClan" is "the Clan that wins by taking over Terra".
>>48251644
I fuck all the girls, and I had my tubes snipped like 10 years ago, procreation is for suckers. Cuckold is non-metaphorically played as both a shit board meme and insult.
On topic, fresh Clan Robits
>>48252072
I expected this from the moment the succession wars stuff was announced.
>>48252104
That'd be far too smart and logical for something birthed in the derp age.
A post-3150 setting though really could do with standardising the equipment to a higher tech level in the rules themselves. Not even simply moving everything to clan tech, just making the baseline something easier to get into for newer players than having to start out with 3025 tech and then work up to the utter clusterfuck of mixed/experimental tech with special modifiers, abilities, how they react to damage, how they deal damage...
>>48252157
>doesn't have kids
You literally fail at life.
>>48252196
>A post-3150 setting though really could do with standardising the equipment to a higher tech level in the rules themselves.
Also for new players, moving the baseline technology up might be an improvement just so introtech-only games don't seem so fucking slow and short-ranged.
>>48252227
I honestly consider him kind of a hero for making sure his genes never pass on. If only more people were so thoughtful.
>>48252355
Hello VHEManon, how are you tonight?
>>48252227
>being this freebirth
literally worse than amaris
So many happy memesters in this thread this evening.
>>48252469
>being this clan
Literally worse than Smoke Jaguar.
>>48252489
>being this plebe
Literally worse than Loren Coleman.
>>48252489
>worse than best clan
really makes you think....
The links in the Against the Bots pastebin are broken.
So, are the cyborg catgirls a Draconis Combine thing, or...?
If you had to devote the rest of your life protecting dispersed settlements on a Periphery world from the occasional pirate raid or native bandit, with possibility of off world resupply 2 to 4 times a year, what mech would you choose?
>All of this/pol/in my Battletech
Somehow appropriate.
>>48252800
MOC, actually. There's art depicting cyborg catgirls.
>>48252865
I consider all of this discussion a faux-/pol/
>>48252863
Not a Purple Bird lover, but the correct answer is the best mech the FWL produces.
Have in in LC colors from an elsie.
>>48252863
Awesome-8Q or -9Q, depending on era
>>48251054
Some of them have interesting facets, or stuff that *could* have been interesting if they were further developed like the Cobra Cloisters.
But a lot of them are "Do ho ho, we're so dumb we fight ourselves instead of anyone else," "Herp a derp, narcotic vision quest time," or "Our only purpose is to always support/violently oppose whatever Clan X does."
20 sounded like a good, round number back in the day but in retrospect 10 Clans would have been easier to manage.
>>48252863
Crab. Wolvie-5M. Grasshopper. Something mobile and with an energy-heavy loadout.
>>48253283
Seriously the Cobra Cloisters are a horribly untapped bit of potential. They're Clan Knights Templar, in the case of the Josians.
>>48252863
There are two acceptable answers to this question, and those are the Awesome and Black Knight. Though I suppose in 3025-50, you could add the OG Marauder II
>>48253248
PPCs are a problem to maintain in the fluff though, and an Assault will suck down a lot of maintenance time and cash.
>>48252863
Probably a Shadow Hawk in the 3025ish era. It's not a spectacularly great 'Mech, but parts are easy to come by and everything on it is known for being able to handle rugged treatment. Has two hands as well so if heavy lifting or extreme rescues are needed it can help.
Other than that, maybe a Phoenix Hawk for the speed, jump range, relatively heavy weapons array and anti-infantry capability. I wouldn't go into battle with more than about 10 bursts loaded for each of the MGs though.
>>48252863
In what era?are you just posting this to get an idea of the best energy boats, or are you actually serious?
>>48252863
This grasshopperI'm kind of sorry, but not really
>>48252863
Probably something that I could easily and cheaply find parts for. Maybe one of the Vindicator variants.
>>48253398
Let's say 3025-50
[Spoiler] I'm serious, I've been thinking of errants lately and wanted to get others takes to see what they'd choose [/spoiler]
>>48253442
>that I could easily and cheaply find parts for. Maybe one of the Vindicator variants.
Spoiler alert, those two things are directly and strongly incompatible
>>48252634
That pastebin is super old and not really relevant beyond the link to Dylan's BT emporium for his releases. Which is really only relevant if you want more fluffy stuff. Just download the most current release linked at MekHQ site http://megamek.info/releases, which is really just a roundabout link to https://github.com/MegaMek/mekhq/releases/tag/v0.3.30 That's all you need, really. The noob guide in the pastebin is still handy, but I would read a more current ATB thread on the OF for setting up/starting out.
>>48252865
nah, that was just being dipshits for fun because there isn't anything even a bit new or interesting to talk about
when /btg/ goes /pol/ you'll know it
>>48253480
The answer is really invariably going to be the most energy boat energy boat available, because it removes 95% of the problems associated with running a mech with poor supply, a hundred times more so in pre-CASE days. That's just a fact, unfortunately
>TFW your favorite BattleTech author is Coleman but he turned out to be a thief
>>48252863
>If you had to devote the rest of your life protecting dispersed settlements on a Periphery world from the occasional pirate raid or native bandit, with possibility of off world resupply 2 to 4 times a year, what mech would you choose?
If I had to go pure stock, then it's Phoenix Hawk time. Enough armor to handle Bugs, solid mix of anti-vee and AP ability, and good mobility in both the strategic and tactical senses. Hell, 45t is light enough that you can still sling it into a train car. Honorable mention goes to the WVR-6M or GRF-1S, since parts are so easy to get and the weapons fit is just about perfect for a marshal with a busy schedule. Stock up on tear gas rounds, of course, and I'd actually prefer the Wolverine since you could try for some inferno gel (incendiary LRM ammo is just flat-out shite). The TDR-5SE is another great candidate, but too slow for defending scattered settlements and harder to repair.
If I could make my own quickie field-refit custom, I'd take a Pixie and drop the MGs for flamers and a sink. Another option would be dropping a half-ton of MG ammo for armor and beef up the head.
If it's an "Anything Goes" custom, than I'd be all about this bitch - I've been developing a fondness for her as I goof about with the Black Widows. Looks enough like a -2D to draw them in, but it just gets meaner and meaner as you close with it and it's geared to deal with conventional forces nearly as well as it does with 'Mechs.
>>48253481
If I was in Capellan space, no.
But on the Periphery, yeah you're right. Maybe a Blackjack then.
>>48253582
I fucking love Superchargers.
and now I want to watch the Black Cauldron
>>48253283
Why do you think they're killing them all off?
I mean, honestly, nothing of value was lost when say, clans Fire Mandrill and Ice Hellion got murdered.
The only interesting faction there really is maybe the Cloud Cobras but they're never given a chance to do anything aside from be Star Adder footstool cronies.
>>48252863
Awesome 8Q
>>48249537
If i'd won the lottery over the weekend I would have gone a-knockin on CGLs doors and taken the financial burden of the damn book on myself...even if it ended up looking something like this.
>>48253829
Catalyst should really merge the Cloud Cobras, Coyotes, Star Adders and Stone Lions into one faction. I swear there's one interesting Clan between the four of them. And I say that as a Star Adder fan.
>>48240874
>"Brutna Fält Lopare" gets the one-two for not only getting the word wrong ("fältlopare", field runners, is one compound word) but "Broken Field Runners" means absolutely nothing.
It does if you speak American Football Jargon, anon. Before the snap, both sides choose and set their formations - the defense to stop the offense form advancing the ball, the offense to break past the defense and gain territory or score. When an offensive player in possession of the ball gets past the prepared lines of defense and gets into the 'backfield' behind the defensive line(s), where there are only one or two (usually wrong-footed) defenders to intercept him before he can score a touchdown, he's engaged in 'broken-field running'. It's the NFL equivalent of a cavalry-raid.
One presumes that the Second Husars recruit a lot of personnel from Sheliak, the gridiron planet from "Three Points of Pride".
By the looks of it, the compound word should actually be something like "Brutnafält" for the proper emphasis, but I don't speak enough Swedish to properly gattai those words. Besides, as >>48241225 says,
>Swedenese is one hell of a language.
>>48253930
>It does if you speak American Football Jargon, anon
So it means absolutely nothing.
>>48251994
It's supposed to be a thing. OTOH, it'll probably kill the franchise, unless BT 2.0 literally ships the month after it gets released.Still good odds of being the KO shot even then.
>>48253705
>I fucking love Superchargers.
They're great if you have a good tech or a bad one with a lot of time on his hands. Honestly the Vang Custom is >probably< better-off with the extra two jump jets instead of the supercharger, but I love the flavor considering who's supposed to be using it. It's also a great example of an outlaw tech refit - all the weapons are sourced off of existing 'Mechs (the SRM-6 from a Whammy, the laser from a Thud, the flamer from a Valk/Wasp, the other arm laser from an SHD-2D), there's a sink bunged into the AC ammo bin, and the rest of the weight is strapped-on armor and engine overrides.
Another refit I put together for my pirates is this - a mock Wolverine, built on a reconditioned SHD chassis. It's technically a pretty high-level refit, but it leaves the armor, engine, and sinks alone and mounts all the weapons in more "Wolverine-ish" spots. I did a model of it as well, with a cut-down autocannon and a Robotech Tactics Command Destroid package. I know it seems a little pointless, but I've always hated the way the Blockhead looks and there are subtle differences in how the two designs handle. Of course, it's technically >worse< than the WVR, but I still like the way she looks.
>>48253949
Kek. But yeah, it's a joke that only works if you know an... unusual combination of languages and slang.
And a shot of the customs I did, from last month.
First one on the left is >>48253582 , and the second is >>48254068 .
The third is a modded Jihad-era Diesel Thunderbolt (supercharger, LACs, MG/rocket pods on a semi-swappable mount), and the fourth is a good old Steiner Griffin/Korchima Special.
>>48253418
No, this Marauder, with this guy driving it. Not shown, the 6 Edge this guy had. Did a lot of Clan killing with this thing.
Long term merc campaigns are a hell of a drug.
>>48253909
Good News! Since Clan Just-As-Planned had a massive advantage over the others after the Wars of Reaving ended, you can be sure they'll be the only survivor before they launch Clan Invasion II: Clan Harder.
>>48254112
Rad.
>>48254135
>flattop Marauder
Good mech, but absolutely haram
>>48254452
It's basically a Penetrator though, so of course it's good.
>>48252052
>>48252107
>le ebin overused tukayyid maymay
Rasalhague Dominion best day of my life one Revival not enough ilClan will become even better day of my life etc etc
>>48249537
So what is this 'outline' thing exactly?
It can't be real, as it doesn't end with ilClan Capellan Bears on top... so was it released on April 1st or something?
I got some newbie questions, /btg/.
1) I want to start a MW RPG campaign where the PCs are freelance mercs (not very original, I don't care), where can I find the costs of ammo, maintenance, repairs, personnel, and all that necessary stuff? I found one of the Merc books but it uses this weird points system that I'm pretty sure is meant for the tabletop. I want prices in C-Bills.
2) Does anyone have a good spreadsheet or program that makes tracking all that stuff easier?
3) How well would MegaMek work for multiple players controlling one "side" of a battle?
>>48254480
Funny thing is, I built that beast before the Penetrator was published. I was kinda amused when TRO 3055 came out.
>>48254452
Well, I thought of the MLs as being mounted in a sort of "spoiler of death" that was attached where the AC mount used to be.
>>48254814
>So what is this 'outline' thing exactly?
>It can't be real, as it doesn't end with ilClan Capellan Bears on top... so was it released on April 1st or something?
Ben Rome, the writer in charge of Wars of Reaving, released it as a joke/look behind the scenes after the ilClan plot meeting back a couple years ago. That was right around the time Herb fell on his sword in a vain effort to kill the trolls and the BattleChats got flushed with the bathwater. There are also pics floating around of a jokey whiteboard "leaked" from said plot meetings to troll the userbase, and the April First Free Taiwa- St. Ives module.
>>48254843
>1) I want to start a MW RPG campaign where the PCs are freelance mercs (not very original, I don't care), where can I find the costs of ammo, maintenance, repairs, personnel, and all that necessary stuff? I found one of the Merc books but it uses this weird points system that I'm pretty sure is meant for the tabletop. I want prices in C-Bills.
CB prices are in TacOps/StratOps/TechManual/IntOps depending on item. Most of the data for rrunning the repair side of a campaign is in StratOps, but the new Campaign Operations book is intended specifically for running that kind of game. Unfortunately, since it's just come out within the week, it's a massive clusterfuck and will likely need a month's worth of errata to smooth over.
>2) Does anyone have a good spreadsheet or program that makes tracking all that stuff easier?
This is literally the purpose of MekHQ, from the MegaMek guys. It's not updated to CampaignOps standards yet, and to be honest I'm still going through my copies to compare the differences so I can't help you there for another few days.
>3) How well would MegaMek work for multiple players controlling one "side" of a battle?
Set them all on the same team as individuals if you want to have "individual initiative" going, or just have them send you their moves in chat. It's a little clunky but it works
>>48251285
Stone? It's been a while since I read up on dark age, but isn't the RotS exarch Jonah Levin?
>>48255127
Stone was in a cryotube. Somebody woke him up.
>>48255137
And got shot in the goddamned face for his troubles, I might add..
>>48254982
Thanks for the explanation.
Follow-up question:
>That was right around the time Herb fell on his sword in a vain effort to kill the trolls...
What happened to Herb, both here and in general?
>>48250213
Battlemaster on the ground getting pounded by Wolverine?
>>48255137
Funny thing is, I just read The Scorpion Jar where Levin gets elected a couple weeks ago on my slog through the DA novels and he seemed like a pretty reasonable guy. Tougher than Redburn but still not the guy you see pulling all this super militarization and Fortress Republic stuff.
Did we ever find out when and why the Fortress went down anyway?
>>48255285
Ironically modeled on the old Warhawk killing a Kuritan Battlemaster pic.
>>48255240
>What happened to Herb, both here and in general?
Forum drama pretty much.
Feddie fans had been going off the tit at him over there for years, blaming him for everything that went wrong for their faction after the 4th SW even though he wasn't really responsible for anything aside from the Jihad and what little post- MW: DA stuff we had at the time, and the Jihad stuff was mandated by the DA plot any way.
Add to that the flack over the proposed timeskip to 3250 with a new rule set and re-igniting the Feddie rage with 3145 TRs and plotlines pushed him over the edge.
If the forum mods were worth anything they would have clamped down on that shit, but OF gonna OF.
Which is also the reason nobody has taken the top job in the 2+ (I think we're getting towards 3 years now?) years since. Just way too much grief and drama.
>>48255298
I'm more curious about what happened to the rest of the Jags.
>>48255392
It didn't seem like that much grief and drama to me. How hard can it be to find a line developer who's competent and also doesn't act like a thin-skinned little bitch when some neckbeard whines about the Chesterton Commonality in a chatroom?
>>48255392
>proposed timeskip to 3250 with a new rule set
I remember hearing about this. Kind of a shame it didn't happen.
>>48255426
There's a reason I don't go to the OF for anything other than errata, anon.
It really is that bad. They wound up deleting most of the threads but the people who were sperging out over that shit are still there.
>>48255426
A lot of shit happened to Herb over that time. He got divorced, lost his house to the ex, etc. Battletech was his one joy left, and people sucked the joy out of it for him.
I'd probably feel worse for him if not for his irrational hatred of Texas.
>All these shitty energy boat answers
You're not going to have enough replacement heat sinks.
Why are the Phoenix Hawk, Stinger, and Valkyrie so lightly armed in comparison to their Macross/Robotech equivalents?
>>48255438
I don't think so. I saw the old rules that were supposed to go with it. The idea of bringing things to a new standard was pretty good, as well as the swiss army mode lasers, but dumping every old chassis completely was a terrible idea. Not like it was ever super serious anyway. They basically tested the waters with the community and came back with an overwhelmingly negative response so tossed it.
It was the original solution for post illClan though. You'd get that book as the end of an era and then a big timeskip equivalent to the FCCW to DA jump.
>>48255469
There's nothing irrational about hating Texas.
>>48255442
I don't remember it being that bad. People are always going to throw tantrums during big changes; who cares? Let them have their threads. I don't see how that affects the line
developer's ability to do his job.
I stopped visiting the forum because it became overmoderated; all the interesting people left and now it's slow and boring.
>>48255502
These rules were different from those "Third Generation" sheets with the grazers and shit, right?
>>48255494
Because BattleTech mostly doesn't do one-shot kills, and they looked scrawnier than Dougrams et al
>>48255522
Not by much. That third generation stuff was the first draft. They like sneaking some stuff into their joke releases sometimes. Or at least they used to. I don't even remember what the last couple April Fools releases have been.
>>48255520
>I don't remember it being that bad. People are always going to throw tantrums during big changes; who cares? Let them have their threads. I don't see how that affects the line developer's ability to do his job.
Except that they weren't just staying in their threads. Every battlechat, every week for almost 3 months after release was basically "Y U NO ARBY'S THE CC?" Apparently the same shit happened at cons over the Jihad too.
>I stopped visiting the forum because it became overmoderated; all the interesting people left and now it's slow and boring.
That's what happens when you make a fansite the main page. And now because of the OF, all of the weird personalities are done with the game and don't post anywhere else, though that's not really a bad thing, since it was a lot of shitposting between factions, which we already get here.
>>48255469
>>48255509
>Texas.
Maybe he has a valid reason for not liking the state.
>>48255502
>The idea of bringing things to a new standard was pretty good
>as well as the swiss army mode lasers
The idea of multi-purpose weapons is workable, but there's no point in making a new standard if it's going to be just as complicated as the old one.
>>48255567
He hates the heat because he's a tubby polar bear person who wilts in 90+F and wears shorts in 40F. That's it.
>>48249537
What the hell are the Stone Coyotes?
>>48255654
Stone Lion + Coyotes? Like how "Cloud Adder" is Cloud Cobra + Star Adder?
>>48255469
If his personal life was falling apart and people were bothering him at cons, I guess I can understand.
>>48255562
There was more to it than faction shitposting. I remember huge threads just about trying to figure out what the Hidden Five were or who The Master and other Blakist higher-ups were. Or that project to track every WarShip in the post-Clan Invasion era. The official forums are too dead and repressive now and /btg/ isn't built for that kind of long-form fan project.
Even the faction shitposting was better. I remember guys like Tassa_Kay and VashtheStampede were pretty entertaining, even if they were total shitposters most of the time.
Maybe I'm just being a nostalgic faggot or maybe 4chan has lowered my standards.
>>48255583
You can do both.
Like say the new Medium Laser is 3 heat, 5 damage, 4/8/12 range. And that's all it does in Introductory rules. But for Tournament rules it can fire like that, or you can add 2 heat and get 5/10/15 range with ER mode, or fire it in Pulse mode for -2 to-hit, +1 hea, and 3/6/9 range. Maybe add Heavy mode for X2 heat, X2 damage, +1 to-hit, and 3/6/9 range. Consolidates the weapon list down from ER/Pulse/Heavy lasers just down to Lasers.
A/Cs are the same, Intro mode they only fire one shot for however much damage, advanced rules they all gain rapid-fire and variant ammo types.
>>48255562
>Except that they weren't just staying in their threads.
Any thread even vaguely related to the era got dragged into it.
>>48249537
Okay, so I ignored the Wars of Reaving because it sounded like a real mess, but are the Cloud Adders a thing now? Sarna hasn't updated anything on the Wars of Reaving for a lot of entries.
>>48255700
>but are the Cloud Adders a thing now?
Not yet, but it might get that way. Clan Star Adder basically came out of it on top with a ridiculously huge touman and tons of absorbed bloodnames.
>>48255700
Nope. It's just from the document up thread. They aren't real.
I don't think the Adders would bother with absorbing the Cloud Cobras either, the Cobras are two free votes in their favour in any Grand Council meeting and free troops since they just do what the Adders want.
Getting rid of them costs more than they gain.
>>48255713
>>48255709
>>48255654
Ah, I see. Why would you refer to them as anything other than their real clan name? Why cut the names in half like that? They're part of the victorious clan now, it's not like the winner absorbed the traditions of the loser.
Is Ilkhan inevitable? While I enjoy the Clans, I don't really want to live under them or see a galaxy ruled by them. That'd be worse than the technological stagnation we see under the Successor States.
>>48255744
Probably just something intended to spark annoyance, assuming the above outline is at least partly intended as a joke.
>>48255767
It's just so confusing.
>>48253829
Hey, I LIKE the Fire Mandrills.
>>48252139
Maybe the ilClan can be Clan Davion, who refound the Third Star League including the Clans. And then we introduce aliens.
>>48255793
In spite of their internal dysfunction or because of it?
>>48255744
>Is Ilkhan inevitable?
ilClan is the next big plot/era book, if they ever get around to releasing it. But it's been planned for a long time now and never come out.
The Clans winning doesn't seem realistic. Even if one of them does seize Earth nobody else will care. It will just spark further conflicts.
>>48252139
>tfw the Steel Wolves landed unopposed in 3131 and only had to face a company of mechs who weren't even from onworld
>Random people were able to smuggle in tanks and shit with no problems up to at least 3134
I mean Jesus Christ, it's a wonder some other trashborn yahoo just didn't drop by and plant a flag during that time.
>>48255844
>Even if one of them does seize Earth nobody else will care. It will just spark further conflicts.
Yeah. I mean it is their "win" condition but becoming IlClan doesn't win them literally everything else forever. It just makes them the new faction at the center of the map.
>>48255827
Because of it. I thought it would be real interesting to delve into why Kindraa are such hotheaded rivals with one another, and how other Clans are able to manipulate the Mandrill's kindraas such that the Clan as a whole was permitted to continue surviving because it was a useful puppet/scapegoat for other, more powerful Clans.
I mean, that's the only way it could possibly have survived so long. When stronger clans like Wolverine, Mongoose, and Burrock all got absorbed so much earlier, how could the fractious Fire Mandrills survive all the way up to the Wars of Reaving?
>>48255883
Well, to be fair, those three Clans committed far more grievous sins than Fire Mandrill ever did, if I recall rightly. The Mandrills never attempted to secede from Clan society, tried to justify ignoring Council rulings by twisting Nicholas Kerensky's words, or kept up a long-running secret association with the Dark Caste.
>>48255883
This reminds me. The best part of the Ice Hellions was when you got the snippets of them entering the IS during the early 3070's in the JHS books. You knew they were trying to escape some serious shit. Really, the Wars of Reaving were much more interesting when they were largely kept as a mystery.
Shame they published the book at all.
>>48255915
What's funny is that because of publishing timing, the stuff on the Homeworld Clans in A Time of War (which defaults to the mid-Jihad era around 3073 or so) assumes things are business as usual in the Homeworlds at tha ttime.
>>48255941
A Time of War didn't come out until after the Ice Hellion and Raven Migrations in the main plot books though. Plus we've know there were going to be weird things happening in the homeworlds then since Forever 67 because of the DA books.
So it's more of a straight up screwup isn't it? The only reason I'm not 100% sure is that I know AToW was in beta development and playtesting a long ass time, like almost as long as IO. So a bunch of it might have been written before the other books even though it actually came out later.
>>48255851
Yeah I found that odd too. Was fun reading about the Steel Wolves making their desperate hop to Terra while facing off the Highlanders, but landing on a completely undefended Terra with not even Republic aerospace assets making a fuss was full retard.
Sounds like Falcons could have taken it without a problem.
>>48255861
Hell, it's highly suspect even as a win condition among the Clans, it's just some random bullshit some crusaders made up.
>>48256170
Technically they all did; taking Terra back and starting a new Star League is the entire purpose of the Crusader camp as a whole. Wardens don't really care, though, that's true. Nor would these newfangled "Bastion" guys.
>>48256138
Wouldn't be so bad if Terra wasn't historically the most defended rock in the whole of human space.
>>48255861
It's not even a win condition really.
I mean, whoever declares themselves ilClan or holds Terra can't do anything with it. The Homeworlders Abjured all of the Clans in the IS and will give zero fucks what any of them say or do. The IS Clans don't have a formal Grand Council for the ilKhan to preside over any way.
If someone had become ilClan during the initial Invasion there would have been a riot. None of the Invaders would have accepted any of the others and they would have just been nickle and dime trialled into oblivion because of it.
>>48256250
>None of the Invaders would have accepted any of the others and they would have just been nickle and dime trialled into oblivion because of it.
Probably, yeah. Though such a Clan might well have held on regardless and actually enforced the position. If the Wolves could actually keep their exclusive rights to the Kerensky Bloodname after Nicky's death, anything's possible.
>>48249537
Wow, this is actually worse than some of the Star Wars Episode 8 "script leaks" I've read, it's just as fake though.
just my $0.02, but the main reason old star league collapsed, was that after Amaris was defeated, there was no one left from the Cameron dynasty to pick up the pieces.
The purpose ofhaving an ilClan could be to replace the Cameron dynasty with something more resilient at the head of the new star league.
IMO - the logical course of action for the next era would be to stabilise the setting with something.
The next part is just me having a nerdgasm with "my version" of events.
Suppose CSA, CCC, CC, and CSL do invade the inner sphere, along a fairly wide front with CSA in the middle, CSL going up against the Horses, Cobras against Falcons, and Coyotes against Ravens.
Steiner tries to recapture worlds held by the Falcons, but fails.
Meanwhile - as the second invasion juggernaut rolls closer, fighting a bloody war with RotS/Rasalhague troops (other clans stalemate themselves), Wolves assault Terra instead.
They are opposed by RotS, and the Smoke Jaguars, who rebuilt themselves after Levin released them from their obligation. So the big battle for Terra goes down between Wolves and Jags, the Wolves win, and Clan Wolf becomes ilClan.
CSA throw a fit, so Wolves, Jags, and Bears challenge them to trials of grievance to put them back in line.
We then have a second Reunification War, with Wolf, Bear, and Jag forces defeating each of the successor houses, and the successor states become districts of the New Star League. Falcons invade the homeworlds and take a chunk, still upset that Kerensky's pet clan beat them to it.
When the dust settles, the board looks something like this:
Clan Wolf controlls Terra and the worlds around it, as the ilClan.
Clan Smoke Jaguar controls some worlds close to Terra as part of the New League.
Rasalhague, Draconis, Suns, Capellan, Free Worlds, Lyran, and Skye are the districts of the New Star League.
Jade Falcons, Cloud Cobras, Hell's Horses, Star Adders, and Coyotes are present in the sphere as small territories, armed to the teeth.
>>48256494
continued:
From here, there is plenty of creative freedom, as most of the factions are intact in some way, or another.
All the "Districts" jockey for power, Lyrans want dominion over Skye, separatist movements within each district want to "return them to glory of being a successor state", CJF wants to replace Clan Wolf, the clans present + Raven Alliance still poke at each other in trials for goods and technology.
In other words - everyone is egligible to fight anyone, and have big plots behind the curtains, which is a fairly good place for a tabletop battle game to be.
And I get my favourite clan back.
>>48256494
>just my $0.02, but the main reason old star league collapsed, was that after Amaris was defeated, there was no one left from the Cameron dynasty to pick up the pieces.
>The purpose of having an ilClan could be to replace the Cameron dynasty with something more resilient at the head of the new star league.
The implication has always been that *someone* from the Winson line was a Cameron. Additionally, the Terran Hegemony worlds were a literal shambles. Best case scenario would have been decades to rebuild, time the TH didn't have. Even as the SLDF marched on Terra, the Houses were snapping up worlds that were easily absorbed, all in the name of "security" for those planets. But yes, it was all down to not having a Cameron there for sure.
>CSA throw a fit, so Wolves, Jags, and Bears challenge them to trials of grievance to put them back in line.
The Adders wouldn't give a fuck, since step one of "Operation: Fuck the IS" would be to annihilate the IS Clans.
>We then have a second Reunification War, with Wolf, Bear, and Jag forces defeating each of the successor houses, and the successor states become districts of the New Star League. Falcons invade the homeworlds and take a chunk, still upset that Kerensky's pet clan beat them to it.
I don't even. The Clans couldn't take on the IS at their functional "height" and you want them to do it at their ebb. Pls go and stay go.
5/10, you got your (you).
>>48256494
>>48256528
The main problem with clans is that they are teeny tiny. Their forces are limited by the small amount of bloodnames available and their proper old school castes for administration and institution of clan society are barely any bigger. It's a very impressive force considering the whole lot of them came from only a dozen barely habitable rocks in the deep periphery, but there's no way they could conquer and hold the whole IS. They never could.
They would have never been able to hold onto their gains during Revival either without all of C*'s generous administrative help. Even then, they couldn't impose clan society on most of their worlds.
I don't even know how the Wolves are currently holding onto the one section of Lyran space where the locals actually know how to fight competently along with the majority of the ultra militant pro-Marik mini states of the FWL. Not only that, they're apparently growing whole militia regiments on trees. It's crazy.
>>48256630
>The Clans couldn't take on the IS at their functional "height" and you want them to do it at their ebb.
i don't know about that - the Clans made short work of IS forces - the canon was always that IS survived on plot armour when Clans repeatedly underbid their forces at a "crucial" moment.
Still - the 3145 IS is not the same as 3050 IS. The HPG situation could be a major factor here.
Also - CSA coming in and just annihilating all the IS clans to start with is a surefire way to commit suicide - as was already pointed out - that kind of "shakeup" has been tried already with WFB end times and it backfired spectacularly.
As for homeworld clans abjuring the IS clans so they don't have to listen to anything the IS clans say - it's still "might makes right" with the clans.
Think of the Great Refusal, when the second Star League that the clans wanted to be masters of, basically told them to fuck off.
WizKids made a huge mess of the setting, and too much chaos is not good.
IMO the way to go forward is to clean up the universe without blowing it up, and stabilise the setting before moving forward.
That's why I think moving to 3250 and mirroring some of the old Star League/Succession Wars events is a good idea.
>>48256674
But they still made more strategic advances in one year, than the rest of the successor states combined in 250.
Plus - CSA is not exactly tiny, and their situation mirrors the disparity between invading clans and IS defenders in 3050.
IMO, one of the IS clans trying to cut them off by being the first clan to legitimately take Terra is a plausible strategy.
And if they (homeworld clans) pitch a fit and go total war instead, they might end up fighting the entire IS again, and the "tiny" part becomes relevant again.
>>48256716
>i don't know about that - the Clans made short work of IS forces
Third rate border forces to start with, followed by frontline units with worse equipment than them. Then by the end of the 50s, the Clans had to work for their wins, with the best of the IS surpassing the best of the Clans.
>Also - CSA coming in and just annihilating all the IS clans to start with is a surefire way to commit suicide - as was already pointed out - that kind of "shakeup" has been tried already with WFB end times and it backfired spectacularly.
The Adders have three fodder Clans to do their dying for them. Even then, the big takeaway the Homeworlds got from the Reaving was that the IS was poison, and it was best to burn it all down.
>As for homeworld clans abjuring the IS clans so they don't have to listen to anything the IS clans say - it's still "might makes right" with the clans.
Which since the IS Clans are going to hear about the HW ones first when they start razing their holdings means... what, to you?
>Think of the Great Refusal, when the second Star League that the clans wanted to be masters of, basically told them to fuck off.
And when the Second Star League collapsed, the Clans said "Oh look, the Refusal isn't binding anymore. Suck it Spheroids."
>WizKids made a huge mess of the setting, and too much chaos is not good.
So in response, you've decided to gut all the factions and yoke them to a Clan led Star League. Is this more, or less chaos than before? I'm confused.
>>48256630
>The implication has always been that *someone* from the Winson line was a Cameron.
If you define "always" as being from when CGL published the Klondike stuff then sure. But otherwise the oldest sources say outright that Amaris killed everyone with any blood tie to the Cameron line when he took over to prevent any legitimate heir coming forth to oppose him.
>I don't even. The Clans couldn't take on the IS at their functional "height" and you want them to do it at their ebb.
In 3049 the Clans had more Clusters than the IS, ComStar, Periphery, Mercs, and Pirates had Regiments. Four Clans in the space of two years carved out a quarter of the IS. On top of that they have more ASF than the preceeding forces combined plus their WarShip fleet gives them the advantage over the non-Clan factions.
You can go on about insurrections but BT history clearly shows it's only the front-line forces listed in FMs and the like that actually matter. Changing the paradigm like that and while things might make more sense you wind up with a setting that's not very BT.
What saves the IS really is that the Clans weren't united enough to come all at once. Coming in piecemeal as they did kept them safe.
>>48256823
>And when the Second Star League collapsed, the Clans said "Oh look, the Refusal isn't binding anymore. Suck it Spheroids."
Eh. To be fair by that point the political unity that allowed the Clans to make the Invasion happen was dead and gone by that point. Whether they considered the Refusal binding or not they couldn't get their shit together to do anything about it.
And ironically they were in that state because of the Crusaders constantly cutting their noses to spite their faces.
>>48253909
So do you think the Homeworlds are ever going to be totally abandoned? Will there just be one clan hanging out there?
>>48258570
They're a dump anyway. Who would want to live out there?
>>48258570
Abandoned as a plot point?
I don't find them very interesting and the fraction of the fanbase that does is very small. I'd rather they focus on the IS and its plotlines than do anything with the Homeworlds, even with ilClan.
>>48253909
Clan Star Cobras. Has a nice ring to it, don't you think?
>>48255548
The re-release of the Solaris rules packaged with Disney princess themed mechs, and the book with all the super cheese alternate setting stuff, like sentient mech AIs and D&D crossovers. (XTRO Royal Fantasy and Welcome to the Nebula California, if you cared about titles.)
>>48258660
I was meaning more all the clans leaving for the more interesting Inner Sphere - it seems to indicate that Star Adder is gearing up and will probably drag Cloud Cobra and Stone Lion along.
>>48255679
Giving a weapon three modes is more complicated than having three separate weapons which do the one separate thing each.
For a new baseline set of weapons you'd want to combine effects in a way which doesn't change the statline from turn to turn. Something like double damage and heat, range modifiers of -2/+1/+4, and an extended long range bracket.
>>48255494
>Why are the Phoenix Hawk, Stinger, and Valkyrie so lightly armed in comparison to their Macross/Robotech equivalents?
As exhibit A, I submit the Royal Phoenix Hawk.
That said, there are a couple of reasons. In BattleDroids, there were something like a dozen designs based on the Valk chassis, and only the ones that filled open design slots were kept through the transition. In addition, the Macross heavies are all significantly up-tonned and mostly have downgraded weaponry as well. Hell, even the Dougram stuff has had armament stripped - all of them but the Roundfacer had a pair of MGs in the left arm, which only the Thud retained (as an SRM-2).
Third, the rules for the weapons to properly represent Macross/Dougram weaponry only really showed up in the Civil War era or early Jihad. All the Valks should be ~45-50t and armed with a RAC-2, for example, but that would be kinda boring from a design standpoint. Likewise, the Thud should have a T-Bolt 10 with a single ton of ammo, an APGR, and a gauss rifle (and somehow fit that into forty tons, but..).
So.. yeah. They basically filled tactical and design niches without worrying about a straight conversion, and I don't blame them for it. But you have the tools now to do a "proper" conversion if you feel like it - see pic related.
>>48258902
If the Homeworld Survivors do migrate to the Inner Sphere, I wouldn't mind seeing the Escorpion Imperio or Hell's Horses nope out of the way and take the Homeworld dregs back all for themselves.
>>48256823
I meant suicide for battletech, not for csa. You don't go killing factions because it kills your fan base.
>>48259599
>Giving a weapon three modes is more complicated than having three separate weapons which do the one separate thing each.
Not really. Just adds more options on a turn-by-turn basis. Either way if you start playing TW-level games you have to learn a shit ton of rules, and even more for TacOps/Stratops/IntOps/CampOps-level play. At least it would cut down on the equipment list and rules bloat.
>>48260099
You can't kill the big ones, certainly, and pissing them off contributed in no small part to the stasis we're in for new plot. They literally went back to the Succession Wars to buy more time to come up with something new.
ilClan will be make or break for the game's future, and they know it.
>>48260219
>At least it would cut down on the equipment list
That's not a good thing and I would drop the game if they tried to makes things easier. Do you think Battletech is too hard? Go play Alpha Strike
>>48260792
Ah, the wild trolling faggot re-appears.
>>48260219
Honestly, I agree on the weapons front. Multi-modal lasers make some sense; shuffling range bands and adding burst-fire capability is already what just about everyone proposes for "fixing" autocannon.
>>48260792
>I didn't read the post but I wanna bitch about change and call you an Alpha Strike babby
Cutting down on equipment doesn't mean cutting down on complexity.
If a Laser can fire in Pulse, ER, Heavy, or Normal mode it doesn't mean complexity has been removed. It just means you've eliminated Pulse, ER, Heavy and Normal lasers in favour of a single weapon.
>>48261024
>Ah, the wild trolling faggot re-appears.
That guy is probably trolling, but I would also personally not be as interested in a cut-down equipment list. I can see why some folks would be, and it would be good for getting fresh blood into the game, but I personally prefer my big derpy shopping list of shit to slap on my 'Mechs.
>>48249088
A friend and I ordered the introductory box set. Is there a recommended way that we could split the models between us?
>>48250213
Is there any mech that says "fighter" better than a Wolverine?
>>48261525
I said it before, but the Awesome is the kind of 'Mech you draw a line on the ground with the RL, then back up behind it and proudly say "This far you may come but no farther."
>>48261525
Depends, do jet fighters count?
>>48260219
>Not really. Just adds more options on a turn-by-turn basis.
I don't mean to compare a 'Mech with 3 multi-mode weapons against a 'Mech with multiple separately-moded weapons; I mean that a vanilla medium laser is simpler than a weapon which switches between pulse or ER or Heavy. This kind of simplicity is important because the baseline weapons should be designed to encourage baseline play: put the focus on maneuver and strategy across multiple turns, not on optimization within individual turns; and player decisions should be reserved for things which affect the state of the board for longer than a single phase (movement, staggered fire, etc.).
>Either way if you start playing TW-level games you have to learn a shit ton of rules, and even more for TacOps/Stratops/IntOps/CampOps-level play.
So multi-modal weapons aren't better than the existing system where players graduate from IntroTech to Tourney Tech to Dark Age. They're worse in that they make it harder to build 'Mechs which *don't* have those options (which affects how interesting force building can get, and makes it harder for players to ignore options they don't want).
>At least it would cut down on the equipment list and rules bloat.
Unlikely. The current weapons bloat happened despite niches already being full (a common complaint is that every new weapon is a sidegrade or downgrade instead of something truly new). If the developers want to churn product, they're going to add weapons no matter what the first set is like, and making that first set more complex may only encourage them to make subsequent weapons even more complex.
>>48260792
I think the long equipment list makes the game easier.
>>48261173
Yeah. It's not so much that I mind the list being long, I just wish the items on it were more distinct.
>>48261367
here's some informal recommendations, people seem to like NEA's better than the other ones. if you want more extensive explanation of why these "feel good" I'm sure someone can post the full doc.
>>48262028
>>48256756
>But they still made more strategic advances in one year, than the rest of the successor states combined in 250.
I think the FedCom allies did better in the 4th war tbqh. Around 170 worlds taken including many industrial worlds of value, such as Tikonov.
The Clans mostly took outback class worlds with a handful of value. How many worlds did they even take total? Like 70-something for the Wolves, 20-something for the Jaguars, etc. Mediocre.
I don't mean this in a "faction strong" manner but I wish the Free Worlds had gotten more face time in the novels back when they were printing them. After reading a friend's copy of "Field Manual: Free Worlds League" I have to say their regiments have the most character of almost any I've read about in the fluff.
>>48262750
You know you want some of dat sweet purple bird, anon.
>>48262837
I'm really not a fan of the waifu meme stuff though. There's a point where we've got to stop and all that jazz.
>>48252469
>not wanting your bloodline to continue to strengthen your clan
literally chalcas
>>48262723
>The Clans mostly took outback class worlds with a handful of value
Were Tamar or Sudeten even worth anything?
>>48263023
>There's a point where we've got to stop and all that jazz.
Agreed. Once every other faction and their fans are wiped out and the Capellan Confederation regains its rightful place as ruler of the Star league.
>>48253829
>not liking clan GOTTAGOFAST
>>48255218
No, the guy who got shot put him in it.
Was Duke Vedet Brewster entirely wrong in having disdain for Clan Wolf during Hammerfall?
From what it said at one point, Alaric turned a surrender into a massacre when the wolves supposedly attacked forces attempting to surrender to Brewsters's Hesperus Guards.
>>48261024
>>48261078
Sorry, I didn't meant to sound like a cunt. What I really meant is that I am fine with the equipment size and would like it to grow in a frequency higher than it is growing now.
Fuck, I am a AS player and I didn't meant as an insult. I think, however, that people who think BT have too many equipments would probably like AS better.
The multi mode equipment is a good idea, but as an addition and not as substitution.
Again, sorry for my previous message
>>48261663
The Awesome is truly awesome
>>48263913
You can never have too much disdain for a Clan.
Plus the Wolves are so bastardized and tainted it's hard to take them seriously.
>>48262750
I was just reading that and man, after reading the one for the Draconis Combine, its shocking how much more interesting the Free World League is.
Shame the FWL got blown the fuck out recently.
>>48263079
And can you tell me one other thing about them aside from go fast?
>>48264711
and yet they still have kerensky's legacy all to themselves
>>48264758
They're also Clan EYE'M THE STRONGEST Which is really WHY they ended up getting rekt in the end.
>>48264791
And that and five C-bills will buy them a drink from JavaPulse Generators
>>48264814
>not respecting the blood of the Founder
maximum freebirth
>>48264843
>the blood of the guy who abandoned tens of millions in the Hegemony to die and his psycho furry son
Wew
So, how many bloodnames would generally be present in a trinary of an Invading force?
Making a force for a campaign, and just trying to figure out some fluff for the unit.
>>48265154
>implying they didn't deserve to die for supporting the Successor Lords and breaking up the League.
>>48264758
Uh...they had a weird zellbrigen variant where they start a battle attacking en masse, then bid for the right to finish an opponent off individually.
>>48265192
What's the Trinary's parent cluster, and which Clan? Generally the more prestigious the unit, the more warriors in it will be sporting Bloodnames.
>>48265192
Between 1 and 3, and most commonly 2 in a Trinary. You might see up to 5-6-ish for very prestigious units (Golden Keshik, for example). On "average"**, Star Captain is as high as you can possibly reach without a Bloodname, so a good proportion of those will have Bloodnames, and obviously everyone higher-ranked will as well. You may see 1 Star Commander in the Trinary with a Bloodname, but having both of them Bloodnamed is somewhat uncommon. Ordinary warriors with Bloodnames are very rare, since you're not going to be nominated without a good record of service, and the amount it takes to get that will generally make you an officer simultaneously.
Again, this is "on average". A few clusters in each clan will have more, a few will have less.
**I'm not going through the Jade Falcon and Wolf phonebooks for a more detailed breakdown.
>>48265201
Even if you respect Papa Kerensky, the bloodline can't be that great since it spawned Nicky.
>>48264758
They were to fast to live and to young to die?
Claners without a cause.
>>48264711
I don't I had hello respect for some of the really oddball Clans, too bad they killed all the interesting ones.
>>48253829
Yes, they killed everyone interesting and kept the most boring, I'd gladly have clan Timothy Leary, or clan James Dean back over the Coyotes
>>48259817
>Hell, even the Dougram stuff has had armament stripped - all of them but the Roundfacer had a pair of MGs in the left arm, which only the Thud retained (as an SRM-2).
All but the Bigfoot, you mean. And yet hilariously enough the Battlemaster has arm MGs. And the Thud retains the arm MGs as arm MGs, the SRM 2 is in the RT with the LRM.
>>48264758
Hatred of drug use due to an early incident involving some of their warriors using amphetamines? Pack dueling?
>>48266810
>Hatred of drug use due to an early incident involving some of their warriors using amphetamines?
Yet they apparently had one of the highest usage rates of EI implants as well, lol
>>48266839
Actually taking drugs is too slow for them, they need their fixes permanently installed.
So I hear in the early days a lot more was made of the whole "Mechwarriors as errant knights" thing. That so?
>>48267727
To an extent.
In the 3rd and 4th SW, a lot of MechWarriors were hereditary nobility who owned their ride.
The Clan Invasion and responses to it shifted that more towards professional soldiers with state-owned machines, though MechWarrior families still held a lot of power.
>>48268152
During the 3rd and 4th SWs didn't a lot of mech technology also become lostech? That would kind of explain why mechwarriors had that sort of status, since they'd be looked at as somewhat elite with rare and powerful weapons.
>>48264082
No worries. There's been a lot of /pol/ trolling the last couple of threads and you'd harshed my mellow a bit. 'Tis all good.
I feel that having a fixed mode for the multi-modal lasers in Intro play, then in TL allowing you to choose a fire mode at the end of each turn (like switching off heat sinks works) would strike a nice balance between encouraging foresight and offering options.
I also feel that the game, despite its breadth, is kind of weighted down by years of unretconned, improperly-balanced design choices made, some of them, before the fucking construction rules had even finished solidifying. It's like the AeroTech problem, though much less severe - thirty years of no-retcon, broken rules they've had to patch and re-patch with ever-newer gear that somehow has to be worse than every other option. And though I don't trust them not to fuck it up (this IS Catalyst we're talking about), it's still a raw and bleeding canker on the game.
>>48268321
The primary wrecking of shit occurred in the 1st and 2nd SWs, the 3rd mainly just saw the gradual deterioration of things, being over a century long and mostly small conflicts, skirmishes and raiding. The 4th was basically right around the tech renaissance's beginning.
But yes, that is part of it, particularly why being dispossessed (losing your mech) was such a big deal, because it would be harder to get a new one. But all the space feudalism and nobily and everything which is a big factor goes back to before the Star League, and before battlemechs. And all of that is still there in the Successor States, it just isn't paid much attention to anymore, probably in part because the focus has shifted to a constant string of high intensity conflicts, with any low intensity periods like the 3rd SW where the could focus more on internal things being glazed over quickly so they can get to the next big thing.
>>48269098
Jesus, thank you. It feels like if you point out the fact that a ton of the equipment wasn't even remotely balanced when it was introduced people act like you dug up and shat on their grandmother's corpse.
>>48269158
I'd say I wish that things could go back to that kind of low-intensity stuff, but after the last attempt at just that sort of thing (being Dark Age)...eh. My faith is low.
>>48269098
>>48269221
Agreed.
Though having a ton of laser modes doesn't actually reduce game complexity any. If anything it adds more because it's easier to track individual weapon types.
And these days it's best to avoid adding a lot of things to remember if the game is ever gonna grow rather than continually shrink. It might not please the grogs but tastes really have changed a lot for the average gamer, especially with a lot of them funnelling out of GW and finding they don't have to remember a fuckton of special rules for everything in almost every other game going. And at least the games with a ton of complexity tend to do data management way better than BT, and that helps massively and would be a great way to make the game more accessible again.
Not that it'll ever happen.
>>48269288
I think really the big problem isn't strictly even having a constant string of high intensity conflict, just the fact that they seem obsessed with the idea, especially now, that everybody must be fighting everywhere at once, instead of having things go hot in one part of space, while leaving things simmering with small raids and intrigues and squabbles between nobles and shit on the other side of the sphere.
>>48269098
>broken rules they've had to patch and re-patch with ever-newer gear that somehow has to be worse than every other option
The "worse than every other option" stuff is mainly a fetish they have for crap gear and penalties, or in some cases just forgetting that construction itself is part of the balance of things.
The actual patchy kind of stuff is just somewhat gimped because they almost always refuse to actually make it totally better than what it's supposed to fix, like LACs getting nerfed ranges. That the LBX 10 exists at all is a fucking miracle.
Has Solaris been a part of the fluff since the beginning?
>>48271127
that depends on how you define "beginning"
it didn't get mentioned in the ancientmost Battledroids stuff, but it was a part of the setting from roughly ~1985-ish on. some of the earliest novels featured it prominently.
so, after the very earliest sourcebooks, the battledroids/black widow era, it was a thing.
So technically it wasn't from the VERY beginning, but for all but the oldest coldest grogs and obscure collectors, it was a basic part of the setting
>>48271236
>Battledroids
>"hahaha what"
>look it up on Sarna
>holy shit it really was called that originally
Man, FASA were really big on cribbing from outside sources in the day, weren't they?
>>48271940
At least no big legal kerfuffle came from that one.
>>48269288
>>48269419
The issue with that is that the factions that get written about the most attract the most fans, and then when a faction has a lot of fans there's a good economic reason to keep them in the limelight so it stays on the same limited number of factions all the time- the FedSuns, Falcons, and Capellans dominate the old novels and when strawpolls are done on the OF those blow everyone else out of the water, which is also my experience IRL.
EVERYTHING IS ON FIRE ALL THE TIME, CGL style, is a bit over the top... but at least all the main factions are doing shit. Of the two options, that's the one they've shown they'll give page time to factions other than the big three from earlier in, and given the current spread of fiction writers I can't say I have any great faith in their ability or willingness to spread the spotlight around.
>>48269414
>It might not please the grogs but tastes really have changed a lot for the average gamer
Unfortunately this. The reality, however much long-time players will resist the idea, is that BT is woefully out of touch with the modern market on every front. Rules are convoluted and crunchy, the game takes a long time to resolve unless you're familiar with the rules or are on MegaMek, it's hex-based instead of terrain based, most of the minis look like shit but that will only change if IWM feels like it, etc.
Much as I hate to say it, something like Alpha Strike is the direction BT needs to head in to have any chance of survival. I'm just extremely sceptical of AS the way it stands since the rules were so terrible when it released that it boarded on broken, and while things have improved it's not there yet after three years and still isn't available as a boxed set for starting players to get them into the game.
>>48272878
Uh, bruh? The name was changed to "BattleTech" for the 2e boxed set because Lucasfilms leaned on them over "droid" being trademarked.
Okay, they just changed the name and moved on, so no "big" kerfuffle, but in light of later events, it was probably a bad omen.
Speaking of legal kerfuffles, is there any basis to the story that the great purge of the Unseen was initiated by people playing Mechwarrior 2 and going "son of a bitch, look at the Warhammer and the Marauder"?
>>48274368
Neither of those and IIRC none of the Unseen even appear in MW2/MW2 Mercs/GBL.
The game was published a year after the court case any way.
>>48274608
>Neither of those and IIRC none of the Unseen even appear in MW2
They do appear, in IIC versions at least, in MW2 and GBL. I can't remember if they were in Mercenaries, though.
>>48274368
No truth. HG pressed their suit after FASA sued a toy company for plagiarizing the Timber Wolf after a toy deal fell through.
FASA thought they owned the rights to visually use the unseen, but the company that sold them those rights had no authority to do so.
>>48274711
The IICs aren't really Unseen though. FASA just got rid of them because they were outsourced to Victor Musical Industries and didn't want to run the risk of some shit being pulled on them in the future. The, like Shimmy's work, are different enough from the actual Unseen not to be IP-infringing.
>>48274760
Actually Harmony Gold doesn't really have the rights either. It's just IP law. Whoever has the deepest pockets gets the better lawyers and wins, regardless of actual facts. Harmony Gold is very zealous about defending their turf and has yet to run into anyone who has enough money and the inclination to test them in court.
>>48274996
Shimmyseens and Reseens are good and all (well, some of the reseens anyway), but I wish Hasbro would squash them like a bug. What good is being a gigantic monster company if you can't throw your power around once in a while?
>>48275030
They did fuck their shit up on a Transformers toy HG was REEEEEing about. I think it was Jetfire, but I just chuckled at HG losing and lost interest beyond that.
But it's basic economics. Even Jap companies that are sort of interested in releasing their stuff in the West recognise that the court costs are going to cut so heavily into their profits that there's not much of a point on any individual product, so each new Macross series they make just stays over there. Which in turn means the IP isn't popular enough in the West for anyone to give a shit.
If Macross somehow became a major hit and Hasbro or Topps figured they could make a shit ton on merchandising they'd take them to court to get it. There's just no money to be made, so they're not interested.
>>48274996
>The, like Shimmy's work, are different enough from the actual Unseen not to be IP-infringing.
Indeed, as they were made as redesigns of the originals for the Japanese version of MW1 in the first place. Though what became the Griffin IIC was the Battlemaster.
I actually like the Shimmyseens way more than the unseens
>>48276048
I like the Alexseens.
>>48276048
Not like there's a huge difference between some of them. The Shadow Hawk went from being Dougram to being a bootleg Dougram.
Yeah I know quite a few guys who like battletech in a general way (like myself) but the Rules, the Hex Map, and the awful looking miniatures have prevented them from actually playing the game.
>>48272928
>Be me, never played board game but interested in it because of Mechwarrior games.
>See group at FLGS and try to engage them in conversation.
>Guy who runs the group/campaigns and email list refuses to speak to me, or take my contact information. It wasn't even like he was playing a game, just fucking around on his phone.
>Trenchcoat and Fedora wearing guy (seriously looked like he just got back from shooting up his highschool) bragging about who he never spends a dime on battletech, then points to pile of MLP toys he uses to proxy battlemechs. then complains about how no FLGS in the area carries Battletech stuff.
>Unbathed hambeast grog tries to explain battle-tech by comparing it to 40k. I had told him that I hadn't played 40k in like 15 years and didn't care to begin with, but this did not stop him.
>Something about no aliens in Battletech prompts one of them to start into his conspiracy theory about aliens and the moon landing or something but I was trying to disengage from the conversation and group without being rude at that point so I didn't catch most of it.
Thankfully I haven't seen them around that much and some other guys are going to start an Alpha strike campaign soon so maybe I'll play some Battletech before I die.
>>48269414
Honestly I'm not even a fan of the "multiple laser modes" shit, just bring things back to an introtech level of amount of equipment, only actually make it balanced and useful as opposed to mixing together clearly superior and gimped shit.
That's not to say that everything should be the same, but weapons should at least fill at least one role effectively. And it has to be a role that actually comes up in play, not some theoretical thing that never makes sense on the tabletop.
>>48272958
Did they even lean on them? I heard it was changed pre-emptively, before there was even an issue raised.
>>48272928
>is that BT is woefully out of touch with the modern market on every front
Ahahahaha no. Look at Star Fleet Battles if you want to see a game that still exists now that's out of touch on *every* front. At least Battletech has made an ATTEMPT at a modern presentation style in its books.
>>48277671
I'm somewhat with this man. Ground up from introtech on, rebalance all the things. I still want all the advanced and experimental things, but I want changes to fundamental basic of the game. Just the autocannon rebalances that have been discussed in these threads alone would be awesome. Let weapons and gear have clear roles with the super advanced shit like ATMs be multi-role.
>>48278316
I still wish MRM's would get a little something extra. Personally I think something like a bonus to the cluster hits roll against stationary targets would be flavorful and situational enough that they wouldn't suddenly become overpowered.
>>48277593
>Yeah I know quite a few guys who like battletech in a general way (like myself) but the Rules, the Hex Map, and the awful looking miniatures have prevented them from actually playing the game.
The complex, scalable rules and hex maps are >why< I play the game - it's a combat sim, not a "modern" low-impact game, and it incorporates better into a campaign than most. I know everybody's got their own flavor, but BT is mine, and that ain't changing.
Now, on the minis front? Oh Christ, that's a can of worms. But FASA needed about twelve more steps of artist feedback. There are good designs in every book, and some of Plog's more recent stuff is really good. But there's soooo much utter trash, especially in 3055, 3067, and the Potato Age sections of every book. Part of the problem is the incredibly rigid requirements in TRO art, part is the lack of backs on 90% of the designs, part is just that Loose and Lewis's fuck-ups were kept right along with their genius designs. A lot of the Jihad-era re-re-redesigns of BD stuff are actually really good, although the Firebee could use the RA moved back and down a little. The "shard" style of art for all the other AoW stuff also blends poorly with Big Daddy Mack, but doesn't look too bad on its own.
>all comments are about awful players
Um, have you been playing in Tacoma? Because I swear to God I know at least two of those people and they (plus the store's attitude) are why I stay in Olympia. Although Hengist and Fenny are much less dickish than the group-runner you describe. If you do want to play in Oly I promise not to be a douche.
>>48278428
Also, I really want more than the four 4e redesigns to see minis (Catapult #3 and the "Fatlas" from PlasTech are both based on the 4e designs, while the Primitive Dervish and Dragon II both crib heavily from them as well). I could give the Enforcer and the Zeus's high collar a miss, but everything else is gold.
>>48278479
sheet two. Lookit dat Spider - it's several really simple tweaks, but the overall effect is to make it look much more vicious and swift. Same with the Cyclops; it's suddenly much spookier (giving it the "invisible cockpit" thing the Mackie had going on is a really nice lineage touch IMO).
>>48278518
I've said it before, but bloody hell I love the Phoenix Wright Quickdraw and the brick shithouse Awesome.
>>48249088
How do people fell about
Aries Games Minis?
Are they good quality?
>>48279134
Not really sure what you are asking, they just sell IWM, Reaper, and CGL stuff (i.e. minis you can buy anywhere). Unless they have a hidden shop somehwere on the registered user locked part of their site.
>>48279288
So is the IWM good quality?
>>48275130
Fairly safe to assume it was Jetfire, since the original toy was a renamed Valkyrie from Macross.
>>48276048
>>48276280
I know it's heresy, but I agree, the Shimseens and the MWO remakes are better than the originals IMO. Given that I started playing back in the dark ages pre-3050, that's saying something.
>>48278238
Given how hyper-aggressive Lucasfilm's legal department was? I'm sure they got a C&D.
>>48279546
Iron Wind Metals is pretty much your only option for the majority of mechs. Introbox plastics, some Ral Partha EU, and various fan project/Russian friends, make up the others. IWM is getting some better scultpting recently but as a whole the sculpts are incredibly dated. Lots of new stuff coming soon™ though
>>48279134
>How do people fell about
>Aries Games Minis?
>Are they good quality?
The guy who runs Aries is one of us. He's also one guy, so things run a little slow, but he's straight-up selling Iron Wind and Reaper stuff at a discount, and with much cheaper shipping than IWM. I go with him and then if there's a problem call up IWM customer service, but so far I've been satisfied buying from him.
>>48279546
Yes and no. Some of the molds - Rakshasa, Mackie, etc. - are worn out or very old, but the actual casting quality is generally decent and if there's a problem they'll ship you replacements with very little fuss or mess. There are some bad or silly sculpts, of course, but what you see on the site is generally the quality of mini you get.
>tfw my crippled ass has already gone out twice to different sides of town to shop and I still have to finish brownies from scratch for my wife's birthday before she gets home. At 1730 PDT.
Warhansa has done another Locust variant.
I guess that's going on the shopping list along with the Black Knight and Banshee and anything else that comes to mind.
>>48280884
Not half fucking bad. Damn, I love our Russian comrades.
>>48280884
That is one nice bug.
what are some good mechs to use in homogenous lances?
>>48279605
>Fairly safe to assume it was Jetfire, since the original toy was a renamed Valkyrie from Macross.
Nope. Just legends.
>>48272958
>The name was changed to "BattleTech" for the 2e boxed set because Lucasfilms leaned on them over "droid" being trademarked.
Mechwarriors were also called "DroidWarriors". Wouldn't *that* have been a weird thing to get used to?
>>48282927
Good mechs? Or canonically approved mechs?
Good, something with tons of variants that are all sorta different, so Hunchbacks, Marauders, or omnis (personally, I really like the Avatar and Blackjack omnis for homogenous lances). Of course, lots of Clan omnis are good at this as well, but I sort of assumed IS based on you asking about lances.
As for canonical homogenous lances, there's the famous "Panthers and Dragons, all day, erry day" lances from the Combine. I think the argument exists for all Vindicator and all Centurion lances from their specific powers. I bet the Lyrans would actually field all Hunchback lances too (though I don't know if those are a thing, in-universe). I don't know what the Mariks would use for homogenous lances, nor any of the Periphery powers (all Warhammer battle lances from the Taurians, maybe? I dunno).
