So. Plasma and some weapons are effective against light tanks.
Here's the thing, There aren't any light tanks in the 40k universe.
>>47673358
That's a nice rust effect.
![[Suspicious].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/TZA142H.jpg "[Suspicious].jpg")
>>47673358
>Valhallan decal
>Predator Tank
>mfw
Also, "light tanks" include things like Chimeras and other tank-chassis vehicles like the Basilisk. "Tank" in this case is a chassis designation rather than a specific combat role for a frame.yes, that's not how it works in the real world, but you can deal with it
>>47673422
So..
>The Leman Russ Executioner variant differs from the standard pattern Leman Russ in that its main weapon is the powerful Plasma Destroyer, as opposed to the Battle Cannon. The Executioner is a powerful anti-armour tank, but its temperamental main weapon makes it unsuited for engagements of long duration.
The tanks that it hunts are just Chimeras?
>>47673461
I've chosen to seldom believe the codex's over-exaggerated fluff. It is nice, if a little cringy, but always read it with 40kg of salt
>>47673461
most alien tanks would be considered light tanks, as they're usually AV12 at best
>>47673461
There are more tanks than human tanks, anon. Even then, most regular human tanks have weak side/rear armor. Plasma guns v. rear armor is way scarier than you'd think it would be.
Ditch Plasma
Ditch Autocannon
Get Blastmaster
>>47673682
My little rhino.
Vehicle classification in 40k differs from IRL friend.
Recon/IFV/APC = Salamander, Rhino, Chimera, etc.
Tank Destroyers/Assault Guns = Vindicator, Thunderer, Laser TD
Light Tanks = Predator, most Eldar vehicles, most tau vehicles
Medium Tanks = Lemans Russ and variants, Hammerheads, Fireprisms
Heavy Tanks = Malcador and variants, Land Raider and variants
Super-heavy tanks = Baneblades and such
Plasma is more than capable of engaging light tanks and decent against medium tanks provided it's not trying to engage from the front.
I don't say an AT4 isn't an anti-tank weapon simply because it won't penitrate modern MBTs from the front glacis.
>>47673846
If you wanted a better AT weapon because your facing space marines or imperial guard.
What would you use? lascannons or vaq.
>>47673422
>marine vehicles have planet names on them other than their home world
What a terrible idea.
>>47673846
>Light Tanks = Predator, most Eldar vehicles, most tau vehicles
How are those light tanks, when they're the primary fighting vehicles of those factions?
>Lemans Russ and variants
More like infantry tanks judging by their usage and speed.
>I don't say an AT4 isn't an anti-tank weapon simply because it won't penitrate modern MBTs from the front glacis.
But you do say a Predator is a light tank because it's not a Russ.
>>47674082
No, because a Predator (lorewise) supposed to be comparatively fast and mobile. You can undersling it from a Thunderhawk, say.
>>47674082
Marines don't use armor in the same way guard does. Yes it is their Fri Mary fighting vehicle but it is designed to keep pace with a fast mobile strike army. It's air deployable, moderately armed and armored and fulfills a fire support/flanking role to the Marine armored core units which are land raiders.
A closer real life equivalent would be the Sheridan (air droppable tank to support paratroopers) or possibly the M3 Bradley as its a CFV.
It's about the combat role the vehicle fulfills not that it's the primary fighting vehicle.
>>47674225
*primary
Wtf auto correct
>>47673358
Taurox
Tauros
Venator
Salamander
Hellhound
Banewolf
Devil Dog
Chimera
All light tanks.
>>47674244
I'd argue that only the hellhound and variants are light tanks.
The others are IFV/CFVs
>>47674285
>>47674244
But I'm just being pedantic. Plasma is definantly effective against them and they more than just apcs
>>47674120
>>47674225
Plenty of modern MBTs are quite fast as well and I don't know if I'd make it "light" because it can be airlifted, since they airlift titans and super-heavies as well.
Lets see what the fluff has to say about the vehicle:
>Predator battle tank
>The Predator is the main battle tank of the Space Marines. Broadly based upon the Rhino STC, the Predator sacrifices transport capacity for improved frontal armour and heavy turret-mounted armament. The result is a well-armed and mobile tank, equally capable of holding ground or spearheading armoured assaults into the most heavily defended of enemy territory.
>The efficiency and durability of the Predator design are attested to by its long and proud history. Indeed, the records of the Adeptus Mechanicus indicate that the Predator was instrumental in establishing mankind's dominance of the galaxy as far back as the Dark Age of Technology.
>It is small wonder that the Predator has become a byword for armoured might
Truly the description of a light tank if I ever saw one.
>>47674082
A Predator is not going to fair well in a slug match against a Russ provided they are both geared towards AV load outs. They are really not equivalent in their use and role.
If orks only had trukks as vehicles it doesn't suddenly make trukks an MBT just because it's their "primary fighting vehicle"
Guys, I'm pretty sure you're taking this too seriously. I think OP was just making a bad joke.
>>47674322
Just because one MBT can't go toe to toe with another MBT does not make it any less of an MBT.
Also, trukks aren't tanks.
>>47674244
>Taurox
>Tauros
>Venator
>tanks
>>47673461
>The tanks that it hunts are just Chimeras?
Somehow, you read the words "anti-armour tank with low staying power" and got that it is a weak main gun.
>>47674319
Let me explain it for you as you cannot grasp tread-head terms well.
Things like light, medium, heavy, and so forth are not terms used with things like Main Battle Tank. That is a modern term for a modern usage of armour. The terms like light tank come from the first half of the 20th century. MBT is not a term in that era. No army today has a stratification of tanks anymore. If it is your primary fighting armored unit with a big gun it's an MBT, doesn't matter if 80 years ago it was called light, medium, or whatever. Fluff or no, the role a Predator tank fulfills is that of Light Tank. Doesn't mean it sucks, doesn't mean it's inefdective. It means it is a Light Tank in comparison to the Imperium at large.
No
>>47674319
Air drop means can be deployed straight into combat. Air lift just means transport via air.
They don't air drop super heavies or titans champ.
>>47674064
It's moreso the fact that the vehicle has no other identifiers that suggest its allegiance save "Valhalla," as well as just having the Guard version of the Aquila on it.
>>47674336
I'm aware trukks aren't tanks.
The argument was since the Predator was the primary fighting vehicle it cannot be a light tank. That is incorrect. Just because it is the main battle tank doesn't mean it isn't a light tank by traditional standards.
>>47674064
They are a list of where they had served, anon.
>>47673358
every 40k tank is a light tank compared to modern day tanks
>>47674319
Lets look at the fluff shall we
>The Leman Russ Executioner variant differs from the standard pattern Leman Russ in that its main weapon is the powerful Plasma Destroyer, as opposed to the Battle Cannon. The Executioner is a powerful anti-armour tank
Sure sounds like an anti-armour tank to me.
Good thing we go by hyperbolic fluff descriptions than actual performance and use huh?
>>47674740
Sure if your facing an army of wooden tanks, Hell if its true that it can't kill anything that isn't light armor then the sherman tank would be able to kill it for sure.
>>47674404
Titans literally deploy from gigantic drop pods
>>47675476
but they don't drop those pods INTO combat, hence it being equivilant of air lifting not combat dropping
>>47675476
Stand by for titan fall.
So Hellhounds and Salamanders do not exist?
Also the Predator is the 40k equivalent of a tougher M8 armoured gun system. Its a fire support vehicle for an air mobile force.
>>47674373
Then why do Light and Main Battle Tanks exist at the same time with one another? We have light tanks today. There's armies making light tanks that are entering service in a few years.
>>47674404
>>47675513
That sure looks like Cadians and titans unloading from a transport vehicle to fight heretics on the Tyrok Fields.
>>47674433
I'll believe it's a light tank the moment you find any fluff telling us it's a light tank. So far a main battle tank is a term thrown around the fluff left and right.
>>47676041
>Tyrok Fields
leviathans are ground-based vehicles, not space transport ships
>>47676041
yet there is no titan drop pod in your picture
>>47674740
Good thing we go by crunch instead of fluff huh?
Also, who doesn't take Executioners against 2+ armour?
>>47676081
That's not a Leviathan on the background. But that is a Warlord titan marching alongside the Cadians.
The leviathan is on the enemy side.
>>47676096
Tyrok fields was largely just a big leviathan-off. The volscani rammed their superheavy transports into the cadian high command so they could disable the void shields and board.
Creed's regiment and the titans marched over from another muster point. No space ships at all.
>>47676113
Then why is there a space ship in the picture from which the troops are disembarking from?
>>47676089
Because muh vanquisher, plasma does the samething on the anit armor tank but with splash damage.
You know what, we should nerf that so that theres only vanquisher cannons.
We should also make plasma useless.
>>47673461
>>47673358
Trying to draw direct parallels between 40k fluff and rules is retarded and won't tell you anything useful.
This is the game where a krak missile, that has an overwhelming chance of doing absolutely nothing against a person in Terminator armour, but will blow a truck to pieces, and at the same time a power weapon that will fuck the terminator every time gives 0 bonus against the truck.
The lore is inconsistent, and the rules are both shitty and aiming for playability rather than simulating the lore.
Stop acting like you figured out something clever every time you catch one of the situations where they rule/fluff discrepancy is retarded, because pro tip, that's all the fucking time.
>>47673422
This is my preferred reasoning.
>>47676214
>AP2 gives 0 bonus against the truck
Nice lies there.
>>47673381
For you
>>47673846
>Land Raider
>Heavy Tank
>Carries 10 dudes and doesn't even has a turret
The Land Raider is an IFV, and a MkI Tank cranked up to eleven (the Spartan is even further up), because british.
Also, the weight classification (Heavy, Superheavy) varies depending on the time setting. Tanks considered heavy in early eras would be considered Medium on latter settings and such.
Here, have a flame tank
>>47679564
Lacking a turret and having transport capacity doesn't negate your status as a tank. The Stridsvagn 103 doesn't have a turret and it's an MBT. Merkava carries troops and it's an MBT.
Transporting people is not the only function of Land Raiders. It functions as an effective combat vehicle as well.
>>47674404
>>47675513
>>47676145
>>47676113
>An airlift is the organized delivery of military supplies or military personnel primarily via military transport aircraft.
>Depending on the situation, airlifted supplies can be delivered by a variety of means. When the destination and surrounding airspace is considered secure, the aircraft will land at an appropriate airport or airbase to have its cargo unloaded on the ground. When landing the craft, or distributing the supplies to a certain area from a landing zone by surface transportation is not an option, the cargo aircraft can drop them in mid-flight using parachutes attached to the supply containers in question
Airlifting is merely transporting stuff by airplane, without specifying wheter you're dropping the thing on your base or deep striking on top of the enemy's head.
Not only stuff in 40k has to embark and disembark from orbiting spacecraft (meaning EVERYTHING is airliftable), but that's precisely the method of deploying superheavies.
And yeah, Titans deploy on drop pods.
>>47674064
They're for signifying past glories and campaigns.
>>47679752
>The Stridsvagn 103 doesn't have a turret and it's an MBT
> It is the only main battle tank and the only tank of any kind since the World War II era to dispense with a turret.
Exceptions =! the norm.
>Merkava carries troops and it's an MBT
So did the Mark I.
What I'm going at is that the Land Raider is the best IFV, one that can tackle anything, originally developed as an environmentally sealed explorator vehicle.
The Predator and the Land Raider are the iconic space marine tanks, but IMO, what sets the Predator as the space marine MBT over the more powerful Land Raider IFV is the fact that Predators are used in armoured assaults, while the Land Raider's role is to carry space marines into battle and give them fire support.
As in, Land Raiders don't usually start the game empty (mine do, because fuck wimpy ass Predators).
I'd quote the SM 7E codex, but it's a lot. It always describes them as disgorging space marines and fighting alongside them.
>>47680460
>originally developed as an environmentally sealed explorator vehicle
the land raider was originally designed as a main battle tank
The STC blueprints Arkhan Land found explicitly called it one. Not an IFV.
>>47680460
>Exceptions =! the norm.
Norm =! absolute.
>the Land Raider's role is to carry space marines into battle and give them fire support
Yet you constantly read about them rolling into battle alone or as armoured formations, hunting enemy units instead of just being an extension of their passengers.
>>47679752
The S-tank was a tank destroyer in operation doctrine and design, being intended solely for defensive use in Sweden to counter soviet armor, with the Swedes relying on imported Centurions for actual tank work.
>>47680524
Hasn't the Baneblade also been called an MBT in old times? Don't quote me on that one, I'm not sure.
Given how the ancient galactic empire (and the Great Crusade) had to be both warriors and explorers, probably the definition of MBT expanded to accomodate the carrying of land troops as well.
Lots of things may have happened or changed in the future, after all, the Predator is pretty much a Bradley with even less transport capacity (0).
An MBT that was developed from a troop carrier, it's a fun thought.
>>47680756
When you're AV14 all around, have an AI for all intents and purposes and the presumed ability to raze down an entire continent you can do pretty much anything you want.
Maybe I'm too focused on its aspect as an explorator vehicle, but the thing that I love the most about Land Raiders is the fact that they can operate underwater (instead of being merely amphibious) and in any and all kind of terrain imaginable.
>>47676022
Because Light Tank serve a role that MBTs can not.It's why we came up with the Sheridan and a half dozen other vehicles. The MBT is a big, rolling mass of fuck you. They're heavy, they're noticeable and they can be hard to get into certain areas. Sometimes you need something light, reliable and with a good range or the ability to be inserted into difficult areas that would not be possible for something like a Leo 2 or an M1A2.
Can the MBT do some of those? Yes. Is that the main role? No. The LT is meant to cover those roles specifically. We have no need to classify anything as a Medium or Heavy anymore. We still have 'Tank Destroyers', and Assault guns have been consumed by a bunch of different vehicles. Infantry, Cruiser and similar designs have also gone similar ways.
>>47680970
Plenty of material talks of it as an MBT.
>>47681100
>Hasn't the Baneblade also been called an MBT in old times?
No, only a light tank by trolling faggots.
The Predator was the main battle tank of DAoT human forces.
>Maybe I'm too focused on its aspect as an explorator vehicle
You are, since it was never that. The Rhino was an exploration vehicle. Land Raider a heavy battle tank.
>>47681261
There's a long history of militaries designating things differently than their intended (or actually used) role. The Swedes called the Strv-103 a main battle tank but they never intended to use it as such to the point that it was referred to as a tank destroyer (i.e. designed for defensive ambush warfare) in analysis by the US army.
The Swedes themselves realized that the nascent Strv-103 wouldn't be able to fulfill all the roles of a proper main battle tank, that their current Centrion Mk.III and Mk.V's could, and chose to purchase a batch of Centurion Mk. X's and upgrade their Mk. III and Mk.V's, with the ultimate upgrade version (Strv-104) outliving the Strv-103.
The S-tank was a fine design but in everything but name it was a very advanced tank destroyer.
>>47674322
A predator truly outfitted for any AV work is fitted with a fucking graviton weapon that will fuck a Leman Russ six ways to sunday.
Emperor bless forge world.
>>47683583
As in, a graviton imploder weapon that only damages vehicles on a 6, or a graviton cannon that usually only glances vehicles through Haywire?
Or maybe you meant Heavy Conversion Beamer at max range? Just don't move.
>>47684688
Blood Ravens still get gifts even in non DoW sources.
Reminder that the main battle tanks of the Imperium move slower than an obese meth addict on a pushbike.
Wait. So according to some here, for something to qualify as a light tank it would need to be:
Strictly a tank. Not counting anything with any transport capacity, or garage weapons.
And
There must be another heavier pure tank within that faction. Defined strictly so that ig and am are not included together
And we have to rule out anything that might be considered a tank destroyer. And for the one faction with lots of tanks we have to leave out hellhounds and varients as well for some reason
And we should assume that of course an imperial commander would use these same qualifications?
>>47685045
Their armor is also paper thin and bolters are tipped with depleted water.
>>47683583
The Graviton Imploder? That only damages on a 6? I'd rather equip a Predator with all lascannons for an Anti-armor role.
>>47685045
>using outdated numbers from 20 years ago that have since been either outright retconned or buried rather than canon descriptions of their functions and their actions in fluff and lore
The great thing about 40K is that when something doesn't make any sense, there's something else that makes more sense, and you can use that instead.
By your logic,Terminators taking Multilasers is a thing.
>>47685045
That's because they are mostly infantry support tanks, like the Brit's mark 1 to mark 5
>>47686387
>By your logic,Terminators taking Multilasers is a thing.
Someday that will be a thing, we've forgotten how to make bolters.
Sorry guys..
It would be nice for IG to get a turret autocannon light tank but then that would basically just be a Predator.
![Space_Wolves_Leman_Russ_Exterminator[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/S7tyRAn.png "Space_Wolves_Leman_Russ_Exterminator[1].png")
>Valhallan decal
>Predator Tank
They obviously just traded tanks with these kind looking fellas.
That or they got confused since they're the same color and took the wrong one home.
>>47690820
Chimera has an autcannon option in FW armylists
Plus there's the Salamander with a hull mounted autocannon.
>>47685527
Imperial armour should not be trusted.
It's painfully obvious the writers though well meaning knew nothing about developments in tank technology post-WWII. There is grimdark and there is just silly. Setting the state of art for tanks in the 41st millennium at roughly 1941 is just silly.
Claiming that a 120mm APCR can penetrate TITANS (Vanquisher battle cannon, if you believe IA) and other hyper advanced alien war machines is pure madness.
>>47674064
>thot
chuckle/10
>>47681292
>a turret strapped on a pseudo M113
>less armored than a Russ (a.k.a poorly reverse-engineered rustbucket).
>DAoT MBT
I'm gonna need a source on that, my good sir.
>>47685527
The armour isn't that thin, also standard bolts have a water core not tip.
>>47673682
Ha, the fagbug was made into a tank?
>>47691134
>The provenance of the Predator battle tank is thought to lie in the forgotten depths of the Dark Age of Technology, when some hold that it was the standard battle tank of Mankind's fighting forces.
-IA vol. 2, pg. 61
>Indeed, the records of the Adeptus Mechanicus indicate that the Predator was instrumental in establishing mankind's dominance of the galaxy as far back as the Dark Age of Technology.
-5e Codex: Space Marines, predator entry
>less armoured
Then I guess the Tiger was shit because the British Churchill had more armour.
>>47673358
Grot Tanks.
>>47673358
>there aren't any light tanks in the 40k universe
>>47676499
Melee weapons have AP now? Damn, what has this game become?
