>So I'm writing a fantasy novel that takes place in a large, fleshed-out world with over a thousand years of history. The story will feature an ensemble cast of interlocking stories that blend warfare, espionage, court intrigue, and classic fantasy adventuring.
Wow, Anon, way to rip off Game of Thrones!
Is there a formal name for the "muh world building" genre?
>>47668597
Most medieval fantasy novels take place in their own "muh world building" setting, so there's not much point in making the distinction.
>>47668597
Fiction
>>47668686
You know, if more aspiring fantasy authors focused on storywriting over "muh worldbuilding" they'd probably actually finish their books.
>>47668581
That joke has nice tessellation. Rolling for lightning damage.
>>47668557
>So I'm writing a fantasy novel
Well, that's your first mistake kiddo.
>>47668768
Nail, head, etc.
Behold, the only fantasy author to write a good novel series in a reasonable amount of time; Andrej Sapkowski.
Want to know how he did it? By not giving a FUCK about "muh worldbuilding" outside of the elements that are important to the story and letting his obsessive fanboys do the hard work for him.
>>47668932
Tolkien actually got LotR down comparatively quickly. It only took so long to publish because of wartime paper shortages. But he also learned to focus on what was immediately important. There's a reason most of his worldbuilding-heavy stuff was published after he died.
In OP's conversation which totally happened, he brings up his setting has "thousands of years of history". Maybe if he put as much time into his narrative he'd probably be farther along than I assume he is. Which is to say, pouring over a bunch of outlines of setting history bullshit.
>>47668893
Hey, give the man some credit. It's better than if he tried to run it and subject players to his literary urges. Writing it keeps the cringe self-contained.
>>47668768
This is my problem. I built this world with history going from bronze to WW2 tech, but can't think of a good story or timeframoe to put in.
>>47669084
So either scrap that setting or at the very least put it away. Focus on characters and narrative. Write more short stories. Focus on subjects and themes you like. That setting will still be there when you go back, and there's a good chance you might realize you don't even like it as much as you used to.
There's really no point in putting in as much thought into fantasy settings as so many people here do. Where's all that information gonna fit in your story, huh? Are you really gonna stop the action so a character can lecture on something which happened a thousand years ago on the other side of the world?
Same goes for turning every novel idea into a trilogy or worse, a series. Start small with your narratives, then work your way up. You'll actually get things done this way.
>>47668932
Brandon Sanderson tends to release approximately one book a year, are generally well-liked, and have some pretty strong world building (Stormlight Archives' world, Roshar, goes far enough so that it's not just "It's like Earth, but not").
Robert Jordan of Wheel of time also had a pretty consistent release schedule combined with a well-structured world, although opinions on his actual writing strength is more controversial.
World building isn't always what slows writers down (although it certainly doesn't help for some), it depends on the author.
>>47668557
>not Malazan
>>47669168
>a good novel series
>Brandon Sanderson
>Robert Jordan
>>47669202
>an iphone poster
>taste
>>47668597
No. It's called a "beach read" or "summer read." It's typically what you'll find in >>47668712, but that's not really the limit on it. Fiction sections are usually devoted to sci-fi/fantasy, mystery and thriller (with Romance sometimes being its own section).
But while the sci-fi/fantasy sections are mostly given over to plot and setting driven stories, there are plenty of books in the literature section that belong there equally. Tom Robbins comes to mind. Charles Dickens belongs there too, by the way.
>>47669168
>World building isn't always what slows writers down (although it certainly doesn't help for some), it depends on the author.
I can guarantee you it's what slows down most /tg/ "authors".
>>47669202
>Looking down on Brandon Sanderson
Opinion discarded.
Back to your Terry Goodkind, please.
>>47668557
I want to fuck your eyesocket for your post.
>>47669315
>his dick is the length and width of an eyeball
>>47669084
Here's the problem; your history is set in stone. There are no grand stories to be told, thusly, outside of what you've already written.
Instead, bravely allow your stories to shape history. Pick a place on that timeline where a hero or villain sent things spiraling off their fated path.
>>47669385
means I got at least one more ball than you tho
>>47668686
What's the alternative?
If you write a story in a preexisting setting, it's relegated to the literary dumpster that is fan-fiction.
>>47669930
I don't think he's disparaging. I think he's just pointing out fantasy is the "muh worldbuilding" genre.
Which it totally is.
It's hard to do court intrigue well.
>>47670298
It's hard to write anything well, frankly.
And most of the people who can write "court intrigue" well don't really write fantasy. They write spy novels.
>>47669266
I think it slows them down because world building is the only skill they have, they embarked on the novel based on their ability to satisfactorily come up with magical not-earth descriptions and concepts, and then they found that writing the story requires an entirely different skill set, and much more practice and trial and error, whereas world building just requires some basic research
>>47670517
Spy novels are just fantasy without the world building
What makes fantasy fantasy is the world building
>>47669084
Well at least when you get a flash of inspiration and come up with an amazing story you'll have a world to set it in.
Out of curiosity, how do you keep track of your world? How many pages of history and maps do you have?
>>47670615
This
Personally for me, when coming up with new narritive concepts I have a harder time world building then creating characters. And can name and create characters/races with ease, but I have the worst time building cultures and worlds.
>>47670615
Completely agree. You can come up with unique magic systems and interesting political systems until the cows come home. But if you can't tell a compelling story then you're without a paddle.
Focus on writing a story first before concerning yourself with who took a shit on this spot 1000 years ago.
>>47668768
>>47668932
A Song of Ice and Fire is almost entirely storytelling. People who think the 4th and 5th books are about worldbuilding are idiots. GRRM doesn't give two shits about worldbuilding; that's why he let those two virgins write his worldbuilding book for him.
So, what are the keys for good storytelling?
>>47669034
>he also learned to focus on what was immediately important.
>50 pages describing a festival that's irrelevant to the story.
>>47670984
>implying I'm talking about GRRM
Gurm's storytelling is great, at least if you ask me. He takes forever because he's got like three dozen PoV characters and I'm not thoroughly convinced he knows exactly how he wants to finish his series. Also he writes his books in DOS.
What I'm talking about is all of the fa/tg/uys-who-would-be-novelists who no doubt have entire folders full of worldbuilding notes. And nothing of any real narrative substance.
>>47670751
>Out of curiosity, how do you keep track of your world? How many pages of history and maps do you have?
In my head. I have thought about settling down and starting a wiki to catalog all of the history, cultures, maps, etc. but I realized it would be pointless, because nobody would ever read it and in all likeliness I will never use it for a book nor a campaign. I probably wouldn't even be able to articulate it properly anyway. It's would be like having an idea for a really good oil painting and only being able to draw stick figures.
Say what you will about GRRM, aSoIaF, or GoT, but he's literally living the neckbeard dream right now. He published a fantasy series combining autistically detailed worldbuilding and depraved neckbeardly fetishes and it became an international hit. So much so that it's normie as fuck now. I have actually picked up sorority girls at parties using aSoIaF/GoT as my in. How the fuck did this happen?
>>47671335
>neckbeardy fetishes
Literally the worst it gets is twincest with one mention of period sex. And we're clearly meant to think it's fucking gross. I've seen far worse show up here on /tg/.
>picked up sorority girls
Stop telling lies on the internet, anon.
>>47670825
For that problem, just think about how the characters were shaped by their cultures, then bam, you've got a jumping-off point for those cultures.
>>47671068
He will probably end up like Jordan.
>>47671041
We get it, you don't like Tolkien's writing and it irks you that it's inextricably historically important to the genre and its associated hobbies.
But do you have to bring it up every time someone disagrees with you?
>>47671335
He's certainly living my dream; he owns a trampoline.
>>47671417
Only when someone praises a shit-tier story.
>>47671417
>>47671500
>>47671020
No one here knows. If anyone here figured it out and actually finished their story, they'd be too busy throwing money out of the moonroof of a limousine filled with champagne or drunkenly weeping over their dead dreams in a gutter. Nothing in between.
>>47671335
>I have actually picked up sorority girls at parties using aSoIaF/GoT as my in. How the fuck did this happen?
Because sorority girls at college parties are literally only there for the D. You could ranted about the merits of anarcho-syndicalism and they'd have fucked you.
>>47671533
Pretty sure only one side of this encounter is exhibiting skub-levels of caring, but I'll let it go anyway.
>>47671573
I don't think you understand how girls' libidos work.
>>47671640
Shhhh don't engage him. He's just mad all those chadbros pull more ass than him at parties.
>>47668597
Extruded Fantasy Product.
>>47671640
A determined girl who's already out and set to get laid couldn't give a shit who it goes to, so long as it's above bare minimum and not too shabby in the range available.
Chances are, if you're handsome, you could talk like a the male equivalent of a bimbo and get tail. Only ugly (remember, a girl's definition of an ugly guy is just a guy who isn't handsome) guys have to really work for it.
If it's a respectable society gathering, that's one thing. But I don't think that's the kind of college party anon was referring to.
>>47670701
The other three (espionage, war, classic fantasy adventuring) are easier to write. Court intrigue forces the reader to keep track of a whole tangle of names and relational ties. And half the time you have to go back and reread the whole thing because you missed something and the tale no longer makes sense. A fine costcutting measure back when books cost $35 each at B. Dalton, but laughable now with the internet.
>>47671834
What was a fine costcutting measure? I feel like I missed something from your post.
>>47671790
You're just reaffirming my suspicions.
Here, try this: "How would I think about sex if there's no guarantee I'll cum?"
>>47671880
So now you have to go back and re-read it, artificially prolonging the longevity of the post.
>>47671891
Sorry, I'm not the person you were originally responding to, so you'll have to project somewhere else. Though after bearing two children, I'm pretty jazzed at being asked to "imagine your sex life as a woman," so thank you for that.
>>47671938
So I've reduced all women to my experience but now suffered for my carelessness and pride. I'll try harder to avoid doing that in the future.
>>47668932
Terry Pratchett.
>>47669660
>Watching that gif
I realize that's from an infomercial, but I just realized someone was paid actual money to be utterly fucking incompetent on camera. I think I've found the job I was born for.
>>47668557
only a thousand years?
well...its a good start.
>>47668557
shes hot, anyone got info?
>>47669034
>LotR
into le trash
>>47672317
Most human beings can barely scrape together a cogent mental image of the last 10 years, much less a thousand.
>>47671533
neutralfags who post that are even worst
>>47672357
>shes hot, anyone got info?
http://www.shutterstock.com/cat.mhtml?models=14491346&context_photo=173442089
>>47672367
>Most human beings
Normies have no place in my hobbies
>>47672413
Novels are usually intended to have an audience, an audience not usually made up entirely of like-minded authors.
So you can write as a hobby, but if anon wants to write to be read that's cool too.
>>47672408
Shes beautifull, can you find her name?
i wonder if she does kissing asmr or pov porn
>>47672458
You're sick, but you're my kind of sick. <3
