This is what it sounds like when Cryx cry edition
Warmachine/Hordes Books, No Quarter, & IKRPG
textuploader <dot> com / 5wm4h
PP Youtube (gameplay tutorials, tournament coverage, and announcements)
https://www.youtube.com/user/PrivateerPressPrime
List building at
https://www.forwardkommander.com
http://schlaf.github.io/whac_online/whac.html
Latest Errata
http://privateerpress.com/files/WM%20MKII%20Rules%20Errata%20Jan%202016.pdf
Steamroller Rules
http://privateerpress.com/organized-play/steamroller-tournaments
The Giant List of Podcasts and Blogs
http://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?76379-Warmachine-Hordes-related-blogs-websites-and-forums
Table of contents for all NQ issues
http://www.privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?4313-Table-Of-Contents-For-All-No-Quarter-Issues
Abridged Lore
gargantuans abridged:http://pastebin.com/XPKMKYUc
Exigence abridged: http://pastebin.com/6D1fwSgv
devastation abridged: http://pastebin.com/KxkzfnXj
Lexicanum Iron Kingdoms Lore wiki:
http://warmachine.lexicanum.com/wiki/Main_Page
I can't wait to drop hundreds of dollars on cards just to play the game again
You will never make love toyour undead elf waifu
I'm legitimately sympathetic to Cryx player for the fact that Withershadow as a Warcaster Attachment is probably going to be pretty shitty.
>>47340027
You chose this when you apparently decided to play ALL THE FACTIONS.
>>47340032
If they still have puppet strings they'll be fine. Literally that's all they need to be good.
>>47340046
I feel like I'm being punished for supporting them.
Man, that image of Goreshade in the last thread made me think.
Goreshade. Thyron. Issyria.
Why the fuck do there seem to be a bunch of freakishly huge Iosans? Is this a lore thing I've missed somehow? Do one in ten elves just come out hueg?
>>47340068
And I feel like it's pretty fucking stupid to expect them to give you like 200 cards for free.
Or you could just use Warroom and get them for like 5 bucks each or whatever.
>>47340032
I actually don't mind the Withershadow Combine being a warcaster attachment- one concern was that they would compete with a Skarlock Thrall but since Skarlock Thralls are bad now- I am curious as to how they will work.
>>47340100
Do we know if the squire has been hit? that thing is auto include in every damn list
Any pics of the Withershadow cards? This is all news to me.
Also requesting Mortenebra and Nightmare if possible.
>>47340152
We don't. Though it's now competing with Reinholdt.
Any news on Karchev?
>>47340152
Its focus pooping function probably changed because the Power Up rule is the same thing but better.
>>47340032
Well they're kinda like Sylys because Admonia kept her free upkeep, but I hope she kept Disbinding too.
>>47340226
Aledged Warpath
>>47340238
It's not the same at all. Power Up fuels your Warjacks, the Squire fuels your Warcaster.
>>47339365
>>47339336
>>47339247
>>47339275
Cross-posting because I don't give a fuuuuuuck.
I honestly cannot wait to use eThags with his new Athanc, Dragon's Blood, and Legion Infantry.
It took me leaving the game and coming back to realize that I just didn't don't know how to play the game and thet eThags, as much as he doesn't look it, is a backline warlock who should be supporting beasts until late, late game when he can afford to do any kind of work himself.
With the new Athanc eThags can now run hordes of shredders and up to two heavies and be just fine on fury, or he can load up on all the best beasts and just throw them into the fire to kill shit without worrying about them surviving the encounter.
The new Dragon's Blood will make Legionnaires an outstanding cheap tarpit: harder to kill and when they do finally die, the corrosion will hurt your opponent back. And then they get to make their vengeance attacks.
Manifest Destiny + Feat means that our now SPD 7 fliers can threaten out to 21" which doesn't sound amazing with only one attack, but Shredders can still get 18" (not as good as the crazy 24" but let's be fair, that was kinda broken) and Harriers will likely be either SPD 6 or 7.
eThag will be sending his dudes to their deaths with the goal of clearing the table so that he can do some work himself. Even Thag's lack-luster damage spells seem to support this playstyle. Scourge looks pretty good when nothing remains of your opponent's army than a unit of Def 15+ dudes and the warnoun.
eThag didn't change a ton but the things that did change allow him to support a playstyle that heavily encourages trading up, which I for one cannot wait to try.
>>47340343
But Power Up means the Squire doesn't need to fuel the warcaster. The focus the caster would have spent on jacks is provided by Power Up.
>>47340532
So you're saying that all focus efficiency attachments should be gone, because Power Up? Isn't that just two steps forward one step back?
>>47340568
Jesus dude, I'm just speculating. You don't need to get so bootyblasted about it
what factions do you play, not just own but actually play?
http://www.strawpoll.me/10138678
>>47340620
The same people are reposting their answers at this point.
>>47340620
Can we just put this shit in the OP already?
>>47340024
I have a feeling that there's either a new model/unit or an old one that will allow Skorne to be able to reliably deliver their beasts to melee.
Think about it, do the changes to Cyclops ARM and Titan DEF matter so much if those things are immune to being shot off the table or if they can get several SPD buffs right before a crazy distance charge?
And don't discount either of those things, the Battle engine is calvary now and all calvary get reposition 3 or reposition 5, and the battle engine can get +3 SPD from rage now. A SPD 7 huge base that can disengage 3" is pretty scary.
>>47340659
The Titan's DEF change doesn't really matter considering it's going from 8 to 7 points, but the Cyclops Savage is not built for charging into anything. 5 to 4 points is great and all, but right now all I can see it doing is being a walking animus for whatever casters become spellslingers. Future Sight on melee attacks sucks dick, but boosting a spell to hit is relevant.
>>47339921
Why don't the iron kingdom have auto rifles or smgs or tanks?
>>47340707
Because those aren't fun, or would make the rest of the world less fun.
>>47340707
>tanks?
you mean warjacks?
>>47340745
I think he meant Battle Engines.
>>47340774
Like the Gun Carrige?
>>47340794
Yes, exactly, or perhaps the Battle Wagon.
>>47340794
Yeah but self peeled if they are smart enough to make steam power armour and all the complex moving parts for their Jacks why don't they make self propelled gun carriages?
>>47340892
Like the Siege Crawler then?
>>47340892
>>47340914
>They keep talking about how it's just pieces of the puzzle
Well, motherfuckers, you can't blame us for not having all the pieces, since you're the ones in total control.
>>47340532
Or they just stack like how every other focus efficiency mechanic has so far.
>>47341017
Pretty much the reason why I don't like the spoilers. I think they're worse than the field test. They should've just dropped the new edition on our heads.
>>47341017
But they can blame you for jumping to conclusions.
so based on the new rules, the corollary still gives 1 free focus in addition to its full load of 3 focus when it spends its focus points to transfer them, correct? That's how it worked in Mk2
As opposed to creating 1 free focus for each focus point it transfers since the transfer is just one action rather than 3 seperate actions
>>47341044
PP literally can not win no matter how they did this. If they did it your way, tons of people would bitch about how there was no build up to it, or about how they t how they couldn't plan their purchases around the new edition. It's a crap shoot.
>>47341072
Nope. It no longer spends focus when transfering, so it doesn't create any focus.
>new Insider is up
>its the new ADR
For fuck sake.
>>47341093
Or they could have handled it better by not publishing exact stats.
>First post is an update on the focus and fury changes
>Second is covering the design philosophy of MKIII
>Faction articles that explain units that had problems and now they want to address them, while spoiling JUST the new battlebox casters
That's all you need to do. You don't give exact rules out of context, just shit like "Goreshade's spell was completely over powered, so we decided to shift him away from control and push him towards being more aggressive. He now has some decent offensive spells while retaining X Y Z elements of his older self". That's it, all that needs to be done is right there. You don't get knit picking over stat increases or decreases, you give people a rough idea of what to expect and then when shit hits people can see the actual changes in context.
>>47341159
No spoilers for you, you've had enough this week ;)
>t.PP
>>47341072
Doesn't create focus at all.
Thus the Angry Corollary becoming a thing.
>>47341093
they couldve handled it better by opening up a beta like they did for mk2... in dont understand why they didnt stick with a winning formula
>>47341203
>winning formula
Were you around for that disaster?
It's why eMorghoul is as bad as he is in MK2.
kryssa's story is up
https://codeoxide.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/thechosen.pdf
>>47341203
Mk2 field test was a complete fucking disaster. Either you weren't around for it or you've glued your rose-tinted glasses directly to your eyeballs.
>>47341203
The Mk2 playetest was the worst thing that happened to the game.
It's shadow still hangs over the game even now.
>>47341237
Because he was released right before the playtest and was utterly broken in every imaginable way. He went from TOP TIER to unplayable because people had no idea where he should fit since their only experience was him fucking everything up.
>>47341203
Too much negativity over certain things in the game. You think Gaspy2 got nerfed hard? Imagine if the community, well known for fair, balanced opinions and not at all known for holding grudges, got to say how he works in Mk3.
>>47341276
>tfw Bone Grinders lost the ability to transfer strength of a dead warbeast to a warlock because of him
I want that ability back and make Carver super strong.
>>47341203
It's not really a winning formula though, just look at Morghul2, went from one of the best casters I the game, propping his faction up, to the worst caster in the game, bar none. An open beta would just be people bitching about Gaspy2, and he'd probably be worse than he is now.
>>47341276
Trenchers have been in the game from the start, and got hit just as hard.
>>47341093
Don't let Soles write anything and don't let shick post anything without pics for proof.
Bam, hype train a moving
>>47341361
Trenchers were also fucking busted where they made it near impossible to deal with Cygnar at range. They were again an auto include that needed the nerf stick
>>47341399
You're right, they did.
But they got murdered into unplayable, and PP spent years trying to convince people to do so.
>>47341264
>>47341237
i enjoyed it alot actually. It brought me into the game and first year of mk2 after the beta testing was done was the most diverse ive seen in warmahordes. I hear alot of whining about how it sucked now but at the time in was interesting and fresh, sure not perfect but better than what mk2 became
>>47341314
so you are saying the data that was created by the beta test was incorrectly used? I can buy that, its not a fair argument for the beta not being a superior way to create hype and interest in a game tho is is? If anything i wish the nk2 beta had a tournament or two ran during it by pp, that is the type of data you can really use to balance a game. and ultimately the only input that really matters
>>47341432
What do you mean, what Mk2 became?
A huge portion of the issues with Mk2, balance and diversity wise, were straight out of the core books. Straight out of the playtest.
So tell me what Mk2 became that isn't the fucking playtest's fault, so I can show you why you're wrong.
>>47341280
Well I mean that kind of hapened. I wouldnt pretend that the devs are immune to internalising the bitching and moaning over the years
>>47341259
A rare insight into the individual personality of a Legion Warlock. I like it.
>>47341477
if this is how you feel why are you here at all? the core books in mk2 gave us infantrymachine which alot of people didnt care for but i enjoyed, as mk2 kept creeping in new types of units u saw some armies capable of creating lists that countered this (cygnar) and other lists that just minimaxed the older ones (cryx). The only other lists you see in tournaments were theme lists which if you like w/e but i feel like they further limit actual army list building. The beta test gave us an opportunity to see the game actually evolve, the fact that it was too short and the returns werent perfect isnt an argument against a process that created more interest in the game.
>>47341556
yeah I'm glad there was more to it than just a battle report, I know a lot of people talked shit about it but the protectorate one has been my favorite so far because it was straight up character building
>>47341587
Oh fuck.
I said you were wrong, but god damn, I didn't realize how wrong you were.
Best counter to infantrymachine? pHaley, straight out of the core book. Fucked infantry heavy armies up.
Cryx minmaxing? Taking Banes, that were already fucking good in Mk2.
Theme lists? Sure, they got out of hand later on, but they also served to shake up the list building people had been following since the forces books of Mk2. They were the only times major lists really changed in any true sense, especially in the bullshit factions.
Everything you're complaining about was straight up the fault of the playtest. It fucked the game up for it's entire run of the edition. No matter what else happens as far as Mk3 goes, them not doing an open playtest is the best decision they made.
>>47341668
>Company does open beta
>Uses the data collected + their own data to balance things
>Company balances things poorly
>Company does closed beta
>Company then has to balance things
>???
>Perfect balanced game with no broken shit.
One of these scenarios is unrealistic.
>>47341715
Except that the open beta was tourney results over a huge portion of Mk2's lifespan, so that's their data to work with.
It should also be mentioned that the vast majority of players who would participate in an open beta are total fucking morons. I trust PP infinitely more than the mouth breathers on the forums, here, or the podcast community.
>>47341734
Aren't the Chain Attack guys and Mr. Malorian pretty smart?
>>47341432
>what mk2 became
The things that ruined Mk2 were predominately straight out of the playtest.
Any playtest that results in Haley2 and Gaspy2 on the one hand, and Morghoul2 on the other, is a total fucking failure.
PP learned from their mistake. Turns out a giant internet echo chamber of screeching nerds all trying to hijack the development process of the game isn't particularly useful.
>>47341804
Sure, but then you've got gibbering retards like Crippled System or Battle Driven. Overall you've got a big net negative in the intelligence department.
>>47341804
Jesus, no.
>>47341725
the difference between what the open beta and the balancing during mk2's lifespan was is during the beta u saw changes to the core units kromac changed ALOT, mord changed.. less, etc. The balance that was done AFTER the beta was to add unit types (colossals) to combat op lists (infantrymachine) and theme forces to create uses for models in armies that were not ever being used (Runes of War). No one is suggesting that mk2 beta was perfect but it was alot of free advertising and imho a better system than this "trust us". If nothign else we wouldnt be wondering what will and wont work at this point, we'd be pointing to youtube and twitch vids of the actual games and models failing or showing how op they were. A much better scenario than what we have at the moment.
>>47341725
You shouldn't balance things purely on tournaments, nor should you balance things from different metas.
Lets use magic as an example as it's really easy to explain this way.
If they print lightning bolt in a set, then any creature with 3 or less toughness loses value in that meta. It can be removed too easy and cheaply. Creatures with 4 toughness become the corner stone of the meta because they can survive bolts. If you then remove bolt from that meta those 4 toughness corner stones are no longer corner stones as the entire value system has changed.
The problem PP has is it's bloated the game with too much shit and it has to try and balance it all and they simply won't be able to. They should of thought ahead before making stuff like bane warriors and bane knights who both occupy the same design space and are basically the same unit they now need to give different identities without upsetting players who bought units they liked for how they are now.
>>47341734
>I have blind faith in a company
OH HO HO HO. Just you fucking wait kiddo, give it 6 months and the tourney fags will have broken MKIII. The meta will be stagnant as fuck the same way it is now. All those models you're upset about being broken now were designed by the same chumps trying to balance them now.
>>47341825
Have you considered that people did complain about Epic Haley but she didn't get fixed because that was her identity as a warcaster? PP didn't change characters identities in the MKII switch.
>>47341804
>people that think that podcasters are somehow intelligent just because they're vocal
lol
Podcasters are literally the worst people. I laughed when all the people complained about the free rider policy hurting discount games because they do a podcast that gives back to the community.
They're just a bunch of idiots.
>>47341905
>I have blind faith in a company
That's not what he said.
As dumb as PP may be, they're geniuses compared to armchair game designer fucktards like you.
Did Tumblr wake up and get bored of trying to fuck up Magic so decided to come fuck up our threads instead?
>>47341905
>blind faith
Not what I mean. I like PP, they're cool guys but they can fuck up just like any other hand company. I just trust them more than idiots on the internet
>>47341995
Every single problem in the game was chosen BY them. So you have faith in people who have shown they fuck it up. The "idiots on the internet" are in charge of the company now if you haven't noticed, most the staff as ex fanboys. Including... ready for this? THE LEAD DESIGNER OF MKIII.
So great, shit on the Internet while blowing Soles like a back street hooker. It shows how intelligent you are.
>>47342042
Soles has been with the company since the DnD modules got done and they started working on the Table Top Game. In fact, he was one of the people that pitched the idea about doing a Table Top Game. What the fuck are you talking about
>>47342042
>Every single problem in the game was chosen BY them
No shit Sherlock.
>>47342042
Yeah, so things can't get worse at this point. But you would rather trust the game to people on the forums? On here? Are you insane? At least PP pretends to be unbiased
>>47342126
>so things can't get worse at this point
not been a part of this argument, but PP is far far better than GW so there's still lots of room to drop
>Nerf Cylena and Nyss Hunters
>Denny1 isn't Cryx's most played tournament caster
Problem solved.
I am pretty confident that MK3 will be good enough that I'll enjoy playing it.
>>47342166
This is pretty much the verdict most people should settle on. Even if balance isn't perfect, and the period of chaos only lasts for 6 months, it will be fun.
>>47341955
Yes.
>>47340620
>Most broken faction and memiest faction are top
Kek
>>47341259
Do we know who died? Was it someone who matters or Schmucky the Arse of Everblight?
>>47342149
Thats skarre1, but denny1 is still very good. I might end up actually playing her in mkiii
>>47342283
Of all the factions, you think Khador is the meme?
>>47342283
It seems like a pretty even mix, actually.
>>47342318
Schmucky.
Most of the fluff has jobber warnouns with no names getting punked.
Force Wall fluff had Ios punk some CoC caster, and even destroy their soul jar, even though they had no idea what it was.
Looking at the changes in mk3 I think I'm gonna pick up a warmachine faction. Knife ears always appealed to me and after the spoilers I think I'm going to go ahead with the purchase of their battlebox when they become available.
I want to paint them up in a protoss color scheme and was curious if anyone had tips for painting that much yellow / gold or if they had any pics of these scheme on Ret.
>>47341259
Kinda cool.
It'd be nice if we knew what they were doing so close to Ios. The Legion never seems large enough to really be invading anyone in the fluff.
Meme-O-Wars is actually really funny. You could probably make a pretty good Trump army from Irusk2 and a bunch of meme-o-war.
Anyone seen any reddish-bronze Retribution?
>>47342768
You're just throwing words together at random at this point, aren't you.
>>47342252
>>47342843
I'm an FBI AI designed to infiltrate right-wing extremist networks. "Traditional Games" have been designated as a potential vector for right-wing extremist recruitment.
Don't tell anyone!
>>47342913
And for good measure.
>>47342913
Seeing Thags2 stay mostly the same makes me confused at how terrible Skorne Warlocks are looking.
>>47342969
Athanc, Blight Fire, and Dragon's Blood all actually got buffed.
Why is Typhon so shitty? lmao
>>47342934
I really wish Legion would all take a card from Thagrosh's deck and focus on the unnatural abomination side of Legion rather than the boring elvish side. Like Kallus. Fucking Kallus.
>>47343036
Are you retarded?
>>47342915
>>47343061
1 POW 17 initial? Fuckin garbage m8. Legion loses again
>>47342969
But we haven't actually seen any Skorne warlocks besides Xekaar and Mordikaar. I'm still holding out hope that:
>Hexeris
Becomes a true frontline spellslinger.
>Naaresh
Becomes more suicidal.
>Morghoul
Turns into a proper tool of infantry slaughter.
>Makeda
Stays the same, which sadly isn't true for pMakeda.
>Rasheth
Stays the same.
>Xerxes
Stays the same, which apparently is true.
>Zaal
Stays largely the same.
>>47343061
What is good about him? PC 24 for a non-reach beast with 3 initials ( potentially ) and a regenerative effect that is countered by a lot of tech? I'm not really seeing it.
>>47343036
He actually got some pretty substantial buffs too.
>>47343117
Well lets see. He has a really good stat line, and an Animus that makes it even better. He has 3 decent P+S melee initials and 5 fury to buy more. He has 3 pow 14 spray 8s. He has a lot of boxes. Does he shine best with buffs? Yep. good thing the very Warlock he has a bond with gives him S&P on all his attacks, and Vayl gives him Incite for a similar effect.
>>47343088
I'm curious what they're going to do w/ eZaal. I assume he'll be pretty much the same, which the faction changes around him. But hell, Immortals + Souls? He's gonna be a beast. Shame Skorne lacks construct Warbeasts or I'd pretend I was playing Convergence.
>>47343059
Hey, I happen to like my dark elves.
>>47343227
>construct Warbeasts
You mean like a FUCKING WARJACK?
>>47343248
Or Wolds, perhaps?
>>47343260
Fuck that non-Skorne shit. Construct beasts really wouldn't fit in Skorne anyway since they operate on a principle of, "If I can't torture it, I don't want it in my army".
>>47343280
>Immortals
>>47343078
yep, you're retarded.
>>47343078
if you aren't baiting, read multiple heads on the backside
>>47343260
I want all wolds to gain +1 strength. Full stop, no exceptions.
>>47343280
>What are immortals?
>>47343320
>>47343326
Revered ancestors are exempt for obvious reasons of being revered.
>>47343088
Xerxes1 got nerfed
Xerxes2 arguably gets a buff
Naaresh gets a buff but is less suicidal/functionally same playstyle
Makeda2 gets more of a sidegrade
Makeda1 gets a considerable buff
Rasheth stays pretty much the same
Makeda3 stays pretty much the same
Hexeris2 gets a substantial buff
Hexeris1 got minor changes
Morghoul2 got buffed beyond feat
Morghoul1 is basically untouched
Zaal2 is about the same
Zaal1 is about the same
Mordikaar has been shown
Xekaar has been leaked
>>47343208
Hm. I think I might be seeing this from a really skewed perspective. I play Khador exclusively so I see low threat weak sauce initials and the gun doesn't even do damage to my AKs/Torch/Strakov etc.
Maybe it's a more dangerous piece against other armies though.
>>47343415
>AKs/Torch/Strakov
You mean those things that will either get some serious buffs in Mk3 or remain on the shelf?
>>47343413
how u kno dis
>>47343439
People who don't play them in MK2 are either new to the faction or just lack vision. Personally I've played and owned basically everything Khador, so I got to the point of playing Kommandos and Kossites just for variety. They're actually really good, especially against armies like Legion and Protectorate.
>>47343413
Xerxis1 is one of the better looking ones, so bullshit.
Losing Fury kind of hurts, but his new stuff doesn't tax his Fury 5.
Tac Sup is perfect for him.
Rift is stupid, but he needed a spell for Marketh to use.
>>47343415
>low threat weak sauce initials
How are 3 POW 17s at 10 inches low threat or weak sauce? Not to mention he's Fury 5, so you can be looking at 8 of the fucking things. That will very reliably wreck any Khador heavy.
>the gun doesn't even do damage to my AKs/Torch/Strakov etc.
So? A tiny handful of fire immune shit ignores the sprays. What about the fuckhuge load of shit that doesn't?
And it's not like those things will even be used unless they get some serious buffs in Mk3.
One Khador player to another, you're an idiot.
>>47343478
Pray tell, what the fuck are AKs going to do against a Legion beast? Sure they don't die to the fire, but they also can't put a dent in anything tougher than tissue paper.
>>47343415
Speaking of which, how is Torch now? Did he get a buff?
>>47343415
He's an infantry thresher.
You put Excessive Healing on him and put him in the nearest tarpit and laugh maniacally as your opponent spends his clock watching Typhon heal as much damage as he takes. Then you hit him with three 8" sprays in the melee (gunfighter) and buy melee attacks (multiple heads) to taste.
He's a heavy warbeast that is all but immune to being shot off the table and infantry charges (Excessive Healing + Dragon's Blood) and can charge 9" with an 8" spray.
>>47342934
>ARM 18
>cheaper animus
>Fury 5
I'm very much alright with this. He was already an amazing beast that I loved to use, now he's just better.
>>47343059
I like the fact that Legion is a mix between disgusting abominations and elegant elves. I loved the image of a graceful warlock like Vayl or Saeryn commanding a horde of disgusting, ravenous beasts.
>>47343508
Nobody knows.
>>47343506
Crowd it until a heavy comes and kills it.
>>47343486
PS17 killing Khador jacks takes... a long time. It would basically take his whole activation to kill a Juggernaut that is 12pts.
>>47343512
So he gets into my patch of AKs and then what? He gobbles 3 of them a turn, maybe more if his warlock wants to waste the fury. Then more AKs cram in since they are dirt cheap, meaning Typhon either spends the rest of the game stuck in place or he tramples out, if I give him a good landing zone.
>>47343629
This is amazing.
Do we have a retard award?
I want to give this guy a retard award.
>>47343678
In fairness, he is sort of correct. In a stand up fight against a similar points cost number of Khador heavies, he's going to get ripped to pieces. But that's not really what he does, and it is generally my experience as a Menoth player that forcing Legion to fight me in a drawn out beat down they tend to fall apart, regardless of what heavies they bring.
That said, that thing definitely rips through infantry like nobodies business, and DEF13 is nothing to sneeze at on a heavy.
>>47343512
He doesn't have assault, but he is a nice beast, if a bit expensive
>>47341802
It wasn't so much a nerf as a role change.
If the way damage is dealt out ends up finally ending the rocket tags wars then an anti infantry melee beast might not be a terrible idea after all.
If rocket tag still exists for Jacks and beasts...imma just be bummed. No rhyme or reason...just bummed.
>>47343629
>He gobbles 3 of them a turn, maybe more if his warlock wants to waste the fury
That's fucking hilarious. FURY 5 means Typhon could eat 6 a round if he needs to keep Excessive Healing up and regenerate each round. Typhon also has critical pitch, meaning that every few attacks he'll get a 2-fer or 3-fer through collateral damage.
AKs get 2 initials per round which deal 21 and 20 damage max per attack. Typhon has 18 ARM. 20 if Thags decides to put Dragon's blood on him. Dragon's Blood + Excessive healing means Typhon will actually be healing damage as AKs attack him.
Thagrosh has 7 fury, he can keep Typhon fine by himself, but even if he doesn't then Typhon has a chance to spend the next turn only eating 1 AK, boo fucking hoo.
You can bring at most 20 AKs to a fight. Typhon will chew through all of them in an average of 4 to 5 rounds with only caster support at zero personal risk. Since 2 max units of AKs cost more than Typhon, this is a good trade for Legion.
>>47343903
Who said anything about assault?
Gunfighter will let him threat 10" on the charge and spray a further 7" into the backlines.
>>47343629
>PS17 killing Khador jacks takes... a long time.
Not only is this statement wrong, you're almost always going to see Typhon with a caster that turns his melee attacks into effective P+S 19 or 20. At which point, he chews through Khador heavies without breaking a sweat.
>>47343629
It takes everything a whole activation to kill a Juggernaut. It turns out, dirt cheap ARM 20 heavies with 34 boxes are pretty hard to kill efficiently. Shall we call every expensive heavy bad now?
>>47344151
If Thags were to cast Manifest Destiny and Typhon were to boost damage, we'd have Typhon making at most 4 POW 17 attacks with 4d6 drop lowest. Assuming average dice that's a total of 38 damage. With luck Typhon could kill it with his third attack and still have 2 fury to use to cast animi or buy attacks against other stuff.
>the Slayer vs Juggernaut debate continues
>>47343958
>putting more than AKs than necessary in gobble range
>trying to kill a heavy warbeast with AKs instead of heavy
>by your own admission Typhon spends 4-5 rounds stuck in AKs
wew anon, you sure you've played Legion before? Sounds like you haven't had the joy of being curb stomped by a good Khador list. It's trivially easy to bring a Beast 09, some AKs, Sorscha2 and make Typhon disappear in a single round.
Get good buddy!
>>47344604
>ha! it takes more than the value of a model to remove a model!
>showed you
Anon was right, you deserve the king retard award
>>47340081
>unwavering "savior" of his people regardless of how little they want help from his cursed, murderous, undead ass
>sword dude who is unenamoured with politics and has decided to solve his nation's problems with the practical application of sword
>lady general who played too much 4X as a kid and can meditate her way to absolute victory
Elves must metabolize clarity of purpose into growth hormones.
>>47339921
mirin the cryx I painted?
>>47344776
can we have a close up?
>>47344776
eh, at least it's painted
>>47344793
of ?
Still have about 80 points to paint up. This is my friends army I'm painting. I'm about two years deep.
>>47344802
Local two shops score it 20% painting for steamrollers, most have painted armies (you get 10% automatically if you have 3 colors and flock)
>>47344850
>forcing players to paint
kek I like playing it painted but causing players to lose out on points if they don't have time or skill to paint is disgraceful
>>47344826
The army I play with Cicle - sold for my DZC table/armies + D&D books + hobby stuff
Looking into Gators
>>47344916
Gators are gr8
How are my Troll dudebros going to crack armor in MK3 warjackspammachine?
Armorcracking was never been easy and now Mulg has been hatefucked to death and all the buffs are warbeast only
>>47344886
I enjoy the hobby, most of the local community does too. It's not bad to paint.
Actually that is only for Leagues, the steamrollers do not have a painting requirement at one of the stores. You're just ineligible for best overall
It makes sense. Any of the GTs I've attended for whfb and 40k require the same.
I want to start MK3 fresh, not try and relearn my faction
>>47344961
Sweeeet
I won't buy any of the big toys until I get a handful of units built/get used to playing them with the new cards. Sacral Vault in the future? hmmm
>>47345011
Vault is also gr8
but we don't know for Mark 3. It seems like they've only got love for battle engines, though, so hopefully it remains great. But maybe not now that pigs can use it too.
>>47341259
>this victory doesn't belong to me, I was not chosen to lead
>BELIEVE IN YOUR SELF, KRYSSA-CHAN, YOU'RE JUST AS GOOD AS LYLYTH AND VAYL
Everblight continues to build his army of corrupted elf waifus from his NEET safe space inside Thagrosh's thoracic cavity.
>>47342537
Try google searching this image for a source blog or something. I decided not to go looking because yellow can be a bitch to get right.
>>47345038
>inb4 bicurious jokes about kallus
will khador be good next edition?
At Core Warmachine and Hordes is a Broken Game.
PP spends its time working around the core issues of the game instead of addressing them and supplementing them with crutch mechanics.
Warjack/ Beast Points? Those are crutch mechanics. A Brute force way to just smash Warjacks/ Beasts into the game.
Take away the bonus points. Take away them all completely and see how many Jacks are played (Even with the powerup mechanic). You will see some, probably with the Rookie warcasters (Or whatever their name is), but Infantrymachine never truly left because the basics of infantry make it better then Jacks.
Hordes also runs on Crutch mechanics. Instead of making the life spirals work properly, they just make healing easy as to not bother.
Caster Assasination, whilst a unique mechanic, also is a form of Crutch mechanic. Never need to balance out armies when it all just comes down to killing the caster in the end.
Heck the culmination of all things crutch mechanics is the Convergence of Cyriss Battlebox. You got jacks that generated their own focus (Before they do so now partially except the COC now generate ALL their focus) a caster that regenerates them by auto to not deal with the Damage Grid. COC as a faction is "Warmachine-The not fucked up version". Its the jack faction when ALL factions where supposed to be Jack Factions. And now they can't even fully fix warjacks because that means taking away COCS full identity.
I never get the sense that PP has ever sat down and really thought through how they want their game played. They just throw out general ideas, which is why when you actually HEAR some of their design ethos it comes out very amateurish:
"To give Khador its own unique heavy infantry identity with the only ones with 8 Boxes......Except the COC because they are also made of metal LOL...And don't ask why monstrosities then have the highest HP of All Warjacks."
>>47344978
Two units of Fennblades with UA + a Fellcaller + Madrak 2 + 2 Kithkars answers a hell of a lot of questions bro.
Plus, Madrak 2 is basically unkillable now
>>47345312
No one cares
>>47345312
>crutch mechanics
aka variety
>>47341162
Spoilering the battleboxes would have still sent people into a tizzy because the models aren't nearly as impressive as other MK2 options.
And telling people a caster was nerfed, but not providing any numbers is still going to get them to cry foul and assume even worse.
Were dealing with people responding to every leak at an emotional level. Even when the whole game is released, they'll be complaining simply because shot is different and they need to relearn many aspects of the game that had long since become rote memory.
>>47345312
>cancer: the post
C R U T C H
R
U
T
C
H
>>47345331
>>47345409
There is that classic PP mentality.
When they made MKI, it was a perfect game. Until MKII. Then it was perfect again. Until at least MKIII was released and the game was perfect once more.
I still get a chuckle out of that MKI battle college article dreaming about how "Maybe we are all just playing the game wrong, and that somebody, someday will flip the game around and make it about warjacks again".
>aka variety
No I said Crutch mechanics. Ways around the core issues of the game without fixing the core issues of the game.
>>47345551
Fuck off, retard.
>>47345551
literally no one cares
>>47345551
game is far from perfect m8, is bretty gud tho
>Ways around the core issues of the game without fixing the core issues of the game.
aka variety
>>47345617
You know you can have variety and fix the core issues of the game right? Im not saying problems with a particular unit, but the game itself.
Whatever.
>>47345749
you called caster assassination a crutch mechanic, when that is a mechanic taken from thousand+ year old chess
>>47342913
Why is his huge pimp hand still 0.5 inch range?
A draw friend needs to do rule 34 for Ioasan female casters/female Ioasans in general
>>47346224
>Elara's KS model has twintails
>her market sculpt doesn't
My arcane jimmies are forever disrupted.
>>47346339
tumblr
>>47346735
google image search:^)
>http://privateerpress.com/community/privateer-insider/insider-05-19-2016
And what should that have revealed?
(Read it with Mabel's voice.)
Have there been any Circle spoilers?
>>47347462
Spoiled the battlebox caster and beasts. Seriously considering playing Circle.
Does anyone have any retribution spoiler cards?
>>47347462
>>47347731
boxes are here
http://www.3plusplus.net/2016/05/warmachine-hordes-battlebox-spoilers/
>>47347799
Thanks broseph
>>47341922
>if it's popular it's bad
Have you seen some of MrMalorian's stuff? Sure his artworks are horrible, but he offers some good insight into the game.
I've had an opportunity to glance through some MK3 merc stuff. I don't have any proof and I'm taking what I've seen with a grain of salt. Not going too much into the details but I'll hit my overall impressions.
My impression was that Hungerford did a good job with the insider. He hit some of the biggest changes. The leaked info we've gotten for mercs is most of the rest of the big changes.
Overall mercs didn't change much. Surpisingly few changes across the board. Mercs didn't get many nerfs and a few of our terrible units got fixed (devildogs/croe).
Alexia1 losing lamentation aura and Eyriss2 losing anti-allocation aura(which we've seen) is mirrored in Orin losing null magic. He still has anti-magic tech it's just different. So any general changes being mirrored in mercs is the main exception to lack of changes.
Overall MK3 Mercs is looking tight mostly due to a combination of +1 pow on Nomad chassis and lack of changes. Everyone else is being nerfed down to our weight class.
>>47341734
You're right, PP shouldn't just blindly implement player feedback. But maybe some of the better players (and we have ways of determining those, they're called tournaments) could offer some balancing insight.
>>47348078
who says they haven't?
>>47348078
Just because they are a "better player" doesn't mean they are not a biased player. Hell that dataset may not be nearly as useful as you'd expect. Pro players are pros because they adapt well not because they are innovative. That's true in any game.
Also how do you determine "better player"? If it's just by tourney wins then all you get is who the tourney winner is. Maybe that's a cryx player that wins with a brainless list?
Last point to make is that, well, what you are talking about is a closed beta. Or alpha. A thing they can do in private. With NDAs. Invite players that they know are good to do some playtests and get feedback from. Zero reason to raise awareness they are doing it because it just puts awkward pressure on such a player. In fact why do you think we get leaks?
Just have JVM design shit, he plays with every model and makes them work.
>>47348039
Can you be more specific regarding Orin?
>>47341259
Do you have the other stories up as well?
>>47345095
>bicurious jokes about kallus
Oh please. Kallus couldn't even be monocurious.
>>47348192
Sure. He has arcane vortex now.
I'm worried about getting too specific off memory and giving people the wrong info. Especially as anything I've seen is unlikely to be final. I think it's near final and I've heard rumors that Minions are the most changed.
Im looking to maybe get into warmachine for mk3 yet a bunch of my friends who left warmachine/ hordes have told me not to bother do to it having the most cancerous of communities as well as privateer press not knowing what the're doing. How true would u say this is?
>>47348107
I do. There's some stupid shit up ahead that I cannot say. But you'll see.
>>47348111
>Also how do you determine "better player"? If it's just by tourney wins then all you get is who the tourney winner is. Maybe that's a cryx player that wins with a brainless list?
If we cannot assume that players who rank high in tournaments (not just the winner, also the x-1's) are the best players then this game is already fucked beyond redemption. I refuse to believe that.
>>47348264
Hmm I think if I leave it at that there will be weird and wild speculation. My impression of Orin is that he is nerfed and not auto-include but I think he's playable. Null magic was a bit hard to get into position but he can stay back and use arcane vortex.
The issue is he gets 3 tokens that he can spend on boosts or to trigger arcane vortex. With no way to gain tokens. So he's going to go dry and only cast chain lightning for the rest of the game after a certain point.
>>47348281
>If we cannot assume that players who rank high in tournaments (not just the winner, also the x-1's) are the best players then this game is already fucked beyond redemption. I refuse to believe that.
Well...best of the best tourneys. Yes I'll grant you that. I was being a bit hyperbolic but my point does stand though. Reliably powerful lists float to the top.
>>47348278
I'd say that's a loaded question.
But communities are communities, the wargame hardly matters as far as they go.
As for not knowing what they're doing, for all of their faults, Mk2 was one of the most balanced wargames on the market.
>>47348278
>most cancerous of communities
This is like walking into a bar and shouting "you're all dickheads". What kind of reception would you expect? But no, all of the players I have met (so maybe 50% of the national meta and a few international ones) have been very friendly and mature. I cannot say that for every game.
>as well as privateer press not knowing what the're doing
Time will tell. <1 Month to be more precise. They have some really good ideas but tend to fuck up sometimes.
>>47348306
>Reliably powerful lists float to the top.
To win any major tournament, a good list is far from enough. But so what? Good players know what good lists look like. Wouldn't that make them a great authority on balancing?
>>47342828
HI
What scale buildings would be suitable for making a Minion's basing scheme where they're destroying Tokyo? I think it would be a lot of fun to base them that way
>>47343342
And why couldn't they make a warbeast size immortal?
>>47348321
I'm having trouble putting this concept in words....it's like the difference between a good GM and a good PC. Only..I've seen many examples in games (including vidya) where top tier players are so specialized in the metagame that they can give bad advice...
Anyway, you've cherry picked one of a few points I made and driven it forward alone. So to bring up two again.
>>47348111
>Pro players are pros because they adapt well not because they are innovative. That's true in any game.
Is part of what I was trying to say just now
>what you are talking about is a closed beta. Or alpha. A thing they can do in private. With NDAs
Is a point me and the other guy made that still stand just fine.
I'd also like to add the point that the fact PP is shifting to a living rulebook is huge. They get the effect of a field test (large swaths of the playerbase using stuff) during the lifetime of the game. So they can fix some of the stuff they fucked up.
>>47348201
http://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?250428-BattleBox-Caster-Fluff
bookmark it because it'll update with future stories
>>47348391
wait I think I might have it...
>where top tier players are so specialized in the metagame that they can give bad advice...
Players get great at playing the _game_ but the better they get at the metagame the less they spot the framework/system the game takes place in. A good designer is working with the core system that everything takes place in and is able to see when they need to adjust that instead of tweaks to individual models.
So say in sports. In...basketball...IIRC the current rules governing how long you can hold the ball before having to pass are "newer". Before that change the game would favor a certain style of play involving solo attempts on the net. After that change the nature of the game changed to a more passing game. This isn't a change that could easily happen without a system level change and I'm sure many pro players that where invested in the old way of doing things where unhappy with the change.
>>47348390
That would be a pretty damn cool Character Warbeast.
Maybe a Light with stats on par with some of the heavies. Like how immortals are a lot stompier than comparable size infantry.
>>47348281
Magic is a prime example of how this would work so lets use it.
Red Deck Wins plays cheap guys and turns them side ways, it has burn spells to clear the path or to finish someone off. There is no real play decisions beyond "Do I have enough dudes?" "Is this hand keepable?" and "Do I need to burn this guy to bash to the face?" That is literally how a red deck plays for 90% of the games it will be in. If red is good in the meta then the top players don't have a big advantage over the worst. In fact some scrub kid could find red deck and dominate a tournament because no one else discovered just how broken it was (This happened with the elf combo deck which flipped it's deck onto the table turn 2).
Tournaments are not about finding a good balance, they're about breaking the game over your knee. If you ask a tournament player how to buff a bad unit he will try and push it up to the broken level because that's the only level he has any respect for. Many tournament players have zero desire to see powerful but random effects as they're not tourney viable, yet this is what a lot of casual players enjoy. If you let tourney players balance the game you will lose a lot of the stuff the average player enjoys. As a good player in many systems I can appreciate the random dumb things you can make happen in them, where as most tourney players I've met cannot.
>>47348477
Just make a heavy made of ancestral stones. Zaal tried to make an uber immortal but it went insane and uses the fury mechanic because they used warbeast blood in the creation of it. Character immortal warbeast raah smashy ancestor.
>>47348329
nice taumachine fgt
>>47348652
Tau are based on macross, that is way closer to Evangelion.
LEARN 2 WEEB OR GTFO
>>47348692
>not recognizing tau as crypto-jew communism
You keep enjoying that blue pill friend. ANIME SO KAWAII DESU~~~~~~~~
>>47348736
>Communism
>Caste system
Pick one you retard.
>>47348751
4 legs good 2 legs bad
>>47348764
I know, I've read animal farm and I'm a regular on /pol/ I'm just saying Tau aren't communist.
If we're using animal farm then all animals are equal, some are just more equal than others.
I'm polish guy from a few nights ago. what are the THREE biggest things you want to know about menoth?
>>47348764
>>47348792
How about you just don't talk about 40shit in Warmahordes general?
>>47348805
choir
>>47348805
Avatar, Amon
I doubt there'll be much disagreement over those choices.
>>47348805
Choir, Book, Vindictus
>>47348806
my only post in that discussion was solely about animal farm
>>47348817
>>47348821
only change to choir is no more +2 to att. rest is the same
avatar has 1" on the shield and it is now ps14. he costs 20. rest is the same
amon the PIMP has flashing blade, field marshal parry, (*) attack trip which knocks down on hit. he has tough.
i know I had pictures before, but these ones have a watermark with id, so i cant really risk it this time
>>47348805
Amon, Thyra and Testament
>>47348884
show some of the card around the water mark then.
>>47348884
heres some more proof, since >>47348870
is still a faggot
>>47348884
thanks man appreciate it and that's totally understandable. any chance you could show us beast mistress from legion? I'm really wondering what they've done to her
>>47348884
Do you have any Circle info?
I'm dying to know if/how Kromac2 changed.
>>47348751
>as if any implementation of communism has ever resulted in anything but a small group of centralized decision makers ruining everyone else's lives
Read a book baddie!
>>47348912
Kromac2 should HOPEFULLY stay mostly the same. Primal Howl might change with the lack of morale checks, but I really hope his feat stays the same.
>>47348899
Any info on the Old Witch?
>>47348944
I'm aware of the history of communism, but Tau don't say "We're all equal goy, just listen to those more equal than you". They say "Fuck you, do as you're told, your DNA says THIS!"
Tau are a caste based fascist system.
Any info on the Hydra myrmidon or houseguard thane?
>>47348986
weald secrets is now pathfinder and hunter
>>47349014
Cool, is she the same otherwise?
I have to say, I'm starving for Circle spoilers. If you don't have any that's alright. Just share whatever you think is cool!
Also, thanks!
>>47348988
Fascism is nationalistic, effectively racist. Tau are universal and non-racist.
>>47349247
>Muh racist
Uh huh. I'll be sure to take your opinion into account with it's incredibly inaccurate statements.
>>47349247
>>47349267
>>>/pol/
Take your shit there.
>>47349278
Is Cygnar communist?
>>47343413
>Makeda1 gets a considerable buff
Excuse me? Losing Defender's Ward is bad enough, but Savagery + Press Forward made for some serious infantry threat range. Nihilators could threaten 15".
>>47349348
It's a monarchy. Especially if Vinter is in charge now.
>>47349448
yea but is it a communist monarchy?
>>47349460
No it's a Communist free market Democracy under a Monarch.
>Hurr I can put words together and pigeonhole shit harder than a Facebook quiz
Personally I'm waiting for a full Skorne infantry spoiler since infantry was always the faction's weak point.
>>47349460
If my eyes roll any harder I'll attach turbines to them and solve our world wide energy problems.
>>47346224
I'm still amazed there hasn't been any Waufus of Everblight smut. I swear to god somebody at PP has a huge mind control fetish.
>>47349479
yea, but are you a virgin?
can we please see the witch coven?
