/btg/ is dead, long live /btg/!
Too Bad, Here Grenade Edition
Old Thread: >>47131179
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First Succession War
http://www.mediafire.com/download/dp9iiecoaz4c29k/E-CAT35235_BattleTech+First+Succession+War.pdf
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>/btg/ does a TRO:
http://builtforwar.blog(not spam)spot.com/
>How do I do this Against the Bot thing?
http://pastebin.com/pE2f7TR5
>Overview of the major factions?
http://bg.battletech.com/universe/great-houses/
http://bg.battletech.com/universe/the-clans/
http://bg.battletech.com/universe/other-powers/
>How do I find out what BattleMechs a faction has?
http://masterunitlist.info/
>Map of /btg/ players (WIP):
https://www.zeemaps.com/map?group=1116217&add=1
>BattleTech Introductory Info and PDFs
http://bg.battletech.com/?page_id=400
>Rookie guides
http://pastebin.com/HZvGKuGx
>Sarna.net - BattleTech Wiki
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Main_Page
>Megamek - computer version of BattleTech. Play with AI or other players
http://megamek.info/
Unit Designing Softwares
>SSW Mech Designer
http://www.solarisskunkwerks.com/
>MegaMek Lab
http://megameklab.sourceforge.net/
>BattleTech IRC
#battletech on irc.rizon.net
>PDF Folders
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/9q792hobnbpw3/Battletech
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/sdckg6j645z4j/Battletech
Gas the Clanners space war now
>>47164806
TUKAYYID BEST DAY OF MY LIFE
THE MASTER DID NOTHING WRONG
ONE BULLDOG WASN'T ENOUGH
>>47164871
>ONE BULLDOG WASN'T ENOUGH
Indeed. Need at good lance of 'em, at least.
Am I the only one who finds it absurd that the Bulldog didn't get even a single refit until the 3080s?
>>47165311
I'm with you on that.
>>47165311
>>47165374
>yfw the IS drowns the Clans in hundreds of thousands of Bulldogs
>>47165311
I'm more confused why more tanks aren't built around LB-10s, since they're the premier tank killer. Hell, if you made pic related with all those FCEs apparently no one used, the Demolisher is now a devastating midranged tank and mech hunter.
Quick question: what were the (old, I think) lance weight tonnage limits? IIRC past 280 tons was an assault lance, but I can't remember the other limits.
>>47165311
Is that a LRM5 and Large Laser on that Bulldog? Or is that just artist screwing up.
>>47166240
Yeah looks like an error. But twin LRM 5s would be a fairly simple variant, since the tonnage is the same as the SRM 4s.
Alternatively, the art was ahead of its time, the aforementioned 3080s variant mounts twin MML 5s.
Are there any mechs that work particularly well in combination with protos? What would make such a mech if none exists?
>>47166634
Not really? I can't think of much inherent to protos as a whole that would make a mech good or bad working with them, it would just come down to the individual models of both.
>>47166931
The one thing I can think of; certain tonnage might work better for carting around magclamp protos.
And in that same vein, TSM might be good as well.
>>47164806
>>47164871
Yes, that is right, bitch and moan and whine harder, you freebirth degenerates!
>>47167378
Bitch and whine? You space furries have lost consistently and badly. So badly you tantrumed and tore each other to pieces in a Succession Wars tier war.
>>47164871
>THE MASTER DID NOTHING WRONG
Incorrect. He turned the taskforce who's job it was to fuck up the homeworlds around. That was definitely not the correct decision
>>47167050
Well, the effects vary according to proto weight, so even that's tricky. I think proto magclamps are kind of crappy, given the weight they eat up and the fact that most protos are decently mobile on their own, combined with the MP hit the carrier takes, which will be at best -3 MP, at worst halved.
That said, mediums are a basically a must, since that's where you would have the potential speed and hauling capacity to be decent at it; a 40 ton mech could carry one 10 ton proto, or two 5 ton (or up to 8 tons if it's an omni) protos with only the -3 MP. So something like a Dragonfly, Fenris or Phantom would work okay there if you want to haul Minotaur Zs or Hobgoblins around.
>>47165954
Up to 130 for light, 200 for medium, 280 for heavy. Over that is assault.
I think it's different (higher) for tanks, but I can't remember any exact numbers
>>47164714
> this is a good plan
>>47165311
Cause it's a good solid tonk.
Though a SFE+ERLL Bulldog would be cool.
The year is 3059. You are a freelance mercenary, at loose ends on Outreach. What are you piloting? Who do you try to sign on with?
>>47166634
>Are there any mechs that work particularly well in combination with protos? What would make such a mech if none exists?
Well, unless you're a git who doesn't use Zell (and if you are, kill yourself now), Protos are supposed to operate as a Point. What you really want are designs that work well together within the Point, like HML Rocs and SRM Gorgons pumping las and missile fire downrange.
They have a couple basic weaknesses; they're slow for their relative fragility, they only rise one Level, and their longer-range weapons are usually pretty anemic. Good support for a Proto point usually means a) something big and scary for the enemy to freak out about and b) something that can take care of long-ranged Gauss and ERPPC fire. You're also weak to pulsefire, so be careful about what you walk them into.
You can also just pick Protos to deal with something your 'Mechs can't, like infantry and vehicle sweeping, at which point they're not technically bound by Zell and you don't have to give as much of a damn. That lets you focus your 'Mechs on 'Mech-killing.
Some of my favorite 'Mechs to bring along to a Proto Party are the Crimson Langur, the Mad Dog, and the Stooping Hawk, but I'm a Spirit player.
>>47167401
At least the furries only had ONE...
>>47170227
And that one did more relative damage than all four put together
>>47170258
One Clan trial to the death does more relative damage than all the Inner Sphere Succession Wars too. Two guys enter, one guy leaves. That's a 50% death rate.
>>47170303
A 1v1 trial doesn't have industrial, or infrastructure damage, nor does it have civilian casualties.
Shit, this is a red letter day. After Coordinator knows how many years of playing Battletech, a Crusader of mine finally 1) walked off the battlefield under its own power and not on a stretcher or in a dustbin and 2) destroyed its enemy too.
I'm stunned. The Crud actually only got a few dents from the Blackjack it was duelling with, and actually brewed the opponent up. Of course, it had to be the dishonorabru -3D and not a stock or a -3K, though.
>>47170556
Holy fuck.
The only intact crud I've ever had finish a game was because the pilot got hit in the face by one single LRM on the first turn, and then the next turn, ran,fell over, passed out and only finally woke up when the game was almost over and the enemy was too shot-up to kill it
Dumb question I'll get bullied for but will we ever see a mobile Battletech game? Something like Megamek for Android/IPhone. Mobile tech is getting more and more powerful and if I could play tabletop with a touchscreen tablet as the playing board that'd be pretty damn cool. No need to lug boards or minis around everywhere, only if you really want to play with them (and plenty of people still will.)
>>47170303
Given that there were battles in the SW that saw units reduced to below 14% strength on both sides, you're (a) comparing apples to pumpkins (battles are a better comparison to Trails than wars) and (b) wrong.
>>47170942
Ah, you do know that "casualties" doesn't mean "dead", right? A casualty is someone rendered unable to fight; for Battletech, that means they could be a healthy Mechwarrior who lost their ride, or the person could be wounded, or the person could be dead. There's no way to break it down any further, but IRL casualty rates in modern armored warfare generally have a casualty ratio of about 5 wounded and 1 dead soldier in every 6 actual casualties. So with a 100-man unit at 14% strength, ASSUMING that every single person who isn't combat-capable is either wounded or dead (which is false, but it weights the scales toward YOUR side of the argument), there's 86 casualties. Of those, given the 1-in-6 death rate which is the closest analogue we have, only about 14 of the casualties should be dead, and the rest wounded.
Which, relatively speaking, is way less of a death rate than any Clan.
>>47171131
You still can't compare a trial and a war. The scale is completely different, and a war factors in a bunch of other factors such as infrastructure and damage to industry.
Earlier, I posted about converting a few Heavy Gear minis into something that could work as a Griffin proxy.
Here are the results of a little time spent kitbashing.
I'm sorry about the mediocre lighting, but it's night here atm and I don't have an amazing setup.
The backs of these minis are pretty simple, but I used some spare 1/100 scale ISU-152 muzzle brakes to build some jump jets.
XOTL, would you kindly eratta away the turret restriction of the iHGR on large naval support vessels?
OK, so in the light of the announcement about ilClan and CGL's inability to write a storyline, imagine that CGL put out another post that says, essentially, that they're actually incapable of finishing in the storyline in a way that wouldn't utterly destroy what's left of the fanbase. They feel that they have only two options with the franchise.
1) Complete reboot and new rules. Inspired by the old rules, but with things like better math and more-thought-through factional portrayals. Aside from the rules, all the fluff is up in the air and you can't count on any given part of it moving forward to BT2.0.
2) Shutter the franchise completely and sit on it (so nobody else can produce a BT game) for at least 10 years before considering maybe bringing it back someday. For practical purposes, they're going to kill the entire game until/unless a new generation of tabletop gamers emerges.
Which would you prefer and why?
>>47171317
I would prefer the former. However, they have Jellico and GhostBear and MadCap as writers/devs and people like Alexander Knight as rules gurus, so like fuck they'd be able to manage it.
The way they're spinning their wheels right now we may effectively get number two any way.
>>47171317
Ditching everything distinctive about BattleTech would be tantamount to shuttering the franchise, so those options are functionally identical. Also, option 1 would suffer the same problems that they're trying to escape from in the premise.
>>47171317
So basically, the fate of the Star Wars EU or the fate of a hundred other RPGs?
I'll take the first one every day of the week and twice on sunday.
At worst, it keeps battletech on life support with a slow flow of people getting into the older version, and at best it's an actual improvement.
The second kills battletech aside from the groggiest of old grogs and the occasional kid who finds the books in the used bin at his FLGS and is like "I wanna play this". Yes, even more than it's like that currently
Were the Lyran mechs that guard the Archon's Throneroom on hand when Clan Wolf Elementals Stormed the Palace on Tharkad and killed the Archon in the Dark Age?
>>47171131
>Which, relatively speaking, is way less of a death rate than any Clan.
[citation needed]
>>47171317
>1) Complete reboot and new rules. Inspired by the old rules, but with things like better math and more-thought-through factional portrayals. Aside from the rules, all the fluff is up in the air and you can't count on any given part of it moving forward to BT2.0.
This is the best option of the two you posited, but honestly, I cannot see anyone but the diehard gamers already in the BT fandom being okay with it. Too many people have given in to the sense of tribalism that the setting offers to wipe out all the fluff and start over. Hell, how many fans did they drive off by saying the FedSuns had a rough few years? A lot of people I know who enjoy the franchise are already tenuous about staying with it anymore. Which is sad, but it's where we're at.
Honestly, they've got a great opportunity to "restart" things if they'd just nut up and do it. Resolve things with the ilClan book, without touching the Homeworld Clans. Leave them be for now. Purge and wipe IS factions as needed, without warping the originals too much for comfort. Do Herb's idea of the time warp forward. You don't need to streamline tech too much, nor make too many things obsolete, in order to set up for a fresh take on things. Give people their beloved old factions (version 2.0), give Clanners who got their factions stomped the ass-pull of "well, in the homeworlds, eventually the Star Cobras got so big they split off into new clans based on the old originals given by Nicky K," put some new people in charge of the direction of the lore from here on out, and ditch the grimderp of the last decade or so for the good old "lived in, rough around the edges, and violent" flavor that it used to have. Boom, fresh starts all around.
I hope for too much, I know.
Just restart the game in 3025 with mechs being rare and handed down in families and their pilots equated with knights of old.
What could go wrong? :DDDD
>>47171232
Looks good, Anon. I'd happily play against you.
>>47172041
So Dark Ages?
>>47172707
Pretty sure that was the joke.
>>47172911
>>47172041
Are we blaming CGL for the Dork Ages now? Or is this an ebin eksdee thing?
I mean CGL are handling things VERY poorly, but you can't really pin the DA on them.
>>47171317
Option 1, BUT, it has to have the stipulation that things will progress to their logical conclusions. No more "lol the CC survives because reasons". Either give them enough worlds to actually be a credible state or sentence them to death during the 4th SW. If the FRR is gonna exist make it the proper DMZ that it should have been instead of some kind of fucking weird ComStar-guided pissing and moaning session. Make the 4th SW take a huge toll on the DC and LA, making it so founding the FRR is literally the best option to keep something like that war from ever happening again. Maybe make it so the FS, FWL, and CC have to step in because someone breaks the Ares Convention and they force the FRR accord. I dunno. But it needs to make sense. Everything they do needs to make sense. If they aren't gonna do that, then they should kill the license so someone else can take a crack at it. Because right now the poor franchise is on life support with Dr. Nick Riviera as its assigned physician.
>>47171317
2, because those clowns wouldn't be capable of 1 if they're not capable of wrapping this up.
Oh man, I just finished rereading Star Lord and now I'm really, really tempted to spring the plot on my players as my upcoming mechwarrior campaign, since none of them know much about the lore.
Talk me out of it, /btg/
>>47173744
But then they'll see it coming when you do the same with Far Country!
>>47173744
do it
>>47173744
Do it, and report back with results.
So if a Clan finds itself short on True Born (Elementals included), but with an overabundance of Battle Armor (doesn't matter what kind) are they going to start issuing them to second line Freeborn, Bondsmen and "volunteers" (conscripts)?
>>47174340
Probably not.
More likely they'll just try to shore up the holes with conventional infantry until they can get more True Born. Aside from the whole honor thing, it takes a lot to train someone in using Battle Armor.
>>47174340
Depends on the Clan.
Hard-core dickbags like the Jags, Falcons, and Vipers don't want freeborns in the warrior caste any way and would try to make do with what they have.
Other Clans realise it's gonna take them almost 20 years to get Trueborn into the warrior caste so it's better to have warm bodies around. Stuff the Frees into Second-Line/PGC/Para-Military units and move the better personnel from those units to the front line in the meantime.
>>47174340
There are such things as freeborn elementals. If you wash out of training, no matter your genotype, you can be whatever. Then your kids will be the same too. In fact there would be a bunch of them working as battle armor techs or even mech techs.
>>47174340
You forgot they can trade these battle armors for something they need more or that they could issue Trials of Possession for true born elementals. Both options are more probable to happen before they start training non-elementals
>>47174398
>it takes a lot to train someone in using Battle Armor.
Not so much this, as that Elementals are freakin' bodybuilder basketball players, and it's somewhat difficult for normal humans to use equipment designed for them.
Since IWM has its Archive-fee-free thing going on right now, what minis from the archive should I hop on? Already planning on buying a Blitzkrieg, and I was also planning on buying a Burrock. Anything else that I should buy, or potentially replace the Burrock with?
>>47174529
Using Battle Armor of any kind has always been mentioned as something you need a lot of intense training for.
And yeah, most armor needs to be custom fitted, since gaps between your skin and the inside layer can fuck up your controls.
>>47174529
They got rid of the attribute requirements to use BA in the recent version of the rules though.
You could literally be built like pre-serum Captain America and fight as well as or better in BA than Lincoln Osis now.
>>47174529
Inner sphere blokes, who are known to generally not be elemental-sided, have been able to pilot Elemental suits with only standard fitting, so trained non-elemental freeborns could, too
>>47174340
>So if a Clan finds itself short on True Born (Elementals included), but with an overabundance of Battle Armor (doesn't matter what kind) are they going to start issuing them to second line Freeborn, Bondsmen and "volunteers" (conscripts)?
Depends on the clan.
The blood spirits are known for doing exactly this, but people like clan JAG HARDER and green birds and snakes wouldn't
>>47174671
Jaguars have done it before but it's very rare.
>>47174868
Really?
>>47174868
Really?
I'm guessing this was at the very bitter end, yeah?
>>47174927
There's at least one case I remember. I'll see if I can't dig through my sourcebooks to find it in a bit. I mean the mainstream Jag philosophy was still Jag harder anyway so I can only assume some Star Colonel had a Russou Howell moment and did it for his own amusement.
So, with the artist's permission, I wanted to share a few shots of my ex-CoimGuard mech unit, the ComGuardians. They're a mech unit in the early Dark Ages (3090ish). It's got some unusual mech choices for sure (the Solaris mechs are because the unit was stationed on Solaris during the Jihad, the Clan mechs are retrofitted salvage, and the Mackie is just because I like it).
This pic is the CO and XO mechs, a King Crab and a custom Hunchback (it mounts a Gauss Rifle and an ER Large Laser). Two more pics incoming.
>>47174991
>yeah
I believe you meant "quiaff" you surat.
>>47175052
The first 3 L2's, including most of the unusual mechs.
>>47175052
>>47175068
The other L2s.
>>47175052
Wouldn't a former ComGuard unit sporting that white scheme made infamous by WoB (even if Com* used it too) in the 3090s attract a lot of negative attention?
>>47175052
>>47175068
>>47175083
Pretty neat, anon.
They look pretty great
>>47175058
Neg, I meant what I said. I's not a clanrat like you, trashborn
>>47175138
They operate mostly in the Periphery and have a lengthy service record *against* the Word. It generally works out, though yeah, they've had a lot of negative attention in the past. It's one reason they're not a larger unit.
>>47175169
What the fuck did you just fucking say, you stravag little bitch? I will have you know I tested out top of my sibko in the Mattlov-Pryde group, and I have been involved in numerous raids on Clan Wolf, and I have over 300 confirmed kills. I am trained in zellbrigen warfare and I am the top duelist in the entire Jade Falcon touman. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before in the Inner Sphere or Periphery, mark my fucking words. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over the Chatterweb? Think again, surat. As we speak I am contacting my network the Watch across the invasion corridor and your HPG is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, freebirth. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You are fucking dead, wet-nose. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that is just in unaugmented combat. Not only am I extensively trained in unaugmented combat, but I have access to the entire arsenal of the Falcon clan and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your little trashborn ass off the face of the Sphere, you little savashri puke. If only you could have known what unholy retribution your little “clever” comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you could have held your fucking tongue. But you could not, you did not, and now you are paying the price, you dezgra idiot. I will shit fury all over you and you will drown in it. You are fucking dead, freebirth.
I've got a clan-related question: In the 3058-67, how common would clan defectors be?
How rare would they be in house units, mercenary units, pirate bands?
>>47175240
10/10
>>47175258
Uncommon, but slightly more common with the death of the Jaguars and the abjuration of the Cats.
Those taken as bondsmen, a small number, in house units. Maybe some in merc units but I imagine most would bondsref themselves.
The one in pirate bands would most likely just be survivors eking out an existence in their own Clanner-only pirate bands. There were quite a few Jaguars that had that fate, sadly.
>>47175289
Don't forget the Dark Caste operating in the Clan OZs
>>47175052
>>47175068
>>47175083
King Crab looks great.
Too much paneling on the Hunchie.
NEA forgot to do the Highlander's cockpit glass
Man, /BTG/ really hates clannersgood
>>47174340
Can a non-elemental caste even use clan battle armour? In fluff and art, they are 7.5 feet tall and have 30% more muscle mass than your average human, specially bred beyond the natural top-end of even a tube born human.
Pic related.
>>47175315
>Too much paneling on the Hunchie.
It's display quality, I kinda like the different look.
Also, he did do the Highlander's cockpit, it's just really hard to see because I'm a failure with photos. Looking at it straight on, you can see it well.
>>47175320
I don't mind what they did to the setting.
I just don't want them to win.
>>47175331
According to whats said they can.
However only an Elemental can utilize it to it's fullest.
>>47175258
Rare but not unheard of. Maybe 1 in 200 for mercs and house units?
Maybe 1 in 150 for pirates, on account of there aren't actually many pirates and the jag-pirate boys.
My personal idea about this is that after the invasion, a lot of the types who would have gone bandit caste would end up defecting to the IS instead, with maybe some of the more disgruntled ones going as far as to merc out
>>47175320
I'm rather a fan of the Horses.
They seem to enjoy military innovation and don't seem as abusive as the other Clans do.
Well not until they joined on with Malvina's "Golden Ordun" shenanigans anyway.
The Snow Ravens are also a favorite.
>>47175320
I like the Smoke Jaguars and Nova Cats, but with *both* of them dead now I've moved on to the Spirit Cats.
Also like the Snow Ravens for aerospace stuff, and the Jade Falcons for fluff.
>>47175320
I liked the clans they way they were originally presented: as a group of terrifyingly insane techno-barbarians who came here to try and impose their insane and horrific vision of a perfect world on the Inner Sphere. At most, you could have sympathetic defectors and the occasional honorable foe, but as a whole the clans were a evil nightmare.
More than anything I dislike clanaboos, really. And I especially dislike that they are allowed to write about the clans
Clans I like
>Jade Falcon (evil)
>Sea Fox
>Cloud Cobra
>Wolverine
>Snow Raven
>Goliath Scorpion
>Steel Viper (Wars of Reaving)
Clans I dislike
>Wolf
>Ghost Bear
>Coyote (pre Wars of Reaving)
>Fire Mandrill
>Jade Falcon (eternal second-best at everything good guys)
>Star Adder
Everyone else I am neutral
>>47175690
>And I especially dislike that they are allowed to write about the clans
You know how stupid this sounds, right?
>>47175690
>a group of terrifyingly insane techno-barbarians
Who oddly enough did less damage to the Sphere than the Sphere has done to itself in the time since the Star League's dissolution.
>>47175809
There shouldn't be an "about" in there, I fucked up with the predictive typing thingy
>>47175823
The term you want is "ironically".Turns out the real monster was Man all along, etc.
>>47175823
>Muh blood of Kerensky
>>47175823
>Who oddly enough did less damage to the Sphere than the Sphere has done to itself in the time since the Star League's dissolution.
Only because they lost at tukkyad. IG they'd won, the overall consequences would have been much, much worse
>>47175883
Which is hilarious, considering the many and varied utter atrocities that the star league perpetuated on humanity
>>47175823
>Institutionalized caste systems and slavery are good, guys!
>>47175785
>Jade Falcon
>evil
>>47175823
>>47175867
>>47175890
>>47175927
The best part is that it isn't even ironic. The Great Houses did all the awful shit that they did for exactly the same reasons as the Clans and even the WoB: to establish another Star League with themselves as the bosses.
>muh star league
Has been the cause of a good 90% of all the terrible shit in the battletech universe from the year it was founded all the way to 3150 and most assuredly will continue to after that
>>47175965
What's inherently wrong with them?
>>47176016
It could be with you
>>47175965
>Report CLAN posts
>Hide CLAN posts
>Ignore CLAN posts
>>47175992
Goddamn I wish the made a DvD...
>>47176016Sauce plz?
>>47175927
>atrocities
See you at the party, Forlough.
>>47176329
I could again point out the janitor fixed the post from an IP jump on public wifi, but you'd rather post off topic and try to "prove" something, blatantly available in the archives.
You're making no friends, love. Back to giant robots and space eugenics.
>>47170908
I actually looked into making a megamek type game for mobile last year, and decided not to even try.
I also remember coming across someone else trying to straight port megamek to android as a pet project and it had the worst mobile UI I've ever seen.
We we ever see one? Probably. Done well in the next 2-3 years? Probably not.
>>47176427
I remember years ago, someone trying to use the bare bones and graphics engine of Mechcommander to build a battletech game off of, but it kinda fell off the face of the earth.
I'd love to play that again, no idea how to get it to work on win7.
>>47176425
>I could again point out the janitor fixed the post from an IP jump on public wifi, but you'd rather post off topic and try to "prove" something, blatantly available in the archives.
I'm actually interested in seeing how this is "proven" given that janitors don't post afaik.
>>47176425
I'm fairly sure you are a janitor, given that every time someone posts against you they get their post deleted. I've seen it both here and in /aag/
I have never seen someone else post something like "fuck off gropey" and have it deleted without a more general thread scrubbing.
>>47176629
As in, it deleted, but not by the user. Also, im on a smart phone, and some posts at the same time were from a comp.
>>47176659
If I was, I would have lost that power long ago.
Now, enough derailing the thread.
>>47176702
>Also, im on a smart phone, and some posts at the same time were from a comp.
Gee, you don't say
I like plastic miniatures better than metal.
How much of a faggotron am I?
>>47176838
Battletech isn't warmachine. I love the starter box plastics, and regularly use some of the Clickwarrior darkage sculpts.
>>47176864
You're not helping
Challenge: take your favorite IS mech design that doesn't have a IIC model, and make one
>>47177031
>Albatross IIC
that might actually be good.
>>47177019
Thanks anon.
>>47177031
FIRESTARTER! Wait, shit.
I guess i'll try and save the Ceasar...
>>47177060
I made a heavy Albatross IIC once, it worked amazingly well
>>47177031
>Bandersnatch IIC
Hrmm.
>>47177031
>Mackie IIC
MAXIMUM HERITAGE
The problem is going to be figuring out what to do with all that tonnage without compromising the mackie-ness of the design
>>47177172
Reinforced structure
>>47177172
>The problem is going to be figuring out what to do with all that tonnage without compromising the mackie-ness of the design
Your answer is simple.
Bigger crotch gun.
>>47177197
Good call. Very Mackie like.
>>47177197
A bit too high-tech for a Mackie. Good suggestion, though
>>47177208
It's gonna be a LPL, -5S style. I'm already putting one CERPPC in the arm, so I kinda feel that putting one in the CT is a bit too cheesy in a design as zombie as the big mack
>>47177259
I was gonna say CT gauss with two CASEd ammo bins below it on either side.
>>47177197
>>47177226
>>47177259
Do the clans even have reinforced structure?
>>47177289
You can't fit a GR, not even a clan one into a mech's CT without a compact engine or gyro m8
>>47177397
Im crunching layout now. I just want to oneshot someone's command mech with a railgun-dick.
>>47177327
Yep.
well, here's my shot at the Mackie IIC.
it's part -9H, part -5S
>>47177031
>Atlas
Welp.
>>47171317
>Alpin Wolf becomes First Lord/ilkhan
>Reveals his heritage
>All potential enemies for the next century die of aneurysms.
900 years later, mankind has replaced giant stompy robots with grav tanks. The ilClan has devolved into a corrupt, evil empire.
In the far corners of known space, a resistance is formed... calling itself the Federated Commonwealth.
>>47178115
Oh, good. Then CGL can have ANOTHER failed Leviathans.
hey guys
I just picked up an ancient copy of The Mercenary's Handbook, and it's given me an idea
you know how we sometimes do MW3/FMMR unit generation?
I was thinking that five of us could each take one of the existing merc unit generation systems (MHB, MHB 3055, FMM, FMMR, MS I) and create a unit that way in the thread at the same time, and compare results
Not necessarilly my favorite, but I've fiddled around with the idea of a Kintaro IIC before.
>>47178356
Of course, since the Kintaro and its Narc is generally more of a team oriented mech that doesn't jive as much with Clanners, I made a more single combat focused sort. With quite possibly too much ammo.
>>47176838
You aren't. I love working with plastic, the transport is easier for large formations and the models don't tip over as easily.
I'm actually surprised at the lack of a Stalker IIC, Emperor IIC, Nightstar IIC or Battlemaster IIC.
Guess the clans decided that turning the pixie into an assault was a better plan than updating the assaults that they already had
>>47178597
>that shad
GEE BILLY
>>47178611
>Battlemaster IIC
This sort of exists. The Battlemaster C (I have no idea why it's not called a IIC, because it *is* the Beemer IIC) is a 3070 rebuild around a HAG-30, a bunch of medium-class lasers, a Tcomp, and an ATM-6 on the shoulder. It's from RS:Phoenix Upgrades.
There's also the Red Corsair's Battlemaster (OTP:Red Corsair), which actually becomes a regular production model for (IIRC) the Wolf Empire (TRO 3150).
Either one works as a "Beemer IIC".
>>47178611
>Nightstar IIC
Probably because the regular nightstar is already disgustingly good, and a clantech variant would just be adding insult to injury
>>47178724
Ohohoho, is it time?
>>47178695
I'm of the opinion the production model of the Red Corsair Beemer is the IIC, as the weapon layout matches the Royal Beemers pretty near exactly. Granted, OOC the Corsair's came first so it's likely the devs made the Royal model to match it, but it fits.
In my headcannon the Wolf production in the Dark Age is just new production, and the design existed as a refit of cached SLDF BattleMasters as far back as the Golden Century.
>>47178845
well, at least it's expensive as shit so there's at least kind of a downside
>>47178628
Because of the Swordsman, Timmy. Because of the Swordsman.Also because Helmar Valasek was a Davion officer before he fled to the Periphery, so I have a couple of -2Ds, a primitive Dervish, and some Valks in the Raiders
>>47179420
>Because of the Swordsman, Timmy. Because of the Swordsman.
HOLY SHIT SOMEONE ELSE KNOWS THE SWORDSMAN
FUCK ME TENDER ANON, FUCK ME TENDER
>>47175331
What do you think happens to all the Elementals that wash out? They become laborers and have giant kids.I'd wager there are more elemental-sized people in the civilian castes than the warrior caste.
>>47179781
I thought that they just shunted them into regular infantry if they wash out of Elemental training.
Regular infantry is the lowest of the low as far as the clans military is concerned, but they still have them and a guy who can bench press a car has to be useful when you're fighting on the ground.
>>47179781
Didn't the caste you washed out into depend on how you did during the tests? I remember Aidan going into the technician caste, anyway. So it's entirely possible for your buff giant to end up in a lab coat.
>>47178611
>Stalker IIC
Already exists. Blood Kite.
>>47179842
>I thought that they just shunted them into regular infantry if they wash out of Elemental training.
AFAIK, that's literally an entirely Blood Spirit and like two other clan thing. otherwise, it's whatever "please save me from slave labor" caste you manage to second-best into
>>47180000
Combination of how well you went in the tests and what the Clan needs.
If you test as the greatest violin player in Clan history but what they need is someone to work in IT, guess where you're going to wind up."Have you tried turning it off and on again?"
>>47180021
>the greatest violin player in Clan history
So, a Clan player who knows how to play the violin?
>>47180010
>AFAIK, that's literally an entirely Blood Spirit and like two other clan thing
Blood Spirits, Hell's Horses, and Steel Vipers all have conventional infantry to wash into. Ghost Bears do secondary testing for late-stage washouts, but you're just as likely to end up a MechWarrior as a tanker in their system (depending on the Clan's needs and your talents, and also how easily you can squeeze your massive Elemental frame into a cockpit).
All Clans have SOME conventional infantry, albeit as solamha or law enforcement subcaste troops. Only the three mentioned above (and I suppose the Stone Lions, if you go in for that sort of thing) have a real love for them, though.
>>47180021
You bastard, now I'm hearing the new emergency services jingle in my head.
>>47180010
Didn't the solahma (?) infantry come into being much later than the castes? Before that, the ground pounding was strictly for 'Mechs and elementals. And maybe vees, depending on your clan.
>>47180058
>you're just as likely to end up a MechWarrior as a tanker in their system
One of their Khans was a former MechWarrior who washed out into the aerospace forces and did even better than the big eyes, small mouth crew. Also, considering how well matched the Clan and IS aerospace forces were, I wonder if any of the Clan higher-ups ever thought "you know, maybe we're wasting resources in breeding these aerospace pilots?"
>>47180085
>I wonder if any of the Clan higher-ups ever thought "you know, maybe we're wasting resources in breeding these aerospace pilots?"
The Bears are noted, actually, for having not adopted the Aero phenotype, instead breeding for improved baseline instead. The other Clans eventually started to catch on towards the start of the Jihad, but by then Protos were becoming widespread, so there's that.
>>47180070
>Didn't the solahma (?) infantry come into being much later than the castes? Before that, the ground pounding was strictly for 'Mechs and elementals. And maybe vees, depending on your clan.
not quite so. conventional infantry predated Elementals in literally every clan, but only the meanest, poorest oldest-schoolest bastard clans kept up the conventional infantry as a standard unit that works ALONGSIDE the elementals and not a death sentence for old folks like other clans.
FWIW, the Blood Spirits had the most "balanced" clan as Mechs VS tanks VS BA VS foot infantry went, all the way to the bitter end. the only people who were matched/beat them as tanks go were the Hell's Horses.
Also, the whole "all warriors are warriors, but mechwarriors are better than pilots, tankers and infantry" thing mostly postdates the creation of the clans by rather a while, but only the Blood Spirits, being obsessively retro and stubborn, didn't change with the years on that subject
>>47179781
....I could have sworn that the Jade Phoenix trilogy made it clear that trashborn were traditionally sterile, because the one wash out girl from the MC's sibco became science caste, and figured out how to get pregnant through clanSCIENCE!
>>47180000
I also remember Elementals being (wrongly) stereotyped as dumb brutes, even by other trueborn. Of course, this is wrong, and there were several Khans who were elementals.
>>47180128
I though solahma were the old soldiers who couldn't pilot a mech anymore, and were typically seen as honorably expendable?
>>47180183
>trashborn were traditionally sterile
Actually, if I remember correctly, female trueborns had to have injections to suppress their reproductive systems while serving as warriors (which in theory, should be the entirety of their lives). If they wash out into a lower caste, it'd be either the ending of such injections/treatments or the removal of whatever implant they use, as well as some fertility shots, to bring them up to where civvies are at.
Males don't have any such suppressions put on their reproductive systems, if I recall correctly.
>>47180183
>I though solahma were the old soldiers who couldn't pilot a mech anymore
it's not that they CAN'T, it's just that nicky K was a sociopathic fetishist who decided that past christmas cake+5=too old to warrior unless they're bloodnamed, because nicky K.
from everything that IS mechwarriors have proved, it's that ~80-100 is the age out point for mechwarriors, which puts the lie to clan logic but good
solahma shit amounts to "if they're not young enough for me to want to fuck, they are too old and should die" elevated to a rule for the entirety of clan society
>>47180247
>it's just that nicky K was a sociopathic fetishist who decided that past christmas cake+5=too old to warrior unless they're bloodnamed, because nicky K.
Nicholas Kerensky didn't say shit about that. Ageism is the result of constant Trials of Position showing that older warriors lose their edge in skill and speed. There is some insulation with rank. Bloodnamed aren't exempt because they have a Bloodname, they're still subjected to the same Trials but do better and remain in service at higher rank longer.
>>47180128
Plus, the Elemental phenotype was first being worked on by the Horses specifically to be conventional infantry.
>>47180398
Of course, the better K showed the clans exactly how much age limits the kicking of butt.
>>47180446
Precisely.
They got their Bloodnames because they were fucking awesome. Because they were fucking awesome, they kept acing their Trials of Position. Because they kept acing those Trials, they stayed as active warriors.
It's not "hurr muh age durr," it's whether they're good enough or not. The way the Clan system works, if you're performing worse at your job than a cadet who just cleared their first ToP, you get canned and they get your job.
Simples.
>>47180403
Horses were breeding big guys (obligatory 4U) but not actual Elementals. The Wolves swapped them BA for those genetic legacies and refined them to Elemental level.
>>47180398
>Ageism is the result of constant Trials of Position showing that older warriors lose their edge in skill and speed.
It's kind of interesting that, in marked contrast to the clans, the best and most dangerous inner sphere mechwarriors are mostly older, with decades of experience rather than young and 'talented'. Maybe the way that neurohelms work mean that a mind with experience and good mental reactions well more than makes up for muscle reflex degradation over the years? I dunno.
Maybe clan nurohelm designs are rigged to be more focused on physical reflexes that mental ones, or else clan medicine is worse at preventing physical degradation than IS medicine is, maybe even because of the agism? Who knows.
>>47180475
>>47180496
Maybe the difference in ages is because of what the clans consider to make a good/great warrior VS the IS militaries?
I'd wager that a lot of IS pilots who died young but blazing out and a lot of solahma would have made amazing warriors in the other side's system, but things didn't work out that way.
>>47179781
>What do you think happens to all the Elementals that wash out?
I just assumed they were placed in Malvina's bondsman harem.
>>47180496
>clan medicine is worse at preventing physical degradation than IS medicine is
I think that would the other way round, seeing as the Clans retained the Star League medical tech and people during Ye Glorious Days of Olde were mentioned have an average life expectation of 120 years.
More likely it's just the application of that tech: the Clans don't see the benefit of using that tech to prolong age, since you're better off living fast, dying young and leaving a good-looking corpse.
>>47180544
>I just assumed they were placed in Malvina's bondsman harem.
Yeah, maybe if they're 14
>>47180547
>and people during Ye Glorious Days of Olde were mentioned have an average life expectation of 120 years.
Seeing as most clanners, military or civilian, don't live to 70, evidently they've either lost that tech or deliberately stopped using it for their own crazy reasons
>>47180496
>It's kind of interesting that, in marked contrast to the clans, the best and most dangerous inner sphere mechwarriors are mostly older, with decades of experience rather than young and 'talented'.
They're wily and experienced.
Think of them as professional athletes in football or basketball. When they're young, they can rely on their reflexes, speed, and strength. As they get older, they get slower and weaker and compete against people who are faster and stronger. You have to rely more on skill.
In terms of percentage, the IS' best MechWarriors are hilariously outclassed by the Clans. The average Clan warrior, by the Field Manuals, is Veteran trending towards Elite (as opposed to the upper end Regular of the IS).
In terms of population, the Clans are shitting out 1/2 and 2/3 pilots by the truckload, with 3/4 considered barely viable. The IS aged combat veteran in your hypothetical in their prime is roughly where a decent Clan warrior *starts.*
There's an argument to be made as to experience and strategic ability since those seem to be linked on either side of the Clan/IS split but in terms of piloting ability and tactics the Clans churn out notably better personnel. There's just a limited amount of slots to go around so the moment someone falters they get replaced.
>>47180580
>There's just a limited amount of slots to go around so the moment someone falters they get replaced.
That must be pretty damn bad for unit cohesion, though I don't expect that the authors thought about that
>>47180547
Yeah, even if you're super awesome, the main concern is using your genes to make the next generation of warriors more awesome than keeping you around as long as possible.
>>47180561
Same reason bidding became a thing. It has to do with what resources you're allotted, all that minimal expenditure stuff they developed from having to scrape a living off the barely habitable rocks of the homeworlds.
"We could clone a perfect limb for you and make you look like nothing ever happened. But shit that would take like a whole two months more than slapping this cheap ass prosthetic on that will give you pain for the rest of your short miserable life. Here ya go!"
>>47180606
Why do you think the old school clan warfare was based around duels and not cohesive units?
The combination of excess resources from conquered IS worlds and fighting cohesive units in the IS caused them to rethink some of their strategies, but the bloodname bottleneck should still cripple a lot of that.
That all tends to get forgotten lately though in terms of the clans.
>>47180580
>Think of them as professional athletes in football or basketball. When they're young, they can rely on their reflexes, speed, and strength. As they get older, they get slower and weaker and compete against people who are faster and stronger. You have to rely more on skill.
From how the novels describe mech piloting, it sounds more like competitive shooting than football in terms of requisite skills. And in my experience as a amateur shooter who's shot with pros, it's mostly an old man's game. The best guys that I've seen are between 45-65 and have been at it for 25-55 years.
Hell, I'd bet all my damn money on a guy with four tours in Vietnam and gulf war I (old IS pilot) and no dualtime against a fast young guy who's fought a dozen western-style duals (clan) in a real-world gunfight.
This is probably why the clans generally got whupped once their extreme tech advantage (3025 shit VS clantech) was reduced
Dumb question, but does anyone have the crittertek pdf? All this talk about clan furries makes me want to see what kind of jokes they made about them in there.
>>47180708
>This is probably why the clans generally got whupped once their extreme tech advantage (3025 shit VS clantech) was reduced
If you read the novels, the Jags get BTFO because the IS is hitting each Cluster with 3 regiments of effective force (WiE/Nova Cat Clusters and ComStar Divisions subbing in as Regiments).
The Great Refusal is 100% drivel with the Clans acting like utter retards.
Even when the tech gap is mostly covered the Clans still outperform the IS in numerical terms, they need a smaller force to accomplish the same ends in the Jihad and beyond.
>>47181326
Fucking furfag fiat...
>>47181503
>let's ignore previous versions of the boardand RP game rules and novels, Clan Aero pilots suck now XD
>let's have Clans that are noted for their adherence to Zellbrigen randomly violate it at the worst possible time so the IS can stomp them XD
>let's have Clans that are noted as giving no fucks about Zell suddenly cling to it like crazy in ways that let the IS stomp them XD
>also there's no Build or Strength requirement for Battle Armour any more so the Elemental phenotype is pointless and retarded XD
Yes, so much fiat.
>>47181546
>Clan Aero pilots suck now
IIRC it's been mentioned since ages ago that the difference between IS and Clan ASF pilots was not nearly as big as that between the mechwarriors, especially when talking about Drac and Rasalhague pilots.
>>47180857
IIRC, it's in one of the OP MF bins.
>>47181565
Yeah, no. In MW2 (the book, not the vidya), the standard Clan aerospace pilot had Gunnery 1, Piloting 2.
>>47181565
Average skill levels for Clan ASF pilots were better in the first version of the BT Compendium, and the Phenotype conferred bonuses when dealing with high-G manoeuvres that gave them the ability to more reliably position their ASFs in a better position.
The reason Tyra Miraborg is able to keep up with Clan pilots is that she's exceptional, not that they're all shit-tier herp derpers.
I can completely buy Stackpole wanting to give Marthe Pryde a sick burn on Asa Taney, but Stackpole _also_ wrote novels where IS characters are sitting around slack-jawed in amazement at what Clan aerojocks are doing.
It's a consistency issue and, I'd say, mostly tied to the end of the Clans being a narrative threat. Prince of Havoc is basically there to clear the board for the Civil War plotline. The only Clan that's going to be vaguely relevant to that is the Falcons, which is why the Falcons don't suck and everyone else does.
Need I remind you of the whole "I'm going to find out who killed Morgan Hasek-Davion and make that fucker pay" scene, and the payoff for that?Hint: There is no payoff. Victor promptly forgets all about it because the authors did too.
>>47181626
I'll also mention that back then, the AVERAGE Clan mechwarrior was a 2/3. All the Clanners fell down and banged their heads hard though the revisions.
>>47181626
Sweet jesus. Do you know the wonderful strafing runs I could do with a squadron of those guys?
>>47181687
I know, right? Now give these superhuman mutants Clan hardware, and add in the joy of fighting against Clans before BV1 ever came out, and you'll understand why old grogs had such a hateboner for the Clans.
>>47181714
Which was backed up by the fluff. The constant revision of technology and piloting skill means that the Clans' blitz through the IS makes less sense now than when they were "Kerensky's kids got SWOLE AS FUCK!"
Now that I think about it, even if I think the tech renaissance makes sense, the proliferation doesn't. Especially since it retroactively makes all of the IS leaders complete fucking idiots when confronted with double heat sinks and ER lasers. Though it makes:
>Indeed. With an army of such 'Mechs, we could make Blake's dream of a united humanity a reality in short order. Myndo stared through the image at Focht. "I shall order our armorers to modify our existing Catapults to this configuration."
and
>Myndo's mouth went sour. New technology in the hands of someone other than ComStar! "That's terrible!
utterly hilarious.
>>47181626
That's funny. In the first BoK book Clan aerospace fighters got lit up and taken out by regular IS counterparts. So much for that inbred skill.
>>47181915
Myndo always struck me as something of a wannabe try-hard big bad guy (or gal) who desperately wants to be the greatest plotter who ever plotted, but then someone always outmanoeuvred her and she's be left cursing to catch them next time like Dr Claw.
>New technology in the hands of someone other than ComStar! "That's terrible!
But didn't people already have L2 tech (even before the 3039 stuff), since in the very next novel there's a typically Stackpolean infodump where the midget scientist extols upon the virtues of pulse lasers and whatnot? Or was NAIS completely free of ROM penetration?
>>47181951
>it's a "Stackpole tries to explain something scientific" chapter
>>47181943
Well, of course. Novel plot ALWAYS trumps the reality laid out in the rulebooks, even if it requires serious neurological damage to all the participants to get there.
>>47181951
>But didn't people already have L2 tech (even before the 3039 stuff), since in the very next novel there's a typically Stackpolean infodump where the midget scientist extols upon the virtues of pulse lasers and whatnot? Or was NAIS completely free of ROM penetration?
That infodump happens in 3051 after the Dragoons conference where they give everyone good toys. Waterly is freaking out in 3049. Clovis Holstein refit Kai's mech with gear basically right out of the labs. His Centurion also has a Miata engine, so expect cheap Japanese parts.
>>47182047
Oh and all this was done because Kai didn't want a Daishi custom podded for him. Imagine Alyina with that happening.
>>47182047
This. Jaime basically goes "Yeah, we've been secretly building Madcats and Daishis for years under Outreach. But have some crappy lostech stuff you can probably produce if you're not complete fucking morons."
>>47182032
hey now anon, victor is STILL searching for morgan's killer. for realz.
>>47182110
>The only reason Victor had a heart attack is so that he could purse Morgan's killer beyond the grave.
>>47181993
This. And compound it with the fact that the science doesn't basically make sense. BT lasers are slicer beams like the ones the Minbari and the Shadows had in Babylon 5, yet even at the same time as Battletech came out, 2300AD (and maybe Traveller) was using pulse lasers. A laser rifle put out a ~30 megawatt pulse for a microsecond, not a seconds-long beam. The BT pulse lasers were IIRC fluffed as something that hammered the same spot repeatedly at intervals that let all that vaporised armour dissipate before the next pulse hit. Why not have lostech pulse lasers have better capacitors/generators/whatever that they could simply put out more pulses per trigger pull, I don't know, but hell, I've all filed it under "disregard science, acquire giant robots".
And don't let me get started on how a 20th Century tank gun wouldn't dent mech armour, yet all the ammo is described either as bursts of DU or ancient APHE type shells...
So has anyone acquired some of our Chinese friends' product range?
If so, is it a worthy investment? I'm concerned about them being in scale with each other.
>>47178611
Nightstar's armaments work pretty well as a Turkina Config.
>>47181714
>Fluff makes a point of saying the Clans went in with less mass and less units than the IS had to make the fights fair
>Official Scenario Packs make a point of doing the same
>Hurr but all Clan players were shitbird powergamers who destroyed the franchise, 3025 forever
Anon, I...
>>47181943
It's Tyra Miraborg (presented as a Phelan-level of skill in ASF) against a Clan pilot who comes from a Clan we later learn doesn't use the Phenotype, in one fight. In every other fight, including at Tukayyid where the Com Guard have ace pilots in SLDF fighters they get completely BTFO by pilots the Clans consider also-rans. They literally spell out that Carew is considered sub-par as a pilot due to his flawed lineage and test scores, but he's smashing the fuck out of the opposition left and right.
TL;DR: We get it, your salt is real because of one game you lost 30 years ago.
>>47183716
>TL;DR: We get it, your salt is real because of one game you lost 30 years ago.
i don't get why you're sperging against them
>>47183716
>consider also-rans
???
>>47183788
Carew (later among the Bloodnamed as Carew Nygren) is seen as a borderline case because the Falcons stiffed the Wolves on genetic material they won in a Trial. The Wolves went after Nygren DNA because their pilots were good but later learned that instead of handing over their ASF phenotype DNA they gave them some other shit, MechWarrior probably. By the time the Wolves realised they'd been duped, the Sibko portion made with those genes had already been decanted so they ran with it, though the group made with that mix tested poorly and were believed to have limited potential. So badly that, IIRC, they even say that Carew is the only one from his gene mix to graduate, and he's immediately thrown into the suspect pile because of his skills. He flat-out says he expects never to even compete for a Bloodname because of all this.
I don't even think he gets his Bloodname until after the Refusal War, but either way once he does get it it's after he's been attached to Phelan, with Ulric and Natasha's patronage.
>>47183716
The aerospace fighter phenotype is pretty clearly inferior to other phenotypes, and I can't think of a single case of Clan aerospace pilots BTFO out of anyone based on skill instead of numbers or tech.
In fact the books even spell out that in aerospace terms the Clans are about even with the Inner Sphere.
>Asano smiled ever so slightly. "Audacious to say the least. Will you concentrate on reinforcing and supplying units with strong aerospace wings, the only combat arena where we seem to fight on even ground with the Clans?"
>"Of course" Theodore straightemend up. "We are also upgrading conventional air forces to aid in anti-mech activities. The cost will be high in terms of personnel, but it will give the Clan fighter pilots even more to think about, a well as keeping their Mech forces off guard".
-Blood Lrgacy. 270
>Taney, his eyes eager and bright threw his arms wide. "We must not allow them to land without opposition. Our pilots will sweep them from the skys".
>A light lilt ran through Marthe Pryde's voice. "That would be a first, Khan Taney. Superior we might be on the ground, but out aeropolots have always been evenly matched against theirs".
>"You have not had Ice Hellions flying for you, Khan Pryde, Quineg?"
>"Neg Khan Taney, but your pilots have never impressed me" No our victories have come on the ground.To engage them in space and the atmosphere allows them to destroy our aerospace assets without getting us a shot at their ground forces".
-Prince of Havoc, PP 33.
>>47183893
But what is "also-rans"?
>>47184031
Not that anon, but it's a term from horse racing describing the horses that didn't place.
>>47182057
>Only Kai, with his special myomers, was fast enough to save Victor
>Kai gets Daishi, and Victor doesn't?
>no myomers
>Victor captured by Falcons
>FedCom does the Rasalhague rollover
>>47184021
>muh sources
Yes, don't point to sections like Carew fighting at Tukayyid, the rules for the Phenotype, or Natural Selection. Also ignore how the Jags were flying mostly Sabutais against mostly Shilones and Slayers.
It's typical BT shit writing, anon. The majority of canon and rules prior to the Great Refusal supports the notion that Clan ASF pilots are just flat-out better than IS pilots. It's the same sort of retardation that causes AFFC units to magically not exist for the purposes of Capellan victories in Guerrero, and for the exact same reasons.
>>47184131
>implying this would be a bad thing
>>47184183
>pic
Clan Pilots are only 1 point better on piloting, and 0 points better at gunnery? That supports the novels.
>>47184183
What about Carew fighting the green ComGuard at Tukayyid? I'm pretty sure he was a blooded warrior by then. And the phenotype was a failure, hence why the Bears didn't use it.
Plus one of the canon quotes I provided was DURING the invasion. They just weren't that good, ever.
>>47183893
Carew's performance disproves the logic of their breeding program. That's the point. Like Phelan he comes from a tainted source and yet is superior to the "trueborn" warriors. The end of the Invasion and the Great Refusal proved the point that it was the Clan technology, not their breeding program, that gave them the edge.
>>47182440
>Chinese
Thought they were Russian...?
Either way, they're pretty gud.
>>47184381
Here's some scale.
New MWO mauler compared to classic mauler.
>>47184393
And another, Highlander IIC scale next to an Atlas.
>>47184411
>>47184393
>>47184444
>>47184411
>>47184393
And the last one for now, Atlas and Summoner side by side.
Keep in mind all of these were scavenged with google-fu.
>>47184282
>I don't understand the rules, so there's no advantage here? That supports the novels.
>>47184595
is this like the Medron Pryde P1E obsession of clanfags?
>clanfag assanguished because later sources aren't identical to early, retconned ones and this hurts his superiority complex
Literally medron pryde-tier faggotry
>>47184286
>ComStar deliberately held its Elite and Veteran forces back to fight the Wolves, and reinforced them with units who had fought other Clans, therefore they were green
Yeah, nah.
>>47184342
>The end of the Invasion and the Great Refusal proved the point that it was the Clan technology, not their breeding program, that gave them the edge.
Fluff in SBs, novels, and rules at the RPG and TT level constantly says the Clans produce better warriors, due to their breeding programs. Do I really need to screencap stuff from Total Warfare to demonstrate the same?
>>47184647
>Yeah, nah.
Tell me about the campaigns the ComGuards fought in prior to Tukayyid to earn their elite experience.
>>47184647
>X says they produce better warriors!
>lost in contests favoring them anyway
lol ok
>>47184663
The skill rating of units is different to their battlefield experience.
Skill-wise, they're still fielding warriors with elite attributes. Experience-wise, they hadn't operated in larger formations and lacked cohesion which was why Focht micro-manages so much of Tukayyid from the mountain bunker.
>>47184675
The Great Refusal is all about getting the focus off the Clans for the FedCom Civil War. Tukayyid is Ulric and Focht screwing everyone strategically so they can't win on the ground.
There are other factors involved but clearly context doesn't matter because
>lolclans, i'm buttmad over the 90s
takes precedence. You can deny the fluff and rules all you like, it's clearly still there and the reasons they disregard it are obvious.
>>47184766
Self-ranking green troops as elite because of war games doesn't mean anything. Hence why Carew, a veteran of battles, wasn't a surprise in downing folks who had literally never fought one.
Carew was attached to an elite unit too, so your using him as an example at Tukayyid really proves... nothing?
>>47184766
>You can deny the fluff
but it's been cited to support our case and not refuted. why deny it when it proves us right? don't be so salty.
>>47184647
>Do I really need to screencap stuff from Total Warfare to demonstrate the same?
It doesn't matter what you screencap, because you are wrong.
>>47182206
>And don't let me get started on how a 20th Century tank gun wouldn't dent mech armour, yet all the ammo is described either as bursts of DU or ancient APHE type shells...
Or how y'know falling over in an open, soft dirt field can do as much damage as said shells. Or how a clubbing attack with common building debris or even a fucking uprooted tree can absolutely wreck Magic Future Armor harder than 200kg of AC20 bullet.
Yeah, nah guys.
So my latest recruit walked in today. I swear the fluff writes itself, I wish it were this easy create NPCs for MWRPG games.
>that name
>that age
>those looks
>green as the spring hills of Sussex
>rides a motherfucking Orion-1VA
It's a rich FedSuns noble daddy's little girl rebelling and joining the mercenaries with the family 'Mech.
AtB's chargen has been strangely fluffy this game. When I was creating the game, it gave me two ladies named García, one a 30 year old veteran mechwarrior and the other a 20 year old greenie in admin/logistics. The little girl who idolises her hardcore giant robot-drivin' big sister and joins the same outfit, done.
>>47184799
>Self-ranking green troops as elite because of war games doesn't mean anything.
It does when the rules use those rankings to determine P/G skills.
I'm not going to argue that there were retcons to how good the Clans were, same as I'm not going to argue tech backdating and other things. The thing to note is when they happened, and why- it's to give Marthe Pryde, leader of the Falcons, a sick burn against a literal retard Khan and make the Bears look smarter ahead of their heel/face turn and integration with Rasalhague.
I find it clumsy and forced, is all.
>>47184867
Hey now.
Maces have ALWAYS fucked armor up better than penetrating weapons once the armor reaches a certain thickness.
>>47184462
>>47184462
>>47184444
>>47184411
>>47184393
thank you kindly, anon
i can't help but notice that the awesome and centurion look like they're the same size
>>47185218
Using the magic of Photoshop, I compared the hex base sizes and put the two together. Honestly, the centurion is smaller than the Awesome in height, and considerably smaller in volume.
The Jaegermech on the other hand is a bit on the sturdier size.
>>47185327
Shame the magic of photoshop does not transfer well into my "not failing to post the image like a complete twat" skill.
What's the smallest mech you could feasibly mount two GRs on and still go 4/6 or 3/5, with 3050s IS tech?
>>47185050
Maces made of comparable materials to said armor, not sticks and rocks. Note that I had no problem with purpose-built melee weapons. I'm not THAT autistic.
>>47184595
>there's no advantage here? That supports the novels.
Read the image I was responding to.
>I don't understand the rules
What makes you think that MW2e chargen is designed to produce "average" pilots, or that the Archetypes default to any particular skill level at all? The Inner Sphere MechWarriors have a mix of skill levels, and the Clans have a ristar and solahma/defector. The Inner Sphere aerojock is a vet.
Even the 5/6/6/5/5 attribute spreads should be a tip off.
>>47185378
3/5 is easy, here's a flippy-arms, dual-Gauss Stalker.
>>47185378
Probably around 65 tons? You can get two on a jager if you squeeze em in.
Maybe as low as a 60 tonner, if you're using a 180XL
>>47185378
50 tons
>>47185378
Well if you just want two gauss rifles on a mech you can squeeze them into a 40 tonner, but you only get a ton of ammo and no armor.
>>47185481
>using ISXLs
>ever
>in the year of our lord 2016
It's like you don't even know how to play real battletech.
>>47185481
>Maybe as low as a 60 tonner, if you're using a 180XL
The Galahad is a thing.
>>47185481
If you want the lightest heavy goose available just get a Galahad. They also look pretty cool, so there's that.
>>47185542
>>47185557
The Galahad is one mech that I'm sad about when it died when Kerensky and co. packed up. It was a one-trick pony but it was really good at that one trick. Besides, the walking mushroom/AWACS saucer style looks ace.
Battlebump.
What's everyone's favorite WarShip design?
>>47186940
A/C-10 Rifleman is the closest substitute you can really get in Intro tech though.
>>47186955
Aegis.
>>47186955
Extinct ones. Warships are terrible for the game universe and never should have existed in the first place.
They're a lot like LAMs and Loren Coleman, actually.
>>47186940
I managed to roll a Galahad for my CO in my AtB campaign. It was glorious.
Getting ammo was problematic though, not to mention the ferro armor.
Dear Mum,
I've been good since I joined with the Housecarls. Captain Atherton and Staff Sgt García are training me and Mirabel García (that is, Staff Sgt's little sister!) very hard, and I've improved a bit. The Staff, who is nice even though she seems a hard woman, tells me I'm still a "greenhorn" though.
We are on a planet called Tsingtao, not very far from Highspire. The Housecarls are hired to guard a very important city (I'm not allowed to say which one, Staff García says it's due to Operational Security).
Yesterday, we were on a training exercise when we were told that raiders had broken through the local militia and Captain Atherton said that we were the only ones close enough to intercept them. Anyway, there was a battle and I destroyed two tanks! Tell Dad that Old Ironsides is just as good as he always said, and Tech Tiihonen, who is assigned to it, says it's always nice to work on an Orion.
I did feel bad when I destroyed the tanks because there was a chance their crews could die, but Captain Atherton said it was them who attacked us and we defended the planet and besides they were Capellans anyway. I don't think it's very nice but he's from Oriente.
Anyway, I'm all right and so is Old Ironsides.
love,
Abi
>>47164714
Thanks OP, now I wanna play a game of Battletroops.
>>47187481
I should write my mom a letter sometime
Pretty good anon, keep us updated on Abi's exploits
>>47187824
>infantry taking on mechs
Now we're talking.
>>47187481
>and besides they were Capellans anyway. I don't think it's very nice but he's from Oriente.
Kek
