In-Universe, Orzammar is a city of about 100,000 inhabitants. How could the city support itself? What type of food could they cultivate en-mass (besides the Nugs we see) to be able to feed this many people? What size of an army could the city feasibly field?
Underground gardens, cheese, lots of meat.
Same as any classic dwarven civilization.
Regarding the army, I'd say about 20k, given a large chunk of the population lives in the sprawl.
>>47156477
Notably, their standing army is probably of a pretty weird size/composition compared to above ground armies. They're basically impossible to siege, but are constantly under duress from below due to Darkspawn incursions.
>>47156477
>literally 1/5 of the population could be the army
Maybe a reserve army, but not a standing army.
>>47156477
Bear in mind, Orzammar is one city connected by many others and ALSO trading with the surface (well, that's shut off at the start of the game, but historically it does trade with the surface at least).
Presumably that's how it draws in what it can't grow, the aforementioned nugs, fungus gardens etc.
>>47156550
I'd figured I'd be around 5,000-10,000. Figure in that Dwarves in DA have a rigid caste system, with warriors 2nd to the top, its doubtful they'd want to many people in it.It's mentioned in DA: Origins if you chose Bhelen as king that the warrior caste was in an uproar when Bhelen allowed Casteless Dwarves to take up arms in the armyAlso, it takes a lot to support soldiers, for ever warrior, especially dedicated warriors and not citizen-soldiers, so how much you could actually afford is a limiting factor; you aren't just paying the warrior, you also are paying for his gear, food, medical treatment etc.
>>47156619
What?
There are all of three underground cities remaining, One was just discovered, and there's hundreds of miles of darkspawn infested deep roads between them.
>>47156619
> Orzammar is one city connected by many others
Orzammar is only one of two great Dwarven cities remaining by DA: Origins. At the start of the game, most of Orzammar's outlying thaigs (settlements) have been overrun and the darkspawn are literally at the city limits so much so that mining is being shut down to prevent accidentally opening up passages for/into darkspawn.Though this can change by the end of the game if Bhelen is in charge, he takes advantage of the lessened darkspawn presence surrounding Orzammar as a result of the Blight to push the front line back to the Dead Trenches, retaking some thaigs
>>47156477
Normally I would answer that Dwarves must keep herds of goats and terraced fields, but that seems quite unlikely for Dragon Age. DA makes life for the dwarves difficult by establishing that dwarves rarely venture above ground if they can avoid it.
I would assume that Dwarven cuisine in Dragon Age consists almost entirely of Nug meat and mushrooms. I also loved that Dwarven Ale is established to be incredibly nasty. I would imagine their cuisine is not much different.
It's still hard to imagine how 100,000 dwarves could support themselves in a sealed environment like Orzammar.
>>47156585
They probably focus almost exclusively on heavy infantry, seeing as maneuver warfare is all but impossible in the claustrophobic environments of the Deep Roads.
>>47156780
It's mentioned that their ale is made from lichens instead of grain. I assume they eat a lot of fungi, seeing as it is probably the most space-efficient foodstuff they could hope to grow. It's also mentioned they have mines, so maybe they re-purpose old mine shafts for cultivation?
>>47156477
They trade lyrium, which goes for megabucks.
>>47156798
heavily armored soldiers to hold the line and berserkers to unleash on the hordes when necessary
>>47160350
Heavy pikemen would make the most sense.
Shame the Qunari aren't about sharing that gunpowder. Pike and shit dwarfs would be pretty savage.
>>47160595
the qunari are only use it on their ships as far as I know they want to keep it under wraps but people have started to independently develop gunpowder without the aid of the qunari I think a dwarf is one of those people
>>47160663
Several dwarfs have tried but it's never really started how close they've gotten.
I think only one has come close and they disappeared, the implication being the Qunari abducted him.
Still the Qunari have cannons. It's a really simple step to turn that into a gun. Which is probably why they keep it under wraps.
>>47156689
Does this have any effect on Inquisition?
>>47156477
They actually clarify in the games that Orzammar actually trades a LOT with the surface using Casteless surface dwarves as intermediaries even as they trade Lyrium for lots and lots of food.
It just shits all over the Casteless socially as they do it.
>>47160663
It requires Dragon Venom doesn't it? So I don't really see how anyone could have gotten that close without a source of that.
I think one of my favorite tidbits of lore about the Qunari is that they have fairly significantly longer lives than most of Thedas, but contrary to what you might think it's actually just because they have the best hygiene.
>>47160698
I like to think the reason the Qunari never develop firearms, even primitive ones, on their own is because they would inevitably make it out into the general populace and their entire culture/religion will fall apart in a manner of months.
The Qun doesn't really sit well even with the Qunari themselves, and it actively chafes and grinds away at the other races it's forced on; even if they are born into it and know of nothing else.
>>47160698
the qunari go after people who tried to steal the formula for gun powder but they cant stop some inventor who secludes themselves in their workshop and keeps it hidden
>>47160730
doubt it considering how rare they are
>>47160730
The Dragon Venom thing is probably just a red herring.
Y'know, like telling someone the process to creating nitroglycerin requires large amounts of crab chitin.
>>47160791
>The Qun doesn't really sit well even with the Qunari themselves, and it actively chafes and grinds away at the other races it's forced on; even if they are born into it and know of nothing else.
You think that because
1. You rarely get anything but the view of the outsider looking in or those who have left.
2. Bioware writers have an irritating habit of letting their personal politics interfere with their universe.
There are plenty of people who flee to the Qun looking for a sense of purpose.
>>47160793
Pretty sure the dwarf from Awakening gets forced into hiding by the Qunari but I can't recall if it was because he tried to steal the gunpowder or if he was simply too close to replicating it.
>>47160839
also it would be easy for non qunari to get their hands on them
>>47160839
In fact, many Qunari within it say that they simply could not exist without it. Like, they go crazy without the structure it brings.
Probably something to do with being dragon-hybrids.
>>47160791
There's another reason that fits with the Qun; guns make killing MUCH easier when you have the ability to produce in large numbers, and the Qunari are OBSESSED with control and the Antaam in particular are highly disciplined and thus the priests likely think it would dangerously promote independence and make their warriors lazier.
Admittedly even when guns were first invented cheaply mass-producing then actually wasn't a problem for around 300 years and they were expensive and not very effective until better and more reliable powder with heavier musket balls were used, but the Qunari are frighteningly efficient at things so maybe they know just how fast their "gaatlok" would spin out of their ability to easily control it.Also, guns would ruin the stereotypical fantasy stuff for plebeians who think that Guns immediately ended all armor usage, and we all know that ultimately this is the real reason why they Qunari don't have them.
>>47160860
he tried to steal it but there are others who are getting their I think anders did which Is how he blew up the chantry
>>47160872
Plus ship combat in medieval times is viewed as pretty dull. So they had to throw in canons to spice it up.
>>47160865
Sorta like China / Japan if the whole "Face" social ordeal falls apart?
>>47160839
>2. Bioware writers have an irritating habit of letting their personal politics interfere with their universe.
My brother who played 3 told me that the Qunari basically refute everything you learn about them in 1 and 2.
>>47160895
They could have just included Sea Monsters.
>>47160901
No, like actual violent insanity. If Iron Bulls description of the Vashoth are any indication.
Plus, I really see no reason why anyone would want to leave the Qun. It doesn't seem that restrictive, at least not for the average person.
>>47160906
Partly, but a lot of it comes from Iron Bull.
And the only real big thing is the trans-people being treated as their preferred gender bullshit. Otherwise it all works fine as expansion of previously established stuff.
>>47160924
I thought the Qun was more or less a social-religion where everyone only has one set role to play in society and any deviation from that role is punished heavily?
>>47160906
It did, very much so
Is the Qun all that different from Mankind's Serfdom?
>>47160956
Yes, but the role is chosen in a pretty streamlined fashion. It seems like you're pretty unlikely to get something you hate or you're bad at, and you still have off time and work time like anyone else. To use an example from the game, a baker in Par Vollen worries about the same things as a baker in Val Royeaux. Will the bread rise right? Will the flour shipment arrive in time? The only difference is that the one in Par Vollen doesn't have to worry about money.
Your average Thedas peasant doesn't choose their life as much as your average Qunari doesn't choose theirs.
>>47160981
No, not really.
>>47160956
Basically. Sten takes issue with female player characters, explicitly telling them that they must not be female because they are clearly a warrior, then in 3 you have Krem.
Nugs aren't the only source of meat, though. Broncos are herder as well.
>>47160924
Bull's explanation of Tal-Vashoth makes sense when you realize that most are likely Antaam (who have the most outside autonomy) and thus have exactly ONE skill they ever learned; killing.
So they get their freedom and what do they do with it? They just keep killing. It's like if you gave a shark free will and expect it to stop swimming and killing shit even though that's kind of a fundamental part of what it IS.
In Awakening the Tal-Vashoth merchant you meet is far more reasonable and less hostile, though he also seems to have a little trouble grasping the concept of goods exchange for currency.
>>47160981
Yes in that its closer to utopian communism.
You have x amount of sectors that have y amount of jobs that need filling. You are then given the job that is closest to your ability. This is maintained through communication between the leaders of the sectors.
Serfdom is more of, I'll let you live on my land but you'll have to pay me/gave me what you make. Also you'll have to fight for me if I need you too.
And if you don't I'll send one of my armoured stooges to fuck you up and kick you off my land.
>>47161042
With the Ariqun (religious caste also assassins/inquisition) being male and females, and me playing a rogue elf female, that accusation felt strange.
>>47161187
Tallis was a mistake.
>>47161208
indeed
>>47161208
Bioware was a mistake.
>>47161208
Lucky, I never played that particular DLC.
>>47161226
Some parts were fun, but I wouldn't recommend it.
>>47160888
The ingredients he asks you to help him find are the ingredients for black powder with a few letters changed.
>>47161268
actually it was for poison gas
>>47161224
>EA acquiring Bioware and driving away the old writing team was a mistake.
FTFY, unless the issues are much more deep-seated.
>>47161282
He has you find him sulfur, charcoal and salt peter, yes? That's gun powder.
>>47161622
I was talking about the dwarf merchant
>>47161666
Ah, I was referring to Anders, which that post also mentioned.
>>47160701
It's a Bioware game, what do you think?
No
The answer you're looking for is no
>>47160701
>>47161712
Not every decision is gonna have earth shattering consequences.
>>47160924
>>47160901
Bull is named Hissran/Hissrad. Which means "liar".
>>47161856
so he's the qunari equivalent of a shitposter
>>47161856
Similarly, I head canon that he's only making stuff up for Krem's benefit. He is effective as a commander, and he can't just be a dick to him if he's going to continue to lead the chargers.
>>47161882
Kinda.
>>47161042
don't see why that's a problem. Qunari gender roles are based on gender and not biologic sex.
>grills can't be warriors
>ergo any and all warriors are not grills
culture warriors are "huurrr hurr trans pandering" about something thats more akin act of ritually changing gender thats been prevalent in some societies for centuries
>>47161891
I agree with that.
Why would Qunari society, which doesn't really get why someone in one profession would prefer working in another job, accept a similar situation but with gender/sex?
Doesn't make much sense.
>>47161905
I thought that was why they had them to begin with
>>47161905
I think you've got it the wrong way around.
Males are warriors, because they're stronger. Females are caretakers and priests, because they're better at being empathetic. You can claim to be man and demand to be referred to as such, which they'll probably just say fine to, but if you want to do something you're not built to do? That's when Qunari get confused.
>>47161908
Especially considering the fact that, no matter what Bioware and their fans tell themselves, transsexuals are stupidly uncommon, and are an extreme abnormality.
The Qun probably wouldn't give half a damn about homosexuals, their beliefs and strict structures and shit would support it because it cuts into population growth which can cause issues when supply of people outstrips the demand for roles.
>>47161993
Iron Bull comments on gays.
They are obligated to mate, but they also have sex therapy clinics were anyone can go and get their rocks off however they life so they don't get too unhappy. So yes, the homo still has to have sex with a woman at least once, but they can go fuck guys on their off time whenever they like if it keeps them happy.
>>47161908
>>47161891
I head canon it kind of the opposite way: Bull is telling the truth that the Qunari have a way to change your gender identity. But the truth is that its never actually your choice: If you are a big strong girl whose good with weapons but lack the cunning/intellect to become Ben Hassrath, you become "male" and join the Antaam. But not because you decided that "I'm really a man" but because the Taamasrans handed you a sword and told you "From now on you are a male". The needs of the Qun decides your gender, not your biology or your personal choice.
It actually makes sense with the Qunari hard-on of efficiency in all things: If you get a female who would best function in a male position you just force her to become a male instead of putting her in a less optimal female post
>>47162065
Makes sense.
I imagine it's basically a mix of what you say here and what is said >>47161976
Just whatever is most efficient, but also the least cause for friction in society.
>>47160839
This guy gets it. Bioware has gone full on left wing mode. There are people (Not a majority, perhaps 1/5 to 1/4) who were untouched by the purges and violence that actively miss Communism because it gave them a sense of purpose, always a job, they didnt have to think. This is all some people want, to be told waht to do and know they can do, others like the freedom to do what they want in the world.
But yes, they are rabidly anti-gun in DA:I. The Qun have gone from absolutist, mono-cultured and hard-bred to all welcoming, socialist untopia.
>>47162065
it just seems kind of stupid the way they do that why go with the whole gender changing junk when you can just say I'm a woman and a good fighter if this is true?
>>47162102
Because that does not sell as many copies or generate as much sensationalist journalism. DA:I was little more than a generic fantasy setting with LOOK HOW LIBERAL AND GENDER NEUTRAL WE ARE.
It's nothing like the Anglo/Saxon/Celtic badassery that was in Dragon Age: Origins.
>>47162100
>Absolutist, mono-cultured and hard-bred to all welcoming, socialist untopia.
You state these things as if they're mutually exclusive.
The Qunari try to blow up the entire government of the rest of the world, and Iron Bull betrays you because the Inquisition isn't part of the Qun.
>>47162102
I would think dogma essentially
Qunari probably have a view of what "Men are good at" and what "Women are good at"
But they also hyper-efficient and have a desire to optimize everything.
Thankfully for them they are ultra-collectivist and individuality is meaningless to them. They have their idealized notions of what men and women can do and when faced with an outlier they can a) put that outlier in a less optimal position appropriate to their gender b) sully their "ideal" by letting the person serve in the best possible position while of the wrong gender or c) force that person to adopt the other gender and serve optimally. A and B violate the tenants of gender ideals and efficiency, while C preserves both by simply trampling on the individual's choices and biology, which are irrelevant to the Qun anyway
>>47162167
they just seem like the types to scoff at gender identity stuff though
>>47162186
Exactly. I'm not really seeing them caring that much about what crap you've got in your pants, besides for the purposes of breeding.
If you're good at fighting, you fight. If you're good at talking, you talk. If you're not really good at either of those, you're probably a weaver or something.
>>47162151
I viewed them as they were. Gradually they have moved and twisted and turned the Qun in to something that people would talk about and be more pallatable to the SJW crowd.
>>47162212
If you aren't good at ANYTHING, then hard physical labor.
If you aren't good at THAT, then you are a corpse and are recycled into fertilizer or dissected for medical knowledge and then recycled into fertilizer.
Or become a test subject for whatever the Qun has as scientists, magic or otherwise.
>>47162186
I'm not gonna deny that. I think its a holdover from before they really pinned Qunari culture down. Strict gender roles don't really mesh well with a society that sees its citizens as replaceable uniform cogs in a machine. But I think Bioware tried to write their way out of a corner and fucked up. But hey if at least the >>47162065 idea is suitably Orwellian and fucks with both trans lovers and social conservatives because its the state giving the finger to both personal choice and natural biology and assigning you the gender *it* wants
>>47156477
Plump Helmets and whatever they decided to grow that season.
>>47162258
Agreed.
I feel like the strict gender roles thing was kind of a weird idea from the start, given the rest of their society.
As a tangential question, has anyone played the Dragon Age TTRPG?
>>47156477
Too much bread baked from milled stone?
That was one of those dwarven cities with lots of magmaducts right? I supose some kind of lichen which extracted energy and nutrients from heat and ashes, plus stale cave water, could be the basis for underground crops.
>>47156477
Hard Mode:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVrXW0WVXYw
In-Universe, How could this battle not be as retarded as a inbred brick?
>>47162276
Remember when they were just tall dark skinned people?
>>47156550
>Regarding the army, I'd say about 20k, given a large chunk of the population lives in the sprawl.
Likely more
IIRC there were 6 Castes, plus the Casteless. Both Warrior Caste and Noble Cast fought, so somewhere around 2/7 of the 100k or about ~30k people could fight
>>47162792
They didn't really utilize any of their defenses, such as the pike wall. Some shields up front with spears would do nicely as defense. Keep the hounds in reserve, use them as the Calvary unity that blindsides the enemy. Hard to fight off a huge mastiff while fighting some human.
The king already fucked up by talking about glory and stories too much, why his dick ass general thought it was a good idea to make a power play on the young king.
>>47162100
Whiiiile not debating they certainly lean left....
Reeeee detected.
>>47161856
>Not every decision is gonna have earth shattering consequences.
Or any decision for that matter. They've become almost as bad as Bethesda games but even Todd rarely says anything positive about the story.
>>47156780
They also have Brontos which are essentially dinosaur cows.
![6M3YZOd[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/3CRrxIA.png "6M3YZOd[1].png")
>>47161905
>gender politics
>in quasi-medieval "dark" (by their description anyway) fantasy
I fucking despise what Bioware has become.
>>47162947
I really liked it. On another note, their new design produced one of my favorite porn pieces ever. Leliana sandwiched by two Quanari dickgirls.
>>47162065
>>47162258
Now this I can get behind since it's actually decent justification and meshes well with how they initially built up Qunari society. Bioware are a bunch of hacks though so I doubt they would ever handle something like gender politics with nuance like this.
>>47163284
Poofter.
>>47163253
I agree the art is well-made, but dickgirls/futa aren't really my thing. I just wish there were more regular porn of female qunari.
>>47162947
I'm fond of the horns. Plus, it explains why ogres have horns.
On a side note, I really like the redesigns of DarkSpawn post DA2.
>>47162151
What the fuck!? When the hell does that happen? Is it dlc?
>>47163035
>Making power plays when at the worst time
It's the time the reigning Monarch is most distracted and weakened, with his armies away from the city and his guard watching for external threats instead of internal. War is always unpopular with the masses and so anybody who can stop it will have the love of the small people.
Or you could be honorable and wait until the kings supporters return from war, until his guard has no external enemy to focus on, when trade resumes and puts coins in to the smallfolks pockets.
>>47163253
>All this gender politics in Bioware games
>Not one single mention of corrective rape which is one of the top motivations in South Africa.
>>47162258
>Natural Biology
It's not natural biology anymore more than anorexia is or a number of other mental illnesses. People just think it's less damaging to accept it. There's a reason no trans person lives past 60, suicide at their fucked up life or poisoning through the build up of chemicals and hormones they have to take to stop their body from attacking itself.
>>47163361
>Is it dlc?
Yep. The only reason the Inky becomes aware of the plot is due to Solas' spy network informs them. yes, Solas as spies inside the spy network. He's the master ruseman
>>47163391
Isn't he also like Fen'Harel or some shit? But really? They couldn't have that in the actual game? Fucking Christ.
>>47163405
Spoilers for that dude, it was still a passable game with a few enjoyable characters, even if it didn't make sense.
>>47163405
Yep. He also tells you that the elven pantheon, including himself, were/are nothing but extremely powerful mages. They're power is beyond anything encountered in the games until that point.
>>47163405
it only happens if you have him save the dreadnaught. if you have him save his men he leaves the Qun and doesn't betray you.
>>47163426
He was much more related and likeable character before the reveal. After that you realize everything he said was utter garbage and utterly untrustworthy.
>>47163416
Been out for years now man.
>>47163426
Jeesus that kinda fucking kills my enthusiasm for replaying as dalish.
>>47163431
So save his men got it.
>>47163431
I love that part for the mind fuckery it gave the sjw-tumblr audience.
>help your sjw mascot Iron-Bull
or
>help your sjw-tumblr goddess Felicia Day
>>47163416
It's easily one of the more boring games I've played in a while. While DA:O was one of my favorite RPGs of all time and DA2 was utter dogshit, DA:I was just incredibly bland. The villain was pretty forgettable, the side quests were copy/paste MMO shit, and the combat was casualized garbage.
Leliana best girl.
>tfw Warden is never coming back
>tfw Leliana misses Warden deeply during DAI
>tfw no adventures across Thedas with my singing archery croissant waifu
>>47163504
>tfw no waifu
>>47163474
I agree it was, I mentioned earlier that Dragon Age: Origins had a really grim, dark and gritty feel to it and it seemed the mythology and standard of living was just about Anglo-Saxon England, from the buildings to the armor to the customs (Feminist-Christianity) but in DA:I it went full blown bland boring and dull generic fantasy with demons invading.
>>47163504
What's it like knowing you're the reason Bioware went to shit, waifufag?
>>47163504
Best girl is Morrigan, anon, stop being a fag.
>>47163520
feel better if Leliana was popular enough for them to give a shit about.
it's okay to have a waifu from back when they were still written well.
>>47156477
>>47156619
>>47157795
>>47160702
Has it in one. Orzmar can't feed itself. That's not what cities do. Instead, the dwarves trade with Feredlans and Orleasans for high quality finished metalworking and lyrum.
Lyrum, it's worth noting, can't be mined by humans. Exposure to even small amounts of it can quickly drive humans insane or poison them. Prepared lyrum can be used by mages and templars, but in it's raw form it's crazy toxic and even dwarves that work with it get a little loopy, despite their resistance to it and lack of any connection to the Fade.
So the dwarves have a natural monopoly on the stuff that is vital for many kinds of magic and anti-magic.
>>47160791
>>47160730
Part of the reason they don't use it much is because Andrastian nations have a fuckton of people that can set powder off accurately from a thousand yards away. The cannons and dreadnoughts are noted as being pretty fucking useless in most fights because one asshole with fire magic can explode the powder.
>>47163542
Morrigan serves no purpose being in the Inquistion other than fan service. Her being their was jarring, stupid and made no sense at all.
>>47163426
>They're power is beyond anything encountered in the games until that point.
Except for all those times you encounter Flemith before then. She couldn't survive a one-on-one with the Warden without arrangeing some life insurance with Dalish.
>>47163519
While I liked some of the setting building elements regarding the elvhen empire in DAI (floating dreamscape libraries, the priesthood of the god of secrets performing bloody dismembering rituals on their head priests. the revelation that the elven gods are parasitic rather than divine, and so on), those were very far in between and the mundane world definitely felt really bland and generic.
>>47163585
True
>>47163575
They had to wrap up the giant dangling plot thread that was god soul baby and what the fuck happens after the mirror. Granted, the answers to those questions weren't great, but I'm glad they got her.
Still, they should have used her a fuck of a lot more. She shows up and pretty much just hands out a few quest and some expostion.
>>47163575
That could be said about every single other returning character because all of them suck and contribute nothing to the world
They should have kept Flemeth alive if they wanted to develop the "mortal vessel of a semi-divine spirit" theme further
>>47163640
>>47163640
It would've been better to have her alive if your Warden chose to impregnate Morrigan and killed her off if you didn't.
>>47163599
I like the slow reveal that the old elven empire wasn't a golden age but mostly some eldrich horror shit. You really had to fucking hunt and pick the right quest games ago to get the information though.
90% of Inquisition was running around doing boring as shit quest. The open world was a bad idea and you ended up with really unfocused storytelling and game play. I'd have rather they dropped the whole Empires De Lon and instead had the old elven temple have way more art and story assets. It could have been like discovering the broodmother in DA:O.
>>47161905
>Qunari gender roles are based on gender and not biologic sex.
I'd be interested to see a citation from the first game on that.
Sten's fatalistic dogma is directly in contrast with the idea that it's acceptable to decide to be anything but what you were born to be.
>>47163667
It could be argued he was indoctrinated that way because he was a special snowflake
>>47163575
Doesn't change the fact that in Origins she is better than Leliana.
Besides (though I have not finished Cisquistion) the all "Elder-God kid" and what >>47163612
said seems to be wrapping up for something big lore wise in the world.
She might not be a lesbian red-head spy that works for you, but she operates in a whole level above that (see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1IZAbXazRw)
>>47163640
Pretty much, but I'm glad to see them back.
They are some of the things that remind you that DA used to be good.
>>47163640
>They should have kept Flemeth alive
Uh.. Whut?
Flemeth can't die, not properly. She returns after the Inquisitor or Morgan drinks from the Well of Shadows. What happens next depends on Old God Baby status, but Flemeth survives to the end where maybe/maybe not the Dread Wolf kills/freezes her.
>>47163690
A stronger argument for the same thing could be made for Iron Bull.
>>47163504
>>47163542
That's not how you spell Eleanor Cousland or Anora
>>47163585
But yet the Flemeth could turn in to a Dragon and fight off Darkspawn at the very start of Dragon Age: Origins. Again, the ending DA:I had made no sense and was completely at odds with the rest of the game in tone and theme.
>>47163640
I agree with you, the only one that seemed to work quite well was Hawke and that may be because I gave up on DA2 halfway through and read a wiki to find out what I missed.
As for the vessl for the divine ending, I was fine not knowing. One of the biggest (if not the biggest) themes in Dragon Age is Ignorance,
>The Dark Spawn begin created from the ignorance of the Magisters breaching the City of God.
>The ignorance the Imperium shows in denial that they caused it all.
>The ignorance of the Chantry, on both sides. We are right and they are wrong, the refusal to even achkowledge each other.
>The Elves self-inflicted ignorance and the bastardized culture they now wallow in, living hand-to-mouth like the Dalish when their is literally no reason to do anything they do beyond what they think is tradition.
>The Dwarves and their self-rightious belief that they are the only sane ones in the world, that their inbred caste system keeps them alive. While they deny it is the casteless that keeps them alive.
They shit all over that by creating a retarded ending just to wrap it up and muh plot twist. The Magister plotline was enough, they should of deepened the mystery with the Elven pantheon (and all the Gods) or moved it over to the Maker proper as that is the God/s we are more invested in throughout the series. Fuck the lazy Elf god, I want to know about the Maker and the Bride of the maker. But even then, I don't want it spelled out, I want it obscure and hidden and masked.
>>47163704
Iron Bull had horns though, Sten didn't. He was also a bro that didn't give off gay vibes.
>>47163667
>From the first game
They never mention that about Qunari culture in the first game. Inquisition, of course, features a transman that is told by a qunari spy and liar that the qun respects the right of trans people to deiced what gender to express. We have no other information on that.
It's worth noting, however, that nothing we see in game suggest that transgender people are a big deal to Andrastians outside of the strawman asshole empire of slaveing, gay conversion therepy and puppy kicking.
>>47163709
>Anora
She's a fucking bitch.
I rather have Alistair ruling Ferelden alone.
>>47163663
They also should have chosen a better antagonist than Corypheus. He worked in the dlc for DA2 because he was just some ancient force locked away and could barely get his bearings once he was released before being "killed" right after. Then they just turned him into just another megalomaniac asshole trying to turn himself into a god with some ancient bullshit artifact cuz evil. They barely even touched on the whole "original darkspawn" thing and the most he did was use his taint powers or whatever.
>>47163663
I actually liked the subtle way of worldbuilding this time around, like how you had to pay attention to the environment (like statues representing their respective gods in specific places) and hunt for codex entries in order to get the full picture. Then the dlcs ruined that feeling by making the dwarf girl and Solas give infodumps to the player.
>>47163700
Read this, anon
>>47163729
I love playing that bitch.
>agree to her terms
>flip mode and become the dominant one
Ali was a bro and backstabbing him wasn't pleasant. But her dad did ease the pain
>>47163717
Are you saying Iron Bull didn't give off gay vibes? Even though he was also a romance option for male player characters?
>>47163729
>Not romancing Leliana, impregnating Morrigan, and marrying Anora
What are you, gay?
>>47163734
>Makes no explanation of how she knows any of this shit. It makes no sense at all. It just werks.
>>47163733
Corypheus was nothing but a Saturday morning cartoon villian.
>>47163765
No I was saying Sten didn't give them off.
Iron Bull is bi.
I like them both but IMO Sten > IB
>>47163723
>Inquisition, of course, features a transman that is told by a qunari spy and liar that the qun respects the right of trans people to deiced what gender to express.
You know, I hadn't considered that, why if Iron Bulls affable Bro act is just that, all an act. He even admits when you press him that the Qun would kill most of the people in the Inquisition.
>>47163712
In theory, the dread wolf should be equal to or more powerful then Flemeth because it's one elf god vs another elf god that had to ditch her body and find a replacement.
In practice, it's super fucking confusing and the lore is a clusterfuck.
>>47163765
the first two, but
>recruit Loghain and bully Alistair into marrying Anora
Given how fucked basically every culture in Thedas is, can we really day that ISIS- I MEAN, THE QUN, TOTALLY THE QUN -/is really wrong? Iron Bulls one claim about how transexuals are totes OK aside.
>>47163780
>Bull keeps bullshitting everyone he meets, finding justifications for things and ways to make them think no, it's cool, the Qun isn't as bad as all that
>he's just fucking making up Qunari-ish-sounding words and shoving them into whatever context he needs them
>"of course you could be a warrior if your daddy belonged to the Qun, little girl! you'd be... uh, shit. Ben... His'qath. Ben His'qath Rahm. yep."
>>47163765
>>47163788
>Knock up Morrigan, recruit Loghain, make Alistair marry Anora, harden Leli, have a 4some with Leli, Zevran and Isabella, deflower the elf in the camp
You guys aint on my level of ballin
>>47163828
>implying everyone didn't harden Leliana and have a sex party
we are on the same level.
>>47163822
Maybe he's even lying to himself
Remember the whole reason he's what he is, is because he suffered from extreme PTSD and decided to scuicide by cop, except the cops turned him into a spy instead
>>47163843
But did you fall for the seducer? I did
>>47163784
How does that quantify anything? The implication was that Flemmeth need to transfer her power to another vessel as it 'burns out' the mortal over a generation or two, so that was why she wanted Morrigan. For the Dread Wolf (Wolves being the popular motif for the end of the world and death of all) to be able to sleep away the ages then reappear with more power than a 'God' doing exactly what they were meant to do makes no sense.
Solas should not of been the Dread Wolf at all, he should of been able to meet him in one of his walks in the Fade, that would of been more suitable. Found him sleeping if need be. But he should not be the God bound in mortal form.
>>47163822
Iron Bull is a liar, cheat and a betrayer. The only reason he does not betray you is because people would of lashed out at the 'coolest gay character' was potrayed negatively, it was a complete knee-jerk for him to do what he did when he betrayed the Qun. My impression was that everything he did and said up until his loyalty mission was a lie made entirely to get in to the Inquistition and destroy it from the inside. There was no loyalty to the Inquisitor or the men Iron Bull brought with him, it was all an act and a fabrication constructed by Iron Bull by his natural gifts of being the implant/spy of the Qun. It was for Social Justice reasons that Iron Bull joined the Inquisition as the SJW's would of hated it and called it outrageous if he had of been true to his role.
>>47163856
what seducer? i don't remember. the desire demon in Redcliff?
>>47163862
I think bulls chargers were loyal, even if Iron Bull himself wasn't. I also think his role as a traitor is more... Unconscious. Like he simply slips into a mask until he's activated, and then his real personality/role reasserts itself.
It's still BS they have him betray you if you have him uphold the Qun. I thought for a second they had a real decision in Inquisition, a choice between loyalty, ethics, and a crack team of mercenaries, and the international shitstorm that betraying the Qunari and the loss of their support would have been
I guess this game really is best played as a hard nosed inquisitor of the Emperor. Suffer not the alien
>>47162258
>Strict gender roles don't really mesh well with a society that sees its citizens as replaceable uniform cogs in a machine.
I don't see why it wouldn't mesh well. two types of replaceable uniform cogs isn't too many to keep track of.
>>47163862
>The implication was that Flemmeth need to transfer her power to another vessel as it 'burns out' the mortal over a generation or two, so that was why she wanted Morrigan.
It turns out Morrigan was wrong about that. Flemmeth wasn't looking to possess Morrigan, she was looking to give her some old elf god soul.
Is there anyone here who actually trusted Iron Bull?
Nobody should be able to say "I'm a professional backstabber from a semi-hostile government" and only get a reputation for honesty.
>>47164829
Yes, to gift her it. The reasoning or the implication do not change, the fact is Flemmeth wanted or needed it out of her and in Morrigan. Possession or ascendancy, it does not matter which it is.
>>47165147
Exactly, a self-confessed infiltrator tells you giving you the impression "Oh, well he told me he won't betray me." Of course he had no loyalty.
Let's answer the real question here. What is the Black City, really?Assumming the Maker isn't real and that's not his city corrupted by the magisters, leading to the creation of the dark spawn
>>47167922
Well, following the shitty conclusion that the Elvish pantheon are simply old, powerful mages. My conclusion is that the First City/Black City is actually the first Mages tower that was taken by demons, the first discovery of magic, of possession. Probably the mages city, a wonder city that had all the trappings of a hedonistic society that fell to possession.
There is literally nothing else it can be. With the breaking of the Magics Circles in the world, they will soon 'discover', that is pull out of their fucking arse, the first city of the mages and want to recover it, it will turn out to be the Black City.
>>47167922
>>47168029
So we're pretty much going full fedora in the next one, then? Maker's just gonna be another elf, putting money on it.
>>47168274
I've RP'd as characters who wouldn't believe in the Maker in Origins and Inquisition, but yeah, I'd like a little more evidence that the Maker or at least an actual God being might exist.
So if Red Lyrium is some kind of living parasite, what is blue Lyrium?
>>47168029
No. The Black City is what they built for themselves after being exiled to the fade by Solas.
>>47168320
The blood of Titans. Red Lyrium is blight infected Titans.
>>47168274
Yeah, Bioware gave up all control of their IPs, they do what is the most populist and most progressive. They have no intention of a gripping story or deep, immersive lore. I don't think it will be an Elf though, another Mage perhaps.
>>47168392
Could be, I would of expected Solas to tell more though. He never hinted at it. But the thing is, it was once Golden and now Blackened, I don't think they would merge the two pantheons like that. Elves actually built the Black City, doesn't seem to be a good direction to go, besides it kills one of their plots.
More than likely it will be something completely unrelated to the previous games, something we do not even get mentioned, unguessable and utterly nonsensical.
>>47168480
In the Elven Myths they say that the deities built it. They're notoriously unreliable though.
I'd wager the reason Solas got so bent out of shape and exiled them from the world is because the other gods created the Blight. So be exiled them and the Blight to the Fade after creating the Veil. That's why the Tevinter magisters become the first DarkSpawn, but there was Red Lyrium before that.
>>47168524
That does not make too much sense. There might be the bait and switch in that it was the taint that made the city black, not the city that made the taint. The taint prexisting the Makers City.
Also, the Dwarves, we saw very little of them in DA:I. What may happen is a cliched 'They Dug Too Deep' and unleashed the taint that way.
Either way, I do not see it being too original or anything but a dull cliche.
>>47168765
What's so hard to believe? Elven Gods fight Titans. Elven gods make weapon to fight Titans. One Elven God sees the weapon as too deplorable to exist, so he boots them out of reality with their weapon. Elves in not reality build themselves a home because that's what you do. Weapon gets out of control, destroys their home. Jump ahead a few millennia, and Tevinter magisters break into their home, get exposed to weapon, and return to Earth.
The Elves used their weapon before, maybe bits of it are still floating around?
>>47168904
It may well be something they do, I have tried to look up Titans in the lore and there is only one passing mention. Sadly this may be the reason they go with as it is something that can be entirely written to fit future needs.
I do find it lazy and sloppy to do that, there is no possible way we could guess or work out or even suspect what will happen because the information they will use in it is purposefully hidden and omitted from the game. Thus the lore is devalued futher and left to come in installments, point of having lore and deep backstory is that it ties in throughout the series, if you bring in a new self-containted unit of lore then it is quite pointless to the continued story as each part becomes its own little story.
>>47169100
What do you mean one passing mention? Are you missing the whole DLC that takes place inside one?
Or that Flemmeth admits to having killed one?
>>47169262
Haven't played the DLC, but the Flemmeth had an obscure reference. It is lazy writing to bring them up in a seperate stand-alone item, be it DLC or a seperate game.
>>47165147
Also 2nd most annoying companion. The 1st is obviously being Sara.
