You're playing and arcade style rpg. Wizards have no limit to spellcasting, but you have to figure a way to make them still feel like wizards, while not having them overshadow everyone else. What's the best way to do this? Give things casting times? I'm using a sort of stance system, where each stance would have a handfull of spells that aren't just damage dealers. So if the wizard wants to use fire, he'd switch to pyromancy, or if he wants to manipulate the world in certain ways he'd switch to geomancy, and so on and so forth.
I could just reduce damage, but I want the wizard player to feel like, given the time and lack of interference, he can drop some pain on things. Glass canon and all that.
>>46991243
If you mean D&D style, just do what they did with the Magic User in Shadows Over Mystara; limit the number of spells per level he can cast on every stage you are at but make them all very powerful or very useful.
This makes him a very potent attack asset in combat but also makes his strong offensive abilities a limited resource he has to manage.
>>46991331
I kind of rushed things, so I'll explain a bit more in detail. I run con games, and I run what I call "arcade mode", which means you use premade characters, and there's very little info to keep up with. It's all strictly "tell me what sounds cool and you'd like to do". There's a deck of cards that you draw from for items like health potions and blessed throwing daggers (gives melee players a ranged attack without switching stances), and there's a special character specific deck you draw from when you kill a mini boss or whatever that gives you a different "stance". Pic related, it's the fighters character sheet. You would put a card over that square in the middle when you want to change stances (and weapons, and usually group roles. This is so when someone gets the fighter, they can eventually unlock a crossbow for ranged dps or a sword and board for more tanking).
Combat usually lasted pretty quickly, so maybe just give each caster stance a 1/2/3 system, where the 1 round spell is simple stuff, and the 3 round spell is pretty mean. For a con game that goes pretty fast in combat, 3 rounds is a good stretch of time I'd say.
What does it mean to "feel like a wizard", OP? I think the Warlock and Dragonfire Shaman feel plenty like a generic fantasy wizard. Do you want it to feel like the classic D&D vancian wizard? If so, why?
>>46991889
As in feel like their character is playing a wizard, and not an archer who doesn't use a bow and the arrows are made of searing fire.
>>46992050
In that case, both Warlock and Dragonfire Adept count, as they have invocations that are not "do damage".
>>46991243
>mfw im running an Avatar game with a stance system
>one of the things is that the Avatar would have to change stances to bend a different element
are you trying to be me or something?
>>46991243
>Wizards have no limit to spellcasting, but you have to figure a way to make them still feel like wizards, while not having them overshadow everyone else. What's the best way to do this?
Make spellcasting skill-based.
Simple, easy spells can be done just by successfully completing a skill check, like any other skill. More difficult spells would consume stamina, life force, or time casting... possibly all three. As such, the wizard can't be casting these larger spells all the time. They could run around and toss fire darts as much as they want, but if they want to move mountains or rain lightning, that requires some dedicated time or to exhaust themselves and leave themselves vulnerable.
Give fighters and other martial characters a similar system - where they can use standard attacks normally, but exhaust their stamina for rapid attacks/much stronger attacks, and you have at least some sense of balance between classes.
The only other thing would be to have spells take a lot of effort to learn and memorize correctly. Either wizards have a very low number of spells known, or learning new spells chews up a lot of skill points/experience cost, or however the system works. That would prevent the wizard from simply memorizing a dozen different utility spells and just rain fireballs from their invisible flying perch.
>>46991243
spells have charge times. level one wizards can charge up high level spells, but it can take a long time, even like a full minute. during that time they can only take non attack actions and cast quick defensive spells.
Spellcasting gets bonuses if the player speaks incanations with verbosity and makes signs with their hands.
If you're gonna play a wizard, you go all or nothing.
>>46994199
>tfw was gonna do something like this for a Jojo campaign where you have to punch the air and yell oraoraora
Make primary caster play revolve around debilitations, buffs, crowd control, and utility spells. Instead of wizards being archers that do more damage less often, or do less damage but in an area of affect, have them be a class that does less damage, but can turn enemies against each other, conjure walls that separate the enemy, reduce an ally's vulnerability to ranged attacks, make someone take two turns, teleport, conjure food and water, and so forth. Obviously, too many of these abilities are OP, but you should find a balance that's interesting to play, contributes to team play, and doesn't make playing the other roles in the party trivial.
Give spells cool-downs. Like, 1-3 level spells you can pop off constantly and have to rapid firing like Fist of the North Star to reach a cool down state, where they have to wait a turn or two to use it again. Using magic during the cool down time has negative consequences, like dealing damage to yourself (casting fireball to many times brings the origin point of the fireball closer to the casters body till the point where thier body catches on fire before the spell flies off)
>>46991243
Motherfucker's worthless without magic. It exhausts their physical form, thus making it harder to channel magic the longer or intense they use it. Basically a mana bar with stamina thrown in. You can't cast spells now? Fuck you, now you're a worthless shit that doesn't even know how to stab properly.
>>46991243
Energy is energy and a wizard can only manipulate as much as a human being can physically. Just with mana instead of muscle.
If peak fighter can pick up and throw a man across the room, so can the wizard. If peak fighter can punch gods to death, wizard can do similar.
>>46991243
Casting times. The thing that makes wizards the most OP is being able to cast as fast at the fighter swings his sword. If the wizard is slower and more interrupt-able, he needs the warriors to cover him until his artillery can be deployed.
Let him destroy dozens, just make him wait to do it until after others have shined. That way, all can bask in the afterglow of combat instead of 3/4 of the team having blueballs while only the wizard shines.
>>46991243
Have one or two long-range, spammable spells that they can use to remain useful in combat, but have stronger spells that have long cooldowns between uses. You can combine this with your idea of stance swapping to limit their versatility at the drop of a hat.
The sorcerer class in the game Guild Wars II does a good job of this by having a small group of spells available at all times, but they change when you switch to different damage types with a long delay between the swaps.
A third option is to have no limit to spell casting, but a limit to how many times you can switch your stance.
>>46991243
RThere is a target number of a spell. Roll d100. If the number rolled is near the target, you cast successfully. Skill determines how much wizard can +- to the dice.
>>46991243
I honestly do not like the idea of wizards throwing fireballs. Everyone has their own idea of what a wizard should be like, but personally my take on wizards is that they should be like witches: hermits who dedicate their isolated lives to the study of magic.
In this case their magic would involve various props, rituals and components to create illusions, control or summonr creatures, place curses on people, scry etc. basically avoid simple damage spells and go for more complex utility.
For example an archwizard could manipuate the weather by conjuring rainstorms, but not"pew-pew lightning strickes" as much as "oh fuck it's cold and there's mud everywhere". Imagine how hard that could potentially fuck an army or how wasted it would be on a small scale encounter.
