So do scars exist in a world that has healing magic? Seems like it would prevent them, and even if you did get them, that they could be easily repaired.
>>46563566
Sorry, image for ants.
Using healing too long after an injury's occurred, OR using shitty tribal healing magic, leaves scars. Some people do it on purpose, because nobody likes a baby-faced grizzled outlaw.
Why would magic not leave scars?
>>46563566
Depends on how healing magic works in the setting.
Get a specific setting and do research or make your own.
I often say clerical magic doesn't leave scars because its restoring the body to before the injury.
Druidic magic speeds up the body's natural healing to accomplish the same affect but leaves scars.
Spells like vigor and lesser vigor grant fast healing so those leave scars in my games.
It really all depends on the person running.
>>46563566
That depends a lot on the exact mechanism involved in magical healing. Should vary between settings and could vary within a single setting. If magic merely wildly accelerates natural healing, you should get normal scarring.
Also, I wouldn't be surprised at there being some odd supernatural effects that cause (possibly unnatural-looking) scarring regardless of healing method, whether as the point or as a side effect.
>>46563631
Scars form because of new tissue. Maybe im wrong, but i always assumed healing magic mended old skin
Maybe you want to keep the scars to prove you've been in a lot of fights.
Also, there should probably be a distinction between magic which removes injuries and magic which simply heals at a vastly accelerated rate. Regeneration would definitely leave scars. That'd also create a divide between rough and ready healing magic for people that need to get back to work and fancy healing for the rich.
cosmetic surgery exists for scars too, don't see every dick and jane doing that either.
Harry Potter
>>46563593
Why would tribal magic be shitty?
>>46563853
The same reason tribal medicine is not as good as western medicine i assume.
>>46563919
It's magic.
>>46563941
Exactly
>>46563952
So tribals would have better healing magic, since that's what they primarily rely on?
>>46563986
In a fantasy setting EVERYONE relies on healing magic. It's just that when you're worshipping gods of healing and civilisation and using their power to cast Cure Wounds, you're likely to get a more efficient and less scar-producing spell than if you call up some savage orc god of violence and death.
>>46563986
I would say that it's completely possible that tribal magic could be shittier than civilized magic if there are such things as magic "scholars" where they could innovate and work on medimagical practices, and where the tribal shamans simply use what works which leads to reinforcing of potentially damaging techniques like if they dab moss onto the wound before healing it and the moss incidentally interacts with the healing process.
>>46563941
But is magic in your setting more like sympathetic, wild magic, or is it more like hermetic magic and hence more scientific in nature? Or do different traditions exist in the same setting?
This is kind of why "depends on the setting" is, despite being a non-answer, often the only response to these general questions without further clarification from either OP or whoever's answering.
>>46563657
I might actually go for an almost metaphorical take on scars and healing. Most often, healing leaves scars because the events that caused them have left a scar on the psyche or soul of the one being healed, and magic being fucking weird as shit and kind of metaphorical in nature represents this physically.
A faithful person might see clerical healing as divine forgiveness, and mend their psyches with that, or a druidic barbarian might take his experiences and meditate on them, growing as a character and seeing the scars as trophies of experience won.
Or perhaps just the opposite. A penitent might meditate on their wounds, growing in the depth of their faith through the understanding of their experiences, while a barbarous berserker might not experience any character growth at all, just impulsively enjoying the slaughter.
Scars can be used much as they are in narrative, to give depth to character and to show us more about their personalities, rather than as simple reflections of game mechanics, though they can also be reflections of the natures of various magics as well. As with all narrative, it depends on a number of factors, but that doesn't mean there's always one correct answer.
>>46564039
This. Main problem with tribal knowledge is it is tyoically passed down as some sacred shit that cannot be innovated or the forest will shit on you for disrespect.
I think good way to do this is that potions and light wound healing spells leave scars, but major healing and resurrection removes them.
>>46563566
In my setting magical healing leaves no scars, aside from a few traditions that consider scars to be a source of power. Some of these traditions are savage, like orcs wearing scars from major battles and thus being empowered by the "trophies" carved into their flesh. Others might use complex scarification to embed spells into their skin, or similar esoteric effects. None of them take kindly to having healing effects that heal scars used on them.
>>46564156
>Main problem with tribal knowledge is it is tyoically passed down as some sacred shit that cannot be innovated or the forest will shit on you for disrespect.
In fantasy they are sometimes right though.
>>46564059
"Depends on the setting" is kind of a non-answer, and true though it is it's also not very helpful in advancing the discussion.
People who want "THE ONE TRUE ANSWER" rightfully deserve "Depends on the setting" as their answer, but I often see questions like this as being motivators for discussion where we can examine the ideas or philosophies or reasons behind it in different settings, rather than what one specific setting does via the rules.
>>46564156
Actually, that's not really true. Tribal stuff often changes, but the stories that remain are timeless because they tap into something that does not often change. Stories serve a purpose in tribal societies and that purpose is to educate rather than simply entertain. It's much like the the "Machine Spirit," where armor that is maintained protects better while armor that is neglected doesn't protect as well. It's animism and reverence directed at prudent, sustainable, good practice. And in fantasy settings; a good helping of >>46564232
>>46563566
Because the god of war thinks battle scars are hardcore. If you get injured outside of a fight, healing magic won't leave a scar.
>>46563566
Okay kiddies, time for some goddamn science.
First off, credentials: Emergency Medical Responder training (for those of you that aren't american, EMR is low-level professional medical training), years of fantasy games and books (the typical fa/tg/uy stuff) and a lot of my own scars). That said, I an NOT a medical professional, so if any of you fags are EMT's or Doctors or Nurses or Dermitologists and you want to get in on this action, that would be most welcome.
The first part of this is kind of a textdump about scars, but we need to lay out a basic understanding of how scars form to get to the magic bit, so just bare with me here. Also, we're throwing conservation of mass and energy out the window here.
When you get an injury, your body produces collagen (a structural protien that, among other jobs, helps to keep your skin smooth, strong, and healthy) to help heal the wound. The new collagen has a different pattern and structure than the rest of your skin, which is what makes a scar. The most common type of scar that forms is a hypertrophic scar, in which the collagen forms a raised, reddish pattern, usually in the shape of the wound the collagen is covering. These scars fade in color over time, leading to the soft peachy-white scars that we all have a few of. There are also contracture scars, which usually form on burns or electrical wounds, and pitted scars, which form when fat or structural tissue beneath the skin is destroyed (this is the kind of scar left by achne or chicken pox). Finally there are keloid scars, a large, raised, (itchy, often painful) wormy looking thing that results from overgrowth of collagen when your body overdoes its job.
(1/3)
>>46564973
Now on to magic. I'm under the opinion that whether or not magic would prevent or remove scarring would depend on both the type of scar and the way the healing magic works. For the purposes of this exercise, I'm going to assume that two "types" (schools, disciplines, techniques, whatever) of magic, one that accelerates natural healing and restores what you already have there (we'll call this restoration), and one that can replace lost material (we'll call this replacement).
First off: restoration. I'm assuming that this magic only helps you heal faster, it doesn't improve your healing ability beyond what your body could do. For the most part I imagine this as being druidic or barbarian magic. For example, restoration could help a slit wrist close up before you bleed to death, but it could not regrow a lost limb. Of the four scar types I mentioned, I think that it would help heal/prevent pitted scars, it would do little for keloid and hypertrophic scars, and it might actually make contracture scars worse. In the case of pitted scars, which are formed as fat and structural tissue beneath the wound dies, so if you speed up the healing process no scar would form. Keloid scars form from the body throwing too much collagen at what should be a hypertrophic scar, so healing it faster might, (note: might) just have it heal like a hypertrophic scar. In the case of hypertrophic scars, the wound is always going to heal by filling with collagen, regardless of its speed. Unless you can somehow "convince" the body to heal differently, those scars will still form, though considering that they fade over time, they'd be softer, paler, and more shapely than a natural scar would be (this would make it possible for ritual scarring more beautiful, intricate, and extensive. Just a thought). For contracture scars, accelerating the healing process could potentially make the scarring WORSE, not better.
(2/3)
>>46565003
Contracture scars form from collagen replacing skin that has been contracted (go figure) by a burn or shock. If that (burned, shriveled, crispy) skin is just rapidly replaced with collagen, congratz, you now have a sheet of wrinkled white construction paper where your skin was.
On to the "replacement" magic, which I generally think as being the holy magic that paladins and clerics sling around. This one is a bit less analytical, because... It's just *pop*, you're healed. One possible interesting thing to consider would be organ rejection! Considering that it's possible for you to have rejection syndrome for organs that are genetically your own. I admit, not that solid, but it could be fun to get a letter from an angry baron because after your cleric healed his sick wife, her body rejected her new lung and she promptly died.
(3/3)
>>46563691
Magic could:
>speed healing
>undo damage
>glue meat together and remove pain
>reverse time
>syphon future life to preserve present life
>and many more!
To me "regeneration" may leave discoloration but no scare while a first level "cure wounds" would. Now a 4th level cute wounds might stop leaving a scar, and a 6th level might undo scars already there.
It's all in what system or setting you like, because magic does what you want it to.
If the injuries are fairly major, yes. Usually scars and major injuries result from critical strikes.
>>46565146
Yeah, I established the parameters of my analysis quite thoroughly. Listing things magic can do, things that I very deliberately and clearly did not consider in my analysis, as a response to that analysis, is pointless. I considered magic as accelerated healing and magic as an all-powerful Macguffin.
>>46565146
I'd think regeneration, as in stimulating fast tissue regrowth might actually cause weird bubbly scar tissue, especially in the hands of an amateur.
I like my magic non-user-friendly.
>>46563566
Here's how it could work:
>Healing magic takes skill to do it efficiently and properly
>The scars left behind are a function of the injury itself and the healer's skill
>Novice healers often have to try multiple times, leaving patients healed, but with nasty-looking permanent scars
>Intermediate healers also leave scarring, but it's less noticable
>Truly skilled healers can cure a large flesh wound with only a tiny mark to show for it
>Masters of the art can make damaged tissue good as new, with no sign of injury at all
>A particularly good healing job is sometimes considered an improvement over the original, since it might remove a blemish or an older scar
I just assume that healing potions and spells accelerate the body's natural healing process rather than undoing the damage, so you would still have scars if the wound was bad enough.
When I'm Gming at least, I fluff healing magic as turbo-charging the body's ability to heal, which closes up wounds and beats illness in the short term, but puts sizable stress on the body that makes you more susceptible to health conditions as you get older, if you break out the magic to heal every little cut, bruise and cold without ever doing some natural recuperation.
>>46563566
Well you could
But a TRUE WARRIOR WEARS HIS SCARS AS A BADGE OF HONOR AND PRIDE
Also, in the wise-words of Fallout 1 and 2, they make great party talk.
>>46563566
Healing magic only works as a sped up healing process. Wounds may heal in seconds but they do so along the same lines as they would have if they had been left to heal naturally. Thus, a wound that would have left a scar naturally would leave a scar even if healed magically.
>>46564973
>>46565003
>>46565023
This is awesome. I actually learned some shit from /tg/, and have an idea how to better visualize healing magic in games at the same time.
>>46563566
scar is part of healing, low kinds of healing magic leaves scars, also manaburn could lead to a scar on certain conditions.
paladins cure by using the power of god to return the body to the best shape possible,
druids use nature to speed up the natural healing fast enought so that it does not creat scars.
tribal magic leaves lots of scars because it only speed up the healing to certain point.
tl:dr healing and undoing the harm are not the same thing.
>>46563919
That seems pretty stupid, given that I wouldn't expect anyone in a generic fantasy setting to have western medicine.
"Because tribal types like scars, and optimize their healing magics or methods to recover functionality without removing scars" seems better.
>>46574403
I'd go with
"Some cultures view scarification as a sign of maturity, worldliness, and resilience. A scar earned in battle is a sign of experience, and a heavily-scarred person is considered worthy of respect. They tend to perceive unscarred people as weak, inexperienced, or immature. For these reasons scars are desirable, and their healers are trained to perform operations in a way that leaves behind aesthetically-pleasing scars. Some people will even choose to manufacture scars on themselves in a bid to raise their perceived status."
Of course, the opposite may well be true. Scars could be considered a sign of foolishness, since this person wasn't fast or cunning enough to avoid a serious injury in the first place.
>>46573445
That's good to hear. Always a little annoying to throw out a big researched post like that and see it largely ignored, but if at least one person takes interest, it was worth it.
>>46575164
Or if the magical techniques are readily available, the appearance of someone not benefiting from such beneficial magic would appear barbaric and uncouth and shockingly sickly. I thought of it because Ringworld has super science to keep you young and heal you readily, and the protagonist misapprehends his own son for a member of a misfortunate, more primitive species of human because he lived his life in a very rough way and looks about 60 despite being 30-40, while his father is about 200, and looks 20, and a pretty, movie start 20 at that by our standards.
So your marvelous, almost legendary types might look upon the settings relatively unmagically talented humans or other races like that. Maybe it would be Elves, maybe someone else that was just good at magic. If they didn't have that kind of thing to deal with their health problems they'd probably get reedy and painfully thin and wrinkly, but since they do they live practically forever and look pretty, whereas the humans have medieval life spans and look like hideous apes to the magic master race.
