http://pastebin.com/NjH6gQqi
Last Thread: >>46528164 →
i fucked up edition
chronicles of fagness
>>46556674
<insert obligatory Black Hand PDF Beg Post here>.
>>46556762
>>46556793
>>46556814
aight fuccbois, help me out on this.
>>46557111
Don't forget Gayracula. And the authors being asked a direct question and answering with 'meh, I don't care'.
When is mage 2e out
>>46557111
"Meta bullshit"
>>46557111
"It's a toolbox. Just do what you want."
>>46557216
Hours of non-WOD relevant arguing
>>46557216
Edition Warring.
Taking a single throwaway comment completely out of context.
>>46557216
"tfw Mummy", "Someone Starts An Edition War", and "When are We Splitting the General?
Keep em coming.
>>46557216
Pronouns
DaveB says what
That Guy who likes Beast
>>46557366
fuck that guy who likes beast.
>>46557349
Random sad and pathetic AmyV post
We did it guys.
>>46557349
Pregnant male characters
>>46557349
"I am angry. Angry about PRONOUNS", "I have an idea for a Kyasid", "The State of American Politics"
>>46557596
perfect, thanks anon
>>46557111
"i really liked bloodlines!"
Replace 'pronouns' with otherkin. Otherkin pops up a little more frequently, I think.
>>46557596
>no unironic mage supremacy shitposting
>no unironic DaveB worshipping
Obviously made by a mage fanboy, how disgusting.
>>46558210
Nah, arguing about pronouns ends up happening way more often than talking about Otherkin. 'Sides, that tends to get wrapped up in "bitch about Beast" these days.
-Accusing someone of being Aspel/atamajakki
-Dresden Files and other stupid shit as inspiration discussion
-that idiot who always types in lower case and asks stupid questions he could just Google
God why do I still come here?
>>46558493
Because you're here forever.
>>46558493
>>46558493
The /wodg/ discourse has actually gotten really bad recently, which is odd because we got a new book that Was Not Bad but no one wants to discuss that. What the people want is inane screaming at one another about how something they read in a Hunter book is not compatible with something they read in a Werewolf book.
>>46558774
If only we were all as enlightened and high in our roleplay careers as you and I, and not as retrograde as these.. things.
>>46557111
"Telling a story about atamajakki that isn't actually about atamajakki."
>tfw Mummy
>>46557216
"Technorcracy Posting"
>>46558774
Don't worry, it's a toolbox
Someone always yammers on about Irem's Rite breaking time. Anyone got a page reference on that? The whole 'time travel is impossible' part of it?
So, STing question. I've got a slightly combat-optimized character in my Werewolf game who has 8-10 defense and I'm having serious trouble challenging her fight-wise. While I don't have a problem with the player winning fights because it's Werewolf, when I want the end-of-story-arc fight between the player pack and the rival wolf pack they've been in a spat with I really don't want them to come across as pushovers.
Do I give the NPCs fighting styles? Enviromental tilts on the battleground out the ass? Carefully positioned snipers three blocks away? What do I do to challenge this character and the rest of the pack without a). creating hilariously OP combat monsters & b). having everything balanced against the ONE optimized character so that the other three players end up getting killed or seriously injured?
>>46559243
Point the pack alpha the combat-op character, who is also combat-op.
>>46558774
I think that it's not as much as no one wants to discuss it as much as it's already been discussed out. There's not much more to talk about when it comes to Dark Eras, unless we all start playing the settings. The Black Hand book's out but I don't think that's gonna get the same kind of discussion Dark Eras had.
So, we've pretty much got nothing but shitposting until Awakening 2e comes out.
>>46557216
>MFW you didn't realize "dumb metashit" was me complaining about you
Wow.
>>46559243
present a problem that can't be defeated by clawing it to bits. THEN go to the umbra and fight ridiculous nonsense.
>>46559413
There's also a lot of dumb metashit in these threads too, though.
>>46559416
Luckily, I've heaped a couple of plot threads that they can't kill their way out of on them already: a spiritual Barren in their territory & a drug kingpin operating in their territory who gets on two of the PC's nerves but is important enough that killing him would cause a bullshit cascade that no one wants to deal with.
I just want to keep these NPCs from getting curbstomped because that's actually...not enjoyable gaming. Especially given how hyped-up the leader of the enemy pack's been.
>>46556754
Where is this damn book.
>>46559094
Book of the Deceived's intro fiction.
>I can see, hear, smell, taste and touch these parts, but without the thread of time stitching them into one account into true recollection. I think I shall never remember it truly, for the Rite of Return violated time. By that time, they had revealed the full technique of the spell, and I saw how the paths of Remet lives were twisted upon themselves. My memories are broken because we broke the moments themselves.
I don't yammer.
>>46559666
Any other sources? That could just as easily be their bizarre personal recollection, destroyed by their experience of the afterlife.
>>46559532
On my computer.
>>46557596
What
>>46559807
gief :(
>>46560115
BINGO!
>>46557596
First I have to ask whether you actually understand how BINGO works. Second I have to wonder if you've only been in these threads for the last week or so.
>>46560115
Say Dave can you have your own familiar claim yourself? Would you still be allowed to play that character, or does something weird happen?
>>46560507
Familia are ST controlled, so you'd have to either have an ST you're willing to compromise with, or everything becomes a roll off as the sythesis blends your alternate agendas together
>>46560744
True it has it's own agenda. But what if, what if you created the familiar from your own ghost?
Then you have the same agenda, hell same personality. What then?
>>46560778
>Then you have the same agenda, hell same personality.
Not really. You are alive, (potentially) rational being with the ability to react, adapt and generally act like a person.
Whereas your ghost is a an echo of the trauma that spawned it, endlessly reliving it and bitterly seeking misplaced revenge or aggressively recruiting aid in preventing an event that has already happened.
>>46560816
A fair point, but the ghost in question was not created in trauma. So I'm not sure quite how that ghost will act.
>>46560816
This is basically something the Purified were built for.
Anyone got V20 Black Hand yet? If so, were the spoilers that were posted a month or so ago accurate about vampires not having souls and such?
So how much worse would a Caliphate be in CoD? Like i'm sure there would be some mummies, but i'd love to see werewolves an changelings wearing the veil... Wait would veils make changelings super hard to spot by huntsmen?
>>46561149
I got Black Hand, i'll go look up the soul shit an get back to you senpai
>>46561397
>>46561397
... Please and thank you? Mostly I'm curious if that was actually a dev or some moron playing around. The review on rpg.net makes it seem ambiguous, but the original post with info is here:
https://desustorage.org/tg/thread/45077740/#45083926
>>46561397
>https://desustorage.org/tg/thread/45077740/#45083926
You could post the book :3
>>46561572
You could buy the book.
>>46561499
I'm not seeing anything about Vampires not having souls, like, only 39 pages in there's this
Rite of Sak Yant
This rite brands the skin and the soul of a supplicant with a yantra, marking them as a member of the Tal’Mahe’Ra.
>>46561649
How about not being a faggot and posting the book.
>>46561820
How about not being a faggot and purchasing the thing you want. Like i'ma risk getting in trouble for some anon.
>>46561649
Cool. I had planned on picking up the book on the next paycheck (I just splurged by spare cash on a bunch of used OWoD books that I found at the local Half Price Books, so I'm waiting).
>>46561649
>Rite of Sak Yant
>This rite brands the skin and the soul of a supplicant with a yantra, marking them as a member of the Tal’Mahe’Ra.
I dont buy PDFs. Just physical copies.
>>46561993
Oh, well sorry senpai you gotta wait until thas out or one of the few VTM fags cares to share that shit. I'm to much of a pussy to do that.
I just realized that a human with the skin walker merit can get the claimed manifestation.
How the fuck does that work?
>>46562895
Stop shitposting this onto every thread
>>46562908
He won't, he's that sad.
>>46562908
>>46562919
It's a bot, dinguses, report it and move on.
>>46557376
Why do people hate Beast, anyways?
>>46563063
Aside from the hamfisted politics of the author, I never liked it because the concept itself seemed boring to me. If you're going to sell me on playing Godzilla I better fucking be able to turn into Godzilla somewhere other than my 'safe space'.
>>46563089
It's the world of darkness. Creeping dread and horror just out the corner of your eye. Godzilla emerging IRL completely misses the point.
Or at least it did until Dave and whoever wrote Demon (I suspect Dave also) got into a power-up pissing contest and started throwing horror out the window in favor of massive power fantasies
>>46563142
The guy who wrote Demon is also the guy who wrote Beast, Matt McFarland (and also Rose Bailey).
>>46562997
How can it be a bot? It shouldn't be able to get passed the Captcha.
>>46562895
Haven't seen this in a while. What's with the image, anyway?
>>46563172
Then the blame lies solely with Dave, because at least Beast had the decency to keep it in it's pants
>>46563449
But people at least like Demon and it has a purpose.
>>46563209
There are places in indo-china where you can get 1000 capchas filled for 1$, Mostly used for spaming but someone could use it for 4chan.
>>46561834
How the hell would you get in trouble?
>>46563449
And Mage didn't? Anon, what DaveB says only really affects Mage/people who want to use it.
>>46564142
>>46564374
Can't tell if bait, or inability to detect sarcasm.
>>46564119
Illegal distribution?
>>46564399
Why would anyone try to track you down and arrest you for that? There's no watermarks so OPP can't really do anything either.
>>46564142
Another square on my bingo board.
>begging for books
>trying to convince some cuck to upload a pdf
omg vampire fags
Between 4 shared and 7 chan are there any books you really can't find?
>>46564508
I went looking for it just to shut him up, actually. There's only requests on all of it. Weird.
>>46564532
You know our plight
>>46563089
It's a shame OPP couldn't spin the antipathy towards Beast as just a right wing backlash against progressivism.
>>46564532
That's pretty much true of all V20 books. It seems to take months for someone to upload them.
>>46564474
Aren't the pdfs like $15?
Just buy the damn thing if you want it that badly.
>>46556668
Soooo, to avoid the bullshit, let's talk about the Bowery Dogs write up. As I was reading it, I realized they left out this huge section of NYC history during this time period that would be so much more interesting than the fifth mention of the Stobewall Riots. I am talking about how for years, the South Bronx burned. Due to crippling poverty and fucked up city codes, it was actually more profitable for people to burn down their apartment buildings then try to save them. This contributed to the blight that infected the city as the hideously poor moved into new neighborhoods. This also touched off an insane amount of racial violence as poor immigrants fled into mostly Irish and Italian neighborhoods.
Isn't this something yours an ST would want to know about the time period?
Pic is Jimmy Carter visiting the South Bronx in '74 and commenting how it looks like Europe after WW2
>>46565073
Stonewall riots. On phone and it didn't autocorrect because it's not a noun you see everyday
>>46565073
Well that point of history would have really shaken up the NYC Shadowside.
I'm a first time ST, going to be a 1st edition Changeling: the Lost chronicle set in Portland, OR. I have a skeletal plotline and several NPC ideas but I have no idea how to develop or prepare further. Wat do? If it's important, all of my players are new to the system and I only have a bunch of second-hand experience with it.
I'm also a bit worried because my players all live in Portland while I live several miles outside of it. I fear that they may have more familiarity than I do with the actual city and I'll be confusing and contradictory somehow.
>>46565143
I know, right? And a new fire court could have risen because buildings burned everyday for almost the whole decade.
>>46565170
Here's what you do for the city thing: just tell them you might be shaky on some details and try to ignore the small stuff. If you really screw up, then yeah they should tell you but try not to let it mess up the flow of the game
>>46565170
Watch the show Grimm. It's basically a Changeling/Hunter crossover chronicle, sans the trauma metaphors.
>>46565073
But the Stonewall Riots are more interesting, especially for Werewolf, since it literally involves fighting.
A Werewolf game set during some city wide riot would be amazing. Everyone is beating the shit out of each other and looting and reenacting No Church In The Wild and the Werewolves are dealing with the complicated Spirits that both flare up during and cause the riots.
https://youtu.be/FJt7gNi3Nr4
Spirits of Oppression going "they aren't human, abuse your position"
Spirits of Passion going "they're your enemies, fight back"
Spirits of Fire making those rags and liquor bottles look good together
Hate and Fear all over the place.
Authority clashing with Liberty
Also, singing about it.
https://youtu.be/47E2tfK5QAg
Fuck me that would have been so much better than just the 70s. We could have had Les Mis. We could have had the Rodney King riots. The Revolutionary War. All those Emotion Spirits stirring discontent.
How is Bowery Dogs? It's been second only to God's Country in settings I don't care at all about, with the only saving grace being that it could maybe be like The Warriors.
>>46563449
Seriously whats your beef with Dave. He has litlerly been in almost every book.
>>46565351
He's the lead on Mage, and Mage is a powergaming wankfest completely out of tone with the rest of the CofD because they have supreme cosmic authority over everything.
>>46565373
You clearly no nothing of the CofD cosmology then.
>>46565398
>the supernal underlies every realm
>not just the material, but the underworld, the shadow, and every other plane that another template makes their niche in
>>46565266
>>46565270
Thanks. You're lifesavers.
>>46565316
I don't know why, but this all sounds really, really gay. It's probably because of the French.
>>46565373
>I haven't actually read any of the info on the version of Mage that Dave is developing, I just skimmed 1e and used the objectively wrong white-room method to determine that Mages are the best splat
They have supreme cosmic authority over nothing. Even a mage with 5 dots in Mind isn't going to have control over every mind in the tapestry. MAYBE an Archmage, but by the time you hit Archmastery rules and balance hardly matter anymore.
The game is not written AT ALL as a powergaming wankfest; if that's what it looks like to you, that's entirely on you. It's written as a game about human beings who have a lot of power, and how easy it is for them to become absolute monsters as a result of that power.
>>46565498
>rules that haven't been released yet are totally relevant to a comparative discussion of the various gamelines
Ah, so you're one of THOSE people.
Good to know
>>46565428
>underlies
Do you know what this actually means? Because it isn't "rules over."
The Supernal underlies every realm because the Supernal is a DICTIONARY. That's all it is. A list of symbols and other symbols used to describe those symbols.
>>46565498
>Mages are is the most human line in the setting
>But also they can be the biggest monsters ever
You just need to have everything, don't you magey
>>46565535
No lie, you are a faggot, and an example of what is wrong with these threads.
No one is telling you to stick around and propagate the dick measuring contest you apparently despise.
>>46565551
>it's not all-encompassing, because of symbols and shit
>just because it applies to literally every other cosmology, creating a unified whole where Mage is the only game that supersedes everything else, doesn't mean that it's absurdly out of place and overpowered at all
>>46565428
Yes, but as has been said billions of times, the Supernal does not define anything. It symbolizes things.
Mages are capable of discerning what a given thing is based on what it has symbolic links to; an Idigam in Spirit Sight is going to show symbols of spirit, change, human, and either moon(for the moon-banished) or earth(for the eath-bound). That doesn't tell you exactly what an Idigam is.
The same goes for anything else a Mage looks at with Mage Sight. They're going to get a vague, symbolic idea of what it is, but exact information is going to require scrutiny and logical thinking.
>>46565535
You're the one who blamed Dave for making Mage a wankfest when he had nothing to do with the rules that ARE currently released.
>>46565560
I said nothing of the sort. They're not the most human, that would be mortals; they aren't the most monstrous, that would be Beast(the splat which has absolutely no reason NOT to be a horrible asshole to everyone and their mother).\
Mages aren't at either extreme, but they aren't perfectly in the middle, either; they're humans with supernatural power, who stand on a slippery slope into the territory of monsters.
>>46565637
>All the other splats have ways to interact with the realms of other splats, if they want
>BUT MAGE IS COMPLETELY UNFITTING AND OVERPOWERED BECAUSE THEY ACTUALLY HAVE REASONS TO VISIT THESE PLACES
>>46565373
Sigh..., you're That Guy.
First, have you actually fully read, no less played Mage, or bothered to read the detailed spoilers for 2e?
Do you realize that Dave had nothing to do with the first edition, he's written for every nWOd/CofD gameline, and he was mostly chosen as the new Mage developer because of his well-received actual plays on rpg.net?
Do you understand that some of the primary themes of Mage are that humans are some of the worst monsters and what happens when these humans gain the power to change reality? It's not the same type of horror as Vampire or Changelings. It's a totally different niche, and it may not be for you.
Do you know that the vast majority of mages, and definitely newer characters, only have proficiency in a few Arcana, and thus while very adept at altering a few aspect of reality, are specialized and quite vulnerable in most others. That's why cabals and consilia are such a large focus of the game. You need to approach the game as someone who plays, not ridiculous white room spreadsheet nonsense.
Lastly, you might be interested to note that Dave is also the lead developer on the upcoming Deviant gameline. You'll be happy to know that Dave has explicitly indicated that the power levels will mostly me on the low end just above Hunter. The perception that Dave's some fetish-like powergamer wanker exists only in your mind.
>>46565637
>just because it applies to literally every other cosmology,
It "applies" insofar as a dictionary always "applies," because it is a list of words and definitions of those words.
The world says "I have a humanoid blood-sucking monster" and the Supernal kicks back "Death-symbols, probably?" until the Mage looks closer and discovers that, no, there's Spirit and Abyssal symbols on this one for some reason--and then he gets ate.
>creating a unified whole where Mage is the only game that supersedes everything else,
Nope. Mage doesn't assert anything, so there's nothing to supersede with. The other gamelines assert "Vampires are this" and Mage agrees, because the Supernal has no power to assert anything, any more than any dictionary does.
>>46565398
Hey, all he has to do is clear it up. So far he hasn't.
>>46565551
It's also a dictionary where scratching out or re-writing a word changes the meaning of the word in the world, or annihilates it as though it never was.
>>46565706
Until it's released, it's nothing but fanfiction.
Which is conveninet, because Dave's APs are what define nWoD Mage. And they happen to be nothing but fanfiction from the man himself
OP hired someone who "loves" the franchise, and he's done nothing but turn them into super saiyans who trounce anything else in the setting because he wants them to
>>46565742
>It's also a dictionary where scratching out or re-writing a word changes the meaning of the word in the world, or annihilates it as though it never was.
And doing so in the real world has the same effect on the dictionary. Either way you still have to be powerful enough to actually do it, and Mages are not.
Archmages can be, but at that point you're now on the radar of other archmage-tier beings, and they've been at this a lot longer than you.
Why would you play Mage when Unknown Armies exists and it's better in every way?
Oh right, you want power without drawbacks
>>46556668
I'm a member of the True Black Hand.
Ask me anything!
>>46565637
>>46565769
Yeah, that's nice, but that's not released yet. In 1e, the only game that isn't what the other person said, fanfiction, the dictionary is all.
>>46565769
>Archmages can be, but at that point you're now on the radar of other archmage-tier beings, and they've been at this a lot longer than you.
Thank You that you have powers to affect everything, rather than just a few individual themes.
Arguing that Archmages are underpowered does nothing to weaken the argument that Mage players are powergaming asshats.
>>46565799
How many hot vamp chicks are in the sect?
>>46565809
>Yeah, that's nice, but that's not released yet. In 1e, the only game that isn't what the other person said, fanfiction, the dictionary is all.
If you're going with "only published things count" then you have to drop the blame Dave line, because he didn't work on Mage 1e. One or the other.
>>46565817
>Thank You that you have powers to affect everything, rather than just a few individual themes.
Not really? Just by sheer XP costs, most Archmages will only be Archmages in one or two spheres, which is definitely narrower than (say) Luna having dominion over everything that changes regularly which--hey look at that--includes every single Archmage's soul.
>Arguing that Archmages are underpowered does nothing to weaken the argument that Mage players are powergaming asshats.
You were the one that brought up 'changing the dictionary,' which Mages cannot do.
>>46565838
>How many hot vamp chicks are in the sect?
Many.
Hot chiks are our speciality.
Unfortunately I can't give you specific phone numbers - we're (supposed to be) a secret organisation.
>>46565796
Because Unknown Armies 3 isn't out yet?
>>46565799
Why do you suck so hard?
>>46565870
But only published things do count, Mage 2e ain't shit yet. Not the same guy thats bitching, just sayin'.
>>46565902
>Why do you suck so hard?
We're vampires, goddamnit!
But, FYI, I suck very gently. I do not like to hurt my prey.
Also I like to enjoy these private little moments.
>>46565800
>someone disagrees with my perfect logic
>must have never played it
>>46565870
Oh, no, see, two (three?) threads back he came out and confirmed that the spirits of 6+ in Imperial Mysteries were meant to not work in the same way as the Supernal Gods. In that when they used their Imperial Influences, it changed only the fallen world thing, not the Supernal one. That still existed, and that things like Luna weren't the 'sponsors' of their respective templates.
>>46565742
Mages can't scratch out or re-write a word until Archmastery. At that power level, you have to deal with things that can completely destroy you.
>>46565747
>he's done nothing but turn them into super saiyans who trounce anything else in the setting because he wants them to
You mean clarify the fact that they don't have supreme control over anything at all? That they are by no means gods?
>>46565809
He's literally talking about 1e you fucktard.
>>46565796
>What is Paradox?
>What are the Guardians of the Veil?
>What are Banishers?
>What are any of the multitude of drawbacks that Mages have?
>>46565800
Also applies to everyone I already quoted, it seems.
>>46565928
Then why was DaveB's 2e Mage work brought up by the cuntwaffle to begin with if "it doesn't count"?
>>46565937
Cant we stop taking the bait, please?
This dbag isn't going to stop, and it's turning the thread into a spergfest led by the chief sperg.
>>46565970
>hurrr, everyone is wrong because I say so
>>46565937
>In that when they used their Imperial Influences, it changed only the fallen world thing, not the Supernal one.
A physical impossibility, so I'm inclined to wager you misunderstood him until you can present the actual thing he said. The Supernal necessarily changes in response to changes to the Fallen world.
We've already seen examples of it: by simple dint of existing and spreading to such a degree, humanity made the Supernal world more amicable to humanity. It was much more hostile.
If Luna uses her power to wipe out the moon, the Supernal symbol for the moon also, necessarily, disappears.
>>46565981
Because he's a cuntwaffle that just wants to bitch, man, thas all. Oh an get a rise out of people, that too. You know, cuntwaffle things, or maybe dickpancake?
If we could get some sort of confirmation from OP that the Supernal doesn't actually underlay everything, thus rendering anything without access helpless to anything that does, we'd be fine. Until then..
>>46565799
Why havent you posted the pdf of your guide yet!
its the fake modesty of magefags that bothers me the most
why can't they just admit that they're powergamers who hate the established setting and want to be able to reshape reality according to their whims, no different to the way Wizards do in Dungeons And Dragons
they insist that their boken mechanics and all-encompassing cosmology are "not that broken" when they obviously are
why?
>>46565747
Is there really something wrong with you? Troll? Autism? Severe erectile dysfunction and anal leakage?
Dave's AP's weren't "fanfiction," at least not how anyone else understands the term. They were just simple, albeit entertaining, write-ups of Dave's various Mage games, and they demonstrated he had a passion for the game as designed and intended specifically and WOD generally, understood the nuances and mechanics of Mage, and was a great creative writer. Dave was already a prolific WW author. Who better than to take the reigns of leadership of Mage than someone with all those qualifications?
Dave has also released extensive and detailed spoilers. While some things definitely will result in a power bump, it was mostly done to maintain consistency in the rules and setting, such as ensuring the spells of the various Arcana actually reflect the proper Practices. However, some other major items will receive a clear power nerfing, including the removal of unlimited success ritual casting.
You really need to read the original Mage book (supplements entirely optional) and peruse the 2e spoilers. You're constantly describing games that exist only in your confused head, and have nothing to do with the real product or actual canon play.
I think it's more the general attitude that's the problem. When they're given evidence that they're wrong, they ignore it. >>46566026
>>46565799
Who is Cain?
>>46566002
He's not bitching, he's pulling people out to argue with him, see >>46566026.
>>46566040
Are you the guy who was going on about how mages aren't superior anymore because he made a throw-away comment regarding size and spell penalties with no insight or elaboration, then single handedly declared Beasts the new Power Splat?
Because you're sounding like him.
>>46566024
I'm sorry, but it's Top Secret information.
The fact that I'm posting in this thread can cost me my head.
So basically: ask me instead!
What do you want to know?
>>46566045
>Who is Cain?
The Dark Father, obviously.
>>46566040
>remove paradox except for 1 die with a dice trick on it (at worst)
>yeah the game is totally more balanced now
>>46565987
>I can't actually think of logical counterpoints to anything presented, so I'm going for ad hominem
Nice
>>46566026
I love the established setting. You can't reshape reality according to your whim until you Ascend, which is literally a win state where you stop playing.
Talk to me when you've actually read the books.
>>46566072
>The Dark Father, obviously.
Wrong answer...
>>46566051
>Only one person could ever possible disagree with me, and they're clearly a troll! I'm just that clever.
>>46566104
>Wrong answer...
Now who's the fcking True Black Hand here, buddy?
>>46566077
>I clearly don't understand how Paradox works in 2e.
>>46566078
You don't present anything to attack, because you don't have any actual counterpoints to begin with.
So, basically, no u.
>>46566125
oWoD sucks.
>>46566141
You suck
>>46566157
Okay.
sure is easy to bait people with bad troll posts about MAGE
>>46566141
I think we can all agree on one thing: Mage: Awakening and Dave B suck. It's shit on the level of My Immortal.
>>46566141
>World of Darkness
>A world of darkness
>it sucks
Wew, lad!
Really?
>>46566125
I find your lack of knowledge about the Cainite Heresy...disconcerting
>>46566198
Yes. It was bad mechanics and bad metaplot that was only forgivable in the 90s because it was virtually alone in its genre. Nowadays, especially with CofD available, there's no excuse for clinging to the garbage that is oWoD.
Unless you're European, I guess. For some reason they just can't let that shit go.
>>46566063
>Are you the guy...
Nope. I have no idea about any size penalty for spells or whatever discussion and believe Beast is a hot mess, but not a new "power splat."
I simply believe that the basic "mage supremacy" arguments rest on ridiculous white room assumptions concerning Mage that don't reflect the actual rules or setting, 1e or anticipated 2e. Similarly, blaming Dave for these perceived failings or the game's themes is ridiculous because he was not the developer for Mage 1e. He did not begin writing for the gameline until the very end, books like Left-Handed Path, Seers of the Throne, Mage Nois, Imperial Mysteries, etc., whom many consider some of the best in the line.
>acting in line with your Vice gives you a willpower
>acting in line with your Virtue gives you all your willpower
Tell me. Why should I bother role-playing my Vice/Virtue when I already have full willpower?
>>46566254
Relax, babby!
Just because you don't like something that doesn't mean it's bad (or others shouldn't play / enjoy it).
Live and let live! ;)
GENDER AND
PREGNANCY
Gender is fluid and gender expression does not
always relate to reproductive capability in the real
world. For the supernatural creatures of the World
of Darkness this is even more true. When discussing
creatures like Wolf-Blooded and werewolves with
powers like Luna’s Embrace, gender should have no
bearing on whether or not a character can become
pregnant. The only thing that should stop a male
character’s pregnancy should be a player who
doesn’t want to tell that story.
>>46566303
Because you are playing a character in a story, not a figurine in a wargame.
Characters are people, and sometimes people do stupid shit based on imperfect beliefs
>>46566303
Because character consistency is more interesting than fishmalk lolrandumb shit.
>>46566322
No. I can't, I just can't. It hurts me to see people playing oWoD when they could play something else. I want to just scream at them, but then mom tells me to take my medicine or I won't get my chicken tendies.
>>46566346
But how is the baby born? Ass baby? Urethra baby?
Would this guy be a good Slasher?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5-1VLDzUvU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GRY81vtr3Jc
>>46566286
Okay. Then I'll peg you as the guy who claimed that your average starting character would do two things, tops, over and over again in a fight despite having any three arcanum with ratings of 3/2/1 because of 'muh rotes' in any of the 'real world' situations that were presented.
>>46566353
This would make sense if wod was a narrative system but it's crunchier than DnD so I will treat it as a game.
I'm sorry I'm having badwrongfun
>>46566379
Develops a cunt for the sake of pregnancy.
>>46566362
>mfw One World of Darkness gets BTFO all these angsty teens
>>46566399
Do real world physics stop you making self-indulgent, not optimal life choices?
If not, then why would a crunchy RPG system?
>>46566303
because they're supposed to represent important facets of your character's personality? And you get willpower back when you do real shit. Restoring all your willpower via Virtue requires some modicum of sacrifice on the character's part.
Plus it's fun.
>>46566399
>Crunchier than DnD
>Has less rules for pretty much everything
Okay, fampai, whatever. Just remember to have fun.
I mean, if the Cosmos and the setting isn't supposed to be consistent, why even pretend? Wouldn't it be easier to come up with something completely new every time? Use the same rules to let crossovers happen, but as far as X is concerned, X doesn't exist.
>>46566379
Hey man don't worry about it, if they wanna get pregnant then they should. Don't worry about a silly thing like anatomy, just let them be pregnant.
>>46566470
This is one part of oWoD that I miss. Each book gave you a backstory that was factually impossible to reconcile with every other book's backstory, basically throwing the idea of consistent cosmology out the window.
Keep the rules for spirits the same, but give them mutually exclusive backstories for every gameline, that sort of thing.
Hi I'm the Lucifuge AMA
>>46566533
>you have gained BROUZOF.
>>46566533
How does it feel knowing that your power comes from an imperfect understanding of the universe, and that you actually worship something that Mages created one day because they were bored/
>>46566603
Mages steal power from Hell and Heaven and their Hubris will eventually damn them for all eternity, while my hunters can manipulate without risks the very thing they fear the most, the Abyss
>>46566655
>heaven
>hell
>abyss
???
>>46565747
>People's actual games are just fanfiction
You do know the difference between a tabletop game setting and a series of novels, right?
>>46566404
boipussy?
>>46566530
If anything, it should be WoD that has the one continuous setting and similar ruleset, and CofD should have the splat specific rulesets and incompatible cosmology that COULD be crossed oher with optional material. Of course it's a bit late for all that now.
>>46566470
Because similar settings and the potential of crossover encourages sales of the other gamelines. It's an obvious sell: buy the other ones and you could have them all in the same game! Nerds love speculation and the idea of a greater universe they can immerse themselves in.
>>46566303
You should be spending more Willpower.
coz I found a girl
who's in love with a girl
she said that she tried
but she's not into guys
oh why tell me why
did I fall for those eyes
she said I was nice
but she’s not into guys
>>46566817
Of course. And yet the authors straight out come up and say 'no' to writing anything about a unified cosmology.
>>46560115
>DaveB
>what
DaveB, Mage developer and amateur comedian
>>46566778
>a story told in the setting of an established franchise not written by any official creator
I mean, if we wanna get specific, any RPG outside of a homebrewed setting fits the basic definition of fanfiction.
>>46566863
>Mysterious open horror setting with potential for new gamelines
>Anon wants clear answers and totally unified cosmology
Someone needs a class in marketing
>>46566969
>"Stop arguing guys!"
>"Give us a damn answer."
>"lol no"
>>46566863
There's no real sales benefit to a unified cosmology. You want to encourage people to buy the other books, not require them. Mention the other games in sidebars, but one too many references to the other games in the main text, and people will be convinced that you need to collect all the books to truly be able to play their one game, something very few except the faithful have the money and patience to do.
If you want a unified cosmology, the only thing you need to do is get into oWoD, and wait for One World of Darkness to start. They're starting with a coherent world from the very beginning, and I think you'll be happier if you dump CofD for it.
Can someone just post the Black hand PDF, its so weird that its not out yet...
that 'toolbox' square in bingo is getting a workout.
>>46565464
I guess you can't hear the people sing, singing the song of angry men, the music of a people who will not be slaves again!
Why is it that I turn away and everyone starts bitching about Mage again? Oh no, people are talking about a book that hasn't been released because we've been given spoilers for it and been able to talk to the developer for over two fucking years.
And yet somehow we have people bitching about Mage in ways that the people who actually keep up with this stuff repeatedly point out is full of shit.
>>46567007
Answers would eliminate much of the mysteriousness and spookiness of the general setting, preclude expanding it for new gamelines, and from an entirely business perspective, discourage people from buying books from across gamelines to to learn all the little bits that might show up.
An inconsistent cosmology is a literary and commercial feature, not a bug, despite the fact that some of us might think we want clear answers.
>>46567007
Author answers would never stop the arguing. They could make the most unified setting ever, and people would still look for loopholes and margins for their favorite splat to come out on top. You either got live with it or go play some other urban fantasy game.
>>46567048
I agree with your basic points.
You also adeptly explained why trying to make Beast the "crossover splat" was a disaster.
>>46567102
It turns out, no one actually wanted a toolbox, they just wanted the promise of what oWoD was, but without all the 90s in it. It's like how Traveller is setting agnostic, but people will just play it with the Imperium setting anyways.
>>46566379
>>46566529
>Shapeshifting magical spirit wolves
>"lol, men don't have vaginas"
It literally lists the fucking supernatural power that lets you change your physical Goddamned sex. Don't go "were does babby com frm" when it answers that fucking question for you.
These threads are getting dumber and dumber.
>>46566399
>WoD is crunchier than D&D
DUMBER AND DUMBER
>>46567170
Beast had other issues, one being an inconsistent tone from what readers were expecting, and another being that it is, well, BEAST.
The published version wasn't anywhere near as bad as the leak but it isn't very good either.
WoD G, I need some suggestions for languages to take for a Brujah who spends his time bikering around the US and the world, studying esoteric lore and beating the shit out of monsters that exist in the dark.
>>46567170
Oddly enough, I still think it could have succeeded as a crossover splat, it's just that it tried to be both a crossover splat AND its own splat, and ended up losing a lot trying to serve both masters.
>>46567251
Japanese, because you're clearly a weeaboo stealing ideas.
>>46567251
Spanish is a given. Another good pick up would be french.
>>46567251
Spanish, German, and Navajo would be great choices. Latin and Greek as well, for reading the secret occult documents of the Founding Fathers.
>>46567190
i play CofD as a toolbox tho. 24 sessions of werewolf and they've met two ghosts & heard one fellow werewolf say that "vampires are totally real promise dudes"
>>46567235
One of the alleged selling points of Beast was that it was explicitly crossover-friendly and such activity was encouraged. Beast doesn't even have their own social splats or an organized social strata to account for this. They were supposed to piggy-back on other splats. However, this requires that ST's and players own a plethora of other WW books, and without them, there's little to motivate Beasts. The teaching lesson material was a very late add-on to try to fix this, but it ultimately did little to give Beasts direction or purpose.
>>46567251
I suggest you instead play a better game
>>46567190
Toolboxes aren't bad. And they're what I want, especially for hunter. Having a bunch of varieties of vampire like things is better than just 'THESE ARE THE ONLY TYPES OF VAMPIRES AND THEY HAVE X HISTORY OF Y THINGS AND ARE STEREOTYPES'
>>46567332
I've taken Latin, Greek, German and Hebrew. I have 2 more to take right now. Spanish feels pedestrian but I suppose stealing Noddist lore from Sabbat would end up making Spanish a necessity.
>>46567343
Well, to be fair, I was being a bit hyperbolic. Still, there's a reason why many setting agnostic systems gravitate towards having one, maybe two settings be the most played.
>>46567413
Spanish might be Pedestrian but it is also very commonly used. It's worth grabbing for utility at the very least.
>>46567456
True, true.
>>46567196
You misunderstand the question being posed. It says the only thing that should stop a male character from getting pregnant is a player who doesn't want to tell that story, meaning you don't necessarily need the sex-changing facet to do mpreg.
In such a case, where does babby come from?
>>46567385
It's weird that they're expected to piggy back on other splats, since supernatural social culture is mostly hostile to outsiders, even with their own splat type. At best, it seems like they could only fit in to certain Packs and Orders.
>>46567196
If it changes their gender then they aren't men anymore. The question was how does a biological man get pregnant and have a child without the equipment.
>>46567550
assigned-female-at-birth man with a vagina.
>>46567557
This, this is a bit of a problem.
Heroes are another. The concept is great but when you've got Hunters and Slashers, did you really need them, especially for a crossover focused Splat?
>>46567561
>>46567590
Just to note, it changes their sex, not their gender. A character can have boobs and a vagina and still identify as a man. That's not at all the issue, though. A transman getting pregnant isn't the same as mpreg, though it could technically fit in there.
>>46567632
>A character can have boobs and a vagina and still identify as a man.
That doesn't make any sense. If you have female biological characteristics and female genetics then you are a female. Anything else is mental sickness. Like deciding you're Napoleon or something despite being neither French, nor dead.
Okay. Now I've got every bingo square. What's my prize? This thread has had almost no actual WOD talk - just people saying 'no ur dumb because u dont agree with me' and trolling.
>>46567765
>What's my prize?
>>46567765
The prize is you realize how much /wodg/ is pure cancer and decide to leave.
>>46567791
>oChangeling
>>46567609
Heroes are also Beast specific, when they should be Everyone's Problem. Strix are somehow a better crossover enemy than the enemy for the crossover splat.
>>46567850
>Changeling
>>46567632
It's a mess that was certain to cause controversy.
However, if OP simply said that in the CofD there are various *magical* powers that would permit an otherwise biological male to become pregnant, the special snowflake brigade would have become irate about the lack of sensitivity to "trans culture" and other ridiculousness.
Sidebars like the one in Werewolf are often phrased in certain ways as simple pandering to a particular customer demographic (who can easily be identified in places like prg.net and tumblr). It's really not worth the effort to become too annoyed. If you don't like or agree with it, ignore it. In the grand scheme of any game, it's really a minor issue.
>>46567801
Say what you will about the OPP forums, but at least the worst thing there is a dude whose really into being a Beast that's a clown.
>>46567893
>Strix are a better crossover enemy
They really are. Strix trigger:
>Werewolves
>Sin-Eaters
>Vampires
>Mages
>Hunters
>Potentially Changelings
>Promethians(?)
It's fucking insane. Strix are a brilliantly done vampire antagonist.
>>46567939
Hahahahahahahahaha.
Oh god. They make 4chan look *tame*. Even their turbo-autist moderation can't stop the shitposting.
>>46567904
>this will cause controversy, better to ignore it!
>Now let me spend way too many words talking about this culture war that I simply can't ignore.
>>46567089
It is out, faggot, you just haven't paid for it.
>>46561130
Except Purified are a separate template, so you don't get the benefits of hosting AND Arcana.
Then again, there's a 2e Mastigos that became a Goetic demon while maintaining mage status, so you could work something out.
>>46567982
>Oh god. They make 4chan look *tame*.
I don't beleive you or your emphasis asterisks.
tfw
>>46567988
It is largely a culture war, and definitely controversial. However, no matter how much the sidebars and political commentary annoys some people or how others believe it's an essential affirmation of their identity OOC, it's still really a very, very minor part of the setting and can be easily ignored. People fighting about it are making mountains out of molehills.
Further, the sidebar in Werewolf was fairly tame and mostly referenced an actual power that changed a werewolf's biological sex and was therefore relevant. I'll take a thousand of the Werewolf sidebars over even one that explicitly insults me like in Mortal Remains.
>>46568154
Beware the Septic Angel
>>46566072
What is the best way I can help resist the return of the Antediluvians?
>>46568201
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eNmhYUaOao
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eNmhYUaOao
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eNmhYUaOao
>>46568201
Support the Septic Angel
>>46568213
>What is the best way I can help resist the return of the Antediluvians?
Stop playing the old WOD, and embrace the CofD.
>>46565464
When did the French turn from being the most warlike motherfuckers in Europe to global laughing stock?
>>46568303
Roughly 1940, and then the next twenty to thirty years was them throwing a tantrum about it.
>>46568303
Blame Bush administration
>>reading all this thread
>>watching Buffy episode 'Hush' at the same time
>>menstrual life force power thingy
HAHAHAHHHAHAHHAHA.
>>46568351
>actually watching buffy
