Why Dwarves in fantasy love axes so much? I mean I know they are Gimli ripoffs but even in Tolkien works not every fucking Dwarf had an axe I read one explanation that had something to do with their height but that's horsefucking bullfuck as Goblins are also short yet typically they are shown with spears and swords in fact if you're a manlet that's exactly when you need a long weapon the most. So basically - why not spears you fucking Dwarves?
The reason they're shown using axes is not because of their stature. Apply yourself friend.
>>46529031
Ever dwarf I make or play uses spears and stabbing swords. Imagine a hoplite phalanx in a tight tunnel, pushing forward at a walking pace......the hell are you going to do about that?
>>46529031
I want a Dwarf version of Guan Yin who uses a Halbred
>>46529031
If I remember correctly, one of the ancient battle cries of the dwarves in Tolkien literally translated to "the axes of the dwarves are upon you!"
Take it as you will.
Don´t know, but other than being a stereotype, they are not exactly suited to besubtle fencers. Sturdy weapons for sturdy beings maybe? And yeah i know, there is other surdy stuff besides axes. Hell, in The Dark Eye, they can get a fucking anti-Dragon Lance that has to be handled by a crew of two. A nightmare to hit and be hit with.
Because Dwarves are axes (and hammers). They're typically short, stout, and tough. They aren't precise or smooth in any sense of the word; they're stout and heavy, and when they do something it gets done in just a few blows.
Compare that to the elegant and precise swords and spears, it fits to a T.
>>46529031
Because dwarves tend to be archetypical craftsmen and hard working salt-of-the-earth types. So they use weapons that can also be tools.
axes make big gaping wounds and look cool
>>46529031
Does anyone here have any ideas for dwarven characters that are anything other than Gimli ripoffs? It's for this reason that I've never been able to play a dwarf and be happy about it, that and I don't find the idea of being a short, burly person appealing in and of itself.
>>46529031
Above ground they're good and can deal with shields, which dwarves also use a lot.
And since we see dwarves aboveground mostly in tabletop rather than their natural habitat, we see axes mostly. Below ground pikes and spears are used along with the occasional siege ballista.
Plus, axeplay in dwarven citadels is akin to fencing for humans. Largely ceremonial but good and impressive.
Oh, and throwing axes. They're good.
>>46529089
Wait until they have to turn and the spears become a liability. You can't keep a tight formation together underground; hoplites had trouble with bumpy fields and bushes, let alone rough caverns and side-tunnels. Better to have small, heavily armed teams working in concert.
>>46529031
>I mean I know they are Gimli ripoffs
There you go.
It's why elves are always portrayed as being all about them bows even though in LOTR they're massive swordaboos
>>46529177
Unfortunately a lot of the things dwarves were or are supposed to be get absorbed into other races like certain kinds of gnomes or goblins.
The other stock dwarves sh/could be greedy happy merchants, literal minded contract types, tinker tricksters, or bookish history buffs with all kinds of weird trivia to help them out because dwarves love their ancestors.
>>46529031
when you think about it, an axe is just a pick-axe used for removing limbs instead of metal.Be it wood, vines, mushrooms, tentacle beasts or those damn gobbos.
Besides spears are for poor-fags, not the people who live near unclaimed gold.
>>46529152
I think this is where Tolkien was going with Gimli in particular. Axemen feel somewhat... Norse? and that association of Viking warriors seems relevant to Gimli's whole approach.
Step 2 is Gygax and crew. the whole wargaming scene had been brewing up to that point. LotR got involved. and D&D is literally, in it's initial conception "let use these wargaming miniatures, make some alternate rules, and tell Tolkien's story"
So yes, for a long time the market for this game was literally a guy who read Tolkien and wanted to be Gimli. So Gimli is dwarves, and dwarves is Gimli, forever.
>>46529156
Snow White's dwarves actually seem pretty relevant here.
thrusting swords then, and I'm talking about tunnels they built themselves and that would probably be smooth, cut stone. Even in rougher caverns and tunnels you'd want a big shield and stabbing weapon since the enemy can really only come at you from the front or back if it's cramped. Though honestly I wouldn't use a Hoplon or Apsis, probably go with a Scutum or Thureos for maximum coverage.
>>46529419
meant to reply to
>>46529282
>>46529177
You can go full Dwarf Fortress and have a race of borderline-autismal violent alcoholics.
I like my dwarfs with a strict society almost caste-like in practice, but that doesn't really care about nondwarfs. I played a dwarven bard that was essentially a used car salesman.
"Gomli Beardaxe, son of Groin the Axebeard" works alright as a placefiller NPC, but you can do a lot with a strict, industrious race.
>>46529358
>A traditional Dwarf axe is on one side a pickaxe, to extract interesting minerals. The other side is a war axe, to deal with the sometimes very unreasonable people who own the land with the interesting minerals in it.
>>46529492
>As a result of such weapons, land owners have instead begun simply pouring boiling oil into holes dug by dwarves, rather than seeking them out by going down into these holes and risking attack.
My dwarves are into spears with explosives in the tip, similar to the medieval handgun which was basically a wee cannon on a stick.
Only dwarves have sharp/bayoneted versions meant to be stuck into the enemy and fired. Both success and failure at this aim have horrific results.
>>46529609
>explosives
>underground
This is how you kill/maim/deafen yourself.
Some settings have dwarves as being about 2-3 times stronger than humans.
In which case I'm not sure why they don't use something like pic related to just crush bones.
>>46529644
Eh? what's that? speak up
>>46529644
Entirely true, but on the other hand....DWARVES.
"Hey, I think I hear the screams of the damned coming from under this mithril"
"Well then we better dig it all out quick before they take any of it!"
>>46529646
>Bjorgas, get the hurtin' paddle
>>46529646
>>46529177
>viking
>warriors
wow it surely took a lot of skill to kill some monks
they were pirates
>>46529646
because you could just sharpen it a touch and you've got a greatsword?
what kinda scrubs do you think dwarves are? some things have really really strong bones out there man
>>46529701
>>46529769
Creatures too powerful to kill with weapons are what levers, bridges and floodgates are for.
>>46529766
but they did have axes and people were scared of them. and of course the helmet-horn guys are... about as historical as barbarians in D&D. it's a fictional idea that people like and care about
>>46529766
You realize Vikings also invaded England and fought wars with the Saxons, right? I mean, yeah they tended to just pillage more but they were hardly unable to fight.
>>46529156
>tools
A scaling bar is just a spear with a chisel tip. You use it to knock down loose rock from a safe distance. Modern ones come in various lengths up to 16 feet
https://youtu.be/RxyBImZyFb4?t=429
>>46529766
Also, conquer Britain (or most of it at one point or another), along with taking on the Franks and every other powerful force in early medieval Europe, often raiding less-defended areas but also winning battles and forcing the locals to the bargaining table for permanent settlements and concessions. Vikings are bastards, but they are successful bastards, it's just as dishonest to pretend that they weren't.
>>46529492
Also known as a pulaski
>>46529609
reminds me of pic
>>46529644
How do you think you advance a tunnel through hard rock? You can be surprisingly close to a blast underground as long as you're not in direct line of sight. You can be within say 50 to 100 feet as long as you're around a corner or something. There's a big concussion that hits you in the chest but that's it. The biggest issue is ventilation, it usually takes 30-45 minutes for the dust and nitrate fumes to clear
>>46529838
That didn't embed properly, go to 7:10
>>46530023
>You can be within say 50 to 100 feet as long as you're around a corner or something.
Which doesn't work when you are -fighting- underground. As typically the thing trying to kill you is literally within arms reach or just outside of it.
>>46529769
>you could just sharpen it a touch and you've got a greatsword
Nah, that thing is too big to be called a sword, even with an edge ground onto it. Too big, too thick, too heavy, and far too rough.
>>46530508
>photoshopped-pacha-making-satisified-gestures.jpg
>>46529031
How else are ye gonna cut down the elves' trees, laddie?
Well in the Hobbit Dain's forces arrived armed with mattocks.
>>46529820
Vikings preferred swords. There is a whole fighting style using viking swords and shields.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkhpqAGdZPc
Only poorfag vikings used axes.
>>46530485
Well sure, explosives at close range are a bad idea, but that's not exclusive to underground. Being underground doesn't really make it any more dangerous to the user than doing the same thing at the surface
My point is that the confined space of a tunnel doesn't particularly concentrate the pressure wave, at least when dealing with the amount of explosives you could carry on the end of a stick.
Never understood the way dwarf warfare was portrayed. They typically fight underground, yet make heavy use of war machines, guns and black powder explosives? Probably the worst things to use in underground warfare. Also didn't understand why they use weapons like hammers and axes when they are supposed to be renown for their shieldwalls. Swinging weapons are really bad for holding a good shieldwall. It would make more sense for dwarfs to go with spears and halberds above ground, and short stabbing swords and punch daggers for underground warfare. Also, crossbows exclusively underground, you would never want black powder going off underground. Don't know why dwarfs who are typically shown as traditionalists who only like reliable things would ever take up something as temperamental as a black powder weapon
>>46529031
it's a shovel you dingbat
>>46529848
Franks kicked their shit in.
>>46529444
>15:58:44
>15:59:48
Next time you do this,
just repost with your link,
or with your missing image,
or whatever you did wrong,
then delete your old post.
>>46530623
>Only poorfag vikings used axes.
So most?
>>46531730
No. After Charlie it was a string of losing ground. You had Franks up the Seine, Elbe, and Rhine, with permanent settlements of the banks and dominating the lower Rhine region, not to mention the repeated sieges and sacks of Paris and Hamburg, among others.
>>46530623
Vikings, and pretty much all people ever, used spears over swords. Easier to train someone to use a stabby stick than a sword.
>>46531855
They didn't sack Paris they were paid to leave.
>>46531903
845, they besieged, conquered, plundered and occupied Paris, then the Franks paid them even more to leave. lrn2into medieval history.
>>46529031
No real clue. Spears would make more logical sense, but benefiting from their stability in a charge and for use in tunnels.
I think it's the obvious Norse/viking influence on the dwarven stereotype. Vikings are thought to run around with axes all the time (although they rarely used them either) and so dwarves, fantasy vikings, prefer axes as well. Also, horned helms being popular.
>>46529031
yeah, it always bugged me too
axes belong to orcs, the barbarians who cut down forests and need cheap, easily-built weapons
dwarves should use hammers and picks, since they are smiths and miners
>>46529031
You shittalking axes, son?
>>46532194
I'd imagine dwarves would tend to use the correct tool for the correct purpose, not go after people with work tools.
>>46529031
every dwarf uses spears underground there is not enought room to swing a fucking axe, and thats why they use axes outdoors, its good to chop heads and trees alike.
its just a matter of utility.
I associate dwarves with industry and work so I naturally make their weapons derived from converted and modified tools.
Dwarves are usually portrayed as incredibly pragmatic. Since the bulk of their time is spent mining and crafting, they tend to prefer weapons that double as tools. While pickaxes and hammers are probably the more common choice in this case, an axe can be useful for other things, such as chopping trees for timber/pissing off elves.
Personally, I'd like to see more dwarven craghammers and warpicks employed in fantasy genres.
>>46529031
I know I'm going to get a lot of shit for it, but Varric's a pretty good departure from the usual model.
>>46529152
> spears
> elegant and precise
Spears were entirely designed to be used in groups by the unskilled. Point spear forward, walk. More advanced tactics basically still break down to "point the pointy end at foe"
>>46532478
Aesthetically though
What I could see is the regular folk having spears while the trained would be mostly sword and board, but the most dangerous are the axe wielders.
So while the majority are equipped otherwise, the axe wielders gain the most prestige.
Axes are for what swords and spears wont kill. When an ogre is sweeping aside spears you call for the axe man to sheer some limbs.
>>46531897
>Insert line about "Spear-Danes" here
>>46529031
Axes chop down trees.
Elves live in trees.
>>46532316
>>46532304
>>46532194
As pointed out here >>46529838 though a spear is a tool underground
>>46532478
>spear
>can't be elegant
>can't be precise
I understand where you're coming from, but I'm a martial artist and well...I'd disagree.
Gentlemen, I have the perfect Dorf Weapon, combining the practicality of a short spear/sword, the thematic coolness of a mining pick, married together by dwarven love of craftsmanship and complex mechanisms.
https://youtu.be/8jgmHwizi24
>>46529031
>Tolkien has dwarves fight with mattocks
>no one ever explores this angle ever again
>>46529903
Also known as Nancy?
>Why Dwarves in fantasy love axes so much?
because 99.99% of games were created by hacks with absolutely no depth, who stope the most superficial elements of LOTR and repeated them 1001 times.
>>46533604
>>46533604
Well mattocks look dorky as fuck. The thing has a fucking adze on it, come on.
A lot of people are saying that it'd make more sense for a dwarf to use a hammer, but you're not considering range. The basic design of a battle axe lends itself better than a hammer for length, which is pretty important when you have arms the size of a human toddler's and don't reach the chin of most of your enemies. Even Gimli which you mention in the OP didn't want to fight Men because he knew they'd fuck him up due to being so much larger, whereas he felt perfectly content mowing orcs by the dozen (since Tolkien's orcs are hobbit-sized and would be more like goblins in other settings, the tall muscular ones would be the Uruk-hai).
>>46533645
Were you thinking of Pelosi?
Pulaski was a forest ranger who fought the gargantuan 1910 fires in Idaho
>>46533791
>The basic design of a battle axe lends itself better than a hammer for length
No. Historical war hammers and axes of the same weight are the same length since they are balanced the same way to hit people the same way.
>>46534094
Poleaxes, bardiches and such exist. Most of the practical usage is lost, but using a mace for hammering also wouldn't be optimal and battle axes are too light to actually chop wood properly
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-VvEXm4C8M
>>46529031
I would assume the same reason Barbarians often use axes, dwarves are usually portrayed as being short and stocky so a weapon like an axe tends to fit them well.
>>46529177
Dwarf rogues are also pretty fun. Basically hairier and stockier halflings.
>>46533307
Never stated it couldn't be. It's however mainly purposed as a weapon of simplicity.
>>46529031
Because axes are used in a similar manner to hammers and picks, which are associated with post-Tolkein dwarves for obvious reasons
>>46534758
Dwarves have been smiths and creators of shit since Viking time.
>>46529177
I give my dwarves thick Germanic accents instead of Scottish ones. Surprisingly, it helps.
>>46534818
oh god, next dwarf I do is gonna have a german accent and be hyper-condescending.
"It's just that....uh....you know, mein spear is a better veapon then your schwert....is all. It's nothing to be upset about, ja? Someone needs to be number zwei and you are the perfect match for it. Good for you."
>>46532478
>>46534644
Spears take a hell of a lot of training to use, especially in formation. The reason they're used so much throughout history is because a phalanx is a unit that requires a fair amount of training on the parade ground, but very little practice in combat. All of the training is in how to form up, how to march, and how to stay in formation under any circumstances. Everything else just kind of happens.
A sword formation is very different. It has to be much shallower since only the first two ranks can fight effectively (although you'll want a couple more behind that to keep the enemy from breaking through), which makes it easier for individuals to break and run. This means that an entirely green sword formation is a huge liability, so you need to work in recruits a handful at a time, whereas in a phalanx, the rear of the formation is isolated enough from the front lines not to break and run, and the front and middle are crushed in by all the people around them.
Additionally, there's a lot more finesse with a shorter weapon than the 15-30 foot spears used in phalanxes. Even with an 8 foot spear you can try to reach up and stab down on an enemy over their shield. A short sword allows you to stab under the shield as well. With a 30 foot sarissa, all you can do is point it forward and march. This means there's a lot of skill and tricks to be gained with experience fighting with the sword, but not much to be gained fighting with the spear. It takes a lot of time to develop the strength and timing necessary to march with a sarissa without fouling the formation, though. It's not the sort of thing you can just stick in a peasant's hands and expect him to be useful with.
>>46534758
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Das_Rheingold
>>46529177
I'm a big fan of blind dwarves. They're subterranean, they don't need eyes.
Dwarves in my setting were blind, lily-white, and if they had to venture above ground, it was with parasols. They navigate with tremor sense; you cannot sneak up on a dwarf, though a sniper is gonna give a dwarf a bad time. That's not a hella relevant threat in the caverns though.
Also, as an entirely blind race, they have no fucking sense of aesthetics. Things are clean and smooth in dwarf society, pleasing to their senses, but ugly.
>>46535689
Smiths in legend are often deformed or sickly such as Hephaestus because in mining and metal working you're exposed to smelter or forge fumes, mercury and lead during gold assaying and milling, arsenic, cadmium and antimony within ores et cetera. There was a occupational disease called blacksmith's augh caused by breathing charcoal/coal fumes 'errday.
So similar to your concept, you might run dwarves as stunted and sickly rather than the typical +1 CON
(No basis for this but I suspect the long-standing dwarfism + mining connection could be due to chronic heavy metal poisoning in mining regions such as the Erzgebirge, Silesia or Idrija)
My dwarves are somewhat fiendish in demeanor, being close to the underworld and all. They're swarthy, rude, but incredibly skilled and valorous.
>>46535532
>Alberich the Nibelung has renounced love, stolen the Rheingold and made a powerful magic ring out of it.
>In Nibelheim, Alberich has enslaved the rest of the Nibelung dwarves with the power of the ring.
>Alberich demonstrates the Tarnhelm's power by making himself invisible, the better to torment his subjects.
Finally, Wotan demands the ring. Alberich refuses, but Wotan seizes it from his finger and puts it on his own. Alberich is crushed by his loss, and before he leaves he lays a curse on the ring: until it should return to him, whoever does not possess it will desire it, and whoever possesses it will live in anxiety and will eventually be killed and robbed of it by its next owner.
Boy, that sounds familiar
>>46529177
You could always go for Gimli, from the Lord of the Rings movies.
He was nothing like Gimli from the Lord of the Rings books.
>>46536238
What, you thought Tolkien was being original?
>>46529031
Axes are a side effect of when mining dwarves who were close to the surface or scooping up rocks in the mines and city expansions found themselves forced into a fight.
They found the scrapping of the shovels against rocks led to sharpened edges, which meant they made have-decent cutting tools.
Which led to them liking axes when they got conscripted into dwarven military. But even then they'd often ignore their actual axe and just use their entrenchment tool.
Actually using axes is seen as something of a 'meme' among dwarves.
>>46535689
>Also, as an entirely blind race, they have no fucking sense of aesthetics. Things are clean and smooth in dwarf society, pleasing to their senses, but ugly.
Wouldn't they want everything to be shaped and textured differently to tell things apart? Why would blind people be less appreciative of fine engraving than seeing people? It's not like they can't tell what it is or what it depicts.
Once upon a time /tg/ said Dwarves trained with axes because they fucking hate elves, who of course live up in the trees.
>>46536606
This is actually a good point, since they're always seen with double-bit felling axes, and never ever ever with battle axes.
>>46536238
Allow me to help. Tolkein was a historian and linguist, he didn't like the fact that the English didn't really have their own myths and legends as everything had been bastardized by invaders. He creates LotR to fill in this niche. As the English were a germanic people like the Franks, Saxons, Angles, Norse, Danes, Geats, Harii and pretty much every other hairy bugger running about the north of Europe. He goes to Germanic myths for inspiration, and here we are.
Rings are a big thing in Germanic culture. Germanic bigwigs would give rings to their bondsmen as a sign of loyalty. One of Odins magic items was a ring that made other rings (forged by the short beard people) Which is where giving a ring to your spouse when you marry them comes from. The ring cycle is also based on Germanic myths, namely the tale of Sigurd/ Sigfreid/ whatever, hence similarities.
Also I don't understand why people think Dwarves/Dwarfs wouldn't have axes? Everyone knows that the worst enemy of a Dwarf is a tree.
>>46529156
>using weapons as tools or other way around, expect in emergency situations
>smashing the precious wood carving axe against armor
>hitting yourself on leg, because battle axe was not made to split wood
>>46536528
You know, now that you mention it, normal wood cutting axes are fairly common in modern vein mines. In not sure why, my guess it's a holdover from when they used timber supports so might need an axe around to trim things. I haven't once seen a guy use the sharp edge, they use the back side of the head as a hammer.
Another common tool is a Finn hoe, it's an axe handle with a beak-like head on it about a cubit long. It would make a good weapon but hard to swing in tight spaces of course.
>>46536712
>>hitting yourself on leg, because battle axe was not made to split wood
Why would you hit yourself on the leg? Punishing yourself?
>>46536740
Much bigger change of accidents if you use wrong sort of tool.
>bigger change of bouncing off, slip, ect.
video related, even though the guy in it, is just idiot
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9T7RhbIcqs
>>46529358
>poorfag weapon
No. Weapon of almost anyone who fought ever. Not letting the other guy get close is an extreme advantage.
>>46532478
Formations were incredibly skilled and needed a lot of drill work and extremely strict discipline to work and not break at 'bad odds'. Take a phalanx for example - the front rank of the phalanx's job was to funnel enemies and hold the goddamn line, they did very little of the killing - it was the ranks behind them that did all the killing. When the front rank of warriors got 'tired' you had them fall back through to the very back rank, with the second rank now being the first rank - this would allow tired warriors to 'cycle out' and rest a little bit, before they got back up to the ranks where they needed to be killing again. People in the middle ranks would also drag wounded soldiers to the back ranks too.
The amount of skill that formations take is vastly understated.
In "dueling" (or formal single combat) spears were also an extremely skilled weapon, because while you had a reach advantage, more emphasis was placed on footwork and positioning, as less of your weapon could be used to kill. Though uncommon there was a 'dueling' style that made use of a longer spear in your dominant hand (about 6 or 7ft) and a shorter spear in your off hand (about 4-5ft), it relied heavily upon wrist strength and clubbing or stabbing anyone who got too fucking close to you. Hildegarde's style in soul calibur games is pretty close to it.
>>46529156
Woodcutting axes and combat axes are designed entierly different. The woodcutting axehead is way to thick and heavy to be efficent in combat. It is however thick and sturdy to not be worn down by splitting wood all day.
>>46529358
>No. Weapon of almost anyone who fought ever. Not letting the other guy get close is an extreme advantage.
Axe is poorfag's weapon even more
Vikings despite being associated with axes, mostly only used those if they couldn't afford a swordor if they needed extra chopping power of tow handed weapon as technology didn't allow for for two-handed swords
Axes in combat, through most of history were, besides few specialised uses, mostly a poorman's substitute of sword.
Spear is also simple and cheap, but also specialised, and had always much better opinion. There are way more legendary spears than legendary axes (I can't even name one named axe from myths or history), and gods and heroes were depicted wielding spears way more often than axes.
>>46538280
>Though uncommon there was a 'dueling' style that made use of a longer spear in your dominant hand (about 6 or 7ft) and a shorter spear in your off hand (about 4-5ft), it relied heavily upon wrist strength and clubbing or stabbing anyone who got too fucking close to you.
How the fuck is that supposed to work? Even dual wielding 40" rapiers involves just fencing with one and holding the other up out of the way until you have a chance to thrust with it.
>>46538283
Take a look at all the fantasy axes you see dwarves using and ask yourself if it looks like a weapon intended for battle.
>>46538432
>Take a look at all the fantasy axes you see dwarves using and ask yourself if it looks like a weapon intended for battle.
A lot of fantasy illustrators either have no idea how a real weapon is supposed to function outside of hitting the opponent or they make them hyperbolic on purpose.
That being said, the dorf weapons in the LOTR movies does look kinda retarded.
>>46538432
Couch the long one under your arm - you want to have the butt close to underneath your armpit, make sure that it's interposed between the person and you - if they step towards you, you either stab them or bash them with it. If they get past the long one, you attempt to deter with the shorter one and choke up the grip on either and stab with it.
It is not a particularly easy style.
If you go on the offensive, you're mostly using your longer spear, if you go on the defensive you try to use your long spear and you fall back to your shorter spear (sometimes the shorter spear is replaced with a more stabby oriented sword)
>>46538481
And if all else fails, you drop the long spear and pull out a dagger.
>>46529031
Axes do sort of make sense as far as weapon utility. Polearms are mostly used in the open, and against cavalry, longer swords are mostly used by cavalry. If you're fighting in close quarters, like a dwarf would a lot of the time, you'd want something a bit shorter and closer to the body.
Although I doubt any of that was the reason. They use axes because they were based on Norse warriors, and they used axes a lot. Fantasy stuff tends to be very derivative, so it's just something that has stuck. I doubt the reason is any more complicated than that.
>>46538469
U mean hobbit movies
There was literally one dorf in LotR movie, and his axe wasn't bad at all.
Basically LotR vs Hobbit movie shows in the most contrasting way good vs bad fantasy weapon, armor and general costume design
Fantasy illlustrators are doing it on purpose, because plenty of retards, even on this board, endorse MUH FANTASY style, thinking it looks cool and badass while it looks just pleby and silly as fuck.
>>46538283
If not using tools as weapons, then still taking the concept of tools and optimise it for combat.
>>46538514
Nah, there was a bunch of concept art for dorf weapons from the first movies that all looked like they thought that curves were for fags.
>>46538618
You might as well turn the woodcutting axe into a hammer or mace instead.
>>46538619
Yet they didn't make it to the movie.
Now watcht the fucking Hobbit. Look at it hard. And try not to empty you stomach.
>>46530508
>>46538658
>chinese cartoons
>proving anything
>>46538635
I don't remember the dorf weapons from the Hobbit and I havn't watched the third movie yet.
>>46538674
Yeah, Berserk's rationalisation of why Guts is being able to use massive swords in combat is very silly and dumb. The only way it would make sense is if Guts was the son of an apostle and just have retard strength.
>>46538722
Even having retard strength doesn't make fat swords more useful.
>>46538730
I think the Dragonslayer was made out of dwarf steel or something. So it has some kind of magic infusion by default.
>>46538757
You could have the same thing with a regular sword
>>46538775
That's less fun than the giant spectacle sword/slab.
>>46538847
Which is fine, it's just annoying when justifications start cropping up.
>>46538775
That happened in the manga. Guts broke a master crafted longsword made by the same smith, using his retard strength, fighting an apostles whitin 20 minutes of ownership of said sword.
>>46529031
I played a Dwarven Bard for a few years. His backstory was that he had been a wardrummer with his Kingdom's army. He spent years watching everyone else crush Goblins and was never allowed to join in because 'we are short on drummers'. He eventually quit and became an adventurer so that he could experience glory. However, it turned out that he wasn't really good at anything else so he continued to play the wardrum like an idiot while the rest of the party did the actual fighting.
This ''le axe is also a tool xD'' meme needs to stop battle axes WERE NOT suitable to cut fucking trees as they had thinner blades likewise woodcutting axes were a shit weapons in battle as they were heavier.
>>46529177
A dwarf rogue that works in the army as a vanguard or scout.
A wizard dwarf that want to create magical objects
A sorcerer/wizard dwarf whose family line comes from a dragon or a magma/fire elemental
A dwarf brewer who becomes an alchemist to brew the finest spirits.
The only time I've ever really found dwarves interesting was dragon age. Sure, they were pretty much bog standard gimli ripoffs for the most part, but I found the idea of dorfs living in a caste society ripe with crime, corruption and dirty politics pretty interesting. Man Bioware really fucked up that series, DA3 was as generic fantasy as generic fantasy could be.
>>46538514
>endorse MUH FANTASY style, thinking it looks cool and badass while it looks just pleby and silly as fuck.
The same tards that mall ninja shit is sold to
>>46539483
It's the fantasy explanation, dwarves aren't historically accurate.
In my homebrew, dwarf use occasionally axes or swords, but mostly they use warpicks.
My reasoning is that, being miners, almost all dwarves know how to use a pick. Being pragmatic people, instead of training to use more sophisticated weaponry, they rely on what they know, and using a weapon very similar in shape to a tool that you already know how to use greatly reduces the time needed to train new militia.
Same thing with axes. War axes may not be used as tools, but they are similar enough to lumber axes to allow woodcutters to learn how to use them pretty fast
>>46529031
You would like the Hobbit
>>46538698
Pikes and Shields, Phalanx-mode. Gets absolutely ruined by elves being fags.
>>46541806
The H&K USP is really out of place in that image.
>>46538674
Are you retarded? I was appreciating the Berserk reference, you fucking moron.
>>46529177
I like very Snow-White and the Seven Dwarves type Dwarves. More prospecting type miners than the big elaborate underground city types.
Aside from a few posters this thread is pretty scary with the amount of people who don't know jack shit about hand tools.
![mattock[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/7V2RVDz.jpg "mattock[1].jpg")
Because Dwarves are traditionally likened to Celtic and Nordic cultures, among which a common footman was more likely to have an axe of some kind as a Sword was a noblemans weapon.
That being said, in The Hobbit, the Dwarven Armies were said to be armed with Mattocks.
The point I think is that Dwarven tools are so well made they double as weapons of war.
>>46529177
Mongol Dwarves.
They're small and lightweight, could ride horses faster than humans.
And those hats and armor just look very dwarven to me.
![5152Bofurs_HammerMattock_NK%20copy[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/iMrFBMK.jpg "5152Bofurs_HammerMattock_NK%20copy[1].jpg")
I have a dwarf in a high tech campaign thats going to have a combi weapon. But I can't decide what I want to combine. It's gonna be either be a Hammer with a pick on the opposite and a drill on the top, or an axe with a pick on the opposite and a drill on the top. Which should I go with though.
>>46531897
Way cheaper, too. Good iron was supposedly quite expensive (and rare) at that time, and a spear takes a lot less iron to make than a sword. But hey, if they could get a sword, they wouldn't say no.
As for dwarves... I imagine one reason would be because of terrain. Spear formations don't work well when the ceiling is low and the ground is uneven, though, so might not be a good fit for tunnels or the broken terrain you may find in mountains. They can be great if you are defending a stable and even castle, but can you imagine using a spear in a mining tunnel barely tall enough for dwarves to use?
If you have a dwarf culture hailing from a desert or woodland, they may be very different.
>>46544684
>"...They are short in stature, quick in bodily movement, alert horsemen, broad shouldered, ready in the use of bow and arrow, and have firm-set necks which are ever erect in pride. Though they live in the form of men, they have the cruelty of wild beasts."
Huns confirmed for dwarf horse nomads.
>>46529031
No spears because they live in tight confined caves. Good luck turning around with a spear.
Axes (and hammers, and picks) because they double as tools. They are eminently practical.
>>46529766
>it surely took a lot of skill to kill some monks
someone hasn't played DND, one of the toughest classes
>>46535689
>>46536588
I sat once next to a blind guy in the train and all his clothes had ribbons and other stuff.
So I guess you are right, they don't want things to be smooth I guess. But as for everything, personal preferences.
Telling apart things is a good point
>>46541806
>implying mall ninjas can afford a Heckle my Koch product
Those things are fuckin' EXPENSIVE, bro.
>>46529031
Dwarves were designed as a dying race that struggles to withstand a massive onslaught of goblins, orcs, and other things from the depths while being massively outnumbered. Axes allow them to threaten a wider area and possibly damage more foes in a single swing.
>>46529177
1) make a character who is not Gimli
2) now make it a dwarf
Wow that was hard
>>46529177
What always helps me:
Make the character gay, you have to take so much into account. It is surprisingly fun
>>46543491
yes they are
>>46535689
On the note of tremorsense dwarves, i would imagine all of their stuff has intricate engravings, with information about who it belongs to, if it was a gift it would have a little bit of info about the person who gave it to them, and ancestral items would be absolutely covered in stuff about all the cool shit the family has done. They would read it by like picking up a cup and tapping it on something. They wouldn't care about color at all but they would be all about the textures.
>>46534818
Do you also happen to type VERDAMMIT in all caps as thus?
>>46529177
I personally like the idea of lumberjack dorfs. Seems fitting to me that they'd be very industrious, and makes axe usage a deep part of the culture.
In my setting, they're very caste based and specialized, which is why dwarvencraft is the finest in the land-their great great great great grandaddy was the first dwarven gemcutter, and each dwarf child of theirs was raised in that environment, around those tools and mantras, and so by the time they're an adult, they're already masters. Then they get a couple hundred years to refine their technique and pass it on to their kids.
>>46546910
Because of their long lifespan, they're also a very patient race, and they take their time on their work in all but emergencies. A dwarven blacksmith might make 50 blades in his lifetime, but each is named, and imbued with something to make it unique for the intended recipient.
>>46536024
That's why they have the +1 or +2 to CON and the big bushy beards, they're the ones who survived the forges and smelting, and passed on their genes. Incidentally, dwarf beard oil is prized as a natural catalyst converter.
>>46538514
The Hobbit concept are was based though.
>>46538381
>Axe is poorfag's weapon even more
Tell that to Gotrek.
>>46538381
>Axe is poorfag's weapon even more
No. A club, staff or even a spear would be a poorfag weapon.
>>46538381
>Axe is poorfag's weapon even more
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9SvgWJNSd8
Please shut the fuck up. Weapons of all types have huge ranges of values, to the point that you must compare specific articles for the comparison to have any meaning whatsoever.
Weapons that were commonplace were functional weapons. Axes are not just better or just worse than swords. There are situation where swords will out preform axes and situations where the reverse is true.
During the period of time when viking raiding was at it height (700-1100AD) mail armor and large shields were used by pretty much everyone. Axes work just fine against mail armor and shields.
>>46546199
>>46535689
Former miner: one thing thing to also consider is smell. Sometimes you can smell something like rock-cutting oil before you can hear the drill, or you can smell that it's raining on the surface. There are fans all over the place to move fresh air in and exhaust/dust/fumes out so the effect would probably be less in a naturally ventilated mine with less air movement but still something to play with
