Useful Links:
http://www.mtgcommander.net
>Official Site: Contains deck building rules and the current ban list.
http://www.tappedout.net
>Deck List Site: You can search for decks that other people have made. Authors often have comments that explain their deck’s strategy and card choices.
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh
>Another resource for commander discussion; they have an entire forum dedicated to discussing decks. People often make primers, which go into detail about how they built and play their deck.
http://www.edhrec.com/
>Statistically see what everyone else puts in their commander decks based on what is posted to the internet.
http://manabasecrafter.com/
>Find out what lands you can add to your deck, sorted by category, based on a chosen Commander’s color identity.
CARD SEARCHING
http://gatherer.com
>Official search site. Current for all sets but has a terrible UI.
http://www.magiccards.info
>Unofficial, but has GOAT search interface.
Post 'em
Also, what can we expect this year for commander? Finally the year of 4 color?
>>46414976
And my phone goes full retard.
>>46414976
>Finally the year of 4 color?
Never, MaRo hates it. I guess PW commanders again, multicolor style. Maybe allied colors this time.
>>46414976
Gahiji list?
>>46415194
> whines about muh Nephilim not legendary once a week
> can't errata these cards that people only play in commander or make new 4-color commanders
>>46415197
In the process of uploading everything to tappedout. I'll do Gahiji soon.
Pretty much Naya goodstuff featuring tokens.
>>46414976
>have all the cards for my Gitgud Toad deck ready
>not going to a prerelease so I won't have my frog for Thursday EDH
FUCK
>>46415483
>tfw Titania can't use Toad only Toad can use Titania.
Princess and the Frog will be a deck.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/31-03-16-gitrog-monster-edh/
Gitrog and Titania present... but how many triggered by LD?How many triggered by wood elemental?
>>46415483
You can use this proxy, anon!
>>46415712
>>46415648
>>46415570
>>46415483
I'm actually terrified of this guy. The turn he hits play or you untap with him, you probably win.
>>46415648
I'm against MLD.
Seeing as how princess and the frog trigger for your lands. There's no reason to run MLD. Unless your that kind of player.
>>46415832
How? Outside of drawing a few cards, or maybe triggering a few landfall triggers. It's not insane.
>>46415934
>any discard outlet + dredge lets you draw your deck
>skirge familiar for a fuckton of mana
>squandered resources draw a ton of cards, have a ton of mana
He's really easy to combo off with.
>>46415972
So 3-4 card combos?
If you are playing shitty players sure.
But people adapt, how many times is someone gonna pull that off until krosan grips start getting saved in hands.
>>46415972
>any discard outlet + dredge lets you draw your deck
Go ahead, find me a free discard outlet that will let me draw my deck with the frog. Ill wait.
>>46416015
>>46415972
Yeah I understand he may be easy to combo off of but I can't really see him being an effecient commander.
Helpful for any golgari type deck I'm sure.
Building Daxos the Returned, because I love B/W and I love enchantments.
What is some spicy tech that's not on EDHrec?
>>46416015
>not running City of Solitude and Dosan
Also those combos are really easy to assemble, especially the dredge ones. You only need one dredge card and one discard outlet.
>>46416019
Skirge Familiar? Putrid Imp? Volrath's Dungeon?
>>46416019
>Play this turn 4
>Frog turn 5
>Discard Golgari Grave-Troll
>As long as you have a land every 6 cards in your deck, your deck is now your hand
Sure, he needs at least 3 cards to go off, but one of those cards never needs to hit play, never needs to be put in harm's way, etc.
>>46415972
>any discard outlet + dredge lets you draw your deck
Well, it lets you dredge your deck, if you don't get too unlucky or can restart the chain should it break from dredging nothing but nonlands in a hit. You only get one draw per instance, not one draw per land. I mean, recur a Praetor's Counsel and it's all in your hand or just go ahead and dread return combo (no narcomeba though) or anything else that can fire off from the GY but it's a bit of a misnomer to say you can draw your deck
>people actually bought the gitgud frog meme
>>46415712
Fixed
Lets discuss why green is the color truly ruining the format.
>>46417203
Ramp is only a problem because people are afraid of mass LD.
>>46417203
It provides creatures that are actually valuable for their mana cost instead of N/N for N+1 with useless "upside"? It isn't packed with removal and counterspells that have contributed to make anything above CMC4 unplayable in all non-rotating formats? It interacts nicely with every zone of the game?
Anyone want to help a nigga out with muh pestilence deck?
http://deckstats.net/decks/30661/458886-kill-them-all
I don't know if I have enough kill, please recommend me some more kill.
>>46417254
That isn't true at all. Some tryhard runs stax decks at my LGS all the time, but then some U/G variant just ramps, counters his blowout spells, and that's that.
The trick is a well-placed winter orb and some rocks.
>>46417520
The key to Stax is land denial, any RW commander should work, ideally they'll also be green so you can use crucible + Life From the Loam.
>>46417520
If Stax isn't running Tap and Tax as well as Sac, they're doing it wrong. You can include and get benefit out of Smokestack without Winter Orb, Tangle Wire, Sphere of Resistance, etc. but you're not going to lock the world with it.
UW or UR gets into a counter war with UGx to resolve 'geddon or one of the red variants. Or just Rx throw Obliterate and fuck your counters.
>>46417203
You mean blue?
>>46417716
Smokestack is secretly terrible in EDH, something people don't realize. It comes out too late and it accumulates too slowly.
Building Kresh, and need a little help. I have oodles of sac outlets in the deck already, and the other obligatory sac benefit spells, but I'm having issue with recurring creatures. I'm kind of new to magic, so what are some good creatures / spells for this? I already have Reassembling Skeleton, Squee, and Tenacious Dead, but I'm looking for something to recur whatever I need.
Me and some friends have been playing EDH on Cockatrice and one of them has been utterly wrecking all of us with pic related. Nothing seems to be working against it, from token spam to stax to mill-counter.
Anybody got decks that can reliably stomp an Omnath?
>>46415648
>the fucking wood elemental
You absolute madman. Dawnstrider is a cool card I missed in my own brewing though, thanks. Have you played with Planar Portal much? Seems like Ring of Three Wishes does what you want anyways a bit cheaper, but even then, both just seem too slow even with the ramp.
>>46417988
Portal is part of my "Default EDH" Package. Some decks can leave it off, but it starts in along with Disk, Ring, and any relevant signets. I'd consider cutting it, but the ability to just get my crucible, or just get my desert twister, or just get Constant Mists, or Disk, or Witness/regrowth, especially re-fetching something I've shuffled back is really tempting to keep.
>>46417959
Yeah, Weenie White land denial. Limited Ressources and shit like that
Or you could just exile and bounce the fuckers.
>>46417904
Eternal Witness, Hell's Caretaker, Sheoldred, Liliana.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/22-01-15-sUN-kresh-the-bloodbraided/
>>46417959
I assume they're using an infinite damage combo to win the instant Omnath hits the field? If they are, honestly you have to both run hate and protect it. RiP, Leyline of the Void, to a lesser extent grafdigger's cage will shut down most varieties of recursion. If the combo is tutoring-based, Aven Mindcensor, Mindlock Orb, and Core Set Ob Nix stop it cold. Leyline of Sanctity, Spirit of the Hearth, Witchbane Orb will stomp anything that uses the death trigger but if it creates infinite tokens they'll still be able to get you. If you don't mind cancer to fight cancer, Sigarda 1.0 locks out almost every Omnath combo since they all come down to sacrificing 5/5s
In the end, though, Omnath loves blowing up artifacts and enchantments so keeping defensive pieces is going to be extremely hard. Since the entire deck relies on Omnath, you can beat it by making sure Omnath never resolves. Counterspelling is pretty basic, with his mana intensity Forbid leaves very little that will actually get Omnath through. Going hardcore on mana denial with stasis and/or prison elements will also put him in his place since a good prison also cripples the prisoner's ability to drop Naturalize or any other way out of it.
>>46415194
why do people want four color , why not just play 5?
>>46419051
as >>46415194 I can say I don't even know. I sure as hell don't care, I just wanted to crush the dreams of someone who did.
What cards should I replace/add to this deck to get that little more out of it? I want to keep as few combos out of the deck as possible as my meta absolutely despises themwhich is bullshit since they're pretty fucking easy to stopAny suggestions?
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/23-03-16-gisela/
>>46415194
What if we get Allied colors along withA colorless deck
>>46419359
Colorless would be fun. 5c might be neat too. But wizards likes them some cycles
>>46414976
>>46415194
>>46419359
We're gonna get dual-colored decks, again. This time with allied colors.
Allies are stupid as fuck and they're a dumb idea.
>>46419617
If you mean the fake wannabe sliver creatures, yes. They're just about the worst. At least slivers had a cool designin their first three outings
If you mean allied color pairs, fuck off, you're worse than the people who whine every new set for their special snowflake enemy duals like the color wheel means nothing.
>>46414976
Either in C15 or Orgins 2 I want Legendary monowalkers that flip into Dual Walkers.
B Sorin to WB Sorin
U Kiora to UG Kiora
W Ajani to RW Ajani
R Ral Zarek to UR Ral Zarek
G Garruk to GB Garruk(?)
>>46419617
>>46419695
This if it's the former. 'Ally' as a new card type means that the entire Zendikar block is jacking itself off while letting nobody else in to the party.
The design team should have taken a cold shower and then removed the term 'ally', and replaced the keyword with 'other creatures that share a creature type with' instead of 'other allies'. And then they just make Ally a creature type that makes it super easy to key off that
>>46419051
Do you even understand EDH? Its not about whats easier or already established, it's about being different. Basically it's a sophisticated meme wearing a fedora made of expensive cards.
>yfw the New Phyrexia symbol is on Ormendahl's forehead
>>46420130This is unironically why I play EDH. So that I can do something different just to throw people off their game, because nobody expects Kaervek deck to be good.
>>46420318
literally just a line, no phi symbol
>>46420341
Naw nigga that's clearly a circle in the middle of that line.
>>46420463
Phyrexia fags are some powerful levels of deluded.
>>46420546
Why are you upset?
>>46420546
It's the NPH whippershappers too. Cosarnit, we didn't fight Urza and his Titans so y'all could point at scratchy markings on the incompleat and call them Phyrexians! Yer all too spoiled with your new-fangled 'colors' and 'infect'. Back in my day we had black, and maybe if we were good newts Yawgmoth would give us a little blue or red for holidays and we liked it!
Building Mishra to replace my Bosh since it has most of the cards I need in there. Anything I should be throwing in besides the jank that makes him work (Possibility Storm, Blood Funnel, Praetor's Grasp, etc)?
>>46421805
Nether Void.
>>46420845
Has crochety old inflection text ever not made someone look like a gigantic faggot?
>>46416317
Shut up jace-poster
Can anyone tell me if I run too much / too few lands in this deck:
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/05-03-16-anafenza-the-foremost/
I only have 3 rocks and a low mana curve, not sure if 38 is the right number
>>46415648
Not wood elemental, use Fungus Elemental. apart from being bigger it also lets you eat the lands 1 at a time.
>>46422736
How many times have you played with it? When in doubt, just keep it at 40.
>>46423329
Not once, yet at least. Still getting all the cards together
I pulled a foil one of these in sealed today
Now how do I make this my commander ASAP
>>46423340
You really won't know until you play it a few times then.
>>46423386
>implying I'll share my secret tech
>>46423386
lands are pretty good
>>46422233
Ain't that, like, real pricey?
So. I have like 40cards ready for pic related because I have pic related in my binder. So far, it's all all clones, and spells that cast spells like Mindclaw Shaman and Counterlash. Now I'm not sure how to finish it. A few counter spells and cantrips/draws like Brainstorm, then finish it with what? Deadeye Palinchron? That just seems lame. Lab Maniac works, but I'm using that as a wincon in another deck.
>>46424979
Lot's of instant-speed cantrips, and then some U, R, UR haymakers like Insurrection, blatant thievery, rite of replication.
I actually just had an idea of Jori En voltron. Cantrip each turn to keep hand full and keep a low curve. Gonna test
>>46425073
That's not a bad idea. If I didn't already have voltron, I'd try that.
I'm thinking a wizard sub theme, since RU is good colors for it, and they frequently draw cards.
>>46425170
Will post first draft of list once it's done. Wondering if there's any way to make it better for multiplayer. Stasis doesn't really work nor does winter orb, as we'd be looking to cantrip.
>>46423386
Dakmor Salvage
>>46425170
>>46424979
Here's my current list, need to cut 14 more cards.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/jori-en-cantrip-voltron/
I had runechanters pike and empyreal plate in there but I think it's better to run equipment that protects as well. I'm also not sure on the ratio of cantrips/counterspells/conditional counterspells/counterspell unless player plays x
I am determined to make Jori En work in some way
I'd like to make a colorless edh deck.
It seems like it would be fun to play and rather evil and I could cause all sorts of shenanigans with pic relatedfor 10 mana he makes a shit commander doesn't he ;_;
>>46426118
No. He's really strong. If you think colorless has an issue reaching 10 mana, you have no idea how wrong you are.
That being said, I think Newlamog might be a stronger commander because of the removal.
>>46426118
Problem with NewKozi is that his counter ability will feel a bit wasted most of the time. This heavily depends on your meta, and what you have in your deck, but the odds of your deck and their decks lining up so that you can counter often is no fantastic.
That said, get each Tentacle Titan and try them all out. Newlamog and Oldamog seem stronger on paper.
Ramp is abundant in mono brown.
Just don't use any wastes in your deck, build it the old way of having all lands being non-basic, because there's no reason to play wastes over a land that has more text even if it is a mediocre Haunted Fengraf
>>46426118
I build him as NoFunAllowed.dec. Every oppressive "Can't let you do that" artifact, Kozilek's counter ability, Can't Even to lock off the very relavant 2, 4, and 6 slots, Chalice to shut down 1 which means if I'm countering primarily on 3 and 5 I'm good. With a little trickert I might be able to seal 3 as well (Sculpting Steel on Chalice + coynter manipulation). All Is Dust is astounding when it hits nothing of yours.
In your opnion, do you htink there is enough good discard cards in magic to make this guy in commander more then just G/B elves?
>>46426793
Yes, notably sadistic hypnotist. Add in the rack, megrim, liliana's caress, stuff that limits their hand size
>>46426793
>mfw I didn't know this card existed
into the Meren deck you will go
>>46426853
Alright seems good, ill start the work on it after I am done with Scion I dont know what to make next.
>>46426854
I was going to make a Meren deck but I have a unhealthy obsession with graveyard/saccing decks and I dont think I need more.
>Marchesa
>Alesha
>Pauper Dredge
>Ayli/Atheros/Teysa,,Orzhov Soon
Having a tough time wither or not to add this as well.
>>46427110
I want to make a Meren deck, too, but I already have a GB deck that I love(Pharika bro here).
>>46427367
>Pharika
>>46427110
I ordered one just to put in my Meren deck.
Ormendahl is going to be fun times. More fun when Innistrad rotates out and everyone forgets what happens when Westvale Abbey is on the field.
>>46427447
Do you think it will drop in price?
>>46427110
What happens if you, sac it while Marchesa is on the field, does it come back a creature or a land?
>>46427483
Probably.
Like alot of cards, it's going to depend on how well it's used in standard for awhile.
The main reason I'm banking that it will drop is because it's Rare and not Mythic Rare. (there will be an abundance of them.)
>>46427399
At what you will, but I love it.
>>46428170
What's to love? She's disgustingly underpowered. What is even your gameplan with her? Kill your own guys and make snakes?
>>46428231
Not quite
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/pharika-build/
Just came back from a dominating session with my group. Ended up 3 of the 4 games using New Ezuri. Got told I should feel bad for using infectI don't even have blighted agent it was just Glistener Elf
I need a janky shenanigans commander who doesn't necessarily win me the game or kill people, but just, does stuff that makes people think for a moment, "wait a minute what?"
bonusu pointsu: the deck can be played in a number of different ways so that it doesn't become predictable, keeping it's "wat" factor
>>46428538
Jeleva super ramp.
Pick only bad spells from your opponents.
>>46426330
>>No reason to play wastes
Ruination
>>46428538
Norin the Wary generally plays out this way.
Experiment Kraj has a ton of different builds that can all be quite interesting.
Sharuum, if not built for glass-cannon infinite combo, can also be extremely versatile and even quite resilient.
Skeleton Ship is fun, but not good.
Lazav clones is always interesting.
Junk elves, believe it or not, can be pretty unique too with some 3-color junk general leading all of the 1 and 2 color elven legends into a myriad of winning avenues at the cost of hardline consistency (but black tutors and green draw/ramp can make up for it.).
Have fun.
what would the best commander for a Humans deck be? I was thinking maybe the new Sigarda.
>>46426330
>Don't play wastes
Yeah, do, actually. Not only does it make the manabase roughly infinitely cheaper, but then you can do sad robot/extraplanar lens shenanigans to help out with your ramp.
>>46428900
Lots of people are going to tell you not to, but I'm going to make the attempt, myself.
It's gonna be pretty budget for a long, long time, but I think it'll be fun.
>>46429106
>>46428900
Just do human goodstuff, instead of tribal
I was just looking around for more sac outlets, and I came across this guy. Does anyone have an experience with using him? I am really interested.
>>46429818
I mean, maybe if you're running Green/Red it's feasible.
sacrificing 10 things is a lot of trouble though, I mean we're talking about Ormendahl in the same thread and he only needs 5 without any silly suspension. He's also invincible has haste and lifelink so, yeah. I probably shouldn't be comparing the two though.
Anyway, it might could work, but If I'm running Red with Green I can't imagine making a deck based on sacrificing around those colors.
>>46429889
It would be for my hazezon deck as a way to get him off the board. Wouldnt the suspend count down each upkeep anyways, or is it strictly based off sac? Also I was thinking for board wipes and spot removal targeting. Just for a bit of a fuck you to the opponent.
>>46429818
It's alright, bad late game and horendous against Mindslaver.
>>46429889
>and he's only five without any silly upside that means he won't be destroyed because he sat on the board for 10 turns
Do you not know how suspend works?
>>46429889
Combos extraordinarily well with pic related, but I have no idea if that's even feasible in Commander.
>>46429927
Even with those things in mind it's a lot of trouble just to cook a 9/7 that does nothing. I mean, If I'm running Red then I can think of 50 different things I could be doing that are faster and deal more damage in the time it takes to get him out of the oven.
>>46429978
>>46429986
Oh, no its not strictly to play a 9/7. I am just looking for more cheap ways to remove hazezon. I have a good amount in already, but I still seem to lack it often enough that I need to add more.
>>46430009
Greater Good
Birthing Pod
Evolutionary Leap
Goblin Bombardment
Phyrexian Altar
Ashnod's Altar
City of Shadows
Miren the Moaning Well
High Market
Momentous Fall
Life's Legacy
Helm of Possession
Altar of Bone
Barrage of Expendables
Blasting Station
Perilous Forays
Shivan Harvest
>>46427511
it will enter the battlefield face up. In this case as a land.
>>46430413
Thank you for posting this. So much.could you post post some black ones, I think I may have found all I could though
>this card is 45 dollars
WHAT THE FUCK, MAN. I'm pretty sure it was <$10 a few years ago.
>>46431035
I remember it being a big part of Lantern Control in modern a while back, but I'm not sure if anyone even still plays that deck.
>>46431035
Lantern Control and one of the few cards that can stop Memedrazi.
>>46431173
>>46431216
I don't follow modern at all. What the fuck is lantern control?
>>46431224
You use Lantern of Insight and cards that mill your opponent one card at a time to lock your opponent out of the game by making them only draw land.
I used to have a 60 card casual Worm Harvest deck that was a lot of fun. After seeing The Gitrog Monster, the idea of a Worm Harvest EDH deck got me really excited. Do you guys think overwhelming with a bunch of worm tokens would be a viable strategy?
Also, do you think this card is going to be overplayed by people? In my area, it's been getting a lot more attention than I expected. Is it going to become the next Nekusar? Is everyone and their mom going to run a Gitrog deck?
>>46431695
Well, every new legend is gonna be overplayed in the beginning. It always happens, even with Jori En, which isn't even that great. The hype always dies at one point, but Gitfrog is actually a damn good card, so I'm guessing that it will be played way after the hype has died. Kinda sad that he isn't white, so no Terra Eternal. Armageddon and friends are rampant in my meta.
>>46431771
Do we even care about Armageddon with the frog out? I feel like we'd be fine after a geddon.
And that's true about a lot of new legends being the flavor of the month when they first come out. I just hope I don't sit down at a table and see 2-3 Gitrog decks like I have experienced (and sometimes still do) with Nekusar
>>46431833
>I feel like we'd be fine after a geddon.
Drawing 1 card won't get you very far.
>>46431853
You'd need Crucible, and maybe Eon Hub to avoid saccing pepe
>>46431911
Or you could be sensible and run Darksteel Citadel.
>>46428900
New Odric would require mono-White but wow.
>>46431999
That's a whole different thing. It doesn't produce colored mana, and are you gonna sac it after armageddon in hopes of recovery? Crucible is however a must in Gitfrog. Sadly it costs strawberries.
>>46432418
Crucible of Worlds doesn't keep Pepe alive after Armageddon because you don't get a chance to play a land before he dies. Run dumb shit like Crop Rotation to grab Citadel in response. Crop Rotation basically says pay G at instant speed to draw 2 cards.
>>46432431
I know that. That's why I said Eon Hub would be a okay. Crucible is just super good with him too. Imagine Strip Mining someone twice per turn and getting 2 cards as a reward for that.
>>46428345
That's a very creative way of justifying your commander choice.
I've seen a similar build using a few lure effects but I don't think it's as burial as livingplane.dec
>>46428538
Second norin the wary
And id like to add that choas decks without a way of winning are boring and will make people hate you more than winning on t3.
>>46433797
Thanks.
I will be the first to admit that she's not the stronkest commander, but the deck works. It works well with itself, and its "fair" because to my knowledge, there are no infinite combos, and the MLD frequently kills people because Massacre Wurm a best. On top of all that, having a bad Night Soil in the command zone is remarkably useful sometimes. I like giving people snakes to block big shit I don't like, and the threat of a DT blocker on my side is generally enough to keep my Planeswalkers alive a little longer.
>>46421805
How are you planning to play praetor's grasp in U/R
>>46431853
Ah shit, you're right. I keep forgetting that.
>>46434550
>Mishra
>UR
>not black
>>46435184
Oh he is grixis? I see Mishra so rarely and only played against one once so i thought he was izzet.
Of course praetor's grasp is an auto include then.
Any red tech for gitgud monster? I want to use things like Borb and Seismic Assault. I'll probably use Shattergang as the commander.
Can we stop this mishra meme before it gets out of hand?
NO talking about mishra
NO replying to mishra posters
NO entertaining "but it combos with possibility storm" mishra sympathizers
Report ALL mishra posts
I got a promo Odric yesterday and I want to build a deck off of him?
What are some prime cards to go along with him?
>>46431695
Any time I build a newish comander, I worry about it becoming a meme commander. I made an Aurelia deck back when she came out, and I was just a drop in a sea of Aurelia decks. Now I have to remind people of what she does. I feel like once the newness wears out, the turds who just build whatever is hip and new will have moved on to something else, and the people who legitimately wanted to build and keep it will still be piloting and tweaking them, and there are usually significantly less of the latter.
Especially with the fact that the Gitrog Monster makes you sac your own lands, I feel like some of the turds will be put off by that and not build it long, if at all.
>>46420057
Ally in terms of Zendikar means DnD style adventurer or party member.
That's why only Zendikar gets them. It is a very specific concept.
>>46436418
Just because an attempt is made to justify something, doesn't mean it's right.
>>46416225
Your deck is now your graveyard you mean
The only cards in your hand are Dredgers
>>46436448
If they could fit the word Adventurer in so many textboxes, they would.
What's wrong with allies anyway? They are a tribe like anything else.
If they made it shared creature type, then you'd have Tuktuk Scrapper deal thirty damage in goblin decks and what not.
>>46422600
>Have rhetorical questions ever not made somebody look like a huge faggot?
>>46436553
Some creature types you don't want interacting much. Eldrazi, for instance. I'm amazed that Eldrazi winter ever happened, considering that with such a limited creature type, someone should have seen it coming.
However, allies have the problem that they can't do anything outside their block, and the fact that they share a world with Eldrazi means the entire set is worthless unless you play it with itself. The fact that they're a tribe doesn't mean too much, but the fact that all of their abilities specifically make mention of the word 'ally' limit what they can do.
Human tribal is a big thing on Innistrad, and lots of cards use the word 'human' in their rules text. However, lots of sets actually have humans in them, so if you really wanted to, you could make a U/G Human deck based on Shards of Alara, Innistrad, and Ravnica stuff.
Ally exists exclusively on Zendikar, meaning that if you want to make the Ally cards useful, you must build an Ally deck. That's fine, Eldrazi are the same way, but Eldrazi and Allies are in the same block, effectively making the entire thing insular with itself and nobody else.
It makes the entire thing a colossal waste of time in the long run.
>>46428786
What on earth is fun about skeleton ship?
Have you actually played it?
People seem to confuse "cute" or "quirky" with fun
Like I'm sure your skeleton tribal deck list looks nice to run through, but actually playing the game with a 5 drop commander that doesn't do a whole lot is actually not fun at all
>>46436653
But allies are still very popular. Sure, it isn't as fun or unique as other tribes since they all kind of do one thing, but it isn't like a problem.
Plus, there are a few allies worth running outside of Ally tribal and as far as I can tell, Rally as a mechanic was designed to allow for more of that, seeing as it affects all creatures rather than just allies.
>>46426793
He's excellent for stax. Be prepared to have everyone hate you, though.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/my-deckbox-smells-of-rich-mahogany/
>>46436760
Rally is one half of the problem, the other half is 'tap and untapped Ally you control'.
They trigger using Allies and only allies. Or are you going to tell me that you're willing to pay for a creature that's going to do something for a turn at sorcery speed and becomes a small body afterward? Or tap abilities that do nothing?
>>46415972
Can you explain how this works to me, please?
>>46436782
This list confuses me
Like you spent top dollar on these 20 year old stax cards that are just going to force everybody to gang up on you
>>46436844
I mean, I've run worse cards than Tuktuk Scrapper, Lantern Scout and Resolute Blademaster.
As for the tap abilities, yeah, cohort is a tribal mechanic. But outside of EDH, I could see running some cohort cards as x4 with no other allies.
My friend used to run Blightspeaker in a deck with no other rebels. It happens.
>>46414976
>http://gatherer.com
At what point did this get changed to a link that doesn't work?
>>46436923
The issue comes mostly from the fact that the entire block is centred around two insular tribes, one far and away stronger than the other being mostly irrelevant.
Eldrazi and Allies shouldn't have shared space, mechanically. I get it thematically, but it just doesn't work.
>>46436913
The idea is that nobody will have much of anything to use against him.
>>46436898
Gitrog in play plus discard outlet such as skirge familiar and dredgers in the graveyard
Discard a land card with skirge, draw a card for gitrog, but dredge that draw instead
Presumably you will dredge at least 1 land, so you will draw again for gitrog, if you have a dredger in your grave, dredge that, if not, respond to the draw by discarding the dredger you just dredged
Then just repeat until your game winning graveyard combo is in the graveyard, you'll most likely have mana floating
>>46436653
Changelings!
>>46436999
>Presumably you will dredge at least 1 land
Isn't that a bit unreliable and clunky?
>>46436988
Admittedly, had they kept the cheapest colorless eldrazi creature 8 mana, things would've been a bit different. Whoops, who knew, right?
I do like devoid, even if it is frustrating as a deckbuilder.
Like, this shit would've been perfect for Lyzolda, except devoid, whoo.
>>46437059
I'm not a modern player, so I'm not going to bitch about how Eldrazi were designed. In fact they're great when contrasted with their opposition.
Devoid is neat, and thoroughly screws with people, and it makes all those lands that generate colorless mana far more interesting to use.
>>46437053
It depends on your dredger, if you're dredging 5 or 6 every time, the odds are in your favor
Not to mention if you started the combo with a couple lands in your hand you can keep going even if one of your dredges misses
It's fairly reliable in a vacuum but there's no question it's weak to graveyard hate
>>46437118
Here's another minor complaint:
http://magiccards.info/query?q=t%3Aeldrazi+-t%3Adrone+-t%3Aprocessor&v=card&s=cname
So, before, every small eldrazi was a eldrazi drone. The singular creature type "Eldrazi" was reserved for the big stuff, supposedly the "real" Eldrazi.
The thing is, for the most part, they kept true to their word. But about 10 of the "EldrazI" are clearly supposed to be drones, but aren't.
By the way, Drone tribal got a big boost with BFZ and Oath.
>>46416083
starfield of nyx
but as a serious answer, I'd say go spirit tribal or atleast spirit token tribal
throw in
Benevolent offering
Custodi soulbinders
devouring greed
gallows warden
long-forgotten gohei
seance
>>46436718
And some people confuse winning with fun.
>He doesn't run Legends legends at the helm of a goodstuff deck when playing with scrubs/randoms
I get that you want to win, dude. But if you don't necessarily know what power level the table will be at why not just fuck around?
>>46436364
The fact that he requires a bunch of fetches and Crucible should also serve as a paywall for flavor of the week deckbuilders.
>>46437128
Yeah, that's fair. I just don't see him as the go to combo general that some people seem to think he is.
He seems better winning through incremental advantage. But maybe that's just my playstyle.
>>46437259
i never claimed winning = fun
i fully support anybody who wants to make a deck that does something really really awesome but rarely wins
but most of the Legends legends dont do anything interesting or fun, they all have a completely boring and totally underwhelming ability, i.e. skelly ship
>>46437370
>should also serve as a paywall for flavor of the week deckbuilders.
At the risk of sounding like a hipster twat, I actually find this to be a good thing.
>>46437380
>He seems better winning through incremental advantage. But maybe that's just my playstyle.
lots of stuff that combos with him happens to generate incremental advantage too though, dredgers are just good value in a black-green graveyard deck
you're going to want discard outlets to trigger the toad for incremental value anyway
he's one of those commanders that just accidentally combos, kinda like ghave. you can build a ghave deck without any infinite combos but you will have had to remove cards that are amazing in ghave regardless of whether they are part of a combo (altars, etc)
the toad is the same way i think, eventually the stuff you want to do with him will just accelerate into an combo in the late game
>>46437407
Some people enjoy building theme decks that are more heavily based on flavor rather than mechanical theme.
At the very least, Skeleton Ship isn't vanilla, so you can do a bit of -1/-1 counter stuff or some "island matters" stuff.
>>46430413
Thanks man. I am in love with Altar of Bone and Helm of Possession. Gonna add them as soon as I can.
>>46437146
I kind of want to build an Esper spirit deck so I can use Innistrad WU spirits along with Orzhov stuff (and Kamigawa, but Kamigawa gives you spirits for any color combo), but there aren't any tribally appropriae commanders, and Esper legends tend to be very far to one end of the archenemy (Sharuum, Oloro, Zur) to trash (Halfdane, Dromar, Chromium) spectrum.
>>46437480
I haven't actually played much graveyard combo. What are some game enders for when you actually do get your deck into your graveyard?
>>46437493
thats why i said im sure your flavorful skelly ship deck is cool to look at the decklist
i just dont see whats fun about PLAYING with a deck that has no value outside of flavor
especially when you consider that magic flavor is really sketchy in game (emrakul dies to 15 squirrels? deranged hermit makes your squirrels as powerful as bears?)
not to mention people who make theme decks arent exactly doing anything creatively flavorful, they jsut found all the playable cards with the right words in their card name or creature types on their type line, that shit dont interest me at all and i dont know why it interests anybody
>>46437695
living death
necrotic ooze combos
yawgmoth's will
>>46437769
How do you get those in your hand from your graveyard?
>>46437695
Necrotic Ooze combo, Mass reanimation (Living Death, Twilight's Call, etc.), Mortal Combat if you're really not afraid of gravehate, Jarad+ Lord of Extinction.
I'm thinking of swapping Gitgud into the command slot of my Jarad deck and moving Jarad to the 99, though I'd have to get more fetches to make him really good.
>>46437794
when your library is in your graveyard, you can usually fenagle out some creatures like reassembling skeleton or bloodghast and power out a dread return on eternal witness for living death, or necrotic ooze to just win the game if your deck is built right
ive never seen a graveyard combo deck fizzle after putting its whole library into its graveyard, but i admit im not an expert on all the little tricks they use to make it consistent
>>46437794
Dread Return (+Eternal Witness if you need a noncreature)
Or having any reanimation spell or regrowth effect in hand when you start to go for your combo turn.
>>46437059
You can run it in Lyzolda though, it's still got a black colour identity. I really don't understand how so many people don't understand how devoid or the colourless mana symbol work.
>>46437865
>>46437897
Ah, that makes sense. Thank you. It does seem like you do have to dedicate some specific cards to make stuff work though. I don't see him accodentally comboing off as badly as Ghave does.
>>46437059
im not sure how you became so confused as to think a colorless card cant be run in your red black deck
like this has nothing to do with any special rules
even when you add the confusion of the commander color identiy rules, does the card have any colored mana symbols that arent part of lyzolda's color identity?
>>46437918
Yeah, but saccing it to her doesn't trigger her draw effect.
>>46438036
why would you sac it to lyzolda anyway though?
>>46437733
They think of the game in different terms. Maybe they actually imagine the battlefield while playing and enjoy thinking of skeleton swarms descending onto a barbarian.
A deck where flavor comes over mechanics tends to be a relaxing deck to play, as you aren't obsessed with getting something online or winning or really much of anything. You can chill, relax, talk about stuff, announce your creatures, etc.
>>46437865
Its rather safe because there's three cards that can wipe a yard without broadcasting themselves: Jund Charm, Rakdos Charm, and Ravenous Trap. Oh, and maybe Burn Away or Crop Rotation->Bojuka Bog if we're feeling generous. Since nobody is hopefully stupid enough to flip their deck with a Tormod's Crypt or Relic of Progenitus on the board, if you can dodge sorcery-speed mass responses, you're good.
There's stuff like Scooze to target key cards, but I don't think they see as much play.
>>46438029
>>46437918
You guys are dumb, did you look at Lyzolda? Her ability cares about Red or Black creatures.
>>46438036
>>46438049
You sac all kinds of shit to Lyzolda. Sometimes, that's the best thing you can do with a creature, even a big one.
>>46438127
>You sac all kinds of shit to Lyzolda. Sometimes, that's the best thing you can do with a creature, even a big one.
you claimed that the devoid card would be "perfect" for lyzolda if it wasnt devoid, and im saying to you, most of the card's value lies in it being on the field when you sac OTHER creatures , so i dont think the card would even be better for lyzolda if it wasnt devoid
>>46437733
>I don't like it so how could anybody
Dude, I know the word gets thrown around a lot but, this is autism.
>>46438116
>There's stuff like Scooze to target key cards, but I don't think they see as much play.
Really? Is targeted grave hate not heavily prevalent in most people's metas?
>>46438217
i guess im autistic then
its not like im questioning something purely subjective here, im questioning why people think its creative or flavorful to make theme decks when objectively, the flavor is lacking and the creativity is non-existent
>>46438224
i think hes just saying he sees tormod's crypt and rest in peace more than scavening ooze, which is true for me too
i really like the scooze though
>>46438116
>>46438224
Scuze and Bog are the most prevalent gravehate in my meta. Angel of Finality gets run in White (nobody wants to give up Sun Titan abuse for RIP), and one of my decks uses Rakdos Charm (seriously, that card is awesome, and probably the only charm I've run in EDH that I have used every mode of).
How do I meme with pic related?
>>46438199
Sometimes, you have two cards on the board, Lyzolda and this guy and need two cards.
... I admit, you could just sac Lyzolda and draw to cards, but, you know.
Fine, I probably should find a slot for him. I honestly have a lot of things I need to find slots for. I am not running Zula port for example. Shit needs to be rectified.
>>46438452
U/G landfall
>>46438367
I actually use every mode of boros charm quite often. The diublestrike and indestructability are obvious, but the 4 to the dome kills planeswalkers easily and finishes people off quite often.
>>46438500
zulaport cutthroat is pretty sweet
>>46438270
My best answer to that is actually still "autism".
I don't disagree that something like 60skellingtons40land.dec is terribly uninspired, but what can you do? Perhaps they find it exciting because they find skellingtons exciting by their very nature; a bit like sonic fans?
>>46438270
>objectively
>proceeds with opinions
>>46438452
Remember that it is any instant or sorcery, not just yours. Dreamscape Artist is a solid ramper for your colors other than the obvious colorless cards.
Some landfall could be fun, since you will be bouncing shit. Like that Guardian of Tazeem. You like jank, right?
Quicksilver Fountain is good if you can keep bouncing one of your nonbasics to keep everything an island.
>>46438510
To be fair, I've never played a Boros colored EDH deck, but Boros Charm is also very good.
>>46438603
>>46438367
Bant Charm is still pretty spectacular, even after the tuck change rule.
Though, I've basically given up on three color decks. I am tired of being mana screwed.
>>46438575
>implying its not a fact that theme decks aren't creative
creative: relating to or involving the imagination or original ideas
theme decks arent creative
fact: magic's flavor mostly doesnt hold up on examination, no intelligent person denies this, its obvious that the game is designed such that when fun game mechanics and sensible flavor clash, flavor is sacrificed
>>46438672
Depends on what the theme is.
>>46438603
What charms AREN'T good?
>>46438725
Dimir charm
>>46438526
i actually am autistic so im threatened by that insult
theme decks are for fags, case closed
>>46438725
Azorius Charm, Dimir Charm, Gruul Charm, many of the mono coloured charms
>spend time working on a picture of my decklist to post to the thread because I'm autistic
>realize that there are 2-3 cards that would make my deck retarded were I to add them.
>Realize that even if I add them, I'm still bad at magic
any of you fags wanna play EDH over Cockatrice?
>>46438506
>>46438602
thanks m8s
>>46438725
EDH charm rankings:
>Abzan Charm
exile mode is decent in EDH, draw mode is okay, counters are bad
5/10
>Azorius Charm
lifelink mode is very strong, draw a card isnt terrible being instant speed, tuck mode is good
7/10
>Bant Charm
smelt mode is fairly weak in bant colors, tuck mode is very powerful, dispel mode isnt awful
5/10
>Boros Charm
damage mode is situationally strong, double strike is usually solid, indestructible is fantastic
8/10
>Chaos Charm
all 3 modes are weak
1/10
>Crosis' Charm
boomerang mode is great, doom blade mode is also great, smelt is solid in grixis colors
9/10
>Darigaaz's Charm
recursion mode is decent, bolt mode is somewhat playable, giant growth mode is situationally okay
5/10
>Dawn Charm
fog mode is good, regen is cool in white, counterspell is situationally awesome normally underwhelming
7/10
>Dimir Charm
counter sorcery is limited but decent, destroy tiny creature is fairly underwhelming, advanced fateseal mode is playable in heavy control situations
3/10
>Dromar's Charm
gain life is usually weak, counter any spell is very strong, -2/-2 is just barely strong enough to make the counterspell mode more valuable
4/10
>Ebony Charm
lifesteal is bad outside of MAYBE karlov, grave hate is strong, fear mode is okay
4/10
>Emerald Charm
twiddle mode has a okay potential, destory ench is weak in green, anti flying is underwhelming
2/10
>Esper Charm
destroy enchantment is okay in esper, draw two is solid, discard two is also solid
6/10
>evolution charm
basic tutor is fairly weak outside of limited, recur mode is solid, flying mode is somewhat playable
4/10
>Fever Charm
haste mode and pump mode are outclassed, bolt wizard mode is too situational
1/10
>Funeral Charm
discard mode is kinda weak in multiplayer, pump mode is weak, swampwalk mode is pretty weak too
1/10
>Fury Charm
smelt mode is unnecessary in red, pump mode is okay with trample, time counter mode is situationally good
3/10
to be continued
Drew this guy as my most interesting card in the prerelease I went to yesterday, what cards help him out a lot.
>>46439218
What's that card that gives indestructible to a single creature at the beginning of combat?
That combo wrecked me.
>>46439244
are you thinking of pic related because that gives indestructible to target attacking creature which happens after the beginning of combat so odric doesn't work with him.
>>46439295
or was it this one because that does work
>>46439322
Yes, that's the one. Nahiri's machinations.
I basically need that thing for my Basandra deck, come to think of it.
>>46439049
Jesus that is too many creatures and not enough land/mana rocks
>>46439334
I think I know what I need to do now, time to make an angry avacyn deck with gisela as well for maximum murderous angels.
>>46439340
With Gemhide or manaweft all the slivers become manarocksI also added Mana Echoes to the deck but I'm too lazy to update the picture
>>46439447
Those guys help a bunch but man it is hard to get them early game when having the fixing matters.
>>46439175
>Golgari Charm
-1/-1 mode can be very good against tokens, destory enchantment is playable in golgari colors, regen mode is great
7/10
>Grixis Charm
boomerang mode is great, -4/-4 mode is pretty good, pump mode can actually do work but grixis is not the ideal colors for it, maybe in a zombie deck though
8/10
>Gruul Charm
unblockable mode can be good, brand mode is very situational, pyroclasm mode is solid
6/10
>hearth charm
destroy artifact creature is too limited, pump mode is outclassed, target tiny creature cant block is bad
1/10
>Hope Charm
first strike is underwhelming, gain life is weak, destroy aura is too limited
1/10
>Ivory Charm
-2/-0 mode is somewhat playable, tap creature is weak, prevent 1 is weak
1/10
>Izzet Charm
spell pierce mode is decent, shock mode is barely playable, careful study mode can be good in some strats
5/10
>Jeskai Charm
tuck mode can be good, burn mode is okay vs planeswalkers, pump lifelink mode is strong
6/10
>Jund Charm
gravehate mode is good, pyroclasm mode is playable, counters mode is weak
5/10
>Mardu Charm
flame slash mode is okay, tokens mode is not awful, thoughtsieze mode is decent
5/10
>Midnight Charm
all 3 modes are weak
1/10
>Naya Charm
bolt mode is whatever, recur mode is playable, tap all creatures mode is versatile
4/10
>Orzhov Charm
Rescue mode is very situational mostly weak, destroy creature mode is strong, recur tiny creature mode isnt the worst thing ever
5/10
>piety charm
destroy aura is bad, pump soldier is pretty weak and situational, vigilance mode is weak
1/10
>Piracy Charm
islandwalk is fairly weak, pump mode is bad, discard mode is underwhelming
2/10
>Rakdos Charm
Gravehate mode is good, smelt mode is playable, batwing brume mode is a surprise killer but very situational
6/10
>Rith's Charm
destroy nonbasic at instant speed is pretty strong, 3 saprolings is also good in naya, single target fog is somewhat playable
6/10
>>46439463
That's why I have 6 tutors, homing sliver, and overlord as my commander
Realistically I SHOULD swap out all the shocks with dual lands because this is over cockatrice, but I'm not a cockmongeler and I'm using a deck that I could realistically afford.
>>46439511
Overlord is only able to come out when you have the mana fixed already.
>>46439480
>Sapphire Charm
cantrip mode is bad, flying mode is weak, phase mode is somewhat playable
2/10
>Seedling Charm
Bounce aura is bad, regen green creature isnt awful, trample mode is underwhelming
2/10
>Selesnya Charm
Pump mode is somewhat playable, exile mode is situationally very good, token mode is somewhat underwhelming
4/10
>Simic Charm
Giant growth mode doesnt do too much in edh, hexproof mode is pretty strong, unsummon mode is playable
6//10
>Sultai Charm
destroy monocolored creature is less situational than you might htink at first glance, naturalize is solid even in sultai, draw mode is decent
5/10
>Temur Charm
fight mode is pretty good, mana leak mode is playable, small creatures cant block mode isnt the worst thing ever
6/10
>Treva's Charm
destroy enchantment is bad in bant, condemn mode is better, merfolk loot mode is pretty bad
3/10
>Trickery Charm
flying mode is whatever, creature type mode is kinda cool in rare situations, sage of epityr mode is kinda cool
2/10
>Vision Charm
mill mode could be worse for 1 mana, second mode is actually beyond my understanding (land type vs basic land type? do they mean legendary lands?), artifact phase mode is pretty situational but okay i suppose
2/10(maybe more once i figure out that second mode)
>Vitality Charm
1/1 insect is bad, pump mode is weak, regen beast is too situational
1/10
>>46439685
>>46439480
>>46439175
Good write up.
>>46439685
>Sultai charm worse than Temur charm
>>46439896
thanks!
i wrote them in alphabetical cuz thats how they were listed in gatherer
but i suppose it would be more helpful to see the good ones at the top of the list
Charm TIER LIST:
>S Tier-Great Cards
Crosis's Charm, Boros Charm
>A Tier-Solid Cards
Azorius Charm, Dawn Charm, Golgari Charm, Grixis Charm, Jeskai Charm
>B Tier-Playable Cards
Abzan Charm, Bant Charm, Darigaaz's Charm, Dromar's Charm, Esper Charm, Gruul Charm, Izzet Charm, Jund Charm, Mardu Charm, Naya Charm, Orzhov Charm, Rakdos Charm, Rith's Charm, Simic Charm, Sultai Charm, Temur Charm
>C Tier-Bad cards
the rest really
>this card doubles in price practically overnight
What in the everliving fuck?
>>46440166
maybe a standard deck of some kind?
who can say when we live in such jewish times?
>>46440166
Because Always Watching is a card now
Also tax effects to dissuade aggro decks
>>46440091
idk man they are close, i like temur charm more
the card draw mode of sultai charm is fairly weak for 3 mana and i prefer the fight mode of temur charm to the destroy mono colored creature mode of sultai charm
strictly for edh of course
>>46440166
Oh damn, I JUST traded for this for my Gahiji deck like a week ago
>>46439218
>have two of the 1/2 wolf with haste
>the flip 2/2 werewolf with menace
>end of enemy turn Avacyn
>topdick odric
>swing with all buffing wolf for lethal
>realize i'm in the edh thread and not the prerelease thread
>>46441352
Yeah my prerelease didn't go too well I got all my mythics in my prize packs and none of them are really playable in EDH and since I only really play EDH and limited kinda sucks.
>>46436718
Skeleton tribal is bad to play with and against. It's linear and terrible. I've seen skeleton ship played in a deck using things like Horobi and Mikaeus or as a pirate deck using every "steal" effect in blue and black (bribery, gather specimens, acquire, preator's grasp, etc.). The pirate theme was cute and actually pretty fun since it was throwing it's opponent's decks back at them. The sneaky interactions deck was gorgeous in the sheer synergy it pulled out of it's ass to the point where every time a card landed we weren't sure if it was a bomb or not, resulting in a lot of wasted counterspells and removal.
To reiterate, it's not GOOD but it's FUN. Some decks are both good and fun, others are neither. Skeleton Ship is somewhere in between.
>>46438672
If your argument is that theme is not creative because the idea is unoriginal, every single card and deck you own is uncreative because someone else runs it. Your clothes are uncreative as well, and your computer, food, porn, and waifu are unoriginal and therefore bland and uninspired.
Take off those thick black rimmed glasses, put on some pants that fit, get a decent haircut, take out the dumbass piercings, and assimilate you mannequin.
>>46414976
Is there any mono black commander deck that isn't "coffers tomb mana ramp until you can play your big demons/x cost cards"?
>>46442010
1-never said being creative is a good thing, just that quirky theme decks arent creative
2-to be creative or original, the standards are not quite that high as you make it seem, the smallest bit of originality counts, but theme deck fags arent even the smallest bit original
>>46442052
I'd say Vampire tribal. look at TCCs video on that, a friend has a similiar build and its nice and not "Cabal coffers is your real commander"
Can we discuss reanimate spells?
Such as, Reanimate or Animate Dead vs. Unburial Rites or Dread Return?
Of course, reanimate is better in general, altough I dislike the life loss (dislike paying ~8 life for no immediate game win) but I really like the value you get trough the flashback options of Rites and Dread Return.
>>46442052
Toshiro Umezawa plays totally differently to most other mono black commanders. You get to do spells slinging without being another cancerous Izzet faggot.
>>46417959
counter omnath? works in my meta at least
>>46442052
well id say cabal coffers + exsanguinate is probably at least the plan B or plan C of every mono black deck, but really there are quite a bit of options for plan A
you can do skithiryx infect, you can do reanimator, you can do control or control with superfriends, you can do hand disruption and or stax
>>46442052
New Kalithas whit most of Destroy creature effect.
>>46442143
>you can do reanimator
I wanna do reanimator, whats the best way to counter graveyard hate in mono black?
>>46442271
probably best to not run a bunch of willy nilly self miss and discard effects, to build up a crazy yard, and instead just rely on discarding and reanimating all at once, to miinimize the chances of being hated out
you cant destory a rest in peace easily but there are colorless cards that work
>>46442058
1- You're stating themed decks are unplayable ("I don't understand why [theme decks] interest anybody", "Don't do anything interesting and fun . . . boring and totally underwhelming"), with inference that creative = fun, don't pull that semantics crap about "I didn't say x" when you all but did.
2- The number of theme decks where the card list is NOT higher than the maximum card count for the deck is extremely limited. If you want your deck to be playable you're gonna have to get creative with your list. E.g. frogs, fungus, Rebecca Guay
3- Just because SOME theme decks weren't creative (almost all sliver decks, 2spooky skellingtons, rats) doesn't make them all uninspired (birds, jihad, clones) and several are quite viable (wizards, lands, superfriends).
4- What even are your versions of creative decks? Not just a general thought of what it entails but something like an actual decklist or a well known archetype you believe demonstrates creativity? Atm is just sounds like you have a hateboner and I'm not sure where it's coming from.
>>46442446
the reason i never said being creative is good is because thats not how i feel about magic
my point was that those people who make mostly unviable themes like bird tribal or spooky skeletons THINK they are being interesting, unique, or creative and they arent, the only thing unique about those decks is that they are uniquely suboptimal
i dont think being creative with your deckbuilding for the sake of being unique and original is good
i do think there is value in being creative at acheiving something like a deck thats good competitively or is at least capable of providing a deep playing experience if its not great winning
and by "deep" here i mean lots of relevant top-decks, meaningful synergies rather than just playable ones
>>46442446
whats fun to me is magic itself. trying to gain card advantage, trying to think about what your opponents are planning
playing around answers. sandbagging your own answers
>>46442621
>>46442775
Jesus, spikes are cancer and need to be lined up and shot.
>>46442809
>spikes
uhh i guess
im really more interested in cool combos and surprising plays of any kind than winning every game
>>46442621
>>What even are your versions of creative decks?
>>an actual decklist or well known archtype
Examples, honey
Birds tribal is actually a decent deck btw.
What you said seems to say that only competitive decks are creative with an emphasis on synergy, yet much earlier in this reply chain it was stated that the skeleton ship deck WITH SYNERGIES was fun and interesting, yet this is discounted by omission. You said "creative is good is not how i feel about magic" but three lines later say "there is value in being creative". I know you said "capable of providing a deep playing experience if it's not great at winning" but then you follow it up with top-decks (threat density) as an example and "meaningful" synergies as another, which means fuck all. Come on man, what's the REAL reason you don't like themes?
>>46442446
im a complete different anon, but to me creative would imply finding neat synergies or unusual dorks that are good because of the interaction with the other cards in your deck. or finding a completly new deck idea and finding weird synergies within, instead of jamming your deck with good stuff
>>46437695
You forgot MORTAL KOMBAT even though it's p disrupteable
