Making the thread as usual edition
Warmachine/Hordes Books, No Quarter, & IKRPG
>>textuploader <dot> com / 52c6a
PP Youtube (gameplay tutorials, tournament coverage, and announcements)
>https://www.youtube.com/user/PrivateerPressPrime
List building at
>https://www.forwardkommander.com
>http://schlaf.github.io/whac_online/whac.html
Latest Errata
>http://privateerpress.com/files/WM%20MKII%20Rules%20Errata%20Aug%202015.pdf
Steamroller Rules
>http://privateerpress.com/organized-play/steamroller-tournaments
The Giant List of Podcasts and Blogs
>http://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?76379-Warmachine-Hordes-related-blogs-websites-and-forums
Table of contents for all NQ issues
>http://www.privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?4313-Table-Of-Contents-For-All-No-Quarter-Issues
Abridged Lore
>gargantuans abridged:http://pastebin.com/XPKMKYUc
>hordes abridged:http://pastebin.com/6D1fwSgv
Lexicanum Iron Kingdoms Lore wiki:
>http://warmachine.lexicanum.com/wiki/Main_Page
Thread question time! What caster from your faction would you like to see go epic and why? How would you change their spell list/feat if they did?
More shilling for Cygnar? Tsk, OP.
>>46334588
>What caster from your faction would you like to see go epic and why?
Strakhov. Because he's the baddest motherfucker in Immoren and bitches need to KNOW.
>How would you change their spell list/feat if they did?
I'd want something to emphasize that he's a one-man wrecking crew who can carry out high-level black ops all on his lonesome. Rules-wise, something akin to Garrythexcept actually worth playing
I really want a feat that's kinda like Ambush ... y'know, immediately redeploy the warcaster on a new board edge or something. Seems like it'd fit.
>>46335782
The last two were from a different OP. I would know because I made them.
I hate everything Cygnar except their Jacks and their Stormblades.
When you kill enemy models with Sturgis' feat, can you put more than one focus point on the same jack?
>>46335963
Pssht, stop denying being part of the Cygnar hivemind, swanfucker.
>>46336074
I just used them cause they're the last faction besides khador I've used as a starter image.
>>46334588
...I'm Skorne.
You bring up painful memories of past hopes and dreams, thread-maker-kun.
>>46334588
>What caster from your faction would you like to see go epic and why?
Kaelyssa, because she's the quintessential mage hunter and she has been back-burnered since Retribution's release.
>How would you change their spell list/feat if they did?
Keep Phantom Hunter.
Replace Backlash with Occultation.
Replace Arcantrik Bolt with Repudiate.
Replace Rift with Hex Blast.
Replace Arcane Reckoning with Mortality.
Replace Banishing Ward with Awareness.
Feat that makes entire army act as if under effect of Backlash spell.
>>46336634
>Feat that makes entire army act as if under effect of Backlash spell.
Yea, fuck off.
>>46337117
I could see them doing something liek this but more like Siege's feat. So that each enemy Warjack triggers it one the 1st hit it takes and deals D3 damage to the warcaster if it's damaged.
Right guys I've got a Steamroller coming up on the 17th and it's my first one. It's only a small one at my LGS, but I'd still like to come prepared. It's one 50pt list, and here's what I'm likely going to be bringing:
Points: 50/50
>Master Tormentor Morghoul (*7pts)
* Basilisk Drake (4pts)
* Basilisk Krea (4pts)
* Cyclops Savage (5pts)
* Cyclops Savage (5pts)
* Molik Karn (11pts)
* Titan Gladiator (8pts)
* Aptimus Marketh (3pts)
Cataphract Incindiarii (Leader and 3 Grunts) (6pts)
Paingiver Beast Handlers (Leader and 3 Grunts) (2pts)
Paingiver Beast Handlers (Leader and 3 Grunts) (2pts)
Swamp Gobber Bellows Crew (Leader and 1 Grunt) (1pts)
Agonizer (2pts)
Mortitheurge Willbreaker (2pts)
Mortitheurge Willbreaker (2pts)
I posted the list a day or two ago and the general feedback was positive. I'm not running a Brute because the only knockdown I'm worried about at my LGS is pKreoss, and the Brute doesn't stop that. Instead I'm bringing along a Drake and Bellows Crew. The idea is to grind down their infantry with Incendiarii, Karn, and Morghoul, then my beatsticks can swoop in and mow down whatever's left. One trick I'm liking the idea of is Morghoul using the Krea's animus, then using Karn's animus, then ending his activation next to a high value target, which applies the -2DEF to it from the aura. Then a Savage can get buffed to shit and run in while basically operating at 8MAT with Puppet Master. That's probably going to kill a heavy, and even if it doesn't, there's going to be a huge hole left in it. Then at the end of my turn after the aura has done its offensive job, Fate Walker triggers and Morghoul can run back to safety. Naturally I'll be shielding him to fuck with beasts and clouds.
In regards to the Steamroller, is there anything I need to know about my matches? Deathclocks work just like chess clocks right? What about objectives like bunkers and shit?
>>46337443
It's like a pop and drop, except that there's even less the opponent can do to defend against it.
>>46337647
>I'm not running a Brute because the only knockdown I'm worried about at my LGS is pKreoss, and the Brute doesn't stop that.
1. Yes, yes it does. "Cannot" beats everything.
2. Hope you enjoy having enemy warnouns slammed over you.
>>46337825
Kreoss can remove the animus then feat. And
>implying my list has no warnouns to counteract your warnouns
>>46337647
>Checking through list of objectives
>Stockpile
>Lash - This model and friendly warrior models B2B with it cannot be knocked down
Holy shit this is perfect. Kreoss can't Jew me out of wins by just feating now, and I can always Sprint + Fate Walker back to it from almost anywhere.
Anyone here signed up for LnL?
Itt we argue about pointless shit.
Butcher, Vayl, ghaspy, striker, kreoss, madrack, axis, magnus, barnabus, issyria, kromac, and makeda all walk into a forest that is 5000 meters in diameter. Only one leaves alive, and everyone is alone. Who comes out, describe what happened.
>>46342767
Well considering ghaspy is dead I think he would just leave, the rest of em would prolly just die when they get close enough to butcher.
Anyone else think that the revelator will be a huge boon to pReznik?
Not only does it give him somewhere to hide, but it also brings a lot of guns for either witch hound or for some kind of feat+Taryn assasination. Only problem is that it can't benefit from perdition, but then again
>casting perdition
>>46344968
I think it'll be even better for eReznik.
That thing's guns plus his feat turn has the potential to wipe entire armies off the table in one go.
>>46342767
I say gaspy, because I like him the best
>>46344968
The thing is going to be a huge boon to literally every protectorate caster. That colossal is boss
I'd like to abridge a couple comments that were made in the old thread regarding skill factor over list factor, what wins games?
Personally as a noob, I like list building because it gives me something to do without actually buying the pieces, but how important do you experienced players feel list building is compared to play time/experience and skill?
Are there actual cancer lists / themes / casters that require more skill to beat than to play? I'm thinking of morv2 specifically, but i'm sure there are others.
>>46342767
Kromac makes friends with the forest's wildlife / feral inhabitants and all the others die from squirrel bites to the eyes, beaver bites to the shins, and wolf bites to the groin.
>>46342767
All beast users die immediately as they have no way of generating fury.
>>46334588
Caster I'd like to see go epic would be
Bloody Barnabas he died and came back after all
Bloody Barnabas feat would be something granting his bbg an additional melee and damage die while giving them blood drinker at least I feel that would be balanced enough. Also give him more utility spells to help buff up his brick giving them pathfinder and an armor bonus and carnivore would help.
>>46342767
Bucher fights striker and magnus winner in this triple threat is unknown
Gaspy vs Vayl winner Gaspy
Madrak fights Makeda winner unknown
Keross vs Kromac again really unsure on this one if it's Keross3 vs kromac2 then it likely be just a draw ending in mutual death.
Axis vs Barnabas winner Barnabas his feat would knock the big guy over and then it's over for the enforcer
Then issyria would likely die because no weapons against all these pseudo weapon master casters spells her end.
>>46334588
>What caster from your faction would you like to see go epic and why? How would you change their spell list/feat if they did?
Epic Runewood and Retinue:
>Good defensive stats, okay melee stats, maybe something like Flank
>Can give out 1 of 3 orders every turn, buffing faction troops in some way
>Feat that allows for additional movement, maybe like Vayl1 or Stryker2
>no FOC, but has a few journeymen in his unit that can cast various spells and allocate focus
>some really broken Elite Cadre for Sword Knights
>>46336042
Sure, why not?
>>46340357
Yeah, the German one though. Was a blast last year and should be better still this year. However, there's no way I won't be happy about getting to play 3 days straight. So take my opinion with a bit of caution.
just finished playing against egaspy for the first time with my circle, I wasn't familiar with what he could do and lost when he teleported over a building, popped his feat, and 6 bane thralls gangraped my emorghana. I'm thinking I'll take kromac and druids against him next time but is there anything else I can take or any other tactics that work especially well against him?
>>46342767
>Butcher
Spends the entire time angrily chasing Issyria to no avail.
>Ghaspy
Sees that there are no Lich Lords to betray here and leaves.
>Stryker
Is still trying to justify the investment into a crappy horse. Dies in a horrible accident.
>Kreoss
Trees are Steady.
>Madrack
Has retired and didn't show up at all.
>Barnabus
Trees are still Steady.
>Issyria
noAttacks.png
>Kromac
Will not leave the forest. Not because he'd die though.
>Makeda
Is probably smart enough to side step out of this mess.
>>46348085
Anything that can ignore clouds or RFP undead. That's it though.
any news from the new Streamroller docu?
>>46348041
For a second, I thought it said Wyrmwood and retinue.
The tree ditches cassius and grabs itself a handful of lesser druids, each with 3 or 4 focus, 5 boxes, and utilizing its spell list. It'd be an interesting way to do another warlock unit.
>>46347313
Skill will always be able to trump lists.
It just might not be as fun. Those are the cancer lists. They won't instant win, but they are pretty God damn strong and warp whatever you want to bring to the table because you don't want to bring something weak to it.
The split I'm holding steady to is 60 skill, 40 matchup and list building. If everyone is bringing super strong lists, then it falls into matchup.
A bad matchup can range from either feeling impotent for 2 hours as you watch your army get blown off the table to "all of my advantages were canceled and I can't do anything cool". Both are not very fun to experience.
This game is very rock paper scissors.
I haven't played in a while, barely remember how to play the rules, looked at a WM/H tournament when I was playing 40k next to it. I noticed like 3/4 of the Troll players had a Glacier King or even two. And also a lot more collossals/gargantuans in general than I remember seeing a year or so ago Many of them with doubles. What happened to the meta? Why take two glacier kings? I remembered back when Warders where the hot thing. Is there something with a new caster
>>46348085
Gaspy ends activation after teleporting so he couldn't feat.
>>46349345
The Glacier King is new, so many people play it. It also works well with Doomy3 who is also new. It's good, but its overabundance will die down in time.
>>46348085
You cant teleport and feat, you can teleport *after*. Tho, 6 bane thralls? Gross. I think I have 6 bane thralls in my list, and I only ever need 2 really
>>46348140
If theres a suitable amount of RFP (Brad) then I can just load up my feat by aceing a unit of bane knights on t1, if I so desire
>>46350018
>If theres a suitable amount of RFP (Brad) then I can just load up my feat by aceing a unit of bane knights on t1, if I so desire
Well yeah, but then you are killing your own dudes just to have a feat. Sure it's possible, but it really plays into your opponent's hands, even though it's probably the right play.
>>46348046
Because it says "allocate 1 focus to a jack".
So is the Mammoth any good? Who's the best person to use it with un Skorne?
>>46350050
My list has 2 units of bane knights, witches and min thrall no ua. So after killing one unit it resembles a 'normal' gaspy2 list. Not the worst setback
>>46350119
For each model. "For each model destroyed by Dead on Arrival, you may allocate one focus point to a warjack in Sturgis' battlegroup in his control area"
>>46350430
It doesn't say that you can allocate more than one focus point to the same jack though, and in Warmachine you need to be careful with how things are worded.
I want to get back into playing the game, with my Circle. I've been thinking about picking up Cassius to do so and was wondering if there were any list suggestions out there. I used to play eKaya, pKreuger, a little pBaldur and maybe two games with Mohsar, so I don't really know what I'm doing.
Also out of curiosity, does anyone use the Woldwrath? What about the Celestial Fulcrum? I want to own one of each but not if they're absolutely dismal. I'd probably buy the Woldwrath regardless because it looks cool to me, but I don't know about the Fulcrum...
>>46350174
>So is the Mammoth any good?
I think it's the second best Gargantuan behind the Blightbringer. This isn't *great* praise as Gargs are usually considerably weaker than Colossals, but it's still playable. You have to build a list around it to make it worthwhile, and it's typically not as good as running two beasts instead, but it's playable.
>Who's the best person to use it with un Skorne?
eHexy and pMorg are the most common answers to that question.
THE ARGUS SEEM TO BE GREAT RULE-WISE newbie is back.
So again why not pick them lol? I mean some of you guys mentioned that there are better things to pick for his price. Erm like?
Oh and by the way are all minis from Two-Player Hordes battlebox viable on table?
>>46352018
The argus is awful. What makes you like it?
>>46350522
Yeah it does. They would have worded it specifically if it worked otherwise. They are very deliberate in their wording, yes, but they call out restrictions if there are any. The way this one is worded you treat each enemy model destroyed as a new trigger. They did say allocate though, so you are bound by the 3 focus limit as well as anything that prevents or restricts allocation.
I have recently discovered that Gun Mages are terrible at melee combat.their guns are a little better than I expected.
That is all.
>>46352098
Well on paper it have good animus, combo strike and stuff.
And i like the two-headed doggie thing.
What about two-player box? Should i consider buying it?
>>46352507
They've got great def, though. Put a few on the edge of a zone and you don't have to worry about much.
>>46352916
Its animus is not very good (considering you're just handing out pathfinder...in Circle), its stats are mediocre, and for the same price you could get a Gorax or a griffin.
>>46348979
>This game is very rock paper scissors
Agreed, though with more rock vs. rock, paper vs. paper, scissors vs. scissors, and varying combinations of all of the above.
>>46349345
Warders got nerfed.
The GK is making a showing because it's a decent model, and doomy3 is super good at protecting it. It's the weaker of the doomy lists right now, but a skew people aren't used too. Expect it to die down in a couple of months
>>46337647
>>46339901
If you take the bugs they're Steady and can't be knocked down, too. Morghoul could hide behind them.
I'd argue that you'd get more work out of a bronzeback, or any other melee heavy, than the two Savages.
I don't know how many Drakes you have, but those sprays are absolutely worth it, and are another worthy option compared to the pair of Savages.
>>46352916
They work best with a point reduction, and eKromac offers them just that. eKromac and a boatload of doggies is your most viable option for running lots of the Argus's, other than that they're mostly just used as support pieces or points filler.
>>46348140
>>46349575
>>46350018
thanks guys
>>46354766
>>46352916
and by eKromac I mean his theme force.
>>46354290
Griffin? Like what?
>>46355089
Mkay i guess. In which book can i find his rules?
>>46355627
razorwing's 5 points and rotterhorn's 4 and either will probably do more for you than an argus will, but a gorax instead of an argus is pretty much a no-brainer gorax are really good for their cost
I just ebayed some Bloodgorgers, what should I do with them?
>>46354724
I'm gambling that Rush + Abuse + Enrage + Puppet Master with the potential for the Krea's aura will allow a Savage to kill a high value target like a heavy or threaten to kill a caster. 5 points taking out 8-10 is a trade I'm more than willing to make when after I've used both I still have Karn and a Gladiator. I don't know if it's right or wrong, I just want to try it.
>>46350671
Anyone?
>>46356997
Just run them and surprise your local meta with how good they actually are.
Also you should obviously paint them.
>>46352018
Well if you are really subborn on playing those Argus, let me tell you a secret: Kromac2 Tier.
>>46350363
>Not the worst setback
It's 10 points you are taking off the table with your own attacks. If that is not a significant setback, what is?
>>46350174
>Who's the best person to use it with un Skorne?
pMakeda. Both of her upkeeps are brilliant on it in a different way.
>>46358284
>Savagery
Why? Models with that can't make ranged attacks.
>>46358238
But any other light warbeast would still be better...
>>46350671
>>46358075
Common Cassius build involves gallows groves, bone grinders for cheap soul, blood trackers, and Megalith.
E Movahhna uses Woldwrath very rarely. The Fulcrum has not seen play for a long time. It's not god awful, but it's very uninspiring.
>>46356997
Run two units with pSkaare and Gerlack along with some Witches and Raiders. As a second line (and one that can easily hide pSkaare), they are great and absolutely gross under her feat + Dark Guidance.
>>46358475
Ah. I was hoping something like Woldwrath's knockdown fists and Cassius' feat would kill lots of single-wound infantry. Still, I have bloodtrackers and Megalith so I may as well grab Cassius and some pigs to see how it goes.
>>46358466
Not strictly true, BigMac fixes most of their problems, auto-hitting on that charging combo strike on feat turn being the big one. He uses them as fire-and-forget missiles, and no other light does it as well.
>>46353621
>Put a few on the edge of a zone and you don't have to worry about much.
but, wouldn't they be put to better use shooting shit?
>>46359669
Anon, think about your words. They can stand at the edge of a zone and still shoot shit, that's why they're GUNmages.
>>46357482
I'm not saying it's a bad idea, but 4 P+S 17 hits aren't going to kill a heavy without some serious dice spikes.
>>46359803
not that serious of spikes desu.
does ~ 27.5 damage on average to armor 18, so it could kill quite a few heavy beasts. Especially if you can get an ardus shot onto them first
>>46360443
Even if I don't kill it, I'm most likely going to blow up an aspect or two.
Does anyone have the fluff in a single pdf? Please?
>>46355760
Whatever the most recent Hordes book is
>>46362734
Besides the world guide in the RPG, there is none
>>46364528
>>46355760
Devastation
>>46356997
Love them with gaspy3 and venethrax
Would I be correct in assuming that Mohsar the Desertwalker is one of the less powerful warlocks in Circle? I really like his design, and am thinking of playing with him in a low-point mostly non-wold list. How should I go about doing this?
>>46359270
So play her theme force?
>Started thinking about migrating to Skorne recently.
>Play Trolls, wanted to play the scumbags for once.
>Love Makeda3, but I want a 35 list to start, so I don't have to invest over $200 just yet.
Options as I see them, what would the expert fa/tg/uy's say works best? Obviously I can see from reading her abilities / feat that she's a much better 50pt caster than 35, but still, worth asking.
1st option:
----------------
>Makeda and the Exalted Court (*2measlypts)
* Bronzeback Titan (10pts)
* Molik Karn (11pts)
* Cataphract Incindiarii (Leader and 5 Grunts) (9pts)
* Paingiver Beast Handlers (Leader and 5 Grunts) (3pts)
* Agonizer (2pts)
* Mortitheurge Willbreaker (2pts)
Do you think a full set of Handlers is too much? It probably is... Should I put in a Swamp Gobber Bellows Crew or Feralgeist instead perhaps?
2nd option:
----------------
>Makeda and the Exalted Court (*2measlypts)
* Bronzeback Titan (10pts)
* Molik Karn (11pts)
* Nihilators (Leader and 9 Grunts) (8pts)
* Paingiver Beast Handlers (Leader and 3 Grunts) (2pts)
* Agonizer (2pts)
* Mortitheurge Willbreaker (2pts)
* Maximus (2pts)
Comes down to the question of do Incindiarii by themselves, or Nihilators combined with a Maximus, do a better job of infantry clear to avoid being swarmed by Cryx etc...
Any help/opinions would be appreciated because at this stage i'm really just not sure.
>>46358374
Savagery and Bulldoze pair well together
>>46359393
>I was hoping something like Woldwrath's knockdown fists and Cassius' feat would kill lots of single-wound infantry.
It's so situational that I would never really plan around actually doing this. The knock down portion of the feat is never something to really plan around. The best use of it that I see is forcing Tough models to pass their tough check twice.
>>46360443
Needs to have an aradus in the list to do that
>>46360660
It's your first Steamroller event, and I can respect your optimism, but bear in mind that aspects only need to be healed by one point to be fully functional again, so your Savages are most likely going to dent a heavy and then get eaten on the following turn.
If you're set on using the Savages, then a good strategy will be to pop Morghoul's feat after you commit them, so that the opposing heavies cannot buy extra attacks. A good alpha strike, followed by a Molik scalpeling, and ending with an entrenched Morghoul+feat should give you the edge.
>>46367105
>>46367105
He's best at being an annoyance with Pillars of Salt and dropping a few Crevasses every turn to mulch infantry.
Skinwalkers are pretty self sufficient, but you'll be missing out on some Circle shenanigans if you don't take at least one of the wolds that let's you force it to cast your warlock's spells.
>>46367105
>Would I be correct in assuming that Mohsar the Desertwalker is one of the less powerful warlocks in Circle?
You would be correct in assuming that. His gimmick loses effectiveness the higher the point level, and he literally doesn't have a feat against a good chunk of Warmachine armies. To top it off he's got the defensive stats of a potato chip.
>playing with him in a low-point mostly non-wold list. How should I go about doing this?
How low is "low"? I'm assuming like 25.
Bloodtrackers+UA, 2x Gallows Grove, Stalker, Gorax, Shifting Stones, Druid Wilder.
>>46367896
>>46367779
Moshar does a decent enough ranged list, I think.It's not like the best thing in the faction, but he can put some pretty decent numbers up, especially combining his ARM debuff with Croaks.
>>46334588
I saw this image done for infinity and i couldn't resist making a new thing for you.
enjoy
sorry had to delete the dub version of my pic. had to fix it.
>>46368548
Got the Infinity version?
Also PP is delaying releases to online retailer that sell way below MSRP.
Poorfags get out.jpg needs to be made. Preferably using mercs.
>>46368572
>>46367404
Those lists include Molik and a Bronzeback. So they are already good Mak3 lists. I don't think you'll have to worry about not being able to clear infantry, outside of stuff like errants (aka the objects of my eternal rage). The problems I personally noticed while playing Mak3 are:
>CONTROL FEATS (all caps because it is that much of an issue)
>high def and/or tough infantry
>being outthreatened
So anything that helps you deal with that is what you should bring. From that standpoint I think I prefer the Incindiarii over the Nihilators. They don't care about DEF. The last issue is somewhat tricky and I don't think bringing a Gladiator fixes it entirely. Bringing a Brute is almost mandatory. The animus is great on Mak3 as a bonus and the Brute takes unreasonable amounts of force to remove from the table. Thereby it can essentially force your opponent to start trading down if for example he wants to score on a flag/zone you parked your Brute on.
Problems Mak3 definitely doesn't have:
>Armor cracking
>Heavy trades
>Getting assassinated
>Enemy guns (seriously, just laugh in their faces, maybe even bring a Krea in ADR)
I found Mak3 allows you to play in a way no other caster I played before does. You can start trading unfavorably, because Mak3 essentially functions as an additional heavy (though many casters do that). You can play extremely far forward and even bait out assassination attempts (don't do that against the Butcher). And as long as Molik, Bronzeback, Mak3 and a beasthandler are still alive you can win. Everything else in the list is just there to ensure that that stays the case.
Reminds me I still haven't built/painted my agonizer.
>>46367404
You NEVER bring a full unit of Handlers unless you're playing Naaresh. There's just no point since they're always 0.5 points per model. Dropping to a min unit and bringing a Bellows Crew is the best thing you can do. And if you want to clear Cryx, bring Incendiarii. Berserk only triggers off living models. If you're playing Skorne, be prepared to have your infantry accidentally countered by things your opponent was bringing anyway. Nihilators are garbage against non-living models, Incendiarii are garbage against immunity to continuous effects like a Krielstone.
>>46368818
>Berserk only triggers off living models
No.
>>46368870
Yeah I just checked, was remembering it wrong. What am I thinking of then? Probably something dumb like soul tokens.
>>46368881
Blood boon? Or anatomical precision?
>>46368818
Berserk triggers on every destroyed modell though, not just living. Nihilators are great for clearing Infantry. You just have to be carefull about their positioning, otherwise they just kill each others.
>>46368896
>anatomical precision
That's the slag.
>>46368903
>Caring about Nihilators killing each other
MUH HOKSUNE
>>46368572
I mean, I can see why they're doing it though. Online retailers are killing the small FLGS all over, they just can't compete. I've seen at least seven gaming stores close in my state, and yeah it's not super populated, but I fear for the future. Plus they're not the only ones doing it, and the retailers can continue to sell discounted stock they will just get delayed shipments. It's not the end of the world, and a little step forward for the rural stores.
>>46368740
Thanks for this brillian/tg/uy response. I appreciate the tips and info about Makeda3, cause I was fairly unsure since I haven't actually had time to field test her yet.
Do u guys feel it's worth bringing Handlers even if i'm only running the 2 beasts, Molik and the Bronzeback?
>>46369338
Beast handlers are always worth it. Just get a minimum unit. Molik and BB love the free charge and +2 STR
>>46369338
Absolutely. A min unit of handlers should be in all but the most corner-case Skorne lists. Just like it's worth it to bring a Menoth Choir for a single Heavy.
Please do keep in mind though, that I am not a top WTC player and your mileage might vary from what I wrote here: >>46368740
>>46368740
>>46369338
Also, with the point >>46368818 (excluding the mistake he makes about Berserk) brings up about the Incendiarii being nullified by immunity to continuous effects, i.e. the Krielstone, i'm starting to lean towards Nihilators more since they seem to be less easily countered.
Are Nihilators really no good at breaking high def/tough infantry down?
>>46369395
Trolls are just a bitch to deal with. Their infantry largely counters Skorne's anti-infantry options. The Kriel Stone drastically reduces the effectiveness of Incindiarii (though they can still go for direct hits or even charge into melee). Their high armor and tough stops Berserk quite effectively. I am honestly not entirely sure how to deal with them best.
>Are Nihilators really no good at breaking high def/tough infantry down?
For Nihilators to be worth it, you need a single Nihilator to kill multiple models. That is because of your 10 Nihilators, most of the time <5 will actually get to make attacks. Anything that can prevent a Nihilator from successfully killing its target is a problem. With 7/12 for offense, that is frankly not that much. It just boils down to very high DEF, multiple wounds and/or tough. And against the first and last of those Incindiarii are rather good, as they do not really care about DEF and can cause two damage rolls with a single hit (initial hit + fire next turn), forcing twice the amount of tough checks.
>>46369395
Here's the way I see Skorne's best infantry.
>Nihilators
They rely on being able to actually kill their target. P+S isn't amazing so they're hot garbage against any number of boxes or high def/arm targets. Doesn't matter if you can cleave through everything if it's got 14 def so you miss on the first swing. This is why pMakeda is mai waifu. Carnage yo. They also rely on not failing tough rolls. I've lost entire units of Nihilators without making a single tough roll, and it's a salty salty feeling.
>Incendiarii
Rely on being able to apply their fire, and when they can't apply it you've paid 9 points for 6 models that are P+S11, MAT7, and have one attack that doesn't have reach.
Those are your main two units, but I'm recently coming around to the next best choice.
>Cetrati
Higher armour than Incendiarii, have reach and weapon master, and their UA makes them untargetable. You can also give them the shield wall order which bumps them up to 20 armour. You sit these cunts on a point and watch your opponent cry bitch tears over how they aren't dying to anything, then cry even more bitch tears over how you're using Mordikaar so you can use Revive to bring grunts back over and over.
tl;dr Incendiarii and Nihilators are great when they work, but can be completely nullified by accident.
>>46369469
>>46369519
Thanks to both you extravagan/tg/entlemen for some very clean and informative responses. Really helps to have these sorts of responses.
In regards to the Cetari, without having the points for the UA i feel like they're simply not worth it in a 35 point list, so instead, having given it some thought, I'm not starting to lean towards a list with Gatormen instead, something like this:
--------------
>Makeda and the Exalted Court (*2measlypts)
* Bronzeback Titan (10pts)
* Molik Karn (11pts)
* Paingiver Beast Handlers (Leader and 3 Grunts) (2pts)
* Gatormen Posse (Leader and 4 Grunts) (9pts)
* Paingiver Task Master (2pts)
* Swamp Gobber Bellows Crew (Leader and 1 Grunt) (1pt)
- And here the question becomes, what's more worthwhile out of these 3 options?
- Agonizer (2pts)
- Mortitheurge Willbreaker (2pts)
- Maximus (2pts)
I'm leaning towards Mortitheurge at the moment, but honestly that's mainly because I'm not really sure how useful the agonizer is for makeda3, does she need the fury bank? Or do you fa/tg/uys really think it's just overall a better support than Willbreaker?
Or perhaps because i'm running the Task Master having Maximus 'bullet for unit destruction and the like becomes more attractive? I'm at an in-pass here gentlemen.
>>46370394
I never considered Gatormen with her. That might actually work, especially because her only "buff" is not Faction-dependent and Gators have two attacks to benefit from it.
Out of those three options, definitely the Willbreaker. It's invaluable as it helps you avoid missing those critical attacks on feat turn.
>>46370457
Yeah i was leaning in that direction, the ability to re roll a 1 just seems too valuable - for melee assassinations specifically - to give up genearlly. I think i'm going to purchase that list with the inclusion of Willbreaker now.
Just since we're on the topic though, your thoughts on the Agonizer with Mekeda3? Seems like having that little guy jam up war jacks would be really nice vs say Khador for example.
Please don't waste your money on skorne if you plan on playing this game competitively, they actively can't handle multiple tier 1 factions. Legion cryx and even fucking Cygnar are bad matchups for you.
>>46370637
Well let's put it like this: Get gud or get out.
>>46370637
I've played Trollbloods competitvely and have had plenty of bad match ups in my comps haha, are Skorne really so much worse?
What is is specifically that has Legion, Cryx and Cygnar putting them down?
>>46370734
A+ and s tier casters. Control casters, recursion, great shooting. Please tell me how you beat anything tier 1 in cryx (you can't and it's fucking lame. It's more of a cryx problem than a skorne problem). Hailey 2 and Hailey 3 are also very difficult. Legion drops vayl2 and you can't do anything period. Abs2, vayl1, thag1 are also all great options. Shit like bethayne, thag2 and Kallus will be favored depending on the pairing as well.
This game basically boils down to how do you beat cryx, control, armor and defense skew. Skorne can handle high Def fine with incend, they can handle high arm with shit like the bronze back (if it doesn't get alphad off the table, which happens a lot in Legion vs skorne). You have very few options vs control and cryx, which hilariously go hand in hand.
>>46371066
>You have very few options vs control
The only thing any faction has versus control is either control of their own or early game board presence. It's not a Skorne problem, it's a game problem.
>>46371134
One they can't really fix without insane bitching and tantrums.
I mean they took one sentence off of eHaleys feat and suddenly we were in Caine2 land.
>>46371244
Pretty sure we entered the Haley3 fogbank. But that's not because Haley2 is now bad. It's because Haley3 is just so good.
>>46367653
Is it that situational? I guess it's too much theory machine and I don't really know what I'm doing anymore but I thought between hellmouth, AOE knockdown on a boostable hit, and a KD doing damage in CMD of the tree would be plausible.
>>46367105
You can pillar of salt and then slam shit into the pillars for extra damage dice. Curse of shadows is an awesome spell. His feat is terrible against half the factions you'll face. He wants a geomancer.
>>46371299
Haley3 might be the best caster in the game
So long Discount Games. Nobody liked you assholes anyway
http://icv2.com/articles/news/view/34100/privateer-axes-offending-online-retailers
>>46371134
Control of your own isn't a secondary Versus Control, it's Versus Control. Not for nothing that complaints arise when one party is unable to respond in kind to something.
Skorne just got screwed when it was given its design concept. They can't respond in kind to quite a lot.
>>46372308
>Control of your own isn't a secondary Versus Control, it's Versus Control. Not for nothing that complaints arise when one party is unable to respond in kind to something.
Could you rephrase that?
Hey /tg/ my store is doing a slow-grow league and I'm interested in starting Cephalyx. I talked to the owner and he said it'd be okay if my starting "battlebox" was Exulon Thexus, a Wrecker and a Subduer. Any tips for them? What should I buy next?
>>46372325
Control factions and players are dicks and there is fuck all you can do about it
>>46372325
It's a lot like poison gas. What keeps it from being a clear advantage isn't because of the strength of the defenses against it, it's because if everybody has it and is using it the increase in performance averages out across all parties and you might as well not have. It doesn't change the result, only increases the toll. If only one side has it to use it's a winner, though.
>>46372578
...Is English your first language?
>>46372747
He is very smart you see
>>46372747
...sigh
>(when one party is unable to respond in kind to something)'s a lot like (the situation with) poison gas. What keeps (poison gas) from being a clear advantage isn't because of the strength of the defenses against (poison gas), it's because if everybody has (poison gas) and is using (poison gas) the increase in performance (from having and using poison gas) averages out across all parties and (all parties) might as well not have (begun to use poison gas). (everybody having poison gas and using poison gas) doesn't change the result, (everybody having it and using it) only increases the (death) toll. If only one side has (poison gas) to use, (poison gas)'s a winner, though.
>>46372904
This is how having control elements of your own is the main answer to the opponent having control elements, instead of the intuitive answer, which is to have defenses against control (Immovable Object and such).
>>46369110
Who is Rhyslyrr?
>>46372120
I get the reasoning.
But it seems like a dick move.
Who will be affected you think?
>>46373484
The poor bastards that showed up to a Vyros scene without any ulterior motives. A Military House that thought their duty was actually defending Ios's borders, the silly bints.
>>46373780
Man, fuck Vyros. I wanna see Ossyan kick him, Issyria, and Rahn into a time vortex or something.
>>46373484
One of Ios' major houses. They're supposedly a 'big deal', but in the context of the Skorne invasion they just serve as generic redshirts for the Skorne to fight and look successful against.
>>46373937
>Story progression
>In the Iron Kingdoms
Anon, I'm sorry.
>>46374196
Th-they let Zaal die...
>>46374319
Actually if you want a better example Madrak's practically retired, Kormac's the Champion of the wurm and carries Rathrok now, Barnabas ascended, and Mordikaar got eaten by the beast of all shapes. I call that progression and it all happened within 1 book. Devastation was a huge climax point.
>>46374319
Best thing that ever happened to him, anon.
>>46374393
>Barnabas ascended, and Mordikaar got eaten by the beast of all shapes
Where? I don't remember any of that in Devastation.
>>46374463
You should go reread it then. I just finished reading it yesterday. It all happens at the same battle-royale where Farrow, Gators, Tharn, & Trolls all end up clashing. Mordikaar followed the portal's distortions there and was observing from the sidelines.
Barny gets his chest ct open by Carver but he gets back up and laughs at him. Mordikaar's void portal gets huge and the beast comes through and swallows him.
Writers have even said in Q&A that as far as they are concerned Mordikaar is not coming back, he's in the wurm's guts now.
>>46372120
Why are they assholes?
What is good about having low prices on minis?
>>46374393
Where can i read about Madrak and Kormac?
>>46374393
>>46374595
Hot damn, I'm glad I was wrong!
The fluff had been stagnant for so long that I ended up ignoring it.
>>46372120
>"Freerider" in this usage having the meaning of "people that spend more effort and meet more success promoting our game than we do ourselves."
>what is not good about having low prices on minis
fxd
>>46375514
Devastation.
>>46373937
There are assholes like Terminus, Goreshade, and Magnus running around, but no, you're pissed of at fucking Rahn?
>>46375740
Devestation was some good stuff. A bit too short all in all but lots of big climactic shit hit the fan in this one.
>Madrak breaks away from Rathrok
>Kromac becomes perma-huge champion of wurm with Rathrok
>Barnabas ascends
>Mordikaar is eaten and gone probably forever
>Doomshaper pisses off the old witch
>Everblight has the 'oh shit they can sense me' moment
>Carver is tryin to pork Helga
Between Devestation and recent shit in Warmachine with Terminus getting wrecked and the whole Athanc business, things are picking up.
>>46377203
Terminus is dead temporarily. But Gaspy is definatly on the run atm
>>46377836
I hope terminus gets an epic incarnation along with venethrax which by the way Venny is still up and running right?
>>46375474
They force actual game stores to close? If there are no game stores for people to go to then it's a lot harder to attract new player. No new players means your game is going to die.
>>46378186
Venethrax is fine. He's barely even been touched by silly Abbys claws slappings.
>>46377203
Goreshade isn't an ass. He's the hero Ios deserves.
>>46378262
d-ded gaem??
>>46378660
DED THRED.
So uh... I'm surprised there is no shitstorm here.
I expected 100% Mad Macros and everything.
I'm personally in the "30% Discount made it impossible to compete. Aggravated by the niche nature of many releases meaning dead stock sat and sat in local stores while good releases were passed on by players due to superior online pricing."
I've never liked how online stores were always able to give us a crazy discount near constantly. Made me wonder why even bother with an MSRP if everyone online just shat on it.
...but I made my last DGI purchase today. It wasArchangel.
>>46379071
I think most of us realize this is what's best for the game
>>46379071
For all the shit people give /tg/ about being "bad at X game" the community is at least vaguely more intelligent than most game forums.
>>46379071
I'm all for supporting my FLGS, but: I'm not super keen on PP's steadily increasing prices, and I'm also 150ish miles from the nearest game store. Whether I'd like to or not, I have to source my miniatures from the internet.
>>46370394
The Willbreaker is probably the best solo in Skorne. By a distance. Like holy shit. This is especially true when your warlock either 1) has a small control range or 2) wants to do more than just support their army. Makeda can't sit around and bubble her beasts, so the Willbreaker is perfect. Also read into his Puppet Master ability. It's basically like buying another attack when one misses, and that attack has a REALLY high chance of hitting.
>>46372120
Pretty sure it's specifically a knock to online stores that DON'T have a brick and mortar store. SO it probably wont effect Discount Games because they are a store that sells online.
They're specifically after the pure, internet retailers and ebay people.
>>46372120
DGI actually had a pretty classy response to the issue.
http://www.discountgamesinc.com/blog/discount-games-inc-press-release/
I know Khador has a Russian aesthetic to it, but is part of it also based on Imperial Germany?
I notice the marshal culture, rapid modernization, strong industry seem reminiscent of Prussia.
The innovative use of new artillery and fire-arms Khador used to defeat both Llael and Cygnar in Llael also seems reminiscent to how new advances in artillery allowed Prussia (and allies) to defeat the Second French Empire at Verdun (if I have that right).
Also similar to how Prussia became the German Empire after defeating France , the Khadoran Monarch also proclaimed her realm to be an Empire after the conquest of Llael didn't she?
>>46380843
Khador is a lot of things. Mostly, it's Imperial Russia, but there are a lot of other cultural/historical bits and bobs thrown in as well. So, yeah, there's probably some Prussia and Germany in there somewhere.
>>46380843
Khador is part Rissia, part Prussia, part Slavic, part Cossack, part Romani.
>>46380114
Steadily increasing prices on what anon? With things going to plastc, stuff is getting cheaper than before - look at the cryx colossal dual kit
And you can still buy online, its just going to not be steep discounts
Are all Menoth Worshipper Dicks?
>>46380754
DGI was specifically one of the stores hit. They're one of the biggest offenders honestly
Everything they do from the podcast to the tourney results exists only to generate sales for their business. They don't give one fuck about the community or your local area
>>46381559
No, there are plenty of decent Menites. The Paladins of the Order of the Wall are generally pretty cool guys.
>>46381641
Which fight for the Protectorate of Menoth.
>>46381584
True. Which is why I always found the reasoning bullshit in the PP thread mentioning "All the work they put in for the community".
I don't like their podcast because it over emphasizes a certain style if play.
I don't like their tourney winning list collection because it emphasizes a certain purchasing habit.
DGI was the main beneficiary for those services. All the purchasing went directly to them and they were front and center at the whole massive discounters schpiel.
>>46381559
>Saviors of Humanity, the main force against the Beast of All Shapes
>dicks
>>46381559
No it's just the Protectorate that probably gives it a negative reputation.
To tell you how bad it is, many in Llael prefer the rule of Khador (the same folk who ran amok and invaded their country, leveling a city among other things) to the rule of the Protectorate.
>>46382535
So, the Protectorate is pretty much isis?
>>46381874
Some of them do.
The Order of the Wall isn't exclusively Protectorate. There are members all throughout the Iron Kingdoms just as there are Menites all throughout the Iron Kingdoms, many of whom do not agree with the Protectorate's policies.
Even within the Protectorate, the paladins tend to be reluctant to go along with a lot of the more extreme policies of the Protectorate leadership due to the fact that their oaths are to protect the faithful first and foremost, not to act as crusaders.
>Not buying from your LGS considering you only need to buy shit once in a tabletop game anyway
Literally.
>>46382410
>I don't like their podcast because it over emphasizes a certain style if play.
Don't listen to it.
>I don't like their tourney winning list collection because it emphasizes a certain purchasing habit.
Don't buy it then
>>46383346
> Then don't claim it's doing good for the community and then whine when the hammer comes down on their pricing.
Everything they did was to promote themselves more than the game.
>>46382804
Easy way to put what you are trying ot say
>Knights, Flameguard, etc
Answer to the Clergy
>Paladins of the Wall
Answer to Menoth and the True Law
Paladins listen to the tenets of the faith, Menoth's guidance, and their own morale compass. They do not blindly answer to the clergy/temple like most of the other groups. This is why Heirarch Voyle distrusted Paladins.
>>46379071
I would like to think that most of us are adults and understand why this policy was created. I'm sure it will affect some people who cannot afford the hobby, but they ca still make purchases, just not as many. It's super shitty for a LFGS to provide a place to play, as people bring in armies they bought from online vendors. My interest in the game dies when the local community dies. As a player who meets weekly at a shop and attends tournaments, I do not mind the move. It shifts the balance back to local gaming shops.
>>46383524
I've shown friends the podcasts to get them into the game who have then gone on to purchase from flgs, anecdotal but I'm sure it's true for others too
>>46384222
Why would you do that? Chain Attack is terrible
Getting back into Warmachine after a long ass hiatus, are Kossite Woodsmen still a joke unit?
>>46384398
Yeah... very humorless.
Their beginner series didn't really sell it well either. I don't think it's ever okay to say "I hate the theme in this game" when trying to sell it to a new player.
>>46384416
Why would that ever change?
>>46384398
production's good enough and they aren't annoying to listen to
>>46384460
Maybe MKII Remix?
I've got a lot of dead pewter in my minis collection. Kossites and Nyss Archers are but some of them.
>>46384452
Eh, I appreciate the harshness. Too many people get into things without research and just get salty.
I chose my games and factions very carefully.
Only game I've ever felt bad for investing was Infinity.
>>46384522
Well if you are the kind of player that can separate their love of theme with their love of gameplay it's fine.
Not every miniatures gamer is like that though. I'd reckon a good chunk really need to like the theme in order to enjoy painting/playing.
Going out and saying "I hate this" is going to unfairly slight the thematic gamer. Possibly turn them away from the game.
>>46384398
None of them attempt to be the funniest guy in the room, which is a big selling point for me. I've tried to listen to other WMH podcasts where each guy tries to be funny or edgy and it pisses me off to no end. I find listening to their podcast is a good way to pass the time when painting.
>>46379071
DGI's prices have already adjusted, but minis market still has the D. Debating between soulhunters and a second unit of McThralls. Or preordering the seppy
>>46384615
Playing a shitty game is worse than playing no game at all. It's better financially and is better emotionally to not be disappointed by decisions made on false premises.
I got into Khador and trolls fully aware that they couldn't run warnouns very well, and I accepted it. I have some current gripes about Khador, but I invested into the game for a decade with satisfaction that i've made an informed choice.
>>46374061
Skorne weren't even successful against them. They've mostly been kicking the shit out of Dawnguard and Houseguard. Rhyslyrr tried to conduct their plan and Vyros/Issyria had to hijack it to show off.
>>46384731
Smart, no-nonsense guys that care a lot about quantification and reproducibility.
>>46384788
...but what's the point?
There are plenty of games that can satisfy the crunch aspect.
Shit rules are no longer a thing permissible in Wargames.
People see Warmachine and they see robutts. People play Warmachine and they see no robutts!
You pretty much just need a community. I mean Infinity was fun while it lasted...but it was too crunchy for me but I at least had a satisfying experience the time I was playing it. My expectations were set in the demo, but the expectations were met through out me playing it.
I dunno. I need theme in my game or what else is the point of playing with super expensive models?
>>46385289
Why do people obsess so much over warjacks?
Seriously, people need to get the fuck over it.
Stop being such pedantic shit monkeys.
>>46371066
>>46370734
So, Skorne and to a lesser extent Trollbloods are seen as the least competitive (not including full minions lists etc...) factions, then what are your brillian/tg/uy opinions on the most competitive?
Retribution has been doing quite well recently, does this have anything to do with Thyron do you think? Or is it just that Issyria with a Hyperion is smashing all the faces?
>>46385476
>Why do people obsess so much over warjacks?
Because big magic robots is one of the big selling points of the games and a major factor both in the rules and fluff?
>>46385289
>...but what's the point?
to play the game.
>>46385476
Warmachine player are Salty Salt Lords. They're always going to be bitching about something
>>46385476
Probably because of the amount of meat in the rules for warjacks and focus allocation.
You have to learn a shitton of rules that really end up being seldom used.
There are plenty of reasons. If warjacks somehow get buffed to relevancy overnight I don't think the image of the game would suffer. We'd get less jaded folk for sure though.
>>46385589
>Trollbloods
>Uncompetitive
You know how I can tell you're an idiot?
Do you guys even like WarmaHordes? These threads are almost as salty as 40kid threads.
>>46385616
The setting, the balance and the focus on army synergy is the major selling point of the game.
Are you pissed that every army in Warhammer isn't exclusively made of models that hold warhammers?
It's a god damn name. If you thought you could put no thought into list building and still win all your games, why the fuck are you playing table top games?
Warjacks are in the game and they are an important part of the game. Because they aren't the sole focus doesn't mean the game is bad, it means you have unreasonable expectations of the game based on it's name.
This gripe is so fucking childish and yet it keeps popping up. Of all the shit you could complain about in the game balance, you bitch because you have to think about the game itself to win.
>>46385727
I personally think that the current edition has overstayed its welcome.
I'm getting into 30k and really enjoying X Wing in the mean time.
>>46385751
Dude, calm your fucking tits.
Nobody is saying that warjacks should be the sole focus of the game, just that, as it stands, warjacks tend to be outshone by other options. People want warjacks to be a more viable option. The fact is that the game as it stands doesn't really facilitate one of its core thematic concepts very well and it could be improved.
>>46385751
>Stop caring about things I don't care about
I mean, I like balance too...but this game isn't as balanced as people give it credit for.
Is it really that much of a stretch to think a big chunk of players checking this game out would expect Warjacks to play a larger composition in army construction?
I get that it's a tired argument, but it persists for a reason.
I play pXerxes with two Bronzebacks, Tyberion, a Gladiator and some other stuff. Can I cast the Train Wreck animus from each Bronzeback on the other Bronzeback from Xerxes? Or can you not cast the same animus in one turn?
>>46385860
Eh, warjacks are represented fine for some factions. The only faction that can complain about jack issues is Khador.
>>46385670
>You have to learn a shitton of rules that really end up being seldom used.
Yes and no. Honestly, there are less rules in this game overall than most wargames. Think of Warhammer where every model seems to have special rules dedicated solely to it you have to remember. Think about Infinity that pretty much requires an encyclopedia to figure out what each rule does in a given situation.
Warmachine doesn't really have complex rules but it does have tons of interacting rules and the way the rules layer really makes it better. It rewards people who know the rules and how to exploit them. I don't see this as bad at all but I know it can seem daunting so I understand.
>If warjacks somehow get buffed to relevancy overnight I don't think the image of the game would suffer.
I do agree with this statement but, I really don;t see jacks as irrelevant. They play a very real part in the game. Just because some are weaker and some are stronger doesn't mean the game is worthless because warjacks aren't utterly dominant (which would be fucking horrible to play honestly).
That said, I think Khador would not be overpowered if their jacks got some sort of mat/rat buff or a mat/rat buffer for them. Also, there are definite quality of life changes that could happen to make the lesser used jacks better options. They however do play a role in the game and I don't think having infantry as bigger focus of the game (like in every wargame) is bad at all. I just hate seeing this weird aesthetic argument pop up when, of all things, you could have real complaints.
I.e. the dominance of theme lists, skornes haphazard balance, etc.
>>46385898
Not that guy, but I think it's foolish for people to think that any logical sense would exist for all jack army.
It's a system based around resources and people are surprised that the thing that takes resources are taken less?
Are people that surprised that infantry can kill jacks? Did they really think having a 10 man unit that can only kill other 10 man things was a good design?
It's just pure logic.
>>46385927
In order to care about the other stuff you mentioned, you would have had to stomach the initial let down of the premise of the game.
If people keep checking out at "Warjacks suck" then a lot of the complaints for theme list dominance, peso/ruble/euro inflation, skornish game hens and Kossites woodsmen won't even get discovered.
The latter complaints are made by veterans. The former complaints are made by newer players.
I've found it fascinating how the perception of the game has warped over the years, but the one constant is "shame warjacks aren't well supported"
>>46385727
It happens in every game where net-listers thrive.
>>46386032
It's not even about an all jack army though.
Like, I just think it's a shame that so many factions are essentially limited to a single jack and filling everything else out with infantry for 90% of their lists.
I understand that nothing but jacks should be weird, but I do feel like 2-3 jacks should be something that most casters can support.
>>46386032
Where is everyone getting "All Jack army" from?
Asking for more battlegroup representation doesn't mean "remove all humans".
>>46385927
I don't know if jacks themselves need to get buffed a whole lot.
What does need to get buffed is Jack Marshal.
It's easily the worst rule in the game at this point, with a very few exceptions.
>>46386144
Because it's the first thing every uninformed player tries to make it work. It doesn't matter the system, new people. either by poorfaggotry or lack of understanding for action economy will always try to make the stompiest list. Everyone thinks they are going to get into the game with nothing but jacks with 1-2 pt mechanics fixing up jacks for the win.
>>46380836
>>46372120
Never knew about this website, but I went to their website and just found out that their brick and mortar store is one of my FLGS....
Strange world.
>>46386087
I really don't think warjacks are unsupported.
like >>46386032 said, if you look at how the system works anyone should be able to understand why tons of warjacks are hard to support.
Like I said, if Khador got some more support, I wouldn't be upset. Cryx is designed for infantry and I am totally okay with that. Instead of buffing their jacks, they would be better off if their infantry received some incremental nerfs really.
All that said, again, there could be some quality of life changes. If they built in some more focus efficiency abilities (I personally think Jack Marshals should help hand out focus instead of taking over jacks) like Hordes has Fury efficiency units, I wouldn't be upset.
>>46386145
Just remove the requirement that a jack need to be under the control of the marshal to benefit from it. Bam, fixed.
>>46386282
Problem is, that makes some of them insanely powerful while others still stay pretty bad.
Drives need to be worked around, I think. Either let a JM give his jack way more psudo-focus, or let him give jacks he's not running(with the same restrictions on characters and colossals) that psudo focus.
Drives are the wonky part.
>>46386226
Some follow up on what their local store is like:
-They offer a discount from MSRP even in their local store, usually around 10%, I think.
- I don't know the owner specifically, but from other people, I've heard he's a bit of a douche
- When they opened, they put another FLGS out of business by undercutting them hard.
- Whenever I go in there, there's ton of people playing Warmahordes
Take it for what you will. I live in the next city over, so I don't always go to Gameopolis, but I feel they are definitely better than the other LGS in that city.
>>46386145
I agree with this.
I keep thinking Jack Marshal should be a rule that lets you allocate 1 extra free focus to jacks in his CMD during your control phase. Also, Power Booster could get rid of it's requirements and be fine.
>>46385909
A beast can only be forced to cast its animus once, but a warlock treats animi as spells and can therefore cast them as many times as they can afford to.
>>46386278
Well I'm not sure about "well" part of "well supported".
I take it they tried, but nothing was able to overcome the activations that infantry provide.
I dunno. We could go on forever on how to change warjacks for the better. I'm gonna enjoy my time off in Ensenada, later nerds.
>>46386655
Thank you.
Does that mean a warcaster can cast the same spell on different targets as long as they have sufficient fury?
>>46381384
New metal/resin packs are quite expensive. Around 30€/$ for Haley3 or Legends is a lot. Granted, they are beautiful minis and I bought them regardless, but that is rather expensive.
Hmmm i dont really get the shitstorm over DGI store. Why choke them instead of lowering prices yourself while their will HAVE to stay on the same level? If you are playing warmachine in your local store - well, i dont think you will be kicked away from there JUST BECAUSE WARMACHINE GOT REMOVED FROM THE STORY when come in and say "Sup guys where can i find others to play warmachine with?"
From your point of view upon hearing that angry shopkeeper roars, pulls away old edition metal dreadnought and rushes towards you to cover it with your blood.
For me living in a country where $ to local currency is in absolute shite DGI was the only REAL option to get into the game, because both prices and delivery via mail was pricy, while our local stores may not even have something i require.
You are saying about your precious local game store community? Well what will happen to it? And what about ME then? What am i supposed to be? Buy lead pirate miniatures or spend my every goddamned coin to pay for delivery and minis themselves?
>>46385674
Elaborate. As far as I'm concerned, Trollbloods got the worst point-for-value ratio all across the board of all factions.
>>46388054
Haley 3's 3 12 -15 dollar models mashed together.
>>46388065
It's a good thing that there's a list that gives a 4 pt swing on a 7pt caster.
>>46386278
>I really don't think warjacks are unsupported.
Aside from CoC, every faction has about 3-5 warjacks that are actually taken. Most of those are either characters or colossals.
PP deleting and closing all threads trying to discuss the free rider policy.
IMO this is an attack directly targeting Discount Games Inc, who got me into this game and made it a bit more affordable with their 30% discount.
I also support my LGS with small purchased, but they don't carry a heavy stock of wargames since that isn't steady money. The real money is the Magic the Gathering and other cardboard crack games, food and table charges, and hopefully soon beer after the license.
I honestly don't understand the hate for DGI, if your LGS is run out of business it's probably because they are run poorly, not because an online store offers a bigger discount for overpriced plastic.
Is PP on the path to GW?
>>46388220
Hell no. GW is notorious for making brick and mortar's lives miserable.
Brick and Mortars can special order for things you need.
Can you tell what it is yet, friends? ;^)
>>46388290
>>46388220
> Is PP on the path to GW?
Yes, imo. In "shitty pricing policy" way
Our Friendly Local Pirate Miniature Casters needs more love, I think.
>>46389191
It's the despoiler, what about it?
im new to warmachine, wanna play cygnar
what is the best way to start, get the battlegroup? get the all-in-one box? buy single models?
plz give me some insight
>>46390013
Well which caster looks the most fun to you, Tracey Gay?
What special snowflake hair colors should i give to my MH Strike Force?
>>46390013
The all in one if you can get it is very good.
The battlebox has 2 usefull models (charger/lancer), Stryker as a caster who is not bad but he is very bland and the Ironclad which you will probably not use much aside from low point games.
All in all its not bad but its not the best
>>46390093
Shades of pink.
>>46387111
yup, exactly right
>>46390215
That is indeed something a Raymond would say.
>>46389191
I like it except for its stupid looking face.
>>46390372
u wot m8 ill fuk u up
