>Try to give my players some cool fights they have been asking for.
>Every time an enemy seems strong they are too scared to act.
Why?
Throw enemies that look weak but are unexpectedly strong at them.
>>46282223
Paranoia about screwing up and RNG, probably. It's kinda a common fear, at least in groups I've played with.
>>46282223
Giant babies obviously want to wade through enemies like grass. Tell them to fuck off back to Dynasty Warriors
Paranoia. Wanting something and suddenly getting it causes suspicion in gamers from my experience. You'd get a similar reaction if you suddenly showered them with loot and restoratives.
players don't know what they want.
They think they want strong bosses, tough encounters, dangerous traps. They think they want to earn their loot.
what they really want is to have their hand held and their bruises kissed.
>>46282223
They aren't very good roleplayers. I've had characters get into rough and hopeless fights because the power gap wasn't be immediately apparent IC or they came later and weren't briefed properly by the group that the XYZ they were looking for was very strong (or that they were looking for them in the first place...).
Sometimes you've got to answer the DM's "are you sure?"s with
>it'd be metagaming if I said no
>>46282478
>implying metagaming is bad
That's what D&D was originally built on
>>46282579
And DnD is shit. Whoda thunk.
>>46282579
If you can find a way to justify it IC it's not irredeemably bad but there is a reason knowledge (subject) is a skill in D&D. There is just some shit your character cannot magically know. Especially bad if you're playing low int.
Also I don't get what you mean by the statement. Please explain.
>>46282223
If your players are such cowards that they won't even put their characters in danger, find a new group.
>>46282737
Original Gygaxian D&D was an extension of wargaming, and a brutal one at that. Generally your character had no real personality, absolutely no backstory and everything about him was earned through play. One mistake -you're dead and roll up a new level 1 character.
Due to this mayfly life you've used whatever knowledge you've gathered as a player. You figured out the way traps tend to be laid out, how to detect them (no perception checks, you have to describe what you do), what monsters are, what are their tactics and so on.
Keep in mind that there were no monster manuals, no stables of canon creatures. You just walk in a dark corridor with you hirelings, turn a corner and see a room littered with rotten pieces of flesh and croken bones, in the middle of it an eye with a toothy maw and eyestalks hovers, one of the eyestalks notices you... What do you do?
>>46282223
Babies who are afraid to lose their character.
Been a problem with a group I've been with the past few months. The GM keeps throwing plot hooks at us, but one of the players is a huge bitch and is always like "if we do that we will die" (which is especially funny considering his character is a strongman orc who supposedly gives zero fucks.) so it is basically impossible to get him to go along with anything unless he is forcibly railroaded into it.
>>46282223
They asked for cool fights, and you gave them hard ones instead.
>>46282391
Sometimes yes, but as a player i have learned that while easy encounters can be fun, they can feel rather pointless if it effectively adds up to the party pushing the "blam noobs" button. Most of the time the only times i truly was enjoying myself was when i was risking death or grievous injury in a bad situation, and if something went wrong then i would be more excited as i tried to save my ass and prayed my teammates could save me if i couldn't.
For those players who want their hand held they need to ask themselves if grinding out a bunch of mooks and "bosses" for magical gear or the equivalent, they need to ask themselves if that is really what they want out of a tabletop RPG, a narrated grindfest with no danger (and with it, the excitement that makes moments memorable) rather than having a more realistic game with consequences and challenge that makes it so everything matters, making the player feel more invested in the game and getting a better time out of the experience (Which is why most people play the game).
Of course, some people simply aren't mature enough to handle everything not going right, and there is nothing anyone can do about that, but they really do need to consider whether such pampering really makes the game worth playing. For me anyway, if i'm not in danger of losing everything i have fought so hard to earn at least once a session, then the session was a bust.(Assuming the session wasn't entirely diplomacy.)
>>46282386
Just like seeing chest high cover in shooters.
"Something is going down here..."
>>46282223
I know what got a different reaction out of my players: the fear of their victory not being complete.
In my games, I hate killing PCs. Even though I'm doing a high-fatality game (Halo: Mythic with a lot of homebrewed shit mixed in to accomodate my setting), I normally keep PCs from dying or just can't provide a lot of tools to NPCs that will outright kill them without feeling like a douche. So, I decided to do things another way: after several sessions of "everything went much better than expected," I rolled up a scenario where if it wasn't handled JUST RIGHT, hundreds of innocents would end up dead.
And they didn't handle it -just- right. They won, yes, and did so with utter tactical efficiency in terms of how none of them ate any real damage. However, in not handling it just right they watched a psionic conjure up lightning in such a way to create a blue, serpentine dragon that seized as the psionic died to a gunshot that basically bisected her. A dragon made of lightning roiling about a huge group of people who had fallen unconscious on the ground -kinda- goes badly. First time the players were like "we won, but fuuuuuuuck."
If they enjoy stomping things, but want to fear losing out, make the objectives change. Plan on them being able to murder shit, but make them have pressure in other means. That way, they can have a fight that while mechanically isn't hard, there's gravity.
Dont be afraid to kill players.
But give them hints.
Give them alternate routes.
Allow them to make checks, to decipher things.
If they go up againts something they shouldnt, and go without thinking properly, then let them pay the price.
My players last game went and assaulted a great stronghold that a Gnoll Army had taken over, thousands strong. They had a straightforward plan, to stealthly break in, kill the Gnoll King and his heirs, destroy the Gnoll High Clerics, and with it, the Gnoll Army would break.
They had ONE extraction plan- to go during a rain storm caused by the druid, and everyone would go invisibly in, then murder everyone using the closed quarter skills for effect. They had ONE extraction plan- the Wizard would teleport them out, and ONE backup plan- a teleportation scroll the rogue would make.
THey ended up accomplishing their goals- they killed the Gnoll King, his three heirs, and the Gnoll High Clerics in amazing, great combat.
But during the last combat, their mage had gotten skewered and got killed. They picked up his body, and prepared to teleport- only to find out that the scroll fizzles- the High Cleric had set up a dimensional anchor when the Wizard began dimension shifting during combat.
The Scroll Fizzled. He didnt have spellcraft. He didnt know.The Cleric didnt have more invisibility spells prepared.No raise dead.
Hundreds of gnoll soldiers swarmed in.The castle was surrounded.The battle continued. They fought like desperate men. They fought like heroes. And they all died to a man.
Then they rerolled, and started a new campaign, in the aftermath.
Let them die, OP.
Let them die.
Anyone who's never had to reroll a new character will be afraid of losing a character. Break their death hymen, OP.
>>46282478
>they aren't very good roleplayers
How? The far, FAR more common problem roleplaying wise is people who refuse to ever retreat and have no self preservation because its 'just a game'.
>>46282223
What system do you use?
>>46282223
Faggots, the lots of them.
>>46282223
Players want the illusion of difficulty.
They want you to congratulate them for rolling high, and using the most basic of tactics.
Actual difficulty or providing them with any evidence that what they're fighting is easy, or that you're helping them is met with indignation.
Players are needy scum.
Well, when it comes to combat at least.
>>46283000
>turn a corner and see a room littered with rotten pieces of flesh and croken bones, in the middle of it an eye with a toothy maw and eyestalks hovers, one of the eyestalks notices you... What do you do?
I shall toss a hireling inside the room then wait andbeholdhow the monster reacts.
>>46282223
>Every time an enemy seems strong they are too scared to act.
>Why?
They probably don't know about your DMing style. Some DMs love to give their players nothing more than level appropriate challenges, meaning the hardest challenge they'll ever face is "needs some persistence and teamwork to take down". Other DMs want to create an organic world with creatures existing independent of the party's level, so every encounter can range from "the party fighter alone could do this blindfolded" to "before you can even draw your sword this enemy will tear you apart and send your brain into a torture-coma that lasts for centuries".
The problem is no objective means to size up an enemy in-character (there aren't "scouters" that give you their CR rating).
>>46282223
Either make a strong opponent shift into a golbin and make him change his form back after they defeated him, so the can see they killed a strong opponent, or put them in a position where they might loose their faces, if they choose not to fight.
>>46282223
>play character I love
>Fuck yeah, rip and tear barbarian
>refuse to retreat for almost any reason
>stand and fight to the death in 95% of cases with my humanoid meatgrinder
>when I think I'm outmatched have to stop myself and remind myself that I'm not thinking like a barbarian
It's scary as fug sometimes, but hella rewarding.
>>46282223
If you're a GM that will actually kill characters for being reckless, then they're going to be cautious about what they engage and just try to minimize encounters in general. Also if they're good roleplayers.. because who would realistically go engage monsters and risk death 'because it's there'?
What I'm saying is that the encounter existing isn't enough. They need some incentive to take on the risks. If something important is at stake they will fight or they'll face consequences of another nature.
>>46282223
>Every time an enemy seems strong they are too scared to act.
Because it's hard to convey the difference between a hard fight they're supposed to do, and an impossible fight that they're not supposed to do.
What the fuck sort of group is afraid of anything?
My group will insist on fighting shit the GM told us to run from on turn one.
>>46282579
>He doesn't know about the ethereal mummies made specifically to punish metagamers.
