Anyone else get the feeling that the Jedi where the true evil douchebags of the Galaxy?
Kinda like the Imperium in 40k except with lightsabers, less MUH EMPEROR speech and some hoods?
I mean... they fucking allow slavery and Hutts and drug trafficking and shit as long as they stay in power.
Palpatine at least made life better for Imperials.
>>44350502
>militant religious order
>takes children away from their families, indoctrinate them in the Jedi religion, and send them into the field to fight while they're still just teenagers
>persecutes anyone who adheres to a different interpretation of the Force
>tries to overthrow the lawfully elected chancellor of the Republic
The Jedi were space ISIS.
Palpatine did nothing wrong.
>>44350502
Didn't he hike taxes so much that he started turning whole world's into slums...
>>44350502
>Sheev
>not letting Hutts and other criminals do as they damn well pleased
It's hard for any one government to police all the inhabitable planets in the galaxy.
>In this thread: it's 1995 and all these jokes are original
/polonet/
I liked the way imperials look too anon. It doesn't mean you have to force youself into trying to make them not the bad guys.
>>44350626
Especially considering the fact that the Hutts are literally the law on dozens upon dozens of worlds.
They get to decide what's right and wrong, and billions of people live by their rules. They're almost as powerful as the Republic or the Empire. The Hutts and the criminals and the lawless people are always going to exist. You can't get rid of them, so there's not much point trying.
>>44350672
I genuinely liked the character. Funny but not annoying at all, imo.
>>44350502
From the way they were portrayed in the prequels, yeah I got a weird creepy cult vibe from the Jedi too. It should have been a semi-formal order of magical warriors, with only a loose association to each other based on a shared tradition of taking on apprentices (who would be force-sensitive adults that they meet in their travels). A New Hope seems to imply as much with the assertion that, when Obi Wan met Anakin, the latter was already an the best star pilot in the galaxy and a cunning warrior.
>>44350763
The Jedi sure didn't anyway. At least the empire has the excuse of being evil as fuck, whats the Jedi's reason?
>>44350812
>because its the right thing to do
dude's cool
>>44350899
I literally just said that.
Getting rid of the Hutts/Criminals is impossible.
Unless you're living in a utopia there's always going to be criminals, especially in a galaxy that big.
>>44350872
Yeah, I like they seem to be defaulting to that interpretation in the new movies as well.
>>44350502
>In E1 they don't think Anakin can be the chosen one but Quigon and eventually Obi wan do
>In E2 Obi wan doesn't think Anakin can be the chosen one but the Jedi do
>In E3 the Jedi don't think Anakin can be the chose one but Obi wan do
Dunno if douchebags, but they aren't consistent at all
>>44350599
Well, Sith are evil though, they just want to corrupt, enslave and rule the galaxy with iron fist. Just because Jedi are fanatical douchebags doesn't mean Sith are the good guys.
>>44350502
The more you learn about the History of the Jedi, the more they are the bad guy.
Everything started because they failed at least two genocides.
>>44350812
Best character in the movie, he has flaws and grows as a character, meanwhile Rey is perfect at everything (knows more about the falcon than even Han, super mechanic, super pilot, super hand to hand fighter, super Force user in like 5 secs, super lightsaber swordwomen, etc), srly, they overdid her character, one thing is making a strong female character like Furiosa, another is making her a fucking Mary Sue.
>>44351043
IMPERATOR Furiosa bloodbag
>>44350953
There is a big difference between not being able to totally get rid of criminals and not policing ones who act openly with no effort to hide what they do.
>>44351043
>vuvalini
>men ruined the world
>gotta save these women from old white men
I don't know man, I liked the movie but they could've been more subtle.
>>44351043
You're just mad the main character is a woman
>>44351105
The Hutts have a literal army. You can't police them, because they are essentially nations unto themselves. If you tried to crack down on them, you'd get open war in the streets of every major city in the galaxy.
They aren't just a mafia, they're dictators on a lot of worlds.
>>44351085
Shouldn't it be Imperatrix?
>>44351134
He just explained the difference between a strong female character and a mary sue, what is your problem?
>>44351134
Finn is a better main character and you know it.
The same way Han was better than Luke.
>>44351117
There is apparently a pirate faction controlled entirely by woman so its not like this hasn't happened before.
>>44351154
Its a gender neutral title.
>>44351043
i honestly disagree. she's not a sue, she makes mistakes all the time. she freaks out and runs away when she first touches the lightsaber.
>>44351171
Luke wasn't as skilled as Rey is though He had to learn.
>>44351199
Well yeah, but he was also kinda bland and whiny like Rey.
Luke was also a better character though, yes.
>>44351148
Like jedi are afraid of wars. The CIS wanted to leave the republic because of how corrupt it was and how harsh their taxes were but they had no problem fighting them.
>>44351117
I'm not talking about the movie, I'm talking about Furiosa's character, she has flaws, she is strong but without overdoing it, she needs help, she messes up, she gets beaten up but wins by her own merits, etc, meanwhile Rey never ever seems to feel like she's in danger, even when she gets captured she overpowers her captors fucking easily and escapes, srly, I rolled my eyes back a couple of times due how over the top perfect she was sometimes.
>>44351186
You sure about that? Because I'm pretty sure the 'tor' suffix in latin is an explicitly masculine one, with 'trix' as its feminine counterpart.
Hence dominator/dominatrix, gladiator/gladiatrix etc...
>>44351220
Yeah despite the whole subtext of the movie Furiosa seemed pretty believable.
I thought every character had their moment to shine and it seemed pretty nicely built without anyone hogging the spot light and going "LOOK AT PERFECT MEEE".
>>44351217
That was the Republics war. The Jedi were only involved because Palpatine created a situation where they had to be.
That's before going into the fact that the CIS was made up of a bunch of equally corrupt and violent dictators and corporate interests.
>>44351233
I think post apocalyptic cancer ridden Australians know their Latin a little better than some randomer on 4 chan.
>>44351171
Luke doesn't easily overpower his nemesis in the first movie though, he's actually very bad at stuff.
>>44351199
Luke didn't grow up fighting with a gaffi stick, he grew up using a blaster. You will notice during the final duel Rey is fighting like she's using a staff, with a lot more thrusts than swings.
>>44351217
>The CIS wanted to leave the republic because of how corrupt it was and how harsh their taxes were
This was the excuse, remember that the principle players in the CIS were Banking and Manufacturing and Trade guilds. They wanted to be unrestricted by Republic law. They were also the ones who were principally responsible for the corruption in the Senate.
>>44351250
Especially because Max saves her ass several times and literally beats her.
>>44351233
It's only modelled off of Latin. Languages are mutable, that's kind of why we aren't all still speaking Latin you dummy.
They also, y'know, call her Imperator in the movie.
>>44351276
His nemesis wasnt some half trained sithaboo either though.
>>44351233
Immortal Joe wore RAM on his chest as a badge of honor.
They called it Guzzoline and Acuacola. I don't think they're using the words properly.
Also, I never thought Gladiator had a gender denoting aspect. Thought it was a title.
>>44351276
Luke never fights his Nemesis. The only time him and Vader even intersect is in the trench run, where he is specifically trying to evade Vader so he can do a bombing run.
On that note, despite never flying a starfighter or any star craft before, Luke somehow showed up every experienced pilot the Rebels had and did what no one else could do. Why? Because DA FORCE.
>>44351307
It's actually "aquacola".
>>44351276
They didn't want to make Darth Vader seem weak in ANH though, while I'm almost 100% sure JJ wanted to make Kylo Ren seem like a little bitch kid by the end.
>>44351345
Yeah he was a skilled pilot. Rey was a skilled Pilot + more
>>44351296
That sithaboo could freeze blaster fire in midair, even if he was full emo at least give him the credit he deserves
>>44351105
On a lot of worlds, the Hutts are the government. When the Hutts demand a cut, it's not extortion, it's taxes. When they kill someone for lying to them, it's not a gang-killing, it's execution for treason. Drug-trafficking and slavery are just commerce for them. The question of putting a stop to crime on the Outer Rims and many of these places isn't a broken-windows policing, get tough on crime sort of thing, it's a de facto regime change question.
>>44351345
>despite never flying a starfighter or any star craft before
What's T16 then?
>>44351393
Yeah but he was no darth vader.
Rey seems like Anakin in Phantom Menace also known as mary sue of mary suest, at least Anakin in EII was more beliveable, even though it was annoying as fuck, he still failed at stuff.
>>44351345
>It's not impossible. I used to bullseye womp rats in my T-16 back home, they're not much bigger than two meters.
Well, I guess this isn't canon anymore.
>>44351493
This line always fucked me up.
>Womp-Rats are bigger than two metres
What the fuck? I get that George was American and probably didn't understand metric very well but used it because Sci-Fi. But like, holy shit, to metres is big dude.
>>44351426
Isn't it the speeder he sold in Mos Eisley?
>>44351493
that;s just tatooine talk for fucking jawas
>>44351538
Yeah, apparently it's made by the same company that makes X-Wings, and they use fairly similar parts/controls for some reason.
>>44351532
Or maybe womp rats just really are that big? Is it really that hard to believe?
Whats the best star wars game or star wars mod for a game?
>>44351577
I mean, sure, but why would they be A) called Womp Rats and b) that's horrifying.
>>44351532
Maybe womp rats are fucking massive? Considering you hunt them from a god damn space ship.
>>44351538
No, is actually a jet figher that can't go into space, still like flying on a F15
>>44351599
>but why would they be A) called Womp Rats
Why are Guinea Pigs called Guinea Pigs when they look nothing like Pigs?
>>44351599
Why is it called a koala bear when it isn't a bear?
Why is it called komodo dragon when it isn't a dragon?
Why is it called a whale shark when it isn't a whale?
>>44351633
Analogous food source.
>>44351619
forgot pic related
>>44351619
>>44351668
Where the fuck did Luke pilot that on Tattooine?
Shit, I thought it was the speeder or Luke was just talking out of his ass.
>>44351648
Why is it called Star Wars when there are no stars fighting?
>>44351648
it looks like one
it is
whale means big. it means big shark.
>>44351648
I would like to see you find a better candidate for dragonhood than a Komodo. They have a 90% kill rate and their only natural predator is other, bigger komodo dragons. They may have potentially wiped out a species of ten foot tall elephant.
>>44350502
The Jedi were supposed to be corrupt and atavistic by the time of the PT.
>>44351728
I dunno if corrupt, but they were full of themselves and stagnant as fuck, they also preached about stuff that they didn't understand.
>>44351345
>>44351426
>>44351493
This. There's a reason he wanted into the Imperial Flight Academy, and that's because he was already a damn good amateur pilot.
Considering how big the Empire is, they probably get a lot of washouts.
>>44351196
And as soon as it's actually important, she instantly grabs it and beats a trained fucking sith apprentice in a lightsaber duel.
If Rey had been a fanfiction character, she would have been a huge fucking Mary Sue and nobody would have hesitated to call her that.
>>44351677
He played with a model version of it in episode 4. Apparently he also owned one of the real thing, at least at one point.
>>44351788
Wasn't he just gut shot or something?
>>44351677
Deleted scenes with him and Biggs mention they piloted that shit several times, and they were pretty good at it to the point Biggs was about to enter the Imperial academy and Luke couldn't because uncle Owen is an ass and didn't let him.
>>44351800
>Apparently he also owned one of the real thing, at least at one point.
Not saying you're wrong, but HOW the fuck did he own it? Wouldn't his Uncle take it and sell it to invest in the farm?
>>44351825
Well they needed something to hunt womp rats with. Fuckers were bigger than two meters.
>>44351825
The same way Rey piloted other ships, but while Xwing uses the same instruments as a T16 so flying both is similar, Rey never ever piloted something like the Falcon (she says this in the movie) and suddenly she was an expert on it.
>>44351578
Jedi Knight III: Jedi Academy, with the Movie Battle II mod. Top quality class based objective multiplayer, with Star Wars classes and weapons. Would be better than Team Fortress if a AAA dev picked it up for a full release.
>>44350502
It's true that a lot of what goes on in the prequels clashes with our moral intuitions when examined even a little bit.
>CIS tries to split off from the Republic because the Republic is corrupt and ignores the Outer Rim
>This is apparently a morally clear enough situation for the jedi to involve themselves in and start a war over
>Conditioned army of sentient slave warriors, led by the jedi.
I get that they were "being controlled by the evil Darth Tyrannus" and all of that stuff, and in the EU the CIS is doing all sorts of heinous shit, but there's a lot of cognitive dissonance going on.
On top of that, I don't like the ethical assumptions of the Jedi in general. The Order as shown is very much into renunciation. Abstinence from extreme emotion, annihilation of the self, no marriage, no meeting your family, but by all means join wars and lead battalions and be an active part of politics.
>>44350602
Yes, but then it's explained that he needed to expand the Imperial Navy to fight the incomming Yuuzhan Vong invasion, which he knew was imminent and was preparing for. That's also the reason he needed the Death Stars.
It was no Disney villain "I want a big weapon thing". The galaxy really needed a battle station capable of such firepower so he could fight the incomming invasion.
>>44351825
Lot of junk around.
>>44351962
I'm not seeing the new one on principal, so I don't understand.
But, you're saying a lot of ships have similar control schemes? That makes sense I guess.
Seriously, how the fuck did Luke own a military fighter?
>>44351788
What this guy said -> >>44351809
Kylo was gut shot by an enraged Chewie after he killed Han. He then fought with Fin, who somehow held his own against (and even injured) a furious, if grievously injured Kylo. And as an anon said above, you can notice she's trying to fight with the lightsaber like it was a staff instead of a sword, because that's how she defended herself on Jakku. I'll agree with you that she took up the Force control necessarily quick, though. Maybe it's supposed to reference the fact that she'ssecretly Kylo's Twin Sister.
I'm more interested in how Fin was able to handle a lightsaber so well.
>>44351788
>grabs it and beats a trained fucking sith apprentice in a lightsaber duel.
A sith apprentice who was still an apprentice, and had been shot in both the gut and the thigh which severely crippled him, then had Finn stab him at least twice in different locations on his body. Even then, until she called upon the Force and finally tapped into it, she was still barely holding her own against him.
It was actually pretty fairly realistic. Neither one of them alone could have taken him fairly and at full strength, which was made very clear by him still being a serious threat up until the very end.
>>44350678
Thing is, not everything is black and white in this world anon.
Moral ambiguity is a thing.
Palpatine was pure evil, but if you bother to read the lore a bit, you'll realize the Jedi weren't saints either. They weren't above prostution, turning a blind eye to that that didn't bothered them, being corrupt when it suited them or just being assholes.
Palpatine was evil, but if you read the lore, you will know he enforced such things as order, written laws and brought law and order to crime infested planets.
The Sith originally weren't saturday morning evil bastards, the Jedi made them be so. Because for the Jedi, there can only be them, and nobody else. The Jedi where the ones who started pursecuting those that didn't agree with them or threatned their rise to power. The Siths became vicious and ruthless because they had to survive.
Ever wonder why all other Force using factions out there HATE the jedi?
>>44352064
On a world with rats over two meters in size, midgets in roaming fortresses, angry sand people and giant pit monsters what sane person wouldn't own a jet fighter?
>>44352064
Maybe he doesn't own it, maybe it was some friend's, maybe it was a part time job, etc, the thing is he piloted a similar fighter and even practiced shooting with it.
Also, even if it's military grade, is still a orbital fighter with only a small caliber blaster.
>>44350953
>Getting rid of the Hutts/Criminals is impossible.
Palpatine did that.
Not to a T. He put the Hutts on a leash and made sure they played by his game.
Notice how there are Imperials in Tattooine in IV and VI, and how in I, II, and III they say Hutt territory is not part of the Republic.
>>44352109
It's a sword that's how. A light as fuck, easy to wield sword.
The whole you have to be a jedi to use a lightsaber thing doesn't mean you need force powers to swing a laser pointer around. It means you have to be a jedi to be able to use one effectively in combat in a universe full of guns, lasers, robot armies, etc.
>>44350975
It is almost like their were living creatures with opinions that developed over the course of someone growing up and going from snot nosed slave boy to a knight that was chewing through placement tests and battles like Roseann through cake.
>>44352109
>I'm more interested in how Fin was able to handle a lightsaber so well.
As the Stormtroopers were raised from birth, they undoubtedly had training in close combat techniques, especially against lightsabers with the rise of the Jedi. The weapon used by the melee Stormtrooper who took on Fin was a pretty good example - it was somewhat awkward looking, but in a trained hand was extremely potent as it allowed for a wide variety of different approaches of attack for different foes.
>>44352149
>Ever wonder why all other Force using factions out there HATE the jedi?
Because shitty EU writers have chips on their shoulders. Good thing it's non-canon now.
>>44352191
In fairness hardly anyone ever really liked the jedi in universe.
>>44352109
After knowing regular stormtroopers are trained against lightsaber users I'm not surprised they also know how to use lightsabers.
>>44352109
>Maybe it's supposed to reference the fact that she's secretly Kylo's Twin Sister.
Fandom aside anon, you gotta realize this is the period where the "balance" in the Force is disrupted (The same amoung of Siths to Jedi), to more Force sensitive users are bound to pop up.
>>44352177
>It's a sword that's how. A light as fuck, easy to wield sword.
>The whole you have to be a jedi to use a lightsaber thing doesn't mean you need force powers to swing a laser pointer around. It means you have to be a jedi to be able to use one effectively in combat in a universe full of guns, lasers, robot armies, etc.
Technically, lightsabers are plasma swords, the length being controlled by a magnet that pulls it back. Hence it has weight and handles like a sword. A saber actually.
They talk about it in some books.
Anyway, I see your point.
>>44352179
>As the Stormtroopers were raised from birth, they undoubtedly had training in close combat techniques, especially against lightsabers with the rise of the Jedi.
>One nigga is known to wield a lightsaber
>He is on your side
>Waste time with anti-lightsaber training and weapons.
>>44352262
Might as well. Niggers still got vibroblades and shit.
>>44352109
They probably get CQC training at some point in their careers, I bet you this guy could've used that lightsaber just as well as Finn could.
>>44352262
Vader used to train Stormtroopers in lightsaber combat so he could have people to spar with.
He actually had an entire unit of clones (yes, clones) that he trained in lightsaber combat. They where his bodyguard company until they got wiped out because... well, the force and all.
>>44352300
I can't unsee that duck beak smiling
>>44352064
You do know that even the u.s used to let people by planes used in ww2 if they were just going to rust in air fields?
Now, this doesnt men you can go and by an f-16 now, just no one bothers with keeping a biplane(t-16) when the military is flying F-35's(tie fighters). No imagine that on a galaxy scale where you have creatures that digest things over a thousand years and worms that live in space.
>>44352300
What I don't understand is why he dropped his main weapons and decided to attack Finn with that electric baton.
>>44352327
Actually the US doesn't mind if you buy any plane.
You can buy a F-16 or a Su-64, as long as you get an authorization, and it passes inspection (as in, making sure you removed everything that lets it carry a gun).
Now, getting that authorization tho...
>>44352368
He wanted to do it manly style.
>>44352109
I would say her force combat augmenting would be close to what Obi Wan had in the EU.
Not so much that she was using the force, as the force was using her. She shut down and let it use her, which fed even more into Kylo's fear, as he was bouncing between fear and anger to fuel his powers.
He got a little too much fear and couldnt channel it effectively, giving the Rey the advantage in her fueled state.
>>44352177
It's still a fuckin' sword of pure goddamn energy. Imagine if that shit rebounded while fighting with Tray-Tor.
>>44352230
Just fuckin' around not, being serious about it. Though jokes aside, that's what the movie really wants to imply, at least to me. Han seemed to have some reaction when she told him her name.
>>44352319
> Vader used to train Stormtroopers in lightsaber combat so he could have people to spar with.
Why couldn't he spar with Palpatine? Surely the ol master wouldn't mind teaching the apprentice a thing or two.
Or spar with those red stormtrooper guys that carry staff lightsabers?
>>44352398
Because he felt like it.
>>44352319
> Vader used to train Stormtroopers in lightsaber combat so he could have people to spar with.
> so he could have people to spar with.
Vader must've been only lonely ass guy.
>>44352368
Overcome with rage at the sight of him, probably.
>>44350502
At least the Jedi didn't blow up entire planets.
>>44352372
Im not really that up to date about what is allowed to be sold atm.
When I had it explained to me, my uncle was buying old war planes while building the F-16 engines for the military.
>>44352412
If he sparred with Palpatine, it would most likely end in one trying to kill the other. The Sith have a thing where the apprentice is always trying to kill the other.
Besides, Palpatine would just SZZZZZZ Vader with his rays and Vader's suit would implode.
Kinda expensive to have your apprentice repaired and rebuild every sparring session.
>>44350502
>I mean... they fucking allow slavery and Hutts and drug trafficking and shit as long as they stay in power.
So you're arguing that a religious organization that does not exert a totalitarian ban on all things they deem unethical, throughout their sphere of influence, is evil?
They should encourage, influence, and persuade but, and please correct me if I'm wrong, it was never their place to enforce their morality upon all citizens of all worlds.
What's next?
Jedi's outlawing dancing?
>>44352433
>kill all the other Jedi
>nobody left to fight
>reduced to choking uppity officers at meetings
>can't even kill them because Tarkin is your boss
Vader's life was awful prior to the end of Episode IV.
Wasn't Darth Plagueis actually a decent dude? Kept those he loved from death, and I've heard that he actually wanted to bring balance to the force. He could have done some even bigger stuff if he wasn't killed in his sleep by Sidious. I wouldn't be surprised if he actually turned into a force ghost and taught Qui-Gon Jinn how to do the same.
>>44352603
Couple that with the fact that he could not sleep (suit was so heavy and uncomfortable that he could not lay down or sit for more than a few minutes), was in constant pain from his wounds, only had one hand and a few flabs of skin connecting him to the force, and was constantly being reminded that he had killed his own wife.
Vader didn't have much going for him.
>>44352658
Nigga used to steal life from others and use it to extend his own.
Any sweet nothings whispered into the ear of Anikin about his abilities should be measured by the fact Sidious is using it to seduce him. You dont sell snake oil while telling your customer that it is actually horse piss and squirrel semen.
>>44352658
>I wouldn't be surprised if he actually turned into a force ghost and taught Qui-Gon Jinn how to do the same.
It's implied as such.
> Wasn't Darth Plagueis actually a decent dude? Kept those he loved from death,
And to every other Sith out there, that means he is weak, thus why he died.
> I've heard that he actually wanted to bring balance to the force.
Balance to the force means either one of three things. Either increase the number of Dark Side users so they match the amoung of "Light" side users, or kill all the "Light" side users to match the number of Dark Side users. The latter is what Vader did and was prophetized to do.
The third option, is putting all this "Evil VS Good" nonsense aside, and convince the Sith and Jedi to realize that there is only one Force, and it encompases both Light and Dark, like everything in the world, and thus balance is achieved as the Force is recognized in it's entirety.
>>44352754
Which of those three options do you think Plagueis wanted to do?
>>44352818
Plagueis was more resonable than Sidious, but he was still kinda of an asshole.
Probably kill all the Jedi.
Plagueis was the one who made Anakin's prophecy btw. It's why Sidious wanted Anakin on his side so badly.
>>44352818
Likely recruiting dark side guys.
>>44352912
>Plagueis was the one who made Anakin's prophecy
>Plagueis was powerful enough that he could use the Force to influence the midi-chlorians to create life
Did Plagueis create Anakin?
>>44352977
>the clone and galactic civil war was all Plagueis trying to get out of paying child support to Schmi
>>44350812
Personally, I think he did a lot of stupid things. Granted, everyone else was dumb, but he sometimes takes the crown.
And fuck the Rey and Disney's mainstream "strong independent womin" wankery.
>>44352977
Will it blown your mind that I've read something that implies that Anakin was created due to some Sith/Jedi shennanigan?
I'm serious, I recall reading something along those lines, but it's buried in the deep vaults of wookiepedia.
>>44353286
Yes, yes it would. But that's sweet.
Even if the jedi were evil, that doesn't make the Empire good. A brutal dictatorship and rampant xenophobia that led the aliens to rebellion isn't much better.
>>44353286
>>44352977
Ah, here it is.
> During the Naboo crisis of 32 BBY, Plagueis and Palpatine became aware of Anakin Skywalker, a Human slave from Tatooine who stood at a convergence in the Force and who had been born around the same time that they had saturated the galaxy with the dark side a decade earlier. Plagueis became convinced that the midi-chlorians, unwilling to comply to his and Sidious's "unnatural" usurpation of the power of the Force, had struck back in retaliation, conceiving a savior to ultimately destroy the Sith: the prophesied Chosen One,[1] whom Plagueis had considered creating in the past.[10]
There was some weird Sith experiment that Sidious and Plagueis attempted, one that went horribly wrong and apparently disrupted the Force a lot.
Plagueis was convinced the Force had created Anakin "as response" to him meddling too much in the Force.
So yeah, he created Anakin in a certain way.
>>44353360
Whoooooa, that's pretty cool.
Can you link the page that you found that on?
>>44353459
>44353459
Long read
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Plagueis/Legends
>>44350502
This is the first time I've ever seen someone argue that the Jedi were evil because they DIDN'T conquer the galaxy, eliminating the sovereignty and cultures that opposed them.
>>44353462
>tmw you realized they finally linked canon articles first if they have one on wookiepedia
>>44353523
But they did eliminate cultures that opposed them.
It's simply that by the time Episode 1 rolls around, they have the status quo.
About 10.000 years earlier there was a Sith Empire that rivalled them, until they got a royal Jedi curbstomp.
The one people/culture the Jedi could never kil, no matter the status quo, were the Mandalorians , because they were too tough for that.
>>44350599
>tries to overthrow the lawfully elected chancellor of the Republic
Who was manipulating the galaxy into a Civil War he acted as puppeter to both sides of in order to secure his power as an Emperor. The Jedi knew about what Sith rule meant. They were justified in doing what was necessary to save the galaxy from it, and their only fault was that they failed, leading to a period of fear and oppression.
>>44351043
I thought this at first, but when I really thought about everything that happened in the movie, I changed my mind. She had been on a desert planet where she was a scavenger. Her specialty at this point in her life would be making junk that shouldn't work, work. She also presents at least some combat prowess already with that staff of hers.She's clearly had some sort of training at it. As for her beating Darth Getoutofmyroomdad, he was already shot in the fucking spleen and they're taking out a lot of the EU shit where Jedi could just heal themselves right up from that. She's fighting evenly with a guy who has been shot through the fucking stomach. That makes the fight make sense in my book.
>>44353607
Ok, so they're evil because they're pacifist negotiators except when dealing with a culture made up of literal baby eating monsters who unless stopped will destroy the very fabric of reality killing all life in the name of their death cult.
This makes total sense, yes.
Also, I've often hated how the australian aboriginals never once stopped the atlantic slave trade in the 17th century, wasting their time with meditation and dreams. Now I realize that they were the true evil all along.
>>44351697
>it looks like one
Um, no. Have you ever seen either of them?
>it is
it is what?
>whale means big. it means big shark.
lolwut. hey look a blue whale. it means blue big.
>>44350502
>Anyone else get the feeling that the Jedi where the true evil douchebags of the Galaxy?
Not really. Just another faction whose entire attitude is "We know what's best for everybody because we're space wizards and shit."
>Palpatine at least made life better for Imperials.
Not really. Doesn't apply if you were a non-human under Imperial rule - with a few noted exceptions (Thrawn, etc.)
>>44353797
Except the Sith Empire wasn't "evil".
They were a totallitarian regime, sure, and only those who were force sensitive could be called Siths, the rest were considered lower-class.
But if you go and read the Lore you will see they where just another government. Not entirelly evil. They didn't go around kidnapping kids or making blood sacrifices. They where brutal and cunning and cunning and brutal, but they weren't evil.
Except the Jedi kept fucking their shit. So they got medieval on their asses.
>>44350502
Don't compare the glorious Imperium of Man to those soft-ons.
>>44354118
To be fair, it actually WAS the Sith who struck first, both in Legends and in canon. That's the Hundred Years of Darkness.
In fact, nearly every war that's happened throughout the recorded galactic history post-Rakatan Infinite Empire was instigated by the Sith either directly or indirectly.
>>44352754
>Balance to the force means either one of three things. Either increase the number of Dark Side users so they match the amoung of "Light" side users, or kill all the "Light" side users to match the number of Dark Side users. The latter is what Vader did and was prophetized to do.The third option, is putting all this "Evil VS Good" nonsense aside, and convince the Sith and Jedi to realize that there is only one Force, and it encompases both Light and Dark, like everything in the world, and thus balance is achieved as the Force is recognized in it's entirety.
This balance thing always makes me laugh. The Jedi were so far up their arse they actually thought balance means no Sith only Jedi in a time when Jedi were dominating.
>>44352109
You can tell a lot about who's winning a sword fight by who's retreating and who's advancing. Until she called about the space magic she was on the retreat hard during that duel.
>>44352368
Balls of blasteel.
>>44351532
>>44351577
>>44351633
Have you SEEN the depictions of womp rats in Legends and the tie-in materials? The fuckers are like to rats what guinea pigs are to capybaras. The things look like tiger-sized wolf-rats. And they have a tendency towards gigantism when they get exposed to agricultural waste.
>>44352368
Because if you were trained in some kind of anti-lightersaber weapon and had to carry it around all the time even though there's no fucking jedis left you better believe you're going to jump at the chance to actually use the goddamn thing.
>>44352045
EU retcon bullshit that was never canon and is doubly non canon now, and you know it. Palpatine was an evil pyschopath, who literally gained strength from fear and misery, he didn't have an ulterior altruistic motive. He was perfectly willing to use those who did like Anakin though
>>44351697
>Thinks a Koala actually looks like a bear.
>Thinks Dragons are real.
>In what language does Whale mean Big?
I just...jesus. I think this post gave me AIDS.
>>44352754
>>44354244
This is never what bringing balance to the force meant, this is a fan meme. Bringing balance to the force meant he would repair the irreparable damage to the universe done by the Sith during the last ancient war
>>44354351
That and I figured he was DEEPLY pissed. He's in combat, he's probably roiding out and huge if he's the Giant Electric Mace guy, so he sees the traitor WITH A SABER, goes "AAHAHHTRJHRHRHRHHFHRHHTRHRHHRHHGHHGHDHDGHHBJHGJKFHGHGHT", and then places his bet all in with a berserker charge.
According to their own code of conduct, the Jedi were not supposed to be involved in galactic affairs, like monks. The only reason they keep getting called into these situations is that the Jedi are typically a neutral third party that everyone can agree on for issues of diplomacy.
Seriously, a big chunk of Episode II is hand-wringing over the fact that the Senate wants to make the order into front-like shock troopers in case of war against the Separatists, which the Jedi really don't want. Its not until the battle of Geonosis that the Jedi are forced into such a role.
>>44354186
As I recall, the majority of the Sith population was convinced that the Republic was about to invade them and that their attack was a preemptive strike against a legitimate threat.
>>44354609
Isn't that just Sith paranoia, though? Destroy things before they can destroy you, whether or not they meant to?
The more I learn about Star Wars the more the Darkside seems like some kind of idiot plague that grabs onto the weak so it can suicide bomb them into each other and the Jedi for fun.
>>44354704
From what I know of the monolithic Star Wars lore, an aspiring Sith leader, Naga Sadow, captured the first Republic exploration team to find the Sith homeworld, and convinced the people they were scouts coming to recon the inevitable invasion.
It is true that the Sith's warlike culture had a hand in convincing them that war was the inevitable result, however I still feel it's worth noting that they genuinely believed they were acting in self defense rather than starting a war for shits and giggles.
As for the dark side, I personally believe that so many Sith are little shits because the dark side comes easier to those without strong wills and who give into their emotions, while the light requires willpower and focus. As such a lot of dark siders are weak willed idiots with poor impulse control.
But if you play through ToR you can certainly meet plenty of Sith who could even be called objectively pretty good people, as well as Jedi who have fallen into the rut of being holier than thou knight templars.
>>44354787
Leaving out EU stuff where sith magic is inherently evil body decaying malice acid, this. The Jedi Path isn't necessarily morally superior, just lawful and more safe. Taken out of Lucas stupid hands, sith v Jedi is chaos vs law
>>44354787
True, yeah. It just seems like, in the end, there is literally no victory possible for the Sith, ever, because they will always make the violent move, always backstab, always betray, always give into impulse which is a stupendously bad idea, and basically just bubble and froth at the bottom of the Force forever to cause bullshit. It just seems like the dame thing happens every-single-TIME.
>>44350502
The Jedi are lazy and incompetent, as opposed to the Sith style of Evil and incompetent.
>>44355018
Is it possible for there to actually be a sane Force user? Like Luke seems to be? Because Jedi and Sith both seem like they don't really accomplish much but help start terrifying ultrawars.
>>44350599
>>takes children away from their families
I thought that was a choice made by both the child and the family?
>>44352300
Actually, I would not mind if they make film about this one trooper and how he crush filthy Resistance and traytor scum under his mighty stunbaton, not about stupid gurl and dumber nigger (seriously, Finn was pretty dumb most of the times). Hell, I wanted them to give just a little more spotlight and time beforeHan shot him first
>>44354977
This is effectively true and kind of the point. The sith way is self defeating because taken to its extreme conclusions everyone just murderfuckers each other. Whereas with the Jedi, their extreme conclusions is... Sitting around doing nothing particularly useful. Which is lame, but inherently less destructive.
>>44355066
/pol/ pls go
Finn was literally raised ONLY to be a soldier, from birth. He can only do one thing, and that is shoot people. You even bear him constantly complaining about NO one having blasters. Blasters is all he can do. He's a foot grunt
>>44351345
Sticking someone in the star wars setting who has never flown a ship into an X wing would be like sticking a 16 year old kid who has never driven into a honda civic.
Sticking someone in the star wars setting who has never flow a ship into the falcon would be like sitcking a 16 year old who has never driven into a semi truck.
Sure, you can coach and guide him but if you let a kid hop into a semi with 0 training and under the high stress situation of
>OMG FLY THIS LIKE AN ACE OR WE ALL GONNA DIE!!!!
they they will fuck shit up and die.
>>44355154
She grew up stripping ships like these for parts. Also, FORCE
>>44355090
Sure,he was soldier and soldier only, with no social skill or other whatsoever and making it up as far as he can go (actually I liked him for this) but sometimes he just don't use a common sense. Like everyone else in this movie.
>>44355198
So i can go down to mexico and find a kid who grew up in a chop shop and say here drive this better then anyone else out there?
>>44355090
You mean a janitor. Remember, he was from Sanitation.
>>44355198
why is 'Force' a bad thing
it was established to be some web between all living things, it does the whole Zen Master thing where you do things without knowing because you let a higher will guide you
>>44355198
Stripping not a driving one. It's like saying "I can eat fish so I can swim in water" with 0 experience in swimming whatsoever.
>>44355225
only if he is secretly a magical chosen one
>>44355225
If that kid has THE FORCE, which is described as literally unconsciously guiding your actions and also giving you split second precognisance? Probably.
The Force translates to PLOT FIAT essentially
>>44355233
That battle was his first. They probably have the new recruits do that type of shit until they get a little experience.
Kind of like how it went down in real life for the last few thousand years.
>>44355233
The order must be really desperate to send a janitor for a combat mission.
>>44355233
I think it's implied he was sanitation because he was shitty (hue) at his job. If you know anything about the modern service, latrine duty is nothing unusual for a trained marine, though usually reserved as a punishment detail because you pissed off your CO or something
>>44350502
Jedi vs. Sith is Law vs. Chaos not Good vs. Evil you ignorant slut.
>>44355295
His relationship with the shiny storm trooper seemed to imply she was constantly being an unrepentant bitch to him.
>>44355312
I mean it's the Empire, she gets a weekly paycheck with a bonus for the amount of Unnecessary Sadism she inflicted
>>44355312
Phasma? She's their duty officer and a captain. It is literally her job to be an unrelenting ass riding bitch. This maintains order and makes the slightly more slack squad level sgts more trustworthy
>>44355412
Right. Only in some cases that hurts more than it helps.
Especially if they where all brainwashed to be loyal. It's all about carrot and stick. You need to know when to give the carrot, and when to hit them with the stick. Imagine how much could have been averted if after the battle, she took Fin aside and gave him an ice cream cone and told him "Hey, not everybody feels comfortable killing loads of unarmed tribal, but we had to because they associated with the crazy genocidal Jedi. It was terrible, but we had to do it to find that one armed guy who blew up the death star. We really need to blame him for dragging all these civillians into it." Then put him on light duty for a bit, another easy mission like that where he can fuck up and it won't cause any damage, and if he fucks up, hit him with the stick.
I mean, damn.
So what is Snoke's deal? He just seems to be Palpatine 2.0.
>>44355412
>>44355333
>>44355312
I really want her to be a better character in the next movie, but I think she might just be gutted as anything more than a three line face because they marketed her then did nothing to her.
>>44355478
This would be how it would be handled by a logical military - well, maybe not that touchy feely - and Phasma DID note he was slotted for re-education... Who knows, maybe that's pleasant. But the Empire tends to treat its soldiers as tools, not men.
>>44355485
He is totally going to be Plaguas.
>>44355493
She probably died in trash chute or something.
The movie only would win if Troopers would shown not only as evul incompetent idiots, but as humans.
Then again, it's not would be good PR for a "good guy" kill ing a whole planet of human beings.
>>44354338
Should be:
"The things are to rats as capybaras are to guinea pigs."
You have to have the analogy going in the same direction on both sides.
Carry on the good fight, stormtrooper. The empire's propaganda department needs to remind its concerned citizens just how huge that hole was, which shows how reasonable it was that it blew up.
>>44355498
Yeah, my immediate feeling when I heard 're-education for a first time ever offense of having trouble murdering' was 'they are going to kill that boy so fast and hard he won't even have time to tell his face from the bottom of a boot.'
>>44355485
He is probably Darth Plageius, Palpatine's Master and Progenitor of the Skywalker line through magic force bullshit. He matches some concept art that has been thrown around online and even has the same lietmotif as when Palpatine tells his tale to Anikin. (Or so my friends claim)
>>44355676
It's the same song, you're friends aren't bullshitting you.
Remember, JJ is actually capable of good foreshadowing. Though his delivery can be wonky.
>>44355555
Yet he doesn't have a qualms and problems to kill his former colleagues and friends.
>>44355707
Probably because they all happily murder innocents and blow up entire goddamn planets.
>>44355707
He did see them gun down a bunch of women and children. Even if he isn't force sensitive, which I think he is, that would be a hard pill to swallow.
If I was a soldier, and my mates gunned down a bunch of unarmed women and children cowering in a circle, I would react in much the same way.
>>44355721
Eh, no one without flaws.
>>44355738
Mate, that isn't a flaw.
>>44355784
It is. It's a big, but a flaw and you can overcome it. I think they all good guys after duty, and totally not raping and boozing with criminals.
>>44355822
>>44351233
-tor isn't a latin noun ending.
>>44352220
that was something weird to me in the movie, there aren't any more lightsabers or force users (by the time of the movie) so why do they have a storm trooper weilding a lightsaber proof clubbing stick? Who's he supposed to use that on? the wimpy guy on their side?
>>44355918
They're probably riot weapons. A full hit from it knocked Finn back but didn't even knock him out.
>>44355918
I think it was for a killing Jedi at first and now using for a riot control because it's fucking effective one piece of equipment.
>>44352665
Vader... Had a hard life.
>>44354977
>>44355069
>The Sith were nothing but unorganized, backstabbing sons of bitches.
That was the whole point for the Rule of Two. Bane knew the Sith would never be able to exterminate the Jedi when they all had their own agendas to gain power. He tricked the Sith Brotherhood into killing themselves, and established the Rule of Two. There would only be one master, and an apprentice. The apprentice would eventually challenge the master, kill him, and take an apprentice of his own. This also allowed the two Sith to hide from the Jedi while plotting their ultimate downfall for centuries.
Sidious and Vader came the closest to successfully ending the Jedi Order once and for all. Almost all of the Jedi were purged, the citizens of the old republic turned empire saw them as traitors, they faded into myth and legend, and their history was nearly completely erased. Not even the Sith Triumvirate were this successful.
>>44355058
It's made evident in the movies that the Jedi have NO PROBLEMS with using their abilities to compromise the free will of others for their own convenience.
>>44355990
So much sand.
>>44352526
Underrated post keke
>>44355954
>They're probably riot weapons.
We have a wiener!
>>44351355
>>44351307
And "Immortan".
>>44356063
tl;dr Kylo Ren has a cracked kyber crystal in his lightsaber, which causes the energy it emits to become unstable (which explains the fiery/electrified effect). The cross guards on the saber act as vents for the excess energy.
>>44356216
People are asking about how Kylo Ren lost, but it's pretty obvious that even if he went around wasting trainee Jedi that he is NOT as badass as he thinks and wishes he is.
He's probably at best moderately more skilled then other young Force users and is just more immediately beefy because he's juicing on that Dark Side junk, but he's got less control, is less certain and assured of himself, and is wracked with enough self-doubt that it probably substantially hinders him.
He's a kid rebelling against daddy to be like his grandfather, a man who he never actually personally met and thus is emulating more by reputation.
He's dangerous yes, but if you want to put it in RPG-style terms Vader was a high-level badass with years of Jedi law enforcement and war experiences under his belt and 19 more years of being a Sith Lord.
Kylo Ren is what, in his early to mid-20's at the oldest?
>>44356521
According to SWSE Vader is like a 7th-level Jedi, 3rd-level Jedi Master, 5th-level Sith Lord.
I'd guess that Kylo Ren is barely a 7th-level Jedi on his own. Maybe with an Unleashed power or two because his telekinesis seems to be really strong.
>>44356521
>People are asking about how Kylo Ren lost
HE TOOK A DIRECT HIT FROM A FUCKING BOWCASTER!!! A shot a bowcaster is more deadly than a typical blaster. Even Han commented on it. They're the SW equivalent to shotguns in terms of firepower. There's even a shot of Ren bleeding all over the fucking snow! It's no wonder how a jedi noob whooped his ass, abeit barely. If he was at peak physical health, he would've easily had the upper hand, just like when Vader kicked Luke's ass in Episode V.
Only one other anon mentioned this in the entire thread. Why the fuck does everybody have selective memory when discussing this? I agree Rey is a Mary Sue, but you still have to evaluate all the facts.
>>44350502
>Anyone else get the feeling that the Jedi where the true evil douchebags of the Galaxy?
No, but that might be beause I don't acknowledge anything after Return of the Jedi as canon.
>>44355058
>I thought that was a choice made by both the child and the family?
Anniken "Are you an angel?" Skywalker was considered too old for Jedi training. He was what, 10 at most? Chances are that by prequel logic, Jedi are most likely craddle robbers. And not the good kind either.
I always felt like it was kind of Yoda's fault for "Sensing the future" about Anakin instead of just letting things play out.
Part of the reason Anakin turned to the dark side was the fear that Yoda put in his mind. The stress of saying, "Your little girlfriend's gonna die if you have babies" was what eventually caused all that stress for the both of them in the first place. Had Yoda not done that, and just let things happen naturally, wouldn't everything have just turned out fine?
>>44355903
Yes it is. It's used to turn another word - usually a verb but sometimes another noun - into a masculine agent noun. For example, gladiator is formed out of gladius + tor. -trix is the female equivalent, so imperatrix is indeed the proper Latin form to use for Furiosa.
I feel like people overlook Kylo's status during that final fight, like yeah it seems like they went over-the-top with how suddenly awesome Rey was, but Kylo was emotionally and physically beaten by that point. He thought doing what he did was making him stronger but he's consistently proven the parallel between him and Anakin, who's attempts to dive into the darkness feet first merely limited his true potential, is superficial at best.
Kylo's true potential as a force for good will always be superior to his potential for evil. So because he's chosen evil, he gimped himself.
The only difference is, Anakin managed to compensate. He made do with what he had at the time to be a seriously evil, bad motherfucker, regardless of what the universe planned, even with him killing the Emperor in the end. He committed some atrocities that scarred the galaxy for centuries to come. Kylo just isn't cut out for that bad mamba-jamba.
>>44356897
I know basically everything is just a plot-hole, but I like to think that the "futures" being predicted and playing out are merely incomplete pictures presented to characters like Yoda.
That at the time, the dark side was far stronger than the Jedi could imagine, because they're used to a physical, obvious threat presenting itself, but that kind of threat had taken a back burner for awhile.
Precognition isn't useful at all when all you can see of possible outcomes are the ones that the villain wants you to see.
>>44351578
KotOR 2. Just get the Restored Content mod so you actually get a finished game. And probably play KotOR 1 first so the story makes more sense.
>>44350502
>I mean... they fucking allow slavery and Hutts and drug trafficking and shit as long as they stay in power.
It's called respecting national sovereignty you twit.
>>44350502
Kotor 2 touches on the idea. Coincidentally, Kotor and Kotor 2 are the only good parts of the EU, and the only downside to Disney declaring all that shit non-canon. Also coincidentally, George Lucas hates Kotor 2 for being good and having any sort of depth. Lucas hates depth and mature story-telling of any sort.
>>44352394
I totally believe that she is Kilo's sister, they ripped off the whole Solo's kids thing in these books that I haven't read but know about
>>44352177
>easy to wield sword
Inform yourself before saying bullshit, most people know that Lighsabers are supposed to have a trong gyroscopic effect that make them hard to wield + a weightless blade is nigh impossible to wield for someone who has trained with normal weapons all of their life, at least without training. Sure, the force can help piloting ship or fighting, but it can't turn you into Edwin in a few seconds
>>44356063
>that last gun on the bottom right
NERF OR NOTHIN' GUISE
>>44352398
>>44352412
>>44352456
The reason why Vader didn't train with Palpatine is quite obvious.
Vader is the most masterfull in lightsaber combat of the two. If it was only a saber match, Vader would kill Palpatine in seconds and claim the mantle of Master. Who rule of two thing going on.
Why didn't he kill Palpatine then? Was he a pussy? No. The problem is that Vader was severely crippled and could not "tap" into the Force. He was mostly machine, only his right arm remained completely organical. While still a superb Force user (with says a lot about how powerfull he would be without the injuries), Palpatine gained the upper hand in this regard. Vader's made him super vulnerable against Force attacks, specially force lighting. There is no point saber fighting an enemy that can counter your Force manipulation and crush your mechanical lungs with his hands. Or fry your circuity with a flick of his hand.
Vader could've been the most powerfull Sith Lord, had Obi-Wan not turned him into barbecue. Vader still could do prodigious feats of Force using with his right arm, but he was limited still.
But in regards to lightsaber mastery, there was none on par with Vader.
Even before turning into a Sith, Anakin was said to be one of the best (but was lazy and didn't practice). After being encased in his armor (which prevented him from resting or sleeping), he could do nothing but train the only thing he could still do. And even then, the suit's design was so cumbersome and awkward, that Vader's range of motion and mobility was hindered, for instance, he could not raise his arms up past a certain degree, not extend them to his side to another, so long strokes or side strokes and most forms of attack where lost to him. And STILL, Vader learned to develop his own lightsaber technique that allowed him to overcome his opponents with brute strength, allow him to make power-attacks with flicks of his wrists and close the distance to neutralize the enemies reach advantage.
>>44357607
Vader didn't have an organic arm. Both his arms and legs were mechanical
>>44357734
He still had a stump.
The state of the glaxy in Episode VII confuses me. I think I've got it mostly right, but are there any glaring errors with this assessment?
>New Republic exists in the outer rim regions
>a weakened Galactic Empire still exists and controls the core regions
>the two are currently in a space Cold War, neither side wants a full-blown war because it'll be far too damaging for both of them
>a group of crazy fanatical Imperial people slipped off and formed the 'First Order' to hunt the Jedi to extinction while also fucking the Republic
>they aren't actually affiliated with the Empire I think?
>the New Republic also funds 'Resistance' cells in all of their systems to combat the First Order
>because the Republic doesn't want to do it themselves, I guess?
>>44352603
>>44352665
>Vader finds out his son is still alive
>Can barely contain his spaghetti at the chance to spend time with him
>Fuck, kid's good with a lightsaber and strong in the force too! He'll be a great sparring partner, this shit will be awesome!
>Make the whole "rule the galaxy together" speech
>a few minutes after son choses to jump into a bottomless pit than join him, Vader smacks his face
>He came on way too strong.
>>44350502
The Jedi Order of the Republic were completly retarded and made stupid decisions left and right while having no actual insight into the universe.
Honestly alot of this prolly comes from what a terrible writer Georgie-boy is and what he thought was a good idea for a plot, cribbing eastern philosophy but dumbing it down a shitton.
Things would be better off with no "Jedi" theocracy, no Sith assholes, Grey Jedi only.
>>44352045
Holy shit the EU was retarded.
>>44357607
There's no reason you should need your limbs to channel the force.
If you are actually super powerful in the force you could be a limbless torso and still just fly around and shit death everywhere, there's nothing physical about it.
>>44357607
Nice fanfic but:
1. Palpatine was better at lightsaber
2. All Anakin's limbs are mechanic
>>44358008
Palpatine a shit, and an incredibly lame ass villain. the EU and the prequels trying to hype up his OH SO BADASS POWERLEVELZ jus made it worse.
All that power didn't help him from being thrown down a shaft by a crippled man did it?
>>44354401
>Give a good reason for the act of villain, making it a multidimensional characters that is interesting.
>THIS IS WRONG THE VILLAIN IS A PSYCHOPATH NON CANNOOONNNN NOT CANNNNNNONNNN.
Whatever fucboy.
>>44358058
Is ok to dislike the precuels, but they're still canon
>>44358082
Except it is noncanon now? Like the majority of the EU.
>>44350502
The gray jedi is the good guy.
>>44358082
The reason was created *literally* decades after the fact, contradicted multiple other stories involving the character and just felt utterly contrived overall. It was a transparent attempt at pathos to seem edgy and cool by making the villain 'deep' and to shake things up. It's good to know some people eat that shit up so pathetically they fell for it.
>>44358124
Make sense, since it actually IS about balance in the force, unlike the Jedi "Only Sith Deal In Absolutes" Order and the Dick-Ass Sith Chaotic-Stupids.
>>44356025
The rule of two is pretty shaky, what if you are both on the same spaceship that suffers a freak reactor explosion?
Plus it seems like another case of writers having no sense of scale, in a galaxy of trillions of trillions with a plausible percentage of Jedi two assholes who are always on the verge of killing each other are supposed to be an equal threat?
This is like when they said the entire clone army numbered less than the armed forced of earth, that they had so few men they would have even been able to deploy about one per world of the galactic conflict
>>44358423
>The rule of two is pretty shaky, what if you are both on the same spaceship that suffers a freak reactor explosion?
That's an extreme outlier case, given how reliable tech seems to be unless it's been tweaked for better performance (ie the Falcon) or heavily damaged (see, half the ships in KotOR2).
Yes, the Rule of Two has some inherent weaknesses. Failing to account for odds that low isn't really among them.
>>44358461
The Rule of Two sith have to be lucky billions of times, their opponents only need them to be unlucky once.
>>44350502
When I was a kid it was always my understanding that the Jedi were neutral in all conflicts and only interfered if the conflict was to affect them in some way.
>>44358423
>Rule of two
>Canon wise Palpatine had 1001 inquisitors trained in the dark side
There never was a rule of two, that's just bullshit
>>44350502
>Anyone else get the feeling that the Jedi where the true evil douchebags of the Galaxy?
No OP, I'm sure you're the first person to ever have this incredibly original, groundbreaking idea.
>>44358484
Mostly they are ineffectual and swamped with religious bureaucracy, not exactly catholic since they let you have all the sex you want it just has to be empty and meaningless with any emotional intimacy involved being wrongbad.
>>44350502
The Jedi weren't the Space Police and they didn't have the numbers to be even if they'd wanted to. For the most part they only got involved in stuff when there was Force shenanigans going on, or someone specifically requested their help.
>>44350502
Retard, inconsistent, blind, easy to trick, etc? sure, evil? no.
>>44358475
That's also why they tend to stick to the shadows and back alleys, and only travel together in times of need (ie teaching a lesson, searching for knowledge).
>>44358484
Obi-Wan called the the guardians of peace and justice in the Old Republic. That's not exactly non-interfering.
>>44358490
The Inquisitors aren't Sith. Even in Legends they were never considered Sith (even after we discovered what Sith actually were). They're cultists working for the Sith.
>>44358490
Yeah but that was EU bullshit adding up over time, like the ridiculous escalation of powerlevels of both force powers and superweapon bullshit like the Sun Crusher.
>>44353642
The proper solution is to let your free press disseminate the information, and impeach the chancellor through the democratic process.
>>44358490
Palpatine never gave two shits about the Rule of Two, he trained multiple apprentices at the same time, and his goal after corrupting Luke was to gain immortality, dispose of Luke, and then rule over the Empire forever.
>>44358528
Sure, they aren't Sith in the paper, but they're in practice, they still know the Force, know the dark side and if the "two" die they can continue the tradition.
>prequel shit
>legends shit
>anything not the original trilogy
>pic related
