How the Warmaster stole Christmas editon.
HHG FAQ - http://pastebin.com/iUqNrrA8
HHG RULES - https://mega.nz/#F!pFgm0RKR!J06C1gVYcjzNGsF8YNLsjQ!EVh0GZZS
Previous thread >>44193090
I have the Betrayal at Carth bundle and I haven't build the Dreadnought yet, I am wondering, is it possible to equip the Betrayal at Carth Contemptor with two Forgeworld Assault Cannons or do I need to buy a Forgeworld Contemptor?
You'll need to cut off part of the BoC contemptor arm. I think it would be easiest cut the arm you don't want off at the point just below the shoulder mount. So on the arm you have the "shoulder pad" for lack of a better word. In this you have the upper portion of the arm that swings way and toward the torso. At the base of this part is the round mount for the elbow joint. Try cutting above the elbow.
Got 5 techmarines and 8 servitors, autilon Skorr, one vigilator, 15 beakies, 2 drop pods, 10 (9 actually as 2 have lightning claws) assault marines, and 3 dreads (with no arms). What can i add to make this a formidable list?
I'm thinking leviathan dread, a flyer of some kind, maybe a sicaran?
So should I have my tainted cultist swarm be 20 guys or 40?
They're just going to be a fun addition to a fluffy AL list
>>44229700
It looks like it would, but they don't sell the shoulders separately.
Better to just pick up a second BaC Contemptor (or just the arm) and make a quick weapon swap.
>>44229850
Arms to the dreads.
>>44229925
Wouldn't work any easier. The BaC arm is shoulder through gun, and only works as the right arm of the dread. Whether you buy an actual FW cannon or another BaC one, you'll have to cut the powerfist arm at the elbow so that you can attach a second cannon.
>>44230017
Easy, Zeke, Kyle are just fine without arms.
How would you lads go about making a Pale Nomads Great Crusade-era army? Still use the RG rules or someone else (Night Lords, maybe)? Luna Wolf allies?
>>44229700
If you have some cutting/gluing basic skills and two BaC contemptors you can make a Mortis.
>>44230237
Raven Guard rules I guess maybe with more emphasis on moritats and destroyer squads, I'd wait to see what the shattered legions rules actually look like as those may be more useful to make semi-renegade/unorthodox elements of the crusade/HH.
Still some more cleaning up and Green stuff work to do on my Great Crusade era Fulgrim
I dont know if I like the face, but im not sure im skilled enough to get it to look any better.
So how do you deal with Spartans?
>>44230565
Melta bombs. Most important squads can buy them in bulk for cheap.
>>44230603
It would be naive to expect Spartans without armoured ceramite.
>>44230653
You should read the rules before you play the game. Melta bombs aren't covered by AC in any way, shape, or form. Which is why they're a staple of every single 30k list.
An Imperial Fist list, made pre BaC boxset. Filled with the models I like while still been somewhat of a cohesive force. Looking for feedback on this 1850 list.
Sigismund
Contemptor Dreadnought
Twin Linked Volkite Culverin
Carapace Missile Launcher
Templar Brethren
5 Additional Brethren
10 Combat Shields
Solarite Power Gauntlet
Legion Tactical Squad
10 Additional Space Marines
Legion Vexilla
Legion Tactical Squad
10 Additional Space Marines
Legion Vexilla
Legion Tactical Support Squad
5 Melta Guns
Legion Sicaran
Heavy Bolter Sponsons
Legion Vindicator
Legion Heavy Support Squad
>>44230675
Honestly, I've been reading the 30k books front to back, but the last time I dug into the 40k book might've been 10 years ago. Aren't meltabombs S8 melta one use? I can't even seem to find them...
>>44230718
Pic related. Armored Ceramite negates the effect of the Melta special rule entirely, which means every single ranged weapon with Melta in the name.
Melta bombs, however, are different; they don't have the Melta rule, only Armorbane. So they bypass AC entirely.
>>44230856
So the actual answer is: meltabombs, chainfists, D weapons? Maybe a Cerberus (but it's ugly so meh).
The 'problem' with meltabombs and chainfists is that there is usually a very scary melee unit inside the spartan..
>>44230856
And the melta bomb in question, to clarify the lack of the Melta special rule.
>>44230947
Just take this and start nuking tanks.
>>44230947
Kraken penetrator missiles on the Lightning also work well.
>>44231088
Three S9 twin linked shots at BS4, that would make a dent. But you need to consider the fact that you're shaving off your own hull points, you're unable to move, and that the inevitable flare shield will be taking those shots down to S8. Why not just use a lascannon HSS instead?
>>44229700
The shoulders on the BaC one are attached to the arms. A simple cut at the bottom of the shoulder and you can attach a FW Assault Cannon.
What you shouldnt do is try to use a 2nd BaC Assault Cannon. Its offset a little bit for the right arm, and though you could hsmfist it onto the left arm, it wont look as good. If you're anything like me, it'll look like shit to you.
>>44230033
No, you cut the arm off at the bottom of the shoulder.
>>44231088
That thing sucks. I'd easily take it out by turn two at the latest if it were a threat to my list.
>>44231087
Thanks
>>44231088
>>44231147
Thanks, I'm not seeing the massive upside of standard s9 weapons though. Still need sixes to glance through a flare shield... And for nearly everything less tanky a relatively cheap and efficient Sicarian has plenty firepower.
>>44231145
Hmm, to be considered. Much bigger fan of Storm Eagles but yeah.
I'm thinking for a Word Bearers army. Maybe I could ally in one of those Bloodthirsters with the D weapon? I'm guessing a Gal Vorbak sergeant with a power fist for 6 str10 attacks could put a dent in av14 too.
>>44231346
Gal Vorbak with a power fist would be great - also remember the normal guys have Rending on their standard attacks, so they have a chance (1/18) to glance AV14.
>>44231087
Ok so I finally found this entry in the 40k book.
I can use krak and meltabombs on monstrous creatures? And on non-immobilised walkers? At full WS? Tell me it isn't true...
>>44230237
>>44230304
This. They are predators, liek the RG and will eventually become Carcharodons.
My Pale Nomads are cataphractii, Seekers, and Veteran Tacticals. Then it's all about tactics. They have very similar tactics to XIX proper, they're big difference comes from their cruelty, brutality, and disregard of civilians. Which you can't really translate into table top terms.
>>44231502
Yup. Only one attack per guy, no matter what, but it's very useful. I once had a marine kill a Great Unclean One with a krak grenade, though he died in the process. I fluffed it as having jumped down his throat with a belt of grenades.
So considering BaC is getting an expansion what are the best Daemons to ally with a largely melee focused Word Bearers army?
>>44232341
Tzeetch for cheese
>>44229656
>How the Warmaster stole Christmas editon.
Twas the night before Christmas, when all through the mist
Not a creature was stirring, not even a Fist
The stockings were hung by the chimney with care,
In hopes that Leman Russ soon would be there.
The children were nestled all snug in their beds,
While visions of flavoured corpse starch danced in their heads.
And Malcador with his staff, and I in my plate,
Had just settled our brains for a long winter’s respite.
When out on the lawn there arose such a clatter,
I sprang from the bed to see what was the matter.
Magnus, my son, appeared with a flash,
Frightened the populace with an almighty crash.
'Father!' He cried out 'Horus is fallen!'
'What?!' I triraded, all shouting and callin'
When, what to my maddening eyes should appear,
But a big-ass fleet, and seven Primarchs I fear.
In a moment, with Chainsword and gun
I knew in a moment 'Battery and Cannon.'
More rapid than eagles his coursers they came,
And he bombarded, and deployed, all was fire and flame!
"Now Sangy! Now, Jagahti! Now, Polux and Dorn!
On, Fulgrim On, Kurze! on Mortarion, Angron!
To the top of the Spire! To the top of the wall!
Now march on! March on! MARCH UPON ALL!"
As bombardments that before them wild astartes loot,
And macroncannon, and lance battery shoot.
So up to my palace-top my marines they fought,
With the warp full of deamons, and advantages were sought.
>>44232679
And then, for reasons unknown, as I heard from an aide
'Sire! The Vengeful Spirit's shields are a-fade!'
As I drew in my power, and conferred with my Son
Up toward the teleport we charged with a bound.
He was called all in scale, from his head to his foot,
And his skins were all tarnished with ashes and soot.
A wolf skin he had flung on his back,
And he looked like a God, just stood without tact.
His eyes-how they burned! His mind - what a will!
His face was like madness, his maul like an anvil!
His cruel little mouth was drawn up as a sneer
And the beard of his chin was black without peer.
The stump of The Angels head he held tight in his claw,
And his body slumped, I a moment too late, delayed by the War.
Tears sprang to my eyes and I fell to the floor.
That shook when he laughed, my grief now torn.
We duelled and fought, me and his-dammed-self
And I held back when I opposed him, in spite of myself!
A wink of his eye and a twist of his head,
Soon told me I had all to dread.
He spoke many a word, to turn me to the God's,
He ripped off my arm, then against all the odds
A lone guardsman entered the bridge
And defied Him and died, as you would slay a midge
I sprang to my feet, and to my powers I called upon
And away his soul died, and to you I leave a new dawn
And with a last breath I exclaim to the Imperium, bright:
"Happy Christmas to all, and to all a good-night!"
I've been asked by a friend to make him a 2k list of Iron warriors, where I have to include 3 Castellax, 6 Thalax, A Thanatar and 30 tacticals.
What do you think about the following? - He is after a list which makes use of "cool robots" but is still good.
Legion Astartes: CAD 1355 points
HQ: Legion Centurion with AA and consul Praevian and Power Weapon Axe (to match the Techmarine model he plans to use). + 3 Castellax with x3 Targeting array and Darkfire Cannon.
Elites: Contemptor-Mortis Dreadnought with Two Kheres Assault Cannons
A Legion Rapier Quadgun
A Legion 'Thud Gun'
Troops: Tactical squad with Rhino and Vexilla, Sergeant equipped with AA and a Power Sword (x3)
Legio Cybernetica: Allied Detatchment 640
HQ: Magos Dominus with Augury Scanner and Mechanicum Protectiva.
Troops: Mechanicum Thallax Cohort (x6) with Multi-Melta (he made one with a Multi-Melta on so have to take the upgrade).
Heavy Support: Thanatar-Cynis Siege-Automata with Targeting Array.
>>44232341
Please dont try to min-max in Horus Heresy bro. You'll either get ostracized by your meta, or drag it down with you.
This game is for fun, not to see how hard you can win.
>>44232974
As a dedicated Ad Mech (Taghmata) player, Thallax are trash. They have /never/ made they never make their points back and barely plink stuff.
>>44233450
Thallax aren't great, but if you use them correctly they can definitely make their points back. I usually deepstrike a small group of them with Ferrox and melta bombs near tanks or near objectives.
>>44233606
>>44233450
I'm sad since they look so cool and not sad because theyre so god damn expensive
>>44233450
They're far from unusable, but yeah. For ogryn with jetpacks they do tend to underperform.
>>44233910
Well, don't ever plan on playing Ordo Reductor since they're your only compulsory troop choice.
>>44233121
Just don't take Rotor Cannons.
![[Decimates internally].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/uLnDxqr.jpg "[Decimates internally].jpg")
>>44229656
Does anyone else feel the Iron Warriors are inconsistent?
Like the legion with the largest artillery reserves can't take any more artillery then normal, their RoW encourages spamming troops and havocs/tanks at the expense of Tyrants because of the impetus to fill out those heavy support choices and either spend some points on the troop squads else treat them as a 450 pts tax/objective squatters, the Primarch encourges spamming Tyrants/termies with the deepstiking and turn one reserve rolls, and gives out a really nasty buff (army wide furious charge is nothing to sneeze at), but neither of these synergize well with the Hammer of Olympia. Hell neither of their special characters actually synergyze well with "the Hammer" either, the bonuses are wasted on Golgs terminators, and despite being awesome Vhalen is very obviously a master of defense, what with his fortification buff, his enemy charge nerf, and his shooting buff to a unit in his deployment zone (side note, why the fuck can't the "warsmith" upgrade give some of these abilities, he costs 20 pts LESS then a identical praetor and has all his special abilities, including stubborn/shatter defences for being a Warsmith).
Don't take my whining the wrong way, I like the Iron Warriors, and on the table top they have some undeniable power, but the whole of the legion is not greater then the sum of its parts, the individual aspects of the legion don't synergize with each other. Perty is way better suited to leading a pride of the legion or orbital assault army, where he could potentially drop or outflank your entire army into the enemies lines on turn one then leading a Hammer of Olympia force, where nothing is going to be coming in from reserve, while that Hammer force wouldn't really benefit that much from Perty, or any of the special characters, if it just focused on Tanks, dreads, and rapid firing tacticles to make the most out of the buffs.
And don't even get me started on wrecker on krak grenades...
>>44234423
I guess in regards to Hammer of Olympia it doesnt come into its own until you have the points to spend on your troops and Heavies. At 3000 it is pretty decent, I have two full squads of marines with the extra cc and apothecaries plus a 10 man objective grabber with rhinos. The extra cc is nice when paired with the shoot and charge.
You still have plenty of points to dedicate then to your four heavy slots. You even have room for tyrants granted itll be tough to also get a full squad.
>>44234423
They're getting a new RoW and we're fairly sure it involves heavy artillery barrages and infantry advances.
So getting into HH and all my friends are mainly traitor legions which means it look like ill have to be loyal. Any good loyal legion for lots of mk4?
>>44234661
Ultras. Slap those bitch ass traitors down looking absolutely patrician as you do it.
>>44234661
Any Legion can be Traitors/Loyalists. Play whatever Legion you want. Granted, if you really want to use your Primarch stay away from the traditionally traitor Legions.
If you don't want anything to do with Traitors, I'd say either Salamanders or Iron Hands. Salamanders are super tough plus Vulkan and Cassian Dracos are nasty as fuck. Also Eternal Warrior on your standard Praetors is pretty nice.
Iron Hands get across the board -1S against them with shooting attacks. Also their RoW with Ferrus Manus is fun if you like running a lot of tanks.
>>44234697
Cool. The GW ultramarine upgrade sprue seems ok for shoulders but what mark is that head with the crest (the one shown on the model)
>>44234784
The red helmet is very fancy Mk VII.
>>44234784
For my Ultras i have
>Tacs in MK 2
>Breachers in MK 3
>Support and Heavy in MK IV
>Centurions in Mk V/VI
>Praetor in MK VII
What's the speculation for tomorrow's FW release? I'm guessing more shitty bundles.
>>44235294
Thousand Sons upgrade kit, and the new Leviathan dread weapon arm.
>>44235294
That's this evening isn't it?
>>44235423
>Timezones
>>44235339
Doubt the Leviathan dread weapon is coming out tomorrow. That's something they teased would be sold at the Warhammer 40th b-day event in February.
>>44234938
>Centurions in Mk V/VI
So your officers get the "lets slap some shit together" suits while all the better ones go to rank and file grunts?
>Praetor in MK VII
But that didn't come around until the Siege of Terra and Ultras weren't there.
>>44235604
Not that guy, but still.
>So your officers get the "lets slap some shit together" suits while all the better ones go to rank and file grunts?
What if he wants a force where those in a position of authority are the hardest fighters with the longest service history? Men that use plate repaired dozens upon dozens of times over centuries of service? Maybe his force adopted a Death Guard-esque mentality of battle wear to display prowess.
>But that didn't come around until the Siege of Terra and Ultras weren't there.
It's a big galaxy. Who's to say the Ultramarines didn't have ties with Forgeworld XYZ to produce prototype suits? What if a Mechanicum explorator fleet escaping the Martian Schism jumped to the Imperium Secundus, reasoning that it was the safest place to go?
30k is very well suited to forging a narrative. Why would you want to restrict yourself by adhering to what's published in the extremely limited reference material? It's a big galaxy, after all.
>>44235604
>But that didn't come around until the Siege of Terra and Ultras weren't there.
It's artificer armor, it makes perfect sense that armor developments that would become standardized among later marks would first have been seen in the custom battle plate worn by Legion officers.
>>44236735
>What if he wants a force where those in a position of authority are the hardest fighters with the longest service history? Men that use plate repaired dozens upon dozens of times over centuries of service? Maybe his force adopted a Death Guard-esque mentality of battle wear to display prowess.
What does that have to do with them wearing pretty much the shitties power armour variant?
>Why would you want to restrict yourself
You got 6 suit variants to play with. What other reason than "I just want to be different" is there to using a suit there's no record of being used outside of Terra during the end of the Heresy?
>>44237016
>It's artificer armor
Then don't call it Mk. VII.
>>44239719
>Then don't call it Mk. VII.
Then how will people understand what it looks like?
If it wasn't likely obvious, the secret HH book coming out on Christmas isPharosUM and IF versus NL on Sotha
>>44241059
Worst kept secret in GW history.
>>44241059
>BL
Who cares.
>>44241074
I'm guessing communication was missing somewhere considering they showed the cover art back during the 40k Open Day.
It's Friday, what do you think FW will be releasing?
>>44241534
And worst case, if FW doesn't release anything good, today Chinaman sure did!
>>44241565
It's on, along with some Red Scorpions stuff and Damocles Command Rhino.
Holy shit it finally happened the Thousand Sons got their upgrade sets !!
>>44242143
>>44241870
Huh. I really like their dark red color more than the metal version.
ok gonna face a friend, he'll bring sons of horus with motherfucking lupercal. I already know that I am fucked but I wanna put a fight.
3000 points iron warriors (pride of the legion)
>warsmith with arteficer armor, iron halo, void shield harness, paragon blade, combimelta, servoarms
>master of signal with arteficer armor
>8 tyrant siege terminators with 7 chainfists
>10 tank hunter veterans, 2 meltas, melta bombs, sergeant with power fist and combimelta, vexilia (they go inside the land raider)
>10 sniper veterans, 2 heavy bolters with suspensors and sharpnel bolts, vexilia and vox, sergeant with powerfist and combimelta, all inside of a rhino with tl bolter and dozer blade
>10 sniper veterans, 2 heavy bolters with suspensors and sharpnel bolts, vexilia and vox, sergeant with powerfist and combimelta, all inside of a rhino with tl bolter and dozer blade
>contemptor talon: 2 contemptors with assault cannon, chainfist and havoc missile launcher
>vindicator with dozer blade, armored ceramite, bolter
>10 iron havocs with missile launchers
>land raider phobos with sharpnel heavy bolter, lascannon sponsos, armored ceramite and dozer blade (tank hunter veterans go here)
I need to buy a spartan as soon as I can to fit terminators and praetor in, for now they'll stay outside, shoot down stuff and repair the vehicles
>>44242143
This is... disappointing actually. Wow.
>>44242204
You don't want to put the Tyrants in a Spartan. Any turn you're not shooting with them is a huge waste of their points.
>>44242359
can't expect TOO much out of the rank and file troops mang
>Just got the stuff I need to start my world eaters
>Find out I can't paint white for shit
>Can feel motivation dribbling away
>>44242668
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=it6sAE-YBDc&ab_channel=WarhammerTV
In duncan we trust
>>44242668
Simple green/dettol is your friend. Paint a squad. Strip all but one. Repaint. Compare your progress. It helps keep your spirits up as you practice.
>>44242668
spray shit white, use an airbrush if you have one. It's not all that easy but it's all about your undercoat and the quality of your paint/how much you thin it.
>>44242668
Prime white.
Take drybrush, dip in Ulthuan Grey.
Wipe paint off, drybrush model entirely in Ulthuan.
Wash recesses in Nuln, clean up with Ulthuan.
Edge highlight pure white.
Bawm, done.
Alternatively go with a brown wash to get a dirty feeling, apply spots of pure white and inside those spots a shiny metal to damage the armor, use pigments especially on legs to show lack of given fucks
>>44242771
Interesting technique... got any finished models to show?
>>44242738
>>44242759
>>44242767
>>44242771
Appreciate the tips lads. I had been trying to use forge worlds method of painting world eaters. It looked so easy I hadn't expected to fuck it up.
2500 point Alpha Legion list. Thoughts?
Armillus Dynat – 200 points
Headhunter Squad – 5X Headhunters – 175 points
Chaplain – Crozius, Plasma Pistol – 100 points
Tactical Veterans – 10X Veterans, 2X heavy bolter w/ Suspensor Webs, power dagger – 245 points
2X Tactical Squads – 20X marines, bolters – 500 points
Sicaran Battle Tank – Lascannon Sponsons – 175 points
Tactical Support – 5X marines, Volkite Calivers – 120 points
2X Rhinos – TL Bolters – 80 points
Seekers – 10X marines – 250 points
Contemptor – 2X CCW – Heavy Flamers– 195 points
Contemptor Mortis – 2X Lascannons – 185 points
Assault Marines –10X marines, 2 power swords, artificer armour– 280 points
>>44241870
>>44242143
>>44242359
>>44242359
Why are you dissapoint?
Helmets are cool imo.
>>44242909
contemptor mortis are far better when given ass cannons over las. 200 points is waaaaay to much for 2TL lascannon
>>44230342
Face looks good but that sword is shit
>>44230342
>>44243190
Not a fan of the sword either desu, nice project thought.
>>44241870
>>44242143
>tfw still waiting for Space Wolves
>>44242738
>>44242771
Is that really white enough for world eaters though?
>>44242359
Really, I think they look fine.
>>44242359
>>44242945
Honestly, it's the shoulders and chests.
I understand why the shoulders were simplified, so that you could do one unique shoulder + one generic shoulder as otherwise the kit would have required double the number of bits... but they're fine.
The chests really though. I hoped for... larger scarabs I guess? Scarabs are all over them in the artworks, even on the bog standard dudes.
The heads are generally an improvement, except for one of them. Overall I'm buying the hell out of them, I just thought they could have been a little more.
>>44242143
I really wonder how they got this metallic effect.
>>44243764
Either mettalic medium + red.
Or spray rub n buff first, then airbrush something like minitaire ghost ink.
It's basically Alpha Legion but in red.
>>44243776
I.. ehh, are those all GW paints? I haven't used GW paints in years desu
>>44243844
The FW team generally stick to Tamiya paints. The only Citadel products i've heard of them using are various technical paints. Washes, shades, effects, stuff like that.
>>44243870
I mostly use Vallejo, don't paint metals too often.
>>44243776
>>44243870
Probably tamiya silver with a coat of tamiya clear red. Add highlights and shades to taste.
>>44243870
Not true i asked them how they painted their Alpha Legion minis and this was their reply
hail citizen of the imperium!
You have chosen a fine detail to adorn on your battle Armour!I must warn you that the following concoction of paint to Armour is not for the faint of heart.
I have attached the required scheme you have asked for.
Have courage though and the emperor will reward you for your devotion to the brush.
It would be joyous to see your progress as you work through your ranks.
Thanks again
Alpha Legion
Undercoat with Chaos Black spray.
Armour:
Base – Stegadon Scale Green
Layer – Sotek Green
Wash – Drakenhof Nightshade (mixed 1/1 with Lahmian Medium)
Highlight – Temple Guard Blue
Wash – Druchii Violet (mixed 1/1 with Lahmian Medium)
Metal:
Base – Leadbelcher
Wash – Nuln Oil
Layer – Ironbreaker
Highlight – Runefang Steel
Hydra:
Base – Rakarth Flesh
Wash – Agrax Earthshade
Layer – Rakarth Flesh
Highlight – Palid Whych Flesh
Black Trim:
Base – Abaddon Black
Highlight – Dawnstone
Highlight – Administratum Grey
>>44243949
That's the non-metallic version. The metallic version was posted 2 threads ago.
>>44243949
That's the shitty non-metallic BaC version. Here's the metallic AL colors, from a few threads ago. Excuse the formatting.
ALPHA LEGION
1.AIRBRUSH WITH THINNED LEAD BELCHER/ IRON BREAKER (50/50 MIX) 2.AIRBRUSH FROM TOP OF MODEL WITH THINNED RUNFANG STEEL 3.MIX A LITTLE TAMIYA CLEAR GREEN WITH TAMIYA CLEAR BLUE (25/75 MIX) AND AIRBRUSH OVER THE MODEL IN 2 COATS 4.AIRBRUSH ARMOUR PANELS WITH TAMIYA CLEAR BLUE. BLENDING FROM MIDDLE OF FIGURE DOWN, SO THE STRONGEST BLUE COLOUR IS AT THE BOTTOM OF THE PANNELS 5.AIRBRUSH FROM THE MIDDLE UPWARDS WITH TAMIYA CLEAR GREEN 6.USING AN AIRBRUSH BLEND A HIGHLIGHT ON THE HIGHEST PANNELS (HEAD, SHOULDER PADS, TOP OF BACKPACK) WITH RUNEFANG STEEL WITH A TINY AMOUNT OF LOTHERN BLUE, EXTREMELY THINNED DOWN. 7.APPLY THINNED COAT OF TAMIYA CLEAR BLUE OVER THE HIGHLIGHT AND BLEND INTO THE SURROUNDING AREA. 8.USING A BLUE GLAZE, DRAG DOWN THE WHOLE MODEL ALLOWING IT TO SETTLE IN THE DEEPEST AREAS. SILVER – BASECOAT WITH LEADBELCHER WASH WITH NULN OIL HIGHLIGHT WITH LEADBELCHER IN STRIKING MOTIONS TO CREATED CHIPPED AND WEATHER APPEARANCE HIGHLIGHT WITH IRONBREAKER
>>44243912
Do Vallejo metallics suck in comparison to Citadel? I tried their Gunmetal Gray and was very dark, difficult to work with, and dried quickly on my palette. I usually use Vallejo but I was thinking about buying some Leadbelcher.
>>44244155
No clue, as I said I don't use gw, so can't compare. In my experience GW paints dry quickly in the bottle. If a paint dries quickly on my palette I can live with that.
>>44244148
Shitty ? I think the non metallic version looks much better than the shiny abortion which is the metallic version
>>44244155
GW metallic paints are quite good, I personally like Vallejo Air and Scale75 better. VMC colours can sometimes be inconsistent in my experience. Quite a lot of variation, which can be annoying.
>>44242522
is it good enough for the rest?
so I'm getting into 30k with an imperial fists armoured/mech army , how effective does this look as a rough draft. the two other legions I know of are Emperors children and Word Bearers
>HQ
Centurion champion
or legion Praetor
>Elites
Templar brethren for centurion in LR
either dreadnoughts or rapier squads
>troops
breacher squads in rhinos
or veteran tactical squads in rhinos (mix?)
recon squad
>fast attack
outriders
Lightning fighter
>Heavy Support
predator squadrons
sicarian MBT
>Lord of war
baneblade chassis vehicle (not sure which)
>>44245113
*I know of in my area
Ayy lmao the thousand sons symbol is fucking wrong on those pads, hahahaha
Can a Word Bearers HQ choice with the Burning Lore upgrade use Daemonology?
>>44241565
>still no AL upgrades
Okay
>>44241565
Fucking Chinaman. As soon as I have the money to place an order, he's managed to migrate again.
>>44245334
Alpha Legion Heads and torsos are on that list.
Is it acceptable to use Land Speeder Typhoons as Javelins? It is both easier on the eyes and on the wallet...
>>44243190
>>44243327
Well what do you suggest
That was the only 3rd party sword I could find that was near the right scale
>>44245708
They uh, hid from me quite well
Typical AL
>>44245229
Seems like a lot of the 40k players that bought BaC are planning to do Word Bearers/Daemon allies.
I expect to see an influx of grey marines in min-maxed lists trying to play HH.
guys plz, let's do some OC donut steel with the lost legions
how do the space wolf series with Ragnar Blackmane fit into this? Are they 30k?
>>44246763
They were apparently people WORSE than Kurze or Angron that the Emperor had Russ murder.
Not sure how you can end up being worse in the Emperor's books than all the kids he decided to keep.
>>44246814
They do not. They are not.
>>44246830
I figured they had either mutated horribly or just flat out refused to join the Emperor
>>44246830
maybe they weren't cisgender enough for the greatest toxic misogynist the fictionverse has ever known.
>>44246855
The Emperor let Sanguinius and Fulgrim hang around.
>>44246830
Not necessarily worse. Maybe they were just fucked up genetically. Sanguinius straight up says that he's afraid to reveal the Red Thirst to Big E because he doesn't want to be yet another Legion of mutants expunged from the history books. They obviously weren't traitors, since both were expunged long before the Heresy began.
>>44246837
Thanks. I'll steer clear.
>>44246868
>Sang and Fulgrimfags BTFO
>>44246869
We know that the genetic material of the Primarchs was absolutely vital for a legion to grow. Look at the Emperor's Children. They were all kinds of fucked up and extremely close to extinction before they were reunited with Fulgrim and were able to use his genetic material to stabilize their gene-seed and start making new marines.
Maybe the Lost Legions just didn't find their Primarchs in time. Maybe the genetic material of their Primarchs wasn't enough to stabilize the decline. Maybe it was corrupted in some way and a blind rush to utilize it sealed the fate of the 2nd and 11th.
What we DO know is that the lost Primarchs were discovered at some point, the novels have made that clear by discussing plinths with statues that were removed at some point. We know that they were expunged under completely different circumstances as "separate tragedies". We know that their crime, be it intentional or simply bad genetics, was abhorrent enough to force the remaining Primarchs to swear a vow of absolute secrecy.
>>44247027
True, but we also know that the Emperor had to call in Russ to deal with not just a Primarch, but a Legion. This implies that the Legion was delivered to the Primarch, but something was fucked up.
Actually, it could be a situation like Magnus, but unlike Magnus, a Primarch failed to help his legion's mutation, or didn't give a shit - that could be a reason Russ figures Magnus is sketchy, especially if the mutation in question was psyker based.
Other options are open rebellion against the Emperor (using the Legion, not just the grumpiness of like Angron), or maybe consorting with Xenos. Maybe one of the Primarchs went full tinfoil hat and went buddy-buddy with the Eldar because he listened to Eldrad, unlike Fulgrim.
This is gonna sound silly. But my anal retentiveness is preventing me from plotting a small force (just for fun you know?)
Do you guys stick with one set of armor? Or do you guys have a force with MKII, a force with MKIV, MKIII armor? Personally, I'm liking MKII, MKIII, they look a little bit more badass.
>>44247092
I don't think rebellion is a factor. The reason the HH is so overwhelming is because nobody expected a Legion to turn traitor. If there was a precedent, even one that they were forbidden to discuss, the other Primarchs would have had contingencies in place and wouldn't have blindly assumed everyone was loyal.
Look at Banestrike rounds. Developed in absolute secrecy because the idea of Astartes fighting Astartes was unthinkable, and designing ammunition for that scenario would have been seen as tantamount to treason.
>>44246735
Well, I'm certainly not coming from 40k. But I do think Word Bearers summoning Daemons and buffing their Gal Vorbak would be the fluffy thing to be doing.
>>44243949
Yeah don't bother with this recipe. The previous FW studio painter, Matt Kane had a better recipe using metallic base and then clear Tamiya Blue and Green.
>>44247163
That still doesn't explain Russ saying that he's fought Space Marines before, before he takes on the Thousand Sons. He seems to be experienced in it.
It is possible though that the legions he crushed never declared themselves traitor, but rather transgressed in ways the Emperor couldn't forgive.
>>44246875
Don't. King's Space Wolf Series Quadrilogy is one of the better series in the Black Library, and also include one of the first two novels they published.
>>44247273
Well, yeah. I really doubt they were traitors. They just did something that Daddy didn't like and were culled as a result. We'll just never know what they actually did.
I'd put my money on mutation, if Magnus and Sanguinius are anything to go by. Maybe the only reason Big E spared the 1KS is because he intended for Magnus to sit upon the golden throne, and that other mutant legions didn't factor in to his plans.
>>44247327
Well, it just needs to be a mutation worse than Sanguinius or Magnus. Or, as mentioned, that the Primarch refused or was unable to get his Legion's mutation under control.
The mention of dates in Massacre is interesting though.
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Two_unknown_legions#The_Horus_Heresy_Book_Two_-_Massacre
If I had to pick favourite head-canon reasons for them getting sanctioned, mutation, xeno-fuckery and tech-heresy would be up there.
>>44247312
okay, then I'll read them after I finish with the 30k stuff.
Want to get the horus heresy stuff out of the way before moving onto other WH books.
>>44247112
You can mix and match armour marks freely.
I'm using MkIII armour for my Heavy Support Squads, Calth MkIV for my troops so far.
>>44247423
Why would tech heresy be there?
>>44247685
Because they were discovered after the Treaty of Olympus and the unification of Mars and Terra. The union was rocky at first, with even the Fabricator General, ruler of Mars and the Mechanicum, seeing it as Terran dominance over Martian ambition. Maybe one of the lost legions got uppity and committed tech-heresy, intentionally or otherwise, by hoarding technological discoveries for themselves and had to be culled to keep Mars in line, and to prove that Terra held the treaty as sacred. Not even a Space Marine Legion would be allowed to ignore the terms.
>>44247879
The article about the legions from Lexicanum mention that the Ultramarine 2E dex says that it was likely that the missing legions fought for Horus during the beginning of the Heresy. Maybe due to bad Imperial record keeping the legions became "lost" in the sense that the records were destroyed by the Inquisition or something. The destroyed by Leman stuff is Inquisition revision.
>>44248103
Losing data on an entire 2 legions sounds pretty retarded, even by Administratum standards. Even if the average humans don't remember anything about them, and there's no hard data, there would at least be apocryphal statements by other Space Marines and Imperial Soldiers.
Plus, its weird to think that the 9 traitor legions are never seemingly portrayed as expunged, but the 2 lost ones are.
>>44248275
>Losing data on an entire 2 legions sounds pretty retarded, even by Administratum standards
The time after the Hersy was pretty hectic but now I see what's wrong with that idea.
>>44247423
What about the theory of them having failed? I remember a GW writer mentioning the two lost legions were just because GW was being unoriginal again and copying the idea of Lost Roman Legions, whose numbers were never filled in again after the Germans massacred them.
What if Russ's "executioner" role wasn't taking down a rogue or mis-stepped legion in full battle, but doing a ceremonial execution of Primarchs and their officers - the remaining troops being subsumed into other legions (see Ultramarines) - after the legion had a series of unsatisfactory results, or a horrifically shameful and embarrassing loss?
This would mean the legions were wiped as examples to the rest to not fuck up, and would explain why everyone seems more sad than angry about the lost primarchs.
>>44248338
I buy all of that except the Ultramarine part, which was refuted by the author.
So... There are some notable differences between the army list in book 1, the army list in the Legiones Astartes books (Isstvan campaign legions, Crusade army list), and the errata.
As far as I can tell the release order was HH1>errata>legiones astartes.
> HH1 Librarians go up to ML 3, errata don't mention them, CAL has them up to ML 2.
> HH1 legion specific terminators don't count towards Pride of the Legion, errata confirms and emphasises this, but CAL specifically states they do.
> HH1 Moritats are broken, errata fixes them, CAL has unchanged (broken) rules for Moritats.
I'm sure there's other stuff I haven't found yet but I'm confused about what is intended and what were copy/paste mistakes and such.
>>44248370
really? The Ultramarines didn't absorb the lost legions`?
>>44248338
The Teutoburg Forest thing was the brainchild of one man in the nineties, long before the current swathe of HH novels. I doubt that's still what they're going for.
Yeah, let's say they fucked up and were annihilated. Is that really so bad? Why on earth would there be a vow of absolute silence for that?
>>44248798
Maybe it was bad enough to make everyone who knows about it vomit in disgust? Like Nurgle and Slaanesh's self-portraits that they probably have hanging around.
>>44248850
But they aren't sad about it. If anything, the other Primarchs seem forlorn and distracted by how different things could have been with only slight changes.
"In the novel The Unremembered Empire, on Maccrage there is table and 21 chairs,built by the Primarch Roboute Guilliman himself for his brothers and the Emperor of Mankind.The chair backs were draped with banners,while the great seat,at the head of the long table was draped with pennant of Terra.Two of the other pennants were plain and made of bleached,un-dyed cloth.The other eighteen were the banners of Legiones Astartes.Also, Primarch Lion El'Jonson says ,that two of the Primarchs will never come,to which Guilliman replies: "Yet their absence must be marked.Places must be left for them.That is simply honor."."
So i have 5 marines left from BaC, do i make them veterans, seekers or devastators?
>>44249006
>devastators
You mean Heavy Support troops, surely?
Do you guys think that BL will ever explore the 2 unrevealed legions? Would you like them to do so?
Personally I doubt they'll ever touch the subject other than mention them vaguely every now and then but would like to have actual lore about them.
>>44249235
yeah, i couldn't remember the 30k name for them.
>>44249319
IIRC, that is one of the only hard rules BL has: do not give concrete information on the missing legions. They have no names, they have no lore, they have nothing but contradictory rumors and rapidly cut off memories. Personally, I prefer it that way, they'd never make anything that lived up to decades of suspense.
>>44249412
>>44249319
Frankly the only Information Id ever not got pissy about the missing legions is if they did something interesting that led to the discovery that the missing legions were quite actually plucked from existence and now have never existed except in the minds of exceptionally powerful individuals like Primarchs and the Emperor
Even that would be pushing it
>>44249319
The original intent, way back when, was for players to use the two lost legions to homebrew their own armies. That's where the Teutoburg Forest analogy comes from. They just didn't plan for 40k to continue to grow over the next thirty years after painting themselves in to a corner.
Current school of thought is that they should permanently be a mystery, which I prefer. We'll never know their names, what they accomplished, what caused their downfall. All we'll be given is small snippets of information, half-remembered, from entirely different and contradictory perspectives. Every new novel throws a new curveball. Guilliman honors their memory with empty chairs, Sanguinius is terrified of his legion being purged and expunged, Russ gives cryptic remarks about his involvement in their disappearances, Vulkan says the shame of their memory is almost too much to bear. And they're all sworn to a vow of absolute silence, so that's the best we're gonna get.
Expanding on the lost legions would be a serious mistake on the part of GW.
>>44248798
Propaganda. Space Marines are supposed to appear to be invincible and infallible. Lots of systems simply surrendered to Emps. There cant be a word breathed that a Space Marine Legion can get BTFO. And if its about sending a message - well, lots of the Primarchs were pretty vain. Being erased from history is a pretty big stick for most of them.
>>44248996
That's what I mean. Seeming more forlorn than "fuck those lost primarch guys"
>>44249607
I'm pretty sure the Primarchs understand that their men can be killed. I'm pretty sure that any random Space Marine understands that his buddies can die. Why would they be sworn to a vow of secrecy? This is 30k, not 40k; most Legions had little to no interaction with the common man short of murdering the uppity ones. That's some pretty shitty doublethink if they're indoctrinated to pretend that they can't actually die and that those two Legions can't have been killed because they never actually existed WOO YEAH GIT SUM XENOS.
>>44249660
I don't mean literally invincible, obviously. I mean that the Legions are supposed to appear to the non-Imperial humans of the galaxy as an inevitability - you can do what you like, but if you fight, they will win in the end. They cannot be bested in war.
>>44249716
I understand that. But that could be achieved by simply telling the Primarchs to make sure their Legions don't talk about defeats.
We're talking a vow of absolute secrecy. Brother Primarchs couldn't even talk about it in private - we've seen more than a few anecdotes about how they straight up refuse to talk about it because Big E told them not to, even if they're the only two people in the room. That sounds like something much bigger than just trying to present an aura of invincibility to people that they're probably never going to interact with in the first place.
>>44248374
It's HH1>CAL>Errata.
>>44249927
Wait, HH1 trumps errata?
>>44250017
No, that's the order in which they were released.
>>44248374
>>44249927
They aren't "greater-than" signs its arrows that infer order of succession
Also to use "greater than": Errata>Everything else
>>44250017
Please actually read. The first anon thought the release order was
>HH1>Errata>CAL
Which is stupid enough, since the download page has a 'Last Edited' date for all errata.
>>44250144
>>44250125
>>44250094
>>44250017
>>44249927 anon here. To be clear it would be HH->HH1 Errata & FAQ->CAL->HH 7th Ed. FAQ and Errata.
>>44249767
Fair enough. I mean, this isn't even taking into account reasons for defeat - it could be a case of "so shameful, the Emperor doesn't want it ever mentioned", and his sons follow his wishes here. If we go by the Teutonberg Forest example again, remember how absolutely devastated even years later Augustus was.
I mean, it is a kooky theory, but I'm weaving it out as far as it'll go.
>>44250144
>>44250183
YEs yes, but the HH1 errata states that legion specific elite terminators do not count for Pride of the legion. Then CAL says they do. 7th edition errata don't mention it.
So which is it?...
>>44250330
The most recent entry is always the correct entry. So in this case CAL is correct, you can take legion specific terminators in a PotL list.
>>44250330
Are you new to 40k or something? Look at the progression:
>HH1->HH1 Errata & FAQ->CAL->HH 7th Ed. FAQ and Errata
If it says in CAL that Elite Terminators count and doesn't mention anything else in the 7th ed Errata, then you stick with what the ruling is in CAL.
>>44250330
Quoting 1d4, but the tactics sections are all up to date.
"Veterans and Terminators (including Legion-specific Elite Terminators) become compulsory Troops, and Command Squads can take a Land Raider Phobos or Proteus. However, if all Veteran and Terminator squads are destroyed, the enemy counts as having scored an additional secondary objective, and you can't take an allied detachment. This is the only one that allows a fortification...but you have Terminator troops, so you don't really care."
>>44250383
nah, I just cherrypick whatever works best in my favor. no one really bothers asking for proof, they just look at my printed sheet of errata and go ?oh ok
teehee
>>44249767
Fo sho.
Greatest mystery along with harrowing.
>>44250382
Then I am really wondering why we aren't seeing more people spamming lists with Tyrants or Firedrakes as troops...
>>44250431
Any game over 2000 is where people start to run their Legion Specific RoW. PotL is mainly for people who don't have enough stuff to run a decent 30k army.
>>44250514
I don't know dude... With one RoW you can assault after rapid firing, get extra armour for free, and need 3 compulsory troops. In the other you get Tyrants as troops and you wouldn't be sad if it required 6 compulsory troop choices...
The Salamanders have a slightly more interesting RoW but Firedrakes are very good...
>>44250661
Tyrants are expensive as fuck points-wise. I wouldn't spam them. Besides if you're the type of player who needs to spam anything in 30k, this game isn't for you. Stick to 40k.
>>44250688
I strongly believe in taking at least 2 of everything I like a lot, whether it is cool or good.
>>44250688
To be fair, you do kind of need to spam a fair bit of troops, most RoWs require you to take 3 troops of one type or another. But I certainly understand what you mean.
>>44250144
>Please actually read.
I did. But thought anon was looking for what source has the most up to date info and that you were indicating the priority of info.
>>44250431
Because theyre expensive as fuck in points and in the game of massed infantry being elite and outnumbered isnt so hot unless you bring an unkillable deathstart unit to fuck shit up.
>>44250922
Isn't that exactly what's fun about it? Fuck having an unkillable deathstar unit that ruins the game for everyone. I'd rather spend a lot of points on a small elite force because I think the models are cool.
>>44251020
Go for it then, might be a boring army with a bunch of termies footslogging it and shooting but if thats up your alley then do it. Go gunline termies go!.
I personally love veteran tacticals, 10 guys with BS5 and rending in a rhino is awesome.
>>44250431
PotL is for newer players, primarily. Extremely low model count and an emphasis on veterans with equipment shared by 40k means most people can repurpose a large section of their old SM armies from the word go.
>>44250514
Pride can be very interesting for certain legions, like fists who can field squads of BS5 dudes with rending bolters, or IW who, with Perty, can start deepstriking and outflanking Tyrants (who now score) and vets turn 1
If the Emps was able to fully realise the Great Crusade and the Horus Heresy never happened, what would've been tge fate of the Astartes?
I don't see them as being able to be culled like the Thunder Warriors were. Especially with having leaders like the Primarchs.
>>44251883
Same thing they do now, strike down rebellions/cults and kill xenos.
>>44251072
Vet tacs dont have BS5...
>>44251999
>Not being a true son of Dorn.
As expected of reverse-satan.
>>44251883
Big E always intended for humanity to rule. The Astartes, whilst less disposable than the Thunder Warriors, were still nothing more than a means to an end. Guilliman and Sanguinius and Vulkan were obviously designed to be able to rule with a strong sense of honor and an infalliable code of ethics, but they were still just weapons at the end of the day and would have struggled to find a place within a pacified galaxy where humanity is utterly dominant.
If I had to guess, i'd say that they'd have been used much the same way they are now. Elite rapid reaction forces to deal with xenos and rebellions.
>>44242668
I have been moving ahead with my World Eaters, but fuck me its lots of work.
Prime Black
Grey 45 degree spay for shading
White smooth spray mostly from above
Agrax Earthshade in recesses for dirty look
white highlights/edging everywhere!
Details and metals as you prefer
Takes a while and you NEED and airbrush but I think its coming along ok
>>44251911
>>44252086
I could also see some of them disappearing far beyond Imperial space.
I think a few of the Legions would suit peace. I think the Iron Warriors would actually enjoy being given the opportunity to be builders.
>>44251072
How do you reckon you're getting the Rending? don't you need to have bolter submunitions for that? And those only come on Seeker squads.
>>44252257
It sounds like they're getting the two confused.
>>44252257
Ah shit, forgot Sniper doesnt have rending anymore. My bad, meant AP2 on a 6, which is like almost rending.
>>44234222
Trips demand we make it so!
>>44252378
For real. When are rotor cannons going to get reworked? As it stands, the only way they're ever acceptable is in Survivors of a Dark Age M&C list.
>>44252537
Aren't they like gatling heavy stubbers? So why aren't they S4?
>>44252537
>>44252609
What if we bumped the strength to 4 and added suspensor web as standard? Yes or no?
>>44252668
I don't think it needs it. If it was just S4, a support squad of 10 could pump out 40 S4 shots at 30". That's the same as a full tactical squad plus 6" more range. And on the move it's still 30 shots to 15" (rotor cannon was 3/4, right).
>>44252537
You know what? They could just give tactical squads the option to switch bolters for rotor cannons, massed S3 shots can be a good alternative there.
>>44252804
Well, I think that would be fine. Support squads are better than tacs anyways.
My thought was to keep them the same, except add suspensors standard and any to hit of 6 makes the attack s6
>>44245113
Post up all the upgrades and shit you're taking and all, you're more likely to get responses
>>44252668
Right now they're 30" S3, AP6, Salvo 3/4. In M&C with the right provenance grenadiers can bump that up to S4.
I genuinely have no idea how to fix it. They kind of work at S4 in M&C because they're priced accordingly. The provenance is 75 points. It forces you to take grenadiers as compulsory troops, which is expensive. And the +S upgrade itself is 20 points, with the provision that all squads of that type have to be upgraded. And even after spending all of that dosh, rotor cannons are 10 points each and you can only take two per squad.
How do we make them viable in a Legion list without fucking up M&C?
>>44250741
One of anything is a target, two is a tactic and three is a stratagem
>>44252907
Astartes pattern rotor cannons.
They get a beefier statline
>>44252907
Make them S4 for both. Then SotDA can get S5 rotor cannons.
>>44252966
Idk, that might be a little much is all
>>44252537
When Destroyers get a price cut, kakophani get reworked, IW get something other then wrecker on krak grenades, and the guy who wrote the Justaerin rules get buried in a shallow grave
>>44252966
Right now they're ten points, same as heavy stubbers. I guess you could bump them up to fifteen or twenty with +1S, but then they'd be either the same price as, or more expensive than, melta and plasma. And i'm pretty sure people would rather have AP2 plasma than 3/4 S5 AP6 shots.
It requires a gentle touch, and I think +1S is too much.
>>44252992
Grenadiers can only get 2. Hardly game breaking.
>>44253044
Rotor cannons on grenadiers don't do much more than just add to the general firepower of the squad, and because they're Salvo, they make the squad more stationary. Meltas, plasma and grenade launchers offer a wide variety of fire power options. S4 rotor cannon wouldn't offer anything other than 1 shot more over the stubber with a 6" reduction in range and a 21" reduction on the move.
On Marine support squads regular tacticals offer the same amounts of S4 fire power and other weapon options are still perfectly usable.
>>44252907
IIRC special support squads actually pay points for Rotors to replace flamers. Flamers are not weaker weapons than Rotor Cannons. Flamers have S and some extra AP, can ignore cover, have a great overwatch, better hit count potential, guarantee accuracy and can shoot and charge. Rotor cannons have a baseline better shot baseline, albeit not much even while static, and have more range. That's it. So just making them cheaper than marine seems to hit the spot.
Outriders with 25pt Rotor Cannons could go down alright.
>>44252907
>How do we make them viable in a Legion list without fucking up M&C?
Let the tactical legionaries exchange their flamers for rotor cannons at no cost, rotor cannons being priced the same as both the volkite options is just ludicrous, and give them the option to buy those mechanicum bio-corrosive rounds at a set cost per squad (like 25 or 50 points), and then either give the squad suspensor webs or just have these ones not modify the range. Alternatively just make them all str 4 across the board as some have suggested, or make the space marine ones something like "Special up gunned Astartes only cannons" that fire larger bullets to the regular cannons, as was done with the division between space marine and regular shotguns.
>>44253015
Don't forget champions
>>44253174
Honestly there's a bunch of little things that could do with reworking. Honestly I'm surprised what we got was so good, and the problems are so small most of the time. Excluding the four isstvan 3 legions. Tbh I think night lords represent soh better than soh rn. That or alpha legion
>>44253174
And Warders, recon squads, regular dreads, Rampagers ...
So, now there are some TS kits out I am thinking of taking the opportunity and making some. I'm thinking of using the word bearers rules and fielding some gal vorbak to represent the flesh-change, which was rampant before Magnus was found. Can also use fit a bunch of psykers in at HQ that way.
Thoughts?
>>44252189
If not disappearing, I can see them being put on the edges in a big circle around the domains of Man, keeping an eye on the halo stars.
Might be fun to imagine how the Tyranid invasion would go with that set up.
>>44253264
Wait for their rules, Im sure they'll have like psyker praetors and shit like that.
>>44253325
Yes, clearly... but the rules won't be here for a year or so and I figured it fitting to represent them in a mutated state before Magnus got there. Some real life continuity to go with lore continuity.
Plus the generic legion rules bore me to tears.
>>44253235
I think the fists and the IW need a bit of touching up, Warder cost and wrecker and all, but I will agree, there are certainly plenty of dud or at the very least below average units, but competition within certain FoC slots seems to be pretty competitive and in lists its driven more by what you think would be cool doing a particular job and what the theme of a particular list is instead of what is objectively the best for the job.
Everyone is going to have their own petty niggles, and we can all hope that FW frequents these threads for feedback on their products, but overall the game is literally OK.
>>44251883
If I recall correctly, the first so many HH books bring this up at times. I think for some of the Primarchs like Horus it was a worry while others like Magnus were already preparing their Legions, Ahriman looking into producing wine.
While we're roughly taking about special weapons and upgrades, how much would we charge as a block cost for tactical squads to:
- improve the S of Boltguns to 5?
- grant Boltguns Shred?
>>44251883
I remember reading in some older fluff that they were suppose to end up as garrison force, phased out as the Crusade progressed and being replaced with regular human forces once they get their ranks in order.
Like others have said, they were intended merely as weapons to fight the Great Crusade. Even Girlyman was adamant that Marines were not to rule, which is why they have no High Lord or anything. Though I seem to remember some legions not being happy being reduced to just glorified guards. Possible a rebellion could have happened regardless.
>>44253951
50-100pts per squad, because fury of the legion with either of those things sounds nasty as fuck, like eldar tier nasty.
>>44253951
I think that's taking it a bit too far
Maybe Dangels or Wolf wargear
I just threw together a quick 1500 point M&C list for a somewhat fluffy allied detachment. I can strip out the Malcador and Ogryns to bring it to 1k if I throw in a few more medicae. Mostly interested in modeling opportunities, but i'll be playing with it so some feedback would be neat.
1500 M&C - Grenadiers
WT: Marcher Lord
HQ:
Force Commander - Augmented Weapon, Bolt Pistol, Carapace Armor, Iron Halo, Cyber Familiar, Digital Laser, Planetary Overlord - 235
The Muster of Worlds - Survivors of a Dark Age, Warrior Elite - 125
Platoon Command Cadre - Augmented Weapon, Bolt Pistol, Refractor Field, 7x Bodyguard, Carapace Armor, Boltguns, Advanced Weapons - 109
Elites:
Medicae Detachment - 4x Medicae Orderly - 50
Ogryn Brute Squad - Carapace Armor, 3x Heavy Bolter - 190
Troops:
Grenadier Squad - 17x Grenadier, 2x Rotor Cannon Grenadier, Lasrifles, Vexilla, Advanced Weapons - 170
Grenadier Squad - 17x Grenadier, 2x Rotor Cannon Grenadier, Lasrifles, Vexilla, Advanced Weapons - 170
Grenadier Squad - 17x Grenadier, 2x Rotor Cannon Grenadier, Lasrifles, Vexilla, Advanced Weapons - 170
Fast Attack:
Sentinel Scout Squadron - 3x Multi-Melta - 105
Heavy Support:
Malcador Heavy Tank - Armored Ceramite, Flare Shield, Siege Armor, 1x Multi-Laser - 300
>>44254024
>Though I seem to remember some legions not being happy being reduced to just glorified guards.
This is also present in the early HH books, some of the Primarchs, including Horus, not being too happy about the fact that the galaxy they had fought for would not be theirs to rule and instead was being given over to mere humans.
Ayy
>>44243330
>look like homeless people
>sleep with dogs
>accessorise with road kill
>noble astartes
Bless your hearts, SW Players.
>>44253173
That's pretty good. Fund it.
>>44254883
I kind of like the white on the bolters.
>>44255557
It really does look good. I love where GW went with the Iron Hands.
>>44255643
That's where I was going with my IH legion scheme. Though I also got a black metallic for the armor
How do you guys use your command squads? Ive been thinking of doing a consul delegatus with 2 plasma pistols in a command squad with 4 combi-plasmas.
>>44257100
Full squad in a Phobos with combat shields and power weapons does well with any character. Apothecaries also add to the survivability
>>44257761
Who actually has/will go out and buy/recast a Phobos, other than Phobos fans.
Like, when have you EVER met a 30k player who was like "oh yeah I've got a Phobos lying around".
>>44257761
Wait, scratch that I was thinking of the Proteus.
pls r8, 3k hammer of olympia, this is like, half list building and half shopping list
>>44260315
+++ BREAK THEIR RANKS (3000pts) +++
++ Legiones Astartes: Crusade Army List (Age of Darkness) ++
+ HQ +
Legion Centurion [Cataphractii Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon, Chainfist, Phosphex Bombs]
····Consul [Siege Breaker]
Legion Praetor [Cataphractii Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon, Digital Lasers, Mastercraft a Single Weapon, Paragon Blade, The Blind Helm of the Black Judges]
····Master of the Legion [The Hammer of Olympia]
+ Troops +
Legion Tactical Squad [19x Legion Tactical Space Marines, Legion Vexilla, Nuncio-Vox]
Legion Tactical Squad [17x Legion Tactical Space Marines, Legion Vexilla, Nuncio-Vox]
Legion Tactical Squad [9x Legion Tactical Space Marines, Legion Vexilla, Nuncio-Vox]
····Legion Rhino Armoured Carrier [Dozer Blade]
····Legion Tactical Sergeant [Melta Bombs]
+ Fast Attack +
Legion Storm Eagle Assault Gunship [Armoured Ceramite, Shrapnel Bolts, Two Twin-linked Lascannons]
+ Heavy Support +
Legion Artillery Tank Squadron
····Legion Medusa [Dozer Blade, Shrapnel Bolts, Twin-Linked Bolter]
····Legion Medusa [Dozer Blade, Shrapnel Bolts, Twin-Linked Bolter]
····Legion Medusa [Dozer Blade, Shrapnel Bolts, Twin-Linked Bolter]
Legion Sicaran Battle Tank [Armoured Ceramite, Dozer Blade, Heavy Bolters, Shrapnel Bolts]
Legion Sicaran Battle Tank [Armoured Ceramite, Dozer Blade, Heavy Bolters, Shrapnel Bolts]
Legion Spartan Assault Tank [Armoured Ceramite, Dozer Blade, Flare Shield, Heavy Bolter, Shrapnel Bolts]
+ Legion +
Legion Astartes [IV: Iron Warriors]
+ Lord of War +
War Machine Detachment
····Legion Typhon Heavy Siege Tank [Armoured Ceramite, Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolters, Shrapnel Bolts]
>>44260331
Not bad, I r8 Decimation/10
>>44254883
>>44255557
>>44255643
How would you paint that white? Looks different from the usual blue-white
>>44254155
So the same price for each?
>>44254297
How can anything without a price be taking things too far? The goal is to set a price so that it isn't too far.
>>44260723
You r8 1/10/10?
>>44262152
Looks like they actually painted it white, rather than a very light blue/grey with white highlights.
I can't see any actual highlights on the white, so the final layer is probably some form of titanium white (which is a translucent, but extremely bright white).
I'm no expert though, so perhaps others have a better idea on how to achieve such a bright white finish?
