Remember when Dungeons and Dragons was evil and was teaching kids to summon up satan?
I do. To be fair, in my super religious area, it is still considered satanic to a good deal of folks. Not everyone, plenty view it as a nerd hobby, but some view it with extreme disgust and a pathway into legit devil worship. The exceptionally stupid are convinced it will grant you magical powers and control over the forces of hell. (I have been playing it wrong apparently).
So, let's have a thread about the old fears and, in some cases, current fears of the D&D and other gaming hobbies, shall we?
http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-26328105
>>44183999
>999
Nice try, upside-down Satan!
You won't convince me D&D is not evil. Good Christians play GURPS!
>Pulling described D&D as "a fantasy role-playing game which uses demonology, witchcraft, voodoo, murder, rape, blasphemy, suicide, assassination, insanity, sex perversion, homosexuality, prostitution, satanic type rituals, gambling, barbarism, cannibalism, sadism, desecration, demon summoning, necromantics, divination and other teachings".
Apart from ERP, these would totally make for an awesome game
>>44184027
But I can't afford a billion different sourcebooks...
Why are they SO OBSESSED with hating Witchcraft, and Demons etc... its like they secretly wanted to try the game out the whole time.. theyd probably love to all play lawful paladins killing evil lol
>>44184081
It is the price one must pay to remain pure of faith.
It is the charity you donate to in order to pull others soul out of the hell-fire.
Do your works and when you receive the root of all evil (money), convert it into the currency of the lord (source books) and spread the gospel.
>"There was also a view that youth had an inability to distinguish between fantasy and reality."
kind of like showing kids the bible huh?
>>44184072
Someone gave them a copy of FATAL and that's where they're getting their info.
>>44184081
The Lord provides, child.
>>44184109
To be fair, the most fun I have ever had playing D&D was playing a human paladin with a extreme knight's templar mentality.
If it wasn't human it wasn't to be trusted. The non-humans in the cities were unclean animals trying to put on a display of civility, but would resort to their animal like ways given the slightest provocation. Magic was not to be trusted at all and was impure. Faith healers (clerics) were exceptionally blasphemous and the 'gods' were simply tricksters who couldn't compare to the one true god.
I smote everything in the field with the righteous fury of my father guiding my hand. I had no need for possessions that didn't further his will and all were potential enemies of the lord.
The DM loved the guy because he followed the path laid out in front of him constantly. If the party wanted to be cautious? They lacked faith that the lord would see them through the conflict and I would stride out into obvious traps with my sword and shield held high chanting hymns and battle prayers. The players liked the distraction and the dice gods like the roleplaying apparently because he kicked the shit out of almost everything he ran across.
Knight Templar August Smith. The right hand of the lord. The blood letter of the church. The crusher of Christ. The bane of magic.
He had a reputation that was well earned.
>>44184065
Are these supposed to make an acronym Because I can't make heads or tails of "S.A.I.S.P.H."
>>44184139
The 80s were a hell of a drug.
>>44184065
D&D hasn't gotten me laid once
>>44184286
Cthulhu Dice got me laid twice, and that's still two more times than D&D has.
>>44183999
>>999
>implying D&D not the devils pastime
Australian Satan pls
>>44184286
>not passing around brojobs with your gaming buddies
>>44184286
>>44184303
Okay, and maybe Magic: the Gathering one as well. Add that to the count.
>>44184065
I never got any of that stuff from D&D, that game was such a ripoff!
>>44184065
>Convincing a nerd to assassinate someone
>>44184418
Have you tried the first one?
To be fair, some parts of DnD do take directly from occultism.
Many of the named Devils are actual demons. And the vestiges of the Binder class are literally demons from the occult text "ars Goetia" of the "lemegeton", with the demon's sigils placed next to their names.
It should be understood in occultism these sigils would be able to influence the person, and give the possibility of attracting the presence of the mentioned demons.
So pretty much yeah, the Binder class pretty much justifies all of the Christian satanic-panic.
>>44184478
The binder class was created long after the satanic scare.
>>44184286
D&D helped me meet my wife, and we have lots of sex. It also caused me to meet a sweet, uncute, codependent and anxious mess of a young woman who loved to put her huge knockers on my back while I was DMing. I probably could have gotten sex there if I didn't already have a better girlfriend.
>>44184286
I got my girlfriend into Magic, feels guuuud man, she became really talented at it.
But yeah, she won't play D&D tho, says she hates acting, she would feel like lying kinda...
>>44184498
Yeah but still, it still justifies the fears.
Not to mention the named Devils like asmodeus and the like.
Remember in Abrahamic belief, just stating the name of a spirit attracts It.
"Speak of the devil and he shall appear."
>>44184478
>>44184498
The Panic was late AD&D1 to early AD&D2, and is the direct cause of the Demons and Devils becoming the Tana'ri and such.
>>44184518
Yeah, it would be bad for your relationship if you knew when she is lying.
has anyone ever actually met someone in modern times that still believes this?
Legitimately curious
>>44184565
That's am actual good point for her, she absolutly can't lie... Because of her education or whatever, she has a really strict sense of justice and all that shit.
She just can't lie. Can be bad sometime (will always say things, even tho it can hurt) but I guess it'a for the greater good.
>>44184478
Can't people summon Angels too?
>>44184518
>Play a round with a newbie girl trying out D&D for the first time
>We kill a leader of a assassin group that happened to be female
>Girl loses her shit because the game promotes violence towards women
>Didn't give a shit that said woman was an assassin
>Says she just can't get into larping with us because we are too violent
>Regular clothes talking about actions around a dinner table is 'larping' now
>Tries to get her boyfriend to quit playing D&D because it will 'make him beat her. She just knows it'.
>He tells her 'no.'
>She cries
>Doesn't give a fuck
>She gets angry
>Tells her to fuck off. She can either deal with him gaming one night a week for about three hours or get out of his life.
I was so proud of him dropping his balls like that, but then again the guy is actually kind of attractive and has a successful career so he isn't hurting for strange either. Wish more would follow his lead, but god damn if I haven't lost many a player to the wiles of women who think a little time spent among friends (with no drugs or whores mind you) for a night a week is too much time away from them and they lose their shit over it.
>>44184572
I have a friend who was kind of a mess, he ended up living with his parents until age 25. His mom was crazy religious. He used to play D&D online (the so-so mmo) but he would have to lie to his mom and say he was playing WoW so she wouldn't freak out.
I don't know how, but in her mind somehow every other video game, no matter how violent, was basically okay, but anything D&D branded was literally satanic rituals designed to turn youngsters away from God.
>>44184572
My parents, mostly mother.
>>44183999
>So, let's have a thread about the old fears and, in some cases, current fears of the D&D and other gaming hobbies, shall we?
Unfortunately, fears about Satanism caused by D&D has transitioned into a more realistic concern of D&D being an indicator of a basement dwelling fat virgin neckbeard of poor hygiene.
The concept of religion existing in 2016 confuses me to no end.
>>44184605
Well there's always planar binding, but planar binding really does resemble ceremonial evocation rituals.
In occultism Angels and demons are summoned.
>>44184504
shoulda done both mate
>>44184617
My gf is absolutly not into that feminism bullshit but I get your point.
I will DM starting january, and yeah, DM night can and should be Men Nights, can always be good to do things without the loved one I think .
>>44184658
I MEAN
>>44184605
Sure, if you want to get absolutely fucked up.
Lesser summoning is demons. Demons are concerned with the lesser things, lust, power, wealth, health, friends, family bonds, shit of that nature.
Angels? That's greater tier stuff. That cosmic balances, matter conversion, celestial bodies, and what not. They also, 100%, don't have to do a damn thing you ask of them, don't have to be nice in any way, and don't share their creators love of you. They lack free will, but forcing them to interact with you? You are asking to be blown to shit across the cosmos.
Summoning a demon is like summoning a powerful mob boss. They are scary, they can make really bad things happen to you, but they are more familiar than you would think.
Summoning an angel is like summoning Cthulhu. From a nice nap. When he was just about to nut in a wet dream he was having. To ask him if he was asleep. It isn't going to end well.
>>44184617
That story sounds plausible.
>>44184658
>The concept of religion existing in 2016 confuses me to no end.
From a fellow atheist: If you're older than 25 and still can't figure this out, you're in a sad state of mind.
>>44184658
It's a communal pillar of support that requires next to no effort to be a part of and by joining actively removes ostracism from you.
>>44184572
My 3rd-4th grade teacher was a rather hardcore fundie.
Very nice lady, but was very much "Harry Potter tells kids to sell their souls to the Devil" and "Dungeons and Dragons teaches real witchcraft and magic spells" and shit. She didn't stop us from doing Halloween celebrations but she said she'd be praying for all of us to avoid the devil's handiwork.
She actually kinda-sorta planted the seeds for me avoiding the fundamentalist bent most people in my area take; I had an idea for how to integrate evolution with Biblical Creation (God created Adam and Eve but let some apes evolve into soulless humans that Adam and Eve's kids married and had kids with, and the kids from those marriages had souls and married soulless humans, and so-on until all humans had souls). When I told her about it, she said it was a neat idea but that I could only believe in one or the other, so I went with the one that made more sense (ie evolution).
>>44184744
No, I get why it exists. I mean, 50% of the world is dumber than average, and the average isn't that smart to begin with.
I just can't get how for some people, yelling louder and louder is enough of a distraction that they never have to stop and realize how retarded they are.
>>44184244
Does that mean any good charitable Christian would torrent all the books to share with their brothers and sisters of the faith?
>>44184765
>I just can't get how for some people, yelling louder and louder is enough of a distraction that they never have to stop and realize how retarded they are.
That's a concept that's not just limited to religion, you know.
>>44184248
That's a pretty fun character to use, never played it to an extreme though.
>>44184795
Which is also baffling.
>>44184765
>50% of the world is dumber than average
Do you not know how statistics work, mate?
>Yelling louder and louder is enough of a distraction that they don't realize how retarded they are
Most followers of faith aren't screaming shitheads. They live their lives quietly like anybody else and while they may think something like 'D&D is satanic' and 'Gays getting married is against God's will', well, they don't think that, they fully believe it, they are also some combination of lazy, indifferent towards others on the whole, respect that government laws are not the same as religious laws, and just mainly worry about themselves and theirs.
You know what confuses me? I know a lot of gay folks who are super into Christianity and Islam. Why? Those works are extremely clear that they are absolutely fucked in the afterlife.
>>44184758
That's a terrible Union of evolution and creationism.
Why couldn't you just consider something like say, God took all of the proper compounds needed for like, aged them in an extremely fast manner and boom. Humans from lesser chimps from "dust"
Hell the other humans doesn't even need to be addressed, just consider that Adam and Eve had many daughters and just as Hebrew culture was and is, the girl isn't important enough to be written about.
Boom, now Cain has a wife (one of his unmentioned sisters.) and the idea of evolution is yoked to creation.
Hell you could also just say that God put together the compounds and him "breathing" into them is him causing them to interact, and slowly he allowed them to evolve.
You also don't have to worry about the whole 6-7 days thing, the word for day is not attached to the cycles of the sun and moon, it can and sometimes is translated out as a "complete period of time"
>>44184823
>Most followers of faith aren't screaming shitheads.
You don't have to be a screaming shithead to be willfully retarded. There really isn't any other word for people who believe in magic and refuse to ever allow those beliefs to be re-examined. I know lots of people want to say "Well, some are nice people", which is fine. They're still willfully retarded. They choose that.
>>44184823
They justify it in the manner of, this is a manifestation of Sin corrupting our nature.
And just how saying the Lord's name in vain, or chopping up a dead body in Egyptian ceremonial manner (what's actually meant by "thou shalt not murder) are sins, can be forgiven so can this sin.
Of course this implies that with enough purification it can eventually be overcame.
Just like being disrespectful to your community and family can be overcame eventually.
>>44184827
The problem with the whole 'days as a standard in time' is that god made all the plants on the earth before the sun, the moon, and the stars in the sky.
>>44184854
Ever try to have a religious experience? I recommend reading "the Varieties of Religious Experience"
>>44184827
>Why couldn't you just consider something like say, God took all of the proper compounds needed for like, aged them in an extremely fast manner and boom. Humans from lesser chimps from "dust"
Why would an omnipotent deity need to do that? Why couldn't he just snap his fingers and make everything, as it exists now, with age built-in? There's no way to know whether the universe is really 13 billion years old, or it was made yesterday with all the hallmarks of a universe that was actually 13 billion years old.
>Hell the other humans doesn't even need to be addressed, just consider that Adam and Eve had many daughters and just as Hebrew culture was and is, the girl isn't important enough to be written about.
Anon, that's still incest.
>Boom, now Cain has a wife (one of his unmentioned sisters.) and the idea of evolution is yoked to creation.
Incest, Anon. That's not how genetics work.
>the word for day is not attached to the cycles of the sun and moon,
No shit, considering the retarded story claims light was created before the sun, and the stars afterwards. So "day" with respect to what?
Why are you just making up shit to defend a bronze-age fairy tale?
>>44184854
The very fact that you think people of faith are retarded speaks volumes about yourself.
>>44184882
Or eating shrooms, im just being honest!
>>44184603
>but I guess it'a for the greater good.
>>44184863
Yet the same word is used for the completed period when the first light was created, and the same word is completed as to when the sun and moon are created.
The Jewish traditions have a lot of streets of intellectualism, how rational is it for a God to complete stages of creation based on periods of time that are measured on something that isn't formed yet by looking at other things that haven't been made yet?
It just doesn't make sense in the context of the religion or philosophy.
>>44184882
>Ever try to have a religious experience?
How do you "try" to have a religious experience? Either you accept the premise that supernatural things are real and then you start attributing anything that happens to you within the framework of your magical beliefs, or you don't and you don't experience those things.
I don't believe there is a god, therefore I can't ever believe that if I pray to someone, that prayer is being answered, even if it might seem like it to a religious person.
>>44184905
The whole creation story works out a lot better (while still flawed) if you read it as god made everything (humans included) then went on to make the garden of eden with Adam and Eve as a super special area.
Think of it this way. When Cain left with his wife, dude went to a whole different city (called Nod if I remember correctly) which means humans were already established at that point.
>>44184854
Spoken like the true fedora-tipper we get stereotyped as. While it's always fun to point out and make fun of the obviously dumb examples of religion, it would be intellectually dishonest to ignore the scientists that exist who still have a religion of some kind. Those are the people who are not retarded, and while it might be baffling to you or I how people like these can be very knowledgeable in their respective fields and yet take it upon faith a supreme being exists with no evidence, this is just one of those quirks of humanity I've learned to accept. I mean, shit, take a look at us: We are fully grown and knowledgeable adults, so why do we still play glorified games of pretend (our RPGs)?
>>44184827
>that's a terrible union of evolution and creationism
I was 8.
>>44184920
Pascal's wager is how you "try".
>>44184932
>>The whole creation story works out a lot better (while still flawed) if you read it as god made everything (humans included) then went on to make the garden of eden with Adam and Eve as a super special area.
Lots of things make the Hebrew creation myth "work better". The question is, why would anyone accept an answer that is clearly fabricated out of thin air post-hoc to bring some form of sense to a story told by illiterate desert nomad barbarians?
>Think of it this way. When Cain left with his wife, dude went to a whole different city (called Nod if I remember correctly) which means humans were already established at that point.
You DO realize that Yaweh was not created as a single, monotheistic deity, right? He's part of a pantheon, that was abandoned when the followers of the war-god Yaweh replaced most of the other tribes and cast their patheons into obscurity? This is mentioned in the Torah.
>>44184664
Don't stick your dick in crazy
>>44184939
To be fair, if the holy bible had stat blocks for it characters, I would be far more interested in it.
>>44184939
>it would be intellectually dishonest to ignore the scientists that exist who still have a religion of some kind.
Isaac Newton was a brilliant mathematician. He was retarded when it came to religious nuttery like alchemy and bible codes.
One does not preclude the other. Someone can be intelligent on one subject, and still be willfully ignorant on another at the same time.
>>44184920
How you try is you take up a scientific mindset, you don't use real beliefs but you work in a framework with "working beliefs."
At this point you can try fasting for a couple of weeks while praying and reading religious texts/poetry. Or you could try any manner of rituals or any manner of meditations of any traditions.
If you really want to understand what they believe and why, you must try to put aside your beliefs, suspend your disbelief and try the practice.
I'm sure the concept of suspending disbelief isn't alien to you.
Once the experience is done you can measure it in a scientific manner, as many people have and do. These experiences are noticeable and very real in the brain.
I also recommend reading "
Psychedelic Information Theory
Shamanism in the Age of Reason" by James Kent
It explains how hallucinations, psychedelics and religious experiences can cause different mental mental states to stack in irregular fashions allowing for strange and different forms of thoughts and ideas and ultimately experiences.
>>44184952
Pascal's Wager is too stupid to even bother entertaining.
>>44184969
The hebrew creation myth explicitly states that god made everything and then has him making Eden in better detail right after that.
>Yahew is not a single monothistic diety
Yeah, that's incorrect. The hebrews absolutely believed in the existence of other gods (what with the egyptians and shit running everything for so long and influencing everything in the area) however, they never had any other gods for their personal faith.
>>44184952
Pascal's wager is the idiotic idea that it's better to believe in God (which god? The Christian one, obviously, you filthy heathen) than to not because if he doesn't exist than it doesn't matter but if he does then if you don't believe in him you'll burn in Hell for all eternity.
(I typically respond with pic related.)
How does that have anything to do with trying to have a religious experience.
>>44184987
>These experiences are noticeable and very real in the brain.
Yeah, they're BRAIN EFFECTS. You know, feelings caused by the various chemicals in your FUCKING BRAIN.
That means they're inherently NOT SUPERNATURAL.
If hallucinations, psychedelics, and "religious experiences" can all be classified into the same category of brain effects, it means that they're MATERIAL PHENOMENA AND NOT FUCKING MAGICAL.
>>44184997
>Pascal's Wager is dumb
The debating skills of your average Fedora-tipper everyone.
>>44184997
>>44185014
Because there's more to it than that. Pascal actually explains how to do it. You basically act like you're religious until it sticks through sheer force of habit. Also, ask other people who were previously not religious for help.
I'm not religious, but there you go.
>>44185009
>The hebrews absolutely believed in the existence of other gods (what with the egyptians and shit running everything for so long and influencing everything in the area) however, they never had any other gods for their personal faith.
Hebrew religion did not just spring out of the sand with no precursors you god damned retard.
>>44184978
Alright, fuck-o.
How about this? Clearly explain to me how gravity works with absolute proof on the matter and I will believe it when you say you only follow logic. Taking shit on faith is only for retards, remember?
>>44184920
>How do you "try" to have a religious experience? Either you accept the premise that supernatural things are real and then you start attributing anything that happens to you within the framework of your magical beliefs, or you don't and you don't experience those things.
"Religious experience" in this context doesn't refer to actual dogma. It's a reference of the general euphoric/ecstatic/induced altered mind states state that can be induced through a variety of means.
In many instances, such experiences are tied to religious/spiritual practices, as many such practiced are specifically designed to induce them.
But you see it in secular instances, like when people get themselves hyped up, lose themselves at a concert, or get really into an intense experience such as when having sex or doing certain drugs.
>>44185032
Very well. What were the precursors?
>>44185028
Do you really need someone to break down Pascal's Wager for you, you shitposting fucktard?
>Hurdf is better 2 believe cuz if god is real u go to hevan and it's awesome but if hes not real nothing happens and u dont lose anything
How do we decide which god? Which religion? Shouldn't I logically hedge my bets and be a devout follower of every religion, just in case? I mean, they all have an equal chance of being the real one, but only one can actually, possibly be right, even though all of them can be wrong.
So which Heaven should I hedge my bets with?
>>44185009
>Yeah, that's incorrect. The hebrews absolutely believed in the existence of other gods (what with the egyptians and shit running everything for so long and influencing everything in the area) however, they never had any other gods for their personal faith.
Yeah, like he said: YAHVW wasn't the only deity around. He was just the only one the Hebrews followed.
>>44185070
>Which religion should I hedge my bets with?
Fedoraism.
>>44185041
>You can't teach a physics course
>Therefore you're taking it on faith that gravity exists
Except, you know, I can demonstrate it. Because it exists. It doesn't matter if I believe the explanation or not.
You cannot demonstrate anything supernatural to me, therefore I cannot accept the possibility that they exist.
>>44185020
No one said they are by their very nature supernatural you blabbering Autist. You want to know why they believe what they believe, there you go.
There's your answer. If you seriously want to understand then you can educate yourself by reading and if you can somehow actually do a bit of experimentation actually try some of it.
It being supernatural was never the point, understanding what they believe, why and if it has value is the point right?
By the way, your philosophical understanding of mind, spirit and body is pretty standard. A lot of spiritualists consider these all one, or three distinct things.
He'll there's whole groups of spiritualists who use spiritual belief as a tool to manipulate their own brains willingly. That's what chaos magic strives to be.
If you actually want to understand, actually try to. If you aren't interested in understanding do not pretend to be interested for the sake of spewing your opinions.
>>44184758
>(God created Adam and Eve but let some apes evolve into soulless humans that Adam and Eve's kids married and had kids with, and the kids from those marriages had souls and married soulless humans, and so-on until all humans had souls
This is really awesome, and I wish I could fold something like this into my campaign world, but its metaphysics are all set.
Maybe the next one.
>>44185070
Not to mention that if God IS real, and you only believed in him "just in case" he's going to KNOW that, and your ass is going straight to hell. You're right, Pascal's Wager is one of those things I'm astonished anybody takes seriously.
>>44185066
Ancient Semetic religions, specifically the Canaanite religion mixed with elements of Babylonian.
Yaweh was a member of the ancient Canaanite pantheon.
>>44184617
yeah man girls are harpies
I was trying to get my friend to come down a few days before christmas to play in my game (my first time GM'ing PLUS would be the first time in a year + 1/2 ive seen him) but he told me he might just stay up north with his girlfriend for christmas
thats all fine and dandy, but last night
>log into facebook, my friends online
>ask how his job search was going
>tells me fine, he got a job at the mall but needs to sleep now
>I ask if he thinks he will be able to make it to the game *NOT CHRISTMAS*
>responds, yea i'm not gonna be able to make it down for christmas
>then it is revealed to me that I am speaking to his girlfriend, whom ive never met before
>ON HIS OWN FACEBOOK
>Like literally freaky as fuck, she asks who I am (in relation to him)
>I answer to be polite and quickly GTFO
Man this shit was weird as fuck
Every gamer should have a copy of this. It's actually pretty sad in hindsight; basically some nice, intelligent, and usually gay kids, from really conservative/Christian families, who played D&D got bullied into violence and suicide and rather than blame more profound concerns they just focused on roleplaying.
Personal story - I went to a hippy primary school where D&D was banned because it supposed promoted negative values. On the other hand Car Wars was totally fine, so we could burn each other to death but playing Tolkien was right out. Go figure.
>>44185129
I forgot to mention, I actually saw that she was on his phone for quite some time after that, like 30 minutes or so..
>>44185139
That's actually illegal in a lot of places and usually qualifies as abusive behavior.
>>44185130
>I went to a hippy primary school where D&D was banned because it supposed promoted negative values. On the other hand Car Wars was totally fine, so we could burn each other to death but playing Tolkien was right out. Go figure.
To be perfectly frank with you, if I were a school administrator at the time I'd be okay with this because at least Car Wars might get you interested in something practical like automotive maintenance, as opposed to some game that might encourage you to take shit like astrology and new age religions a tad too seriously.
>>44185111
>Yaweh was a member of the ancient Canaanite pantheon
Which also included? Note, this isn't me being a cunt, this is me being actual curious because while it make complete sense for previous religious roles to have existed before, what with mankind basically being hardwired to be religious, what I haven't been able to find is anything concrete in so far as names, ideals, concepts, roles, etc. that ancient hebrew lore would have on their precursor pantheon.
>>44185088
>Can't teach a physic course
I didn't as you to teach a physics course. The effects of gravity can indeed be measured, it is absolutely real, but we have no understanding on why the fuck it happens exactly. Why does mass attract shit toward it? How the fuck can something be so power as to pull god damned stars around but insects can tell it to fuck off with a few wing beats?
It is odd and we work on it being there as a truth because, well it is obviously there, but without a proper understand of how it does what it does and treating it like a law is also a preposterous notion..
>>44185041
Not that poster, but science doesn't deal in absolute truths or proofs. One of the major 'science vs religion' contentions is that religion DOES (claim to).
To more directly answer your question, I can't prove to you, or to myself or to anyone, that gravity exists or works at all. I can say that, based on the observations we've made and the evidence we have, gravity is the BEST CURRENT EXPLANATION (caps for emphasis/attention, not for yelling) for the phenomenon that exists where an object moves towards another object when the two are close enough together (such as a human and the earth). It could well be absolutely wrong, but at the moment we have more evidence for it than for the alternative hypotheses, and as such we have to use it because, while it's not necessarily perfect and there are things we don't understand about it, it is, again, the best explanation that we currently have.
We don't take the existence of gravity "on faith", we take it on "right now, there's nothing we know about that explains the shit we can observe better than this".
>>44185155
Conversely we could have been learning about making molotov cocktails and forming motorcycle gangs, but your point is valid.
>>44185142
good point, I should be a decent friend and see what thats all about. I think hes probably more "whipped" if anything but still.
>>44185172
>The effects of gravity can indeed be measured, it is absolutely real, but we have no understanding on why the fuck it happens exactly. Why does mass attract shit toward it?
Science doesn't really concern itself with that kind of "why?," that's more a question for philosophy. "What?" and "How?" are the important science questions.
>How the fuck can something be so power as to pull god damned stars around but insects can tell it to fuck off with a few wing beats?
That's easy; that's just straight math, dude.
>>44185178
Running on the best possible explanation is an act of faith. A far more grounded act of faith than saying some dude in the sky made everything a long time ago because a bunch of desert dwellers said so, but an act of faith none the less.
That is the point I am trying to make.
>>44185172
Shit like the "law of gravity" is a similar terminological holdover as the "BC/AD" division of time.
Few scientists use them literally, but they're so ingrained into just about everything that they're easier to use than the more correct versions.
Seriously though, talk to almost any physicist and they'll call it the 'theory of gravity', because it's a scientific theory; a hypothesis with a shitton of evidence supporting it.
>>44183999
In our Swedish Church, we have no problem with D&D or other rpg (maybe except FATAL and other shitty rpg).
>>44185172
>Which also included?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canaanite_religion
>but we have no understanding on why the fuck it happens exactly.
At the moment, yes we haven't been able to unify gravity with the other fundamental forces of the universe. We know it IS related, we just haven't discovered the mechanism. But this doesn't actually mean anything.
>How the fuck can something be so power as to pull god damned stars around but insects can tell it to fuck off with a few wing beats?
Insects are just as gravitationaly attracted to you as you are to the planet beneath us, or as our planet is to the Sun. The only difference is proportion. We know the formula to determine the relative gravitational strength of things, it's not hard to work out. The fact that you haven't taken that class in school yet doesn't change anything.
> but without a proper understand of how it does what it does and treating it like a law is also a preposterous notion..
Treat WHAT like a law? We have this amazing thing called the Theory of Gravity. Just like we have the Theory of Evolution, and every other scientific theory like the Germ Theory of Disease.
A "law" is nothing. It's just a description of an effect we observe in the universe that, as far as we can tell, remain consistent across the expanse of the universe. The fundamental equation that describes the effect of gravity appears to be the same everywhere, meaning we can describe this as a "law". By itself, meaningless.
What you're talking about is the THEORY of Gravity, which is an explanatory framework that seeks to bring together all the observed facts and create an explanation that fits all of them and allows us to make accurate predictions about reality. THAT is what science is.
>>44185186
Pussy makes you tolerate strange things right up until you hit your 30s.
>>44185214
Ergh, this might be a word dispute between us. From how I've been raised, an act of faith is utterly independent of (and often in contraction to) the existing evidence. Shit like having faith that your grandpa's gonna be okay after he shot himself in the head with a 12-gauge.
Running on the best possible explanation doesn't require you to have faith that said explanation is actually correct.
>>44185214
>Running on the best possible explanation is an act of faith
No it isn't you fucking dolt.
Faith is, by definition, accepting things as true or likely true without any good reason to do so. It is accepting a claim, despite that claim not fitting the observed evidence. Faith is gullibility. That's what the word means.
>That is the point I am trying to make.
You evidently did not graduate highschool.
>>44185258
I can see it, having a girlfriend now myself
But shes pretty tame, still, she sometimes just acts like a naggy bitch as if she expects my will to crumble
>>44184939
It may be fedora-tipery to you, but in my opinion, willful ignorance is a horrible thing to do to yourself and society. Think about it: people are allowed to vote on things which they choose to be ill-informed on. That is fucking dangerous. Much of religion absolutely depends on willful ignorance.
>>44185337
If faith really ignorance, though? "Ignorant," by the dictionary definition I'm used to, is having a lack of knowledge. But even though you and I lack faith in any sort of religion, if we're being intellectually honest with ourselves here, can we really equate "faith" to "ignorance"? Because they're two entirely different concepts. And so, in my mind, it's possible to be genuinely knowledgeable about many things and yet still take other things on faith (religion, or just the simple notion that your favorite sports team is going to win).
I agree that willful ignorance is a bad thing but I've met many religious people who would also agree with you and they strive to NOT be ignorant about anything - they just happen to have faith in certain things we can't perceive.
>>44185416
*Is faith
>>44185416
To hold faith in any religion requires either a lack of available knowledge, which is a possibility based on location, community, family or many other possibilities, or is an act of willful ignorance of varying degrees, "accepting" that knowledge is and should remain beyond you.
>>44185416
>If faith really ignorance, though?
By definition, yes.
>>44185486
How so?
>>44185337
>Think about it: people are allowed to vote on things which they choose to be ill-informed on.
The main issue is that in many cases what is considered "well informed" is simply what your political camp agrees to be well informed. In your case, you're using "informed" as a synonym for "agrees with me."
>>44185520
nailed it
>>44185463
>or is an act of willful ignorance of varying degrees
It might be for some people. But the point I'm trying to get across is that most of the people I know who are geniuses in their respective fields and yet attend church regularly are NOT, by any means, WILLFULLY ignorant. They seek knowledge just like you or I, and after many an extensive conversation with them about this subject, I realized that their faith is not borne of willful ignorance but in how they choose to "connect the dots" with the information they have available to them right now.
Why does /tg/ have to be so cringey?
>>44185204
>science doesn't concern itself with "why"?
science is equally about the "why" as it is any of the other questions. just in my own field, something like "why do storms rotate" seems to be a perfectly fine question.
>>44185539
>most of the people I know who are geniuses in their respective fields and yet attend church regularly are NOT, by any means, WILLFULLY ignorant.
They are when it comes to their religious beliefs. Because they refuse to question those and submit those to the same scientific scrutiny that the subject the rest of the world to.
>>44185585
I believe any person investigating the subject would ask "What causes storms to rotate?". It may be a semantic difference, but science doesn't deal with inherent purpose.
>>44185585
That's kind of a category error, though. What you're asking there could be more clearly phrased as "what is the cause of storm rotation?"
You're asking for the specific cause of an effect.
We know what causes gravity, we just don't understand the mechanicsm entirely yet. "Why does gravity happen?" is a metaphysical question, and the best answer you'll get out of science (rather than the philosophy of science) is going to be something like "because that appears to be how our universe works."
>>44185614
I dunno. I still disagree with this point. "What causes" and "Why do" just feel interchangeable to me here. I think the "purpose" is important in Science.
>>44185606
Like I said: I've had extensive conversations with people like this on many an occasion. And if you were talking to the people I know right now, I'd guess they'd tell you the same thing they told me: They don't refuse to question their beliefs at all. They constantly examine them. It's just that's it's hard to subject certain aspects of their faith to scientific scrutiny. To give an example, we're pretty certain that there are stars many light years away from us but given the distance between the Earth, the speed of light travel, and the stars we can see right now, we don't really know what EXACTLY is out there so far away RIGHT NOW IN THE PRESENT. But we can make an educated guess.
And that's how they explain their faith to their respective deity's to me: a form of educated guess. It may just so happen to be a guess you and I don't agree with, but it's the conclusion they arrived at. And we can simply agree to disagree.
And the point I'm trying to get across to you here is just that: It's possible to agree to disagree with certain people who have religion, instead of going into full-attack fedora tipping mode the moment somebody walks in with a crucifix around their neck as I've seen so many neckbeards do at conventions or my "friendly" local gaming store.
It's okay to criticize the genuine retards we all know exist at the Westboro Baptist Church rallies, but I think we can all remain on friendly terms with the people who have faith that don't actively try to make our own lives more miserable. Just be a little bit more discerning and don't dismiss all people of faith as complete retards.
>>44185719
>a form of educated guess.
There is literally no such thing as "an educated guess" when it comes to supernatural, magical beliefs. Period.
You have no data to experiment with, you have no evidence to base your conclusion on, you are simply accepting unfalsifiable claims as true or likely true.
That is inherently at odds with the process of scientific inquiry.
>>44185745
Fine. Have it your way. I have to work in the morning so this will probably be my final post. But I've been carrying on this conversation in an effort to make a plea for tolerance of people who will remain on friendly terms with you in spite of differences of spiritual beliefs (or lack thereof).
But if your default mode is always going to stay in ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK even if someone is trying to politely avoid the subject with you, well... then I tip my fedora to you.
why is sorcery seen as a bad thing among the religious? wasn't jesus a sorcerer?
>>44185786
no, beliefs in sorcery/etc among Christians range from its hucksterism to its Satan powered to its Satan powered hucksterism
>>44185779
You seem to be confusing "ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK" with "will not concede his point".
Religious individuals are entitled to their beliefs, and nonreligious individuals are certainly entitled to scrutinize.
>>44185836
>Religious individuals are entitled to their beliefs, and nonreligious individuals are certainly entitled to scrutinize.
That we can agree on but what I take issue with is the blanket declaration that anybody with a religion is automatically a COMPLETE retard who we can no longer invite to the gaming table, or invite out to share a beer and watch the game with. We need to hold ourselves to a higher level than the very religious nutcases we criticize whom try to ostracize us for our lack of faith.
>>44185862
>the blanket declaration that anybody with a religion is automatically a COMPLETE retard
No one ever said that. You can be an idiot in a certain subject without being an idiot in other subjects. I am an idiot when it comes to physics and math, but I'm not an idiot when it comes to things like computer animation and programming.
You can be a smart person in general, and still be retarded when it comes to the subject of religious beliefs.
The difference is, people who are dumb in other areas don't tend to get defensive about it. Religious people do. Why? Because they're convinced that they're NOT an idiot when it comes to that area of their lives. They, in fact, think they're 100% correct and nothing can change that. They choose to be ignorant on that subject.
>>44185862
>the blanket declaration that anybody with a religion is automatically a COMPLETE retard
Yeah, it's a bit silly.
It's not like worshiping reason and empiricism are inherently better than worshiping a supernatural dad in the sky. I suppose it reveals 'the truth' better? For all we know, we're brains in vats being spoonfed an all-encompassing simulation as 'truth'.
Just try not to act like a dick and interact smoothly with people around you.
>>44185919
>All these blanket statements
Fuck's sake. It's like saying no fa/tg/uy can get off unless he's playing FATAL.
Can we at least try to stay a bit realistic here? Your churchgoing nan is not on the same level as fucking ISIS.
>>44185948
>Your churchgoing nan is not on the same level as fucking ISIS.
In what respect? In the respect that they both accept without question that their lives are dictated by the rules by a magic man in the sky who loves them personally at the expense of others? That seems to map to both parties.My grandma was Jewish.
>>44185959
>In what respect?
with respect to compassion, freedom, respect for the past and art and such, etc. etc.
>>44185980
Ok, so what's your point? They still both believe ridiculous fairy tales. Just because one is a nice person and one is a fanatical murderer doesn't make the former's beliefs any more sane.
>>44185959
>In what respect?
In how defensive they'll get in a practical sense when confronted with another worldview.
I come across very few reports of religious grannies lobbing the queer off of rooftops.
"Leave the boy alone, he's a fookin' sweet boy!" said my nan, as my straight uncle tried to take my gay uncle to see a whore.
>>44185992
>They still both believe ridiculous fairy tales. Just because one is a nice person and one is a fanatical murderer doesn't make the former's beliefs any more sane.
And that's a reason to go off and rub your self-righteous empiricism boner in their face? I know who I'd prefer at my gaming table.
William Dear kept the reason behind Egbert's disappearance and death secret for four years because of a promise he made to him. This resulted in the drama surrounding D&D. I wonder if any tg-ers back then were angry at Dear for letting it happen.
I'm imagining a bunch of LARPers storming his home. He comes out, with his coat, mustache and weary eyes. He sighs. "Well? Do it."
>>44185992
>doesn't make the former's beliefs any more sane.
It does, actually! Since a core element of psychology is that mental illness isn't about whether it conforms to your personal standards, but whether it is maladaptive, ie its relative.
>>44186018
Nigga we're having a conversation about the fucking topic. I'm not smacking people in the face saying "Hurr ur dum cuz u beleev in god!" out in public, I'm having a conversation about the subject with you dumb motherfuckers right now.
How do you conflate the two so easily? You don't see me taking your defensiveness here and claiming that because of it, you must be a bible-thumping idiot who slings Jack Chick comics to everyone he meets.
>>44186029
Oh, I'm sorry, do you feel that it's an unfair generalisation?
Karma's a fucking bitch.
>>44186038
You are one really, really stupid motherfucker, you know that?
>>44186048
It must suck to run out of sensible retorts.
>>44186056
I'm not that guy, you drooling retard. I have no dogs in this fight, I'm just pointing out what a moron you are.
you know this thread seemed like a good idea, but somehow I could see this turning into shit a mile away
>>44186067
Neither am I the other guy, you slavering sodomite.
How practical anonimity is.
>>44186088
Sure thing, 'tardo. Sure thing. Go with the 'oh dear god, more then one person can't possibly disagree with me!!!' defense.
>>44183999
>Pascal's Wager
Isn't gambling a sin?
WHO CARES?
>>44186109
Sweet, sweet irony.
>>44184905
Dude. Dude. There is actually no way to prove that the universe isn't destroyed and completely rebuilt after each discrete change that we call "time".
>>44186140
Yes, and there's no solution to Solipsism. So why bother talking about it?
In b4 Godwin's law.
>>44186026
woo psychology
I almost wish I majored in it. Super interesting stuff.
>>44186038
And here we see the stop where this guy left his intelligence and boarded the bus with his retard side.
>>44185130
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN_nuxOhT2s
I always found it hilarious how much rage a religion that preaches respect and kindness to your fellow man attracts.
Christian lives matter. Equal rights now.
>>44184065
Well, can't argue against the homosexuality. If only it was right about the sex too.
Religious beliefs don't preclude scientific thought. You just have to be open minded enough to realize everything said to be the word of god is through the mouths of men from thousands of years ago, with their limited understanding of the world, and through a filter of muh political agendas.
>>44185551
>MRA
Magnetic resonance angiography ?
>>44186460
Men's Rights Activists
>>44186460
>>44186472
Which given her response is ironic, because obviously they were calling *her* a fedora tipper, not themselves.
>>44185551
We aren't you fuckwit. Some people on it are.
>>44186472
Im confused, why would they name it after something very well known and important?
why not something no one has used like nambla?
>>44186504
Think it's taken, something like the National Association for Men's Brotherliness and Liberty Advancement. Hear they're a bit spartan for your average fedora.
>>44186504
I've honestly never heard of magnetic whatever.
>>44184678
Sounds like you need a new girlfriend
>>44184678
>DM night can and should be Men Nights
Why?
>>44186867
Don't stir the shit, anon. You know full well what their personal reasons are by reading their posts and nobody is forcing you or your friends to abide by that rule.
>>44184658
It is still 2015, come on!!
>>44186903
I have genuinely no idea what kind of retardation would provoke such a post.
I do not know their personal reasons. Or did you think they were >>44184617?
Besides which, there *is* no personal reason to play with men only unless you have an actual phobia of women, which obviously he doesn't.
*Besides which*, he is definitely making it a general rule for everything.
>>44185028
>>44184952
I didn´t know there were people that used pascal wager as an actual argument anymore.
>>44185028
It was rejected by the religious because no one claiming to be religious because of it would actually have any faith, and it was rejected by the irreligious because they still didn't believe God existed in the first place, rendering the wager moot.
>>44184286
I suck my GM's dick sometimes.
>>44187059
>sometimes
Ungrateful faggot.
I don't get one thing: In most DnD games, demons or evil magic users are the stereotypical villains, while the players often include a Cleric or Paladin which are blatantly based on christian faith.
If anything DnD promotes fighting against demons and witchcraft.
>>44187059
I'd suck my player's dicks if they'd lose weight. I wonder if I should use that as encouragement.
>>44185633
You're thinking too shallow. He means "why is it that this bullshit is happening to begin with"?
>>44187143
Depends if you're an attractive member of the gender they are into.
>>44187172
Oh, one of them's made their attraction towards me very apparent, and I've made it apparent he's going to have to lose weight before that happens.
>>44184540
>still justifies the fears
If you are a deranged fundamentalist maybe.
>>44187190
Well, first you've got to make sure that he knows it's mostly/only a physical thing (I'm assuming, anyway; people usually don't give too much of a shit about attractiveness if they're into each other, but maybe he's REALLY fat or something) and secondly you have to make sure that this will not fuck up the group as a whole. Or that you don't care as much about fucking up the group as you do about sucking his dick.
Also, try to ensure you're not just manipulating him.
>>44184540
>"Speak of the devil and he shall appear."
Oh shit.
That's where it comes from.
>>44183999
I'd rather have my hobbies be treated as evil, than have the "moral" guardians of the decade (the church, soccer moms, SJWs, and what not) try to change it into what suits their tastes
>>44184027
Good christians like Hitler!
>>44186146
>>44187293
Well done Anon.
>>44184027
>GURPS
You mean Cyberpunk 2020 / Shadowrun?
>>44184027
Everybody knows good, Catholic Christians play God's Own Song of Swords.
>>44187407
I vaguely recall hearing about how Jerry Holkins of Penny Arcade fame grew up on cyberpunk because his parents wouldn't let him play DnD.
>>44187407
>implying I'm not running a CP2020 game in GURPS
It works so much better.
>>44187426
Exactly.
>>44187420
>not Sword's Path Glory
Well, if you want something inaccurate.
>>44184244
That He does.
>>44187485
I have heard good things about it.
But was it written by a Catholic?
>>44187503
Every one of those people is a GURPS character. Even the swarm of rats in the background.
>>44187525
Fuck if I know. I've also only seen the combat system book floating around. The non-combat rules and full character generation book has never been scanned.
>>44183999
Dammit now I want to make a homebrew just to take the piss out of that stupid sorcery shit.
Imagine it, fighting against a neckbeard that is rolling dice at everyone else to summon demons.
>>44187574
How do you determine his successes? Do you roll his rolls for real or do you roll his attacks normally and then decide he in-game rolled enough to succeed?Feels like battling a D&D nerd while rolling his rolls IRL would be funnier in a game that isn't D&D.
>>44187664
>The Answers to Our Questions
Vehicles 4e when?
>>44187682
All true believers know it will come when GURPS decides it shall be so.
>>44187531
The fucking scissors are probably a GURPS character.
>>44187217
He's got a lust inducing personality wrapped up in lard, bald and facial hair, which are turn offs to me. I can't comprehend how he's sucked/been sucked off numerous times with his physical characteristics and I have very little luck finding people attracted to me that I would reciprocate.
>>44184440
>"I heard he was talking shit about your waifu..."
>>44187682
Soon, I hope.
>>44183999
Man, imagine if it HAD turned out that Dungeons and Dragons secretly had magic inside? Like someone from the wizard underground had designed the magic system that way to smuggle the information out to the muggles in such a way that the wizarding world couldn't mindwipe everyone involved when it finally came out.
Weirdest way for the sixth world to awaken.
>>44187913
we Unknown Armies now
>tfw gurps is not actually enjoyable
>>44187931
Joy is a sin anon, you wouldn't want anything sinful in the chosen game of God.
The funny thing about the 80s morality panic is that it skyrocketed D&D up as a household name. If it hadn't been for that happening rpgs would have probably developed a much healthier ecosystem without a single game being the leader.
>>44187005
Needs to add a GURPs row and column.
Dude, this religion thing is simple to solve.
What others believe is none of your damn business, as long as they understand that what you believe is none of their damn business either.
Live and let live.
>>44188186
AND IT WAS ON THAT FATEFUL DAY, THAT ANONYMOUS POSTED THAT FAMOUS POST ON THE TRADITIONAL GAMES BOARD ON 4CHAN, AND ALL RELIGIOUS CONFLICT CEASED FOREVER
I work with a guy who attempted to give me an entire lecture about how D&D is satanic and causes people to murder.
I calmly asked him to not speak to me about it again, and now he keeps asking me how my worship to Satan is going. I respond with "Kord is the only god I need" now. Thinking about taking him to HR with this bullshit. Considering how it IS getting in the way of my work with his "harassment".
>>44183999
I'm glad it isn't sorcery, my CHA score is in the single digits.
>>44184572
I am 30 years old and have to hide my roleplaying from my mom otherwise she wouldn't let me see my niece and nephew...
>>feels good man
>>44183999
When I was 15 and leaving the house my mom asked where I as going, when I told her to a friends to play D&D she had a panic attack thinking I was going to do satanic rituals and sacrifices. This was a solid 20 years after the the whole bullshit that happened in the 80s but somehow it was still going around.
>>44184712
Dude, my best friend and foreverDM couldn't attend a single fucking game for five minutes without his controlling cunt of a girlfriend harassing him constantly on the fucking phone. Some bitches are nuts.
Then she started playing in the games and that was worse. She fucking argues over every fucking GM decision ever jesus fuck.
>>44184765
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JiW3qRlDhig
there ya go bub
>>44184065
SAISPH
I honestly thought that was going to mean something.
>>44184504
I also met my wife through D&D, even though she doesn't play.
>>44183999
What is it about people who, when they find something they don't like, instantly go out of their way to shover their face repeatedly into said thing they doing like and keep screaming about it?
There's one guy in my group, paladin who is screaming about the possibility of a wizard summoning demons. One of their reasons against it has been personally religious.
This is rich coming from a guy who had no problem getting a necromantic Death Knight and a demon summoning Warlock to level 90 on WoW either.
>>44185551
One fedoratheist is giving the rest of us a bad name. Thank god I grew out of that shit and am now a normal, who gives a shit type atheist.
>>44184248
That's a blackguard, not a paladin.
>>44189146
I think it's mostly an American phenomenon. I think so, anyway. Mostly people don't give a shit here, probably because like half the population is essentially irreligious and all the young to young-ish people are atheist or agnostic.
>>44187664
There are Jehovah's Witnesses all over the New York City subway. Weird little cult. Better than the Hare Krishnas though
>>44183999
If your lifestyle is based on teaching children bullshit from a book, obviously you're going to panic a bit when they start reading a book with way cooler bullshit in it.
I live in Sweden though, where role-playing games are surprisingly popular given the small population, and getting upset about stuff for religious reasons hasn't been a thing for ages here, the only people who do it are muslim immigrants and a few offshoot christian cults.
Over here the scare was never about satanism and shit like that, it was way more about "violence" and how action movies and role-playing games were going to turn us all into rapists and mass murderers. Sort of like the modern day video-game blaming in the states.
This was never widespread though and very few have experienced it first hand, it was something that mainly existed as an evil strawman for concerned mothers to rile each other up with, and there were a couple of cases of violence or murder with young offenders where the defence tried to go with the "role-playing games made him do it" schtick, but that was like back in the nineties.
>>44187283
>I'd rather have my hobbies be treated as evil, than have the "moral" guardians of the decade (the church, soccer moms, SJWs, and what not) try to change it into what suits their tastes
amen brother
>>44185786
It's seen as a bad sign in crazy fucktarded Christian sects that hold that sorcery exists, like the Protestants. The rest of us are just concerned about the Jews.
>>44183999
I used to have a Christian friend. We were both Star Trek fans, but he once told me his parents didn't approve.
They thought Star Trek was "occult".
>>44184072
So did they only glance at the monster manual and/or DM guide? The vast majority of player parties are good, our at the very least neutral.
The objective of most parties will be to move against such things...
>>44187283
This.
"Stop liking what I don't like!"
in the 80's it was Metal
in the 90's it was Video games
in the 00's it was Nu-Metal
in the 10's it's now back to Video games being sexist.
>>44189344
>>44189344
Until the evil feminists and SJW's are the majority consumers of those hobbies, they'll never be able to do more than maybe scare the big, family-friendly brands into playing it safe, or trying to cash in on them a bit, which they were already doing anyway.
The internet hugbox makes them look and feel far more relevant than they'll ever be for the simple reason that they just complain about shit and agree with each other but don't actually do much themselves.
Eventually someone will make the most PC and inclusive game in the history of games and realize that the people who were the most vocal about being excluded and offended still won't buy it because gaming isn't actually their hobby, nurturing a victim complex and holding their breath until they get their way is.
>>44184572
My mom repeatedly threw out my MTG and Pokemon cards.
She threw away a couple of D&D books too. I had to start hiding them.
I started collecting Spawn comics, and she was pretty firmly against that. Then she saw the movie and figured it was okay because he was fighting AGAINST evil. Also, she liked the actor playing him.
Then I started getting into other sci-fi RPGs. She later told me that it wasn't so much all the Satan worshipping stuff, as much as the fact that she didn't want me to become some closeted weirdo who can't tell reality from fantasy and sits in his apartment all day playing videogames.
She's really cooled off about it now that I'm older. I'm married, have a pretty good job, I'm getting another degree, and I still play all those crazy fantasy games, play videogames, and do Renfaires- among other things. She sees that they didn't fuck me up.
I haven't told her that the wife and I have started practicing Haitian Vodou yet. Might be a little too much for her.
>>44189187
I imagine people who live in countries where religion is not an active problem like it is in the US are going to be more laid back about it in general.
>>44189464
For a short while, it was Chess.
so basically ITT
>fuck christianity
>fuck sjw
>fuck dumb parents
what else is new
>>44189551
Religiosity in a society is inversely proportional to most positive indicators. Nations that score highly on quality of life lists tend to have religiously indifferent populations. USA combines a very religious tradition (many cities were founded by various religious sects) and a very unhealthy society with exceptionally sensationalist media, so they have a large number of wackos who get a disproportionate amount of attention.
>>44189475
Plenty of people buy Bioware games, though. Not the same audience, but close to it. Bioware is cashing in on SJW's.
>>44184971
a hundred time this
>>44185070
That's the reason why I don't buy into Pascal's Wager, and one of the main reason I've never seen a point in becoming religous. Every religion in the world claims they're the One True Religion, and offers the same amount of proof (ie. very little). So it's very likely that you could spend your life as a devout Christian only learn after death that sorry, the correct answer was Odin. No Valhalla for you.
You could follow the tenents of every religion in existence just to be sure, but that would be difficult if not impossible (can't exactly reconsile, say, the "you shall have no other gods but me" from the ten commenments with worshipping every pantheon in existence), and whatever god that may or may not exist likely wouldn't take too kindly on you worshipping him not out of any real faith but along with every other god that may or may not exist "just in case".
At least if you remain neutral on the matter and it turns out god does exist, you at least have a better explanation for not worshipping him than if you devote your life to worshipping another god that didn't actually exist (in the former case you've remained neutral because of lack of information on one way or another, while in the latter you've misintreperted or belived in false information).
>>44189522
>practicing Haitian Vodou
Don't do Voodou anon, that stuff really takes away your soul.
>>44189675
Plenty of people buy Bioware games because plenty of people don't know better. Bioware RPG is a genre in itself, now. A trademark with its own pool of consumers. Or because even more people don't give a fuck about writing, craftsmanship or just basic decency of delivering a complete product. They want to have some light fun and don't care if some bits suck ass or cost $15 extra. It's no worse than what you get from an average Hollywood blockbuster.
>>44186443
Which means you aren't worshipping that fucking religion. Your following your own personal religion that you adhere too
>>44189675
I think this is inaccurate though.
Bioware makes high-profile, content/story heavy games that appeal to a huge amount of players, the SJW stuff is both incredibly exaggerated and more about the culture in their writing department than something that actually drives sales to any significant amount. If their games were incredibly sexist, people would still play the shit out of them while writing angry rants on tumblr.
And like I said, of course big companies cash in on it, their job is to get people to give them money.
my mom hates my guns and thinks they should be banned
...
oh wait wrong thing to talk about
>>44189804
>>44189836
Maybe. But it's pretty clear that Bioware's writing culture was actively changed by SJW complaints. Up until the first Mass Effect and Dragon Age, they were a normal company. Afterwards, they shifted focus in audiences.
>>44189837
I'm just waiting for the moment when a WAAC neckbeard clubs his GM to death in a bout of retard strength with a copy of The Book of Nine Swords, thus legally weaponizing RPGs and having them treated as dangerous, controlled substances.
>>44184572
I kinda do, sometimes the fact that there's a dirty in Pathfi der named Asmodeus, who is supposed to basically be Satan, large demons named Tiamat, among other ancient names. As an earlier anon said, among Christians, just mentioning the spirit can attract its attention.
That said, I like to run D&D and Pathfinder in low magic and avoid all the stuff that makes me and my friends uncomfortable, because we're adults, not children who cry. So there's that.
>>44189903
Their player base was largely the same, they made more of an effort not to offend the people who scream a lot on the internet, that's not really the same.
I mean, did you play through the game and feel "oh man all this sjw bullshit getting in the way of my fun"? Probably not. They threw the tumblrinas a bone because creative writers and game devs are skittish as fuck about being seen as anti-feminist these days because of social media and games journalism etc.
>>44190054
I played Mass Effect 2, and said "this is so different from what I enjoyed about the first that it's really not the same game anymore". There was a massive paradigm shift in which target audience they approached. That doesn't translate to 100% SJW influence, but that was definitely a part of it.
>>44183999
>Remember when Dungeons and Dragons was evil and was teaching kids to summon up satan?
Remember? It's still like that for many poor kids out there. But, peril of internet, has overshadowed many of the older heathenish activities.
>>44189475
>Until the evil feminists and SJW's are the majority consumers of those hobbies, they'll never be able to do more than maybe scare the big, family-friendly brands into playing it safe, or trying to cash in on them a bit, which they were already doing anyway.
So there hasn't actually been any change. Good to know.
>>44190100
Could you give an example of how you felt the second game was different to the first in a way that was clearly due to catering to SJW's?
>>44190133
The increased focus on interpersonal contact in general, and same-sex relations in particular.
>>44184286
I got a girlfriend out of it, temporarily.
I only noticed too late that she was lusting after how I acted in-game. My IRL self being totally different was my downfall. Our association lasted about a year.
I guess that makes me a decent actor though.
>>44190100
>There was a massive paradigm shift in which target audience they approached. That doesn't translate to 100% SJW influence, but that was definitely a part of it.
The thing that bugged me about MEII was Tali. They caved to Talifags and not only made her a romance option, but also made her into this lovestruck little girl with daddy issues who had a crush on her sempai.
>>44190182
But that describes half the cast. Talking to your crew was a metaphorical minefield of them wanting to jump your bones.
