Hey /tg/, what exactly happens when an empire collapses? What happens to its people? What happens to its army, and its generals, and its government?
I'm planning a D&D 5e game soon and it takes place 25 years after the collapse of a tyrannical empire in a middle eastern themed part of the world and the nations it conquered have been rebuilding and reclaiming their heritage and culture, but I'm not exactly sure how things go from there.
>>44082803
Generally speaking they just kinda decay over time and factions claim different territories as their own.
First you gotta tell us how it collapsed.
enjoy the weird temporary fusion religions springing up
>>44082881
Oh, sorry.
A big fucking war.
The empire in question in my game was manipulated into attacking another nation by a necromancer cult that planned to use the deaths caused by the ensuing war as sacrifices to summon their god. Unfortunately, the nation they attacked called on three other allies that made war on the empire and defeated it.The emperor is assumed slain, but in reality, the mists from Ravenloft claimed him, so he might as well be dead to that world.
>>44082881
this, how an empire collapses can determine entirely the results of what's left
also whenever I read the comic in the OP I always lose it at "Double Hell"
>>44082803
The answer to all of your questions is "it depenends on a wide number of things".
What kind of empire?
What are the people like? Their culture, their beliefs, their religion, their history, their relationship with their rulers, their government, their recent past?
How big an empire? How long did it last? When did it get made? How did the culture turn to imperialism? How did it achieve it? How did it sustain it? What kind of technology are we talking about? How widespread was it? How big was the government? What kind of government was it?
If you want a "real" answer to the questions you asked you need to get around to asking the question; your initial doesn't actually have an answer because it requires every culture that's ever become an imperial power to be exactly the same as every other one, and like everything else based in real life this is too simple a definition.
>>44082803
Spooky monsters kill all the people and they get replaced by other people who appear out of the ground
Or reasonably speaking empires fall in a variety of wars, like exceedingly slow decline or rapid toppling
Sometimes the empire exists only on paper anyway, and the chief states comprising said empire are already more or less empires on their own like the Austrian empire succeeding the Holy Roman Empire
They can also rise and fall during the span of a single ruler, often Chinese dynasties were interrupted by a new dynasty which had to fight claimants from the old dynasty and ended when the imperial founder was finally killed and the old dynasty reclaimed their entire territory. The first French empire also rose and fell in a short, violent period.
Sometimes the empire has been wittled away over the decades or centuries and controls little direct territory and are subsumed into new aspiring empires which clash and eventually consume the territory of the old empire, like the Byzantine empire being divided up by the Ottoman, Serbian and Bulgarian empires which then fought each other for supremacy
The people continue to exist, things can get really shitty for them like during the collapse of the Western Roman Empire or maybe the only difference is who their ruler is
>>44082944
The three nations that attacked the Empire probably carved up several good chunks of territory to "reclaim their kin's ancestral lands".
The central empire might still be functioning in some reduced capacity, depending on if any highly-placed nobles or generals were able to seize the reins of power.
If the trade routes have been blockaded or otherwise cut off, then the central empire is probably SOL, because it likely relied on imported goods for most of its people. Expect massive migrations out of the area, a reduced amount of qualified guards, and a general worsening of living conditions for people whose livelihoods relied on a strong empire.
>>44082803
Wrong question. An empire doesn't collapse and then things happen to it, it collapses because what's happened to it causes people to look at it and say "wow, that USED to be awesome."
It's like asking what happens to an argument when the people having it stop arguing. "It depends on how they resolved it" is technically valid, and there's a couple of common responses, but it's ultimately sort of missing the point of what an argument is and what "stopping" means for it.
>>44082944
Then that depends on how they were "defeated" and what the four victors decided to do with it.
If their armies were smashed and then everyone shrugged and went home, it never "fell" except as a military power.
If the victors burned every major settlement they could find to the ground, it probably suffered economic and infrastructural collapse and the surviving parties are now relatively isolated and accordingly poor.
If the victors divvied up the territory between themselves, then things probably continued more or less as normal with some major local disruptions.
And so on and so forth. Again: "Empire fall, wat do?" is a relatively meaningless question.
Thanks for the advice, guys. I've got some more details to work out about this empire before I can figure out exactly what happened after it fell, but I wanted a strong theme for this game to be "reclaiming what was taken" because the PCs will be playing characters from various countries that were formerly ruled by this empire
>>44082803
What is in Scarytown?
>>44083863
Half-drow-half-spider-half-devil-half-spider Illithids.
And yes, that ads up to an entire spider.
>>44082803
>What happens to its army, and its generals
If you want a somewhat modern example on a smaller scale: In the early 2000s, Iraq's army was disbanded with no adequate replacement, and after that the soldiers (now lacking any career prospects or marketable civilian skills) took their weapons, armor, and training home with them. They often joined militias and/or became insurgents fighting the occupation.
Leaders would escape if they can, ideally with as much money as they can funnel out with them. Those that didn't escape would probably die to whatever made the empire fall, or else be thrown in jail or executed. There might be a government in exile if there's still a place that obeys them. Some military leaders or local officials might form militias, mercenary groups, or carve out their own zones of control from what remains of their command.
Employees and bureaucrats have decent odds of being allowed to continue running affairs, at least for a time. They know how things work in the former empire, after all, and have some power over its institutions. If someone intends to hold onto the former empire (like a reasonably-civilized invader or a rebellion), they might still want to keep water and power flowing, have garbage collected and fires put out, and make the trains run on time.
>>44082803
Power vacuum leads to people trying to fill that void.
Neighboring states move in, claiming territory. Remaining generals become warlords with whatever force they still command. Its former citizens migrate to better lands if possible. The old ways change or are lost.
>>44086427
If its a large empire, they may well stay put. Empires tend to fracture when they fall and going "fuck those guys, we're the REAL inheritors of the empire" is possibly the grandest tradition of local governors.
>>44082803
>middle eastern themed part of the world
Magical suicide bombers.
>>44088270
good meme
upvoted
>>44082803
Often times, they splinter: see Alexander for an example.
Alternately, presuming theres no suitably charismatic generals, the soldiers form militias and start to establish independent settlements.
Some will also turn to mercenary work and bandits.
For most people, life probably progresses as normal but with increased dangers.
As for the government, they try to secure as much territory and such as they can, scrambling to hold whatever they can together individually or together.
>>44082803
When the Rathe Empire finally collapsed, it wasn't from any of its foreign rivals, nor from the various rebellions that would spring up from time to time, nor from the barbarian hordes that always made themselves a nuisance; rather, it was from poor leadership. But to put that poor leadership on the head of any one of the Rathe emperors would also be incorrect. In truth, the Rathe Empire had suffered from a line of incompetent emperors for generations.
To say or imply Emperor Pirius, the last truth Emperor of Rathe, was the worst would also be false. While Emperor Pirius was naive and too trusting, leading to not only his downfall but the downfall of his empire, others had paved the way for the destruction with their wanton greed, their insatiable lusts, and their unwarranted and misguided overconfidence. Emperor Pirius was merely the last straw that broke the camel's back.
Upon the betrayal of Pirius, the Rathe Empire went through nearly a hundred emperors in a month. At first, the coronation of a new emperor was cause for celebration. Parades through the streets. Shops closed. The people sang the new emperor's name. After about the twentieth, people stopped caring. After around the fiftieth, when the empire was getting a new emperor twice (sometimes three times) a day, the people couldn't even keep up.
During this time of confusion, the Rathe Empire lost a lot of its territory. Under the guidance of foolish emperors, the empire had reached out too far, and now its conquered lands were slipping from its grasps. Some of the these territories simply reverted to their old leadership, some were absorbed into neighboring, rival kingdoms, and others became the territory of warlords.
Eventually, the generals of the emperor's army, without an emperor, began disputing over leadership, each fighting for "the true emperor." The lands of the Rathe Empire split among the winning generals, who emerged as kings from the ruins of the empire.
>>44088453
Still, none of these kings possessed the power of the Rathe Empire, so roads went into disrepair. Trade routes that were safe under the empire's protection mostly fell to banditry. The great wonders of the Rathe Empire fell to disrepair. Monuments hastily ordered by the incompetent emperors went unfinished, and along the road to New Den (formerly Raemos, the capital of the Rathe Empire) half stand statues of the worst emperors of the empire, all missing arms and heads and legs. One is only the emperor's horse, with its rider completely missing save the legs.
Coins from the empire still get traded, but more often than not, are melted down to make coins for the new kings. Some of the empire's traditions remain, but in new forms. Rathe Day became King's Day in some of the new kingdoms. Many traditions have been entirely abandoned, especially the new holidays minted by those incompetent last emperors. A lot of the history has been forgotten. A lot of stories and plays and songs lost, others changing in form and meaning.
Rathi is still spoken. Some people even still say "Thank the Emperor" and other similar expressions, but they aren't quite said with the same feeling they had when the empire was at its height.
A few of the empire's descendants, like myself, are scholars of the old empire. There's just a fascination, a sense of wonder, when one stumbles upon the old texts, or enters one of the old arenas. There's a sense of finding something about yourself there in the remains of your ancestors: something familiar, yet different.
>>44082803
Depends on the kind of empire and the kind of collapse. And how long it's been in charge. And what do you mean by it being tyrannical.
>>44088573
Bah, spoke too soon, you already answered some stuff. Not the other stuff though.
>>44082803
they just disappear
>>44082946
It's pretty good, and it's the kind of joke that PA is good at delivering. Well, used to be good at delivering.
One day my players will visit Double Hell. The hard part is getting through Shadow Shadow Bo Badow first.
>>44082803
>Hey /tg/, what exactly happens when an empire collapses? What happens to its people? What happens to its army, and its generals, and its government?
Everyone has to make a save roll on dex or get 2d6 damage caused by the collapsing empire.
>>44088641
I give PA a lot of bunk, but that was a good comic.
>>44088655
Man, wizards be boned
Bandits fucking everywhere.
All those soldiers deployed all across the Empire. Most of them are from far off nations, and now have no easy way back. No supplies, l i t t l e m o n e y, and of course, everyone with a grudge against the empire's going to go after the soldiers.
So go awol, find some dumb village, and steal what they have. Then find another village. Kill any peasant dumb enough to stop you. After all, you should be paid by their taxes, but without tax collectors, you might as well just go collect them yourself.
>>44082803
>To some people, this counts as humor.
God help us.
No nation, no more army. Soldiers turn to crime and mercenary work because there's no one paying their checks anymore and their skills aren't useful elsewhere.
Look at what happened in Eastern Europe when communism fell. The Serbian Mafia and the Russian Mafiya are fucking terrifying because they're all made of ex-military.
The Serbs robbed a bank with a goddamn helicopter, and the crime rate only went down because the government started hiring the same ex-soldiers as police instead.
a multitude of things, in rome i think it was blamed on the influx of foreigners, the collapse of the patriarchical hierarchy, the religious stuff, corruption and that the military became outdated and spread thin
>>44084175
Just one entire spider, or like some kind of recursive spider hydra, where if you smash it with a hammer, two more spiders take it's place?
>>44088655
>make a save roll on dex or get 2d6 damage caused by the collapsing empire.
>tfw peasants have 4hp
Empires fall, everyone dies
