Connecting to Shadowlands BBS...
>Verifying Biometrics...
>Identity Verified...
>Opening /srg/...
Books:
http://pastebin.com/SsWTY7qr
Chummer 5:
https://github.com/chummer5a/chummer5a/releases/latest
Issue tracker:
https://github.com/chummer5a/chummer5a/issues
Last Thread: >>[DATA CORRUPTED]
Because one anon asked for it last thread, what are your HRT teams like? When shit hits the fan, who hits back?Also, what's up with the archive? We're missing like the last 3 generals
I have a month to kill before my session starts, and I'm working on backup characters. I've got a couple so far, but I'm trying to figure out extra roles to cover.
Current character:
>Ex-ganger human cybersam with a side in lock cracking
Backup:
>Chaos mage with an xbox hueg pile of Shape spells
Party's a drone rigger, illusion mage, and mundane face. I'm not sure what other roles to cover with other characters. Things I'm considering:
>Disguise adept with facial sculpt, kinesis, etc etc and the quality from Hard Targets that makes you have to wear a disguise at all times
>Parkour unarmed adept (I actually have this one partially statted out)
>Corporate wolf-spider (part decker, tiny part rigger, part infiltrator, all anti-security)
Any other ideas that might work out? Character generation is all I get to do with Shadowrun now.
Pic related is the Horizon HTR for our (upcoming) campaign, Event Horizon. There's nothing documented on them that I've found (corporate security or otherwise) beyond their name, so we ended up having to fluff a lot of it ourselves while in the planning stages. Heavy usage of rigger-style surveillance drone networks (it'll allow fancy tricks like the Barrett through the wall later in the campaign, if need be), PI-TAC systems, etc. More cyber- and matrix-heavy than your generic Knight Errant goons. Internal structure is fucked up, and individual teams got hit hard with Horizon's "everyone is perfect and decent in the exact form we want them to be"; skillwired-up goons with a link back to Horizon's own skillsoft network combined with how deemphasized their personal selves are means you're gonna see a lot of faceless, interchangeable parts. Maybe even the really elite groups having good ol' prototype ware to link them and their actions together to coordinate (see Corporate Guide 104 from 4E if you want to know where I pulled that from).
That's kind of a mess of writing but hopefully it made sense.
>>43911060
Actually, hell. I'm gonna piggy-back a question off my own post.
What the fuck is Horizon's deal?
I've got most of the other corps pegged down, I think. Aztech has their blood magic shenanigans, Renraku had the entire Deus mess back in the day (and I'm not sure what they're doing now), EVO is transhumanism incarnate and accepts head cases, so on and so forth. But what the fuck is going on with Horizon?
Pic unrelated, generic PSC.
>>43911503
>But what the fuck is going on with Horizon?
You mean the mega-corporation that has almost complete control over media, entertainment and public relations?
The mega-corporation who's slogan is "We know what you think?"
The mega-corporation that has a Shadowgroup dedicated to eradicating or propagating memes?
>>43911600
Yes, that Horizon. What's its biggest frag-up?
Renraku had Deus. Ares had Excalibur. Aztecs had nationalization debacle (not sure if Sirrurg counts as a snafu case). Evo is a russian corp now. When did Horizon faceplant to a pile of cerberus shite?
>>43911060
Two obvious holes in the party as-is are decking and a dedicated killer. Drones are fine for cover, but they can't carry you through a fight, and it's tricky to make a rigger/decker work.
You've got no one great at handling the Matrix, and no one who can really pull your ass out of the fire when more than 3 bog-standard rentacops show up.
>>43911941
A well-televised massacre of technomancers in Las Vegas. Also, they backed the wrong horse in the Az-Am War.
>>43911972
Did you miss where I'm a street sam, or are you assuming for once I kick the can? I've got ~14-16 on my combat dice rolls, I think, in both Automatics and Unarmed.
>>43912035
Thought you were asking specifically about opinions on your backup characters. As is, the party only has Matrix stuff as the big hole, but when your character dies it's Matrix and physical security.
>>43912137
All right, just making sure, since you said as-is. The face has some combat skill, but not enough to carry it himself, most likely. As far as the decker-rigger bit goes, I'm not even sure the wolf spider would have a control rig and all that, more of hacking and controlling security drones along with the rest of a building's security systems.
>>43910816>Also, what's up with the archive? We're missing like the last 3 generals
>>43877586
>>43770218
>>43803803
>>43912398
The only one I can see in the official archive is >>43803803 →
>>43912438
>>43912398
Wait, I see the problem; nobody's using /srg/ in the OP. Why aren't people using /srg/ in the OP? It makes it so much easier to find.
>>43912398
>>43912467
Another General missed in that roundup >>43842334
We really need to standardize naming conventions.
>>43910816
My party is in a long conflict with Ares and has run into HTR's more than once. I have them lead by "domesticated" prime runners.
The Roman. An Amerindian Ork in milispec armour who favours an Ares Stoner loaded with hi-EX explosive rounds. Wears a custom centurion helmet, killed the party rigger by emptying a belt into her van.
Moxie- Double cyberarmed psychopath who favoured knives, nearly impossible to put down due to the fact he had a maxed our pain editor and used alot of drugs. Killed the parties troll tank hand to hand and has a chunk of horn as a keepsake.
Mr. Black- Cold calculating mage, initiated twice, expert at setting up ambushes, favours shape and manipulation spells. Is currently stalking the party gathering as much intel as he can.
Once the party beats him I think the three will come together and form a strike team. Some sort of shield to protect Ares from the runners.
>>43912615
Standardization is for the wageslaves, omae!
But seriously, at least keep something Shadowrun in the title, I couldn't figure out why there weren't any generals until I realized my filter against generals was excluding these (the exemption tag was srg and not shadowrun)
>>43912679
What are the double arms like? Must have crazy AGI and STR to do serious damage with knives.
how do infiltrator mage/mysads work, usually?
>>43912679
>pic related
>>43912721
Very well. Improved Invisibility is great, plenty of mental influence/illusion spells if you want to be subtle about it, and being able to have a spirit bail you out is top.
What's the most interesting role for an edges focused character?
>>43914051
Untrained demolitions.
![61ejSgVkQbL._SY344_BO1,204,203,200_[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/6sStdmN.jpg "61ejSgVkQbL._SY344_BO1,204,203,200_[1].jpg")
/srg/, I need a bit of help.
I recently GMed for the very first time, and did Food Fight for 4e. I'm fairly certain it didn't go great, but the players haven't kicked me out of the GM chair and I'm moving onto a proper game.
Thing is, I'm not exactly sure which module to try and run. So far, I'm leaning on pic related, as it's supposed to be for beginners, and I actually have the book. The downside is that one of my players has actually GMed it before themselves.
Should I just do it, or are there other 4e runs good for starting GMs?Also, how easy is it to adapt older modules to work on 4e?
>>43912713
Customized out the wazoo. Plus he's using GM fiat mono-knives.
>>43912680
All of the missing threads have Shadowrun General in their title.
>>43914274
On the run as written was really weird and confusing to me. Starting with the Johnson meet and throughout the adventure there was shit that I didn't get on, like, third read.
For example, how was the Johnson to receive the disc? Where exactly had it vanished? Who handled it last? How does the Johnson know that a random optical disc procured by runners at a flea market or a rarity shop ain't the real deal? How do runners recognize the right disc?
I could go on like that for half an hour.
... or maybe I'm just daft and all that crap is thought of by the author. Please do supply a page reference if you want to call me an illiterate idiot.
>>43915140
I don't have the book on me, but didn't it have JetBlack's handwriting on it?
>>43910816
>When shit hits the fan, who hits back?
My group operating in Marseille has just found out about the S-K deathsquad.
I have given them a vague look made of full MilSpec integral armor Dredd-styled badasses who take no prisoners, but nothing much.
Someone in the last thread mentioned Turbo Bunny and Cherry Bomb getting gangbanged in the last thread and I can't get it out of my head.
Thanks whoever you are.
>>43915512
Go make an expedition over to /d/ drawthread. Might as well get something out of your newfound desire.
Do claw and bone density damage stack?
>>43916124
By RAW, bone density increases "unarmed combat" damage. Now, the Unarmed Combat skill does have a cyber-implant weapon specialty and you can use a natural weapons specialty for the skill as well.
It's a nitpick but due to the case of unarmed combat vs. Unarmed Combat, I'd say no. That's RAI, though, I imagine.
Read strictly, that would work.
Truthfully, you should bring that up with your GM. I'd allow it, personally, if the claws were natural and were actually bone.
So I have a game that's starting this coming weekend but I believe it'll mostly just be char gen and some practice runs for the main game.
My main question is will I be gimping myself if I go unarmed without being some kind of Adept? The main concept for the character I have going is a EVO designer baby who's a doctor that's into transhumanist idea but also takes their hippocratic oath serious to the point they won't kill another person so I'm mostly focusing combat wise on unarmed and maybe some kind of shock baton and the use of knockout drugs/dart gun.
Will I be a hinderance to the team fighting this way?
Can we make a Shadowrun version of this
We need pictures and ideas for text
>>43916464
>insuring
DROPPED
>>43916464
Please can we keep this shit out of here? I'd really like at least one bastion from the normie/reee bullshit.
>>43916339
>will I be gimping myself if I go unarmed without being some kind of Adept?
Not really.
>Will I be a hinderance to the team fighting this way?
Non-lethal takedowns only? Nope. Melee only? Yes.
>>43916565
I don't have access to the book at the exact moment but primarily I wanted to avoid putting points into guns as much as possible for the other skills such as the medicine group and what not. What is a good way for me to handle enemies like enemy drones or other non human opponents (or opponents with heavy armor for that matter).
>>43916741
>wah wah I don't want to take weapon skills
How the fuck are you going to use a non-lethal weapon, then, duckface
>>43916785
He said he wanted to avoid putting points into /guns/, not all weapons entirely. Plenty of melee and unarmed nonlethal weapons. But you did raise a valid point, melee-only is a hindrance. Other-guy, I don't know how to help you, but your best friend is going to be Stick-and-shock rounds or gel rounds.
>>43916823
Can you throw stick and shocks or are they only available as bullets and or arrow heads?
>>43916845
>Can you throw stick and shocks
>>43917004
a throwing adept that uses bullets and spent shell casings
>>43916741
>What is a good way for me to handle enemies like enemy drones or other non human opponents
Guns.
>or opponents with heavy armor for that matter
Grenades, all of them.
>I wanted to avoid putting points into guns as much as possible
Well sucks to be you.
>>43916845
Shafts/heads/bullets only. Hard targets has a throwing syringe though.
>>43917045
Literally zero damage.
>>43917089
>Literally zero damage.
Whatever you say friend
>>43917089
but you know what, chummer?
people would tell stories about that man.
immortality's worth it, i think
So I got a question about Edge.
I know you can spend it to reroll dice that weren't hits, or add the edge dice on top of your dice pool before rolling a test and you can reroll any 6s, or burn one forever to say nuh-uh to a bullet in your eyeball.
It says you can regain edge by performing good roleplaying for the GM. but, if I start out at character creation with 3 edge does that mean the GM can grant me more edge above that 3 or does that mean I can only hold a maximum of 3 edge at a time.
>>43917138
>people would tell stories about that man
About *another* throwing adept?
>>43917396
3's your cap. Using edge lowers your edge until you recover it naturally up to your cap and burning edge lowers the cap by 1.
>>43917396
You only can hold 3 untill you buy more Edge.
>>43917445
Why are throwing adepts so coo in concept, but always lame in execution?
>>43917877
They are good if you focus on throwing actual weapons and not just some junk.
Throwing pencils and paper airplanes can be something that compliments your skills and that's it.
>>43917954
No they're great. When you can throw a tomahawk at someone in full body armour so hard you kill them it's awesome. And I agree and the ability to walk into a place ostensibly unarmed and still take on guys with guns is super cool.
It's just in practice everyone is Bullseye or Gambit and it's gay as shit.
>>43912679
>your player group enjoys moxie and mr. black as characters and asks you to include them in further conflicts
>"no, you want the roman"
How exactly are riggers different from deckers? Actually.. why would you ever want to rig yourself into a drone? What if your drone gets squashed? especially something like one of those bug drones?
>>43917138
Immortality in the sense of, "Remember that idiot who threw shell casings around? He got ventilated by some kid trying to get into the Halloweeners, the kid just stood there are he was lightly bruised by brass before putting three bullets in the idiot's head. I'm going to tell the story of that moron for the rest of my life."
>>43918721
Drones have a maximum skill pool of 9, excluding bonuses. Your average rigger will have a skill pool of at least 12-16, with a reduced difficulty threshold based on their control rig's rating. In addition to that, there is a world of difference between giving a drone with a brain roughly equivalent to a dog and performing the action yourself.
Assuming you're talking about 5th, the only real reason a rigger can't double as a decker or vice versa is one of cost. Drones are fragile and expensive, while decks are just ludicrously expensive (Though Data Trails does a lot to mitigate this).
>>43918721
Deckers do computer warfare stuff. Their arena is software and the Matrix.
Riggers use robots in the real world to do things; they have their robots sneak into places metahumans can't reach, they drive vehicles no one else knows how to use, and they might have a swarm of drones to riddle people with bullets.
Mechanically, jumping into your drone gives you benefits (from the improved control) but it does put you at risk for some feedback. It's not that hard to avoid if you've got a good console, though.
>>43918402
This guy gets it.
What's An interesting persona for a Decker? I want to steal your ideas.
My initial characterization was Richard Stallman by way of Robert Anton Wilson and The Legendary Pink Dots, although the latter two are more reflective of a mage I think and that role has been spoken for.
Other than that the image I have in my mind is the typical mirror shades black trencoat skinny pale guy, slightly arrogant and a bit nerdy, which is pretty rote.
Is it inappropriate of an e-ghost to romance a technomancer? Asking for a friend.
>>43920258
What is inappropriate in the future?
>>43920375
Romancingelves
>>43920258
Highly inappropriate.
But it will feel so right, you won't care.
>>43920258
somewhat related. If you are jacked into the matrix full VR, would you know if someone if messing with your body likeholding you hand
>>43920411
That is probably the most socially acceptable fetish in the 6th world. Like when dudes are sitting around in the bar you know the conversation goes like this
Guy 1: So I've been dating this ork chick for a few weeks, it's been amazing. The sex is CRAZY.
Everyone else: Oh!
Guy 2: I can't believe you're with a tusk girl! They're not even people! Humans and metas shouldn't ever be together!
Guy 1: Yeah well what about elves?
Guy 2: Well...I mean...elves are fine.
Everyone: Yeah.
>>43920536
It depends, generally you're totally unaware of the meat world when you're hotsimmed. But you can override it and move around meat world but you're super fucked up because your brain is processing completely disassociated stimuli.
>>43920583
But dude.
They're ELVES.
decisions, decisions, do I want better edge or do I want to be an elf.
on the one hand, better chance to not fuck up my decking and elves don't help with logic or intuition.
on the other, being an elf and looking good out of the box.
I can't make up my mind
>>43920780
>Playing scum
>>43920780
Elf deckers are literally /dev/grrl tier. Be a human.
>>43917396
I don't like giving out extra karma to players outside of completing runs/story arcs. So, sometimes I let a player go above their maximum edge and get one more added to their pool. They only get to add dice equal to their normal maximum edge though, not higher.
>>43920780
More edge.
Unless you plan to take a high Charisma and skills to put it to good use. Orherwise, more edge. You cannot get enough edge.
>>43919000
Okay, I've seen talk about data trails, and I've also seen talk about being able to, like, turn a Metalink into a mid-tier deck for 100k. It seems really min-max-y to me, but, I find myself in a position where I'll be needing a good (or at least, decent) deck on the cheap.
How exactly do dongles, or whatever they're called, work? If it's an obscenely long description, then just leave it as "you REALLY just need to read it" or something (i'm on a phone and can't really use the paste bin so it will be a while anyway). Otherwise, I'm curious about alternatives to decking without breaking the Bank.
>>43922263
It's a hardware module that allows you to add an Attack or Sleaze attribute to your commlink, effectively allowing it to perform cyberdeck actions. The major differences between a 'link and a 'deck at that point are that a link can't switch its stats around, and it can only ever have the one module.
>>43922263
The Attack/Sleaze dongle allows your commlink to do Attack/Sleaze based actions and hack. But, you can only ever have one dongle installed, so you have to choose between Attack or Sleaze. You can never configure your stats either. Its a trade off of price versus versatility.
>>43922263
The cheapest "deck" you can use costs 510 nuyen.
Get some Stealth RFID tags, use the modification allowing to run a persona on it from DataTrails, and there you go: 0/3/3/3 "deck".
You'll need a datajack to connect through it, and you can only use cold-sim, but hey, it's extremely cheap.
>>43911981
>we decided to make the company based on media conglomerates completely retarded and unable to even control media
Also the whole Az-Am war thing is retarded, it should still be going on in early 5e, instead they made something that had the potential to turn into a world war into a one year affair.
>>43922515
>>43922375
>>43922308
Alright, thanks. Its... hm. That's interesting for sure. I could certainly see the uses of doing some small time hacking with a burner and literally smashing it if things go bad.
Whelp, in such a case, looks like I'm still damned with trying to build around buying a 300k deck for the sake of being ahead of the curve.
What the hell do you need the internal router for?
Can't you control all your shit with a commlink and a datajack?
>>43922576
Time hacking?
>>43922581
1: do you have enough datajacks to go to each piece of equipment?
2: do you have a free hand to adjust your equipments settings while, say, in a fire fight, firing on someone
>>43922581
You can. It's for those cases where you want the comlink out of the equation. (i.e. when you want your Wired Reflexes and Reaction Boosters to work together all the time whatever happens.)
>>43922603
Hacking that is Small-time, not a small amount of time hacking.
>>43922581
the internal router lets you get certain wireless bonuses without actually having your equipment set to wireless, and therefore be vulnerable to hacking
unfortunately, nothing specifies exactly what wireless bonuses the internal router applies to, so you're forced into playing Mother May I with your gm
>>43922610
Both those points are moot with a good comlink and creating a PAN with all your gear, omae.
>>43922633
There wireless bonus thing is the most perplexing. If the bonus comes from having your gear connected to the matrix, how could the router provide that shit?
>>43922676
Because, in some cases (which one depends on your GM), another piece of gear can deliver/substitute the data that would come from the Matrix.
How hard would it be to, like, have a legitimate SIN, own a business (commercial lifestyle, Run Faster), and also have the Day job quality, working at the very place that you own (effectively making 10 grand, needing to pay 8, and still getting an etiquette roll to reduce rent).
You could also take as many days off as you want (though have your DM change how much you make from day job if you end up working fewer hours)
R8 my half-assed attempt at a stealth/social hybrid. Would love some feedback.
>>43923661
>11 agility
>no initiative boosters
hilarious
you can only have one attribute at your racial max at chargen, so either charisma or agility needs to be lowered
disguise and palming are very good skills for you to have: disguise lets you look like you belong, a key part of any criminal endeavor, and palming has obvious applications
i'd also recommend taking pistols over automatics (or take both, 19 dice in your weapon skill is overkill), because handguns are easier to sneak in or justify, and in many cases will be easier to secure on-site if need be
you definitely need to have some kind of initiative booster, because 7+d6 is not nearly enough. even the averagest corpsec is going to have a good chance of acting before you, and of acting as often in a combat round
ideal would be a synaptic booster, because it isnt going to trigger MAD scanners like wired reflexes or reflex boosters will, but thats definitely out of reach for you
used reaction enhancers would go a long way towards ensuring you get that second initiative pass, but as cyberware they're going to probably show up on MAD scanners, and thats one more thing youll need to be able to explain to whoever youre visiting
a few doses of cram/jazz would do wonders. concealable if you invest in palming, effective enough to give you the edge against most goons, and they last long enough for most combats.
>>43922814
Ask your GM
>>43920536
short answer: no
Long answer: no
>>43920583
It's like gay people, but lesbian porn is fine.
>>43910816
?
My group decided tonight during a preliminary free for all between characters (so everyone knew the rules) that stun damage was way overpowered, being as it's a shorter damage track, and when it's filled, you're unconscious for at least an hour, which generally means dead. Of course, I'm using the basic house rule that a full stun damage track means you're unconscious, but they want the RAW, which is stun damage trades at 2 for 1 physical damage, and no unconsciousness.
Has anyone made any house rules for this system to still allow knockout toxins and such to work without completely filling both damage tracks?
>>43924717
What's your issue? The stun track isn't shorter, your team just didn't take any willpower because "that's not a combat stat, hurr durr"
>>43924717
Catalyst just kinda forgot to have you go unconscious when your stun track fills up. Quality!
And no, it's not OP. Same size as normal track, but with a stat other than body.
>>43924717
How knockout gasses work in RAW is that they kill you because it overflows into physical in a matter of seconds.
So we houserule that knockout gas doesn't overflow. Raw force like mana spells and a riflestock to the back should of course overflow.
And yeah, full stun track means KO.
You should recommend your party to get willpower because it's literally a resistance stat. Unless they want the first low level mage they come across to rape them of course. There's also combat drugs that increase willpower and some that increase pain resistance, meaning you wont take negative modifiers from having damage. So notify your gang of that option.
>>43924911
Not him, and you do have a point, but Wil is limited at 6 at chargen (unless Gnome/Naga/Pixie or E.A.), but you can get up to twice that in body and/or add more physical track with cyberlimbs.
>>43925009
Tl;Dr on drug use. Without going into homebrew chems which are an option in Run Faster, just the core book stuff.
Cram - Get Hyper, get twitch skills
DeepWeed - Mage mental focus
Bliss - Morphine
Jazz - Like Cram but operative style
Kamikaze - PlusEverything. Take note of the descriptor for users. This is what your tank will want to use.
>Kamikaze users are near-crazed, filled with a feeling of imperviousness and invincibility, exhibiting almost no regard for their own well-being. They can be entertaining to watch, as long as you’re not in front of them.
NovaCoke - allrounder drug. It's cocaine.
Psyche - The drug of choice for deckers and riggers.
Nitro - Like Kami, but less mind crazing. Gives +2 Willpower and +2 Perception, as opposed to Kami. Trade off is there's no boost to body or agility. But that pain tolerance won't make you want body. Damn, son. You won't feel a thing until you hit the ground.
Zen - It's weed, sorta.
>>43923224
well bugger me.
>>43925068
>Kamikaze - PlusEverything. Take note of the descriptor for users. This is what your tank will want to use.
>>Kamikaze users are near-crazed, filled with a feeling of imperviousness and invincibility, exhibiting almost no regard for their own well-being. They can be entertaining to watch, as long as you’re not in front of them.
so 'Kamikaze Troll' is runner speak for 'Holy crap move your asses!'
>>43925137
Oh fucking shit. At least she wasn't sacked? I think that's what's being implied here.
>>43925155
Yes
>>43924717
I haven't played 5th yet, but aren't Pain Editors and Trauma Dampeners a thing anymore?
Pain Editors solved the knockout problem quite handily in 4th
>>43925269
Pain Editors still exist. 18F, 0.3 essence, 48000 nuyen.
Solves the problem for runners, not the opposition.
Damage Compensators are like High Pain Tolerance: Useless in this case. They only allow you to suffer less negative modifiers while you're still conscious, but tbey do nothing to slow how fast the stun track gets filled, nor allow you to remain conscious longer.
>>43925320
>Not the opposition
What, you have a problem with people going down from injuries? I don't see the problem.
>>43925320
What keeps the opposition from implanting Pain Editors? Forbidden means nothing to CorpSec/HTR or an organized crime ring with a grudge.
Or is the problem that the opposition in general is too squishy? I always found that easy to remedy with tactics and the group edge rules.
How would you handle getting knocked out by non- or less-lethal means otherwise?
Genuinely curious, as I always found that simply knocking out everybody kind of detracts from the moral issues with Shadowrunning.
>>43925330
I would appreciate another solution than "get a pain editor." Especially a much cheaper and temporary one that would allow mid-level opposition to suddenly grow fangs in a desperate situation without loading them up with bioware they should never have access to.
>>43925386
Ahh, I see!
You could always have them huffing drugs like K10 or Kamikaze. Fluff at least supports Jazz-Use with police officers who run into shadow operatives.
Another thing you could try to make combat more challenging and really tense are your opposition chucking grenades everywhere. There are few things that get the blood of a player pumping like you describing the grenade that landed beside the dumpster she's crouching behind.
>>43925386
Nitro!
>>43925386
>should not have access to
>the people your fence gets that shit from in the first place don't use it
>just like monsters in DnD
Stop playing DnD.
>>43925700
> fencing cultured bioware
Kill yourself.
>>43925736
>getting it legally as a shadowrunner
You amuse me, but not in a good way.
>>43925536
Nitro gives one single temporary stun track box. The HPR 6 means any user will remain dangerous until they go down, but it doesn't make them last. No drug does significantly enhances the capacity of a body to take more stun damage (or ignore it), yet that's what I need as an alternative to more bodies.
>>43925384
I sadly don't have an answer to that question, hence my frustration. I tried with having the bonuses from cyberlimbs add to the stun track as well, but this still does favor runners and higher-end opponents. Put simply, what I need is the equivalent of what Jazz is to initiative for stun damage.
>>43925824
Just have mooks get the anti-electricity upgrade to their armor. There, now they only take stun from stunbolts.
>>43925824
Have you considered gas masks, isolated clothing or similar? I'm assuming you don't have a problem with fist adepts, because the fix for them is hilariously easy (start the combat out of melee range).
Most sources of stun damage can be entirely negated for cheap.
>>43925824
What sort of combat is your party using that you're significantly worried that stun damage is going to be a problem? Non lethal weapons are by design worse than lethal weapons. Using lethal weapons in an effort to apply non-lethal damage carries a -4 penalty, and still applies half stun/half physical.
Gas grenades can be powerful, but so can regular grenades. And the only gas that reliably works as a knockout gas is Neuro-Stun, which is contact vector, meaning your party requires a fully chem-sealed exosuit to walk into the room while the gas is active.
And if your party manages to pump neuro stun into a room, wait the 10 minutes it takes to dissipate, all without raising any alerts, they kinda earned it.
I don't suppose I could get a few more comments on >>43914274, could I /srg/?
>>43924717
That's not RAW, first of all.
It's one line in the description of the Pain Editor 'ware but the 5e book does state that you go unconscious when your Stun track is filled.
As others have stated, there's the same natural potential for damage tracks for both P and S but you can get bonuses more readily to absorb Physical damage.
Either get better at not getting hit or load up on more armor so your damage resistance is boosted; personally, my combat characters do both but that can be difficult to manage.
Also yes, when in doubt; pain editor.
>>43926162
Grab some of the Missions modules from the OP. They're good for beginner GMs. Just avoid the bits that railroad your players and keep in mind no encounter is mandatory. Also, if you can't explain how your runners were "found", don't have them be found by the obligatory combat encounter.
If you want to use prior editions, just whip up new stat blocks for your goons and you're good.
>>43925859
>>43925864
>>43925960
Mostly they use gel rounds on anything wearing an armor jacket or less, and switch to APDS against anything in real armor, "exploiting" the armor rules. That allow them to deal stun damage without any real drawback reliably, and the targets go down just as fast or faster. I can't even accuse them of metagaming, since an "AP ammo only against armored targets." rule actually makes sense.
Making HTR and other heavy hitters a hard nut to crack isn't the problem, but I really cannot justify beat cops, regular security guards and the like having enough cyberware and gear to be able to shrug off small arms fire.
Now you'll tell me such guards aren't supposed to be much of a threat to runners, just slow them down; and I agree with that idea. I just find that unless present in high numbers, they fail to do so.
>>43926246
Well, it depends, I guess. If regular security forces are overrun with ease constantly, even the thriftiest of companies will eventually shell out for some quality security and gear. So your runners are suddenly faced with loads of drones with improved firmware, juiced up security with assault rifles and layered armor and so on and so on.
But I personally do not like the player/pc arms race and escalation. I try to make my combats interesting by letting even mediocre goons use tactics to slow runners down. Things like smoke (with the security wearing thermal goggles), thermal smoke, Flash-Paks, cover (shooting around corners using smartlinked guns), covering fire, drones and grenades will at least make it harder and more dangerous to simply rush through these encounters, but yeah, YMMV as always
>>43926246
If your beat cops are constantly getting neutralised with relative ease, the proper reaction to it is to upgrade to a private security firm or to equip them better.
Why you'd have your cops underequipped to handle threats in the first place is something I do not know. Ignore the "recommendations" in the book. They're idiotic. Cops in Istanbul today have automatic weapons and body armor. You can do the same for your beat cops. They're citizens and they earn an honest living. Plus, an autoinjector loaded with cram, jazz and kamikaze, as well as decent body armor and an assault rifle are far cheaper than the cost of their training.
inbe4 some autist whines it's "not in the stat blocks that haven't changed in three ingame decades". Fuck that shit. Governments and by extension cops adapt to threats. If a beat cop needs to go toe to toe with a cybered up ganger, then he better damn well be capable of it.
I'm looking to build a Thrown Weapon Troll Adept. Any chummer done this before? Any pointers?
>>43926350
This. So much.
If your average, not-min-maxed runner can easily dispatch anything from 1 to 3 RAW Red Samurai per Combat Turn something is fishy with the stat blocks given.
Shadowrun gives you a lot of ways to make life really hard for your players without breaking fluff or immersion - pretty much every sadistic thing you can dream up is something runners could legitimately face in-universe.
>>43926246
http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n205/brandonblauer/PoliceTacticalGearLawEnforcement_zpsfb6fd8d0.png
http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n205/brandonblauer/GreatTacticalPoliceGearLawEnforcement_zps26ae1033.png
http://www.redonpolice.com/supply/44.html
http://www.everychina.com/m-anti-riot-body-suit
http://www.blackpearlgear.com/images/Insatsgrp1.jpg
If you want to go and compare this to military equipment, go ahead. It's almost identical, just with a wider array of firearms.
You can easily apply that to Shadowrun. Cops in "milspec gear" isn't overkill. It's reality today.
>>43926409
A guy called UmaroVI has done some Archetypes for 4th Ed. Luckily for you, one of those is a throwing troll adept!
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1RL6OPk6YgliUZ3MaFSZ-MnCCsnoWl8296HB1LV6DmuI/edit?hl=en_US&pli=1
The characters are even missions-ready.
>>43926468
>>43926350
In my stat blocking for Goons:
Gangers and Mall Cops are weaker than runners,
Actual cops and organized crime are equal to runners
HTR and Special Forces are superior to runners, as they should be.
>>43926497
Then I'm not really sure I see the problem you're having with stun damage.
>>43926534
I'm a different guy, omae, just giving my input on how I personally play out NPCs.
>>43926497
Don't know if I would have cops (the underfunded, easily bribeable, cheapest bidder gear guys at least) on the same level as specialised runners looking for every edge they get, but I agree with having SF and HTR being superior to runners.
The one and only reaction your players should have to people armed to their teeth rappelling from a military-grade chopper is a gasped OH FRAK.
>>43922541
They're doing a good job spinning the massacre, but they can only reach so far; A lot of UCAS and other national citizens buy Horizon's explanations and obfuscations, but it's hard to get at other megacorp citizens (especially when those corps are having their own news outlets use the opportunity to drag Horizon's name in the mud), to say nothing of the shadows.
People still hate and fear technomancers, and a lot of them accept that Horizon was acting in self-defense, but Horizon can't just make it disappear.
>>43926569
>underfunded cops
I don't really see that. It's a bad cliche, nothing more. Never mind if you really want to, you can equip someone to take down a runner on a budget of 3k nuyen per person, tops.
>>43926187
Okay, thanks.
Are Missions still feasible? I'm seeing things about characters from New York and maintaining continuity between modules, but a lot of the info seems to be based on the Shadowrun4 website, which is closed down now.
It's a little bit overwhelming, if I'm honest.
>>43926495
Yeah that is one of my inspirations, but i was trying to do it in SR5 Priority, not sure how well it translates.
>>43926612
NYC is fifth edition. 4e ones are Denver, and while they have some problems, they're still OK. They just need a bit of tweaking to remove the convention railroad track at times.
>>43926608
Remember, cops are privatized in Shadowrun. So many corners got cut they are now indistinguishable from circles.
>>43926630
I don't think you know how private security contractors work. "Corners cut on their own men" my ass.
>>43926569
Unless your runners are either stupidly brave or actually highly skilled and equipped, yeah, I'd agree with that.
Gangers and rent-a-cops should, imo, be lower on the scale than your average runner. Real cops and organized crime outfits should vary from being similar on that low end to being equal or slightly better, depending.
HTR and spec-ops should kind of be nightmarish yes but they should definitely be just as killable as the runners themselves imo.
Most of the difference in these different types of "tiers" should come from attitude and roleplay. Gangers will invariably break and run unless you've got some real hard-asses.
Cops are trained and will employ actual tactics but may not be as willing to die for the cause as some others; like, for example, some organized crime rings.
HTR and special forces should be able to go toe-to-toe with runners. Even prime runners. They shouldn't, though. They're highly trained and should employ actual tactics that aren't standing nearby and unloading mag after mag.
>>43926659
On an individual level I say cops are less than most runners in terms of combat ability (or equal to non-combat oriented characters, like the decker or face).
Where the cops shine is that they have access to the entire facility. People always forget that the runners are going up against someone on their home ground. The guards can shut doors or open them to get around, activate built-in security systems to monitor or engage with the runners, use the sheer force of the Host and the spiders to crush people messing with their equipment, etc.
In a straight-up fight, a runner will beat up a cop, but that cop has a dozen friends and a turret coming out of the ceiling.
>>43926659
That's exactly what I wanted to convey, yes.
Sure they're killable, but they are a no-nonsense, shoot-or-blow-up first and ask questions later killing squad. HTR will employ every little edge and dirty trick they can to get the job done before the runners leave exterritoriality. Even if that includes splattering some runner over half the complex.
>>43926645
It's a fucking duopoly. Of course there's corner cutting.
>>43926748
>it's a duopoly
No, it's really not. Lonestar and KE are just the big names in North America. Now, if you think someone competing with Ares is cutting corners in their equipment, which is why clients will see, that's your business. I don't think it's plausible. Lonestar needs to seem every bit as well equipped and up to smack as KE to maintain their contracts.
Hell, as far as private police forces go, the USA is pretty much the third world anyway. Most of the ones worldwide are former militaries and use milspec gear on the street.
>>43926795
>>43926748
Not to mention that there are like 4 different security corps under the Ares banner, and none of them like each other (something exacerbated by the civil strife between Vogel and Knight). Unless someone from Head Office comes down and forces it, they don't want to work together and will happily leave each other to twist in the wind.
>>43926795
>I don't think it's plausible.
It's plausible if Ares cuts corners too. That's the entire point of a duopoly.
It's also backed up by the fact that cops use drugs to get extra init instead of ware or magic.
>>43926820
Point. Sorry, I forgot ares were so incompetent they could have a monopoly and still fuck it up.
>>43926825
The fact? You mean the stat blocks? Those aren't "facts", those are suggestions which do not match the fluff descriptions of what these companies actually are.
>>43926795
Regardless of competition private or governmental police forces will always gear up their guys appropriately for current threat levels.
I find that there is some nice living world potential in that.
Your runners just took two corporate sabotage firebombing runs?
Expect the police to gear up in response to "a new terrorist threat" the mega you hit is stirring up in its news broadcasts.
Your runners just hooded a bit and caught the latest serial killer to make the news?
Suddenly, policemen everywhere seem more relaxed and stop pointing guns at everyone open carrying a mere taser.
>>43926855
Except the fluff descriptions also describe them as using drugs to make up for cut corners.
>>43926900
Depends on which fluff you read. Not everything CGL releases is consistent with what came before.
Here's an example of how the rest of the world handles security, btw:
http://shadowrun.wikia.com/wiki/MET_2000
>>43926887
This is something I like and something I wished more GMs did, not just in Shadowrun but in every game.
Just make sure the response is reasonable.
>>43926569
I was the one complaining above, and having my players leg it when HTR arrives isn't the problem. My HTR are built like runners and equipped with top notch gear, and my players know that they *might* kill them, but not without half of their numbers dead as well and whoever sent those guys even more out for their blood.
It's having them waltz really too easily through lower level "opposition" that is.
>>43926939
According to that article no-one used that pmc as a police force.
Which is good, because there's so few of them they'd be hard pressed to police a single country, never mind multiple countries around the world.
>>43926939
MET 2000 is not used in policing - they are mercenaries, sometimes used in HTR or extremely well protected corporate sites.
The police work is actually done by corporations such as SternSchutz. Their abbreviation to SS is quite fitting, as they are worse than LoneStar in their mega hate.
They are arguably better equipped than your average KE or LoneStar officer, though.
>>43927003
>mega
I presume you mean meta?
>>43926959
>My HTR are built like runners
Am I the only one who doesn't do this? My HTR teams are all fairly uniform: Guys with lots of cyberware and long military backgrounds, with an aspected mage or two (rarely a full mage) and some good combat deckers.
They usually aren't colourful or unique (unless they are going to come back over and over), they're efficient, faceless and terrifying. They're literally just made on the template of 'Corp takes a guy, trains him his whole life and gives him the best gear, and uses him as a weapon.' I feel like making them super flashy and uniquely stylized (like runners) runs counter to the whole 'fight the evil corps that want to fit everyone into neat boxes' ethos.
>>43927000
>>43927003
It was just an example. The Corporate Security Handbook does list counter-intelligence as a basic essential of security work in Shadowrun, though, and SS clients who hire the MET2000 for their HTR (which is frequent) will have access to ARGUS counterintelligence to keep their streets safe.
It's a multi-level response, in other words. You have preliminary threat identification via ARGUS, on-site physical security and personell security from the SS, then HTR from the MET2000 and if all else fails, ARGUS is tasked with recovering your stolen property. It's in your contract, after all.
>>43927047
Oops, wrong image. That's precisely what I DON'T make my HTR like; it's really stylish and kinda goofy, which makes it great for a group of runners/mercs, but not for the arm of a megacorp.
>>43927067
>It was just an example
But it isn't. That's like offering up Blackwater as an example of a private detective agency.
>>43927041
Absolutely. Terribly sorry, stupid typo.
>>43926959
Would nerfing stun damage sufficiently alleviate the problem, though?
I'm not sure, they might simply change to physical damage then.
You could always talk to your players about that.
Don't their characters feel bad for mowing down people who try to provide for their families?
Do your players want more challenge in these battles?
Some players want their characters to mow through grunts - so it may be that you have other expectations from the game than them.
Don't take any of this as an insult, I simply don't know enough about your group
>>43927108
Well, the Stenschutz doesn't have a page on the English wiki. Sorry.
>>43927131
Anyway, if you really want to know the SS's equipment, here you go:
Trained barghests and Gomitias
Full palette of combat drones
A thaumaturgic corps
Competent matrix security and overwatch
Cyberware
>>43927185
That's fairly cool, thanks.
>>43927131
The german wiki has the following about their gear:
-Barghest Units used as early as 2060
-Martial look in black with either light or medium security armor with a fully tricked out helmet (sensors, flashlights, the works)
-Often with vehicle and drone support
So they are definitely better equipped than your typical UCAS counterpart.
Their intervention teams have even commissioned a special cybersuite for their operatives.
Sorry for the weird formatting, but I can't be arsed to translate that convoluted German writing right into acceptable English right now
>>43926959
Are they killing or not? I assume not, since this whole thing is about stun damage. Personally, I wouldn't bother. Levels aren't really a thing, omae. Lesser trained, skilled and equipped combatants will have a hard time defeating a force superior to their own unless they've got some tricks up their sleeves.
This is kind of like getting upset that a level 10 party in D&D is mopping the floor with level 5 NPCs or something, you know what I mean?
Granted, I know that analogy isn't perfect. I don't think you should worry about scaling the opposition up unless you think it's really called for; and i mean narrative-wise, not just for gameplay purposes.
>>43910816
>Because one anon asked for it last thread, what are your HRT teams like? When shit hits the fan, who hits back?
It depends on who's being hit.
Most HRT's are relatively similar, as small-unit tactics on the scale SR uses for runner combat tend to all look alike regardless of who's doing them mostly because there's only so many ways a small tactical unit can operate that's very effective; SWAT teams and their equivalents often have ex-military personnel because it's basically the exact same sort of thing most days without the drudgery of downtime soldiering attached.
The only one that's appreciably different in my game are Aztechnology Warrior Orders, Red Samurai, and HardCorps. Azzie units tend to have more adepts then average compared to other units. In operational play doesn't change much at all really (the guy with a gun in heavy armor will be magic instead of cybered) but it's something to take into account when preparing countermeasures.
Red Samurai are ONLY found in small units (I remember reading an olde sourcebook saying that there is precisely ONE unit of Red Samurai in all of the Seattle Metroplex, which shows how exclusive and rare they are), but these individual soldiers are incredibly highly trained and heavily armed. The upside is, every single one you DO manage to kill seriously hurts the unit because they won't be getting reinforcements anytime soon, though they might not retreat as a matter of pride since the loss they would take would seriously dishonor them.
HardCorps are notable for being NOT like an operating tactical unit but for basically employing crappy 80's movie combat tactics; they just charge in with a shitload of guns and blast everything that moves and basically make a mess of everything and everyone as that IS what you pay HardCorps for after all, to be a blunt instrument that isn't very discriminate.
>>43915140
Chances are it was used to verify of JB is alive. Since he is now an awakened vampire that is going to be blackmail. Remember the media circus doesnt like awakened cults and despite JB's innocence he is still a bloodsucker
>>43926705
You are talking like cop-killing is something your runners aren't even batting an eye at.
Do you know what happens to people who kill cops? They get shoot to kill HTR teams sent out after them, and they're not gonna stop searching until they find them.
Your runners damn well better make sure they don't show up on 8pm news or they're gonna have a bad time.
Is there an age, or an age range, that people typically Awaken at?
>>43927841
10-14. That is, start of puberty.
>>43927795
Huh?
I was talking about HTR teams the whole team.
The HTR teams are the no-nonsense killing squad.
My runners know full well that they would be in a world of pain if they went full ballistic pink mohawk.
The HTR teams are the ones blowing pieces of runners over the exterritorial fence, after all
Do HTR teams in your game wear Hardened Milspec armor?
>>43928158
At the minimum...
>>43928158
Why would they? There's stats for SWAT gear.
What would be the best way to learn the history of the Shadowrun world? Started reading the novels, still feel like I'm missing things. Like what the fuck is the Great Ghost Dance?
>>43928248
Sixth World Almanach gives you a short overview of everything that happened.
Beyond that, read everything. EVERYTHING!
>>43928178
Because Hardened Milspec Armor is way way way more powerful and makes you impervious to everything short of a high-force spirit? It's basically power armor.
>>43927881
All right. Are there any examples of it happening earlier? I know there's at least one or two cases where it happened significantly later, but I can't think of them off hand.
>>43928176
But the book says that Hardened Milspec is for elite forces like the Red Samurai. Isn't it a bit much to be putting it on every schmuck in an HTR team?
I've posted these before, but since the topic is HTR...
Rate my HTR.
>>43928107
you kill a STREET COP they'll sent the HTR after you. Learn to read
>>43928385
The red samurai ARE an HTR team. HTR team and "shmuck" do not belong in the same sentence.
>>43928449
I've never talked about cop killing in my posts. I said that HTR should be killable, but I agreed with the things the other anon said about them being nightmarish.
What did you actually think I was talking about?
>>43928395
>dat troll with 0 charisma
He or she is so ugly that this would actually qualify as a war crime and the runners give up out of sheer desperation and shock?
>>43925028
>Wil is limited at 6 at chargen (unless Gnome/Naga/Pixie or E.A.)
>E.A.
Now I'm imagining some megacorp charging microtransactions to anyone who buys their cyberware, offering to give their augs a tiny but critical boost for the low price of 50¥!
How long does the boost last? They're not telling you!
>>43928274
Alright, dopeness. I planned on reading 'em all, just lack funds atm.
>>43928573
Wireless bonuses, omae. Gotta get that always-online bonus.
>>43928456
Red Samurai are a very, very particular HTR team who respond to a very slim number of events in a very narrow area.
They aren't a full-scale army with one Red Samurai thing per Renraku facility, and they are EXTREMELY exclusive in number and usage.
It's been repeatedly mentioned in the fluff that if something goes down, a Renraku exec can't just order a Red Samurai team show up because they aren't actually in command of them; RS has it's own separate command structure that reports DIRECTLY to the head offices in Japan and not to the regional or local directors.
If Renraku America's director wants Red Samurai backup they gotta politely ask if Red Samurai will give it to them and if they say "no" because they feel it's not important enough (as most subsidiary operations are in fact not) or if they feel their resources are better spent elsewhere then that exec has to deal with it, and if they DO get assistance it repeatedly says that every Red Samurai unit operates in very small 5 or 6 man fire teams with no support and no backup beyond what they can pull locally, which they often refuse because the suggestion that a Red Samurai team isn't enough to resolve a situation is insulting to their honor, which they DO take 100% cliche seriously will the whole "cut my belly if I fail" shit.
Most Renraku teams will be considerably less elite and well-armed then an HTR team just by necessity.
>>43928276
If you give it strength/mobility servos, it IS power armor. You can even make it chem-sealed. You can turn your HTRs into Space Marines if you want to.
>>43928616
Going Wireless is free. I'm talking about some street sammy being pinned down by Firewatch in combat when a tooltip pops up on his HUD, saying "It looks like you're having some trouble with those guys, would you like to upgrade your software to SureFire Plus™ for only 49.99¥? Y/N"
>>43928707
Aren't all Red Samurai also exclusively male, human (with background checks to ensure no metahuman ancestry) and Japanese? That's a very small pool of recruits to draw from without resorting to cloning.
>>43928248
If you want, there's the Neo-Anarchist Podcast. The release schedule is spotty at best, and it is clearly an amateur production[1], but it's good over all. He's up to 2065 atm.
[1] Yeah, that's right, Opti. I don't know if your alert system will pick this up like you did on the last forum where I brought it up, but it's true. The sound quality is middling at best, the editing in the first few episodes is sloppy, and your 'guests' are almost uniformly enthusiastically bad, like they came from a high school drama club. It's not a bad show overall, but it has it's problems.
>>43928724
I thought it was already chem-sealed. It says in the description "Hardened mil-spec battle armor is fully enclosed..."
>>43928572
Oops
>>43928707
Yes, you just summed up why the Red Samurai are on the lower end of HTR teams in terms of efficiency and something to toss at runners, because they're fairly easy to kill.
They work in Japan, where local security is competent enough to terminate most non-yakuza criminal rings, which means relatively poorly supplied runners etc. They do not work internationally.
Modern "swat" and "military" gear are identical, as well. I see no reason why it should not be the case in 2070, especially if criminals walk around as power armoured killer cyborgs. You're either equipped to deal with that, or you're not an HTR team.
>>43928805
Meaning it covers every part of your body, leaving no skin exposed. It does not mean it is proof against chemical attacks.
Is there some book that explain precisely how exactly the matrix works? Servers, routers, repeaters, etc. I mean, I'm guessing the penalty for distance is not just lag, right?
>>43928830
What I mean by "do not work internationally" is that outside of Japan, their approach is suicidally retarded. Runners with access to better equipment (so, basically, any US or euro runner team with half a brain...) will completely wreck the Red Samurai.
>>43928845
No. The Matrix is magic that you access through a screen, and it has no relation to real computer systems. Don't try to make one match the other- just accept the technobabble and move on.
>>43928774
100% human and japanese ancestry, yes, but women are allowed.
>>43928868
That's just pretty sad, if I wanted to shutdown the wireless connection of an entire block, town or whatever, where/how do you attack?
>>43928890
The power supply. Good luck, solar power is commonplace, IIRC.
>>43928890
Get a fuckload of jammers?
There's no real data on the physical infrastructure, other than it having been upgraded through two crashes so there's a lot of redundant and forgotten systems out there. There's no practical way for a runner to cut off access to the Matrix for such a huge area. Even when the Megas were moving against Boston it took them a while to root out and shut down all the signals travelling in and out of the zone.
How the fuck do jacked in riggers even work?
Is it just logic and intuition to do everything? Is there any point to building physicals besides reaction?
>>43928967
Decent BOD will help you when you get dumpshock and don't want to die.
>>43928967
Physicals are very helpful when they figure out where you are and kick down your door.
>>43928860
No runner has access to better equipment. What are you talking about? A runner has to make sacrifices for stealth. A Red Samurai can wear the heaviest armor and weapons they want in the open without any problem. Moreover, the Red Samurai have access to pretty much every beneficial piece of gear in the book.
>>43929131
And so do runners. All it takes is time to get it. A runner doesn't have to sacrifice jack shit with a bit of patience.
>>43928830
>Yes, you just summed up why the Red Samurai are on the lower end of HTR teams in terms of efficiency and something to toss at runners, because they're fairly easy to kill.
What planet are you on? A Red Samurai is going to have around 21 Hardened Armor. That means any attack that does less than 21 damage has no effect. Any attack that does more than that is going to have a -11 damage penalty before you even get to the resistance roll. They're close to being the hardest things to kill in the whole book.
>Modern "swat" and "military" gear are identical, as well. I see no reason why it should not be the case in 2070, especially if criminals walk around as power armoured killer cyborgs. You're either equipped to deal with that, or you're not an HTR team.
Well that's not how it works. Hardened Milspec Armor blows SWAT armor completely out of the water.
>>43929210
Curb your autism for a bit there, anon, and read what I typed again, slowly.
Red Sams are hard to kill, sure. Any HTR team member is. That's in the job description. Red Sams also come in numbers of six people, tops. That makes them managable. Other HTR teams aren't restricted by squad size at all and have just as good gear. Red Sams are mostly hype and only functional on their home turf, because there, they outclass your average runner. Elsewhere, where you can get equivalent gear or firearms that can do more than 21 damage in a pinch (full auto is a thing), they can be reduced to slag fairly quickly.
>>43929163
The point isn't that runners can get a hold of it. It's that they can't go anywhere in it. What are you gonna do, march into a high-sec corp compound wearing battle armor and just walk through their front door?
>>43929298
I don't need milspec armour, I just need a weapon that can punch through it. And that would be anything with full auto. A laser'll do, too, in a pinch, even if they get progressively worse every edition.
>>43928888
Considering how sexist Japanese society is, I'm surprised they allow women to join the RS. They probably look cute in their dress uniforms though.
Also, nice quads.
>>43929298
No, I'll put Ruthenium coating and thermal dampening on my battle armor and sneak in with the rest of my team, then start shooting when the time is right. The Ruthenium also makes it easier to conceal when I'm not wearing it.
>>43929274
>Other HTR teams aren't restricted by squad size at all and have just as good gear
No they don't.
>Run & Gun p. 66: Beyond even security-grade armor, military-grade armor is simply too expensive and maintenance-heavy for common use or even routine security work. Aside from the most intense of fast-response teams, it resides only in elite military units deployed when absolutely necessary.
>Elsewhere, where you can get equivalent gear or firearms that can do more than 21 damage in a pinch (full auto is a thing), they can be reduced to slag fairly quickly.
Like what?
>>43929443
>like what?
An AK with decent recoil comp., dumbass.
>>43929528
Oh, I get it now. You're playing 5e. Yeah, your loss.
>>43929349
Full Auto doesn't do anything to armor rating.
>>43929577
Even in 4e the rule is the same. If the modified DV does not exceed the modified AV, nothing happens to hardened armor.
Add the net hits scored to the base Damage Value of the attack; this is
the modified Damage Value.
ergo long bursts or anything aren't factored in.
you'd need at least a gauss rifle to reliably pierce 21 hardened armor
>>43929760
>bursts aren't factored in
And this is where you're wrong.
>>43929780
Has there been an errata or something I missed?
On page 150 of the 4th Ed Rulebook:
*Autofire does not count when comparing the modified DV to the modified Armor.
It's pretty hidden and I just stumbled upon that recently, so I can understand everyone who thinks otherwise.
>>43929903
That line has not been part of the rules for a long, long time. I can't find it at all in my current edition.
>>43918953
Actually throwing adepts can be pretty nasty. I played one in my first game in 4E, that ended up killing a fleshform ant spirit with a pocketful of screws and a screwdriver.
>>43929975
Ranged Combat Summary. Page 150
Otherwise - Modified Damage Value:
Base DV + Net Hits
What edition of the '20th Anniversary 4th Edition' are you using then?
>>43930107
Opened the English edition now.
It's there, but it doesn't mean you do not do "no" damage or FA does less. It means that these weapons do stun damage if their base DV+net hits is lower than your armour, and when your stun track is full, you still go down and your physical track starts filling up.
It does not mean you suddenly have more soak vs full auto weapons.
For combat purposes, you go down either way and enough stun hits can kill you just as much as if it were physical.
>>43914157
>>43930208
That's for "normal" armor, yes.
Hardened armor is another beast entirely:
If the modified Damage Value of an attack does not exceed the Armor rating (modified by Armor Penetration), then it bounces harmlessly off the critter; don't even bother to make a Damage Resistance Test (so no Stun damage either).
So if you attack with a base DV of 6 + 8 net hits you will not do any damage to someone wearing hardened armor 21 (even with +9 full burst damage). If you somehow reduced his modified AV to below 14 however, you would do damage and you would incorporate the +9 full burst damage.
I assumed we were talking about penetrating hardened armor, but I may have misunderstood you.
>>43930365
Which 4e book is hardened milspec in? I can't seem to find it in Arsenal.
>>43924911
>>43925009
>>43925269
One of the big issues the players mentioned was that the pixie could get tazed more than the minotaur and still be up, and something about how tazers aren't that effective because drunk people get tazed like 5 times before they go down. It became a question of "Ethics aside, why shouldn't I just taze someone instead of shooting them? It's a shorter damage track"
>>43926246
>but I really cannot justify beat cops, regular security guards and the like having enough cyberware and gear to be able to shrug off small arms fire.
Everything's in order, then. Beat cops and first line security guards aren't there to square off against runners, they're there to issue tickets, keep petty criminals honest, and report serious crime to the people equipped to deal with it. If your players are abusing that... good.
The appropriate response to a growing trend of police being overpowered by heavily armed criminal elements is having their HTR sit around in the ready room so their response time is frighteningly low. Corps may issue cheapo biomonitors to their desk/patrol jockeys so security is alerted to serious issues more reliably and may situate HTR on site in more locations.
Don't give in to the temptation to scale beat cops and gangers to the runners' level of competence. Build scenarios that expose them to real threats for being careless/abusive with their competence disparity.
>>43928830
>especially if criminals walk around as power armoured killer cyborgs
You fucked up if you let your players have milspec.
>>43930989
Check the average ganger descriptions...
So, I've got a lot of broad stroke familiarity with the general setting of Shadowrun, and I've been trying to get a game together for a very long time. I have finally found a group (2 consistent [New to SR, RP experience], 2 frequent [1 w/ SR experience, 1 new to PnP], 1 sporadic [Mostly new to PnP]) who are actually excited to play Shadowrun (ecstatic to not have to just fall back on D&D again) but I've got some minor problems.
While I normally run games fast and loose as a DM/GM as my goal is facilitating fun, while getting things set up I have discovered I kind of have a major lack of detailed background stuff to pull from. Specifically in regard to the Corps.
So, while working with the players to get everyone into the mindset and start rolling characters it was identified that at least one player (Decker) has an antagonistic relationship with Renraku and another (Face) will have one - they just don't know who it's with yet. Playing in Seattle, where should I start looking to see what sort of hijinks Renraku is up to in the Seattle area that I could rope into the overarching plotline?
tl;dr - New to GMing SR, looking to reasons to be all "Fight Me" to Renraku.
>>43929399
I don't remember reading that, but if it's true I imagine they're heavily marginalized and sidelined.
Renraku is super racist and traditional; they don't even like magic that much, so while Red Samurai teams always have a mage on them it explicitly says that they are NEVER in charge and NEVER allowed promotion.
>>43931209
>Playing in Seattle, where should I start looking to see what sort of hijinks Renraku is up to in the Seattle area that I could rope into the overarching plotline?
Renraku's a megacorp so the basic answer is; any dickass thing you can imagine a corporation doing to make money is something they've done before or are doing right now thanks to sheer size.
Megacorps don't need special "plots" to be assholes, they just need to exist, and a lot are probably committing what the real world would consider criminal acts as BYPRODUCTS of the stuff they do, not even intentionally.
Of course some like MCT or Aztechnology actually DO do it intentionally, but those guys are just assholes on principle basically.
>>43931109
I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be gathering from this.
>>43931394
Yeah, I get the feeling that some of us have a wildly different description of "milspec" in mind.
>>43931367
Alight, dickassery up to 11. I just know that some corps are more prone to certain activities than others.
So in that case, I would imagine the Arcology is probably a relatively easy place to start with trying to figure out at least the initial hook. Thanks.
And this is for 5th edition, anything in recent history ('70 to '75) that might be notable occurrences that would be a good hook? Any that /srg/ really likes to use, regardless of setting/timeframe?
>>43931474
>I just know that some corps are more prone to certain activities than others.
They are, but all are so large that they all get involved in everything to some degree.
And what they don't get involved in as much they hire runners to steal or sabotage or blow up so they CAN get involved in it better, or at least prevent competitors from doing better then them.
>>43931255
Why would any mage work for them then? Mages are very rare assets, they could just go "Fuck you guys, you can find someone else to protect you from magic users. I bet your grandmother's Korean anyway."
>>43931543
Because they're born into the company and have no choice, because they have no other employment options, or because they're getting paid lots and lots of money, or because self-sacrifice and honor is a big part of Bushido so they don't expect promotion?
Seriously, Bushido is all about self-denial and absolute unswerving obiediance to your master and not expecting anything except death in his service and loving it.
From a real-life standpoint it's very clearly a code designed to encourage unwavering loyalty to an asshole who can exploit you and then you never question it, which give the behavior of most daimyo in history suggests that this was probably the whole point.
>>43931510
So, say, something like attempting to hardwire Metahuman brains to function as adaptive CPU systems for a distributed and advanced drone network (i.e., unwilling subjects for processing power) would totally be in Renraku's umbrella of activities. I know they're more xenophobic/meta-xenophobic than some of the other members of the Big 10, yes?
Has anyone made a guide to how AIs work in 5e yet? Sort of like those Cheat Sheets people made for weapon rules or vehicular combat?
>>43931394
>He thinks he'll find something useful in CGL fluff
>>43931422
Yeah, its possible people are reading something like 'armor vest' and thinking, "Well shit, bulletproof vests are current military gear. Every ganger has one? The fucking police must all look like SWAT!"
Meanwhile Joe Wageslave is also wearing armored clothing just to keep the acid rain off and maybe help shrug off a stray bullet from a convenience store robbery across the street.
Pic related is what's conventionally referred to as milspec, for reference. You'll notice even the military brings it out of storage as infrequently as possible.
>>43931652
Man, they don't even work with Chummer yet. No one's gonna go to the effort of making an SR character by hand. Let alone the sheets to do it.
>>43931620
Sure, why not?
I think MCT actually did experiment with creepy shit like that and technomancers early on (the project was headed by an urban myth guy from earlier editions who literally put kids brains in jars and hooked them up to the Matrix), so there's precedent in the setting.
Renraku would just be aping MCT's stuff, or perhaps it co-opted some of the science and technology for themselves to keep the project going.
>>43931612
I imagine defections do happen. One Shadowrunner assignment could be to "extract" a Red Samurai mage who's realized how badly his company is fucking him and wants out.
>>43931707
Yeah, but that'd have to be quite the realization tbqh.
>>43931707
It's gonna be rare and then RS probably deleted it ever having happened to not loose face; you join Red Samurai for life and you DON'T get to leave alive.
It's a fairly common backstory for PC's I've found, to be "Ronin" red samurai; we actually had an oni who Goblinized due to his team's exposure to a Mana Spike, so he nailed rather then be killed for what he was and fled to Seattle to hide in the Underground.
Bonus irony points for him turning into a candy-apple red oni of course.
>>43931761
>Supernatural powers only afforded to a minority of people
>Stuck in a highly dangerous job with no chance of promotion working for a bunch of people who distrust you, who lack these powers
>Given cutting edge weapons, armor, and training, which you can take with you when you walk out
>>43931697
Thanks, chummer. Much appreciated. I'll definitely include it being co-opted from MCT. I like that and it will help my players feel like the world is bigger.
Have some pleasing wire bundles for appreciation.
