You are an alchemist, there is no magic in the setting, what can you use as weapon? what "potion" can you make? what deadly little flasks you would carry?
>no magic
Well then.
>what can you use as weapon?
A crossbow
>what "potion" can you make?
Powerful painkiller
>what deadly little flasks you would carry?
A extremely powerful disinfectant, several vials of reactive substances, a powerful acid, and plenty of narcotics
>>43896388
All you're asking is how an aggressive chemist could fuck somebody up, and the answer is everything from flamethrowers to contact explosives to aerosol poisons.
Chlorine Triflouride.
Sets fire to stone even whilst underwater.
The water, incidentally, will be exploding.
Water-resistant napalm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_fire
>>43896496
What of these can be made with low tech? how could it be made? and what are the substances?
>>43896895
Okay. So. Real talk. Do you want detailed, accurate information on the capabilities of low-tech chemistry, presented in a RPG-friendly way?
There is a way. But you won't like it.
>>43896940
gurpsfag here, but seriously, i don't remember lowtech talking about chemistry
>>43896388
I played a magiphobic alchemist in a 3.5 campaign once. It was fun, but difficult. At the end I had a whole host of potions, a suit of power armor with a potion/grenade launcher, and a little robotic companion.
>>43897009
Page 25, plus incendiaries in the weapons chapter.
You mix herbs together and smear the result on a dagger. Then you shank a bitch until they stop spasming.
Or you mix chemicals together until it's suitably flammable and/or suitable for fumigation . Then you douse someone in it and take a light to them and/or spray them in it and watch them choke.
And of course, the old classic "Hey, dose this rag smell like chloroform to you?"
>>43897091
i love you, normaly i only play ultratech settings using gurps, don't know shit about lowtech.
>>43897127
>You mix herbs together and smear the result on a dagger. Then you shank a bitch until they stop spasming.
you can do that without the herbs
>>43897159
But if you don't use the herbs, you can't call yourself an alchemist.
>>43896388
Weapons are simple, crossbows are a good starting point and can be modified to just be a portable launcher of anything without requiring much effort on your own part. Potions are a bit trickier to explain, but generally there are 2 kinds to carry around, the medicinal and the explosive kind. Alchemy is powerful in the right hands, and the appropriate applications are more than enough to handle most problems that would normally require magic to solve.
>>43897190
that's a point. going mix my herbs.
>>43896388
Explosives.
Poisons.
Chloroform.
Flamethrowers.
Crossbows.
Bombs with clockwork timers.
...let's assume the setting is the modern world, what chemicals would an "alchemist" use offensively and where would he get them?
>>43897242
Anon, are you trying to kill someone? We won't judge.
>>43897242
Cleaning supplies. Bathtub meth overdosing. Molotov cocktails.
Especially the cleaning supplies part. Countless people accidentally mustard gas themselves every year.
>>43897331
i'm op and this >>43897242 is not me, i'm reading Low tech searching for the Distillation rules, he is just someone who wants to keep the thread going.
If anyone here has ever accidentally touched bleach, that weird slimy feeling you get is actually your skin dissolving.
>>43896388
Assuming low-tech and roughly medieval setting, there's quite a few poisonous mixtures you can make that react either when ingested, injected or on skin contact. You can look up spme real-life plants and herbs that do that but if you want some more fun stuff;
Try Greek fire (the recipe is lost and forgotten but oil is definetely a component), gun powder (low-quality and better off as flash powder unless you know the precise mixtures to get a half-decent bang out of it). You could probably get smoke bombs and the poor man's flashbang if your character is the smart sort.
You could also use narcotics to enhcnace yourself though with long-term consequences.
Honestly, there's a lot you can do with a no-magic "alchemist" but they'd need a fair amount of prep time and some of those reagents are quite rare/hard-to-get
>>43896388
>Weapon
Run away
>Potion
Epinephrine
>Deadly flask
Napalm
>>43896388
A tube
An explosive powder
Metal flasks filled with the explosive powder and capped with balls of lead
>>43897449
are you serious?
>>43897557
ANon's not wrong, it won't "dissolve" your skin but it will give you some quite bad burns. Bleach is a very powerful alkali so it's pertinent to wash it off or else it'll start burning the more sensitive part of your epidermis (the very surface is already dead), though it's rarely dangerous unless you expose yourself to a large amount of it, or ingest it. That shit will give you alkali burns on the inside out if you drink it
>>43897678
It will dissolve your skin, one layer at a time. If you were both really dumb and really careful, you could use it to give yourself really smooth, silky skin. By removing the entire first few layers of the surface, imperfections and all.
>>43897331
more looking into home defense mechanisms, I'm paranoid that America is going to implode sometime soon.
>>43896388
for weapons use crossbows and greek-fire vials
Dioxygen Diflouride
>>43897742
Can it remove your fingerprints?
I mean it's obviously a horrible idea and nobody in their right mind would do that instead of gloves, but theoretically would you be able to have leave no fingerprints at a crime scene like that
>>43901271
what you do is, if you're stupid enough to not wear gloves while commiting a crime, you use it to dissolve them just slightly, disfigure them in a way that makes it so the fingerprints at a crime scene can't be matched to you.
or just dissolve them outright, your choice.
>>43897127
Fun Fact: Chloroform is actually really bad at knocking people out. You're better off using kerosene or gasoline.
>>43896388
>what can you use as weapon?
CHEMISTRY!!!
>what "potion" can you make?
All kinds of stuff...
Whatever you need really.
>what deadly little flasks you would carry?
hehehehehehehe!
besides Dynamite?
all sorts of "fun" chemical weapons.
Ground glass or acid to deal with immediate problems.
Diamond dust for long term problems or for people I just don't like.
>>43901451
Diamond Dust in food is a remarkably effective way to kill someone. There's no antidote or treatment for it and it ensures that the ingester dies a slow and painful death.
>>43897449
Ah, so that's why the leaking battery felt soapy to the touch.
>>43901451
>>43901822
>look it up thinking it's a nickname for another poison
>it's actually ground up diamond
>it just slowly shreds your intestines until you're dead
>it would only take a gram of this shit to kill someone
>low grade synthetic diamond dust costs like 10 cents
HOLY SHIT THIS IS UNDETECTABLE POISON FOR FUCKING CHEAP
LITERALLY THE BEST WAY TO KILL SOMEONE
>>43896550
I came to post this.
It burns asbestos. I don't mean burns ON asbestos, I mean it lights the substance known for its inflammability on fire.
It's also toxic.
>>43896388
Gunpowder
>>43902053
okay my prices are off, it's actually like 5 bucks, but 10 carats worth is enough to kill like 20 people.
>>43902111
how do you carry it though? it reacts with fucking GLASS
>>43902204
Steel bin. It reacts with the steel to form a non reactive surface inside the container.
Still, it'll explode if you expose it to water, heat, or if you shake it.
Crazy dangerous stuff. Possibly the most dangerous chemical known to man.
>>43902204
Steel, copper, or nickel, apparently.
>>43901271
>>43901308
Disfiguring your fingerprints is painful and rarely worth it, since it lends an implication of guilt and the rest of your hand leaves perfectly fine prints.
Wear thrift store gloves and discreetly dispose of them.
>>43902316
Would gold work?
>>43902345
I'd recommend double layers of surgical gloves, or a pair of surgical gloves and pic related, keep the hood off and keep your face away from cameras until the time is right.
>>43896388
Botulinum toxin, atropine, mercury, berries from the lily of the valley, white vinegar, ammonia salts.
>>43901379
Not at today's prices. We might be kidnappers, but we're not made of money.
>>43902146
Now that's some value pricing.
Storytime about the time I played a non-magical Alchemist in a fantasy game incoming.
I'm playing a chick like this rn in a friend's game. She wears a dead bird on her face. Also all of her potions are basically meth, roids, etc., so she can buff people with the good shit i guess.
>>43902718
So, the basic part of the plot you need to know was that a Princess had been kidnapped by two demons, named Brains and Brawn, and we'd have to beat each of them at what they were named after to earn the princess back. I was essentially playing a theif archetype who also knew alchemy, so I ended up thinking about how to take on Brains, and I had an idea. My GM loved The Princess Bride, and he'd sprinkled in a few references already, so I challenge Brains to a battle of wits, for the princess, to the death. I produce from my equipment two identical white tablets and pour a goblet of wine for Brains.
>"Well, Brains. One of these tablets is filled with what is called Iocane powder; it is odorless, tasteless, and among the more deadly poisons known to man. The other tablet contains nothing but salt. The game is now begun. It ends when you decide and we both take our tablets."
The GM is loving it at this point, and goes through Vizzini's whole chain of logic, substituting my character's homeland for australia, all on the fly(apparently he'd memorized the scene) Anyway, he does the "what the world could that be!" thing, and swaps the pills. Of course, I play along. At this point, to prevent cheating, the GM tells me to write down where the poison is, and then has Brains pick the tablet closest to him. It should be noted that Brains is a demon posessing a human body, so death of this body will be a major setback for him.
>Me: "Alright. I hand Brains the goblet of wine and swallow my pill."
>GM: "Brains takes a sip and swallows his."
>"Alright, he dies."
At this point, trying not to have a huge shit eating grin on my face, I flip the paper over and show my GM.
"Neither tablet was poisoned. The poison was in the wine. I dry-swallowed my pill."
I've never seen such a glorious combination of hatred and admiration in one man's face since.
>>43897242
Pretty easy mang. Gonna assume you don't have access to industrial chemical production equipment.
Key materials to stock up on:
Potassium Nitrate, found in fertilizer. Or you can synthesise it yourself out of piss.
Potassium Permanganate, found in old style snake bite kits
Calcium Carbide, found in old carbide lamps and those toy cannons.
Gasoline, found anywhere.
Styrofoam, found anywhere.
High proof alcohol, found anywhere.
Iron Oxide, it's literally rust, just oxidise a nail and scrap the rust off.
Aluminium powder, break open a few old etch-a-sketches
Potassium Chlorate, which you can synthesise using bleach and potassium chloride, which can itself be found in health-food stores or in tablet form. Alternatively, you can just use Solidox if you can find some.
Magnesium Ribbon, which you need to buy outright.
Hydrogen Peroxide, which you need to buy outright.
Individually, these chemicals are all mostly harmless and easy to obtain. Together, you can do some wonderful things with them. Though, be careful about buying stuff unless you want to get black bagged.
Mix 6 parts Potassium Nitrate and 4 parts sugar, heat over a low flame until it turns to brown sludge. Once it dries, ignite it and it creates a ton of foul, heavy smoke that sticks around forever. Enough to fill a building.
Iron Oxide and Aluminium powder is literally Thermite. That stuff they use to melt railway tracks together. It's difficult to ignite without Magnesium ribbon or a blowtorch. You can melt straight through an engine block with this.
Calcium Carbide and Water creates Acetylene. Pressurise it in a container and ignite and it creates quite a nice small scale explosive.
Styrofoam dissolved in Gasoline is napalm. Put it on something that you want to burn forever, because it's essentially impossible to put out or get off once lit.
Potassium Nitrate, Sulphur and Charcoal is gunpowder. I really don't need to tell you what you can do with gunpowder.
>>43896388
Dichlorodiethyl Sulfide aka Mustard Gass
>>43902053
It's not undetectable in the slightest. It doesn't even metabolize, so as soon as the autopsy is performed they're going to be clued in.
>>43901271
please note that it is possible to match scars and other marks in a comparable manner to fingerprints. it may be *less* certain evidence but how many people have finger scars from exposure to an alkaline substance? you'd be a little obvious.
>>43902345
Also,what they said.
>>43896388
Molotov Cocktails
Black Powder Grenades
Codeine/any other form of liquid medication that can be taken orally
>>43902866
I am fucking stealing your twist. That is marvelous.
>>43902878
Bleach is also a generally good thing to have on hand. You can do a lot of fun things with bleach. Mix it with Hydrochloric Acid and you get pure chlorine gas.
>>43897502
Napalm is too thick to be useful in a flask.
You're probably better off just hurling globs of it at people and then setting it alight with an aerosol flamethrower. Wrap the globs in some grease paper for ease of transport.
>>43897242
Succinylcholine. It's a medical paralytic that's quite quick to expire, so you'll need access to a hospital or other such. Enough of the stuff will cause a heart attack, and the compound will dissapear in the body in minutes. It's got quite a fanbase in certain circles. Recommended injection areas will be discreet areas with a lot of blood supply, like the gums of the mouth. Apply when target is sleeping.
>>43896388
Crush some appleseeds down till you get a fine powder then boil it in a pressure vessel. Strain the liquid using a fine, fine filter. Strain that liquid 30-40 times. Save the filters from steps 20-40. Dry the resulting liquid and filters. Grind it all down into a fine powder. Strain. Leave mixture to dry entirely. Carefully put 10G into round glass bottles. Shoot bottles at enemies. Watch them die.
>>43902664
You live outside of america? Cause we got $1.89 per gal right now and chloroform is like $5 per gal.
>>43896940
This is the same book that believes that silk cannot be penetrated by any weapons whatsoever.
>>43902906
It's literally undetectable while the guy is alive, and they can't do anything if they realize the problem, because they'd have to dig out every single little particle.
>>43901271
Use a flat belt sander and a delicate touch.
>>43903186
That's a given, but something high profile like diamond dust has way too many loose ends attached. Glass dust will have much the same effect and without all the traceability.
>>43902053
>>43902146
What legitimate purpose is there for diamond dust like that? There has to be something for it to be so cheap.
>>43903218
Mining. Its also made of shit tier diamonds so there is literally nothing else to use them for hence the low price. Only top tier jewelry diamonds are worth anything.
>>43903218
Machines like belt sanders or saw blades.
Also low grade industrial diamond is cheap as fuck.
Personally, I'd use a crossbow, but for any real war effort I wouldn't be on the front line. I'd be with the siege engineers, concocting strange chemical warfare devices, like a keg filled with LSD that is launched and explodes over the enemy.
>>43903120
If you want a quantity of cyanide which is actually dangerous you need a hell of a lot of apple seeds. You're generally better using peach or apricot stones, less hassle.
>>43903218
Industrial sanders, saws, and drills.
>>43903218
It's the leftover particles from when normal diamonds or industrial diamonds are cut. It's seeing some use in dental fillings.
>ITT: how to get poisons from everyday items/for cheap
Real question is: how do you get something like glass dust into a politician's food?
My idea is to mix it into the salt shakers, but then you'd have to be a waiter at a restaurant they frequent to deliver it. What about you guys? How would you deliver poison to a politician in this obviously fantasy yet modern world?
>>43903385
Apply leverage to one of the waiters through any friends or family, and have them deliver it. Then have him disappear from the country at large, or just disappear in general.
>>43903249
>>43903258
>>43903325
>>43903332
"Legitimate" isn't really the right word for what I'm wondering. I knew that it has industrial uses, but by the way Anon was talking about how easy it is to get I'm left wondering how a normal-ish person could it. It doesn't seem like something that could be acquired without having preexisting connections in a business that uses it or buying it without a reasonable purpose, both of which would make you an obvious suspect if you use it. Unlike making cyanide, which leaves behind mainly what could be argued as just evidence of you liking apples.
>>43903484
Well, that's the kicker isn't it. Diamond dust is a great way to kill somebody, untraceable and incurable. But you'll get caught.
>>43903512
That's why you buy a P.O box anonymously and anonymously buy it from some china factory, shipped to that box.
Or just use glass dust, much easier to get and with the same properties as diamond dust, though less effective.
>>43903300
Its not cyanide. Its ricin missing a key step though not many would know to call me on it. 1g is more than enough and its easily absorbable through skin let alone glass cuts.
>>43903484
You could probably sift through a jeweler's trash for it, although that would take a while. A more practical approach would be to start up a business as a jeweler and disguise the item in some bulk orders of goods. Even if you don't go through with this plan you can deduct the costs of the failing business from your taxes.
/tg/ is scary in how it plans to murder people sometimes.
>>43903628
I'm not really planning to murder someone. I just want to be prepared so that if I ever decide to I can murder them right away.
>>43903484
I'm a normal person.
10 seconds on google and $12.00 plus shipping for a 20g package.
>>43903582
No, it's actually amygdalin, a form of cyanide. I have no idea where you are getting ricin from.
We call it cyanide because the only step between it and the cyanide compound itself is to expose it to water.
>>43903792
Entirely forgot the link.
http://www ebay com/itm/like/331364653312?ul_noapp=true&ul_ref=http%253A%252F%252Frover.ebay.com%252Frover%252F1%252F711-117182-37290-0%252F2%253Fmtid%253D1588%2526kwid%253D1%2526crlp%253D53601919689_324272%2526itemid%253D331364653312%2526targetid%253D154774687209%2526rpc%253D0.11%2526rpc_upld_id%253D59471%2526rlsatarget%253Dkwd-154774687209%2526device%253Dm%2526mpre%253Dhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.ebay.com%25252Fulk%25252Fitm%25252Flike%25252F331364653312%25253Flpid%25253D82%252526chn%25253Dps%2526adtype%253Dpla%2526loc%253D9019686%2526poi%253D9019701%2526campaignid%253D239125209%2526adgroupid%253D14978428809%2526gclid%253DCI7nityxt8kCFQ8vaQodHv8COQ%2526srcrot%253D711-117182-37290-0%2526rvr_id%253D940594194421&chn=ps&lpid=82
>>43903735
I still thinks that counts as planning to murder someone, even if you don't know who the person is.
>>43903821
Wow. You're right. I'm so tired i some how mixed up castor seeds and apple seeds.
>>43903792
Doesn't matter if a poison is incurable when it's so astonishingly tracable.
You don't use a high profile substance like diamond dust unless you plan on vanishing.
>>43903837
Conspiracy to murder.
>>43903837
It's called defending yourself bro, you won't take mqh guns.
>>43903628
Nah, I was just a really edgy teenager.
If the skills I picked up are useful, though, that's all the better.
>>43903856
I never said i wouldn't get caught but its easily available and any person can get it no background check. You also make it sound like i'm the only guy that buys it. Theres auto shops that use it for fine polishing bodies for paint and theres 5 of them around not to mention the 2 dental labs and the local college and any unknown person polishing things at home. Hell you can buy flashbangs internal guts and the casing seperatelt for $25 no background check. You're severely overestimating its rarity and amount of people using dangerous products.
>>43903931
Do you have a link to the flashbangs? That sounds really neat.
>>43903249
>Jewelry diamonds have worth
>>43903930
This. Its like the only reason i'm decent at chemistry and tinkering.
>>43903931
Depends where you are, but the fact is that it's still a very high profile poison, and that inherently narrows things down immensely.
When you are killing people, any excess traceability at all is a bad thing, and something you want to avoid.
>>43903959
fine. Jewelry diamonds are the only diamonds that have worth attributed to them. Just like any other product or material. Happy?
>>43903950
Ebay and google. I'm probably getting v& for googling 30 different deadly poisons and osama's birthday in a 20 minutes period so i don't wanna make it worse. Just use the grenades on your property and don't hunt with them.
>>43904041
Appreciate it. If it makes you feel any better, feds would probably wait for the death to occur before spooking you. All the same, I'd disconnect any webcams you own.
>>43904041
Yeah, traceability is a bitch. This is why you want to be able to synthesise your own shit out of supermarket brand materials.
If you go online and search 'Bomb making' and then buy potassium nitrate on ebay, you will end up in a black bag in some deep, dark hole somewhere.
>>43904104
Incidentally how long between these events is a safe zone?
>>43897742
My girlfriend does this to her face with some watered down bleach. The hazards drive me fucking nuts but she won't quit.
>>43904153
Few months if you want to be really safe.
3 weeks is probably fine, assuming you have a dynamic IP.
>>43904171
She's gonna go blind. Theres no way shes not getting some in her eyes and unless she's flushing that shit like no tomorrow its still there fucking it up. If she wants smooth ass skin get 1 part brown crystal sugar and one part olive oil. Mix it up and make like 1/2lb. Scrub the ever living fuck out of your skin with it then leave it for like 15 mins. wash it off gently then take a shower. She'll be so silky smooth you'll both insist on it happening daily.
>>43904240
Then i should be fine. Damn highschool science projects.
>>43904293
Also it takes off small thin hairs so she might not even have to shave unless she's italian.
>>43904330
>unless she's Italian
And my sides are blasting off again!
>>43904293
Awesome, thanks anon
>>43903186
>>43903215
Neither glass dust nor diamond dust will kill a person. They're an irritant at best, by which I mean the workplace safety regulations regarding them list them as a non-fatal irritant, and would be readily apparent to any form of radiography due to different density and composition.
>>43904531
Ingesting a sufficient quantity is fatal.
By the time it starts to hurt, you're already a dead man walking.
>>43904531
You're absolutely wrong. When ingested the nano particles cut up the stomach and intestinal lining causing severe bleeding and swelling. This is exacerbated by the acid that will eat at the wounds. Starvation is also a problem but you'll bleed to death before you starve. Diamond dust is worse than glass cause its sharper.
I BUY A BOW, A DOG, AND A LOT OF ALCOHOL.
I MIX ALL THE ALCOHOL TOGETHER AND DRINK IT, CALLING MYSELF AN ALCHEMIST.
I RUB THE ARROWS IN DOG POOP.
BEHOLD, INFECTIOUS WEAPONS.
>>43902866
You magnificent son of a bitch. I am loving this.
>>43904911
Dog poop is highly acidic and dry making it a poor way to infect people. Human feces on the other hand is entirely infectious though you'd have a higher chance of infecting wounds by spitting on the arrowhead right before you shoot it. Human saliva is so dirty human bite wounds have a 100% infection rate of several bacteria and viruses unless immediately treated.
>>43905121
GOOD ADVICE. FORGET THE DOG, I WILL JUST DRINK ALCOHOL AND BITE THE ARROWHEADS.
Long term assassination technique.
A slightly sweet, colorless liquid, a single drop is all that's needed to place a death sentence on someone a year later from severe mercury poisoning.
>>43905203
Man I'm sorry to poke holes in your plans, but the alcohol would sterilise your mouth. You need to collect a big ol' bowl of saliva before you start drinking, or a sufficient amount of time afterwards.
>>43905681
This. Maybe chew your own feces before you spit on the arrows THEN drink some alcohol for cleansing.
>>43896388
I fucking love playing an alchemist.
The last time I played one, I got the DM to agree to me using a 300 lb mountain goat as a pet/companion.
As the campaign progressed I developed a bunch of steroids and mutagens that would turn my pet goat from a pretty docile pack animal into a hulking engine of death. The DM eventually introduced a heart strain mechanic so we couldn't just cheese every encounter with "hulkify his goat, let's move on"
>>43896388
Gunpowder. Lots and lots of Gunpowder.
>>43896388
Uranium flakes suspended in strong acid, deployed from a spray bottle.
It works in SS13!
>>43906270
Wouldn't that just make a slightly flammable slightly acidic solution?
>>43905121
>100% infection rate of several bacteria and viruses unless immediately treated.
That sounds interastign as fuck. Source me brotha
>>43903173
>+1 DR against certain attack types
>Cannot be penetrated by any weapon
Way to not have reading comprehension.
In the end, magicless alchemist is mostly poisons from local reagants and flammable shit.
It's more about the delivery method than the dangerous components.
You could start as an erudite with the big book of bad things already complete.
As you gain experience in adventuring, you figure out the best way to make ceramic/paper grenades or engineer yourself a fluid delivery system.
It's more about being a tinker than an alchemist.
>>43902053
>>43901822
>>43901451
>>43902146
>>43903249
Sorry guys.
>Post-publication note: Peder Schultz [personal communication, June 2005] reports feeding commercial-grade diamond powder to animals with no ill effects. “In the first tests, 5 carats of diamond powder (300-1600 mesh) were given to dogs, mixed into the food so that the powder would come into contact with tissue in the mouth, to test the effect on the entire digestive system. No toxic effect was observed. A cat was then fed with 2/3 meat and 1/3 diamond dust (5 carats of 300-1600 mesh) for a short period. A considerable part of its digestive system must have been filled with diamond powder for some time. No symptoms have been observed after a year – the cat is still well and shows no sign of any illness.
>>43896388
>You are an alchemist, there is no magic in the setting, what can you use as weapon?
Is this question just poorly worded? What are y you asking exactly?
Because the answer is obviously whatever poisons, acids and explosives you feel like.
>>43902467
Double layers of any kind of rubber is an iffy proposition. It rubs together and can easily rip both layers just from normal movement.
>>43907067
Then how do you keep prints off a crime scene?
>>43907230
put cloth gloves on, then pull a rubber glove from that tissue-box-like box they come in and put them on top.
If you're extra paranoid wash your gloved hands with soap.
