How good is Netrunner?
>>43885982
It's shit.
>>43885982
It's great.
>>43885982
Its great. The honey moon is over with the game but there are still tons of people that play it.
Just not as much on release. Check your LGS to see if they play.
>>43885982
NETRUNNR IS GREAT. Normally we have a general up that has plenty of resources to help you out.
>>43885982
>What is Android: Netrunner?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAslVfZ9p-Y [Embed] [Embed]
>Android Netrunner Official FFG News & Spoilers:
http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_news.asp?etyn=1&ecan=197&epn=0
http://boardgamegeek.com/blogpost/24049/netrunner-spoilers
>Floor rules
https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2015/9/24/install-new-security-measures/
>Official FAQ, Compendium on rulings, and common mistakes
http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/ffg_content/android-netrunner/support/FAQ/Android-Netrunner%20FAQ.pdf
http://ancur.wikia.com/wiki/Project_ANCUR_Wiki
https://www.reddit.com/r/Netrunner/comments/2f8qj8/netrunner_beginner_faq/
https://www.reddit.com/r/postalelf/comments/2sm1d2/welcome_to_netrunner/
>Netrunner Card List and Data Pack Details:
http://netrunnerdb.com/
>RIP onosendai.com
http://acoo.net
http://www.cardgamedb.com/index.php/netrunner/android-netrunner-card-spoilers
http://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/147101/android-netrunner-lcg-setlists/
>Deckbuilding Resources:
http://netrunnerdb.com/
http://netrunner.meteor.com/
http://www.cardgamedb.com/index.php/netrunner/android-netrunner-deck-builder
http://www.littlechiba.com
http://acoo.net
>Articles and Blogs:
http://www.strangeassembly.com/tag/netrunner
http://netrunner-math.blogspot.ca/
http://teamcovenant.com/blog/category/netrunner-lcg/
http://stimhack.com/
http://www.cardgamedb.com/index.php/index.html/_/android-netrunner
>Podcasts/Videocasts:
http://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/157566/android-netrunner-podcasts-metalist
https://www.youtube.com/user/ANRBadPublicity?feature=watch
Try "Why I run", great for prospective Runners looking for a hands-on demo on how Running works (replace the spaces by dots):
www nagnazul com/whyirun/whyirun.html
>>43885982
It's shit.
So we got that box. We fucked up the first game and didn't add any of those neutral cards. Turns out it's literally impossible to win and you just have to mill the deck.
The game is MASSIVELY unbalanced in favor of the hacker.... for a few turns.
Then the corp gets some impassible ice, and the hacker is completely fucking fucked.
Then the hacker gets the required programs to bypass the ice, and then it's finally a game of strategy and logistics and all those typical gameplay mechanics.
Early gains help secure later victory, so the game is largely determined by how lucky the hacker is with pulling the right cards.
>>43886469
So basically you are a terrible player who can not read cards and manuals.
>>43885982
i like it
it feels kinda imbalanced at times but thats just because you get better and smarter at the game in an asymmetrical way sometimes, and the metagame has to adapt
Have we hit that inception point?
Is there an "Android: NetRunner, the card game" videogame delivered on the Android OS yet?
Only way it could get better is if it was developed by "Running With Scissors" or some other game developer with a punny name.
>>43886491
Yeah, that first game didn't go very well.
What exactly is a corporation supposed to do prior to having ICE on his hand and deck?
What exactly is a runner supposed to do if there's ICE he cannot break?
Maybe it's different for the crazy new cards not found in the box, but we only have the box.
>>43886560
Okay, so you can choose not to ice up your hand or deck and immediately start building remote the can not break right away.
Now, if he can not break ice he draws his breaker or attacks other server getting the corp to rze more cards. Cause it might mean he can not pay for it nd score agenda. You learn to be aggressive.
>>43886615
>[corp] immediately start building remote the can not break right away.
What cards are those? There's the agendas you obviously don't want them to get. The assets they could trash if they access them. The trash cost? Is that what's keeping the runner from just walking up and shitting on your parade?
> if [runner] can not break ice he draws his breaker
Right. Luck of the draw. Great opening move to cycle 4 cards hoping to draw something useful. With the hand limit, these are things he'd have to discard afterwards. Or you could get money and play stuff to make room in your hand, but then you're just drawing 1 or 2 cards.
>or attacks other server getting the corp to rze more cards.
. . . So you spend a turn forcing the corp to spend some credits towards something he wants to spend anyway?
We've had 3 games with periods where the runner was just fucked and had no targets he could run on simply because he didn't have the required programs to break through the ice. Aggression is simply not an option when the opponent has an absolute shield. It's really not a great feeling to have turns come and have to say "whelp, I'm still fucked over here, your turn".
Likewise, until the corp draws enough ice/money, it's open season. Really shitty to have the runner capture 3 agendas from your hand and draw deck in the 2nd turn.
Once I realized that there are just periods in the game where one side is expected to be fucked over a barrel, and that it comes and goes, then I could enjoy it. Prior to that I was just confused about what I was doing wrong.
>>43886779
Sounds like you aren't building around these problems.
>Remotes
The remotes he's speaking of are cards like SanSan City grid, which is a one-of in the core set. It's hard to find good examples, because this strategy has become much stronger as of recent, especially after the second big box. We're at the point that Wizzard is considered viable because people are playing almost entirely asset based economy.
And yes, it's the trash cost. Thank god there were so few cards with high trash cost in the core set, because econ was pretty weak for the runner, outside of Magnum Opus.
>Breaker
Play 3 of Special Order in pretty much every deck. Problem solved. If that's not enough, run 3 of Diesel. You'll rarely see Diesel after core.
>Attacking other servers
No, by forcing the corp to res ice, early on, the corp has to risk both losing the money they were going to use on other ice, as well as giving away too much info to the runner. As long as you're running early in the core set, and have 3+ cards in your hand, you're normally fine.
>Corp draws enough ice/money
That's bad deck building. The corp should be extemely ice heavy in core set, unless you're playing Scorched Earth or some sort of fast advance.
The other issue is that you're running one core.
Many of the staple cards of the "Core Only" format are things that you don't get three of in core. Desperado, SanSan City Grid, The Anarch Breakers, Scorched Earth, Astro Script Pilot Program, ect.
Also, you're missing the corp staple, Jackson Howard. Without him, the game is pretty much completely different. You see him played in nearly every corp deck, and I fear for the day he's cycled out.
I absolutely love Netrunner's flavor, and I greatly enjoy the Influence mechanic and how it affects deckbuilding.
My friend and i just started.
It's a learning curve for sure, but it's a different kind of game with a great theme.
We're still learning our way and the game got much much better once we expanded the core set
>>43886469
>hacker
>not runner
git outta here
>>43887013
>I fear for the day he's cycled out.
I rejoice at the though, for one.
>>43887013
I'm glad Damon Stone is in in the lead seat now, I trust he will bring interesting alternatives for Howard, I've seen his previous work and I like how the guy thinks.
>>43885982
Really fucking good?
Why do you ask?
Can we just make this our new general thread?
I love this game
What should i buy next?
I have..
-core
-creation, control expansion
-order, chaos expansion
-what lies ahead data pack
What next fir Runners and what next for Corps?
>>43889615
Note i myself like Shaper and HB
My roommate likes Crimnal/anarch and likes everything corp but Jinteki
>>43889615
I'd say go with Honor & Profit, that way you have the complete card pool that will not rotate.
And it has some cards that other corps might like to use, so you get value even if you don't play that much Jinteki (hell, Mushin no Shin, if anything.... Mushin is love, Mushin is death).
Probably not the best option if you want to go competitive, but if you don't mind, that's what I'd do anyway.
>>43886469
Holy shit you're retarded, get out of my hobby please
>>43889615
Opening Moves if you can get a hold of it. And Honor & Profit, for reason anon already mentioned.
>>43886469
Hahaha how does it feel to be retarded
I'm in love with the game and I've been playing it extensively for the past 3 months, still feel awful at it though. Just finished up my cardpool. First tournament coming up.
Anti DLR Val (49 cards)
Blue Sun: Powering the Future
-- Agenda (9 cards)
2 Global Food Initiative
1 NAPD Contract
3 Oaktown Renovation
3 Project Atlas
-- Asset (11 cards)
1 Adonis Campaign
1 Corporate Town
1 Elizabeth Mills
3 Executive Boot Camp
3 Jackson Howard
2 Public Support
-- ICE (17 cards)
2 Archer
1 Assassin
2 Caduceus
3 Curtain Wall
3 Enigma
1 Ichi 1.0
1 Orion
2 Spiderweb
2 Turing
-- Operation (10 cards)
3 Hedge Fund
2 Housekeeping
2 Interns
3 Oversight AI
-- Upgrade (2 cards)
2 Crisium Grid
So I typed out a long post, but Captcha ate it all so I'm not gonna retype all that. Long story short, it's a deck built to handle DLR Val and I'd like feedback. Any questions, I'll answer.
>>43898148
>Anti dlr
>No freelancers or all seeing I
>>43898670
>>43898148
He raises a good point, how exactly does that deck counter dlr?
>>43898670
>>43900004
Elizabeth Mills to nuke the Off-Campus as soon as they put a Drug Dealer or Street Peddler on it. Corporate Town for the midgame. Unfaustable ice. General siphon resistance. I'm trying to make a deck that's resilient to DLR without just being stupidly vulnerable to other stuff like PPVP.
I want to get into it so bad, but having to buy multiple core boxes just to get play sets of all the cards is awful.
>>43900113
mills requires a click and they are most definitely running fall guys.
>>43900201
Upfront is scary, but totally worth it in the long run. I have like 8 playable decks at any given time, if I organize a game night I can lend premade decks to some friends, or just cube draft.
>>43900341
Yes, but the idea is to shoot the OCA before they get setup. If I can hit it before the Fall Guys appear, it slows them down greatly. Not foolproof, but that's why there's Corporate Town as well.
>>43900201
>multiple core boxes just to get play sets of all the cards is awful.
Seriously this.
As much as I love the IDEA of the LCG model, the fact that I still have to buy things twice to get a playset just turns me the fuck off.
>>43902989
Thank fully that only holds true in the core sets. The rest of them does not appear to be the case.
>>43900201
Honestly, I don't think buying several of the cores is really that required.
Like, yea, the core crim and anarch consoles are really good, but they're not absolutely required. There's plenty of other good consoles that have shown up in the later datapacks and such.
None of the cards in the core set are absolutely required to build effective decks.
>>43903179
It's only true of the core set because the core set was designed to have seven quick assemble decks instead of a playset of cards for tutorial purpses. I'm sure there are websites out there that sell singles.
I actually remember seeing a site that will sell you a core set and then a complete set of all the cards the core set didn't have three of.
>>43904434
I think it depends which corp/runner you want to play; some factions are quite dependant on some cards till you get alot of data packs i.e NBN.
>>43906192
Sure, but beyond learning, it's cheaper to buy those data packs then it is to buy two more core sets.
Like, the two sets gets you 6 data packs, more than enough to buy a deck that doesn't take core limited cards.
OK SO YOU GUYS WANNA GET THE MUMBAD SPOILERS STARTED?
>>43907102
Obviously, but please deliver or you'll just be an attention whore.I want to believe...
>>43907190
Crim gets a Peddler for events.
>>43907222
hnnnnnnggggg
>>43907222
Sweet.
>>43907222
So you can choose to do a run event even on a Corp turn? Neato.
>>43907379
My guess is that there's a limitation that says only trash on your turn? Or it requires a click? But a click requirement wouldn't be fun.
>>43907388
Well, if AOYCF can exist, runs during the corp turn shouldn't be too much of an issue.
The only question is how much influence it's going to cost.
>>43907102
>>43907222
So...anything else?
>>43886423
/thread
>>43886469
>The game is MASSIVELY unbalanced in favor of the hacker.... for a few turns.
>Then the corp gets some impassible ice, and the hacker is completely fucking fucked.
>Then the hacker gets the required programs to bypass the ice, and then it's finally a game of strategy and logistics and all those typical gameplay mechanics.
It's called tempo.
I don't know how much it is clear from the core set but netrunner is mostly a game revolving about tempo
Some runner decks are made for the early game ( massively unbalanced in favor of the hacker phase ) to be the longer, so they win before the corp can play
Some other decks are made for the end game to come the faster they can, so they can win with superior "strategy and logistics"
Also the deck supposed to be played in the core set are very bad because they don't use influence and jinteki is not at all the good faction for beginners
>>43900201
This is the main drawback of netrunner honestly and one of the only thing i hate about that game
Other things include DLR
>>43907438
Yes, but AOYCR is controlled by Corp. An event Peddler would be controlled by Runner, which is significantly different.
>>43907222
Let me guess, it's called "The Eternal Struggle" ?
>>43908125
DLR isn't the issue though.
Wireless Net Pavilion is.
>>43909270
Wireless Net Pelican not the problem. Fall Guy is.
>>43909309
I want a wireless-net pelican now.
(The whole set up really, not just DLR individually. I still think WNP is the worse piece as it makes it all come into being - but then people will complain about trying to play Character assassination because it's a "suboptimal agenda". You get the game state you deserve).
>>43907222
Waitaminute
You said you didn't have anything post d&d before...
Not to mention that instant speed events doesn't work - you'd be able to run while you run, or in the corp's turn.
I could see a "draw three and place them face down, play one at a discount" like peddler, but instant speed is a huge part of that card
>>43886469
Sounds more like you're just a retard and fucking terrible at the game. You probably weren't even playing it right.
I just like playing NBN and listening to Dirty Laundry the whole time
Is Weyland or NBN better for a deck focused on trashing all Breakers that hit the table?
>>43910382
Weyland has power shutdown and archer in faction. I think they are more reliable tools than NBN. Data Raven/Gutenburg and Keegan Lane is powerful but unreliable.
>>43910382
Weyland.
NBN's Tag-Keegan strategy is good, very good, but Weyland has more tools for the job.
>>43898670
>>43900113
>>43900341
>>43902430
I now know how people who don't know how to play Magic feel when I discuss it.
>>43910447
Play NEH and import them.
Unrelated note, spoiler ken confirmed for attention whore?
>>43914001
He is the new (and vastly less skilled in my honored opinion) FFG Insider.
>>43885982
[Opinion]
\thread
>>43914031
I never thought I'd say it, but...
Bring FFG Insider back? At least he generated discussion about design space, if nothing else.
Discussion: how would you design an anti-AI ice for Weyland?This will never happen and NBN will get a second anti-AI ice because FFG hates Weyland.
>>43914456
Morph ICE,
With an even amount of advancements, it can't be broken by AI breakers.
Otherwise, it can't be broken by non-AI breakers.
>>43914456
I will see what I can do about talking him into coming back. He works a few cubes over from me (he introduced me to Netrunner). Maybe I can get him to start doing some design idea posts.
As for a anti-AI card in Weyland.
Dynamic Noise
Weyland - 2 IF
Cost 6 - Barrier
Str 2
If a AI card is used to break a Subroutine on this card remove one -> End the Run Subroutine and force the Runner to encounter this ICE again.
-> End the Run
-> End the Run
-> End the Run
>>43914456
I like the idea, but too convoluted (and It' probably not going to work as I intend it against Faust):
Infinite Feedback Wall of Sound
Rez Cost 4 Str 3
Barrier
-> End the run.
Infinite Feedback Wall of Sound gets +1 STR for the remainder of the run every time the runner triggers an effect from a program that isn't a Fracter while encountering it.
>>43914601
Simple, I like it.
>>43914665
On the one hand, seems fairly costed when compared to Spiderweb, on the other sitting at 6 it suffers from being too expensive to be used as the anti-AI piece one would want it to be. At least seems so to me.
As a new player interested in this game, I always hear people making decks and bringing it to events, so they have both a hacker and a corp deck, do they just bring 1 of them? How does that work?
>>43915084
6 is not that bad for Weyland and if they have to use a AI breaker it costs 6 breaks to get past it.
It also combos insanely well with Sub Boost since it adds effectively 4 more subs to it.
>>43885982
It's okay. I don't think it's any better than any if the other FFG LCGs. I don't know why it gets the most attention.
>>43915211
It is the best constructed card game on the market right now. The new L5R will likely beat the shit out of it in 2017 but for now it is the king by far.
>>43915169
Yet, the problem with Weyland ice again is that they're all expensive for just ETRs. Facechecking it punishes Corp, unless you're Blue Sun.
>>43915169
It's not that bad in the long run, but let's face it, you want an anti AI piece that works for the early game. And unless you're going Oaktown (or Hostile Takeover I guess) rezzing this could really be crippling at that point.
I don't know. I'm not saying it's bad, but without testing my first hunch is that this wouldn't play its role well enough in too many cases.
>>43915154
You play both sides. A full game is you playing the runner against your opponent's corp deck, then you playing the corp against your opponent's runner deck.
Player with most points on hose two rounds win.
>>43906146
>I actually remember seeing a site that will sell you a core set and then a complete set of all the cards the core set didn't have three of.
My shitty googling didn't help me find this, is this still a thing?
>>43914819
I like that it hoses datasucker just as much as AI breakers.
I just wish I could find a better wording.
>>43915269
Can't really mess with their theme on that tho.
I mean damaging ICE is Jenteki's thing, taxing ICE is NBN's thing, and funky ICE is HB's thing.
Weyland ICE are just walls that get in the way while you build a kill combo.
The advancement based ICE idea will never really work while Parasite is in the meta (so forever).
>>43915269
On the one hand, I understand what you're trying to say, but ending the run is the first and foremost purpose of ICE.
If you do end the run, and it manages to get you that scoring window, how does that face-checking hoses you ? That's what you wanted an ETR for all along.
>>43915343
It's not just Parasite, it's the whole ICE destruction tools, or forcing back ICE into HQ deal.
Runner just has too many efficient tools to make it seem like advance-able ICE is a good proposition.
Note that, this may just be an impression.
Going back to the "Weyland is the high variance faction" bit: I *win* games thanks to advance-able ICE. I do. It may just be that, as I lose a lot more when losing one such piece of ICE to a trashing, I hate the risk taken, and resent the outcome irrationally.
I too often feel the risk isn't worth the while. But is it not ?
I don't have solid data on that.
Bit like Human First is deemed a bad card by most competitive players, yet it's been doing good to great in most decks in which I play it.
>>43914456
Nightmare
Weyland •••
Cost 4 Strength 8
Ice: Sentry - Destroyer
↳The corp gains 2 credits
↳Trash 1 AI program
"Imagination is a terrible thing to give a program"
>>43915343
>shitty ice is Weyland's thing
FTFY
>>43915399
Yes, but cost factors highly into what makes ice good. If the rez cost is too high, you're crippling your ability to score agendas or protect other servers, and these days the Runner has a million diferent ways of working around hefty ice.
Eg: Wraparound. It functions perfectly as a cheap ETR that won't tax the Runner much, but also won't break your bank rezzing it. The fact that it's anti-AI is pure gravy.
Swordsman: basically pure AI hate. But even then at 3 cost, it has a 1 net damage subroutine, which can be very irritating to handle. It breaks for 2 with Mimic, so it's as taxing as Architect.
Turing is 4 cost for a 5 str ETR on a remote that can be circumvented with 3 clicks. Very' very taxing. On a central, it's overcosted but you'd only put it on a central to fully exploit its anti-AI capabilities. Despite being just ETR, it has the potential for taxing away the Runner's entire turn.
We can't just say, 'oh, Weyland's always had big ETRs, let's give them more.' Look at Crick. Look at Meru Mati. A change in design space for Weyland has to be made. The Mumbad barrier that gives you money when the Runner breaks it is a step in the right direction, but they can't just stay stale with big ETRs. It's pretty much why Blue Sun is so good, it keeps your expenditure on ice liquid.
>>43916150
>Look at Crick. Look at Meru Mati
I'm assuming you're comparing Crick's awesomeness to Meru Mati's meh-ness?
Really disapointed at how weak MM was compared to the others - they all got cool gimmicks and MM was just a half price Bastion
>>43916277
Not even how weak it is, I'm just astounded at how boring it is. The str increase based on position is the cycle's thing, but giving all of the ice except Weyland something cool just isn't kosher.
>>43916335
Weyland ice (with a couple of exceptions) does 4 things:
It ends the run
It trashes a program
It makes the corp money
It can be advanced
If you want a fifth thing, they do trace for tags as well, but nobody lets that go off if they can help it
And they chose to just do the first, most boring thing, which really kinda sucks
Would you play a 1/4-on HQ strength Destroyer?
That seems like something they could have been given without it being OP
>>43916766
I think Wendigo was a good move, but like all positional ice, it's less than effective.
Sometimes I think Architect is more a Weyland card. Hell, look at the name. And who's Meru Mati but an architect? And BUILDING A Better World. Because We BUILT It. Builder. Argh.
Are there any good beginner videos or podcasts?
>>43916810
Yeah - I get that Archives manipulation is HB's game, but it really would be just as good in Weyland.
Builder is... it's okay. LOVE that you can move it, that's something that can make positional ice really nice, but it's mostly just a tax, instead of support for an already difficult archetype.
Sadly NBN does it better, with Matrix Analyser.
Wendigo is cool - actually, despite their rep, most of Weyland's code gates are cool (though they only have 7, including Orion, and there's an honorary member in the shitty Lycan), with the only shit ones being Salvage and Ieress
I think there's a fair bit of potential in Weyland ice - it has good effects, but it doesn't do them well - but too often it's too slow, expensive or weak.
A big problem is that historically, FFG's nerf-bat is just a bit too strong - it's been stated in an interview with Damon Stone that during the playtesting phase they prefer to make cards found to be OP weaker than to produce seriously OP cards, and Weyland cards (Student Loans, Negotiator, the "advance while rezzed" set) suffer worse than most (the other major example he gave was Monolith, which apparently gave shapers some insane click compression)
Bailiff does look like a step in the right direction, even if it is on the very low end of powerful - I'd say it's Weyland's pop-up window, which isn't a bad piece of ice by any stretch of the imagination
So i got a bunch of the cheap lcg sleeves for my netrunner and conquest collections, The problem is the sleeves are slightly to big for the boxes i have, Does anyone on /tg/ use the ffg sleeves? If you do how do you store the sleeved cards?
>>43917407
I like that Bailiff is a Popup that requires a breaker.
>>43919058
Just toss a few patches and sub boosts on that bitch and... cry when it get's a parasite on it or they just break it and keep you RnD locked.
>>43919223
If you're using a popup on it I'd consider that a fair trade - sure, you'll clone chip it back, but it's still one of the most harmless pieces of ice you can hit.
Still, we've seen three scary pieces of new HB ice like pic related, I'd like to see if Weyland gets any showstoppers
>>43919456
That ICE will never trigger.
>>43919482
Oh really?
>>43919700
>resolve 1 subroutine
1 brain damage very scary
>>43919828
Zero, actually. It only has subroutines on encounter. Batty doesn't work with it.
>>43919828
Ugh, this is what I get for posting late.
Use the Twins then, or patch it or something
>>43920007
Still just going to parasite it or break it for a few credits with mimic. 9 Credits for almost 100% chance of no effect.
>>43920415
>>43919482
Come on, Inazuma isn't THAT expensive to import.
If anything, I love how the possibility of Inazuma + Brainstorm on a server can make Defective Brainchip a nice deterrent.
That's a lot of ifs, but it's a funny idea.
>>43921073
The cost is a bit of an indicator though - when it's in the cardpool, you'll have to be careful against HB above 9 credits - I can only presume that the 4 influence is so Blue Sun doesn't splash it and have a field day
>>43921213
Splash it along with any HB alliance cards that get released and baby, we've got a brew going.
>>43921213
But then it opens interesting bluffs for HB if/when it choses to sit on a big pile of money.
>>43919456
Personally i like the flavor of it being a better komainu due to the rivalry between them and jinteki.
>tfw a delicious brown Eli clone for jinteki in the mumbad cycle.
>tfw it's a trap
>>43921277
>any HB alliance cards
Have you not seen the HB alliance card?
It's fantastic (and will make me bitch about lacking the "Bioroid" subtype forever. No, being a product line is no excuse, Tenma Line still has "clone"), good enough to be worth splashing - though it's best in HB
>>43921341
That... hmm, that's an interesting thoughtbut not my fetish
Maybe an upgrade that can be a Deflector-Caprice - Jinteki's tech support is just a bunch of indian clones bouncing you to trap servers?
Speaking of HB-Jinteki rivalry, pic related might possibly, potentially, make Custom Biotics worth playing, maybe?
>>43921378
Its awesome in Weyland. Specifically, Titan Transnational, though if Weyland ever gets a Jackson replacement you'll see it other places. Here's what you do.
3 copies of Biotic Labor
2 of Jackson
3 HB influence to taste. You could use recursion or just economy (though Lateral Growth would be perfect if it weren't 2 influence).
Then you run Subliminal Messaging and Shipment from Kaguya. With a Jeeves on the board, you can fast advance Atlas without Biotics (Subliminal-Kaguya-Kaguya), fast advance a 4/2 with a single biotic (Biotic Labor, install, triple advance, Jeeves click advance)) or get a 5/3 (Subliminal-Biotic-Biotic). This is all in addition to the normal benefits of Biotic Labor. Jeeves can also be used as a psuedo Gila and it has a heavy trash cost. It all combines to add some flexibility to the Titan fast advance plan, since you can get out those Oaktown grids for free. But where people will really use it is NEH, cause they're boring and Subliminal-Lateral-SanSan works just as well.
Where it would be really cool would be Building a Better World, though then it suffers for a lack of Jackson Howard. You run Subliminals, Jeeves, Ash, and HB transactions in a Glacier build. Sure it won't be that often, but Glacier builds run a long time, so you'll probably get the combo off every couple games. And it has that jank appeal all over it.
>>43914601
Horrible design? Horrible design.
>>43922061
Heh, with Jeeves in Titan you could pull off the incredibly hilarious turn: Geothermal, Geothermal, Geothermal, to gain 21 credits, 3 Bad pub and a click
Also with Simone/The Root you could do a hell of a lot of advancing for very little money indeed
>>43921378
I'm still wondering whether or not Jeeves triggers only for triple click actions (aka purging virus counters, Melange and Eliza's) or for taking the same action 3 times (a la The Collective) or both. To me, the wording difference from The Collective suggests the former.
>>43923288
That's the big question with that card - only triple click actions make it much less attractive, but also much less crazy, but "action" makes me think it's any corp click action, which includes installing and playing events
This guy looks interesting - the losing a click is a bit rough, but the potential (especially with operations, I think) is intriguing
>mfw when adam gets to his last card and realises he forgot to include Aesop, meaning his drug dealers limit his maximum income to 1 credit per turn
As it happened I had the tools to kill him, but given that I had a glacier that could have taken ages for me to win
>>43919938
It gains the subs for the remainder of the run, that's word for ford from the card dude.
>>43925783
I see, thanks.
>>43925783
And even if it was for the encounter, there's a timing window between the Runner breaking subroutines and resolution of subroutines for the Corp to use Marcus Batty.
My coworker said people wanted me to come back for awhile.
So lets try this out without spoilers!
Here are my thoughts on the current state of the game and how Mumbad will evolve it.
The core issue people are having is with decks focused on non-interaction with the other play. Both Runner and Corp decks that excel at this are doing very well.
I think one of the biggest changes we have seen recently is high value assets. There are many assets you just can't leave on the table anymore, pushing the Runner into running remotes to deal with them. This opens the econ tempo game back up for both sides since many of the new assets are low rez cost and high trash cost. Jeeves is one of the best examples of this. It is a insanely high value target.
This makes for win/win plays as the Corp where they can ICE their Jeeves in a remote and if they Runner goes for it they likely open a scoring window and if they leave it you get the use of a very powerful card.
Now outside of that what I really want to see out of Mumbad is some new Ambushes. I think Ambush play is something that has not really been fully explored yet in the game. I also think it is a key part of Corp late game play that many people ignore.
>>43927390
I agree, and that's how I see Eliza's Toybox. That's why Whizzard/Scrubbers are still some of the strongest cards in order to counter this kind of play. Although meanwhile we have Valencia doing Blackmail runs through my Glaciers, trashing my assets with bad pub.
I want to see some new ambushes too. Considering the last we see was Archangel and News Team I think Lukas was out of ideas at this point, so I don't expect something revolutionary regarding ambushes in mumbad. But next cycle we'll have Damon Stone over it, so I expect a new direction in this regard.
>>43927560
IMO Val decks are a reason to run more Illicit ICE/Bad Pub generating cards and Bad Pub removal cards.
Removing Val's Bad Pub can be near crippling to many of her decks right now. So BP removal cards have fairly good value in this meta. Toss in some cards that give you BP and you don't have dead cards in other match ups.
Toybox I have always been iffy on since while it's effect is powerful it is also costly. I have yet to see it really excel in value.
https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2015/12/1/a-mirror-to-the-soul/
What does BMI stand for? Brain Muscle Induction?
>>43928171
Brain Machine Interface.
>>43928232
If that's true that's incredibly lame.
>>43927754
Toybox is pretty grand in Blue Sun. Lets you free-rez Curtain Wall or Janus for dollars without the risk that Oversight AI brings.The risk of Oversight AI is real. Ever seen a Quetzal drop e3 on her first turn and smash your OAI target with no breakers? It ain't pretty. Also, wtb big code gate with no other types.
The card layouts are cluttered with nonsense techno-kewl doodads and are generally hideous. Really painful to look at. Maybe I'd play it again if I could have very clean and basic proxies with no art or shitty borders
>>43929633
Yeah, unless you catch them in a lucky moment most runners can deny your OAI and make you sad
>>43928797
How is that lame?
>>43931694
It is not lame but this art keeps getting creepier. The parents color coded the kids eyes to their gender.
>>43932686
Creepy, same gear as this dude
>>43932686
I don't know, it looks more like the eye colour is due to the BMI's activation. Consumer products would be gendered, unsurprisingly.
>>43931485
Is OAI Curtain Wall that weak nowadays? I was going to bring a Blue Sun deck that uses Adonis and OAI Curtain Wall, but when you put it like that it doesn't sound very promising.
>>43930912
>No art
Enjoy your autism
>>43915252
I'm just not a fan of it. I don't like the asymmetrical nature of it, and I find its setting boring. It's not bad by any means. It's just another LCG in my eyes.
>>43935303
There are a few points to OIA these days: e3 is a major issue, David is a problem against almost any anarch, and there's the general point that beating Curtain Wall (11 with Corroder) will deny the corp 14 credits and a Curtain Wall, which is essentially Vamp+ levels of efficiency
>>43927754
>IMO Val decks are a reason to run more Illicit ICE/Bad Pub generating cards and Bad Pub removal cards.
Thats' an interesting point. It probably would help if Illicit ICE looked like a better investment.
Fenris only really helps early (though I like it patched); Shinobi you'll probably only rez if you get a kill shot; I want to like Muckraker, I really do, but it so rarely does the cut for me; Swam can be fun as a one off, it's always fun to see someone that wasn't expecting it lose half a rig to it, but it suffers from the advance-able ICE issues; Checkpoint... I don't know... I have a hard time with that card, it's an econ tax card for a porous server in the end, could work I guess: Grim is Grim, like Shinobi, it does its work, or it sits there, I guess it's reliable enough.
Reality ThreeDee is a weird one, and I could see it do the trick for some decks... but against Valencia specifically ? Don't know that I would want it. I'm probably discounting it a bit too easily, haven't played enough against NBN bad pub decks (hardly anyone makes them) post D&D. With Exposé, Broadcast Square and The All Seeing I, there's probably something to be said about NBN being the best equipped to make it work.
On that note: comparing Eposé with Rex Campaign is fucking depressing.
>>43936837
>beating Curtain Wall (11 with Corroder) will deny the corp 14 credits and a Curtain Wall, which is essentially Vamp+ levels of efficiency
Even knowing how important being able to turn installed cards into liquidities (or threaten doing so) can be for Blue Sun, I just can't see how you'd think making the runner pay eleven credits to trash the Curtain Wall when you've paid one to rez it happens to be a bad transaction for the corp.
>>43938500
Exactly. Unless I hardrez a Curtain Wall and you Crescentus it, I don't see how that's a bad trade for me. You deny my potential money, but at the cost of your actual money.
>>43885982
CCG. It's shit like all CCGs. Magic fags plz go
>>43939693
>Netrunner
>CCG
What?
>>43934329
I always love the idea that some dude with anarchy and chaos tattoos clearly shown managed to get far enough inside a corp building to do an inside job.
You'd think they'd have a bit more stringent screening process.
>>43940382
Maybe he's a cosplayer.
>>43886453
AGENDA is plural. AGENDUM is singular
holy shit is is this for real she keeps saying "agendas"
>>43927390
You know, your point about putting Jeeves in a remote reminds me of Haas Arcology AI. If you IAA it in your remote and use it to FA a 2 pointer, the Runner still has to go in to stop you from doing it again. If you have Team Sponsorship, it gets better. Shame Haas A AI is so cheaply trashed.
Since we're talking Jeeves, too ridiculous to pass: Eliza's Toybox on space ICE.
>>43943160
It's a shame you'll have to Eliza's before taking another action, otherwise Jeeves won't trigger. So you can't install, then rez.
>>43939940
Original Netrunner was, but that just raises new questions
>>43940382
You don't understand: the guy got the tattoos *specifically* for that one inside job.
The chief engineer he's impersonating has the very sames. Duly noted in his ID profile.
>>43934329
obviously the dude got let in by a janitor or something. he's in the bathroom for chrissakes.
>>43935303
it's still really good. OAI orion is also not bad, and doesn't require you to position your install. the highest wey deck at worlds was a non scorcher that ran 2x CW 1x orion
so, from a standpoint of what they do(more or less), or their name or the references made on the card, what are your favorite programs/resources/assets/cards?
my friend always plays Project Junebug and Snare. and I like the virus I cannot remember the name of that lowers the strength of a hosted ice every turn...
>>43945322
you mean this guy?
A couple questions as a new player: other than the core set, what other expansions are worth picking up initially? As someone who comes from magic, are there any comparison to deck styles, like control, aggro, etc.?
>>43949292
to answer your questions.
'couldn't say' and 'yes' respectively.
laying traps, forcing plays, stealing resource, milling the deck...they aren't usually the same as MtG plays, but they can be pretty intense...
>>43949292
You have to buy all currently released content to even have a shot at building the lowest level decent decks.
There is only one style of deck in Netrunner. Uninteractive control decks. Anything other then that loses turn 3.
>>43949351
>>43949351
>>43949348
A better way I could have asked that is: do the IDs have their own playing styles for both runner and corp?
>>43949930
Most factions only really have one playable ID that massively outshines the others. So I mean you CAN say they play in their own style in that one is good and the others are shit.
>>43949995
>>43950050
HB: Engineering the Future
NBN: Near Earth Hub
Jinteki: Replicating Perfection
Weyland: Bluesun
Shaper: Kate
Anarch: Val
Criminal: Andy
The CLOSEST to not just being 100% better then other IDs are Val and Andy. Noise is fairly strong but does not have the same power as being able to use Blackmail at the start of the game. In a Bad Pub removal meta Noise takes the care tho.
Criminal is kind of in the shit right now but Andy's extra starting tempo is still hard to beat. The main reason you don't see her anymore is that Crim is just bad in this meta.
>>43950176
>NBN
>not HS
>>43950215
Oh right I forgot that HS has taken over at this point. I have not really played NBN for a few months.
>>43950471
Not only HS. Leela is way better Criminal than Andy in our current meta, IG can gives RP a run for its money, and there's a bunch of anarchs more balanced than Val. The only reason Val is such a figurehead is because DLR is pretty balanced between its main strategy, the Siphons, and the blackmail. But Val is still a one trick pony that can get shutdown by Caprice, strongly Icing HQ, and freelancing her resources (since now that Dan won Worlds with it, everyone is taking measures against it). Which is why Noise is still consistently better, L4J Whizzard is just as soon taking over the asset meta, and Quetzal enjoying the barrier rush.
Which leaves only HB, Kate and BlueSun. Which, I admit, there's no case.
>>43951172
I am only going off what Dan says and he has proven to be the best Netrunner player and expert by far.
>>43951198
Yeah, that's what he said, he picked DLR Val for worlds because it was strongly balanced in its strategy and few people would know how to play against it.
I quote:
>You can beat it with pretty much anything but PE, I think. Freelancer is probably the best tech card for slow decks, though I think most of what needs to happen is people need to practice and learn how to play against it.
His words.
>>43949930
Leaving aside the power level stuff, yeah, different IDs do play totally differently (with more or less difference depending on which you compare).
But to pick one just one faction: Leela plays nothing like Fisk, which plays nothing like Santiago, which play nothing like Geist.
There's going to be some similarities between runners/corps ID of a same faction, because obviously they share the same card pool, and some of the same bread and butter cards. But the play-style can vary tremendously.
That's part of the pleasure of piloting with or against a lot of different decks if you ask me.
Talking about Fisk, I'd really, really want to be able to make a Fisk deck using Itinerant Protesters, but the cost of bad pub options makes it a daunting task.
>>43953469
Yeah, no kidding. It's already hard enough in Anarch. I went once with Valencia+IJ+Fan Site+Frame Job, plus Itinerant Protesters of course. It was really slow, took a good chunk of my deckspace, and crippled my early game.
Really weird/amusing game.
Managed to rush an early Utopia Fragment in Gagarin, then proceeded to Underway basically 2/3 of the runner's deck from a server with Simone Diego protected by a single RSVP. I just trashed most most of his breakers and recursion, and by the time he finally got a Faust going, the Underway was so far out of his reach I just continued to advance to finish trashing the stack, leaving him with a Faust with just four cards in hands.
Brutal.
I'm having far too much fun wit rototurrets right now. Most people seem to have forgotten it's a thing that exists, and it's won me a fair few games wiping out breakers.
>>43957020
Really? My rotos were always either preemptively hosed by mimic or parasited to oblivion.
Now I Lancelot-Batty his breakers for revenge.
>>43957377
I think you're in the wrong bait thread, friendo.
>>43957377
This is literally a copypaste that popped up here before. Begone.
>>43957020
I hit a Rototurret recently in a tournament. I SMC'd for Parasite, then followed up with a Makers' Eye.
>>43957688
It has also been my experience that a reasonably experienced player knows to be wary of sentries and even the most basic of preparations work efficiently against Rototurret. For your money you are probably better off with an Ichi 1.0 or an Architect (in HB anyway). I really like Ichi 2.0 as it is very taxing, not commonly used and players will often facecheck expecting a 1.0 and are instead introduced to a world of robotic pain.
Someone who regularly facechecks Ice with no way to deal with sentries and while also having other critical programs installed is not a very good player.
Is there a rule of thumb when it comes to deck building for both Corps and Runner?
>>43955444
That's pretty fucking awesome.
>>43961210
Corps generally prefer to have 4 additional cards over their minimum decksize. Also include 12+ Ice and 6+ Economy.
Newest of the Faggotry here.
I've had the intro box set for a while, and would like to get into playing it properly.
I get how the game works etc, but the main issue is the deck building. I understand the mechanisms but now how do I build decks? I like the shapers from the runner faction so ideally would like to build a deck around one. I haven't really read much into the corporates much now, but I'll see.
So, my question is where do I start? which expansions should I be looking for?
Thanks.
>>43961604
Deluxe boxes are always safe bet, since they never rotate and give some useful tools for each faction featured in them.
>>43961604
Okay, let's talk about what a Runner deck needs.
At its core, Netrunner is about, well, running. Therefore, your deck has to be about running, to achieve agenda points. Let us consider what we need to run.
Firstly, what stops us from running? The ICE that the Corporation puts up. How do we get past those? We need icebreakers and money to fuel them.
Thus, the first essential is icebreakers. You need all three types, fracters, decoders and killers to ensure you don't get locked out, and you need multiple copies in case one gets destroyed and also to help you find them quicker. 6 or so icebreakers (2 of each) is usually good.
Money cards are stuff like Sure Gamble, Armitage Codebusting and Easy Mark. A typical deck wants about 12 money cards, but if you're playing core set, you want to cram in as much as you can since there aren't many econ options in Core.
To get your breakers and money, you need card draw, so things like Diesel are great in Shaper. Cards like Special Order are called 'tutors', which let you find a particilar icebreaker in your deck. Special Order is a great include, since it adds consistency.
With draw/tutors, breakers and econ, you have a solid shell of a deck. This is where you must think about the 'gimmick' of your deck. Say you're Kate. Getting that 1 cred discount for install tells you you want to be installing things. In Core Set, the general way to play is to be the Big Rig Shaper. You take your time and set up breakers that get you in for cheap, take all the money in the world with Magnum Opus, and steal agendas whenever the Corp tries to score. The Makers' Eye is also great pressure, allowing you to get to the Corp's agenda before they can draw it. Multiaccess cards are good here in this slot, as are surprise cards like Inside Job that can throw the Corp off since they think you can't break into a particular server.
>>43961925
just out of curiosity, any idea what sorts of archetypes you or anyone would recomend for a beginner player? I've been trying to run NBN Tagstorm and Criminal Events, but I'm not hitting on anything good.
>>43962217
That's a terrible idea for a beginner. Tagstorm is often hit and miss, hard to achieve (except for midseasons, maybe), and almost impossible with the core cards that usually have a beginner.
Criminal event deck is more common, but I wouldn't say it's beginner friendly since the player needs to know how to use the events for pressure and close scoring windows when the Corp thinks there's one open.
>>43962217
I played NBN Tagstorm and Stimshop CT when I first started. I loved that Midseasons PsychoBeale let me do a Scapeshift-like one turn win, as long as I have enough money and the Runner decides to steal my shit. It was actually pretty alright, but if that's not working for you, core set Weyland with SEA-Source and Scorched Earth is a good way to go. HB ETF Glacier is also good if you want to go for pure glacier, but I recommend Weyland because it teaches you about flatlining.
As for Runner, Event Crims are rather difficult to start with, because you don't have a sense for when to use what. I'd say either go for an Anarch-breaker run-heavy Gabriel or Big Rig Kate. Run-heavy Gabe will teach you a rule that comes in handy: run early, run frequently, run aggressively. Big Rig Kate will teach you that Runners have inevitability on their side.
>>43958834
Who in his/her right mind rezzes a Rottoturet when there's a SMC on the table, though ?
>>43962644
Maybe to bait out a sentry breaker when all your other ice is barriers and/or code gates?
>>43965088
Would Housekeeping be the corp version of this?
It seems functionally similar.
I am about to blow your minds with my epic idea for a card!
The Collective
Neutral - 5 Inf
Event - Current - Contract
Cost: 3
This card is not trashed until another current is played or an agenda is scored. When The Collective is trashed remove from the game.
Trash an installed card: Host a Power Token on this card.
2 Hosted Power counter: Break an ICE subroutine.
>>43966192
You really love Apex,dont you
>>43967023
I was thinking more Noise but I did not want to make it Anarch since I can see them breaking it.
Since it is a Non-AI, Non-Progam, non-installed breaker I figured making it 5 for all IDs to run is fair, Running more then one forces you to really build a deck around it.
It is nice in Apex since he won't flip it with Apocalypse but it eats away at his face downs really fast.
I think the main reason it'd almost never see play is that most Corp decks run Currents so this is insanely easy to remove.
>>43966125
Similar effects, but very different in their effect on game tempo.
HM is generally less hard the corp than HK can be on the runner, if only because the corp can still install and then rez only at the time of need - though it has an interesting effect in value proposition conflict whn you have to weight the possibility of Queen's Gambit or Drive By.
Contrary to HK, it can have an explosive effect though which is really nice against, say, decks abusing Breaker Bay Grid.
HK generally forces the runner to install as much as possible at once, and install as little as possible until removed. Which can be a huge tempo kill for decks that need things on the table to perform, yet still need to keep a certain amount of cards in grip to prevent flatlining. Which can be godsend early to mid-game for the corp (sometimes evne late with some of the most install intensive decks around, but they tend to be an exception).
>>43967890
Really? It actually feels like HM has a harsher effect on the Corp. Unless, of course, they're rezzing Jackson. Rezzing a defensive upgrade or economy assets like Pad Campaign suddenly become a tough question to answer. The main difference to me is that HK allows the Runner to pick and choose the card being trashed, while HM is random.
>>43970892
I think the randomness is the equalizer: no runner is going to play with nothing to install - even the most event heavy Tenma deck is going to install support cards. At least not so far.
But even if it's not the fad right now, corps can have and will play decks that are devoid of assets and upgrades.
>>43966192
Sure, it's a powerful effect, but I don't think it needs that many limitations, really.
Definitely feels very anarch, but they usually have AI breakers so it's pretty limited
Any thoughts on >>43921498 - a three influence card is pretty hard to quantify in power, especially as you're only likely to have one, but could it give pic related - as an ID that would be okay with running multiples - an opportunity to shine?
bumpan
>>43975707
I guess it's great to be able to tutor your triple Scorch, but is having no ability really worth it? NEH's draw probably adds more consistency to finding kill pieces than that card.
>play targeted marketing
>against chameleon Shaper
>>43978793
Perhaps not, but that's not the only thing you can get 3 of - getting 3 Restructures is probably worth 4 credits, and if you're rich you could use it to get multiple Biotic Labors
>>43979712
Nice. Becomes much less of a gamble when you know the runner has to install the program to run, I might try that some time.
>>43979798
It always works very well against Account Siphon since you'll get more money out of it then they'll siphon
Unless they just want some extra bits
Are there any cards that work extremely well with having a buckload of bits?
>>43965088
Wow, you don't realise how shit the art is on Hacktivist until you see the full res version, huh?
>>43979712
Lovely.
>>43979827
Issue is, it also fuels the Account Siphon. If I had tyo chose, I'd much prefer rezzing econ assets into poverty, being back to manageable level next turn while the runner happens to be none the better.
Don't always have a choice mind you.
>> >>43921498
I'm so late on testing I have barely given the Mumbad cycle more than a passing thought.
Given so few people seem to be willing to try and build entirely new deck archetypes these days I can't rely as much on playing against new thing to evaluate new game space, have to build most of it myself (the builders are still there, but I see less of them, more optimization all around, or trying to adapt old builds to new ID... thinking of it, I'm probably a bit unfair, it's probably more that their efforts have been highly concentrated on the D&D runner IDs... at least runner side).
As mentioned, kill decks obviously *might* want it. Though that's kind of a stretch.
I like the idea of getting three Shock! or similar Ambushes. Just to send a clear "leave that HQ alone" message.
Following that vector: draw three Domestic Sleepers. I have 0 points in HQ, potentially three, are you willing to run to prevent that potential ?
Econ transactions (in HB ?), which you can then mass recur via Reclamation Order ?
Would there be a deck where a piece of ICE happens to be so central it might be worth the investment ?.
Overall, if I have to pay that much influence for it, I want it to be versatile enough to justify the investment. So it would probably have to be several of these things.
>>43980968
>So it would probably have to be several of these things
I think that'd be key. It's likely a waste if you only have one reason to use it.
I'd forgotten Reclamation Order, that could lead to some seriously nasty scenarios, playing the same event 6 (or even 9) times.
Hell, if Jeeves isn't just 3-click actions that could be amazing.
Domestic Sleepers is also an interesting idea.
>>43980467
It's not Efficiency Committee levels of bad, but yeah, not great
