File: GURPS 4th -Dungeon Fantasy Treasures 1 - Glittering Prizes.pdf (1 B, 486x500) Image search: [Google]

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Here's the latest DF book.

100% of published fourth edition material is now in the MEGA archive.

I'd like to take a moment and ask that you consider paying for some of this stuff, even though I'm helping distribute it for free. SJ Games have been very cool when it comes to dealing with their fans and are generally the kind of company which deserves some support. So why not show some appreciation? It doesn't have to be a huge amount; anything is better than nothing. But if you paid for half the stuff you use then you would still be getting fantastic value for money.

I get that some people are really poor and some people want to read everything without necessarily paying for stuff they aren't really going to use. But if you can afford it and you do use it, maybe think about paying for at least some of it? That way SJG stays in business, GURPS keeps making a profit and we keep getting books.

>>43859248
kromm bless you, based anon.
Just bought DF2&3 in tribute.

>>43858922
Why don't we just use getsync to spread the gurps files? Or refer to torrents on public trackers?

>>43859248
I want to buy some GURPS stuff but a lot of 4th stuff is out of print. I can't find a copy of Martial Arts for a reasonable price.

They should do Print on Demand for their back catalog.

>>43859248
I've bought about $300 in pdfs this year. The only thing I bought that I didn't like was the one pyramid about metatronic generators. I just don't get it even though everyone recommended it for pricing out magic items.

Obligatory link to last thread:
>>43769104

>>43859359
I'm not familiar with getsync.

I think MEGA is better than torrents because a lot of people only want to download a few books rather than an entire collection. Having a separate torrent for each book probably ins't practical.

But if you know a better method of distributing files, feel free to explain them or set up something that other people can use.

>>43859248
I fully intend to buy whatever books I use once I actually find people to play the damn game with.

Anyone running a GURPS game? I just wanna hear some stories about what you guys are doing with it.

>>43859762

Currently running a modern-day investigation game.

The concept is that the characters are super-competent people, like the protagonists from House MD, Lie to Me and various detective shows. They work for a fictional branch of the WHO investigating unusual biological entities, which can range from microbes to people. So far they stopped an outbreak of a prehistoric parasite in central europe and are currently trying to figure out why a couple of early hominids were found living in a park in Seattle.

It's a very low-combat game with a lot of fairly realist forensics and science combined with light-hearted interpersonal drama.

>>43859762
Not running anything currently, but I recently started thinking about putting together a introductory game for the RPG-introduction-events sometimes held at my Uni.
So far I'm thinking going for Dungeon Fantasy, since it's the sort of thing people are used to, but I also want to show of the system and what it can do a bit, so I'm considering having some fun with Thaumatology to spice it up.

>>43859762
I'm about to run an XCOM-inspired game using the Pointless Monster Hunting article, MH: Applied Xenology, and bits of Action. My group will be made up of people that aren't huge GURPS fans and others that don't know the system at all, so I'm hoping using the Pointless version will keeps things speedy. Planning on using GURPS Lite for the basics of combat with bits of Action to make things easier (e.g. range bands). I'll post back here in a couple weeks or so with stories of how it went.

On a related note, any clever fa/tg/uys willing to help with the organization's acronym? I don't want to use "XCOM;" the adventures will be more traditional investigations with action towards the end instead of pure run and gun missions, so calling them the eXtraterrestrial COMbat unit isn't quite accurate. Also due to budget cuts being what they are, the PCs will also have to be their own R&D crew (though they can requisition facilities and will have a decent-sized budget to spend from)

And that sound dB/distance chart from last thread is from Powers: Enhanced Senses.

New to GURPS, and the GURPS community is very comfy. Finished GURPS Lite and I'm almost done with my first read of the Basic Set. I intend on running a campaign of my own sometime early 2016.

>>43861342
ICE: Invetstigation (and) Containment (of) Extraterrestials.

>>43861431
Not that anon, but that's actually pretty good.

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>>43861342

UNified Intelligence Taskforce ;).

>>43861342
XIST: Xenologic Investigation Super Taskforce

>>43861431
I like it.

Rule #1 at I.C.E., stay frosty.

>>43861948
I see you're okay with the inevitable flurry of ice-related puns your players will throw about.

So I'm relatively new to gurps and have been working through the basic set in my spare time. I'm hoping to be gm'ing for my mates over the holidays and I want to go along the lines of an Indian Jones style explorer adventure. Are there any of the supplements that stand out as must reads for an adventure of that type?

>>43859762
I am in a game that a friend is running. It is basically a sci-fi STALKER game set on another planet. I'm having a good time, but he is having trouble with the rules. It doesn't help that half the players have no grasp of basic rules either.

>>43862558
The Action series is good for high-flying cinematic Hollywood action. It focuses on stripping the rules down to the basics that won't impede player badassery. Pyramid #3/08 Cliffhangers has advice for tweaking the stuff from Action for pulp-era settings if you want to be similar to Indiana Jones in that way too. High-Tech has the guns you'd need.

How to Be a GURPS GM is helpful as well.

>>43862638
What are the parts he is having issues with?

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>>43862026
A flurry? No, a blizzard!

>>43862781
He just doesn't like how rules-heavy the system is. I gave him all the books and told him to just start with ultra-light and work up from there, but I have no idea if he read it. I have even statted shit for him to attempt to save him time, but it doesn't seem to make any difference. In comparison I have ran GURPS campaigns, so this shit is easy to me.

>>43862843
>He just doesn't like how rules-heavy the system is
>I gave him Ultra-lite

Mate, Ultra-lite is literally the lightest you can get without being a no-rules or barstool game. It's six fucking pages. He hasn't read it.

Have you seen A Clockwork Orange? Tie him down, force his eyes open, and explain it.

>>43862906
You're telling me how retarded that is. You have no idea.

>>43859248
Thank you! And I'm way ahead of you. I only download as an extended preview. If I actually use the contents I buy the pdf. I've been playing GURPS for 25 years, I have a vested interest in seeing SJG continue to publish it.

>>43859727
Is it a lack of players or a lack of GURPS players?

>>43859762
Just started a new one to convert some die hard D&D players. Will be using their favorite old school modules converted over (or the ones they always wanted to play but never did).

Just finished running a year long Monster Hunters game.

>>43862965
I'm offended for you.

>>43863032
The other players keep having to ask me what to roll, when there are only 3d6 in front of them. Despite all of this, I at least enjoy the plot.

>>43861342
XSD: External Security Department
IPF: Internal Protection Force
NRD: No Real Department
SIO: Strategic Intelligence Office
SEO: Security Enforcement Office
SSB: Special Security Bureau

I could go on like this all day.

And then there is this: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fictional_espionage_organizations

>>43863082
Playing with people who make no effort to learn the rules is a frustrating thing. It's one thing to ask occasional questions about rules that don't come up often, but if they haven't even grasped 3d6 roll under, goddamn.

>>43863502
It has so much potential, but I don't want to snap and rant about how I'm playing with casuals or goodbye ever playing GURPS again with friends.

>>43863540
I know the feeling. The group I'm in (currently playing AD&D 2e) actively avoids all of the interesting things our GM comes up with for us in fear of losing their precious characters. It always ends with them wasting half of the session only to realize that they have to go to the place with the things for anything to get done.

>>43863580
They just need to bring a stack of sheets and just have fun with it.

How many people use the wildcard skills? I don't usually (In fact, I have never,) but I just thought that they seem like another good tool for easing people into GURPS. A big common complaint is "I didn't know I had to take everyman skills a, b, and c to do something that every human being on the planet should just be able to do..."


But maybe, in introductory GURPS games, people should start with two skills:
Everyman! and
Your Job!

Then they should be able to do all the things that would be normal for them to do... and they can slowly accumulate singular skills and/or continue to improve the wildcard skills as the adventure progresses.

>>43863614
That's how I feel. I always keep one fully-made backup character, and some pre-rolled sets of stats ready for making new ones. It doesn't even make sense to become attached to a particular character in this campaign, because it's a dynastic game, CK2 style. We switch to the next generation once every couple months.

>>43863658
I like the idea, you should try it out and see how it works.
>>43863689
That's pretty neat. You could keep rolling fighters and accumulate infinite keeps lel.

>>43863689
>it's a dynastic game
Actually, in that case, it makes a bit more sense. It's one thing to be a bit reckless for the sake of fun with Bob the Barbarian, but when you are Bob, son of Bill, of the Dauterive clan and your death spells the end of your entire lineage, it's a bit more intense. I know all that stuff is already the case in normal games, but dynastic games push the fact that your character has ancestors and probably some other sort of family to the forefront.

Still doesn't excuse pussyfooting around instead of playing the goddamn game, but it's a bit understandable.

>>43863903
Except our DM is pretty generous with regard to the number of children our characters can have.

>>43861430
Don't forget about 'How to be a GURPS GM', and also numerous excellent blogs (they are stickied on the official forums). Oh, and do google the forums for any questions, very often the authors of a particular book/article are the ones responding. Or ask it away here/on the forums.

>>43859248
Thanks, anon. The only pdf I bought and couldn't find any use for is the latest Perspective Pyramid. The main article seemed too weak and floaty for me.

I am considering buying the pdfs I won't ever use, like high-tech ones (more of a fantasy guy), just to help the numbers. Not seeing GURPS in top 40 profits of 2015 was humiliating.

>>43864345
>Don't forget about 'How to be a GURPS GM'
I've actually been working on that one. I'm about a third of the way into it.

>and also numerous excellent blogs (they are stickied on the official forums)
I'll have to check these out.

And yeah, the forums seem pretty good, which I was surprised by. Seems like for the most part there's an older audience (like you said, the authors of books and articles respond often).

>>43858922
Can someone please explain why you can dodge bullets?

http://www.themook.net/rpg/examples/ranged/index.php?id=three

I don't understand this.

>>43864925
Probably because you're a tripfag.

>>43864957
Right.

So you don't know either?

>>43864975
Your "dodge" is to represent you being where the gun ISN'T pointed when the the trigger is pulled. It's not dodging a bullet in-flight like Neo, it's ducking the projected trajectory of the bullet.

>>43865077
>ducking the projected trajectory of the bullet.

Then why is it rolled after the attack, and not before?

>>43865144
Not the anon you're responding to, but now you're just being petty.

>>43865144
>>43864925
It is explained in Basic and I think MA; here's a good interpretation from a quick google search:
>A moving, erratic target aware that you're trying to hit him and trying to avoid being hit is much harder to hit than one who is standing still (or moving and making no effort to avoid being hit, such as a pedestrian or a jogger). This is represented with a Dodge roll. This is not dodging bullets.

>>43865198
>Not the anon you're responding to, but now you're just being petty.

I was just wondering. The reason I ask is becasue I often see gurps billed as a badass tactical ruleset, but this kinda flies in the face of that.

Now, I could be missing a ruleset that "fixes" this and if I am, I will gladly shut my face and go read that, so if I am, please point it out to me.

>>43865248
>>A moving, erratic target aware that you're trying to hit him and trying to avoid being hit is much harder to hit than one who is standing still (or moving and making no effort to avoid being hit, such as a pedestrian or a jogger). This is represented with a Dodge roll. This is not dodging bullets.

I think this is greatly exaggerated in gurps with firearms at close ranges. Close being within 50 feet.

People are big targets. It's not hard to track them.

>>43865198
>tripfag
>petty
Surprise surprise

>>43865144
A) To keep it in line with every other defense in the game.
B) GURPS is heroic realism, so 'dodging' bullets like this is allowed to keep PCs alive. If you want to play up the realism aspect, there are optional rules like having defense rolls done before attacks (potentially spoiling things that require concentration like aiming or causing you to dodge and drop without reason) or simply doing away with dodging bullets and replacing it with a penalty to being hit.
C) The guy is still aiming at you. If you rolled dodge first and succeeded, the gun would still be in your general direction. An untrained shooter would would probably still try to make the shot. If you want you can roll defenses first and keep the results secret (I think keeping attack roll results secret is already a thing, one of the options rules from B).

>A) To keep it in line with every other defense in the game.

This is an acceptable answer, thank you.

>B) GURPS is heroic realism, so 'dodging' bullets like this is allowed to keep PCs alive. If you want to play up the realism aspect, there are optional rules like having defense rolls done before attacks (potentially spoiling things that require concentration like aiming or causing you to dodge and drop without reason) or simply doing away with dodging bullets and replacing it with a penalty to being hit.

Where are these rules? Also that makes more sense if it's a mechanism to keep people alive. i suppose my exposure to GURPS was "This is what you use if you're running a hardcore Operator game", and the "Dodging" bullets kinda flies in the face of that.

>C) The guy is still aiming at you. If you rolled dodge first and succeeded, the gun would still be in your general direction. An untrained shooter would would probably still try to make the shot. If you want you can roll defenses first and keep the results secret (I think keeping attack roll results secret is already a thing, one of the options rules from B).

Ah. Alright.

>>43865414
>Where are these rules?
Scattered around a bit. Tactical Shooting is the Operators Operating Operationally supplement, and it has one of them. I think the rule it introduced was you can only dodge against a single gunman; bobbing and weaving takes focus and you can't do it against a mob, get behind cover if you're outnumbered numbnuts. Also defensive options like dodge & drop or acrobatic dodges require you to do things on your turn to set them up, so there's a chance you will drop prone to get a bonus to dodge you won't even end up using. The "no dodging, only penalties to be hit" is from the Gunplay issue of Pyramid. No clue where keeping attack results secret is, maybe the first Alternate GURPS issue of Pyramid?

Still, considering the relative unreliability of dodges, even the basic system promotes cover against firearms a lot more than relying on dodge. You can operate operationally with the basic set, it's just the game will be slightly more forgiving (which is good for new players).

>>43865283
There are more explicit and realistic rules in the corresponding splats. Just like the bow is 'fixed' in Low-Tech and Martial Arts (less accuracy and damage) or some armor stats in LT. GURPS is, after all, universal and generic, and the default rules are a compromise between technical and more narrative approach; then GM and his group decide if they want to keep default rules, simplify them or add details. More work, but more flexible.

>>43865283
>>43865900
Oh, and I forgot: the accuracy is actually partially based on some cop shooting statistics (maybe someone would provide the links necessary); in short: in a stressful situation in close range for a trained petson to shoot someone accurately is not as easy as you, anon, might think.

>>43865926
> in short: in a stressful situation in close range for a trained petson to shoot someone accurately is not as easy as you, anon, might think.

But I've been in that situation before and it's actually pretty easy if you already have your firearm out and aimed.

>>43859564
What are you talking about? You can download separate files from torrent, you just need to mark down all unwanted files as "Do not download".

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>>43865941
You do understand what statistics mean, right? Unless you have been in a number of gunfights constituting a sufficient sample size for adequate and statistically significant inference, I have to dismiss your claims with a hefty kek.

Also, obviously you are biased against the system already, so you will argue semantics, definitions and principles just to save face.

Moreover, there are GURPS books that are specifically dealing with your issues. Are you arguing that the Basic Set doesn't correspond to the reality 146%? A strong position you have taken.

>>43865144

There's an option in a Pyramid magazine where someone has to decide to dodge before knowing the result of the attack roll. I use it whenever I GM a game with guns.

>>43859248

As a materialistic person who loves LOOT, I adore all the extra detail they go into. Especially the fabric weaves and the coin materials.

As the guy who's eventually going to release the GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Treasure Generator program, I hate all the extra work I now have to do.

That whole stupid argument in the RC thread makes me so glad we do not have enforced classes in this game. Let alone having races as classes.

>>43867150
You know, you could also just say things such as "you're getting shot at" or "the maceman swings at you", and let PCs decide if they're dodging or not.

>>43866279
But Anon, that's only for fat shittily trained cops, it doesn't concern operating operators trained in gorilla warfare with over 300 confirmed kills such as SSB.

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>>43869712
There is much work to be done brother, I saw in another thread that some people still consider class based games 'fun'.

hey general, my dwarfs are faster than humans because of they high HT, how can i make them slower without lowering HT/DX? i mean, they have like one meter and half, they have short legs.

>>43870199
Just directly lower their Basic Speed and/or Move?

>>43870213
this wouldn't look much "artificial"? i mean, it would be a system flaw making a SM-1 creature be faster than a +0 because of +1HT, maybe i'm missing something.

>>43870286
Dwarves are SM 0. And it's not really artificial, you've got a good explanation for why you have decreased Speed on their template - they have short legs.

>>43870286
Most SM-1 creatures are faster than people.

But you are meant to freely change secondary attributes to model things as well as primary ones.

>>43870286

What? Real world animals don't really scale their speed with their size, never mind fantasy races.

You need to adjust your attributes to match your size anyway. You don't get extra Strength for being large, you have to buy it.

>>43870320
Basic, Fantasy and the common sense makes them -1, they under 1.5yards/gurpsmeters

>>43870310
i think i will just add a disadvantage called short legs to not be just "-1 basic move" without description

>>43870365
shit, the phrases are in the wrong places.

this: "Basic, Fantasy and the common sense makes them -1, they under 1.5yards/gurpsmeters" is mean to >>43870310

>>43870365
>i think i will just add a disadvantage called short legs to not be just "-1 basic move" without description

Why, really? Did you make up an advantage for +1 HT? It just seems confusing adding in a bunch of new terms.

>>43870365
Why does it need description?

What do you find so unusual about changing their basic move? Banestorm does it and Fantasy should do it but doesn't for some reason.

>>43871852
but anon, its hard to do 10+20%

>>43871852
"I can not get over fourth grade"

Where are the rules for what happens when you get hit by a flare gun.

>>43871852
The most "complicated" math I've seen must have been in demographics calculation, and that was just "complicated" because of all the variables.

>>43872312
Where's that?

>>43872246
There's some in the equipment section of Monster Hunters 1.

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>>43871852
>>43872074
>>43872091
>>43872312

I love how people assume these aren't posted by GURPSters

>>43872328
Pyramid #3 Post-Apocalypse.
Again, it's not like the math was really complicated, it's just that shit like this is hard to follow for human beings:
p(a1,a2) = (1/(1 + r - m + c)a1 - 1/(1 + r - m)a2)/(1 - 1/(1 +
r - m + c)LE), unless r - m + c = 0; then
p(a1,a2) = (a2 - a1)/LE, if r - m + c = 0

So what rules do I need for crit table splatter fun and where can I find a list of energy weapons so I can do Fallout?

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>>43873258
Define 'crit table splatter'. The standard crit table is in the Basic Set, check the contents.

Ultra Tech has the big list of energy weapons, just keep in mind they will kill a normal human dead with ease through Fallout level armour that is not a full power suit.

And stuff like leather and metal armour will do much less using GURPS rules against normal firearms than they do in Fallout unless you tweak some numbers.

Christ, PA is even better than I thought.

If we assume T-51b is equivalent to the heavy battlesuit then the torso is impervious to .50 cal ball, laser rifles and 20mm Vulcan/25mm Bushmaster HE. And is highly resistant to .50 cal AP and plasma rifles.

No wonder the Americans fucked the Chinese up.

>>43873547
tweak to crits so when crits do more severe damage and maiming.

Because I want the badwrong fun of causing a head to explode via thrown with a well rolled attack

>>43873755
t51b is a TL9 power armor

>>43873547
>>43873755
This pisses me off to no end in actual Fallout. Raiders with unarmored heads needing several shots to die because of their level or HP value, or my own character becoming about invincible to them.

>>43873978
Well its obviously better than the TL9 battlesuit in Ultra Tech and its not as big as the TL9 combat walkers, more like the TL10 heavy suit in size. I would give it 100/75 at least. And hardened against energy weapons due to its coating, adding a split DR would be more fiddly.

>>43874556
google GURPS fallout

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>>43874094
Well I find that an advantage of GURPS, makes it play more like STALKER or Metro in terms of lethality and avoids the stupidity of emptying machine gun magazines into a super mutants unarmoured skull.

Just important to make sure people realise that its lethal so they don't think leather armour will do anything but make baseball bats hurt a little less.

I would still give the deathclaws High Pain Threshold, a high HT and a moderately unrealistic DR though. Just to keep them scary.

>>43874587
I know about it, the armour in that still needs work to make sense. Combat armour should not have only DR 12/5 just to give one example.

Some of the gun stats are a bit weird as well.

>>43874616
I'd give deathclaws a lot of that.
Super mutant some. And maybe some injury tolerance for feral ghouls.

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>>43875035
I would just base Super Mutants on the Ogre stats. ST 20, DR 3 tough skin and HPT should make them tough enough. But they are also stupid and clumsy so as long as you don't try to fight them hand to hand humans have advantages.

Deathclaws are even bigger than the super mutants so they could easily have ST 25. They are living weapons so combat reflexes and enough DR to ignore knives/buckshot at a minimum.

>>43874715
>only 12/5
do you that the "combat armor" its just an "militar" tactical suit? maybe the chest should be more than 12/5, but only the chest.

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>>43875240
>maybe

It should have flexible 12/5 plus an additional rigid DR 25+ on the chest, its meant to be stopping rifle fire. Plus at least an extra DR 10 on the groin, knees and shins for the plates there.

This is late TL8 armour at least.

>>43874715
Then there's the problem of people wearing clothes and no armor and yet having DR/DT, or only a shitty old patched-up vest. That's sort of a regular thing in Fallout, and with GURPS, they'd just get rekt. Unless you tone all damage down (which you'd pretty much have to do anyway, especially with plasma and laser.)

>>43875447
>which you'd pretty much have to do anyway

I for one see no issues with combining modern firearms, laser armed robots, poor medical care and crappy armour.

>>43875776
There will be if you want to emulate Fallout and not have GURPS' lethality.

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>>43875879
That was sarcasm friend.

Personally the lack of lethality is one of the aspects of FO3/NV I heavily disliked so its a bonus for me. Raiders wearing brahmin skin and old tires should die when you shoot them in the chest with a .308 or hit them in the skull a few times with a 9mm, sneak attack or not.

I played a few skirmishes in GURPS with my nephews visiting for thanksgiving. The one in fourth grade knew how to multiply 1.5 for cutting damage. They had fun and if they visit for Christmas, might be interested in a full blown dungeon fantasy campaign.

The nephew in 9th grade called Horo from spicy wolf his waifu when I commented on him using a Horo wallpaper on his phone, and he got offended when I sang the ending song wrong on purpose.


I think I like them a little more. Kinda impressed they can do GURPS level calculus in elementary school.

>>43878895
>The one in fourth grade knew how to multiply 1.5 for cutting damage.
last random guy who asked to play in my group quited saying that the "combat math" is hard, he is 26 and only plays d&d.
Fuck god, give me some nephews, after 9 years my group needs someone new

>>43878895
>Kinda impressed they can do GURPS level calculus in elementary school.

They're probably all autistic-savants. No normal human is capable of multiplying things by 3/2.

>>43879406
>No normal human is capable of multiplying things by 3/2.
I really hope this is a joke.

>"anon, i will make a merchant"
>spent 3 weeks preparing 5 cities to receive the merchant with enough profundity
>first day came
>he is just a rich murderhobo and plays like so
I wanna die /tg/

>>43879625
iktf anon

Have you tried talking to him about it?

>>43879625

>Being a fag

He is a merchant, Anon.

AND HE TRADES IN DEATH

>>43858922

Do people only play GURPS because they have never played any other RPG and are afraid to leave their comfort zone?

There aren't any upsides so.. That's all that's left.

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>>43879843
ebin troll

>>43879649
session ended a few minutes ago. I'm carrying too much disappointment and its too late(its 02:01 here) to say anything.

>>43879789
at leat he do have the merchant skill, at 9.

i want new players

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>>43879843
hilariou

>>43879917
>>43879936
While obviously trolling, it's hard to disagree with the premise.

Is there even an upside to GURPS?

That picture says to just "refluff Pathfinder" and as sad as that is, it's one of the only systems where that's a clear improvement.

>>43880168
Melee combat is far more engaging than any RPG I've played. From video games to DnD 3.PF through to 5E. It allows you to use all kinds of set-ups to turn combat into your favor by the rules in a simple way without having the GM handwaving stuff just because "I want to hit him in the face" isn't a thing you can do in the system.

It is able to do what you want it to do with simple mechanics for it, but it requires you to put down the time to actually read through these options and decide which to use.

It allows games to go from "I roll to hit. I do X damage. Nothing happens unless it's a magic spell." to "I parried last turn so I want to counter-attack. I take a penalty to my skill from the counter-attack move, use deceptive attack and the negative modifiers from my feint last turn should make his defense nigh impossible. I'll also aim for his hand to cripple it and in effect disarm him.

>>43880168
>While I'm obviously trolling, it's hard to disagree with me.
FTFY

I will give you props, though, "GURPSfags are terrified of leaving the only system they know" is at least a fresh approach to trolling. Still incredibly lazy, but fresh.

>>43880437

See, I want to like GURPS for this reason, but the level of granularity it makes, neverminding the skill floor it demands of any character to even bother considering doing those things at all, means you have to be quite versed in the system before you even think about getting fancy.

Which is kind of lame. I kind of want to use GURPS for a Dominions 4 campaign but every time I realize I would have to familiarize myself with a solid 3 books worth of material, I just don't want to bother.

Neverminding how you need other autists to take advantage of any of this granularity at all.

And also I just plain hate the advantage/disadvantage system. Getting extra points because of stupid shit like phobias that the GM has to shoehorn into the campaign or just let the player enjoy free points is just so lame. Front loaded cost disadvantage systems have always been a terrible idea because they front load the reward and their rammifications always fall on the GM's shoulders to make relevant.

>>43880668
Jokes on you, that was my first post in the thread, I just know a good thing when I see it.

>>43880743
Why not make constant advantages? Where you get the boost, but the penalty always applies, even if it's a role-playing one?

That's how the Complete Book of Elves did it.

Just call up Steve Jackson and ask him to get on it as soon as he's done with the next masterpiece Munchkin game.

>>43880168
>>43769107
The one time it's not posted at the start of the thread we have to deal with this shit

>>43880743
I like the disadvantages for what they can help with something many people struggle with: character. It gives you, on paper, a helpful guide to what kind of character you're playing. Although the core is extremely anal about how you HAVE to pay of disadvantages with points, sufficient in-game work should be enough.

I've barely played three games of GURPS, although I have prepped to be a GM and run some 1 on 1 games for people to get them into the system. It doesn't take any more effort than learning all the DnD spells and reading through them to find all these options and how to use them in GURPS. The most helpful tool is the forums or GURPS general, since we know the vastness of the system and if we know the answer will help out.

The skill floor is actually set by the GM in GURPS rather than the system. If you limit players to a few rules and teach them step-by-step with increasing options it will be great. I wonder why there isn't a guide like this yet, even if How To Be A GURPS GM is great and does have some hints for the options I feel like they game could use a step-by-step option advancement crib sheet.

I'd be happy to help anyone get into GURPS personally, I even considered doing some "boot camp" stuff on roll20 just to get people into how the game runs and learn more myself.

There's also the... I want to say Ham rule from Action. Basically, to keep the GM from shoehorning in situations where the disadvantage is relevant, once per session the disadvantage can be "activated" and it gives a sizable penalty for the rest of the scene. After that, the disadvantage is done until the next session; it had no further effect until then. The example is a character with Letcherous having a penalty in a combat scene because he's trying to show off for all the lovely ladies.

It's one of the rules Kromm says he would have put in the Basic Set had it existed when 4e was getting started. In fact, the Action series was the birthplace of like five of the "I wish I could have made these core" rules.

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>>43883443

Went to go find that rule since it sounds cool, grabbed a screenshot for reference. It's a nice little rule now I've read it.

>>43881061
>I like the disadvantages for what they can help with something many people struggle with: character. It gives you, on paper, a helpful guide to what kind of character you're playing.

Oh gimme a break. Sure if you're fresh off the 3.5e wagon and have never been exposed to more competent design, but there's plenty of ways to get character out of the concept of disadvantages without the accompanying crap (prompting minmaxing, foisting more work on the GM in a system that already demands the GM attain Level 9 Transcendent Autism).

Pay as you go for disadvantages, like what Mutants and Masterminds does, is and always has been a far superior way of mechanizing this stuff. With this way of doing it, the GM does *not* have to keep track of this crap and shoehorn in disadvantage appearances, since with pay upfront style he's giving the player FREE... POINTS if he never brings it up. Since it *doesn't* give points unless it *does* hinder the player, disadvantages become a focal point of roleplaying instead of a cookie jar you dig your hands into only to begrudgingly get grounded by the GM later down the road. With pay as you go, a part of you *wants* to get grounded since that's the only way you get any cookies.

Like, I read this How To Be A GURPS GM thing, and I was floored some of the dumb shit this disadvantage system prompts. At one point the PCs are just walking along all casual like, see some dudes on horses who would otherwise just leave them alone, and as the two bands of travellers just kind of awkwardly pass eachother on the road, of course the PC with Bad Temper has to make a self control roll to *not* say something stupid and inappropriate that would start a fight.

It's so fucking dumb, and a huge, huge, huge turnoff of the system.

>>43884363
But anon.. You did take the Bad Temper disadvantage, right? And there do exist people like these. And it *can* lead to a new scene, so the fun ensues. And it does cost quite some points. I honestly fail to see a problem here; however, your prejudice is obvious enough.

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>>43885003

What if there was a way
To get the fun roleplay out of disadvantages
But without the bullshit foisted on the GM
And without encouraging minmaxing

If only such a system existed but obviously it does not and GURPS could not possibly be better so let's never analyze this again because that would be thought-crime

>>43885170
>But without the bullshit foisted on the GM
Literally three posts above you you sperging autist.
>And without encouraging minmaxing
Still not sure what your argument is here. Good things cost points. Bad things give points back. If you want points to instead slowly trickle in over the adventure, there's the fact that you don't get your fucking XP at the end of a session if you don't roleplay disadvantages. If that doesn't satisfy you, there's also the Heroic Flaws system from Pointless Slaying & Looting; translated into the normal GURPS system, they're vague negative aspects worth a meager -10 on their own but grant bennies when the GM evokes them to screw you over. So there, if you're so butthurt about disadvantages, there are official avenues around them. Have fun playing GURPS: FATE you whiny roodypoo.

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>>43885366
>bennies

>>43885366
>Wow look at these rules in all these different books you didn't read that correct(?) the problem you had with rules in the core rulebook

I didn't intend to touch on this, but your smug asshattery now makes me feel like it.

This shit is exactly why nobody can even talk about GURPS as a system except other GURPSfags. Because apparently, there is literally always some obscure rule in the assend of one of the hundred thousand sourcebooks out for the system, and I guess I should just take your word for it that it fixes something I don't like about the system, such as something in THE CORE BASIC RULEBOOK THAT EVERY GURPSFAG ALWAYS TELLS YOU TO START OFF WITH FIRST, but I guess it's MY bad for not pouring over all hundred trillion books to find the one rule that fixes the one thing (and it may not even do that; guess I better go read it to find out if it does or doesn't!) before discussing the rules in the basic fucking rulebook. It's like some kind of Schrodinger's Houserule shit here, where until you read each and every solitary GURPSsplat there is, there may or may not exist a rule that can actually solve an issue you have with the basic system you're supposed to start with. And who the literal fuck has time for all this shit?

Seriously, this system is less a game system and more a religion. Trying to discuss merits and faults here is like trying to grab at oil. There's no standard for discussion because there's always another rule, and you're not gunna get the game you want until you read all of them. It's just galling.

No wonder this thing withers away as a meme system recommended as a joke every thread with a scant 30~ people actually talking about it.

Also

>Still not sure what your argument is here.

That's because you're dumb. The issue is HOW the points are distributed and the type of gameplay they provoke.

That said, the screencap mentioned does indeed seem to provide a solution to one of the things I dislike about this system. Thanks, faggot.

>>43885591
Are you seriously bitching that a game that was initially published over a decade ago includes rules and fixes in books beyond core? God forbid the devs see an issue with the game and write a fix for it. And then have the head dev go out of his way to advertise it and say "I really think this should be considered core rules, it's really nice."

>The issue is HOW the points are distributed
Yeah I get that you don't like the front-loaded nature of the extra points, but I don't get why. Assuming the GM is actually being competent and *not* letting disadvantages be free points, the effect on the game is the same. Whether the points are earned all at character creation or slowly over time or the PC gets some non-XP benefit from them or whatever doesn't matter; in all cases, disadvantages are painful and at the end of the day you're trading that pain in your ass for some sort of benefit.

Also, you're welcome, cuntface.

>>43885170
>what if
Guess what, someone posted a screenshot just fricking above. How hard is it to be unbiased at least reading the damn posts.

>could not possibly be better
That is a strawman argument; you are attacking a claim which nobody made just to win the argument, pretty pathetic.

>>43885591
>why nobody can even talk about GURPS as a system except
Firstly, a lot of people unfamiliar with the system a discussing it all the time both on the forums and on tg, in a civil manner. Your claim is even funnier when one realizes that sjgames forums is one of the comfiest places when it comes to RPG systems, and many competent people there will even advise you against GURPS if they feel it doesn't meet one's requirements.

Secondly, I am constantly GMing oneshots and short campaigns for newbies at my local store, and their reaction overwhelmingly clashes with your edgy memes.

>THAT EVERY GURPSFAG ALWAYS TELLS YOU TO START OFF WITH FIRST
What, a factual lie, and from noone other than you, anon?!
Everyone advises Lite and "How to Be..". Talking out of your ass is definitely your forte.

> there may or may not exist a rule that can actually solve an issue you have with the basic system
Firstly, you can ask on the forums and all the references will be provided. Again, a welcoming place.
Secondly, if I have problems with other systems, they are often either unadressed in any splats at all, or a "fixed" with some ad hoc nonsense; GURPS at least provides a consistent framework.
Thirdly, if you have so many problems you need to fix with GURPS, just drop it. Why are you so butthurt about it? Obviously not your cup of tea, and that's fine.

>No wonder this thing withers away as a meme system recommended as a joke
To be completely honest with you, you are partially the reason of this happening, and you definitely seem to be that kind of guy who hates the system and would memespam it everywhere.

>>43886096
>the forum

But didn't you read that ridiculous article posted a few threads back, the forum makes us all look like autistic double major engineering/history students apparently.

>>43873258
google "gurps Fallout" and some fanmade 4e sourcebooks should pop up. I think they were decent, but it's been a while since I've looked at 'em

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I'm reading a Russian military manual on hand-to-hand combat, and I need help GURPSifying some attacks from it.

RB-N (basic system, told to everyone): it teaches strikes with bayonet and rifle butt, as well as parries with rifle. Spear and Staff skills sound obvious. But there are also some knee strike and kicks in the knee, used only if someone has grabbed you gun, to yank the gun back. Should I add some Brawling, or those strikes should be done from defaults? Also, in addition to butt and bayonet strikes, there is a magazine strike - I should probably treat it as pommel strike.

RB-1 (common system, also taught to pretty much everyone)
First, it has swings, stabs and parries with entrenching tool - Axe/Mace is obvious. Second, it adds unarmed strikes - both kicks and punches, as well as unarmed parries and leg parries. It also teaches to put body weight into the strike. I think it warrants Karate skill. No grapples are taught. Defense against armed opponent stumps me - you are supposed to dodge/parry the enemy attack, grab both the hand and weapon and then wrestle it away. I have no idea how this should work in GURPS.

RB-2 (special system, taught to volunteers serving in infantry)
Adds knife strikes, similar unarmed "parry then grab" defenses against knifes, and also teaches how to escape from grapples.

RB-3 (special system, taught to reconnaissance troops)
It adds grappling techniques, arm and head locks, throws. Judo is obvious choice. Another technique - disarming the enemy while he draws a pistol, disarming the enemy who threatens you with a pistol from a point-blank range (it also teaches you to keep a certain distance from an enemy if you threaten him with a gun). Disarm also doesn't involves Disarm in GURPS sense (knocking the weapon away), but an attempt to take it for yourself. Still no idea how to do that. Also a Thrown Weapon (both Knife and Axe/Mace) and Knot-Tying, but this is pretty straightforward.

>>43886096
>any competent people there will even advise you against GURPS if they feel it doesn't meet one's requirements.

Not that guy, but I'd seriously like to see that. Because I've only ever seen a GURPS fan recommend against GURPS in the "oh why don't you go back to playing D&D, you pleb!" fashion.

>>43879526
>>43879526
>>No normal human is capable of multiplying things by 3/2.
>>43879526
>I really hope this is a joke.
Nah, that's like some post-grad shit or something

I ain't never did no math so when I wanna do some gurps I just find a nerd and I'm like "hey nerd, roll me a wizard i'mma roll me a blunt ok"

p fun time, really

>>43886697
If you want fantasy games with tons of material and little complexity in terms of combat, then yeah, use D&D. GURPS can model that decently enough, and jRPG style games too real well, but if you don't want a lot of crunch then use it.

>>43879625
>"i'm gonna make a merchant"
>"i never said that i wanted to play a merchant game"
>yes, you did, you said you was going to make a merchant
>and i made it, but i don't want play like a merchant
>you are just a rich criamortos(something like"murderhobo"), you doesn't even have the skills.

what to do? i wasted weeks of work, even my husband is mad at me.

>>43886678
waiting for the experienced, i want to see it too.
also i think some of these(RB-3 and RB-2) would be techniques and RB-1/RB-N its just brawling/staff/spear or you could make an new skill generic that covers everything but i think somewhere in the modern and ultra it is already covered.

>>43886697
Some prominent GURPSfags
>here's a fallacy in believing that everyone who complains about GURPS would stop complaining and play if you addressed those complaints. The truth is, most of these people have tastes that are just too different to really fit into GURPS. The D&Der who loves D&D qua D&D will never be a GURPS fan, because GURPS can't be, shouldn't be, D&D. They have different niches. Likewise, GURPS will never be Nobilis and we shouldn't expect to be. They do different things, they scratch different itches. I'm not saying you can't dungeon crawl in GURPS, or play a God in GURPS, but the experience will be fundamentally different.

>GURPS cannot serve everyone. It will never appeal to certain segments, not because they're "too stupid to understand" or "not good enough," but because GURPS isn't what they want. To try to sell GURPS to the Wushu/Lady Blackbird crowd is largely a mistake. You could try to sell them another game, but it would be another game. I'm not saying nobody who likes the one can possibly like the other (Zorg likes both), but even they can see that the two are different games.

Kromm, chief editor
>That may well not be their preferred kind of fun, of course . . . but if it isn't, then it's important to accept that getting people to like GURPS isn't very compatible with their preferred kind of fun

But if one really dislikes GURPS, those examples are readily dismissable, of course. Because memes. Do you need more examples?

>>43861342
Office (of) Research (of) Extraterrestrial Objects
OREO

Give the budget bonus for product placement.

>>43887765
I was mostly using Martial Arts as reference. I think that RB-N/RB-1 should be a single style, with the stuff from RB-2 being an optional parts of it, while RB-3 is big enough to be considered a separate style that is taught in addition to the first style.

>>43873755

http://gurps.fallout.free.fr/

Site's in French, but the pdfs are all English - you want the Compilation.

It's a pretty good conversion - though I think it only covers up to Tactics.

>>43880743
>Which is kind of lame. I kind of want to use GURPS for a Dominions 4 campaign but every time I realize I would have to familiarize myself with a solid 3 books worth of material, I just don't want to bother.

Honestly, how do you expect to do a Dominions 4 game in any system without a lot of work?

In GURPS at least, you have Thaumatology and Mass Combat to help.

>>43887938
not that anon but i run a dominions style with little to no effort(besides making maps and shit, oh fuck, i have spent weeks)

>>43880743
try gurps cities and states, thau, sorcery, masscombat and lowtech(don't forget the companions)

>>43887979
>cities and states
Do you mean City Stats?

>>43886678
>RB-N
Spear and Staff, like you said. For the kicks, I would actually give the style the One-Task Wonder perk; you roll your DX to do a thing, but only a very specific thing and only in certain circumstances. I would say a kicks to the knees when someone's grappled your weapon is a very specific scenario. Retain Weapons would also be worthwhile.
>RB-1
Axe/Mace and Karate; again, you got the basic skills. While Brawling would be easier, it sounds like practitioners are expected to parry armed attackers, which is bad news if you're not using Karate. While the style might not teach grappling skills proper, what you're describing sounds like a Grabbing Parry, probably based on Wrestling. Sumo might also be worth a shot; its benefits make it suitable for shoving instead of full-one grappling. Lastly, you could again Perk it up and use Skill Adaptation to steal Grabbing Parry away from grappling skills and give it to Karate (you have RAW precedent; the Boxing style teaches the clinch, which is Skill Adaptation – Standing Grapple to Boxing).
>RB-2
Knife, Escape, and Karate along with continued use of SA (Grabbing Parry). This might actually be the same style as RB-1, it's just that the protocol is to teach students Axe/Mace and Karate first and not add on Knife/Escape until later. That means RB-1 students wouldn't have Style Mastery.
>RB-3
Now we're getting to proper grappling skills. I also recommend Judo, at the very least because it's meant to go up against armed opponents. Stealing away an opponent's weapon is under "Grabbing" (not "Grappling"!) on p. B370: roll grappling skill at -4 to grab ahold of the weapon, then on subsequent turns you (and your opponent, I'm assuming) can initiate another roll of Regular Contest of ST, with the eventual winner keeping the weapon (though I think you would need a Ready to turn it around and actually use it).

So the Fallout discussion had me wondering.
If you ran a GURPS Fallout game, would you add clothes/armor with stats? Like the lab coat usually giving INT or science/medecine in game.

>>43888065
Not unless it's from Barbie's closet.

>>43888065

A Tool bonus to relevant skills wouldn't be unreasonable, but not a large one.

>>43865414
What?

How does dodging attacks fly in the face of hardcore operator operation... stuff? Someone attacks you, you dive for cover - roll dice to see what happens.

Isn't that literally what you're supposed to do when getting shot at? Hit the ground and try to find cover? I'm pretty sure that's what they told me in basic. It's been a while though.

I think your mistake is assuming "dodge" is somehow... magically backflipping under a hail of bullets ala Max Payne. It's just getting out of the path of the gun. It makes perfect sense.

You're dodging the attack. Most people are terrible shots in real life situations. Ducking and covering is a good defense against bullets. This isn't that advanced.

>>43888007
i was talking about the unofficial guide but i can't find it, its something like "cities and states" but i can't remember

>>43887979
I was going to spend weeks on the maps until I realized googling "Dominions Maps" and looking under pictures actually gave me all the maps from the game and several more, and then flipping them into photoshop and applying a few filters made them seem very neat.

Out of interest - has anyone ever adapted GURPS for use with a dice pool system (like Shadowrun's) rather than D100? Maybe some other alternative roll system?

>>43888169
>D100
GURPS is 3d6.

>>43888193
wait what

My bad, must've really mixed things up here. Sorry.

>>43885591
Well, maybe you should have read all the books before commenting here.

No one should post here until they have memorized all the splat books.

>>43887788
Why would you post this? GURPS is Universal, it's best at everything.

Why did those people tell such lies? It Wushu's better than their Wushu game.

>>43888045
I think Escape doesn't really fits here - it is used if you are tied up or restrained by weapon. I think this particular situation calls for another Skill Adaptation that would allow to use Karate skill to break free from standing grapples.

As I said, I am combining RB-N and RB-1 into a single style (they are almost never taught separately) and RB-2 will be an optional part of style. So far, it looks like this:

Military Hand-to-Hand Combat (RB-1/RB-2), 5 points:
Skills: Spear, Staff, Axe/Mace, Karate
Techniques: Targeted Attack (Karate/Legs), Targeted Attack (Karate/Groin), Retain Weapon (Rifle), Disarming (Karate), Grabbing Parry (Karate)
Perks: Skill Adaptation (Grabbing Parry defaults to Karate), Skill Adaptation (Karate skill used to break free from standing grapples), Form Mastery (Rifle)
Optional Skills:

Military Hand-to-Hand Combat, Special (RB-3), 8 points:
Skills: Spear, Staff, Axe/Mace, Judo, Karate, Thrown Weapon (Knife), Knot-Tying
Techniques: Grabbing Parry (Judo), Sweep (Judo), Disarming (Judo), Arm Lock (Judo), Head Lock (Judo), Targeted Attack (Karate/Legs), Targeted Attack (Karate/Groin), Retain Weapon (Rifle)
Cinematic Techniques: Binding
Perks: Armor Familiarity (Judo), Improvised Weapons (Axe/Mace), Improvised Weapons (Karate), Form Mastery (Rifle)
Optional Skills: Knife, Thrown Weapon (Axe/Mace), Search

Not really sure about perks, but it would be shame to not have any, especially since you don't need Skill Adaptation if you have Judo.

>>43888515
>Optional Skills:
Whoops, first one should include Optional Skills: Knife

>>43888169
I've been thinking about it recently, but it's pretty difficult to make the numbers fall of at anything like the same rate as 3d6. Of course, if you don't give a shit about that, it gets easier.

Skill-5 d6s, each 6 is a success, 2 successes is a crit looks playable.

>>43888169
If you want to remove the bell curve, you can roll 2d4 (or, if you hate d4 like me, d2 and d8,)

One die is 0,4,8,12, the other is 1-4, add them together and you have a 1d16. Add 2 , and you have an equal chance of rolling any number from 3 to 18. If you seriously consider doing that, I'd recommend making only 3 a critical success and 18 a critical failure (unless you absolutely love critical failures and success.) a d2 and d8 are similar.

A d8,d6,and d4, will give you a slightly wider standard deviation than standard 3d6...

And if you want the tightest possible standard deviation with standard throwing tokens, you can throw 15 pennies, count the number of heads, and add 3.... which gives you a standard deviation of 1.94 versus 3d6's 2.96, meaning you will roll towards the average of 10.5 even easier... though throwing 15 pennies would probably be really tedious.

I've been trying to think of a system of card drawing that might or might not add anything... potentially if you had 216 cards with all of the combinations of 3d6, you might be able to strategize a tiny bit by card counting (Ok, I know all 4 critical failures are in the discard pile right now...) Or maybe multiple decks of cards with the numbers 1-6... that'd probably need too much shuffling, so each deck might need several iterations of those numbers (but the same amount of iterations for consistency... or maybe differing amounts if you want to throw off card counting... but then what is the point?)
But if you use only numbers 1-6, you could easily buy three packs of standard playing cards and have 1-6 4 times for each of the 3 dice.

An even more complicated system using card drawing might allow even more complicated strategization with a modified version of luck, that maybe let's you draw, for example, 9 cards at a time, and then you *have* to choose how to use those 9 cards in sets of 3 over your next 3 rolls... but then people might crit fail dumb things on purpose.

Defining an Ally as a "summoned monster" ability, summoning a specific beastie to come kill stuff for you, is pretty straight forward and simple enough.

Is there a way to make that "summon monster" ability so you can select one of, say, three different options when you use it? The point value of the summons would be the same, just a different configuration of point.

>>43889403
you can give alternate form to the monster, just buy it 3 times or ask your dm if you can mae 3 templates and then pay 20% extra for each one

>>43889403
>>43889424
An alternative that occurs to me is buying an Ally Group advantage for 3 allies, with the limitation that only one is present at a time... not sure if that would be easier or harder, cheaper or more expensive, than to stat a monster with three alternate forms.


Slightly depends on if you get to choose the one you want to summon, or if it is randomly selected.

>>43889403
That seems like a textbook case of Alternative Abilities.

>>43889525
Oh yeah, this definitely makes more sense than ally group, and it is pretty cheap.

>>43887788
They state it well, but aren't both of those guys staff at Steve Jackson Games? Maintaining professional form is hardly indicative of a fanbase. Regardless, that's good enough for me.

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time to reply to old posts because i have nothing better to do
>>43885170
disadvantages are supposed to be something that will severely affect your character whether you like it or not, you're not supposed to stack them up to -300 just because you theoretically can
when you take bad temper, it's expected that it'll put a severe dent in how you interact with people
otherwise, don't fucking take it and instead roleplay your character being a scratchy bastard

seriously, i took impulsiveness for a friend's campaign and it's a fucking blast playing it out
>sneaking past a guard with a party member
>i succeeded my stealth check, he didn't
>guard accosts him, asks him what he's up to
>quickly decide whether to help him out or - wait, no
>roll against impulsiveness 12 for myself
>failed
>i'm right behind the guard, my sword is right there, he has no armour around his neck
>all-out attack(determined) the guard's neck at like 14 skill
>situation evolves from there
GM didn't need to roll a single thing

>>43885591
>there is literally always some obscure rule
well yes, the system practically runs on optional rules - the GM is supposed to decide what optional rules they're running with before the campaign, so that they can tailor the system exactly to their specifications
trying to run every rule as-is is an exercise in madness

>>43870199
>>43870286

>>43870324
to add to this, by doing the minimum required research on wikipedia: an american jackrabbit can run up to 64 kph (roughly 18.5 yards/second), which means that they'll have about 16 basic move at the minimum (sprinting brings it up to +20%), or several ranks in enhanced move(ground)

in contrast, their SM would probably be below -4 or -5 (under 18" to 10")

just because a creature is small doesn't mean it can't be fast, and this is why SM doesn't affect BM.
>Rabbit habitats, or "rabbitats", include...
kek

>>43887788
People are just mad that GURPS doesn't do everything for them as far as creating an adventure goes and they are left to use their imaginations.

>>43889986
>supposed to be
Why did they fail at making them that way?

>>43890007
>GURPS doesn't do everything for them
But, that leaves nothing unique or good about GURPS.. you can do that with any other system
>"You might as well refluff Pathfinder"

>>43890007
and research

GURPS is good for people like us, who like to research the subject of our campaigns, instead of just hoping that the writer of the system included the ability/item/etc we need

>>43890048
>Why did they fail at making them that way?

They didn't fail, what is your point.

Unless you think blaming the system for a GM failure is anything other than idiotic.

>>43890620
>you're not supposed to stack them up to -300 just because you theoretically can
>supposed to
You can.

Why say GM failure when it is objectively the systems fault?

>>43891273
Because system outright tells you TO SET A FUCKING LIMIT ON DISADVANTAGES. If you didn't, then it's your own damn fault.

>>43891400
It doesn't tell you that in the core book.

Are you saying it's the GM's fault for not reading every article online and every splat book?

Absolutely ridiculous, not even FATAL would make that assumption.

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>>43891273
because GURPS basic also recommends setting disadvantage limits, primarily on points

maybe if you'd actually read the books you wouldn't be looking so retarded

>>43891417
holy shit how stupid are you
p11 and p120, basic characters
pic related

>>43891417
I haven't seen such an insistent troll in a GURPS general ever, but it's kind of funny.

>>43891417

But you're wrong. Right at the beginning of general chargen (as in, Chapter 1, page 11), it ezxplains the disadvantage limit. It also brings it up again at the beginning of the disadvantage chapter.

>>43891273
Because GURPS is a broad system that's meant to allow for a lot of things. If stacking -300 in disadvantages isn't part of the game, a halfway competent GM will shut it down. No different that shutting down people that show up to a low fantasy game with Burning Attack 10d (Explosive, RoF 300). If it is, then it's fine. Most games don't allow that – disadvantage cap normally sits around -75 in most campaigns – but there is a possibility that some game would want to (e.g. larger than life campaign where the PCs are not!Greek gods with both exaggerated capabilities and flaws), so there's an option to let it get that high.

>>43891417
Page 11 of the core book you colossal dumbass. Second fucking page in the "Creating a Character" chapter.

>>43891417
PAGE

FUCKING

E
L
E
V
E
N

>>43891417
Page 11 of the basic book discusses disadvantage cap.

>>43891445
That doesn't tell you what you think it says, you should read it again.

There's no rules, just saying what a GM might "wish" to do and talking about a "rule-of-thumb."

If I'm going to have to house-rule every single little thing because there's no rules, why not play freeform?

>>43891529
D&D also has no rules for what level you have to start out at so anyone can start out at max level any time they want, right?

>>43891529
Dammit, you are grasping at straws at that moment.

>>43891529
>Following official guidelines is houseruling
Are you the same nignog that shit himself in rage over optional rules being a big thing in GURPS, saying they were the exact same as homebrewing and they tortured the system as much as running gritty cyberpunk in Pathfinder?

Because if you are, man, I have to applaud you on your dedication to really half-assed trolling.

Also,
>all dese responses
Ten GURPSbucks says that his next response is something like "lol u so mad i called you out?"

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>>43891529
the gm not setting a disadvantage cap as the rulebook itself recommends is entirely a fault with the gm and not the system
of course, you're now trying to shift the goalposts because you know this

i think you should give up while you've still got a sliver of credibility left now, anon

>>43891529
>house-rules

Oh its you again. Like we pointed out last time, its not a 'house-rile' if that is how the system is supposed to work

>>43889577
No, the first two are from Mailanka(sp?), an old poster who I remember only because of an excellent bestiary writeup (or rather monster modifiers). I could easily find more of similar mind - and it shouldn't be a surprise, those exist in any gaming community. GURPS is just overmemed so much that such a basic thing (like the quoted sentences) is regarded as astounding.

>>43891529
You make some really weak claims for a troll, but the dedication is admirable. Oh, and the fact that
>there's no rules
is refreshing to hear! Everyone is whining about GURPS being rule-heavy, and at last you have put those complaints to an end.

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I'm new to GURPS and I need some help understanding how would a standoff situation at gunpoint develop mechanically.

The situation:
>Guy has the PCs at gunpoint while talking to them
>If any of the PCs try to reach for his weapon or gun, he'll shoot him close to his feet to intimidate him (but missing on purpose)
>The guy doesn't has any intention of killing the PCs, he just put himself in that situation because it was the only way to get their attention

My questions:
>Should all the characters involved put in turn order, with the guy with the gun on top? (even if he doesn't have the highest basic speed?)
>If the guy shoots the PC to intimidate him, does he lose his turn and the rest of the party get a chance to ready their weapons or even shoot him?
>If a PC uses quick draw to get his gun and shoot before the guy with the gun gets to react, how is it solved?

Thanks beforehand.

>>43891956
*If a PC uses fast-draw to get his gun...

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>>43891956
Hope this helps. It's from Tactical Shooting.

>>43891956
How "realistic" is your campaign? How much do your PCs transparent are you about NPCs actions?

Maybe you could give the NPC a couple of Alterned Time Rate levels?

>>43891956
1) I wouldn't use combat turns for this. Yes, weapons are out, but combat hasn't started yet, and the conversation should be more free-flowing than turn order would have it. If one of your players says they want to Wait maneuver to draw, then just have it sit there until the condition is meant.
2) There's the Who Dra-- Nevermind, >>43892009 posted it.

>>43891658
Actually, this is a different guy. Sorry if I started a trolling meme.

>>43891445
>clumsy, one-eyed. alcholic out-laws who are afraid of the dark.

That isn't sounding all that bad, in fact it sounds like a believable combination of traits (though the clumsiness may just be because the guy is fucking drunk).

>>43891956
Can 'Partial Surprise' (B393) rules be somehow applied here? I'm also new to gurps.

>>43891956
>If a PC uses quick draw to get his gun and shoot before the guy with the gun gets to react, how is it solved?
if noone ask for enter combat before the guy shot they can't use the combat rules of basicspeed to "fast draw and shot".

>If the guy shoots the PC to intimidate him, does he lose his turn and the rest of the party get a chance to ready their weapons or even shoot him?
yes.

>Should all the characters involved put in turn order, with the guy with the gun on top? (even if he doesn't have the highest basic speed?)
if he is the one starting the combat, yes, think like "we are all talking about shit and then someone pull out a gun"
the one who did "pull out a gun" is the "first", but he already used his action to "pull out a gun", then you just continue the combat based on basic speed and he keeps the position, at leat is this way i use, but, ya know, you can do whatever way you want, u just need to keep this way of gming through the campaign

>>43892043
No, my point is the game is built with the assumption the GM will use whichever rules in the book fit the game he wants to run.

For the vast majority that includes disadvantage limits, a term which appears 5+ times in both core books and which it is assumed you will probably use. Its not a house rule, its an optional rule.

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ITT.

>>43892009
I knew that GURPS had the answer for that situation somewhere in a splatbook. Thanks man!

>>43892031
I'm trying to run a campaign as realistic as possible, but there are some situations that are more focused on narrative like this one

>>43892046
I have to agree you there, I guess that combat would start once someone pulls a gun and confronts the guy with the intention to harm him.

>>43892172
Sure thing, it's only that I prefer working through the book for the time being. Once I can wrap my head around the system I'll be able to work these mechanics better.

Thanks a lot, guys!

>>43892327
Anon, I think you have reached a whole new level of misinterpreting and skimming through written text.

>>43892327
are you just intentionally misinterpreting everything people say so that you can even vaguely pretend that you have an argument
because you aren't even offering anything more than basic semantics anymore

>>43892572
Look on the bright side, the comparison could have easily been
>GURPS has a rule that tells you to swallow dicks
>Then has 5+ references throughout the entire book telling you it's a bad rule, but it's still the standard.

>>43892607
Why couldn't dick swallowing be the optional rule?

Why is the design so poor?

What's everyone's favourite advantage, and why? I'm curious to see what you guys find the most enjoyable and useful.

Personally I'd go for telekinesis because it provides a huge benefit even from level 1 and it's levels give a ton of stuff when you stack them. The offensive and defensive posibilities are also incredible.

>>43892631
GURPS is about tailoring the system to what you want run. Chosing what rules you want is a big thing, if you are the optimal butthurter get out, i'm pretty sure you can find some work to do.

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>>43892987
Ally (Summonable, Sympathy)

>The task in question succeeds if the total rolled on the dice is less than or equal to the number that governs the action

Jesus, that's unfamiliar.

I wish they would update the basic magic system. Skill based magic does not get enough love.

>>43895639
thaumaturgy, Sorcery, Ritual Magic, Essence, Blood Magic, Chaos Magic, etc.
it is already lots of oficial alternatives or some made by players.

>>43859248

This. I often take PDFs I get here and like and then buy them officially and pay for them. The pdfs are cheap and usually very good. Not even any drm so they deserve our $$$

Can someone explain the damage of the weapons to me? I do not get it.

>>43895724
No, I mean it would be nice if they actually properly updated Magic and the spell list for 4E. I know about those, I just prefer spells as skills.

>>43895974
i could try translate the list from my game to english and send you, i'm playing for almost 4 years using the same spells, its something along the 3hundreds.
my game will start in a few minutes, i can ask the GM for that list

>>43895942
It's the opposite of D&D. Where D&D has damage determined by the weapon (longswords deal 1d8, greataxes 1d12, daggers 1d4, etc.) and modified by your strength (STR 14 = +2 damage), GURPS has damage determined by strength (ST 10 = 1d damage) and modified by weapons (longswords deal +1 damage and use the Cutting injury multiplier). The only really new bits it the divide between Swung weapons and Thrusting weapons. Both are determined by the character's ST score. Swing damage (abbreviated "sw") is generally higher than Thrust damage ("thr"), but, depending on the rule's you're using, thr has its benefits over swing in a few cases (the most universally available benefits are the ability to target the Vitals or Eyes and access to the punishing Impaling injury type).

So, lets look at a thrusting broadsword in GURPS. Let's also assume bog standard ST. That ST score means you deal 1d damage with swung attacks and 1d-2 with thrusting attacks as a base. With a thrusting broadsword in your hands, you deal sw+1 cut or thr+2 imp. That comes out to 1d+1 cutting damage if you swing the sword at a motherfucker or 1d imp if you shank his bitch ass.

Now, lets beef you up a bit to ST 14, good "strongman" territory for heavy hitters. That changes your base damage to 2d sw and 1d thr. Now that thrusting bastard sword deals a whopping 2d+1 cut or 1d+2 imp.

If this were D&D, you would be dealing 1d8 with a longsword as a normal person and 1d8+2 or 1d8+3 as a really really strong dude.

The important bit to take away is that your strength tends to impact your raw damage much much more than your specific weapon. A strong motherfucker with a shorsword will fuck you up ten times harder than an average or weak dude with a full sized sword or axe.

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>>43896084
Don't worry about it, just a vague wish. Thanks for offering through.

>>43895974
You mean an expanded spell list beyond what is in Magic?

>>43896610
To me, I think he is saying he likes the idea of every spell being an individual skill, and is only wishing that they would rebalance the spells... you have some spells that are something like a perk effect like final rest that cost 10 fp, and you have some spells that ruin someone's day or can completely short circuit a plot that cost peanuts.

You have recover energy skill which isn't really a skill, but for the point investment in recover energy, you get something that blows very fit out of the water (plus it works for magic fatigue as well as Physical fatigue) not to mention Regeneration(FP Only)

I have a weird fetish for pre-requisite spell flow charts, so I kinda agree that a retooled spells-as-skills list would be enjoyable... for the right games.

>>43898883
As a follow up to that, since Sorcery, (spells as advantages) kinda has a built in mechanism for making magic more balanced, maybe someone could develop a simple algorithm to convert an advantage to a skill (I think a Pyramid article does the opposite: skill to advantage, so maybe that's a good starting point?) by figuring character point cost for a spell and converting that to required FP and skill difficulty... Only small issue is that the prerequisite tree would probably still need to be developed by hand.

Or, if doing straight conversions of skills to powers using sorcery, then sorcery back to rebalanced magic skills, you could use the existing prerequisite tree.

>>43899101

You could also take the Psionic Powers approach and build your spells as abilities and have a separate Hard skill for each of them.

I want to try Gurps Ultra-Lite, what should I do to make it more magical (a simple spell system) and cozy (trading, beer-making and the like skills)?

Also where do I find the 6 pages book? The booklet is horrible to read on the pc.

>>43873547
When I've ran Fallout games my players realized this pretty early on. They could tank a hit or two if they layered on the armor, but for the most part they approached every encounter extremely cautiously.

>>43900002
In combat, use IQ+Wizard to hit and deal damage like a firearm (1d for at-will spells, 2d 1/encounter, and 5d 1/day; add levels of Wizard to damage). Utility spells are tougher. Probably a very freeform system (Ultra-Light IS eight very tiny pages, and one and a half of those are taken up with tile copyright information); maybe describe how you can magic up a solution, and if everyone at the table agrees, roll HALF (IQ+Wizard) to see if you can pull it off. If you want to keep something like FP, temporarily drop HT by one level on a failure to represent the tiring effects of magic and make it not be the first choice for solving all problems.

For coziness, that all comes down to good, solid, comfy descriptions and proper Skill selection.

what's the best way to make golems and other constructs?

>>43900462
I see. Does adapting an existing spell system from a videogame is feasible for GUL?

>>43900555
If you think it'll be fun, it's at least worth a shot.

>>43900555
A little. Ultra-Light is so absolutely barebones that you have a lot of difficulty bringing a lot of things from the actual system to it.

Well, wait. The big issues are lack of skill granularity and that there's no FP in GUL.

Maybe you could do levels of [TYPE] Wizard skill instead of just Wizard. You need [TYPE] Wizard to cast spells of that college. Take a penalty to your IQ+[TYPE] Wizard casting roll equal to the spell's number of prerequisites. You know the whole college, but more advanced spells are harder. That deals with skill granularity. Also, GUL's skills are basically Wildcard skills, and I think it's cannon that a college of magic is kosher as a Wildcard skill. Replace any need for Magery with increased IQ; You effectively have Magery 1 if you invested a level into IQ, Magery 2 for two levels, etc. This also stops people for keeping IQ normal and just putting levels into skills.

Take a look at Thaumatology for it's Threshold-Limited Magic. Instead of taking FP (a stat GUL doesn't have) to cast spells, mages add the energy's cost to their running power tally. The energy slowly bleeds off, but should mages cast too much too fast and let the tally get too high, blammo, magical crisis.

>>43900510
That's a broad question. Do you mean as a race? I'd figure they'd use the machine meta-trait and just add onto any other Advantages and Disadvantages on top of that.

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>>43901999
yes, as a race, i want make some constructs templates for players but don't i want exploitable flaws. what sould i use for something like pic?

>>43902104
Well, it often depends on the kind of game and setting. A magical golem is very different to a race that is just "kind of" a golem, because their skin is like stone and such. What kind are you aiming at?

>>43902104
First thought is combine Body of Earth, Stone, or Metal with some mental disadvantages reflecting how they were "programmed" to serve. Perhaps the Automaton metatrait, though that is probably too much for being a player character.

>>43902179
Magical Golens, i'm using a magic system that i have stolen from the general(you spend HT to fuel permanent spells) so the golens are anymated constructs who carry the soulf of someone. The soul only gives him "essence" and they still need """food""", crystals, mana or something like that.

Also how much HT would a generic tree have?

>>43896084
>>43896084
>i could try translate the list from my game to english and send you, i'm playing for almost 4 years using the same spells, its something along the 3hundreds.

I would love to see your list; I'm about to take some German classes and would love to have something other than textbooks to work at.

>>43902896
German is a fun language, hope your classes aren't shit.

Is there any book that helps with creating religions? I'm hoping for something with the same level of depth as the planet and alien species creation in GURPS Space

>>43903927
GURPS: Religion from 3e has some really nifty advice for creating cool religious, myths, etc., but it's more of a book of advice on how to do it yourself than a generator.
I honestly use the old TSR AD&D World Builder's Guidebook for my fantasy pantheons. Unless i already have an idea in mind, I roll up everything randomly and then start adding in details to try and get it to make sense; by the end, I feel like I have something reasonably close to an old school religion, at least in terms of tone.

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Latest gurps experience:
>Player is using a pick, fighting in a fantasy-China bar, when the city guard bursts in, wearing heavy armor.
>"I get, like, an attack bonus, right?"
>"For fuck's sake, man, why?"

Then he points to a footnote in Low Tech. Pic related.

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>>43904618
Now I'm just looking through books. Here's my favorite illustration of the Basic Set.

"I cast Enlarge Head!"

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How would you stat Monsoon from Metal Gear Rising? Specifically, I'm interested in the way he can separate his body parts and use them independently. What advantage would that be? I know it's similar to Injury Tolerance (Independent Body Parts) but that's not quite right.

>>43904832
Only played a little bit MGR; how independent are his body parts? IBP is, I think, meant for things like being able to detach your hand and have it act like the Thing and crawl around on its own. If your hand just floats there like a normal hand – just with no arm – IBP would be overkill. If he can extend his reach, I'd say that's just adding multiple levels of Long to your existing "arms."

The biggest issue would be his (near?) immunity to Cutting attacks. If I'm remembering this correctly, his entire body is held together with an electromagnetic field, and he can "split" himself at will, making him nearly immune to slicing attacks. Some form of IT (Diffuse) would probably be the best bet, or IT (Damage Reduction 4; Cutting only, -40%; Active Defense, -40%; Electrical, -20%; Reliable 4, +20%) [20]. The books caps the advantage at level 4, but considering the point values of MGR and the cheapness of the advantage after factoring in the limitations, hell, raising it to 8 wouldn't be out of the question.

>>43904832
I feel like there is something awesome here for a cinematic dodge?

>>43905039 here
I actually think >>43905044 is on the right track, actually. He has a shitton of Enhanced Dodge. Like, all the Enhanced Dodge. I'd slap on Electrical -20% but other than that, yeah, that answer's simpler, easier, and more accurate, at least as far as the defensive body separation thing is concerned. Ignore all that Injury Tolerance bull I posted.

Using it offensively would still be Long limbs, possibly with Low Signature (+10%)

>>43905039

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OddVmAd_zE8

tldw

Can go Magneto style to throw around shit, but with less precision than Magneto would. He effectively just hurls things around kind of like Darth Vader did in the original movies

Can split his body to "dodge" attacks, but requires some level of concentration to do so (as he doesn't do such ALL the time), and he is disoriented by EMP grenades to such a degree that he literally falls apart

His body parts can act independently of one another; in fact, he can use them as a projectile of sorts when he wishes

>>43905134
Hmm okay.

•Telekinesis (Area of Effect, ???; Magnetic. -50%; Visible, -20%) at a very high level. I think the lack of precision might be more of a personality thing, a question of want and not ability. I'd also say that Monsoon uses this ability with his detached hands as they aren't Thing-ing it up but flying. Maybe include Compartmentalized Mind to control both hands at once or control them while also fighting normally.
•Enhanced Dodge {Arbitrarily High Level}.
•Electrical. Whether it's because you're unconscious or because you're a heap of bits on the ground, you're incapacitated by EMPs and similar devices for seconds equal to your margin of failure on the HT roll.
•Independent Body Parts (Detachable Head, +15%; Detachable Torso; +50%; Instant Reattachment, +50%; Willing Detachment, +100%) [110]. Those tow new enhancements are very rough eyeballing, but the first one would let you separate your entire body at the torso if you suffer HP cutting damage (low half has some rules as Legs but no penalty to Move), and the second one would let you detach any limb with a Ready action instead of requiring it be attacked.

Just a rough draft. I'm tired and I need to stop fucking around on 4chan and finish my goddamn paper.

>>43888065
The GM of a gurps Fallout game did those.
My character found a WW2 Stahlhelm that gave my character "a bonus on attacks against, a social stigma from, and an Intolerance towards Jews."

>>43905417
I feel like Monsoon should also have some form of Injury Tolerance (Diffuse). He can even turn into a flying swarm of tiny magnets.

>>43906654
>I feel like Monsoon should also have some form of Injury Tolerance (Diffuse). He can even turn into a flying swarm of tiny magnets.

Maybe better modelled with a shitton of enhanced dodge? With alternate form?

>>43902896
i'm not german, i'm brasilian, kind of it, i'm son of a Awetí with a frenchman. We play using Awetí and portuguese when we call someone who doesn't have our heritage.
My group is me, my aunt, two of my cousins and my uncle, he is the one who GM.

>>43902277
you stole this magic system from me

>>43888065

GURPS already has some rule for clothing adding to skills (notably, footwear can help stealth, climbing and hiking) so minor benefits seem very reasonable and in a more cinematic game (which I think Fallout should be) you can easily justify clothes which give full-blown advantages. At the very least, you should be able to buy equipment bonds for clothing which give a bonus to a related skill rather than needing to take it on the tools.

>>43908581
Also, full helmets give penalty to reaction modifiers, just like power armor helmets give CHA penalties in FO.

My group has been doing rotations of mini-campaigns in new systems every two to three months for about a year now, and it's finally time to try out GURPS in January

My group's interested in running a modern spy/espionage type game at some point 2016. Is GURPS a good system for that sort of thing? Is their s GURPS spy supplement that would be appropriate if we decided to use GURPS for our spy game?

>>43908998
>Is GURPS a good system for that sort of thing?
Definitely. Espionage implies lots of social stuff, so you might want to look into Social Engineering. High-Tech contains many useful toys for modern campaign. But only do that if you want lots of details. Otherwise, use Basic Set and Action.

>>43908998
What, in you opinion, are the hallmarks of a system that is good for a spy/espionage game? Because I'm trying to think of some and coming up blank. Spies should, realistically, be doing most of their shit through roleplaying and social skill checks; that's minimal involvement with the system as most systems have social skills in one form or another.

I guess there is Social Engineering like >>43909107 was saying, though; I guess you could say social rules are fairly well supported in GURPS, and that might make it an especially good system for spy games.