Is there any film or video out there that correctly depicts half-swording?
All I can find is Lindybeige or Skallagrim being autistic about it on youtube. I think it makes no sense the way these people present half-swording based only on historic manual pictures. The way they portray it simply seems impratical, (holding the blade at half length and trying to fence or stab with it) seems to only make sense if you are fighting in a thigh corridor where you risk hitting the walls with your sword.
Besides, no videos out there cover the mordhal or spinning the blade to use the pommel, grip and crossguards as a mace/warhammer.
I also strongly feel half-swording and the mordhal work better as great sword (two-handed/longsword, pick what you fancy) technique instead of arming sword technique. An arming sword just seems to short or to light to warrant this kinda technique being used.
Anyone who follows HEMA closely got anything that portrays proper technique?
Please feel free to correct whatever assumption I got wrong.
>>43840047
It was used more commonly with Arming Swords. They were more common swords and better for thrusting. Half swording especially was meant to boost penetration to finish off an armoured knight.
2 handers did have the allowance for it though. This is what the leather-covered or blunted section was for.
A common tactic to deal with Pikemen, for example, was to use Zweihanders. You walked forward swinging an upwards figure 8, knocking the pikes out of your way, until you were close enough to strike. Then, because of the press this resulted in, you half-sworded to stab bitches in the face.
>>43840047
>I think it makes no sense the way these people present half-swording based only on historic manual pictures. The way they portray it simply seems impratical, (holding the blade at half length and trying to fence or stab with it) seems to only make sense if you are fighting in a thigh corridor where you risk hitting the walls with your sword.
it's against an armoured opponent if you are (preferably) armoured and doesn't have another, better weapon. So it's basically a Plan B.
Also don't forget that you have to stab relatively small areas while the other guy really doesn't want this to happen so your best bet is to get into some kind of grappling and then stab that bitch. The other guy want this too if you are armoured so long reach isn't really needed and doing those small but precise motions are way better in this situation
>Besides, no videos out there cover the mordhal or spinning the blade to use the pommel, grip and crossguards as a mace/warhammer.
because those aren't the most useable techniques regardless of how much circlejerk there is about them on /tg/
>I also strongly feel half-swording and the mordhal work better as great sword (two-handed/longsword, pick what you fancy) technique instead of arming sword technique
might be but the time when two handed swords were really common full plate was started to be less and less common.
about a better video, Matt Easton might have one, or if you are very lucky then Dimicator maybe (although I wouldn't count on that one)
Interested in this shit.
>>43840047
Well, you got a few thing mixed up.
Half-Swording is more than holding the sword by the middle and stabbing with it. That's one of the things that you can do by employing Half-Swording, but there's more to it than that. And half-swording can be used for both arming swords and longswords (what you call two-handed), it can even be used with stuff like a messer, the principle stays the same. Of course, as the length of the sword increases and decreases, so does the number of things you can do while Half-Swording.
Think of Half-Swording as turning your blade into a quarterstaff. It's basically about making your weapon more versatile, allowing it to be used faster and turning all of it's ends as striking points.
Starting with the example you provided, and the one most people think it's the only use for Half-Swording... let's suppose you have an arming sword, and you use it to sucesfully stab an enemy with it... except the man is using a thick leather jacket or a mail hauberk and the tip does not penetrate... what could you do? Well, you could half-sword, grasp the blade with your free hand, and in that case put more limb force into the stab (ramming that point in there), which would certainly create enough force to penetrate the armor.
If you were a knight in plate armor, you could use Half-Swording as a way to close the distance between another opponent, armored or un-armored, then use the sword as a grappling tool (hooking the blade or crossguards) to bring down the enemy, then employ half-swording again to drive the point into a vulnerable gap in his armor, instead of pulling out your dirk and finishing the man.
And nothing stops you from swinging your arming sword around and hitting people in the head with the pommel or using the cross-guards to hook people's joints.
>>43840047
You do have a point that Longswords (two handed) are better for Half-Swording. It allows you to virtually turn your sword into a quarterstaff and use all , or bring it about faster, or use it as a way where the reach of your sword becomes a problem (fighting in a line, or in a corridor, etc.) But otherwise, the same about arming swords apply here.
The Mordhau is simply one of the things you can do while half-swording, and it works more agaisnt armoured opponents. (obviously if you hit someone without a helm in the head with it, that person is gonna die.
As for your request, here is a good video that shows how half-swording can be used agaisnt armoured (or unarmoured) opponents. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi757-7XD94
I am gonna get hell from people here, but the movie Ironclad also shows some accurate half-swording, despite how /tg/ likes to yell that it is a stupid movie.
I can't find the scene right now but you can google "Ironclad two-handed sword". The templar character in that scene accurately uses half-swording to compensate for the weight of his sword, or to shorten the reach or strike faster with it when it's more advantageous to do so, basically the whole "quarterstaff" thing I talked about in the other post.
>>43840485
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_r91EnIN3O4
Ignore the sword cleaving through axe, armour and half a man in the beginning and skip to 0:52.
Notice that when the viking dude manages to close the distance (technically putting the knight in a disadvantage because of how long the sword it), the templar sucesfully half-hands to compensate for the close-quarter combat and use the blade to kill the guy. He does a lot of interesting shit during the rest of the fight as well.
>>43840485
I'm not sure if you get more yelling because of Ironclad or because you posted a video with John Clements in it
>>43840535
also I'm afraid to ask but... why are the vikings speaking hungarian?
>>43840546
Probably both, but I hope people will watch the video first and see it makes a bit of sense.
>>43840573
Beats me...In the movie they are supposed to be danish...
>>43840047
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4k-vjdeZO4&list=PL2EC6F386118BEF99
Here you go OP.
Two guys in full armor actually using halfswording . The exchanges are step by step so you can follow them.
>>43840143
All of this is wrong, or unfounded.
>>43840590
well, even if they watch them it's very... arguable on how informative they are
>>43840622
now that is a useful video
>>43840535
A bit off topic, but I don't get why people hate that film, and that particular scene so much.
I've seen people behead a cow with a machete in a farm. Those fat guys from cold steel have videos where they are cutting Ballistic Torsos made of human flesh and bone analogues in half with sabres from a close distance. Not to mention people in that day were stronger than modern day.
Why is it that unrealistic that a trained templar, with a great sword, and all that run-up and "charge" behing the strike, can actually cleave that man to the waist? Do people say it's bullshit because THEY can't do it, because it really is so?
>>43840573
The "viking" extras which are kinda sorta not really at all based on the French and Flemish mercenaries used by King John were played by hungarians.
And of course nobody in England was using a two-handed sword of an sort in 1215.
>>43840660
I don't like John Clements much, but if I were to half-sword agaisnt an armourer opponent, what he does is pretty much what I'd try to do.
Besides that full video does a good shop explaining how mobile knights in plate were, dispelling the myth that plate armor was cumbersome (they have a guy put on a set of armor and sprint balls out after another, unarmoured guy)
>>43840677
>Not to mention people in that day were stronger than modern day.
This isn't actually true.
>>43840660
The video with Clements is excellent, however. It even goes out of the way to correct the misinformation that not wearing armor could provide and advantage.
Clements may be an asshole, but none of his ridiculous opinions find their way into that video.
>>43840742
I'm not implying they where born stronger, but obviously if someone grows up picking up hay and doing a lot of manual labor, that person is obviously gonna be stronger than someone that grows up playing nintendo 64.
>>43840801
They're not going to be stronger than people who dedicate considerable time to fitness with a modern understanding of the human body.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ja_DV6zvEqQ
>>43840677
> Why is it that unrealistic that a trained templar, with a great sword, and all that run-up and "charge" behing the strike, can actually cleave that man to the waist? Do people say it's bullshit because THEY can't do it, because it really is so?
I have no doubts someone like this, or with some great physical strength, could possibly do that. There are historical accounts of people getting cleaved from shoulder to stomach in battle afteral, and I don't think it's an exaggeration.
I don't think any average person could do it however. So yeah, I agree, a lot of people base "realistic" on the context of what they can do or not.
Yes, I used the Clegane bowl picture. Sue me.
>>43840733
>>43840742
true that he doesn't say any idiotic thing in that video but than again he shows there a very specific scenario only which wasn't the norm (armoured vs unarmoured and doing only pommel strikes) basically over-focusing.
>>43840833
>Modern understanding of the human body
We live in an age where people seriously believe squatting causes upper-body musculature to increase...
If my life depended on it, I'd stick with the guy that grew up lifting heavy shit for a living and recieved proper martial training, than with the guy that lifts some weights for 2 hours a day and eats some oats.
>>43840677
Nothing wrong with it, but it's not realistic to cleave through 2.5 persons and their armaments.
>>43840833
Nobody is saying the guys were superman.
The guy you are quoting is saying that people who grow up doing physical activity from an early age are obviously gonna be physically stronger than people who grow up doing jack shit. And yes, they are gonna be much, much stronger.
You obviously never heart of Brian Shaw, america's strongest man, who grew up in redneck country lifting bays of hale and benched 500 pounds the first time he stepped in a gym.
>>43840884
>>43840919
Watch the linked video.
>>43840143
>more common
Fucking when?
>>43840902
If fat /k/ommando guys with one-handed blades can do it from 1 feet away, then a trained knight with a giant sword and lots of woomph is gonna do it too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0ledM32E4A
>>43841000
Controlled conditions for test-cutting help a lot, but given considering that he hit the haft square, the haft was bare wood, and the guy didn't appear to be wearing mail or anything I think it's pretty plausible.
>>43840047
>spinning the blade to use the pommel, grip and crossguards as a mace/warhammer
Pretty sure that either of the video boys you mentioned have talked about this.
