itt: Red flags that any remotely experience party should spot the second the DM utters them
>Massive cavern that "appears empty"
>You don't THINK you see anything
>I tell them there is no way that they can go in without someone escorting them.
>They tell me I am obstructing them and that I will be punished and storm off.
They hid a bomb.
>>43819018
>anything, absolutely anything, on a fucking pedestal
Cast every detect and check you have on that thing. You should know it's social security number, bank statements, if it take it's coffee with two sugars or three, and it's music taste long before you even sneeze in it's direction, let alone go up and touch the thing.
>>43819018
>there is a young girl suspended in a sphere of energy
>along the road, you come across a large rocky outcropping
>You comb through the abandoned space station and find nothing
>this character has a goatee
>>43819018
>You enter a long, dim, empty hallway, about 10 ft wide and 10 ft tall
>You see an ornate wooden chest
>"Roll a wisdom save..." "Don't worry about it."
>>43819018
>You start in a tavern
>You start in a tavern. It's a sandbox campaign. What do you do?
>you guys aren't getting any information because you haven't rolled yet
>only the DMPC knows how to retrieve the macguffin
>I'm an experienced DM
>You are all knocked out and captured without a fight
>My plot NPCs are super powerful wizards. Let me tell you how awesome they are.
>Oh wow you guys are SO going to die
>You need to keep telling me that you are making spot checks or i will assume that your character isn't paying attention and automatically fail all their spot checks
>I randomly generate all encounters and treasures.
>Oh, your character can do 100+ damage at 4l? Yea, that's fine, wizards are more OP anyway.
what i like to do:
>you see nothing of danger. at least thats what you are sure of. you could go in there , BUT only if you dare.
however , it looks safe , at least from your point of view.
then , like the ass i am , i just roll if there is actual danger
>>43819128
>"Don't worry about it."
that's a good one
"It seems like nothing's wrong"
"That was probably just your imagination"
"Are you sure?"
>No, you don't need initiative for this fight
>>43819180
>local town/city is throwing a festival
what could go wrong?
fantasy towns always have festivals that aren't plot driven... right?
>>43819157
>starting in a tavern
don't really care honestly. Making really good beginnings to a campaign can be quite a feat of writing and some people just don't have that talent. No shame no blame
>I randomly generate all counters
yeah that sucks but
>I randomly generate all loot
I don't mind this at all provided that there is a hefty amount of gold as well and players are allowed to buy some of the less common items from time to time.
>>43819192
That is 90% of our fights in Call of Cthulhu.
>>43819095
>Cast every detect and check you have on that thing. You should know it's social security number, bank statements, if it take it's coffee with two sugars or three, and it's music taste long before you even sneeze in it's direction, let alone go up and touch the thing.
I PICK UP MY AMULET!
>>43819018
>recurring NPC that only shows up at night
>absolutely any NPC noted to be a domestic servant of some sort, but noted not to be a slave
>large stash of unguarded supplies
>>43819018
After running a trap-filled session with my group:
>"You see a closed chest. It is not locked."
>"This is what the floor looks like."
Also:
>"Roll a Perception check."
>Rolling dice behind the screen at all
>"You hear footsteps."
>in a dungeon of some sort
>scout/wizard class roll a perception check
>low number
>you dont notice anything
The moment the GM out of nowhere asks for whatever roll, any roll, then you know the rape train has started
>>43819251
>Rolling dice behind the screen at all
Eviler DMs will do that just to fuck with you.
>>43819018
Are you sure you want to do that?
>>43819871
In my experience as a player, it's only ever been when I or a party member wanted to do something dangerously risky or something that would be obviously stupid in any other situation that a DM would ask that.
>>43819846
I advise every DM to pick up some at least rudimentary acting ability, not only to help with storytelling, but to make those times you're fucking with your players as convincing as when you're being on the level with them. Really useful for horror games when you start bullshitting roles and feigning reactions since it sets a natural air of paranoia.
>>43819192
Very new player here, why would that be a problem?
>>43819871
>taking that action may have lasting effects or cause something unintended to happen
>>43819941
Not sure, but it sounds like a scripted battle that just happens to you, rather than giving you any agency in the results.
>>43819909
Therefore it should be a red flag, anon.
>>43819957
Hmm... Cool, I might use this, myself and a bunch of friends started playing very recently. I appear to have been made DM for life though so I'm trying to learn new ways to make the game fun for them.
>>43819018
>You spot large tracks in the mud
>Many trees are severely damaged in this supposedly uninhabited area
>Many rotten corpses of fish litter the dry riverbed, through which a tiny stream still flows
In the end it turned out to be a colony of dire beavers, but we were spooked all the time
>>43819975
Eeeeh it doesn't really sound fun especially if it just screws over the party. You should script it unless everyone involved isn't a player, like 3rd parties in a scuffle.
>>43819991
Oh I suppose you're right. Thanks though!
>>43820031
Right, that should was supposed to be a shouldn't though, just in case you missed that.
My most recent I sprung on a player:
>You arrive at a huge castle built into a mountain side
>You got lost from the other party members but you're pretty sure they're here somewhere
>Proceed into basement of a secondary tower
>Run into a malnourished servant boy carrying a sliver pitcher
>The interior of the pitcher has dark stains all about it
>Force him to take you to the area he brought the pitcher
>It's a prison pit that spirals downward with cells embedded into the walls
>At the very bottom is a single cell to which he has the key
>Take the key from him and enter
>Inside is a blond woman chained by her wrists and ankles to each wall, her damn hands are wrapped in wire mesh so she can't so much as move her fingers, and the blindfold on her face is basically a metal circlet locked into face
>I'm gonna free her!
Really?
>Really
>So he smashes one of the wall chains free
>Turns out that's all she needs. Just one limb to free the other three.
>Scalps half of her head yanking off the metallic blinder
>Decides to let him live for being so very helpful and heads off to parts unknown
>Enlists another party member as her carriage driver in this process, resulting in her death
My players don't have a lick of common sense. On the up side, I get to craft crazy evil and totally genre savvy plans.
>>43819018
>Player: "So, then my character goes..."
>DM: "Hold that thought while I looks something up."
I should practice my DM poker face a little bit more, since when I have really bad stuff incoming I can't help but grin
>>43820113
Grin intentionally at random intervals
>The door is locked. You can see a riddle written on it.
Great, I was hoping we could spend the next four hours trying to read the GM's mind!
>>43819018
>"Greetings, Citizen."
>You don't see any cameras in this room.
>Your PDC starts ringing
>You see IntSec grunts in the hallway before you.
>>43819983
That is actually fucking rad
I am stealing that idea
>>43819018
>when the priest finishes the bizarre ritual, you see the rock you brought him has turned to solid gold
>Players: wtf? but that isnt possible to do. there is no spell in the book that does that
>DM: Yes. Interesting isnt it?
My players think either im fucking with them or I am 5 steps ahead of them. Truth is, I got drunk, fucked up, pulled a plotline out my ass and now have no idea wtf im gonna do next session lol
>>43820144
I have used riddles effectively as a DM, but they have to be those 1 word asnwer hobbit style riddles, where the answer is related to the dungeon.
I had a dwarf tomb where the treasure was guarded by a riddle. Being a dwarven tomb under a mountain, the answer was mountain.
the longest to get it was only about 5 mins. just enough time for them to discuss while I take a piss and make coffee
>>43819157
>oh wow you guys are so going to die
I say similar things, because my players apparently like feeling like they beat me. So I pretend like I'm doing my best to kill them, whenwhen in reality I'm fudging rolls to keep them alive left and right.
>>43822303
>there is no spell in the book that does that
I hate this.
I'm the GM, bitch! I get to decide which spells exist and which don't.
>>43822371
Im gonna have fun in my next game. bronze-age homebrew. magic is all granted by pagan-style gods and spirits who demand sacrifices. some demand blood, others silver. the more powerful the effect, the greater the sacrifice.
I cant wait to see the look on their faces when they first get paid in cattle instead of gold coins
>>43819871
My DM just says that to fuck with me
If you're reading, fuck you Kila
>uses an interest session for another game to promote his own game in another system.
>has an NPC made specifically to kill PCs who try and mess up his world.
>>43819871
>party spends ten minutes planning, tell me what they are going to do.
>I look over the screen and say "ok"
>suddenly a change of plans.
>>43819018
>It's a simple run.
>>43822803
Almost every GM worth his salt has some form of OP Police otherwise you get optimizing turds that try to rob banks and go full GTA rampage mode.
>>43822960
JESUS CHRIST ITS AN ABOMINATION KILL IT KILL IT WITH FIRE
>>43819846
I do it then talk to myself or do fake math or some shit.
>roll
"Hmmm."
>roll
>scribble scribble erase scribble
>roll
>more scribbling
>visible sweating around the table
"You don't SEE anything wrong with the room."
By the end of the session i usually have a really detailed drawing of a kitten or flower or some such. If i feel assholish i'll leave it on the table as i pick up my screen cause its the only piece of paper i wrote on.
>>43823095
you are an evil man
GOOGLE STOP IT'S NOT FUCKING TURKEY DAY YET
>>43819064
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImaiZH67xKs
>>43822803
Do dont have Fingers of God in place in your games just in case you need them?
I always have super tough guys in place somewhere just in case players think they can run wild without plans or repercussions.
I dont ever plan on using them, and so far never have had to, but they are there just in case
Had a fun GM who would "drop hints" when we were getting off track.
>"A red Fiat drives by."
>"You hear a train in the distance."
>"You feel as though someone just walked over your grave."
>>43823207
Fingers of God? Care to explain? Anything to help reign in the wild group of bandits that I dm for.
>>43819099
>along the road, you come across a large rocky outcropping
this x10
>>43823274
Whats this about? I don't understand it and as a DM I feel like I need to
>>43823296
>a faint green glow is emanating from the lower level of the cavern.
>>43819095
I once put a bottle on a pedestal with a sign saying "drink me". They assumed touching it would be safe, the fools.
>Roll a spot check
>So your cleric and your paladin worship different gods, right?
>You hear rumors in town about [whatever]
And any time, EVER, when the DM smiles from behind his screen.
>>43823332
Is it meant to be a precursor to an ambush or something? Or are we talking about a rocky overhang rather than an outcropping?
>>43823254
Finger's of God are not really to 'reign in' players so much as teach them an important lesson.
Once you use them, that campaign is over cuz at least 3/4 of them are going to die if not more.
It is to remind them "If you guys are going to be assholes, so am I"
Fingers of God are a last resort, and there is always almost a better way of dealing with the situation... but sometimes you need them, if only to gesture to when the players are being colossal twats.
You could have some mid-level Paladins, like 6 of them, come poking around asking questions. just to scare em a little. Dont intend for them party to ever fight them, but if they are dumb enough to... well...
Not the best plan, and ya a little passive aggressive if done wrong, but it does work.
>>43823254
He just means he has NPC's set aside specifically to kill them if they get out of line - not realising he's GM, so all he has to do is say "you're dead."
Don't take DM advice from "That Guy".
Instead of trying to reign in your wild bandits, work with them. Every bit of chaos they create is an opportunity for adventure. Killed some random shop owner for his loot? Oh, that guy was doing the daily ritual that kept the Army of Darkness from rising. Raped a random maid? Turns out she was the king's daughter, sneaking out at night and posing as peasantry. Also, she's pregnant. Also, she was bitten by vampire that same night... There are, complications.
The advantage to wild bandit adventurers is that they can basically write your story for you. Actions have consequences, and sometimes, consequences are fun.
>>43823420
It's a great ambush site, yeah. And it's a very strange, mundane thing to announce to your players unless there's something that's going to happen there, so you can expect trouble when your GM says it
really there's nothing wrong with it at all. it's just a cue for combat 90% of the time
>>43823253
>>"A red Fiat drives by."
Stolen
>>43819157
Nothing wrong with the tavern or the random treasure, but yeah the rest of that is pretty shitty.
> Only the DMPC knows how to retrieve the MacGuffin
That's why I always sit down with one player who is willing and give him the "leader" position kind of like Roy in OOTS. Party dynamics are free to evolve from there, but it's nice to have someone initiating things.
>>43823420
There's no reason to mention it otherwise.
It's either hiding a horde of orcs, bandits, or it's going to get up and turn out to be a dragon and/or earth elemental/golem thingie.
>>43819846
Yeah dude every DM does that, it's so you don't give away when something actually happens.
DMs who don't do this destroy all the tension by making it obvious when shit is about to go down, and it's not as much fun.
>>43823254
Not him, but I assume he means the god is the DM, as in "the DM's agents to keep things going right."
I just like this concept because it means the players aren't the only super high level adventurers, and if they go bad, they might become someone else's villian of the week.
>>43822803
>Oh, in RPGs I can do anything right?
>Well, yes, but there will be cons-
>THEN I WANT TO KILL EVERYONE I MEET!
>That's not how it-
>Alright, you said we met a frail old man on the road, right? I behead him!
>*roll*His head falls on the road with a meaty thump and his body slumps down next to it.
>SWEET! We continue down the road.
>... you encounter a very big lizard-looking creature with horns, spines growing from it's back and great leathery wings. It is currently eating a horse.
>I CUT OFF IT'S HEAD!
>*roll roll* Your sword slides off it's scales and it turns to face you. *roll* It bites you... *roll* -and eats your arm.
>...WHAT THE FUCK GM? WAAH WAAH RAILROAD WAAH!
The crying guy is you, by the way.
>>43823462
I don't get it...?
>>43823461
Aaah, I get ya.
Question: How suspicious would a wattle and daub wall section at the side of a road be? Or is there not really a way to make an ambush actually a surprise because if you stop the travel to announce shit its obviously for an ulterior motive?
>>43823455
>giving the players a fighting chance, if only a small one, is worse than 'rocks fall everyone dies'
Honestly, id be a lot more pissed as a player if the DM pulled a "well that maid you killed was actually the king's daughter in disguise" over a "here is the hardest fight of your life"
Players always have a choice when it comes to Fingers of God (which is why I have never had to actually use them, just gesture to them).
As someone who has been on both sides, petty railroading is not the way to go.
Seriously, why was the king's daughter in a brothel with not even a single loyal bodyguard...cuz im the dm and i say so! good job, everyone hates you now.
>>43823530
DM Fiat
>>43823525
Whatever you may think of it, Undertale's Genocide run is EXACTLY how a murderhobo rampage should progress. It starts off normal, you start killing everything, some people try to convince you to back down and fail, every town you come to starts being empty as people evacuate to flee from you, heroes start rising up to fight you, and then you finally catch the attention of someone or something WAY out of your league.
>>43823554
...Well played.
>>43823540
>Or is there not really a way to make an ambush actually a surprise because if you stop the travel to announce shit its obviously for an ulterior motive?
Yeah, unless you want to get into majorly annoying sleight of hand like constantly announcing threatening structures they pass that don't contain ambushes, to some extent you just have to expect that there isn't much of a surprise if it's out on the open road. It's not a big deal, it's just kind of funny to a player
>>43823564
Yes, that's exactly how it should be.
If there is a murderhobo in my game who kills everyone he meets, eventually he will make stronger and stronger enemies... who will even overwhelm him.
When you fight against the world, the world Will fight back. And usually it's not a hard fight, to be honest.
>>43819018
>There's a knock at the door
>The Gryphons will remember that
>The Grand Duke Didn't like that
>>43819257
>>43819400
That's why you ask for perception roll several times for no reason and just describe random details, so players stop worry too much
>>43823564
Soul Nomad's Demon Path had you either make existence itself go poof because you literally ate everything and everyone or get stuck with a cow in a sword for eternity after the whole world bands against you.
>>43823596
That is exactly what a Finger of God is and should be.
You never force them on the players, the players force it on themselves. It should never come as a surprise.
>>43823596
It'd be much more interesting for him to get a vicious reputation and be recruited by some similarly vicious characters with the lure of power and cash, and thus go on an edgy edgmeister quest of bloodlust only to be betrayed by his fellow murderhobos.
"Education" players is not your goal, as GM. Your goal is to create an adventure they can enjoy.
Granted, a lot of people treat RPG's as strategic murder-simulators, and if that's your thing, fine. But you mayas well play on-line MORPG at that point. Tabletops are better suited for actually creating a story, and a story that ends with "murder hobo gets what he deserves" isn't much fun.
I still feel it was justified but one thing I did as DM that pissed off a player was to have NPCs in a village that was under attack get scared of and angry towards our Tiefling PC.
One time he used Thaumaturgy to open a door for no reason and an old dude went ''Fucking tieflings'' and the guy had to be restrained from roasting the old fuck alive...
>>43819018
>I spit on the floor
seriously... in the Duke's Manor.. on his hardwood floor, with your acidic dragonborn spit..
welp, there is a tee-ball sized hole in it now asshole, that is coming out of the quest reward. Also dont expect any more jobs.
I love you Andrew, but sometimes you are really fucking stupid.
>NPCs that initiates conversation with PCs, not vice versa
Our DM has a habit of making NPCs that look and act like DMPCs. For example, anthropomorfic horse named Tardis that crashed from space in front of us.
>>43823540
Just announce various thing as you go.
You see a nice stream off the side of the road, a looming rock cropping can be seen in the distance, a farmhouse is visible ontop of a nearby hill. Is the stream a good place to camp and refill water or is it a good place for river bandits? Is that giant rock the road circles around a perfect landmark or a nice place for bandits to wait on the otherside of unseen? Is that farmhouse inhabited by a kind caring family with a fetish for helping travels and 3 hot, young, impressionable daughters or is it a perfect hideout for bandits and the farmhouse is actuall a slave whorehouse? So long as you keep the norm the one time the norm gets them attacked they'll be tense about any other described thing.
>>43823678
I generally don't allow murderhobos into my games.
If they lie and tell me they aren't murderhobos and then the truth comes out, I will deal with them then and there.
Also, a certain set of manners is required for a group of people to function well together. If you are not well mannered it is my duty as a GM to correct you and/or boot you out if you're going to be disruptive in my game. That's if you're ruining the other players' fun. If you're all having fun playing murderhobos, I will be the one leaving. Easy as that. You got it?
Also, your pic is grade A bullshit. What is fun for some can be boring for others. If you find murderhoboing fun, I pity you and hope we will never-ever meet at the gaming table or on a skype-call to game together.
Have a good evening.
>>43823736
Good point. I was also thinking of using the whole ''Wattle and Daub wall'' thing. Hopefully the ''what the fuck is wattle and daub'' part will keep em off balance enough to get got
>>43823727
>anthropomorphic horse named Tardis that crashed from space in front of us
>>43823774
"you find a random wattle and daub wall on the side of the road"
>party stares at it convinced somethings up
>entirely ignore the warband of orcs 3 feet behind them
>>43823678
I should indulge and encourage behavior I do not want in my games?
I dont mean to be harsh, but you sound like Virtualopium
you are under the assumption the DM is enjoying the game and they player have an interest in anything even remotely resembling a story
>murder hobo gets what he deserves" isn't much fun.
that is the point. It not fun for me to have my game trashed.
And now that the game is over with glorious combat when can sit down and have a serous talk about what everyone actually wants to play cuz clearly the other game wasnt working.
>Shadowrun campaign.
>A strange homeless person has been following the party G-man style.
>Final mission, in a facility that was guarded to the brim.
>WAS until we reached the artifact we were trying to get, having snuck past the guards.
>The bum is just fucking standing in the room with the artifact alone, congratulating the party.Fucker was a god damn dragon.He still shows up in our SR campaigns if we look around to hard.
>>43823805
Well, I still have 2/3 of the group that once used a familiar to convince enemies that the noise they heard when a half-orc barbarian tried to stealthily climb a wall was just a random animal and didn't understand what an overhang was so heres hoping...
>>43822411
I feel like you're inviting the players to commit ritual genocide for massive power.
>>43823564
>Out of your leagueUndertale cannot stop the murderhobos, challenging them only makes them MORE MURDERHOBO.
https://youtu.be/kFnUCNIStRw?t=1m23s
>>43823890
That's why instead of Sans I got pic related.
>>43823770
Well, if ya got a campaign already running that isn't of that nature, and someone comes in and starts murderhobo'ing, yeah, smack em down.
But if you wind up GM'ing for a group of muderhobos... Believe it or not, it can be a lot of fun. Certainly a lot more fun to encourage and work with their nature, than to "teach them a lesson about reality" or some shit.
Granted, I've been involved and ran a lot of drama based zero combat adventures too, and had a grand ol time with that as well, even if of another sort entirely.
But regardless of your game style, your mission as GM should never be "you're going to play my way or no way". You are the god of your world, but your subjects have free will, desires, and feelings of their own. You are creating a world for them to play in, not for yourself. Even if you have to manage an individual miscreant who is causing trouble in your paradise, it's much more entertaining for everyone involved it opens a door to a new adventure, than it is to simply slay him or otherwise "punish" him. Make him an asset, rather than a liability.
>>43823890
That's actually a good thing, it's allot of fun in my opinion.
>>43823922
But this is just faggotry.
>>43823564
Thanks, I've been waiting for someone to spoil the entirety of Undertale for me.Actually, I really have been. I have no interest in playing the game either way, and I have to cope with the memes somehow.
>>43823877
Ritual genocide is tricky. Power is not equally shared amonst the gods and they only have an indirect influence on the world now.
Also, not all gods accept human sacrifice. and depending on your tribal ancestors, you may be unable to do so without angering your ancestors (who, if angered enough can come back in spirit form)
There is an empire in the east built on slavery and human sacrifice if that is your thing. so sure its fine as you are from the right tribe and faith.
but to quote the movie Dogma: "Mass genocide is the most exhausting activity one can engage in, next to soccer."
>>43823939
>But if you wind up GM'ing for a group of muderhobos... Believe it or not, it can be a lot of fun. Certainly a lot more fun to encourage and work with their nature, than to "teach them a lesson about reality" or some shit.
The day I'll get bored of a good story is the day I die.
>But regardless of your game style, your mission as GM should never be "you're going to play my way or no way". You are the god of your world, but your subjects have free will, desires, and feelings of their own.
I do try to find a compromise. But if they want to coerce me into playing a game I don't want to play they'll have to find someone else.
>>43823962
Found the murderhobo.
>>43823832
>random NPC congratulates the party on anything
PANIC
>>43823678
Not that guy, but my players will give me a campaign I can enjoy, or I'll find new players. I do all the work, and I'm not a chairty.
>>43824011
Normally yes, murderhobos are faggots. However, if it's a good murderhobo campaign then you won't say "fuck you, you get shrekt". A good DM in my eyes, would give a challenging opponent rather than a wall.
It is acceptable if murderhoboing gets out of hand, and you can't have a normal campaign. However if it was focused around it to begin with then naw. Don't do that.
>players meet in a tavern
>there's some bard in the corner playing songs
>one of the players heckles him
>DM just gets this smug look on his face
>never mentioned again
>1 year and 40 sessions later, it turns out that guy in the guitar in the tavern was the BBEG and everything could have been avoided if the party barbarian didn't tell him to play freebird
>>43823718
Since when is Dragonborn spit corrosive? Breath weapon =/= saliva. You don't make fire-breathing dragonborns spit napalm, do you?
Also, what's stopping him from dribbling into bottles and selling it as acid for massive money?
>>43824047
As I have stated countless times already. I do not run murderhobo campaigns.
If you're a murderhobo who wants to slaughter anyone he meets, you're welcome to do so at another table.
If you want to play in my game and be a murderhobo, you can fuck right off.
>>43819257
I roll those checks behind the screen, only asking for modifiers. Keeps up the tension, keeps low the meta.
>>43824104
Well you were talking about how a murderhobo rampage should progress, so I assumed that mean't campaign.
>>43824000
>>43824000
Wait, so the gods only have an indirect effect on the world, unless they get pissed, in which case they can just pop up and kill your ass?
>>43824136
No, we weren't. I just stated my n.1 way of dealing with murderhobos: making an NPC they can't beat to justify booting them out of the group as early as possible.
And you said, correctly because you're a bitch-ass murderhobo, that you are butthurt when an unbeatable enemy kills your ass when you show your true colors.
>>43824101
He was copper, so acid breath
and we had decided at the start of the game that the acid came from saliva instead of whatever 'breath' is
we had agreed to not bottle/sell/weaponize it like that in exchange for allowing him to use it to escape bonds and chew through metal, exactly like the space marines he loves.
>>43824203
You seem tiggered.
>>43824252
>>43824252
>tiggered
POOH THIS ISN'T HONEY YOU'RE EATING BAIT
>>43823393
clearly they never played dragon's lair
>>43823525
There's a difference between that and a guy who comes down from on high for the sole purpose of casting maximized mass harm on PCs until they stop moving.
>>43824271
>>43824286
>Tiggering intensifies.gif
>>43824188
Gods cannot 'pop up' they cannot enter this world anymore.
The spirits of your ancestors can tho, so dont piss thoses guys off.
Not meant to be a 'gotcha' thing, players have full choice of their ancestors and full understanding of what that choice means.
Its mearly meant to be a different take on magic focused more on rituals and planning instead of typical venetian magic
>>43824305
There is no reason not to use an NPC with overwhelming force to remove a chaotic-evil-randumb murderhobo from your game though.
>This is a sandbox campaign.
>What do you do?
>Is there a blacksmith in town, you say? Good question. Lemme roll for that.
>Plot important question that this NPC should know the answer to? Lemme roll for that.
>Does the peasant answer yes or no to this simple question? Let's see. [rolling to see simple shit that could just be arbitrarily decided/roleplayed intensifies]
>Letting the PCs manage a town/outpost and taking out grid paper so that we can "plan" buildings and shit, never again using any of that beyond circlejerking about PC's families and acting a place where we can go ERP
>The sultry maiden gives you /that/ look and walks off into the woods, beckoning you to follow. (Especially when said by a beady-eyed neckbeard while licking his lips)
>Lemme just roll here. Yep, I'll allow it, go ahead and roll STR.
>Having everyone roll attractiveness.
>When the GM looks at you expectantly, waiting for you to do something that is obvious to them.
>Guys, I got this awesome plot, you are gonna love it.
>Are you sure you wanna do that? Okay then.
>You guys are so gonna die.
>Is that all you do?
I really hope that none of you do this.
>>43824332
Don't play with those guys then?
>>43824401
I try my best not to.
Some are good liars though.
>>43823774
>the ''what the fuck is wattle and daub'
This only works if you know your players don't know what the fuck is wattle and daub is.
>>43824337
>What do you do?
My only offense on the list. tho in my defense it usually after 10 mins of being off topic and 5 mins of recap.
>>43824337
>are you sure you wanna do that?
I do this and then put my shit eating grin on behind the screen, let them sweat, and then nothing happens.
This only works once per group, but they grow to think this is nothing out of the ordinary.
Then I do it and it's a massive fucking trap. I never kill them outright, but they'll get through into a balls to the wall encounter or get captured in a pit or wake up the Neutronium Golem several planes away that they have to seal off
>>43824337
>What do you do?
Can you explain a little bit more in detail how this is a red flag?
>>43823462
Ditto.it's d&d
>>43820065
So did the players actually get any chance to fight her, or did she just do this crap all in one round?
>>43822361
FUCKING THIS
>>43819157
>>Oh, your character can do 100+ damage at 4l? Yea, that's fine, wizards are more OP anyway.
If it is a high OP campaign, yes wizards are. Otherwise, agreed.
>>43819246
*rolls all the dice*
And, oh, look soldier, everybody dies. Want to start over?
>>43822803
I have an npc like that. Only a level ahead of the party. When someone gets a bounty he goes after them. Never tackles them head on. He'll drop fake quest hooks and lure them into really inconvenient traps. It's killed a few characters, the most memorable being them walking into an abandoned tavern. Peasants locked the door behind them and there was only a dog door large enough for the dick ass halfling. They were instructed to send the halfling out or the place would blow. Now, I did leave a few options if they bothered looking around. They turned around and started bashing the door like morons and lo and behold the place gets set on fire and the two martials make it out in time to eat arrows for lunch.
>>43824424
Ah, then
>I'm sorry, but I'm going to have to ask you to leave
>>43823678
>"murder hobo gets what he deserves" isn't much fun.
Violence and that other game... Kill Puppies for Satan, great fucking games. Neither end well. Ever.The players still have fun.
>>43819983
>Dire Beavers.
>players following the dried up rivulet find tree stumps sharpened to needle points, just jabbing up out of the earth.
>Have a Dam as a lair.
>They are functionally deforesting the immediate region to build a structure the size of a small hydroelectric dam.
>their dam constructed of tree trunks and mud, densely and expertly smashed together.
>Their teeth are like Shovel heads, their pelt luxury itself.
>Special attacks include a tail slap that can knock down everyone in an AoE, and a bite that can sunder wooden shields or weapons.
>If the players attack, they may drop logs from the upper levels, breach their own dam to create a flash flood, or even just retreat underwater into their dam, forcing the party to go swimming.
>>43824661
I do ask them that. And to justify them leaving, I have my NPC kill them in-game.
>>43823540
As long as you describe the terrain they're travelling through in a general way you dont need to describe every ambush point.
The valley leading up to the monastery is a relatively narrow road, with lots of rocky outcroppings, small bridges and switchbacks. Clumps of brown foilage and boulders dot the hillsides and trickling rivulet flows down the very bottom of it. From that the players can do what they will
Then near your ambush point/event you can ask for perception checks, and anyone that passes notices "something" to potentially cue them off. If noone passes the check then they wander their happy asses into it and then you describe where they are when the first arrow/rolling boulder happens.
>>43824323
>venetian magic
What, like Summon Gondola?
An oasis with trees.
There WILL be angry monkeys, but a treasure chest in the water.
>>43824470
This one tied in with the previous sandbox thing.
Basically it's when a GM says it and then sits there staring blankly at the party, not having thrown any plot hooks their way, or anything that needs reacting to.
Basically it's when the world only does things when the PCs do things.
A good example of this would be.
"You all meet at the Shitting Donkey, a local tavern which smells of piss and booze." At this point the players are waiting for the GM to continue, but since the latter is a fucknut, he just looks at them and says. "What do you do?" Waiting for them to create plot hooks for him to improvise off of.
Does that make sense?
>>43824337
Hey there, That Guy.
>>43825052
Yes, I see your point now. I agree with it.
>>43819018
>my wife will be playing
Not always bad, but approach with caution.
>>43825627
jesus christ this, half the time it's perfectly fine, they're just another player, but the other half is the husband coddling the wife in every way possible, if the partner is the GM, the wife will get shit handed to her on a silver platter, if it's another player, they'll white knight for her and keep her from any actual danger in the game.
>>43819018
> HOW do you open the door?
>>43825352
>That Guy
>>43819201
>annual festival of flowers
>group of investigators arrive
>that mayor is suspicious
>break into house, steal safe
>plant explosives on obvious ritual floats
>torture cultist impersonating a nun
>break open safe, find plans of world domination
>find the location on the plans
>decide its best to destroy the building
>blow it up, burning demons crawl out of fire
>finish them off with swords and magic
Town having its annual festival
>terrorists arrive. Steal mayors safe
>blow up festival floats
>torture and murder sister Flanagan
>blow up newly constructed orphanage
>slashed and murdered every child
>mayor mourns the children, begins plans for another orphanage...this time with an animal shelter.
Alternatively..
>annual festival of love and joy
>adventurers arrive
>nothing suspicious
>leave
>mayor sacrifices orphans to fuel his hell golem
>floats attach together to form an 11 point star
>summon the darkest gods avatar
>sister Flanagan becomes his vassel
>dominate world
>eternal darkness forever
>never roll a nat one for sense motive
>everyone starts running
>>43825627
This shit right here. 9/10 its fine but that one fucking time god damn i'll never let it happen again.
>DM wants to introduce his wife to DnD
>everyones kinda iffy on it
>takes our awkward attempts at telling him we're not comfortable with this as a "we're comfortable with this"
>brings her in
>shes drop dead gorgeous like shes on a night out
>2 of the less socially adept members go catatonic
>introductions made and we finally are going to get to the game
>dm stops everything
"She doesn't have a character sheet. Figured we could all help her."
>group takes 3 hours to get her set
>group members fought each other the entire time deciding exactly how her character would look to what she wore and her traits and even a trademark
>entire time she'd say maybe one thing or a small comment like "i always imagined her being short" or "i don't want her to come off as a slut"
Reasonable requests i get it but it made them go for each others throats redefining her entire character around being short or having smaller breasts.
>finally get to playing the game
>entire time for character creation she's trying to make sure her character isn't the group sexy bimbo
>first thing the dm describes is her character diddling a waitress on her lap and making out in the tavern corner
>wife giggles
>finally get out of town after an hour of them pseudo flirting and half the group jacking off under the table
>first dungeon we find we go crawling
>we're all getting our asses handed to us cept her
>she either magically lands devastating hits or the enemies miss her
>got hit once which called everyone cept me to immediately kill everything around her
>entire session she gets all the loot
>got to the point the party actually gave her some of their loot as well
>got mad at me for not wanting to give her half my shit all the time
>>43826712
>entire time dm's putting her in "sexy" or "provocative" situations and she RP's into it for "shock value"
>session ends with her jumping in his lap and giggling
>DM says sessions over and its time for us to go
Group asked later if she'd be coming back and dm thankfully said no cause she didn't enjoy it enough to sacrifice her saturday nights.
>>43826712
are there actual people out there with zero self awareness?
feels good being a NEET
>>43826789
More than you'd think which is quite terrifying.
>>43819018
>the giant immortal demigod is upset by your actions
5 times I've had people anger people of similar powerlevel.
5 times I got a "I talk shit to him and attack him" responses.
5 times a PC ended up defenestrated at the sped of sound due to this shit.
>>43826935
>defenestrated
I might know you.
>>43826935
Is that you Arnold?
Did you learn now that Hercules don't fuck with low-levels?
>>43823095
Reminds me of the K'yu stone story.
>>43827682
Not familiar with that one.
>>43824432
Well yeah but one of my players has english as their second language while the other lives in the boonies, has little interest in history and no real media connection. Its a reasonably good bet
>>43824101
Er...
Actually, my fire-breathing dragonborn spit a kind of "Greek fire" spray... It all burns off by the next turn...
>>43824045
>I do all the work
Sad but true. I wish players in general would contribute to games more.
>>43824932
Noice
>>43829412
Not sure about you but how awesome would it be to have a boat on hand 24/7.
Dealing with a pesky orc you KNOW will feed you your own spine? Summon Gandola ontop of him. Thats also a polearm for the steering stick and all the firewood you could want.
>>43819201
We had a celebratory thing that went smoothly once, had a big party thrown in our honor for clearing out a shadow infestation in a dwarves mine. There was wrestling, which included my character punching his opponent in the nads (only rule was "no killing or lasting injury") and sparring matches with fake weapons. Obviously, lots of good food and high quality booze as well, because dwarves.
>>43826789
>>43826870
Deeper than you'd think too. Some people don't have a conception of self, which isn't exactly a barrel of shrieking laughter for someone in an authority role's subjects.
>>43819018
>looks clear
>>43831425
Are you sure you're not using "lacks conception of self" when you should be using "lacks awareness of social cues?"
I mean, someone with literally no conception of self wouldn't even speak in the first person.
>>43831761
No, I'm quite sure.
>I mean, someone with literally no conception of self wouldn't even speak in the first person
Even animals communicate verbally without a sense of self.
>>43831793
Does not a dog distinguish itself from other dogs? Sure, it might be fooled by its reflection, but it's not fooled into thinking "this poodle and I are one and the same" if it's a cocker spaniel.
Then again, when I hear "conception of self," I think "the ability to regard oneself in any way as separate from others or the environment," which may not actually be what it means.
>>43824252
> What's your passive sense motive...yeah this guy seems legit to you.
Literally anything in a dungeon that looks like you could rest on it.
Do you have any idea of the sheer quantity of monsters that try and trick people into sleeping on them so they can eat them, cause let me tell you it is a lot.
> Does anyone in the party read abyssal? No, ok...the book seems to have some gibberish writing on it, you can't read it.
>>43822303
last week i was drinking stock amarula while gming for 5 hours and two of my players ended up in a dream of their past while fighting demons of themselves, i don't even know how to continue that shit but they are loving it,
I did this to players:
>This is not an encounter than your skills will help with, no amount of diplomacy can reason with him and no amount of intimidation stop him. He does not think in the same way you do, nor does he care about what will happen either way. What is going to happen here is that you all have already screwed up monumentally just to have pushed it to this point. From here on out you are on the knife's edge, one misstep and not just you, but everyone will face oblivion.
I the took out a set of cards and put them on the desk.
>Now we shall play a game, where the currency is life and nothing matters but your skill in mind games. It is called E-card. Now pick up your cars and let us begin, and let us pray the gods will have more mercy on your souls than I will.
They weren't angry. More scared.
>>43819201
I've used a festival or holiday twice in my campaign.The first time, the festival went off without a hitch and the plot hooked was completely unrelated and happened after the fact.The second time the adventure concluded before the holiday even happened. And the Holiday was actually the solution, not the problem (Ritual to bless the snowfall and kill a bunch of undead)
It's probably been mentioned already, but this happened in today's session of CoC.
After retrieving a bunch of clues, the group returns to one of the players home to go through it.
As he goes to open his door I casually ask him "how do you open the door?"
He suddenly does this whole fucking acrobatics act to open his own door to the apartment he's lived in for years.
The rest of the group asks him why and he can't really answer them.
God I love the small things.
>>43820144
Oh hey, Riddle Autist. How's it going? I mean riddles are shit in games for sure, but you're still an idiot.
>>43820144
I honestly don't get that riddle.
Is it a pun or what?
>>43833369
"there are three words in 'the english language'"
"language is the last word in 'the english language'
the riddle was shit
>>43833549
That's not a riddle, that's being a dickhead.
I can see why he got his hand cut off.
>>43833549
It's not a great riddle anyway but the phrasing of it in that example is particularly shit.
A better way to phrase the same type of dumbass gotcha style riddle would be. "Words ending in NGY are very uncommon, hungry and angry are two of them. Do you know what the third word in the english language is?" Because at least that way it is actually set out as a logic puzzle containing irrelevant information as opposed to the way it is phrased in the comic where it makes no goddamned sense.
Is it okay to curse your entire party to use as a plot device? Do you feel it restricts some of the players freedom and mobility? I Recently did this to my whole party. They decided to mess around with a cult, one thing leads to another and now everyone in the party has an aberrant living dragon mark. Thoughts /tg/?
>>43833840
If you mess around with any group, I feel, you accept potential repercussions.
In the case of a cult, one such repercussion is being cursed.
I see nothing wrong with this assuming it was the groups actions brought this about, not 1 individual or you escalating things needlessly
>This won't be a long session, I haven't done much planning
I understand that life can be hectic, but at least warn us in advance of the game. This is about having fun, and you bumbling your way through a 5 hour session with long pauses and interruptions while you convert or look stuff up just isn't fun.
We've set aside our entire evening for this. So have you. Do us, and yourself, a favor and only go through with it when you're ready. We're okay postponing if it means we actually get a fun session.
Alternatively, just stop fuckikng telling us if there's an issue. "Oh, the book doesn't say that. There's no mention in the book. I forgot to convert their stats. I didn't plan for this. I didn't plan at all. There's an encounter coming up and even though we're only two and a half hours in to a five hour session I'm going to make up an excuse about us not having enough time if we progress to find a good stopping point."
Stop telling us. Stop relying on the book for everything, or maybe read it in advance. Maybe even make some notes or put some effort in to reading from the book rather than condensing it. You've already proven that reading straight from the book sounds better than the "uhh uhm aaah like this like that you know what I'm saying" that you come up with when put on the spot.
>The woman asks you for help
It's pretty much a 50-50 chance it's gunna be a trap
>>43819018
>>43819027
These are not read flags. That is GMing properly.
>>43834364
I think the OPS red flags are ones that only apply to danger happening to your characters, not red flags of a shit game.
"The Bandit Leader promises to meet you alone."
"You hear nothing. Not even birds chirping in the trees."
Etc etc
>>43819018
The word 'Bulbous' only appears once in the 3.5 monster manual.
>>43832517
>go out and get comfy campsite photos and used or abandoned campsite photo's
>sole purpose is to give the group time to recupe and rethink in particularly hard dungeons and area's cause they tend not to do that ever and die
>entire time are convinced its a trap
>Burned to the ground campsites of previous adventurers
>even got so paranoid at the quantity (15) they decide even the inns aren't safe
>burn those down too
-sniff- n-no...its okay g-guys. Its n-not like i w-wanted you to know i p-put in work and w-was thinking about y-you.....
>>43823455
I've been doing my best to play along with them, and work and play around it, but they do make it difficult sometimes because like I said, none of us have ever played before. I'm alright at improvising but one of them in particular does his best to just downright derail sometimes.
Last time the were wandering around town looking around, which is fine, but not really talking to anyone, so I start dropping hints which they ignore on purpose, eventually one of them trys to fuck a sheep owned by some farmer bringing his animals to sell in town, so I let him do it so I can arrest him and bring him before the Lord of the town (quest giver). Then he gets offered to be left off the hook if he does quest. Not exactly that, but generally that.
>>43837779
Should just make quests with consequences.
"Theres talk of a mysterious force gath"-
Ignored
"Undead have been see"-
Ignored
"Towns have been dis"-
Ignore
"Theres been odd happenigs in the local"-
Ignored
"You're undead attack by an endless army of undead tagteaming with around 30 dragons."
If they bitch tell them you gave them tons of hints that they refused to go with so the lich achieved his goals cause he was ignored.
>>43837836
Reminds me of that story where the party got side-tracked trying to get marriage equality in a kingdom that they ended up obliterated by the BBEG because they didn't stop him.
>>43833840
as long as they're aware that ignoring the curse in order to go sidequest or something like that will have consequences, sure, go ahead
it's their own fault if they choose to ignore the more pressing issue, and as >>43834013 said, mess with certain groups, potential repercussions may happen
>>43831854
>Does not a dog distinguish itself from other dogs?
Sure, if it's old enough and smart enough. Does that mean the dog can percieve events through the perspective of others? For some breeds maybe, for others not, and likely not for wild dogs or wolves. Same with humans.
Now look at meerkats. They have an entire language, and nothing indicating a concept of self.
>>43834150
I love this, the fact that a GM hasn't prepared is exactly what makes for a long session. Not just literally but in the individual units of boredom as well.
>but we can just go through what stuff I have prepared and then leave it at that!
You want us to go through all the setup and rigmarole of preparing an RP session for just a few hours of play? No, that's inconsiderate. There's no point in putting on your bike leathers to do one round of the local grange and no-one's putting the effort into a game without a payoff.
>Are you opening the door with your right hand or your left hand?
last nighy my dm kept asking random players "heads or tails" and once someone got it an earthquake happened in the town we were in, so we're gonna have to keep an eye out for those pesky coin flips from now on
>>43839265
Damn, I'm sure I had an image of this saved someplace.
>There is a 10 foot tall statue in this room.
>>43839514
Wolves are the smartest breed you know. They can form impromptu tactical formations for hunting that can evolve based entirely of sounds on the otherside of the hill telling them the other wolves fucked up or changed tactics midgame no real communication needed.
>>43839804
Smartest don't figure into it. The GM in the original example that spawned this discussion is probably well above average in intelligence for instance, but their mentalising ability is low.
>>43833311
epic /v/ meme dude
>>43820144
I love games like this; mathematical challenges, shape rotation, word games, logic puzzles and so on. It's always so disappointing when the DM makes an overly simple one or when they reuse a famous one.
>You see three columns of-
>Tower of Hanoi, got it.
>>43820144
I've made a fun riddle door once.
It was just a talking door that had the following riddle:
>What is, but never will be, supersede existence but still is liquid, move the conscious while being gaseous?
The door sometimes misquoted the riddle, sometimes remembered it right.The door was actually open the whole time.
It took them a while to get trough, but thankfully, it was just a bonus room, so they didn't need to.
>>43825052
I do that.
My players still like my game because it's got this weird persistent crossover thing going on.
Or they did, I guess.
Haven't played in a month or so, I've retired into cooking, sleeping and doing nothing all day.
>>43844335
Best thing to do if they ever actually try the door.
"Ok.... What hand do you use?"
Just watch them sweat and take back the action then roll behind screen to increase tension.
>>43839265
here you go.
>>43839703
>You enter a hallway lined with statues. At the far end is a door.
GEE, I WONDER WHAT'S GOING TO FUCKING HAPPEN
>>43844628
Surely you can counter that by saying "What side of the door's the handle?"
>>43844945
"do you turn the handle clockwise or counter clockwise?"
>This room features a large pool of water...
>>43822361
Don't worry, anon, we all do this. Players do not need to know that perceived danger is not the actual dangerAnd then you legit sic a murderthing at them
>>43819018
>Your character has no reason to believe he's lying.
>>43845333
Now THAT'S next level - and trips confirm!
>>43823074
>Every GM worth his salt his this That DM trait that only absolute scribe need
How about you 1)talk to the players or 2) run a bank heist campaign? Does conflict of any sort trigger you?
>>43819180
anyone from /k/ would say "I wouldn't worry about That" is a red flag. More so from how often that creepypasta gets posted.
>>43843758
Well in my case it was a riddle the GM wrote, and all the players agreed it made no sense.
>A blade is my worst enemy.
>When put to work, I am yearned for.
There were a couple other lines I forgot, but none of them helped narrow it down, and I'm going to tell you the answer anyway. It's fingers.
Apparently that second line means "when [you are] put to work [with your fingers cut off], I am yearned for", and the GM expected us to just intuitively fill in the gaps without even knowing there were gaps.
As for the first line, I wouldn't say a blade is a finger's *worst* enemy since a blade cuts many things and fingers can be hurt in many ways. The connection is so vague, you could only guess it was a body part at best.
>>43833369
>>43833549
>>43833579
>>43833670
"There are three words in the english language that end with gry".
Because he continued to say "that end with gry", it invalidates the answer and logic of his riddle.
None of these three words end with gry, and "language" doesn't answer the context of his question.
This is pretty typical of XKCD's work, he's always attacking some strawman with his "lol violent" stick figure stand-in.
>>43850993
Mmm, I've enjoyed some of Randall's work before but I can't say it isn't clueless and or pretentious at times.
>>43819018
I fooled my players once with a cavern ceiling that was higher than their light radius. Never again though.
My players also become intensely paranoid the moment they come across writing that they can't read.
>>43843758
>mathematical challenges
>You see a series of numbers and letters preceded by what appear to be three elongated Ss
>Elongated Ss?
>Yes, here's a picture:∭
Almost strangled that DM.
Doors. Doors everywhere. All styles and colors. Big or small. No rhyme or reason.
Ex:
>dming for 3rd time
>dming for my friends group
>3 plus buddy
>apparently friend has been telling stories about how i seem nice but an secretly cruel and malicious
>entire time if i went into too much detail they'd treat it as some enormously elaborate trap
>them finding out its not a trap just puts them more on edge
>entire time RP goes from actual decent character based RP to acrobatics and drama crossing the cobblestone streets
>then comes the door
>they're to meet their contact at a back alley
"you walk down the dingy alley. What light filters through the myriad of clotheslines and rotting clothes only serves to accentuate the dirt and grime."
>by now i know if i go into detail they at least pay attention and take note of things
"As you turn the corner in this oddly labyrinthine back alley you spot a door. Its double wide and could fit 3 men abreast. Absolutely immaculate despite the dirt clinging to every other surface. Its colored a bright red near the exact color of a perfect ruby. Its trimmed in bronze gold with 2 perfectly spherical knobs to match."
>they immediately stop and run away
>no explanation or IC pretense
>spend the next 3 hours trying to convince through various means for random people to open the door for them while they remain as far away as possible
>a week ingame has gone by already
>finally they up and kidnap a kid
>prod the kid forward with a 20 foot pole
>finally get to the corner and tell the kid to open the door to go home
>kid opens the door
>the players get a brief glimpse of a room full to the brim with gold before the door shuts and disappears with the kid
Since that point i put doors in random areas for them to find or notice. Tiny doors in elegantly carved steins to giant impossible to open doors out in the open. No one else sees these door but them. Most are absolute death traps or just swing open like normal doors and thats it.
>>43844917
The door is a mimic.
>>43853182
They checked a door once hoping for that gold room but instead got a wave of undead that luckily was located at the bottom of a ravine. Never opened doors after that. If they see a door, something door-like, or hear the word they immediately run. had to actually omit the entire concept from my narrative or they'd stop everything and hightail it. If i said an NPC walked through the kitchen door they'd either murder him or run. If i dm i'll occasionally throw in a door just for shits and giggles no matter the setting in perfectly ordinary circumstances just to watch them freak out. Other than that one campaign doors have never nor will ever hurt them.
