What is the worst Space Marine Legion and why is it Salamanders?
That's a funny way of spelling best
Salamanders are boring as fuck. Yes they haven't been ruined by shits like Ward and Goto, but they haven't been elevated by greats like McNeil and Abnett either.
>>43640821
Iron Hands and White Scars are just as bad (boring).
>>43640755
One vote for Space Wolves
>>43640967
Make it two
>>43640755
WE WUZ PERPETUALS AND SHIT!
>>43640967
>Space wolves
>there are actually wolves
Why...
Moving my polls to this thread.
http://strawpoll.me/5930460/
http://strawpoll.me/5930460/
This time also with favorite 40k faction poll (based on the army list on GW's website.)
http://strawpoll.me/5992841
Iron Warriors because they are literally autistic, plus the fandom is quite obnoxious
>Dark Angels
Fite me.
Seriously, why don't we have a poll set up for these on going threads?
I don't like the Blood Angels I think the whole thing is stupid. It seems like it's everybody's first Space Marine army so they don't play Ultramarines.
>>43640755
Lamented get off my board
>>43640755
Because Nick Kyme is the only one who ever writes mainstream releases about them and he is fucking atrocious.
There are a pair of Salamanders stories in Meduson, both written by Guy Haley and they're so much better and do so much more to show how the Heresy has affected the Salamanders beyond the 'Vulkan Lives!" crap. It's a huge shame that other authors don't take them on besides the occasional side character.
>>43640755
That's a funny way of spelling Imperial Fists.
>>43640967
wolf wolf wolf wolf wolf
>>43641624
>Because Nick Kyme is the only one who ever writes mainstream releases about them and he is fucking atrocious.
This so much, he is the worst writer working for BL. The last one NK novel I read some marines were looking for a glass fragment of the emperor's force lightning, which I think as an idea is cool as fuck, but he managed to make it the most boring slog imaginable.
Also the fact they are fucking blackface marines never fails to make me laugh. Wasn't that written in late 3rd/4th edition? I remember for a long time before that thinking they were just black dudes. It's hilarious that the only canon black characters with a model in 40k are actually white.
>>43642247
As far as I'm concerned, Salamanders and the people of Nocturne are predominantly of African descent. They still have the pigmentation flaw in their geneseed, but have African facial features. The blackface thing is just such a stupid asspull.
>>43640935
Read Scars and Brotherhood of the Storm.
If you don't like them after that, that's cool, but White Scars are not even remotely boring in those books.
>>43642247
Kyme may be bad, but he's not the worst. Goto gets that award. Shit, at least kymes dwarf books were alright(unless I'm wrong and thinking of another author)
>>43640979
three for space wolves
>>43642247
>>43642307
Frankly, I think the primarch racial traits are a joke. There would probably be a mixture of races in each legion.
I've always imagined vulkan as a legitimate black man however.
>>43642338
>Kyme may be bad, but he's not the worst. Goto gets that award.
I've not read Goto. Kyme isn't offensively bad, but so so boring and bland.
>>43642349
Oh, I agree, but I can understand how some planets could have a dominant race based on cultural colonization. It's why I said "predominantly" in my post because, even of Nocturne was heavily African, there's probably people of European or Asian descent there as well, of whom likely have the same chance of becoming Salamanders as anyone else.
Hell, "realistically" the majority of humanity would probably be heavily mixed-race, especially that far into the future.
>>43642369
Read some Goto(actually read reviews of his "books"). Kymes a great writer in comparison. Hes still not that great though, just not the worst lol
>>43642333
Preferably in the opposite order.
>>43642247
>>43642307
As someone who didn't get into 40k into 5th edition, but has fully read pretty much every piece of lore that's been written, I find the old African look to be horrendously stupid and much prefer their coal black skin and glowing red eyes. Making a big deal about, "We made these guys African because we needed a black guy!" is so much worse than actually having a interesting mutation, like the Raven Guard.
>>43642338
Goto hasn't written a word for Black Library in 7 years. No one gives a fuck about him and it's pointless to hold him up as, "No! He's not as bad as Goto!"
>>43642462
>I find the old African look to be horrendously stupid
What? All the eavy metal models of them were just painted as black guys, they didn't have any african tribal trappings or anything.
>>43640755
That's not how you spell Stormcast Eternals.
>>43642419
Plenty of the legions are mixed race, Salamanders included. It's the process of becoming a marine that tends to standardize their features. It's the whole, "True Sons" of the Luna Wolves, or the black hair and pale skin of the Raven Guard or the hair and fangs of the Space Wolves. The Salamanders are no different. Not to mention, the majority of legions recruited from multiple worlds. The Salamanders just had all recruits brought to Nocturne as part of their traditions of joining the legion. This exposes them to Nocturne's sun, which triggers the red eyes and coal skin.
>blackface
why.jpg
Dark Angels are the worst tho.
>>43642247
>>43642624
Dark Angels conquered the largest amount of planets after the Luna Wolves.
>>43642700
They're total fags with the unforgiven emocutting.
>>43642700
Except their own.
>>43642247>>43642307
>>43642349
>>43642419
I always took it as some sort of DAoT project where they gave them high Melonie or whatever to make them more resistant to the high radiation of noctourne
>>43640967
>wolfback riding
How much a Space Marine weight?
>>43642809
It's a very big, mutated wolf.
>>43642861
>>43642861
It's a mutated dude, hence the whole 'no wolves on Fenris' thing.
>>43642462
>It's stupid to have racial variety in a setting where people come from desert planets and ice planets and jungle planets
>only white people and drow are allowed
>>43642883
You what
>>43642902
Tallarners are Semitic and Vostroyans are Slavs.
>>43642950
THE WOLVES ARE PEOPLE. PEOPLEEEEEEEE!!!!!!
>>43641030
Obviously, because they're not on Fenris ...
>>43642950
The wolves of Fenris are actually Space Marines, specifically Space Wolves, whose gene seed has gone completely bad and turned them into quadrupedal man-wolves.
So they're failed Marines who mutated.
>>43642950
> There are no wolves on Fenris
It's theorised that when humanity first colonised Fenris during the DAoT (Anywhere between 10,000 and 25,000 ad) the original settlers couldn't keep up with the cold, so they experimented on their own genetics to develop a resistance.
Fucking about with genetics is rarely a good thing and some of the newborn were devolved monsters. Cue a few thousand years of evolution and the people don't remember the real origins anymore, only that there are unnaturally big and intelligent xeno-ish mammals that look a bit wolfy.
It's the Canis Helix and why Space Wolves can only recruit from Fenrisians- they literally have a different genetic makeup to normal humans.
It's also why Wulfen are a thing, as they devolve as the original settlers did.
>>43642809
1 to 1,5 tons
>>43642999
>failed Marines
Failed? Or Super-Wolfen???
>>43642953
Nah, they'll both be albinos or mutants by the time GW is done with them. They just haven't been updated in forever.
>>43643102
Yes.
>>43643063
Ignoring the fact that that makes no sense.
Why weren't they purged for being filthy mutants?
>>43640755
Are those combi boltguns?
>>43643161
Predates the imperium.
>>43643161
> Space Wolves ever answering for their hypocrisy
>>43643172
Autocannons
>>43642902
Congrats are completely missing the point of what I was saying. I said that any legion can be multi-racial since almost all of them recruited from multiple worlds. The physical traits of a recruit prior to implantation may be nothing at all how they appear as fully grown marines. For fuck's sake the Blood Angels recruit from mutant stock! What we see of the marines is the result of their geneseed acting upon them. You want black guys in your Raven Guard? Sure, but the geneseed gave them pale skin and black eyes and probably fucked with a few other features as well. You want black guys in your Salamanders? Sure, but the geneseed turned their skin hard as rock and made their eyes glow.
>>43643204
look just above the autocannon, it looks like a boltgun
>>43642700
DA had a head start too.
>>43643255
>For fuck's sake the Blood Angels recruit from mutant stock
The blood angels recruit from a desert planet of white people.
>What we see of the marines is the result of their geneseed acting upon them.
That must be why they're described with different physical and racial features all the time in the books. Hell, SCARS talks about the comparison between the mongolian white scars and the terran ones constantly.
> Sure, but the geneseed gave them pale skin and black eyes and probably fucked with a few other features as well. You want black guys in your Salamanders? Sure, but the geneseed turned their skin hard as rock and made their eyes glow.
That explains why the galaxy has literally nothing but white people, because geneseed. Ignoring the fact that it's plainly untrue, it must be true.
>>43643260
I do believe those are scratchbuilt.
They are bolters repurposed as targeters.
GE, you still post art on tgchan? You ever finish that picture of Curze with the inlaid negative silhouettes?
>>43640755
Space Wolves are the worst Legion. They also have the worst Primarch.
Legion would be alright but WOLFWOLFWOLFWOLFWOLFWOLFWOLF. Seriously, is it so hard to drop a few Low Gothic'd up Norse words for something instead of a WOLFgun?
Russ would be redeemable if he ever won a fight to earn his title and ego instead of being a huge bag of hot air. The two missing Primarchs don't count as we have no context for their deaths. With the sole exception of Magnus, Russ loses, or stalemates, every fight against another Primarch.
>>43643438
nope. I write
>>43643481
Don't forget all the hypocrisy
>>43643438
Those aren't scratch built, It's Forgeworld. That's just the handle for the Autocannons, they don't fit with the usual Heavy Weapons style arms, they fit to Bolter style arms, hence the mostly bolter shaped handle.
>>43643499
Sadness.
Write what?
>>43643521
Hmm, alright.
>>43643538
lotsa stories don't feel like plugging
>>43643514
It's douchey in-universe, like Erebus, but I'm willing to accept it as a trait of their Legion. It's the WOLFing that turns me off of them conceptually.
>>43643560
Time to hunt.
>>43643481
Same with Blood Angels and Salamanders
>BLOOD BLOOD BLOOD
>FIRE FLAME FIRE FLAME FIRE
>>43642499
Go away, Goto. Everyone knows you're shit.
>>43643590
Blood Angels don't ride BLOOD Predators with special BLOOD engines that make them faster so they can get in range for their BLOODcannons.
I'm not saying they don't go overboard with using their theme for naming, but at least they use more than one word.
>>43641624
>>43642247
Some of Kyme's shit is at least decent, Gav Thorpe is actually the worst.
>>43643438
>doesn't know anything about FW
>thinks they're scratchbuilt
>but somehow knows about some faggot namefag's shitty Curzeshit
Is this fucking nigger serious. Get the fuck out you cancerous piece of shit.
>>43643388
There was A black trooper in the Valhalla regiment Caiphas was attached too. Came from a whole planet of them.
>>43643161
Because the Inquisition will never mess with the abnormal practices of certain chapters. That goes double when applied to the Space Wolves.
>>43643854
Well, yes, because then they'd be Khornates. Though even Khornates toss in SKULL and Brass, so, compared to Wolfwolfwolfwolfwolf, the World Eaters are practically high culture.
So if you can't have Space Wolves successor chapters due to only Fenrisians being compatible with the gene seed, how did the legion get created on earth?
>>43641198
Nah, only their papa is. They get a mild douse.
>fandom
It's very amusing to watch IW and IF fans sperg out. Just like Pert and Dorn.
>>43644091
I actually just read that part yesterday. She was born and raised on Valhalla but they speculated that her ancestors might've immigrated there a generation or two back since it was somewhat uncommon on Valhalla but not unheard of.
Honestly, the whole discussion about race and 40k comes down to a little more effort could be made on the part of the painters to include more varied examples. The actual books seem to be a fair bit more diverse as far as bringing up racial diversity among forces compared to the actual painted miniatures.
Yeah, painting different races on models is more effort sure but if someone is painting up some shit that's gonna be printed in a codex then add "a bit more color" you know what I'm saying?
>also how the fuck has no one mentioned my battle brother Jonah Orion already?
>>43644334
I was just thinking about that. I don't remember anything about wulfen before Russ was found. I also highly doubt that the natives wove the canis helix into themselves, maybe something similar though.
>>43644334
Something something The Emperor something something geneseed remnants from the Primarch creation project.
Note that Space Wolves, Salamanders and Alpha Legion geneseed was developped separately.
>>43642659
inb4 kfc
>>43642700
What is that even supposed to prove? That they're good at fighting? There's a lot a Legion should do aside from being good at fighting. The World Eaters were good at fighting. The Emperor's Children were good at fighting and very well organized - if they were as large as the First Legion, they'd probably be better than them in every respect.
>>43644648
In 30k, out of question, how do those legions perform on the Tabletop?
>>43644334
I've been asking myself the same thing since I realised FW will have to make an explanation of some sort.
I also can't remember any Terran Space Wolves being mentioned in the HH series.
>>43642307
You do realize that all Space Marines are of African decent, right?
Humanity kind of started there.
>>43644954
You do realise that all Africans are of maritime descent, right?
Life kind of started there.
>>43640967
The new wolves piss me off so much. I started collecting them in 2010 when they were badass space vikings, now they're shitty space furries.
Smh senpai
>>43644954
What a redundant comment, thank you.
>>43645070
What the hell. I typed f a m and its corrected itself to that gay senpai shit. I was wondering why everyone on every other board was saying that
>>43643161
How many people know that?
>>43645172
Smh desu senpai
>>43642349
My headcanon is that all the Primarchs inherited some of the Emperors ability to change their apperance, but it was a passive ability which only activated to match the culture and characteristics of the planets they landed.
>>43641030
Because hurdur wolf legion.
>>43645070
You do realize that in 2010 space wolves were already space furries?
>>43645056
I knew there was something fishy about those space wolves...
>>43644394
They have some cool bits, like the liking to shoot point blank rather than taking out a knife or refusing to allow mutation to spread by replacing mutated bits with cyber stuff.
It's not so fun to see them go at each other after a while, especially when it ends up being an IW circle jerk where everyone patc each other on the back, even derailing the thread with no reason like it happened in a 40krp general, like they don't get enough masturbatory threads to shit up.
Black Templar's because they are literally retarded.
Everyone at GW seems to think that the only reasonable characterization for crusaders is for them to be monged out autists who think every problem should be solved by throwing wave after wave of your own highly difficult to recruit and train men at the problem.
They used to be one of my favorite chapters but the recent fluff has been dire.
>>43641005
No.
>>43645433
>Black Templar's
>Legion
>>43645477
Whatever. They're still retarded and I hate them.
>>43645329
The thing you described happened to Ferrus Manus after he arrived to Medusa, it's in Angel Exterminatus.
>>43642659
I'm dying, anon. Hahahahah holy shieeet
>>43645329
But then why was Lorgar the one who ended up most looking like the big E?
>Muh no wolves on Fenris.
How did Leman Russ get raised by Thunderwolves if Thunderwolves are supposedly space marines?
>>43645353
>It's not so fun to see them go at each other after a while, especially when it ends up being an IW circle jerk where everyone patc each other on the back, even derailing the thread with no reason like it happened in a 40krp general, like they don't get enough masturbatory threads to shit up.
IF is my favorite loyalist legion but every time I see an IW thread I just go full "favorite 'traitor' legion" until shit thread consumes itself and dies.
>tfw gotta smash cities instead of playing with lego
>hazard stripes are c-cool rite guys?
>muh daVinci! muh misunderstood genius!
>boy, I sure do hate IF even if they're better
>imagine if we'd only had 10% more troops...
>Iron cage totally makes up for our shitty conduct during the crusade right?
>>43640755
Ultramarines, they're almost literally place-holders for actually interesting doods. Even deeply flawed premises(space wolves) are better than the sin of being boring.
>>43640821
>McNeil
>Great
Anon I suggest you read something other than the Black Library for once, or even just another author. McNeil is an incompetent hack who can't write humans for shit.
>>43642247
They aren't blackface anon. The people of Nocturne (besides those weird albinos) look African and have deep tans thanks to the scorching sun. It's just when they become a Neophyte, their skin color turns jet black as opposed to being brown.
>>43644648
The Dark Angels are important because they were the literal first Legion. They were the testbed for every other Legion, hence them specializing in basically everything from void warfare, bike spam, and massive tank formations. The reason why the Dark Angels are so good is because you can turn to them and get the traits of most other legions.
It's why they were previously tied for the title of most powerful legion with the Ultramarines, they were fucking huge and could adapt to virtually any threat. The only reason why they sunk was a combination of sacrificing themselves late in the Great Crusade against a great Xenos invasion and Caliban turning out to be a slumbering daemon world.
>>43644091
The Vitrians from Gaunt's Ghosts are also predominantly black.
>>43646289
Caliban was a daemon world? It's fairly close to the Eye of Terror, but still a little far for that. And the DA spent a lot of time protecting the wreckage of it during the 13th Black Crusade.
I'm not saying they aren't important - they're actually a personal favorite - but they're not the best. And besides, it's the Luna Wolves/Sons of Horus that deserve the title of best legion. They did the most conquering and had the most successes - those just got more or less written out of later Imperial history because they were traitors.
>>43640755
>worst legion
>not word bearers
>>43643161
The Emperor knew and he allow it, so fuck everyone else who disagrees with his decision.
>>43645700
It's now that you realise that most of the things /tg/ says about the SW come from made up shit of congetures from other butthurt anons.
Simply /tg/ cannot be objective about SW so you'll do good in just ignore and avoid any SW releated threads.
I'm not going to be mean anymore about other peoples favourite legions. Instead i'm going to say something nice to one that I was mean to before.
Emperor's Children, you all have really nice hair and should never shave or crop it like most of us other legions do.
>>43640755
I thought it was Scyther
>>43644091
>>43644506
>>43646308
There's plenty of black characters in BL but in terms of dudes with models there's nothing but blackface marines.
>>43645776
Abnett did a pretty great job with them in Know No Fear.
>>43643903
>Gav Thorpe
I'd forgotten about him, yeah, he's fucking awful. Doesn't make Kyme any better though.
Did I hallucinate this or did Sallies have I3 in their first chapter approved rules?
>>43648941
They first came out in armageddon.
And yea, they were slow. Chaplains got Thunder Hammers for free. Only 0-1 for fast stuff. Artificer armour on sergeants.
They were neat. Also space negros instead of being actually pitch black which is the dumbs.
>>43647237
There was a greater daemon of nurgle/unaligned living inside of it and the planet corrupted everything that lived on it. Originally the taint purely existed in the beasts of Caliban, but when the Lion killed them all the taint instead flowed into the people itself.
Also, the Luna Wolves never conquered the most worlds. The Ultramarines basically solo'd the galactic south-east.
>>43648941
correct
>>43640755
They are not the worst, just the "good guy" or the seems like a really cool guy meme from Kharn.
I feel like they are the most human and more akin to the every mans marine.
The flame motif on their armour never looked good to me.
Space Wolves are the worst. Hypocricy regarding mutations, Russ being a shit Primarch, and wolfwolfwolf-furrfaggotry.
Dark Angels are pretty shit in 40k; they don't do anything other than chasing down "Fallen" and have wasted 10 000 years failing at doing this. Such a stupid gimmick.
>>43643255
dude this is racist if you interpret GW fluff about geneseed as any thing to do with reproduction and racial expression then your fucking racist and just the same as some one who takes imperial guard stuff to extream and thinks they are SA or some Yugoslav fascist shit. dude fuck you seriously. this is a game and you realize the closet modernday equivalent to geneseed is taking hormones and people of all races take roids and estrogen and don't turn into your fucked up fantasy reality of pure race.. it doesn't matter if the artist prefer british faces the fluff clearly clearly indicates racial divercity at many times and obviouse I think the only reason they don't make them portrayed as a black male is the artists are shy on the subject and that might speak volumes around racial problems in the UK but the artists are prob chill ass guys at the end of the day and just scared.
get real using 3rd party black heads on salamanders or painting a head to highlight it in that way in a nice way should be encourage and if I ever do SM im theaming them on Ureal Torniment Era Green SM guy with beret because salamanders are mostly black if not all. and yes I might theam them around a china owned plantation or oil or metal mine in Africa and I might theam them around strange economics and shit my friend who works in ganda says about the culture there atm and I might theam some mutated ones around ebola in a tasteful scifi way but im not racist but you are.
>>43644611
dude fuk you
>>43651499
>dude this is racist
Wow,
No one fucking cares
I guess the one that bores me the most is Imperial Fist.
>>43645700
No no No the wolves are a human mutation and genetic engineering error when I spaced wolf fails and becomes a wolf man it is similar but not identical
>>43649035
Honestly that lore for Caliban sounds kind of shitty. The beasts of caliban could have easily been explained by proximity to the Eye of Terror affecting the locals - it could have even been an ironic similarity to Fenris and their 'lack of wolves.'
Though it does cast some confusing doubts on the Fallen - were they tainted already, and the Lion could somehow sense it and tried to keep the non-Terran marines at arms length? Were they always going to betray the Lion, no matter what he did, instead of just being victims to the autist's ego?
>>43651751
The wolf mutation does speed up the process of making a Space Marine because they grow stronger at a raped rate.
>>43651779
*rapid rate
Thanks for raping my post, autocorrect.
>>43645491
BT are a ship boarding oriented space faring chapter, what the fuck do you expect to do in a ship engagement? Launch the titans?
>>43651499
fuck off sjw, preach to people who don't work for a living
>>43642902
>Celestial Lions, White Scars, Tallarn Desert Raiders
>countless BL characters, including whole planets and IG regiments
There is plenty of diversity in 40k.
>>43651838
>Launch the titans?
That's what Gundam and Macross do.
>>43640755
>worst Space Marine Legion
>Salamanders
You mean Space Wolves. Or Dark Angels if SW lore would be fixed and cleansed of faggotry.
>>43652099
DA legion was pretty badass though. Bunch of black armored swordsmen knights.
>>43652114
DA theme is to be useless team-killing faggots.
>>43652175
That's 40k. We're talking about legions.
>>43652204
Remind me what DA did during Horus Heresy.
>>43641030
Because the codices are, without exception, written by retarded fucking man-children.
>>43651499
>>43641030
Some writers are furfags
>>43640755
Your favorite legion is always the worst legion OP.
>>43652212
Saved the entire Imperium?
Conquered the third most worlds?
>>43640967
agree
