Modern is cool now, we have Eldrazi edition
Reposting, I wrote a few lengthy posts about my thoughts on the deck and the key card Fold Into Aether here:
>>44685329
>>44685564
Considering making a UR decklist with two Gut Shots in it for surprisingly usable removal and turn 4 instant emmy into untap on turn 5.
>>44685968
So, tier 2 edition?
>>44686023
>>44685564
>Of course, Twin has a large advantage over both in that it outside of these interactions it is an on the spot win.
No, Twin has an advantage because it has a wincon that doesn't revolve around putting a flying fatty on the board and praying for no removal.
Your wincon is literally cheat out Emrakul and just hope you win from there. You have literally no other plan if that doesn't work. That isn't a combo, thats just Timmy. At least Goryo can win the turn Emmy goes down
>>44686023
>Fold into Aether doesn't say counter target creature spell
Holy shit, I've been reading this card wrong the entire time.
It's suddenly so much better when you don't need to play loads of cheap useless creatures in your deck.
I hope they don't touch amulet bloom
It's a fair deck and people just don't like adapting to it
>>44686159
I hope they ban bloombecause I already traded it all away in fear of an upcoming ban.
>>44686131
>No, Twin has an advantage because it has a wincon that doesn't revolve around putting a flying fatty on the board and praying for no removal.
Really now? The only 'Alternate Wincon' in a twin list is beatdowns with 1 to 3 power creatures and the good old 'Bolt Snap Bolt'.
If you run the deck as just UR twin with a slightly slower, more resilient combo then you see that Fold is really more of a sidegrade to twin lists for use in slower, more hate heavy metas.
Also
>Emrakul
>Removal
Show me all the spells used in modern that effecively deal with a creature that has "Protection from colored spells".
The Emrakul is honestly a placeholder card of "Any big resilient and game winning fatty of your choice". Stick in Progenitus, Stick in Iona, fucking jam a Grislebrand there if you love cards. Point is that Fold is comparable to twin in that it's a turn 4+ combo piece that gets gamewinning advantage.
>Your wincon is literally cheat out Emrakul and just hope you win from there.
The decklist I posted is just my first thoughts on a more all-in style use of the card. It can fit easily in a huge variety of builds.
And returning to this point for some memetext
>>Twin has an advantage because it has a wincon that doesn't revolve around putting a flying fatty on the board and praying for no removal.
>>doesn't revolve around putting a flyer on the board and praying for no removal.
>Twin
>Not EXACTLY putting a creature and enchantment on the board and hoping for no removal.
Dumbass
>>44686023
>>44686131
>>44686239
Consider Peek. It's a non-free Gitaxian Probe, but it is instant speed. Sure, it is one turn slower, but it enables a more reliable EOT 5 "flash" Emrakul.
It does however suffer from being far less reliable than twin in its current iteration.
Twin runs 4-6 of one combo piece (untap creatures), and 3-4 (mostly 4) of the second.
This one runs 2 emrakuls and 4 of the fold.
The deck has an advantage when it comes to losing to removal (in that it flat out doesn't), but it's also far weaker to counterspells (having your original spell countered when you try to fold it.) Also, twin never really has to go all in, and can sit back with their creatures.
>>44686239
>Really now? The only 'Alternate Wincon' in a twin list is beatdowns with 1 to 3 power creatures and the good old 'Bolt Snap Bolt
What are you talking about? Twin wins without combo all the time, and sides out the combo in around half of it's matchups. Your deck has literally none of those alternate conditions or even the means to defend itself let alone win when you can't get Emrakul in hand.
Saying that this deck has anything to do with UR Twin just shows you don't understand how UR Twin plays beyond yolo Twining T4. Fold doesn't create a winnable game or even an advantage any more than Living End does, and requires insane amounts of hand sculpting. You literally have no way to win the game if you can't straight up draw Emrakul and perfectly execute your sculpted hand with zero disruption.
Jamming Twin down on T4 with a prayer for no removal is how Twin LOSES. The combo is essentially delayed past T5-T6 just to ensure you're packing enough defense to secure Splinter Twin.
>l2Combo
>>44686025
Wrong thread, I know but I want to make an EDH around him
>>44686346
Stop yourself.
Think for a second.
Take UR Twin.
Swap Twin cards for 4 Fold, 2 Emmy.
Add some more removal or goodstuff.
Oh hey look it's ALMOST EXACTLY LIKE TWIN, WIN WITH OR WITHOUT COMBO AND ALL.
The Esper decklist was just an experiment because Fold doesn't require red AT ALL. You can run it with red, you can run it fucking bant if you want, the only requirement is that you have blue mana, fold, any spell and a creature you want to crap on the field for cheap.
>>44686023
Manlands + Proteus Staff is a better deck idea than Fold into Aether, and even that is downright janky.
>>44686346
>Saying that this deck has anything to do with UR Twin just shows you don't understand how UR Twin plays beyond yolo Twining T4.
Anon, he's saying that you can build the decks so similarly that the only comparison needed between the two is the actual combo itself, the rest can be the same UR list you already know, love and win with.
>>44686349
>>44686217
I hope they ban Bloombecause I want a Summer Bloom for my green EDH but don't feel like spending that much on an uncommon
>>44686409
>>44686384
Swap 6 cards with tapdown that swing and block Zoo all-stars for a dead fatty in your hand/deck. And an enchantment that accelerates a beatdown battle/makes Snaps go crazy for a counterspell that actively helps your opponent when you cast it. Swap out the control sideboard for a pile of random hate. True genius there. The twin combo pieces are so resilient because they are either easily sided out, or actively help with the alternate wincons. The Fold "pieces" do literally nothing outside of getting the combo off.
>>44686407
>An AT LEAST 7 mana, sorcery speed interaction that requires you to run no other creatures but your fatties and to not draw them is better than a 4/5 mana instant speed interaction that lets you still run good stuff like Snapcasters.
Dude c'mon, stop shitposting.
>>44686497
>Swap out the control sideboard for a pile of random hate.
Then run a better sideboard?
A deck list isn't gospel anon, you can always change it to what you need or how you think a deck should be made. Just because his deck wasn't 100% perfectly tuned doesn't mean that Fold ISN'T a card that can slip incredibly easily into most shells that the Twin combo also fits in. The objective fact here doesn't change. Fold is a Twin alternative for when you want to be less fucked by potential removal.
>>44686497
>>The twin combo pieces are so resilient because they are either easily sided out, or actively help with the alternate wincons.
>Twin
>Resilient
Except Twin has to wait to Twin later in the game for backup so they don't get hit my a counterspell, creature removal OR enchantment removal. The actual COMBO of those two cards can be ruined by three avenues of hate.
>or actively help with the alternate wincons.
That's a fair point, but that anon did actually point that out in >>44685564 just after he said Splinter Twin was somewhat 'useless'.
>>44686497
>The Fold "pieces" do literally nothing outside of getting the combo off.
Except that's wrong? One of the three pieces can be almost any spell in the game and Fold is actually a (although overcosted and with a downside) hard counterspell, making Emmy (Or any dumb fatty you want) the only dead draw in the deck.
>>44686676
>The actual COMBO of those two cards can be ruined by three avenues of hate
This is just getting sad. With a Fold "combo," a single Dispel or Negate on anything you play literally removes your ability to win the game, the combo going off doesn't actively win you the game, and there is literally no way to win if you don't happen to have all of your combo pieces in hand at the same time.
>Fold is actually a (although overcosted and with a downside) hard counterspell
If you're casting Fold as a counterspell against a pilot with half a brain, you are instead actively accelerating their board and clock rather than hindering it. At least Splinter Twin doesn't help your opponent win by keeping it in.
>>44686804
>This is just getting sad. With a Fold "combo," a single Dispel or Negate on anything you play literally removes your ability to win the game,
Unless you had a deck built like UR twin perhaps, that can also win without ever casting it's combo.
You're right, it's sad how you don't understand that your own complaints of the deck having no other wins cons are mute if you played a version of the list built around winning a more fair way.
Fold combo is 6 cards. Not even 6, that's just what I thought might be fine. Stick it in any deck you want that has flex slots and would benefit from it. That's the point I wanted to make. Not that my exact deck is good, but that Fold is a card with a lot of potential.
Yes, it has issues with the fact you will most likely run a creature you can't cast most of the time to combo with it. It also has only two weaknesses: counterspells (of which not every deck runs and you can also run because you're in blue already) and sacrifice removal (which makes up a small section of the removal used in modern).
Twin, as a two card combo, NOT a deck, is even more vulnerable to counters, vulnerable to more creature removal and also vulnerable to enchantment hate.
Twin as a full deck is irrelevant for the argument here, you can run nearly the same deck with Fold but with a few more spots for cards you may have wanted to run in Twin but didn't because you wanted to fit 10 combo pieces.
Fold (the combo) is a resilient twin substitute, play it like one.
>>44686804
And as a final point
>If you're casting Fold as a counterspell against a pilot with half a brain, you are instead actively accelerating their board and clock rather than hindering it. At least Splinter Twin doesn't help your opponent win by keeping it in.
I didn't know that countering spells cast by decks that don't run value creatures/don't run creatures at all because they're combo somehow gave them a free Progenitus to slap down.
Yeah, countering enemy spells with Fold isn't pretty, but it can be a much better draw in some situations than any of the Twin combo against decks like Scapeshift or Ad Nauseum.
>>44686159
>I hope they don't touch amulet bloom
Me too, senpai.
>>44686942
>>44686987
You keep ignoring the fact that Pestermite and Exarch actively support the control wincon against all matchups, whereas Fatty and Fold are either dead or help your opponent win. Twin "as a full deck" works "as a full deck" because it has combo pieces that help the control side. You can't just slot those out for garbage and say it'll play the same.
If you're honestly trying to tell me Fold is a better play than an instant speed tapdown, Im going to just have to assume you don't know how Twin plays outside the combo.
Tapping down a land or a utility piece can be game ending, countering something just to give them anything else (or spending mana inefficiently against a race combo deck) is just a waste of cards.
>>44687127
Bruh, Fold is a smaller combo package. You can play 4 Exarchs for all I fucking care with the little bit more room you get by only running 6 combo cards over the normal 10. Also no need to play cards Twin sometimes mainboard like Twisted Images because shit like Spellskite won't fuck you.
I get that the Twin pieces are good for supporting the control wincon. With Fold you can run cards that are even BETTER at supporting the control wincon. You have more room to run cards, and you can run more colours because the only mandatory colour is blue.
>>44685968
>MTG Modern General
>posts a card in the standard cardpool instead of a famous non-standard Modern staple
Great way to attract Standardfags, OP.
i need a new bag to carry my shit
should i get a jansport or a messenger purse
>>44687127
Here anon.
Certified 7/2 Twin sideboard, 9 slots for you to fill (I couldn't think of what fits here off the top of my head), adjust lands all you like. Give me a legitimate reason you can't put 8-9 strong UR cards in those slots and be playing twin with a more resilient combo and a higher quality of live draws. Pester and Exarch are nice cards, but I'm sure you can find something better.
>>44686159
it's guilty of all the things storm is, if they don't ban it then they better unban something for Storm
>>44686159
>fair deck
>>44687336
Messenger
>>44683895 #
>Do I have tron?
>No:Get tron
>Yes:Win the game on turn 3
It really is that simple
>>44687336
With the way prices are going, you'll be better off stripping one of these on as a backpack.
>>44687175
And what cards would those be? Keep in mind you have 6-10 dead cards in your deck for anything but combo, rather than essentially zero.
>>44687403
Im convinced you're just trolling at this point. Look at the first line of that decklist. 2 Emrakul. If 1/30th of your deck doesn't turn up in your hand alongside a copy of a playlet of a dead card, you lose.
Add in the fact that a single Thoughtseize on Fold either removes your ability to win the game, or signals that you have multiple dead cards in your hand.
>>44687823
>And what cards would those be?
I asked you that, I'm not an expert on the modern card pool but you certainly act like you are.
>Keep in mind you have 6-10 dead cards
6, and 4 are counterspells.
>rather than essentially zero.
Of which, I am assuming, there are better cards in modern, even in UR as well, that serve their secondary tapdown/disruption and blocking purposes.
>Im convinced you're just trolling at this point. Look at the first line of that decklist. 2 Emrakul.
You mean "2 Placeholder card for your choice of wincon creature".
>If 1/30th of your deck doesn't turn up in your hand alongside a copy of a playset of a dead card, you lose.
No, you play Twin without the Twin combo in it, which you previously stated is very capable of winning.
>Add in the fact that a single Thoughtseize on Fold either removes your ability to win the game, or signals that you have multiple dead cards in your hand.
If they Thoughtseize Fold and take it they have taken your combo card, but not your win. I literally copied 90% of a twin deck for that list, minus twin combo. You are contradicting yourself (>>44686131 "Twin wins without combo all the time, and sides out the combo in around half of it's matchups.") saying this deck can't win otherwise Twin would never win after side-boarding out combo. They are almost the exact same deck, but this one has 2 combo-only pieces and 4 sub-par but usable counters that can also be sided out.
It's Twin.
It's fucking Bizzaro-Twin.
>>44687965
>It's fucking Bizzaro-Twin.
The combo pieces in Twin can attack.
>>44687993
The cards you replace them with can too if you want.
>>44688024
>fold into aether can attack
>>44688049
>being intentionally dense
Twin is 10 cards
Fold is 6
From the lists I saw they had a few twin-support cards too like Twisted images
You have 4-6 card slots where you don't have to play pester/exarch now
You can put creatures there
Creatures that can attack even!
>>44688088
Pestermite and Deceiver Exarch can't attack?
>>44686159
Don't worry, I'm hoping they don't touch it either.
With 400 Amulets in my cart.
>>44688088
>being intentionally dense
Twin has 4 cards that can't attack
Fold has 6
Also Splintertwin has alot of value even outside of the combo like on a snap or on a spellskite and that utility comes out more than you might think where the 6 cards in fold are dead outside of the combo.
>>44687993
Not only do they attack, they tapdown, wall Junk/Zoo stars, and most importantly: DONT CAUSE YOUR OPPONENT TO WIN THE GAME WHEN YOU CAST THEM OUTSIDE OF THE COMBO.
>>44687965
>4 are counter spells.
You keep saying that, and Im convinced you just don't understand how counterintuitive spending 4 mana to give your opponent free creatures on the board is. The resolution of a Fold is more often then not going to lead to significantly more assrape than if you hadn't countered in the first place.
>Of which, I am assuming, there are better cards in modern, even in UR as well, that serve their secondary tapdown/disruption and blocking purposes.
You're seriously underestimating how consistent the 6-4 spread is, and how efficient the Twin cards are.
>No, you play Twin without the Twin combo in it, which you previously stated is very capable of winning
Except for the part where you don't have the creatures, tap control, or inevitability.
>If they Thoughtseize Fold and take it they have taken your combo card, but not your win
Im not even going to try to beat this in anymore, Im just going to have to assume you've never seen Twin play the control game and win the game through life total with Snap, Exarch, and Pestermite on the board.
Exarch can effectively stall or even win games when played independently, Fatty de jour sits in your hand as a dead draw outside of the combo.
Splinter Twin can aid in the beatdown or buy you a Snap, Fold literally just makes you lose for 4cmc if you aren't "winning" with it.
Im just going to add in the hilarious fact that getting the Fold combo off doesn't actually win the game, and your opponent has an entire turn to kill you while Fatty sits there looking pretty. Fold "going off" essentially loses to Twin going off in response.
>>44688113
That's not the point, the point is you can play better value/attackers when running fold.
>>44688151
Fold puts in 4+ more higher quality attackers than exarch/pester
>>44688174
>You keep saying that, and Im convinced you just don't understand how counterintuitive spending 4 mana to give your opponent free creatures on the board is.
Not every deck runs creatures.
What would wizards need to print for Control decks to become Top 8 in modern?
>>44688202
How do you win if you're hellbent? Twin does this easily, topdeck a creature then topdeck twin. Your shitty deck requires you to draw Fold, draw Emrakul, and then also draw a third spell for you to counter, and you still haven't won the game.
>>44688215
Lantern already is, maybe a colorless silver bullet like Nevermore for Corrosion, Vandalblast and whatnot.
>>44688215
I think UW Control is good enough in theory but the format is way too fast. BGx is about as slow as you can get.
>>44688254
>Lantern control
>anything but fotm meme deck
>>44688174
>Fold "going off" essentially loses to Twin going off in response.
>Tapping out against Twin is a loss
Tell me something new, Einstein.
Fine /tg/, I'm sorry that I tried a small innovation on the modern meta and I hope you can let me repent for my heresy.
>>44688247
Or you topdeck lands over and over. Poor argument.
>>44688202
But if you're planning to win by folding in an emrakul why do you want better value attackers? Why are you so desperate to play this obviously subpar deck and convince us it's better than the most played deck in modern right now? Sure it isn't shit, but Twin combo wins the game on the spot. Fold relies on a full turn at least before it wins. The deck is slower, and it's combo pieces don't have any real application outside of the combo? You're never going to cast Emrakul, your cantrip is just that, a shitty cantrip, and fold is a trashy ass counterspell. Twin gets extra beatdown and more snaps, Exarch/pester can play the controlly beatdown game pretty well.
>>44688271
>Or you topdeck lands over and over. Poor argument.
The same could be said for you.
>>44688288
Exactly, why bring up an argument of such a niche situation?
>>44688280
>But if you're planning to win by folding in an emrakul why do you want better value attackers?
Because that was anon's complaint you retard. Read the thread.
>Why are you so desperate to play this obviously subpar deck and convince us it's better than the most played deck in modern right now?
I'm not playing it, I was simply THEORIZING on cards and real applications for them. Y'know, the thing that the top meta players do. The thing that any good player does. Thinks of new decks to see what might be viable. Lantern Control came from thinking of new uses for old cards. So did Amulet Bloom, the new cancer.
Is the BW Tokens vs Twin matchup usually this slow?
>>44688202
>Fold puts in 4+ more higher quality attackers than exarch/pester
So does TarmoTwin. It still runs Exarch to actually win the game though.
>Not every deck runs creatures
Spending 4cmc to do nothing but counter a spell essentially means that either Ad Naus and Scapeshift have already won, or you have so much mana and such a slow opponent that the Twin package could have gone off by then.
>>44688271
>Or you topdeck lands over and over. Poor argument.
The argument isn't "what if Im flooded or starved" it's "I have zero ways of winning the game outside of pulling 1/30th of my deck with zero tutors." And the dead Fold, and an enabler. Then you have to have the mana for both the same turn and neither can be countered or you lose.
A good tip for combo decks: when the Thoughtseize decision making is along the lines of "what discard fucks him over" rather than "what can't I deal with." Your combo likely isn't secure. Even Scapeshit suffers some bad matchups due to this.
>>44688347
You are making a mistake in assuming you are a good player with good ideas concerning the modern meta.
Good deckbuilders make good decks, which is what they are known for, unlike you, who is trying to convince players that your silly idea is worth mulling over.
>>44688215
>Force of will
>Senei's divining top unban
>A really good card draw, like brainstorm or at least ponder
>A 2cmc counterspell that is not conditional/soft
>>44688347
So well done, you've theorised a little bit and have worked out you could make a combo deck. Good job, plenty of people have done it before. You've decided to compare it against other, competitive decks. Good idea, it can help you see how good the deck is. Then you decide to go into the Modern general, and talk about your deck. You see you've hit a little speedbump now, because this is a competitive modern general, dedicated to discussing the current state of the meta, not your jank ass shitbrew, you fucking moron. You've managed to completely derail this thread, and don't seem to understand your deck is so, so much worse than twin with this misguided idea that Twin can't play the beatdown game and needs to dedicate a few slots to some better beatdown creatures by running a completely different combo which doesn't even win on the spot. You want to beat someone down when playing Twin or a twin-esque deck? Play fucking tarmo twin and fuck off about this stupid ass t3 combo deck.
>>44688397
Thanks for the insulting hostility anon. I guess I'm just the embodiment of /tg/ being bad at magic, but you're the embodiment of being an utter cunt for no reason. Go an hero.
>>44688445
someone issalty
>>44688445
I love how whenever someone comes up with an idea and posts it in these threads it's met with ferocious rejection and scorn because it's not already tested and proven
I bet it's also the same people who complain about modern being a solved format
>>44687336
I like the bag of holding from thinkgeek.
I dislike all the stupid branding they do, but that is a high quality messenger bag.
>>44688521
>because it's not already tested and proven
Nigga fold.dec is older than you are, hell it even got like a single result 2 years ago that nobody expected.
Go meme somewhere else kid.
>>44688521
I don't complain about ideas. I like ideas. What I don't like is the brewers who think they're hot shit and don't understand and refuse to listen to any criticism, brushing it all off, using niche situations and deliberately making shit up about other decks to somehow prove their brew is good.
And don't try and tell me fold in aether combo hasn't been tried before, it's been around for literally years and still makes the rounds in the casual scene.
>>44688546
So why are you getting this assmad because someone posted their list?
>>44688215
Unban Jace
Reprint Counterspell
Reprint Force of Will
I wouldn't unban Top though because that card would just go into everything.
>>44688521
Imagine the first eldrazi poster.
That being said, criticism is good. You need to refine your idea, and then test it.
My worry with your idea is that six combo pieces, 2 of which are actually dead if you don't have one of the other 4 is both too much dead cards, and too little resiliency.
I foresee really bad matchups against any deck that can get set up fast, such as Affinity or even Lantern (though G1 you'll usually beat lantern, I don't see you beating them G2 or G3).
Burn is gonna hurt you too.
And with bad matchups against burn and affinity, you'll have serious trouble in this meta.
>>44686023
Isn't that too slow to actually be consistent?
You have two Emmys, which are your only wincon, and then you need to wait until you draw into one and also have fold into Aether in hand, and then have at least 5 mana for a combo.
>>44688456
You've been arguing your point of view for hours and you still don't get it. Don't you see the flaws in your game plan? You can't use Fold as a counterspell, or you can't win and if you are using it to counter something, you've already lost. You have no real way to dig well apart from Visions and Remand, which will hardly draw you Emmy, and if it did, it'll be a dead card until you can use Fold on one of your own spells.
The deck idea doesn't work, don't delude yourself into thinking it can if you fine tuned it more. I honestly think you're a troll, and I guess you won, since we all responded.
>>44688618
He's got 4x git probe so his deck could win t5 with a t4 emrakul. Well, not win but after annihilator 6 no one's in a healthy state. The deck's still bad but it isn't THAT bad.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/gw-collected-bears-2/
How's this look?
>>44688215
>>44688806
>>44688806
Pretty solid. Maybe a Mindcensor sideboard since that card is spicy.
Lot more Naya Company day 2
Glad I built it
>>44688806
Your curve doesn't have enough 3 drops to really get value from CoCo AND it's a nombo with Thalia, vial would be alot better.
Troll isn't really a good card and when it is good it's on the defence but that isn't your gameplan
Wilt-Leaf Liege would be bomb since you lack reach and something to help you alpha strike and break stalemates but you can't CoCo it.
Also Aven Mindsensor is a must as is I believe an extra copy of Thalia.
1 or 2 tec edge, 1 or 2 Stirring Wildwood would also be good. Also fetchlands, what the balls? Or are you going to tell me that you can afford 4 Nobles and 4 Voices but not the cheapest fetch on the market?
These eldrazi decks are gonna be the shit. The absolute, top of the format shit. They're already competing with other decks, and everyone is just playing blind. Now they've gotten a whole shit ton of staple quality cards printed that slot in perfectly with their decks, and after a month of experimentation with the new eldrazi, a single archetype is going to emerge and punch tron's shit in.
>>44688871
Yeah I really don't see the point of not reprinting this desu senpai.
Combo decks would still run Remand over it anyway, hard 2 mana counters would help keep a lot of nasty stuff in check.
Silumgar's Scorn, the new Surge counter, I hope they're considering it at least.
>>44689091
Fetches + 4 mainboard Leonin Arbiters is kind of a no go. No Hatebears list ever runs fetches. I do kind of agree with you on the topic of Trolls and Mindcensors though. I used to have this as an Aether Vial based deck and I didn't like it.
>>44688268
>deck that less than 0.01% of the player base is capable of playing
>has no bad matchups beyond burn
>meme deck
![conduitofruin[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/GRL5gF0.jpg "conduitofruin[1].jpg")
>>44689208
Fuck, this is too many cards to start investing in.
Should've bought Heartless summoning earlier now it just went up.
Is this guy seeing play yet? Because I'm thinking of buying a shitton of them just in case.
>>44689208
>everyone starts playing tron and eldraziBlue MoonCrucible of Worlds + Tectonic Edge + Ghost Quarter
>>44689279
Capable? Get over yourself, Modern is a flowchart format where the outcome is largely inevitable based on opening hands.
>>44689279
Wait, people have trouble playing lantern control? The decision trees are obvious 99.9999% of the time. There are only a few niche situations where you have to think anything beyond "well, is this a land or a non land?"
>>44689310
He's seeing some play. And why not? With heartless summoning, it, and three lands (urborg, eye of ugin, eldrazi temple), you can hardcast Ulamog you just tutored for 2 mana.
>>44689310
>heartless summoning is currently at $7.00
Glad I held on to those. Should I sell or wait?
>>44689319
I'm ahead of the masses when I say GB is the way to go with Eldrazi deck but no one is listening
NO ONE IS LISTENING
>>44689427
Nah man, 4 conduit of ruin eldrazi storm.
>>44689416
Would probably hold on to them for a bit, but if you aren't confident then sell now.
>>44689416
wait a lil longer
>>44689390
Bought 20 of them.
Worst case scenario I'll just send them off through PucaTrade
>>44689416
Fuck, I was literally minutes away from adding them to my cart
>>44689503
That'll teach you to act now rather than later
Seize the moment
>day 2 Grishoalbrand
>>44689692
>"I was playing MTG"
>"But he was playing 60 card pickup."
Does devoid function outside the game as well?
Can you glittering wish for a brutal expulsion?
>>44689692
I hate this deck, but only because I've had terrible luck playing it when I was testing it out.
>>44689832
Yes, Devoid works in all Zones.
And people thought that Devoid wasn't busted as shit.
>>44689832
Oh, I mean, no you can't Glittering wish for it.
>>44689863
>AND PEOPLE THOUGHT THAT CARDS BEING STRICTLY WORSE THAN IF THEY WERE COLOURLESS WASN'T BUSTED ;^)
>>44689884
Thanks. That's what I figured, but it just seemed odd that an ability would function outside the game.
Outside the game I guess is actually still in the game.
I miss the days when wishes could get exiled things.
>>44688563
This. Ideas are fine. But you need to be open to the possibility that your idea is bad.
I'm looking at the list in >>44686023 and I see a deck that just dies, just completely hopelessly dies, if it doesn't draw an Emrakul, and has no way to tutor them, and still only runs two copies. There is no planet where that's a good plan. And please stop pretending Fold doubles as a counterspell, I'm pretty sure judges are trained to interpret a player using Fold to counter an opponent's spell as a concession.
>>44689503
>still being on 1€ on MKM
lmao
speaking of ideas, heres mine!
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/22-12-15-trash-for-treasure/
The idea is basicly to control the game long enough to drop a fatty with Trash for Treasure, sacrificing a Wellspring or in need a Citadel.
Ive been actually playtesting this, and the main problems are that its just a worse twin and kind of looses to GY hate, altough you still can drop Titans, Leviathans and Wurmcoils its not very good if your yard gets hated.
I've been thinking about splashing green for Bring To Light and also one or two huntmasters in the sideboard to support keranos as an alternate wincon.
If I refuse to copy paste top8 should I stop playing modern? Serious question.
How do you beat tron?
>>44690274
I think there's room for brews in the format, but you need to use some guide on the metagame to know what to brew against.
>>44690274
Why do you refuse?
>>44690274
You tell us.
>>44690274
Just build epic snowflake homebrews.
>>44690274
It's okay to brew if you happen to be among the 20 best deckbuilders in the world. If you're not, don't bother unless you really like losing.
Netdecks are like chess openings: not using the tried and true is not creative, it's just incorrect. You want to flex your creativity, play cube draft or something.
>>44690308
I'm a contrarian or something, I don't know. When I recognize something as overpowered or the flavor of the month, the same shit everyone is doing, I try to beat it with something "worse". Logically it makes no sense, but it's what I do.
>>44690306
My shitbrew hasn't done explicitly horrible at my local meta but last FNM was disappointing enough for me to forego the tournament series today.
I just don't feel that I could do too much to improve it without changing colors and I'd just be playing Jund or Grixis at that point.
>>44685968
>is that card's name a play on "Thought Nazi" ??
haha turn 4 ulamog on stream oblivion sower 2 gud
>>44690406
whoops, didnt mean to greentext
>>44690406
That's what my group has already nicknamed it.
>>44690406
Oh my god, it actually fucking is. It has to be.
I'd bet you money that that card's playtest name was Thought Nazi.
>>44690435
rebroadcast lol
>>44690399
Then work on a new shitbrew. Test it on cockatrice before buying.
>>44690435
Nigger if you think that's good ramp you haven't seen what Devoted Druid and pump spells can do.
If there are decks that can reasonably be expected to kill on turn 2, shouldn't a reasonable counterspell or response be printed?
UU: Counter Target Spell
Would solve the amulet bloom problem.
Checking if I have this right: a card returned to the field from exile is essentially the same as playing from your hand, except it doesn't count as "play from your hand"?
>>44690719
It wouldn't solve it, but it wouldn't really power any other decks up. Twin would be on the fence about running Counterspell because it's "hard" to cast on turn 2 and doesn't do much more than Mana Leak until later in the game, and Twin doesn't really want to be there anyway. Control, however, would fucking LOVE a 2 mana counterspell.
>>44689319
rise of monow death and taxes in modern?
>>44690746
Describe the entire hypothetical situation.
>>44690746
Returning from exile will trigger "enters the battlefield" type abilities.
Returning from exile will not trigger "when you cast X" abilities.
Casting a spell from exile will trigger "when you cast X" abilities.
Casting a spell from exile will not trigger "when you cast X from hand" abilities.
Just read the card.
>>44690766
>Mono W D&T
You realise that this is as redundant as the flavour text on Ancient Grudge right?
"In this world, nothing is certain but death and taxes. Oh, and some fucking dumbshit trying to force white weenie in every format."
- Oscar Wilde
>>44690766
Already running GW Death and Taxes with Eternal Witnesses to recur Ghost Quarter and Path multiple times, and to get back bolted Arbiters.
They said I was crazy.
>>44690784
>>44690794
All right, one thing I wanted to know specifically is if exile "resets" a card as if returned to your hand? Like, do counters stay unless stated otherwise?
Brew UW tempo. Geist of Big Shaft, Clique, Snapcaster, Remand, Judge's Familiar, Ojutai's Command/Cryptic Command,Lyev Skyknight. The only problem is lacking the reach that Bolt gives you.
>>44690719
>>44690764
Adding the real Counterspell to Modern would likely make Modern more boring. Its power level is fine for the format, but since it's completely unconditional, there's no real way to play around it.
What did tokens lose and tie too?
>>44690875
>there's no real way to play around it
Seriously? Do you think that Modern decks are currently playing around each other? Affinity, Burn, Infect, Scapeshift, Twin, Tron, Living End. These aren't decks that want to interact; they just want to run people over while screaming LALALA NOT LISTENING with their fingers in their ears. Counterspell promotes interacting with your opponent and making decisions as to whether you want to let that spell resolve or whether you want to be greedy. My god I wish I could play control in modern.
>>44690914
Reality.
No but seriously
>mono-u tron
>uw tron
>B something eldrazi tron meme deck
Need to GTFO
>>44690864
If a card is exiled, counters will fall off it and disappear, unless otherwise stated (see skullbriar). The card that comes back from exile is treated as an entirely different object from the card that left to exile.
>>44690875
The best modern decks are completely uninteractive piles of cards though.
Modern needs low CMC fast answers to diversify it. BFZ and Oath are going to help a little bit with this, since devoid helps to get around protection, and thus can help against affinity.
But we also need a good counterspell, and an okay cantrip that doesn't promote combo too much.
I'd also like to see some cheap nonbasic land hate. We need more ghost quarter type cards.
And finally, they need to reprint cabal therapy and innocent blood.
>>44690869
That sounds pretty fun and prettybad. Care to share the list?
I could see Reflector Mage in a deck like that. I think the card looks fun and I want an excuse to play it.
>>44690864
Being exiled, even for a split second, makes a card completely forget what it was doing. It is treated as if it's a new card entirely.
>>44691058
There is no list, just a vague idea of UW tempo and good UW tempo cards.
>>44691060
>exiled
It doesn't matter where the card goes or where it came from unless specified on the card. A card has its memory wiped when it changes zones.
Tron, Scapeshift, and Amulet Bloom are all the reason that WotC's policy of not letting people interact with lands cheaply is retarded.
At least let us have some cheap nonbasic land hate.
A slaughter games at 2 mana that can only name nonbasic land cards.
There. Affinity, Tron, Amulet Bloom, and Scapeshift all brought down to acceptable levels.
>>44691132
>Reprint Wasteland
>Ban something to stop Affinity going out of control
Tron is literally the least satisfying way to lose in MtG. At least with affinity/twin, etc, I feel like the opponent had to work for it. Tron just sits there until they get it online and then casts karn and wins.
This motherfucker with the Team Braverman hat
>>44691132
>A slaughter games at 2 mana that can only name nonbasic land cards.
>Tron can't cast wurm until t6, karn until t7, ulamog until t10
>most likely not even as fast as that since his deck now contains only 15 lands
>acceptable
Are you fucking serious?
>>44691409
He plays slow as hell too.
TOKENS!!
>>44691624
Tokens putting in some work.
Time to bring in the Angers.
>>44691132
Armageddon should be reprinted in Modern.
What round is the open in?
What stream is everyone watching?
>>44691665
SCG Open
>>44691517
Golly gee, how terrible for you that someone was finally able to interact with your uninteractive deck.
>check out the stream
>UR twin v. BW tokens
>boring
>check 20 minutes later
>same match different players
>check again
>twin v. _____
>check again
>_____ v. tokens
I'd rather watch and Ad Nauseam mirror than see either of these decks again.
>>44691718
Interacting =/= hosing
>>44690986
U Tron is a tier 2.5 staple
>>44690986
UW Tron was my first real Modern deck
Then I realized how shitty it was and promptly sold it.
If your deck can't survive getting 4 cards exiled from it, then your deck shouldn't be good. It's as simple as that.
>>44691746
Good fucking luck, Modern is literally UR: the format
>>44691840
In response to: >>44691797
>>44691840
>Modern should be Standard!
>>44691157
Ban etched champion
>>44691956
>wild implications and straw men, the post!
>>44691956
>Muh combo shuldn't be disrupted, is unfair!
>>44691840
Slaughter games isn't even interactive man. You're effectively ignoring your opponent and gutting their deck. It's about as interactive as plopping a stony silence on the field.
Stop beating around the bush and just say you want the tron lands banned. That's a perfectly respectable opinion to have.
>>44691157
January 18th:
Banned:
Cranial Plating
Arcbound Ravager
Tarmogoyf
Lightning Bolt
Spell Snare
Snapcaster Mage
Path to Exile
Karn
Amulet of Vigor
Aether Vial
Noble Heiarch
Unbanned:
Deathrite Shaman
JTMS
Stoneforge Mystic
Birthing Pod
What happens to Modern?
>>44692092
I was expecting you to say Skullclamp.
What I really want in Modern is some kind of a one-mana Ruination that singlehandedly makes nonbasic lands completely unplayable.
>>44692092
Tron becomes the undisputed god of the format, the format becomes standard
>>44692092
Plz don't say that anon i want to play affinity for babbys first modern deck.
>>44692118
Is this the birth of a new epic meme?
>>44692092
Entire format becomes a repeat of the Caw-Blade Standard, one of the worst formats in Magic history.
>>44692092
Why ban all those fair cards? You could just stick with the unban list and things would get interesting.
>>44692039
You're probably right.
a 2 mana thought hemorrhage then. Here's how I'd word it:
RB
Sorcery
Name a card.
Target opponent reveals his or her hand. If any of the named card are there, exile them, and deal 3 damage to that player for each of the named card exiled this way. If any cards are exiled this way, tSearch that player's graveyard and library for all cards with that name and exile them. Then that player shuffles his or her library.
That way you still have to guess which of the tron lands are in his hand, there's some interaction.
Then reprint brainstorm, to make it even more fun of a mini game.
Oh, and give it Flashback---Sacrifice a creature.
>>44692153
Fuck off back to your containment thread.
>>44692208
This is my containment thread.
Bitter complaints about the state of modern belong in modern general.
There needs to be stronger nonbasic hate in the meta to control decks like tron and amulet bloom
>>44692153
Oh this won't be abusive with IoK and Thoughtseize at all. :P
http://www.mtgstocks.com/decks/63970
I... what? I don't even see what the idea here is.
>>44692092
>Goyf, Bolt, Snap and Path gets banned
Literally 90% of Modern players switch to legacy
>>44692283
>2014
>>44691132
You could always play D&T like me
Is the CMC of a disrupting shoal on the stack that was cast by exiling Force of Will 0, 2, or 7?
>>44692283
Was this deck ever used in a competitive event?
Cause I don't see how.
>>44692362
If it soothes your jimmies I was looking up decklists that ran Sun's Champion and found this. Being a deck from 2014 doesn't make this make sense. My brain can't even.
>>44692092
Just ban whatever are the three most expensive cards in the format every month.
>>44692423
The converted mana cost (commonly abbreviated CMC) of an object is an integer equal to or greater than zero. It is determined by converting each colored mana symbol in the spell's cost to 1 (unless it is one of the hybrid mana symbols Mana2w.pngMana2u.pngMana2b.pngMana2r.pngMana2g.png, each of which converts to 2), then adding the results to the colorless mana cost of the spell. (For example, spells with mana costs of Mana 2.pngGreen mana.png and Mana 1.pngGreen mana.pngGreen mana.png both have a converted mana cost of 3.)
The only case in which a spell's converted mana cost can ever vary is for spells with Mana X.png in the mana cost. When an object with X in the mana cost is on the stack, X equals whatever value was chosen for it when it was put on the stack. In any other location, X equals 0.
>>44692466
>>44692466
So 7. Thank you. I would have guessed 2, since I thought the X would only effect it if the X was actually paid for with mana.
>>44692366
I've considered D&T, but I didn't think it had good matchups. How do you do against the big 3 (twin, tron, affinity)?
>>44691837
>UW tron
>Real modern deck
Pick one and only one, my nigga
>>44692092
idc i play storm
>>44692328
Snapcaster Mage can get fucked.
I can't stand these expeditions. They just DON'T read well at a glance. I'm still not sure what land the Junk player has. Overgrown Tomb I guess.
OK, for an oldfag who dropped out of MTG back during Mirrodin... Where would I start in picking the game up again?
>>44692582
Legacy
>>44692542
I'm not attracted to Asians.
>>44692092
The format becomes Esper Caw-Blade v Junk Pod. They both play Deathrite Shaman and Stoneforge Mystic.
>>44692582
Did you pick up a decent amount of mirrodin product before you ducked out?
>>44692582
Do your wallet a favor and don't bother. The game is more expensive right now than it has ever been.
>>44692582
Depends on when you started. If you have some vintage playables, try moderately competitive EDH. It has a good community, is eternal, and is a lot of fun.
If you don't have vintage staples, and aren't willing to sell 2d8 organs to buy into vintage, you're stuck with modern or standard.
Modern will cost you 1d4 organs to buy into, but if you buy something like affinity, the upkeep will be very little.
Standard will cost you 1 organ per year for the rest of your life to buy into and maintain.
And then finally, there's the lowest tier of play, casual EDH. It costs about 1000-10000 dollars to buy into, almost all of which is spent exclusively on commissioning furry porn alters of varying playability.
>>44692582
Just buy the modern event deck and wing it from there.
>>44692719
But anon, the Modern Event deck is back at $100 now
Goryo's Vengeance is scary as fuck.
Ali is a hotty.
>>44692815
I like it more in gifts lists than the grishoalbrand list. But yeah, the card is criminally undervalued.
Really happy to see Grishoalbrand in the top 8, I really like decks to that.
>>44686159
They'll ban Prime himself and you'll like it.
>>44692867
>I like it more in gifts
stop pushing this shitty meme, gifts decks are shit
>>44692892
Nah. I've got a positive win rate against everything but mono u tron with it.
>>44692892
Calm your tits breh.
>>44692874
I, too, enjoy buyouts of kamigawa block.
>>44692954
Hair-strung Koto bro, trust me on this you wanna get your playset and then some
>>44692954
I hate this shit, youre happy for your pet deck but youre also unhappy because the prices gonna spike like fuck. Am I misremembering something or wasnt this the case half a year ago?
>>44692980
Prices are always unstable before banlist announcements.
>>44693015
Youre probably right. The only thing im gonna do for now is reserve my blooms and amulets in a few days, in case they dont get banned
>>44692954
Toshiro Umezawa is gonna make you bank. Trust me, it and forbidden orchard are going to define an archetype.
>>44692874
Bob piloting it?
I love seeing decks i play do well.
>>44693045
Forbidden Orchard will spike once someone figures out a consistent Beck//Call Elves list.
>>44693117
Or if Massacre Wurm makes a comeback
>>44692864
Tom Ross is also a cutie. Sucks that he plays infect
>>44692954
Yeah Kamigawa Block Pauper Tiny Leaders its really the best format
>>44692890
That would be unfortunate. I really like Primeval Titan inValakut Titan
>5 Infect day 2
>same number as affinity
feels good man
>>44693213
That's why I like him :3
I'm a MTG noob, how does this card actually work?
I'm confused, because when I asked the card shop owner about it in rl he gave me a weird answer that I feel is wrong.
Basically, what he told me, is that when it comes into play tapped that you immediately get the "Add [a] Planes to your mana pool" is given to you for free. That it's basically a free +1/+1 Vigilance for that turn AND a Planes land all in one. That sounds too good to be true to me.
How are you supposed to use the Planes tap effect anyways? Is the card itself just a Planes outside of the buff or do I have to use a token of some kind to represent the Planes?
>>44690869
You could use blue bolt if you want
>>44693207
This will always be my favorite creature.
>>44693252
WAT
It enters tapped, you can't it again for mana the turn you play it. Because of that drawback, one of your creatures gets +1/+1 and vigilance until end of turn.
FUCK YOU JEFF YOU DON'T DESERVE TO WIN YOU BALDING FUCK
>>44693252
it's a land with an etb effect. It buffs the turn it comes in. It comes in tapped so you can not tap it for mana the first turn it enters as it is already tapped. You can tap it for W once it's untapped.
>>44693252
>That sounds too good to be true to me
Because it is.
>>44693263
*blue char
>>44693252
Never play against your LGS owner
>>44693299
Kiki-Chord is way cooler than Tron though
>>44693331
I can't get off to pictures of Boohoogland though.
Who's going to Minneapolis Regionals on Feb 3rd?
>buy up all the Heartless Summonings in the bargain binder
>sell them for 10x what you bought them for
>mfw
>>44693352
Fair desu
>>44693360
>heartless summoning 6 buxx
Why
>>44693252
It doesn't create a Plains card. It just taps for white mana, just like a Plains card would.
All basic lands have and "invisible" ability that says "Tap this card and you get a mana of this color". They are not mana themselves, they just can give you mana. Mixing the two is a common mistake for newbies, especially since Duels gives confusing tooltips that claim lands are mana (they're not, mana is an entirely separate thing that lands just give).
>>44693392
Everyone is hoarding whatever new tech is found for the Eldrazi meme hoping that version will become the best
Personally I got my Eyes and Temples and most of the OGW Eldrazi preordered so Imma chill
Fuck tron
>>44693445
God whens the last time a FOTM deck jacked up prices this hard? And still is showing like no results
>>44693445
Everyone is buying out Delay because T1 Thoughtseize, T2.5 Delay, T3.5 Ulamog's Nullifier is actually just a game win.
>>44693297
>>44693306
Thanks, the more I think about this the more this makes sense to me.
Yeah, so I bought this White/Red starter deck and at the same time the store owner gave me this black deck box for free with two 30 card decks (one White, one Red) as well. It was pretty nice.
Today I took them apart and made two complete 60 card decks. One mono-white and one mono-red.
>>44693430
This really clears things up nicely.
These last few days have made me really hate WOTC, this economy is out of control
In legacy I can be fairly sure my expensive cards will be playable for years but in modern, the banlist is so erratic I don't think anything is safe
The other part I really don't like it's how lately no cards are just gaining value normally but spiking hard through panic buyouts and staying there
>>44693392
New eldrazi decks are all about reducing costs or producing more than 2 mana per land. Hearltess Summoning lets you do it, and effectively lets you run all the ulamogs.
>>44693467
It goes to show how desperate people are to get into modern, they pray with all their might the deck will become good and they won't have to spend 1000 bucks to play competitive MagicI'm one of them
>>44693430
>Duels gives confusing tooltips
The simplified rules also give misleading answers as they claim that lands add mana when they become tapped, rather than them adding mana to your pool by tapping.
>>44693478
The problem is that there isn't really an economy in Magic. In the real world, supply rises to meet demand and keep prices in equilibrium. But in Magic, supply CAN'T rise to meet demand, meaning that for equilibrium to be found, demand must fall. The anger people are feeling towards Wizards over this shit situation is an aspect of that forcibly falling demand. People are being forced out of Magic by money.
Why does the ref keep replacing perfectly functional tokens with less functional and uglier tokens?
>>44693521
I gave up on hoping WotC would try to explain the complexities of MtG to newbies rather than dumbing down the game for everyone else when Rosewater said the stack was a mistake on his blog
>>44693478
Fetchlands and Shocklands will hold value for a long time, probably the safest investment.
>>44693506
Thats pretty cute. This deck is huge on MODO right? I should build something on it that would just eat it
>>44693509
You play it? How do you like it?
>>44693547
SCG brand tokens.
>>44693547
SCG branding
Oh look. Its UR twin v. BW tokens. AGAIN.
Jesus, these two decks are boring as fuck.
>>44693561
I figured that out months ago
buying up blue fetches and shocks every paycheck
>>44693564
I'm not playing it, as I said I just bought the staples for the deck and I'm waiting for someone to figure out the best list
>>44693564
>>44693572
Fuck that noise.
And they insert ads in the middle of matches?
Boycott the jews lads.
>>44693544
Wizards can only make more money by reprinting every staple down to reasonable levels led
Why are they intentionally giving up money to appease retarded cardboard collectors
>>44693576
Less boring than Bloom Titan matches at least.
>>44693625
Why would they ever run a tournament without advertising themselves
This seems like a non issue
>>44693621
Ah okay
What's the most YuGiOh deck, past or present, in Magic?
By "YuGiOh," I mean decks with extreme deck-search and draw power and big sicknasty plays you can make early on. Does such a thing even exist?
I'm trying to imagine how it would look in my head. Perhaps there could be a card that bypasses your restriction of playing one Land per turn, Creatures who search for more creatures when played, and then winning the game with some insane 10+ damage combo.
