Always considered it, but never went through with it. I get a lot out of the regular setting already. I might someday.

>>44281462
I once had a game of Requiem in which the vast majority of the game was set in a few years in roughly the present day. Once the main story was concluded, I did an extended epilogue, which took the form of the PCs now being Ancillae in a Bleeding Edge setting.

File: Merry Conditions.pdf (1 B, 486x500) Image search: [Google]

1 B, 486x500

Relinking this. It's my entries into the 12 Days of Onyx thing. I felt like sharing them here where more people are likely to see it. Plus I can pretty it up.

>>44281533
I just feel like most of the rules would really fit well with something more fantastical, especially the mortal stuff that they can get up to with Spirits and Ghosts. Dread Powers especially add to monster creation capabilities, making things straight out of D&D.

I've mentioned before, but I want to run a heavily modified Woundgate portal fantasy, where the players are modern day folks who get pulled into a fantasy World of Darkness where the realms are all stitched together and there's no masquerade. Although I do ultimately feel that you could run a really good game using WoD without using any of the templates or gamelines besides core (and Hunter).

>>44281724
>Once the main story was concluded, I did an extended epilogue, which took the form of the PCs now being Ancillae in a Bleeding Edge setting.
>Bleeding Edge Vampire
I'd be down with it for the Bloodlines in the future. Maybe have a Mekhet bloodline that has turned their shadow into a computer virus, and can use it to influence technology or turn people into Ghouls with clickbait.

So, am I just blind or stupid (probably both), or is V20 Dark Ages not in the mega?

>>44281724
>>44281800
I know someone who did a Bleeding Edge game. I decided me and the ST didn't like each other enough so I dropped out. Most of his players complained to me that he wasn't really letting them have fun, and I hear that after he put the game on hiatus or ended it or whatever, he started it back up with a completely different group without telling anyone. Between that and doing the same thing with Shadowrun it's like he burned all his bridges with the group for no reason.

Not at all related, but after watching Daybreakers, a friend and I got the idea to do that, but in space. I ended up playing the runaway distant prince of Space Roman Vampires who was getting buggered by his human clone slave and being a space pirate. The third player was Kaylee as a vampire. We played vampire Firefly. It was dumb, didn't last but a few sessions before petering out. We used Mutants and Masterminds.

So, I wanted /CofDg/'s opinion on an angel I'm statting up for an encounter muuuuuch later into a campaign I'm running, in the current setting they're basically the big bad, rank 5 psychopomp who's been largely responsible for managing the Seattle infrastructure nightmare, was trying to pin down their bane/ban and I'm having trouble with it, any recommendations?

>>44281783
Have you sent them to Onyx?

>>44281986
I put them in the thread.

I just realized, you could use Mage to play Mastigos Urksar E Creed.

http://pastebin.com/ZhCkEkPP

Shitty homebrew coming through, I threw this together for a warrior-cult my hunter group are going to be facing relatively soon, any way I could improve it?

>>44282426
Fuck, I forgot to put in an actual merit dot-value(it's 4 dots)

>>44282426
>implying this thread ever gives feedback on homebrew

>>44282760
Yes we do. Just not much. We don't give feedback on a lot of things.

>>44282426
I'd need to know more about it, but as is I'm not really sure what to make of it. I don't really like the rules for the drug itself, and I don't know what purpose the Merit serves. If you tell me more about the warrior cult (I'm assuming they take drugs to be Barbarians?) I can make some suggestions.

Overall, though, I'd say that you should take the same route that the Rampant take, refluffing an existing Conspiracy (in this case the 2e rules for Ascending Ones) and making new powers for it that fit with what you're going for.

Onyx Path's having an AMA on the Rebbits: https://www.reddit.com/r/rpg/comments/3xldx5/hi_its_onyx_path_back_again_ask_us_anything/

It's still ongoing if any of you use the site.

>>44283597
Why bother, that's what DaveB is for

>>44283613

Sometimes there's other info in there, or questions they ask that we don't tend to. I guess we'll see if that happens today.

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>your coterie has been tasked with protecting an amber pendant holding a single drop of vitae suspended within its midst
What follows from this scenario?
>>44282426
1) Divide duration into scenes, not minutes. The measurement is less exact but A) Turns-to-minute conversion is a BITCH even in systems that focus on it and B) Drug duration's too individual for this kinda thing anyway
2) "Unable to be beaten down", does that refer to the Beaten Down tilt?
3) Given this is a combat stim I suggest giving characters the Poisoned Tilt.
4) Change the line "must go for blood" to be conditional and use the standard rules for Drugs (Resolve + Stamina), but have the roll require 1 Willpower to be expended.
5) The -3 to recognizing it feels exceedingly punishing.
6) +2 to ANY perception checks? Is the +2 also applying to any attacks? The latter is tricky. I'd instead suggest bonuses to any unarmed fighting techniques as well as evasion.
7) As Aspel said the entire thing feels very vague.

I hope that makes sense.

>>44283782
>What follows from this scenario?
The Tremere drinks it and promptly mutates.

>>44283782

Our Cotorie defends it after a bunch of sneak attack and one big battle. The Daeva consistently jokes about drinking from the pendant and everyone keeps him as far away as possible.

>>44283825
What a numpty.

>>44283782
>>44282426
Oh, and before I forget.
8) The text gives me the impression you want to goad them into taking it accidentally. Don't do that.
>>44283896
>numpty
That word never fails to make me chuckle.

>>44283835
>Daeva
Always either the best or the worst character in the coterie.
>>44283896
>>44283825
Yes that sounds tremere alright.

>>44282426
So the idea is that the warrior-cult uses this cocktail of drugs for a combat boost?

Looking at the drug first:
- Any particular reason why you think it's MDMA if you fail the Streetwise test? Shouldn't it be a Science or Medicine test? Streetwise is a social skill so the sort of thing you use to track down a dealer in the first place rather than ID the exact composition of a drug, I would have thought.
- Given the rose symbolism, I'd suggest the quarter dosages be called thorns or petals.
- What happens to the -3 fatigue penalty if you take another dose? Presumably it lifts for the duration of the new dose's effects

Ok, so basically a combat drug. The 'you are tolerant' merit seems pointless. Surely it's more effective as a horrible combat drug if the cultists are craving their next hit because they feel shit and want to get rid of that hefty fatigue penalty than actually barely being affected by the drug downsides? I don't see what exactly it brings to the table. At most, just having it read: 'You gain an additional +1 to attack rolls and perception checks while under the effects of Rioter's Rose' would be a short, simple and effective Merit of, what, 1 or 2 dots?

>>44284037
>not invited to Reddit AMA
>slums it out here instead

kek

>>44284088
He's a rebel. It's the equivalent of skipping class to smoke just off campus

>>44284088
The AMA is all line devs and stuff, not mere plebeian writers such as myself. Not to mention I've never even used Reddit before!

>>44284088
He's just a lowly writer, not a developer.

>>44284037
>Streetwise is a social skill so the sort of thing you use to track down a dealer in the first place rather than ID the exact composition of a drug, I would have thought.
Can't any skill be used with Wits to notice things? Wits + Streetwise seems like the kind of roll you'd use to determine something, like what dealer's mark a drug has, or what it is based on the shape or effects. Wits + Science or Medicine would only really be helpful if you analyzed the chemical composition.

>>44284215
Sure, but why would you look at this little rosebud pill thing and think 'oh yeah, that's MDMA'? Streetwise would be good for getting the info from someone ('Yeah, the rosebuds are this new drug that XYZ...') but I'm not sure why failing Streetwise gives you such a specific result that seems more what would come out of an attempt to analyse it more closely.

I mean, you'd have to be pretty dense to get a street drug in pill form and just assume it must be MDMA because reasons.

The more I think on it, the more it sounds like a Dramatic Failure than a Failure,

>>44284285
>>44284037
I really stumbled over the MDMA comment as well. Maybe the pill has learned Obfuscate?

>>44283835
Your Daeva player seems to be quite good at getting into character.
>>44283825
>Tremere
Not necessarily in the top ten of the walking timebomb all-time hit list, but certainly in the upper quarter.

>>44284356
>Maybe the pill has learned Obfuscate?
Well at least it isn't Abyssal Kudzu

>>44284356
>>44284372
>you wouldn't ghoul your chem lab

>>44284198
Dave=Reddit
Dave H.=Tumblr
Chris=4chan

we have our new lord and saviour folks. time to burn my dave effigies and start building new ones.

>>44284198
Yo Chris, how would you deal with a Spirit of Kudzu?

>>44284395
I do love the cliche of the 'new street drug appears but it's actually supernatural!'

Never gets old. My latest version of it was 'street drug is infused with the hallucinogenic slime-scrapings from a titanic carnivorous mollusc that lives under Paris, harvested by a psychedelic Bone Shadow heretic sect'.

>>44284465
>'street drug is infused with the hallucinogenic slime-scrapings from a titanic carnivorous mollusk that lives under Paris, harvested by a psychedelic Bone Shadow heretic sect'.
Well that was certainly a thing.

>>44284465
>Not crack that's uses vampire blood instead of baking soda.
>Not meth made of out of pure mana, for the all night rituals

>>44284454
Hmm. Depends, but I think I'd have it actually be approached more from the idea of a whole brood of kudzu spirits working together and consuming other plant spirits/urban spirits of places they grow over etc.

For maximum entertainment, make them extremely friendly towards werewolves, helpful, and generally all buddy-buddy so that a PC pack have as much of a dilemma as possible about whether to try and purge the fucking stuff or let it continue spreading.

There's probably also fun and games in having kudzu spirits popping over the Gauntlet to Claim actual kudzu. In fact, when enough kudzu spirit control has been exerted, I might have the spirits gain a special Numina that basically shreds the Gauntlet so that the spirits can permanently thread through and merge with the plant in the Flesh, forging a vast, spreading hivemind of Claimed and spirit intertwined.

Now, how would I *stop* kudzu?

Fire sounds good.

(Also rallying predatory Courts like getting all the clattering, biomechanical horrors that reflect mowers and harvesters and the like)

>>44284546
>>Not meth made of out of pure mana, for the all night rituals
But which Arcanum are you funnel the Mana from? Life For the Buzz, Fate for the 10 second precog or Prime for...something else.

>Hello! I'm Dave Brookshaw, Developer for Mage: The Awakening and Deviant: The Xxxxxxxxx
>Deviant: The Xxxxxxxxx

That is a fairly specific number of X's. What 9 letter word fits Deviant? Deviant: The Abandoned?

>>44284546
SNORT TASS EVERY DAY
>this is your brain
>this is your brain on Paradox
>>44284565
>>44284454
>>44284372
NOPE. FUCK. I'm out. I'm so done.
>>44284395
AFAIR you can ghoul plants, so Vampire >>44284465 weed could totally be a thing.

>>44284479
Is it any surprise that French folklore features a huge killer snail?

>>44284546
I tried the vampire blood thing as a PC once in a Requiem game, didn't work very well from what I recall (since iirc Vitae stops having most of its properties after being outside of the vampire for a little while?).

As for the all-night rituals, just go Life or Mind and give yourself the effects directly rather than concocting an actual drug.

>>44284600
>SNORT TASS EVERY DAY
>derelict Free Council mastigos discovers a hollow and sells off the mana as meth
>false awakenings false awakenings everywhere

>>44284599
I think Dave's just used a random number of Xs unless the subtitle changed since I last heard about it (which is entirely possible).

>>44284599
http://www.bestwordlist.com/9letterwords.htm
>>44284661
>>44284616
>>44284465
Plot hook get.

>>44284668

Any feedback yet from Stew about your Werewolf Gift creation project?

>>44284546
Vitae crack is a thing in Tales from Precinct 13.

>>44284465
I was in a game where there was a drug that was harvested by mutating the addicts into giant fleshy metal machines that secrete the drug.

With my Gotham game, I'm thinking I'm going to have Venom (Bane's drug) be a street drug, similar to the Gotham episode "Viper", but... not some guy handing it out on the streets.

>>44284616
>(since iirc Vitae stops having most of its properties after being outside of the vampire for a little while?).
Hey, it's your game, fudge things. "Ordo found a way to make it stay working".

>>44284565
>Fire sounds good.
My advice, Fireheart Ogre.
>Huddah huddah huh!

>>44284714
Some. I'm still hoping for an Xmas-time update :)

>>44284744
Well, I was a player rather than the Storyteller.

Although I still fondly remember that game for being an excellent demonstration of my Mekhet going completely and utterly mad via a slow and entirely reasonable reliance on Obfuscate.

Mages have their own version of crack that requires they kill aliens and milk them for their venom.

>>44284744
>Hey, it's your game, fudge things. "Ordo found a way to make it stay working".
Maybe liberal abuse of the Vitae Reliquary Ritual and its rules, though why the Lancea would involve themselves in that is another question.

So while we're talking about magic drugs, what kinda magic drugs could you buy at a Goblin Market?

Chris got any fun ideas?>>44284809

>>44284882
As I'd assume that the regen of a werewolf makes it so the effect of drugs pass by rather quickly, maybe a form of of weed that induces a high upon your very spirit when the smoke is inhaled.

In mechanical terms it makes you veer towards Flesh on your Harmony track, but it makes it harder to do basically anything Gauru, Urshul or Urhan related due to being high as a kite.

>Have any of you ever used WoD for a game not set in the traditional World of Darkness?

I was once in a Discworld game using the nWoD system. Fantastic campaign, ran for 2 years and still talked about. I was a Black Ribbon vampire, stole Death's cat, and accidentally destroyed Klatch. Good times.

>>44285004
>and accidentally destroyed Klatch
How do you "Accidentally"destroy the entire country of Klatch?

>>44284882
The obvious thing that springs to mind is a Tillinghast drug - something that opens your mind, maaaan, so that you can see Twilight or see the spirit world half-imprinted onto the real world, all the twitching, horrible things that look far more like they belong in the abyssal sea or locked up tight in H R Giger's mind where they can't get at anyone. And, of course, they can see you too - not totally, they just get the impression of a faint, blurry haze but it's enough to get them to come and pay attention to you. Brewed up from some rare, highly toxic berries from Guatemala, the spleen of an endangered lizard species and the secret ingredient - juices extracted from the eyes and liver of a naval rating's corpse recovered from the Philadelphia Experiment. As a side effect it makes you feel curiously hungry when you see dead animals (humans included), and sometimes you hear weird echoes of commands over a ship's internal comms system.

Of course, if you're looking for something less recreational or spiritual there's Bleed, a cocktail spliced from the red stuff out of a half-dozen different supernatural species, put through some alchemical processes then rendered down into a tacky red gum. Pop a stick of Bleed gum and your heart will hammer away like it wants to explode, but you'll get a massive boost of oxygenation to your muscles and organs and brain, like living life in the fast lane when everyone else is driving a Robin Reliant. You'll also seep blood out of the pores of your skin but it looks far worse than it is - you lose only a few mils of blood over a good hour or so of a Bleed trip. Hell on your laundry bill, though. Side effect not advertised on the pack: Once you're deep into a trip, the parts of your brain that deal with logical mathematics and numbers tend to go on the fritz until the experience is over. Also sometimes users' blood spontaneously all goes as thick and tacky as the gum. This is, er, lethal.

Barely happens to anyone, though!

>>44285004
Huh, I missed that line in the OP.

Yes, did a complete Mass Effect conversion of the system and ran/played quite a few games with it.

Considering a Fallout conversion but, er, there's not actually a lot you need to do to make CofD 2e work for post-apocalyptia.

Yes, Dark Eras probably will make it easier just due to adding various widgets and bits of rules, but obviously the Eras are all focused on the setting in those timeslots rather than offering a more generic historic experience.

Amy tips for making monsters not get totally BTFO by mortals? I'm going to be running a new campaign soon and while only one person is really built towards combat (he's part of one of those anti-government militias and owns a ton of guns), I'm worried that 5v1 or even 5v3 is an unfair advantage for the players. I can make the monster scary, but if it comes down to it they can probably just gang up on it and kill it fast. Or, if I make it strong enough to fight 1v5, its strong enough to also instantly kill someone on the first roll of combat.

I haven't run a game in along time but I remember a few years ago having this badass multilevel Master get chunked by 3 mages before he could get to his second turn. Which was Mage, and there were reasons why it came down to a head on fight and why the villain wasn't prepared and stuff, but its always been my experience that numbers trump everything else.

>>44285094
Chris, can you make a book for us that contains just wacky and insane magical drugs you've thought of? I want this for April Foolz day because these would be wonderful pranks. Tell Rich we want that.

>>44285127
seconding for reasons of- JUST DO IT!

>>44285004
Tell me more. How did it work? Discworld doesn't seem like it would work for WoD. Then again, it didn't seem like D20 or GURPS work for it, either. Fate would work, though.

>>44285115
>obviously the Eras are all focused on the setting in those timeslots rather than offering a more generic historic experience.
Eh, most of them work fine enough. They give rules hacks that are useful.

Although for Fantasy I feel like all that needs to be changed mechanically is switching Computers for Use Magic Device.

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>>44285035
>Break into Seriph's palace disguised as dancing girl
>Drunken Seriph takes me back to his quarters
>Can't risk him spotting me sneaking out, decide to knock him out by smashing expensive vase over his head
>Roll badly, injure him but don't knock him out
>Seriph starts to call for guards, I panic and kick him in the head
>Roll the most amount of damage I've ever done in my life
>Kill him outright
>Oh shit
>Bail
>Guards soon discover the Seriph has been murdered, palace is in an uproar
>Party barely escape with their lives
>Civil war breaks out in Klatch as minor lords fight to fill the power vacuum
>Lords start to call in aid from neighbouring countries
>All of the Disc is soon engulfed in a world war
>I unintentionally destroyed Klatch and caused the death of millions
>GM's face when

>>44285186
>Tell me more. How did it work? Discworld doesn't seem like it would work for WoD.

It worked fairly well- according to the GM they only used WoD because they knew that system and didn't like the Discworld one. We had to do some houseruling for magic of course, but most things translated straight over.

For things like vampires, werewolves etc we ignored clans/auspices, but kept their abilities and things like frenzy. If anything weird came up we'd discuss as a table what to do, then add it to the houserule list. Worked really well.

>>44285125
Use multiple foes, use minions, use mitigating circumstances that for ex. let the monster hit and run so it can't get focus-fired, allow it to dole out malisons onto more than just its primary attack target, give it horrible return-from-the-grave powers, make it monstrously resilient, make it so utterly lethal (but make sure to telegraph this) that attempting to stand and fight it is pretty much asking for a character to die each round if they fuck up even the slightest, etc etc.

It depends hugely on the combat capabilities of the characters, what the group make-up is like, what the *player* psychology of the group is like (ie are these guys ever gonna run from a monster), and other forms of context.

Numbers for human-level foes *are*" a major, major factor. It's less of an issue for a more inhuman level foe with monstrous defences or resilience. For the human-level opponent - even the mage who, after all, probably has less than 10 health levels behind whatever magical defences she's pulled out of her rear - preparation, cunning and refusing to play fair are pretty key. As in real life, friends are overpowered.

>>44285127
It's better if the actual fans tell RichT you want that, rather than me telling RichT that of course the fans *totally* want that, honest guv, you can trust me, would I lie to you boss.

(Seriously though, whenever people say 'we want to see Product X' it is far more fruitful to express that directly to the boss people than asking writers to feed it up the chain).

>>44285257
Summat tells me that the Golems of the Trust would be most put out by their portrayal in Promethean.

>>44285279
>It's better if the actual fans tell RichT you want that, rather than me telling RichT that of course the fans *totally* want that, honest guv, you can trust me, would I lie to you boss.
>(Seriously though, whenever people say 'we want to see Product X' it is far more fruitful to express that directly to the boss people than asking writers to feed it up the chain).

Where do we go and demand this? Monday Morning Meeting Notes?

>>44285311
Probably not a bad place to mention your wishes and desires.

Just don't be a dick about it and you should be fine. Asking doesn't mean Thing XYZ will happen - but it means the head honchos will be aware there's a desire for it.

>>44285359
Coolio.

Yo Chris, Upthread I mentioned Bleeding Edge Vampire, with an example being a Mekhet line which has converted their Shadow into a computer virus, allowing them to teleport through technology and turn people into Ghouls with clickbait ads. What do you make of it?

>>44285418
>Coolio

Makes me think of sausage rolls, dunno why.

>>44285418
Forgot me link >>44281800

>>44285279
>It's better if the actual fans tell RichT you want that, rather than me telling RichT that of course the fans *totally* want that, honest guv, you can trust me, would I lie to you boss.
I want better layout.

>>44285279
>As in real life, friends are overpowered.
Can we have a merit that allows a Mage to use his Proximi Friends as amplifiers?

>>44285427
I don't know why you would makethat connection either.

>>44284037
Basically, yes. The streetwise test was assuming they tried to identify it at a glance as it's got a bit of a reputation in the public mind, setting wise stories are told of the stuff being sold and fucking you up extra hard(whether in the good way or the bad way changing). I do really like that idea with calling the quarters thorns/petals, that's really neat. And yea, taking another dose would lift the fatigue, I'd probably also rule that if you strung doses together to avoid the fatigue you'd have to start rolling for addiction.
The merit was mostly thrown together to be something I gave to the big bads of the area, maybe something the party could took if instead of destroying the facility that's making this drug they suborned it in order to get tons of it for personal use.
Really, it's just something I threw together to serve as a bonus to the cultists in the area and as a possible boon they can take if they decide to 'not' detonate the place that's creating it.

>>44285482
>>44284037
That's some very elaborate ways of saying it's shit.

Hay does any body have an idea of how starlite would work in CofD. The stuff basically makes you immune to heat. Here some info for it.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starlite
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=W4nnLP--uTI
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KP62WMvrNhg&itct=CBkQpDAYACITCO6Mj9Gt68kCFRLffgoduFkKyjIHcmVsYXRlZEiy8vr9z-X5xFs%3D

>>44285506
Meant to quote
>>44284037
>>44283782

>>44285464
I genuinely don't know. Something to do with a cinema, but the memory is too fragmented and doesn't make sense.

>>44285540
>I genuinely don't know. Something to do with a cinema, but the memory is too fragmented and doesn't make sense.
Anon... I think the Machine knows.

In the Reddit AMA RichT said they stick with the layout they do because most of the community is good with it.

I really can't help but feel that he's insulated against criticism...

>>44285625

the book layout or the site layout?

the book layout is fine, they just need to bookmark things better.

>>44285519
>https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starlite
>mobile

fuck off

>>44285418
Isn't the Mekhet Shadow the Hollow thingy fro the Clanbook, ie a total dick, or am I misremembering that?

>>44285721
Book layout sucks ass for NWoD. I can't read shit. The fonts are terrible and the pages are organized like shit. Have you red the Mage book? The rotes are nearly unreadable. It's like a monkey put it together.

>>44285737
Either way, teleporting between computers screens and clickbait ghouls are awesome.

>>44281462
i use the new wod crunch for nay non fantasy setting and even some fantasy settings

>>44285740

that book is 10 years old. the 2e stuff is a lot more readable.

>>44285482
>Really, it's just something I threw together to serve as a bonus to the cultists in the area and as a possible boon they can take if they decide to 'not' detonate the place that's creating it.

Sure, but the boon would be that they can actually access what is a pretty vicious combat drug, there's no need to then stack the merit on top of that.

>>44283782
1. That's a great idea.
2. Yep.
3. Given how long it lasts, tha seems like it'd pretty quickly go lethal.
4. Sounds good
5. Hm...maybe something like -2 to str/dex rolls, shaky hands and fatigued muscles?
6. Yea, +2 to perception rolls and +2 to attack pools, I figured it'd be fine given that(and I realize I should've made this clear now) the drug is produced at bit of infrastructure that props up this cult.
7. Eh.
>>44283916
8. Ideally, they wouldn't just take it without finding out exactly what it does, so far they've seen someone take it and keep on fighting after being shot in the arm.

>>44285886
Yeeaa, probably.If I want to give he big bads more 'oomf' giving them extra flat out bonuses is probably unnecessary.

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>>44285721
>Fine
>Merits in the rules section
>Character creation things not in the character creation section
>Rules in the Merit section
>Nothing where it should be
I've been trying to get Werewolf started and teach new players and it's a fustercluck. Parkour in both Werewolf and CofD still references 1e rules that aren't in 2e.

>>44285740
I like most of the fonts.

>>44285865
A lot of the layouts are still similar. They're better, but not great, and for some reason the bookmarks get nested wrong.


>>44285886
>7. Eh.
Ouch. I don't even get a proper reply for my advice?

You know bitching about the layout in the AMA isn't going to win you any friends at OPP, Aspel.

Is anyone else worried about Hunter 2e after reading MonicaV's responses to faggot-kun in the Onyx Path AMA? Maybe she just hasn't had any inspiration yet but it sounds like she doesn't know what she's going to do other than clean-up the rules. Also, did anyone else roll their eyes at her Geist answer? I don't think multiculturalism is the big stumbling block for that game.

Finally, faggot-kun is such a fucking apple-polisher it's sickening.

>>44286010
In regards to it being vague? I don't really know how to make it less vague, as I'm unsure what exactly about it is 'vague'.

>>44286015
>>44286134
>Bitching at the layout won't win you friends
>such a fucking apple-polisher
These two posts are hilarious together.

Also, not trying to polish apples or win friends.

But yeah, it does sound like she's still in the early stages of figuring out where to go with Hunter, but at the same time Hunter is something I'm not at all worried about. Even if it's 2e is just cleaning up the rules that'd be fine. Then again I feel like I'm one of the only people who isn't upset at Changeling or Promethean.

>>44286147
Like I said, give us more information on what you're trying to do. Having a merit and a drug without any real context doesn't give us any idea on how to help you do what you're trying to do.

I'm pretty butthurt that the Yazata won't be part of the pantheons in the Scion 2e core.

>tfw both of your questions basically got "maybe someday!" answers

>>44286504
Well, the drug itself was a side-deal that had to do with the cult itself, it plays into several of their ceremonies(One of which is basically just blood-sport), as well as being a rather important boon that indoctrinated members are given, the drug itself is produced at a bit of infrastructure that the cult themselves guard/work out of.

>>44282760
We give Aspel a little.

>>44286942
We mostly tell them to fuck off, I thought.

>>44282760
Smiling Shade gets some, aspel does sometimes.
>>44286961
I don't mind him now.

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>>44286634

You WILL find true love some day anon, don't stop believing

>>44286989

I just want more Mummy books and a Dark Ages: Wraith.

>>44286942
>>44286986
>Smiling Shade gets some, aspel does sometimes.
We also both give some advice. I try to, at least.

So how do your groups deal with the worthless defence system?
Mine halves the bonus from athletics, resulting in a 3 (with specialty to dodge) from athletics at best.
This feels a bit cheap though.
Since using a full dodge now requires you to actually roll for defence i was wondering if any of you used that system for normal defence aswell and how that works for you.

>>44287323
We run it as-is and it seems to work fine.

>>44287462
How? i mean anyone with a sports background can reduce an elite fighter to a chance die in a straight up fight

>>44287323
I don't really mind the Defense as it is, but I keep telling everyone to use lower of Athletics or Brawl. With a merit, you can use lower of Athletics or Weaponry when you're armed.

All Out and Willpower in melee combat really help you get passed an opponent's defense as-is, but I'm also going to try having it where All Out only takes away your Skill to Defense, not your whole Defense. As-is, the trade off for All Out Attack is +2 for your roll and +5 for your opponent's.

Really, the problem is that if you're Brawling without some kind of gloves, you end up doing only 1B a turn when you attack. Not really a problem, but most characters who go all-in with Fighting Styles are going to want to do more damage than that.

On the subject of Dodging... I actually always did it the new way and didn't realize you weren't supposed to. I wouldn't suggest always having rolled Defense, but that's because I tend to like nWoD for the fact that you only have one roll attacks.

>>44287526
Have you really used the 2e rules?

- Most people won't have 5 dots in Athletics
- Attacker will always have the advantage when things are even due to All Out and Willpower

>>44287526
The "elite fighter" would have Fighting Merits, some of them reduce Defense or deal auto-damage. If the "sports background guy" is not a fighter himself, the fighter can even go All-Out and not worry too much. Defense is also harder to raise than attack dice pools (two Attributes to worry about, no Specialties).

And circumstantial bonuses and penalties. The athlete might not be used to being in an actual fight and so takes Defense penalties after actually attacking. Beaten Down is also going to apply after a good Willpower'd roll.

>>44287526
No they can't, unless I am really misunderstanding you.

Someone with sports background, I've not actually an athlete/professional, has base Def of 2 or 3 and Athletics 1 or 2 for Def 5 at most. Elite fighter is prob Strength 3 or 4 plus 4 in the relevant skill, plus at least 1 from Specialty (bug may we'll have AoE) for a baseline of 8 to 9, plus 3 for Willpower, probably another 2 from all out attack to absolutely fuck the other guy right up, and that is up to around 9 dice after subtracting defence. The guy with the background in athletics is fucked and we haven't featured any fighting styles etc. yet.

My werewolf players routinely chuck a lot of dice even against spirit-tier defences.

>>44287693
Are you on a phone?

Basically what >>44287526 is saying is that someone can have Wits/Dex of 3, buy Athletics 5, and then have more Defense than someone who has Strength 3 + Brawl 5.

People tend to ignore combat options like going All Out or using Willpower.

>>44287776
Even ignoring Merits, All-Out and Willpower, the Wits/Dex 3, Athletics 5 characters has spent 4 more EXP on that than the Strength 3, Brawl 5 dude.

>>44287776
iPad at the moment. hate typing on this damn thing.

Anyway, sure, but Athletics 5 is an incredible level of physical training, not a sports background. Someone with the utter muscular and reflex honing of Athletics 5 damn well should be able to give even a seasoned combatant a challenge to land a powerful hit.

>>44287632
>>44287659
Trading a +2 modifier for losing your entire defence next turn is not really a good tactical move, and with willpower you only get 5 or so tries with a measly +3 modifier before you are mentally exhausted and out of tries.
Also, very, very few fighting styles actually lowers an opponents defence, infact most styles lowers your own defence to pull off the different types of moves.

>>44287885
Also, statistically speaking, more people should have a higher athletics then people with brawl.
The athletics skill is so broad in its usage that a lot of people could be good at it through various means.

>>44286134

Geist could stand to use a little more world influence. The most interesting part of their culture is their willingness to take aspects of other cultures without abandon. It's on display in God's Own Country and that's a big part of why it's a neat setting.

As for Hunter, I think it's just too early to ask about any details. Hunter's very popular and it must be approached carefully. I'd be surprised if Monica even had a layout to speak of.

>>44287323
It works fine. And I say this as someone who doesn't actually like 70% of the post-GMC combat mechanics.

>>44287885
Well, usually you use the All-Out attack to seal the deal, for instance when you know that hit will take them out or push them into Wound Penalties. If you have a ridiculous weapon a single successful attack can straight up kill a fool.

In armed combat, weapon damage is quickly going to add up to a kill, even if you have to spent Willpower to make a hit.

In unarmed combat you either have trained combatants taking full advantage of their Fighting Merits or grapple like regular people. In a grapple the damage piles on quickly and Defense does not matter any more. A lot of Brawls are just various forms of grapples.

But really, if you do not want to roll Chance Dice and cannot commit the Willpower, then do what real people do when they have a hard time getting a hit in: Change things so they can hit!

>>44287099
Yeah, same. I like good homebrew, and those two *are* actually pretty good.

>>44286961
A few people CONSTANTLY tell him to fuck off, but it's mainly the same guy, who adamantly hates Aspel for... Some reason.

>>44288172
Well he does spam his stuff in every thread

>>44288221
Not as much, lately. And he brings up Geist these days when other people mention it.

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By the Exarchs, I never had much of an opinion on Reddit as a community -not least of all because it isn't- but each time I try to use it I'm once again convinced that anyone enjoying the layout must have immense issues with their eye sight.

>>44287955
Absolutely. Always wanted to see a bit more of Sin-Eaters being (un)helpfully enthusiastic in their interactions with the Hunters and perhaps even some mystically inclined Vampires like the Circle, trading ideas and approaches and whatnot.

It's hard to actually get RID of the weird fuckers after all and easy access to Ghost mojo seems like the kind of skill many factions would be willing to put of with quite a bit of 'disrespectful' bullshit for.

>>44288120
We could always use more, in my personal opinion.
>>44287863
>iPad at the moment. hate typing on this damn thing.
It's like communicating by tapping out morse code on an aquarium.

>>44285886
>3. Given how long it lasts, tha seems like it'd pretty quickly go lethal.
True, maybe have it so not being in combat immediately stops the effect. You're no longer pushing your body beyond what it was intended to do so popping a Xanax and sleeping it off works.
>>44286897
Oh, so it's Technomagic? This should've been a bit more clear.

>>44288069
So what you are saying is that grapple is the only way, since it circumvents defence.
That only seems to highlight the issue at hand imo.
and as i said, most fighting merits actually give a penalty to defence and very rarely makes it easier to hit. So to me it seems like it doesnt really matter how good the techniques are if they dont hit.
Also, grapple needs to initiate with a strength+brawl - defence roll. So the issue still stands. I mean how hard is it to actually hit a guy? Or better yet, grab hold of him?

>>44288258
Speaking of Geist homebrew, Aspel, have you made any more progress on the manifestations?

>>44288258
He's been talking about his gotham stuff for ages.

>>44288261
That could work, yea. Maybe have it as a much more short term deal rather than something you pump up on before a bigass fight or blood-sport. And yea, it's techno-magic more or less.

>>44288295
That is NOT what he said.
>>44288319
He's talking about a campaign he's going to be running, not really a homebrew. People do that in general threads.

>>44288320
Well, maybe not but he didnt really adress the issue either. not with anything concrete. People keep saying that fighting styles makes all the difference, but i really cant see it.
I can at best find two things that makes it easier to hit an opponent in melee from the book.
Most things actually lowers your defence and adds some kind of modifier to the hit (if it hits!)

>>44288295
Why rely on grapples? Even if a foe has a defence higher than an attacker's dice pool - not particularly common in actual play unless your ST sends you against goddamn ninjas all the time - then Willpower, all-out attacks, the penalty from multiple attackers, ambushes, Conditions, straight-up shooting them and more besides means that grappling is just one tool in the toolbox.

>>44288319

To be fair it's mostly questions on how to run Werewolf. Normally I'd say "just run it and wing it, you'll do fine", but I can understand being a bit gunshy with a new group and after a long dry spell.

>>44288295

> I mean how hard is it to actually hit a guy?
Imagine two people fighting each other, both of them focusing on not opening up their defense. You do not see that with untrained folks (just throwing All-Out Attacks at each other). On the other hand, think about how long a professional boxing match can last and those rarely even end with KOs! Also, a bit of a technicality, but worth pointing out: Hitting != Damage. A single point of Bashing damage puts the average person 1/7th of the way towards knockout That isn't just a knee into the stomach.

>Or better yet, grab hold of him?
Really connect? Probably tricky if the above is kept in mind. Again, All-Out should help and the Storyteller should give bonuses for the target having loose clothes, long hair and that sort of thing.

Also, just as an aside, I am not just theorycrafting here. I had some pretty intense GMC and VtR 2e games and high Defense was never a detriment to the game. Quite the opposite, really.

>>44287824
Hey, I'm not saying they're right, I'm just explaining people's complaint. I think they're off base. I think that Defense is at it's most just 1 or 2 points too high, and that's handled easily with a simple tweak. Even without that tweak, Defense is rarely insurmountable unless you're dealing with an Ephemeral Being that uses Finesse as Defense and has a decent Rank.

>>44287863
People tend to always assume everyone has 5 dots.

>>44287885
You're rarely going to need more than "five or so tries". Between Damage ratings, the low health, everything being lethal, and Tilts, most combat between human or humanlike opponents is ended relatively quickly.

>>44287937
This kind of attitude is one of the reasons I don't allow people to take traits that don't fit their character. "I'm a librarian, but also I have Athletics and Firearms of 4 because I run and shoot on the weekends."

>>44287955
I didn't like the way that Geist got Egyptian trappings in Mortal Remains. I don't mind it, but Egypt is territory that gets explore a lot, in many of the games (Mummy; Mekhet, Osirian) and I'd rather see China or something influencing the global Sin-eater culture. I think a syncretic mix of China/Japan and Mexican would be really good for Sin-eaters.

>>44288319
Well, yeah, but I'm also trying to run a game.

Most of the day I've been ̶w̶a̶t̶c̶h̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶G̶o̶t̶h̶a̶m̶ doing research, and also trying to finish up making Christmas presents (but I kinda fucked that up).

Not trying to start a shitstorm but how would you do a bloodline that only or only primarily embraces males?

>>44288854

Make it like one of those old boys clubs at college. only influential heirs to big estates can get embraced. also, totally NOT gay.

>>44288854
This ain't Tumblr, son.

As for your question:

1) A super traditional Bloodline inspired by sub-societies that were exclusively male, for instance knights.

2) A Bloodline deeply connected to an archetypal, mystical role that is generally considered exclusively male.

3) Perhaps as an addition to the above. Make it two Bloodlines, one male, the other female and play up that symbolism.

Now, those are mainly a cultural thing and could potentially be broken. But the Qedeshah have set the precedent of Bloodlines only working with one specific sex. Maybe a quirk of the Blood, a Curse or some other Mystery.

>>44288789
Are you seriously saying that putting a point in athletics because your character works out is not a valid reason? sure 4 athletics is one thing but using the same reasoning less people would have even one dot in brawl making the issue stand, just with even fewer dice.
Also, assuming you actually hit with those 5 or so tries with willpower you will need a week of rest just to recouperate the mental exhaustion of trying really hard to hit someone in a bar fight.
Tilts actually need something to hit to be of any use.
>>44288656
Sure, i can accept that hitting does not equal damage, at least with amateurs fighting, but boxing matches usually go on because they have a referee, a timer, protection, they know how to actively defend versus incoming attacks (dodge manouver and/or brawling dodge) and they can take a shit-load of damage (high stamina).
This still seems off to me then, that actually being able to hit is so difficult, and that countering a good hit should be an active manouver (like preventing a take-down or grapple with an opposed brawling roll or something) and not the passive lance-armstrong-is-a-dodge-god take they are doing

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>>44288854
The I'd make them a Ventrue Bloodline inspired by Highlander and the Sith.

Meaning there is a strict Master-Apprentice relationship between Sire and Neonate that focuses primarily on training up the Childe in all manners of combat and conspiracy in order to fulfill their perceived role as apex predators and rulers.

It'd be less about just being male and more being >>44288964
>2) A Bloodline deeply connected to an archetypal, mystical role that is generally considered exclusively male.
the best kind of Man you can be.

I also like the idea that they don't so much /refuse/ to Embrace women but that they /can't/, and try to make the best out of it. They're not gynophobic, but depending on character they might have a certain reflexive kind of Chauvinism going on.

They'd probably focus a LOT more on Resilience than your average cookie cutter Ventrue does.

Maybe call them the Sons of Ramiro or the Asura.

Most cities with one of their kind as prince would have his childe operate as his Seneschal.

Mess with the Prince, his Childe comes down on you HARD.

That is both a strength and a weakness as >>44288899 the Bloodline has a higher-than-normal tolerance for blood bonds.

Actually, I kind of want to write this now.
I think it could be cool.
>>44288789
>I'd rather see China or something influencing the global Sin-eater culture. I think a syncretic mix of China/Japan and Mexican would be really good for Sin-eaters.
Huh, no Voudoun or Russian Shamanism?>"I'm a librarian, but also I have Athletics and Firearms of 4 because I run and shoot on the weekends."
"You get the Hobbyist Clique merit and 2 dots and you'll like it".

>>44288899

So what you're saying is, an entire bloodline based off of this film: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAvjILE0Obo

Except, you know, with even less women.

>>44289093
actually this made me curious to se if using weaponry/brawl instead of athletics for everyone is a better option or if i should just go "fuck it, EVERYTHING IS AN OPPOSED ROLL" this last one would completely fuck with merits and shit, so i guess thats not really an option if i want to keep a semblance of integrity to the system

>>44289142

I think, in the ideal Geist, things are so mashed together due to talking about the collective culture of the Sin-Eater, that it's hard to figure out the origin of things at all. The challenge of that of course, would be that one would need to research enough so that their culture and how it forms is complex, but coherent. A good Geist culture is as much comic books and creepypasta as it is shamanism and traditional religion.

>>44281462

I know I'm the only one who gives a shit but why the fuck does the Mega have literally none of the Mummy supplements?

>>44288297
No, like I said, been a bit busy. Been thinking about it in the back of my mind, but I haven't actually updated or changed anything.
That said, I did add one of the things I've been thinking about just now. Half-Sin-eater mini template.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1SMgt9996QXnCahP_B6acce9_vZuj5myu_3RC7JYygpw/edit

>>44288899
>>44288854
I was just going to say straight up gay bloodline.

Also, I actually had one character who was a crossdressing Spina. I forget the reasons, but it was this gangbanger chick who got Embraced by a Daeva who felt bad about her dying in the middle of the street after a shoot out, and she tried to change her life around and wanted to become a Spina. She was already kind of butch, so she cut her hair and bound her breasts and impressed the Old Boy Invictus who was the only Spina around. Got inducted into the bloodline, but he kicked her out when he found out she was female.

Something like that. That sort of old school sexism of "women can't learn [THING]".
I mean, there are a ton of bloodlines that are basically "this is ladies work". Heck, I think there are already a few male only or at least primarily male Bloodlines. The Kuufukuji and Satoha are pretty male only, and any female members would be a modern nights thing. The Kuufukuji actually have a spin-off sect that's Daeva and primarily female, and the Daevas hate the Mekhets because of how the Mekhet treat the women they employ as whores.

>>44288964
>3) Perhaps as an addition to the above. Make it two Bloodlines, one male, the other female and play up that symbolism.
That's actually how the Kuufukuji are, though the Daeva one isn't actually statted up.

>>44281462
Ran Star Wars using a custom template I made that sort of ripped off Mage.

>>44289461
>the Daevas hate the Mekhets because of how the Mekhet treat the women they employ as whores.
Mekhet don't have a very wholesome approach to humanity (lower and uppercase 'H') anyways so that seems par of the course.
>>44289267
>I think, in the ideal Geist, things are so mashed together due to talking about the collective culture of the Sin-Eater, that it's hard to figure out the origin of things at all. The challenge of that of course, would be that one would need to research enough so that their culture and how it forms is complex, but coherent. A good Geist culture is as much comic books and creepypasta as it is shamanism and traditional religion.
Oh certainly, but just like Buddhism it'd probably still have recognizable regional variations, or at the very least that's how I see it.

The Twilight Network is SLOW compared to how Mages operate.

>>44289093
>Are you seriously saying that putting a point in athletics because your character works out is not a valid reason?
"Oh, I work out on my lunch break" isn't a valid reason for why your character is an olympic athlete, no.
>Also, assuming you actually hit with those 5 or so tries with willpower you will need a week of rest just to recouperate the mental exhaustion of trying really hard to hit someone in a bar fight.
Are you the person from the other day, who I had to explain 2e to? Willpower comes back a lot faster. I mean, you've always been able to get Willpower back other than by sleeping, but now it's much easier.

I've messed around with 2e. I know that yes, you can hit things. So, yes, those Tilts will come into play. And since most people are not going to want 3 damage (since that's about a third of their health) it's pretty bad.

>This still seems off to me then, that actually being able to hit is so difficult
It isn't, though.

>>44289200
Again, I suggest Defense be:
[Lower of Dexterity or Wits] + [Lower of Athletics or Brawl].

>>44289142
Voudoun is also good, but Geist already has that. There's a bit of the Mexican stuff, but not as much as could be.

>>44289267
I think half a Krewe's symbology should be bullshit they saw on TV or a video game.
>A good Geist culture is as much comic books and creepypasta as it is shamanism and traditional religion.
This is top tier. I'm going to remember to quote that in the 2e write up for Krewes.

>>44289543
>The Twilight Network is SLOW compared to how Mages operate.
I always got the impression that the Twilight Network is fast. It seemed to me like basically spooky Twitter.

I think as a general rule, restricting players to 3 or less dots in a skill unless they have a good explanation in there background is best.

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>>44289919
That's one of my houserules, actually.

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>>44290017
Also, I need to work on this.

So many homebrews...

>>44285865
In my experience the 2e layouts have been even worse, but that may just be me having gotten used to how 1e did things over 10 years.

>>44290672
On the one hand, in 1e you'd have Derangements and Merits stuck in fluff sections. But in 2e you need to read the whole book to figure out how to make your character because there are rules not mentioned in the character creation chapter. At least that's how it's been for the otherwise great Werewolf.

Hey I got a question /tg/, did they ever change the Mysterium merit that was shown in the open dev? I think someone mentioned it was changed but I wanna be sure, I reeeally didn't like it when it was first shown.

>>44291488

It is currently being changed, though we haven't seen exactly how.

>>44290820
Same with Demon.

Because demon form rules aren't at all explained in character creation.

What's the Underworld equivalent to a Locus called?

Oh are we having that lovable 'all out attack isn't worth shit' argument again? Ive been waiting to get into one of those!

Anyway my worthless 2 cents on the topic:

Do an all out attack when your opponent can't hit you back. Surprise! Any monkey knows to hit really hard when you get the first hit, or your opponent is stunned. Or doing that oh so lovable PC thing 'everyone focus on that one guy and no one else until hes down!' If no one is going to attack you, why not go all out?

When your opponent hits harder then you. Really, if your foe has a knife with a 2 damage rating then 4 hits from now you might not be in a complaining state. If you got fists and hes got said knife then all out attack + WP and give that bastard arm wrack to make him drop the knife. Now hes got 2 choices; pick up the knife again or go at your with fists. Bashing vs lethal, I would take the bashing.(-2 to aim for the arm, +2 for all out attack, you need on average 2-3 damage)

When your defense is terrible. If you have 2 or somehow less defense naturally then what does it matter that you are loosing 2 dice to get some damage.

I guess my point is, a lot of the time your not going to be using all out attack, but it wasn't made to be used all the damn time, its a tool for when you know you can't get hit with repercussions or to try and level the playing field.

Also if you have athletics 5 or brawl 5 you should have some other tools in your kit to use, rather then the 'flail your arms angrily' attack.

>>44292789
avernian gate/low place

>>44293209
>>44292558
meant to quote this guy.

Are we going to see any errata for Demon?

Also, is "Finance Psychopomp who fell because he took his own Infrastructure to the mattresses to keep his cult safe in the hopes that they could finish the job without him" too Mary Sue? I'm wondering if I should just ditch the entire idea.

I'm not sure how falling instead of noping out of existence would work though.

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>>44289143

I said NOT GAY!

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>>44288854
>>44288854

FRAT VAMPIRE HOUSE

I'M ALPHA KISS MY ASS

ALPHA ALPHA

>>44281462
>Chronicles of darkness

As someone who hasn't really touched the world since bloodlines what the hell is happened? Why can't they just announced saying that they have a new edition out instead of these bizarre rebranding like blood and smoke?

>>44295555
Blood and Smoke wasn't a rebranding, it was a new book that later got turned into the new edition's core.

>>44295555

Paradox, the Crusader King guys, bought all White Wolf IPs that Onyx Path didn't already own (Scion, Trinity, Scarred Lands) and in order to have two separate IPs to sell and prevent Hollywood Executive confusion, renamed oWoD to One World of Darkness and nWoD to Chronicles of Darkness.

>>44295555

Paradox of Crusader Kings fame bought WW and the licenses from CCP. They want to do multimedia things and things

nWoD 2nd ed is now CofD
oWoD is soon to be One World of Darkness

>>44295780
>oWoD
>One World of Darkness
Oh look, the abbreviation still fits.

>>44295806
They should've called new world of darkness... Something that fit.

>>44293835
>took his own Infrastructure to the mattresses
I'm not sure what that means in the first place. But I don't see why it would be "Mary Sue".

>>44295555
Dracula doesn't want use dirty new WoD fans dirtying up his beloved oWoD.
Plus they're kind of right, the whole "nWoD/oWoD/cWoD/WoD" thing was confusing as hell. They really should have used a different name in 2004.

>>44295780
"One World of Darkness" isn't the official name, just a marketing thing.

>>44296194

Fuck Dracula

>>44296194
>They really should have used a different name in 2004.
They probably didn't expect oWoD to have such diehard fans

>>44296194

>Dracula doesn't want use dirty new WoD fans dirtying up his beloved oWoD.

He's said multiple times one of his favorite games is Promethean the Created.

What would Promethean and Geist look like if they were made in OWOD?

>>44296392
I'm torn between making a joke and feeling like it was inevitable.

On the one hand, oWoD was dumb as fuck, but on the other they were neck and neck with D&D during the late 90s, and a strong metaplot is going to get a ton of fans even if your game is a badly edited pile of garbage with rules that barely work. D&D never really seemed to have anything *this* bad until 4e, though, where 5e is basically a reaction to everyone wishing the last edition was more like the edition two editions ago.

>>44296476
Yeah, but I get the feeling he either likes it in concept without actually playing it (which is how most people seem to be; it has a reputation for being a good idea but "unplayable" because of the themes) or would rather just make an oWoD version of it. He doesn't seem to care for the nWoD as a whole and it doesn't seem like he'd mind if he just cut the whole thing to further his One World of Darkness.

>>44296554
Wraith.

>>44296556
>He doesn't seem to care for the nWoD as a whole and it doesn't seem like he'd mind if he just cut the whole thing to further his One World of Darkness.

His heart is in the right place then

>>44296620
How do you figure?

>>44296819
Anon's obviously a fan of oWoD and super salty that CofD exists.

Does the new White Wolf deal mean we'll get in-store versions of the 20th anniversary line?

There's any love here for Mage: the Sorcerers Crusade? This gem deserves more appreciation.

>>44285094
The problem with the Tillinghast-drug is that it can overstimulate the pineal gland, which sometimes leads to disintegration. Which thankfully is quite painless.

>>44297712
>Which thankfully is quite painless.

That is a lie propogated by ghosts killed by the drug in question to trick you into taking it.

>>44297738
No no no, it's the seeing the things that disintegrate you that is painful.

>Memorable landmarks from across the world plopped down in the middle of nowhere.
>Weird, larger than life architecture
>seedy as fuck elements everywhere
>informal contracts and rigged bets everywhere
>literally located in "paradise," and symiltaniously in the middle of nowhere

Do Changelings or Arcadia have a hand in Las Vegas?

>>44297756
The whole place is Infrastructure

>>44297764
>>44297756
Why not both?

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>>44297770
Las Vegas is Hedge Infrastructure.

Crap, I just pictured the CSI series with DB Russel in CofD.

This is total fanon from a fansplat, but what would happen if a Genius used their ability to understand any technology on a piece of the God Machine? Would anything happen at all, aside from enlightenment, head exploding, Angels coming to kill the Genius, or nothing at all?

On a related note, how hard would it be for a Genius to become SUCH a force of chaos and insanity that the True Fae would start following him or her like a real life Truman Show? "Convince North Korea's top brass that Kim Sr. Descended from the sky like an angel and ordered them to dance to South Korean pop" level, or "caused the deaths of millions on a whim" level?

>>44297832
>On a related note, how hard would it be for a Genius to become SUCH a force of chaos and insanity that the True Fae would start following him or her like a real life Truman Show? "Convince North Korea's top brass that Kim Sr. Descended from the sky like an angel and ordered them to dance to South Korean pop" level, or "caused the deaths of millions on a whim" level?

I think I speak for the whole board when I say: What the hell are you talking about son?

>>44297877
Geniuses are a fansplat of mad scientists, and most of the dialogue writing in the corebook makes them seem hilariously deranged. Not to mention the entire splat has the same feel as the fake documentary "Look Around You."

The True Fae are always looking for interesting sources of conflict, and for people to abduct, mess with, or otherwise use to entertain themselves.

How much general insanity would a Genius need to cause in order for them to start watching him or her? Would he or she need to be "funny" insane or "Doctor Doom as a mass murder" insane?

>>44297892
That wasn't the problem. The problem was your examples.

>>44297892
The true fae are indeed great for shenanigans. I intended to introduce an aging true-fae to my hunter group in their next lil plot arc, every couple of years or so they just sorta...lapse, and a bunch of their changelings escape, followed quickly by them playing pickup sticks with them until they lapse again.

>>44297892
>How much general insanity would a Genius need to cause in order for them to start watching him or her? Would he or she need to be "funny" insane or "Doctor Doom as a mass murder" insane?

You know, I wouldn't use a comic book villain as my example for when one is serious. Especially not Dr. Doom.

>>44297911
that could actually be quite cool, maybe they are trying to keep the changelings because they need someone to act as a living battery/avatar for themselves.

>>44297903
Oh! Sorry. That makes sense. I was trying to go for one extreme of "zany"
and one of unforgivable cruelty.

>>44297911
That sounds equal parts interesting and horrifying, which means it fits perfectly in Hunter.

>>44297915
Really? Doctor Doom is actually a good example of a Genius character if you remove some of the hammy parts and focus on the "I can lead the world better than anyone else, and too bad for anyone who disagrees."

>>44297945
That was part of the idea, partially I'm borrowing bits from a gm friend of mine who ran a game of changeling that didn't pan out, the keeper would go through weird cycles where he'd just lose control of his realm and half his changelings would escape, said keeper pretty much made up 90% of the people in his area as "masks", tended to groom some of his changelings to serve as new masks for him to play.
>>44297954
Sounds like I'm on the right track! With any luck I'll have the idea distilled out a bit more before they actually 'get' to that plot arc.

>Generaly unhappy with where I am in my life
>Lots of creative energy going unused
>Already in abusive situation
>Most of the meaning in my life comes from beauty and art that could be considered otherworldly

Is this how Arcadia gets you?

>>44298136
>otherworldly art
Is that talking about games or are you just being idealistic about your own work?

>>44298156
Stuff like Cirque du Soleli. I'm not talking about my own work.

I should mention that I really like escapism.

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>>44297832
>This is total fanon from a fansplat, but what would happen if a Genius used their ability to understand any technology

1) It's repeatedly said that the GM operates on Clarke's Third Law. As such a high enough intelligence is capable of rationally grasping at least minute aspects of it.

A Genius would relate to the God Machine the way Sequel That Shall Not Be Named -Era Carter relates to Asgard and Ancient technology; Not a full understanding, but they could eventually pick up on the right ways to smack Technognostic constructs so they do what they want of them.

2) Depending on what they do, I'd suggest you require the player to roll in order to avoid gaining the Marked condition from Heirs to Hell (need to be careful so I don't fuck this up again), meaning the GM's gotten a little too interested in them.

3) Anything that actively runs on Aether or Essence WILL bring down Unchained, Angels and in the latter case a potpourri of other splats. Best case the lab burns down and a couple fireman cultists steal the thing.

>>44296859
>Does the new White Wolf deal mean we'll get in-store versions of the 20th anniversary line?
Hopefully. I get the PoD move was necessary at the time but it's really disconnected a lot of people from CoDa and WoD who'd otherwise have gottan involved (again). It's a bitch to get anyone interested in something you can't just look at and impulse-buy at a store.

>>44293835
>is "Finance Psychopomp who fell because he took his own Infrastructure to the mattresses to keep his cult safe in the hopes that they could finish the job without him" too Mary Sue?
There is nothing Mary Sue about 1) Falling because of getting too involved in mortal affairs 2) Having Resource 5 as a result of it. Might in fact be a decent enough plot hook. Obviously it was you who created the Housing Bubble of 2008...

>>44289679
>seemed to me like basically spooky Twitter.
All the shitposting, man. Only Mages are probably worse in that area.

>>44298210
>A Genius would relate to the God Machine the way Sequel That Shall Not Be Named -Era Carter relates to Asgard and Ancient technology
What, do you not like Atlantis?

>>44298210
Thank you for this incredibly detailed answer!

Could it be possible that Wonders which compell the GM to act in certain ways or even mark other people as priority targets are actually what the Peerage and Lemuria refer to as the Needle Grail?

Is Mania some kind of pervasive glitch in the God Machine, given that it specifically ignores all laws of physics but breaks down spectacularly once inspected by someone who knows how science works?

A kiasyd
just a kiasyd
some old fart with shriveled up lips and saggy eyes
someone who does not fight neither physically nor verbally.
someone who just opens portals for the gang or makes dinner. someone you talk to not because hes a great fixer of things but because he wont judge you. with goblinism. some goblins for him to boss around and most likely stumble over and break his glass bones. his hobby in the after life? collect lighters. yes thats right . from zippos to "why wont this trash work fuck it" he collects them all. he asks the party to collect them for him cuz he wont leave the basement/house. maybe even send goblins to steal them from drunk ppl in bars ? . storing blood in one ore 10 of his lighters to hand out to the party.
"if you fall on some hard times Sonny just bite on one of these"
what does he do wilst the party is out killing ppl with katanas at mach 3? shine his zippos prepare for the evac portal. "that darn goblin been on my collection again im missing the blue one with the dolphin on it GET OVER HERE U LITTLE GREEN SHIT"
i realy wanna play dis guy

>kiasyds dogma is riddles. what kind of riddles is he solving shining zippos in a basement?
well yes kiasyds are fascinated with riddles and knowledge but why always play a librarian?
one of the biggest riddles in 21 century is
".. where is my lighter?"
and he has the answer
"in my basement"
infact he has allot of answers to allot of ppls questions. wich pleases him greatly.
>you aint gonna do much and will most likely find yourself watching the other PCs battle and shine while you shine your zippos
well thats up to the ST and the party. i might just get information from the nossie network wilst captain badass swings his katana but thats ok. i like my chars passive but helping

>>44298252

>character:
he has gazed to far
at some point in his past in the pocket dimension he contacted something deep down in the abyss
or maybe it has contacted him anyhow a glance at that being made him lose it.
is rest self gathered what was still human and warm in his essence and found a scene.
he was a student in jena and a mediocre one at that. he was called to one of his teachers to get some beating. johann wolfgan Döbereiner. as he got skulked he noticed a fascinating object on his desk. asking him what it is for. the teacher grabbed it and KLICK there was a flame in his hand.

that flame was the only thing his mind could grasp before the rest went silent.

>grumpy
>mumbles to himself when he feels unnoticed
>hates the noise trains make when they stop
>hates trains in general

>>44298252
>>44298256
the fuck are you saying/on?

>>44298252
>>44298256
I genuinely have no clue what is going on here.

>>44298249
>Is Mania some kind of pervasive glitch in the God Machine, given that it specifically ignores all laws of physics but breaks down spectacularly once inspected by someone who knows how science works?
I'd love to see what happened when an Angel tried to perceive one of the Manes.

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>>44298272
>>44298268
get riddled

>>44298289
that still tells us 'fuck' and/or 'all'.

>>44298252
>>44298256
I have no idea what the hell you're saying, but I kind of want to make Kiasyd for VtR2e. Someone posted the Dark Ages V20 write up, and it was kind of interesting. Someone else mentioned them in relation to nWoD Faetouched being Embraced, or something like that this thread/last thread. Might be a good place to start.

>>44298297
A rare form of aphasia the works by typing instead of speaking.

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>>44298297
character idea for vtm
you no likings?

>>44298315
I, for one, think it makes absolutely no sense. It would be great for a Malkavian.

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>>44298323
ok every time i post on this general and come up with a character ppl tell me its shit but works great for malkavs. darn it how do you kiasyd ?
like i said i dont wanna be a librarian or breckett. and other then that there is just no way you can kiasyd.
its a 2 meter tall slenderman elf who likes to eat children. how can you play that sane?
they dwell even deeper in the abyss then the lasombra can how do you stay sane?

i give up

>>44298389
>i give up
An excellent step on the road to madness.

>>44298256
>>44298252

Are you on the drugs used to write Changing Breeds?
>>44298249
>Could it be possible that Wonders which compell the GM to act in certain ways or even mark other people as priority targets are actually what the Peerage and Lemuria refer to as the Needle Grail?
That... could make sense.
>but breaks down spectacularly once inspected by someone who knows how science works?
Methinks that feels more how Enlightened Science works in Ascension, but sure give the Genius and his tech a Cover rating. Right Tools, Right Job seems to push a similar SCIENCE, WHAT SCIENCE angle after all so we do have precedent for it.

>>44298389
They are literally already a Lasombra Bloodline, but what you are describing makes the one you want to play sound like a Malkav.

>>44298389
>ok every time i post on this general and come up with a character ppl tell me its shit but works great for malkavs.
Maybe the problem is you. I mean, you start on with this inane ramble with no explanation and you're barely making sense.

>>44298427
>>44298423
>>44298419
so lemme get this straight.
someone gets embraced in like africa 300 years ago
bruja or whatever is most generic.
he witnesses the death of countless child soldiers being eaten alive by monsters like him either supernatural or just sick warlords.
this goes on for 300 years

lads and gents i present to you the most mentally stable addition to your group.
he has no mental scars or traumas because hes not a malkav so he cant break down.
what? being exposed to the supernatural an prolonging your existence for 300 years while you can feel the beast taking more and more control
thats OK you still a cool suave dude becasue
your
not
malkav

iv this reasoning is actually canon im quiting

>>44298479
>you're barely making sense.
I blame that Abyssal Aphasia. the one where you are infected, but when you try to tell people about what you are saying starts making less and less sense.

>>44298490
Are you on that stuff that Chris mentioned opens your mind to the Twilight? cos it sure sounds like it. you're just luanching into the idea without any background.

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>>44298479
>ramble
maybe thats the point i was trying to make.
reading this might be intentionally irritating to get the mood across

or maybe im just rambling

>>44298521
>cos it sure sounds like it. you're just luanching into the idea without any background.
Oh god, how you've infected me. at least I can still use commas and proper word formation.

>>44298528
>how
*now
Help me.

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>>44298535
malkiasyd strikes
again

>>44298567
Fuck, the dude is walking Abyssal Infrastructure!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxDQh_-vJss
Would Ultron be a Beast?

>>44298423 #
Awesome! Thank you again. I really like talking about Genius. That explains why nobody can use Apokalypsi 5 to discover the Needle Grail. Rolling an exceptional after asking "how do I Needle Grail?" gives a really basic printout of the God Machine existing and how to build Wonders that make it act in ways that it shouldn't. Basically like a beginner's guide to writing computer viruses for the universe.

And then the antivirus software shows up.

Unless you stumble upon it by trial and error after using Understand Technology on Infrastructure, at which point you're not dangerous enough to get wiped off the face of the earth quite yet. Then you can get into the fun of literally tampering in God's domain.

Fuck. Now I want to see an Equinox Road or Gutter Magic type addon for Genius, with rules for fucking with the code behind reality and either ascending to jury rigged demonhood or rediscovering a version of Enlightened Science. Admittedly the second one makes much less sense given that Mania is explicitly not magic of any kind, but I really like the Technocrats. Personal bias.

Also, you're right. Wonders only break down when someone touches them, not when someone notices they're impossible. The latter is Enlightened Science. It does say that people who know how science works are unusually good at making them blow up though. The implications!

>>44298735
>Unless you stumble upon it by trial and error after using Understand Technology on Infrastructure, at which point you're not dangerous enough to get wiped off the face of the earth quite yet. Then you can get into the fun of literally tampering in God's domain.
God help anyone if you learn how to make Infrastructure in your Lab.

>>44298579
Thanks for THAT idea!
I have a Mage/Demon crossover campaign floating around in my head. Was going to mostly go the Seers/GM angle. But Abyssal Infrastructure! That's amazing!
It needs a rather reliable Output, so it has to involve something there is a lot of. Humans. Abyssal thought patterns? That sounds nice.

>>44299067
>Abyssal thought patterns? That sounds nice.
Maybe the maybe it's forcing people to act as conduits for itself essentially bot-netting humans if one person is thinking about it, even passively, then the people around them will get the same nagging thoughts at the backs of their heads as well.

So.. what with all this talk of Infrastructure... could someone explain it to me. I've read the part in the Demon book... and I still don't get it.

So I've been thinking about the Male Only Bloodline a little bit more. Killing another Immortal is pretty much Diablerie, right?

Backtracking a bit to Masquarade, but what if each Kindred of the Bloodline understands itself as part of a Deity, and Diablerie is a means to re-gather all the splinters of it?

Osiris is already used by both Requiem and PtC. Are there any other myths that deal with male a deity getting cut apart?

Does any of this sound even remotely good?
>>44298886
>God help anyone if you learn how to make Infrastructure in your Lab.
Yep.
>>44261563
>● A working group of Fractals at the University of Washington has found a way to duplicate Occam's Razor. Does the party try to suborn them, support them or just blow it all to hell because the smell of Angel is way too thick on the entire project?

>>44298735
>ascending to jury rigged demonhood
You gonna try to backdoor god?
>Unless you stumble upon it by trial and error after using Understand Technology on Infrastructure, at which point you're not dangerous enough to get wiped off the face of the earth quite yet.
Yep, it's likelier to just make the Genius in question Stigmatic, which is going to give you THRICE the madness for the same price!!
>That explains why nobody can use Apokalypsi 5 to discover the Needle Grail. Rolling an exceptional after asking "how do I Needle Grail?" gives a really basic printout of the God Machine existing and how to build Wonders that make it act in ways that it shouldn't. Basically like a beginner's guide to writing computer viruses for the universe.
>And then the antivirus software shows up.
I really like this explanation.
>>44299067
>Guardians and Inquisitors haphazardly trying to get over their rapidly mounting paranoia to stop it
>Integrators teaming up with the Gatekeepers and getting BTFO
I like it.
>>44298619
Ultron came from Loki's scepter, right? Pretty sure he's an Unfleshed who lay dormant inside.

>>44299179
Infrastructure is essentially anything that serves as part of an occult matrix. It's also the lower-case-i infrastructure that goes into creating the Infrastructure, like diverted shipping manifests and pizza boxes that get delivered to the houses of giant flies.

Infrastructure (usually hidden in folds of space created by other Infrastructure) tends to have some sort of function, but what function that is varies. They also tend to have a Lynchpin, and if you destroy that the entire Infrastructure crumbles (metaphorically or literally) and becomes unusable and, because of how the God-Machine tends to work, is unlikely to be tried again in that fashion.

>>44299209
The way you quote things tends to get confusing.

>>44299241
>The way you quote things tends to get confusing.
Do you mean cross-thread quoting?
(Sorry for the double-post)
>>44299179
>So.. what with all this talk of Infrastructure... could someone explain it to me. I've read the part in the Demon book... and I still don't get it.
Infrastructure is just technology operating on science mankind doesn't yet understand.

As opposed to magical devices which operate on things man CANNOT understand because it isn't of this world.

The first is handing Graham Bell a Nokia 7500. It's a phone alright, but without extensive study of fields he isn't even aware of exist he'll never ever find out how it works.

Infrastructure always has some sort of quasi-magical aspect and/or purpose such as manipulating time and space.

>>44298210
I doubt they'll put the 20th Anniversary ones in stores. They want to put their whatever-4th-edition-becomes in stores and having 20th Anniversaries in there will dilute that focus and attention as well.

>>44300016
>I doubt they'll put the 20th Anniversary ones in stores. They want to put their whatever-4th-edition-becomes in stores and having 20th Anniversaries in there will dilute that focus and attention as well.
V20 already is in stores though.

>>44297659

I always thought its Magic system was super fun, maybe even more than baseline Ascension. I'd like to see it again someday.

>>44300086
Eh? Where are you at that has V20 copies in a physical brick and mortar shop?

>>44300140
>Eh? Where are you at that has V20 copies in a physical brick and mortar shop?
Austria. There is barely any nWoD though; In fact the LGS owner didn't even know what DtD was despite having answers to everything else.

>>44300239

That'd explain it then. There's still a few European distributers for V20.

>>44300394
>tfw 125 Euro for V20 Premium edition
So tempted.

>>44292558
Avernian Gate or Haunt

>>44298427

I think that got retconned in the anniversary edition

>>44288258
>other people mention it
You know that's Aspel just samefagging, right?

What tag skills would you pick for Professional Training for a vampire that makes their living (and feeds) off running a little custom tailoring shop? Have mortals to run the shop during the day, sew clothes and handle particularly rich clientele in the evenings.

Crafts, obviously, but are there any other tag skills that could fit?

I guess they call them Asset Skills. I'd need two more (third dot adds a third asset skill).

There's a house rule in place that you can't turn combat skills rote in combat with PT, so no need to try and shoehorn weaponry (scissors) into it or anything.

>>44301410
Persuasion, obviously. Any shopkeep needs that. And Politics might be a good one?

>>44301410
Persuasion would be a good one. Business owner and such

>>44301498
>>44301516
What would business management/accounting/economics fall under? Academics?

>>44301601
Academics covers economics and law, so yes.

>>44301498
>>44301516
>>44301629
Thanks, guys.

>>44301629

So the Academics is the knowledge of Law, and Politics is the practice? Trying to refresh myself on the nWoD skills.

>>44302005
I believe so. Politics is also figuring out who does what in a bureaucracy.