Welcome back to your irregularly scheduled 40K AU discussion.
The Hektor Heresy is a long-running collaborative writing project based on 1d4chan. The main page is at https://1d4chan.org/wiki/The_/tg/_Heresy, but the Primarch page is also a decent starting point: https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Primarchs_(Hektor_Heresy)
Last time >>48106503 we left off discussing various existential threats to the Imperium in the wake of the great civil war of the Heresy. Who needs The Beast when you have the Vetrovnak?
I looked at the last thread with the suggestions for a new Thunder Kings color scheme. They aren't bad, I particularly like the suggestion to replace the Aquila's wings with lightning bolts. I think that the gold should be featured more prominently though. I'd mock something up but my computer has no internet.
In particular, we have a pitch for a massive invasion of the nascent Imperium by the Ruavu Grun to consider:
>>48175189
>The Ruavu Grun are part Aliens from Independence Day, part Vortigaunt from Half Life and part Yuzhaan Vong from the old Star Wars Expanded Universe. They use dimensional tunnelling to get around, genetically modify subject races to better serve them and use a vast swathe of unusual technologies that made them a tough foe to face. During the Crusade they show up, the Imperium understandably shoots first, and then they launch a full scale invasion that overruns almost all of Segmentum Tempestus before they are finally halted at the gates of Segmentum Sol. Then the Imperium, led by the Emperor in Person proceeds to reconquer Tempestus and utterly exterminate the Ruavu Grun, so that by 953.M30 they are practically extinct.
Thoughts? Opinions? Tirades?
>>48185394How many holes do they have.
>>48185394
Just how sentient are these guys? Closer to the Vong or Xenomorphs?
>>48185295
>Those Ork poses
AWAKEN, MY BOSS
>>48185499
In terms of sentience I'd put them halfway between the Vortigaunts and the Vong. They're smart enough to flee when the Tyranids swarm their galaxy a few million years before the present (30k) time.
>>48185490No idea. I frankly don't want to imagine their reproductive habits.
>>48185490After the Emperor is finished with them, I'd say that the answer is "a lot".
>>48185639
I don't really understand those terms of reference. Can you rephrase that without bear lore, i.e. Are we talking about something smarter than a human? A lot smarter? Somewhat dumber?
>>48185815
Well, I know the yuuzhan vong are about as smart as humies. No idea about the vortigaunts.
>>48185815
It's not supposed to make sense. It's a level of intelligence humans can't quite comprehend. They've mastered dimentional travel and dark energy manipulation, their minds operate on a level beyond human comprehension. And yet because they're used to fighting biological enemies, they're not used to humans and especially Space Marines, which ends up their downfall.
>>48185899
That idea reminds me a bit of the jokaero.
>>48185891
The internet puts Vortigaunts across as intelligent and social, seemingly comparable to humans in intelligence. So basically, these guys are a human-like intelligence, except
>>48185899
UNFATHOMABLE.
I guess my main question about the Ruavu Grun is what impact they'd have on the Scale Bearers and Steel Marshals.
>>48185952
Him, I guess then I would put them at the same level of intelligence as a human (both of them are the same number on a 1-10 scale of "intelligence"), but the Grun have thought patters and priorities that make little to no sense to humans. Darmok and jalaad at tanagra!
>>48186053
Scale Bearers are the Salamander-type 'Champions of the Common Man' now aren't they?
If so, they'd be sickened by the 'Battleborn', massive legions of modified Human Serf-Soldiers the Ruavu Grun deploy en-masse during the reconquest of Tempestus.
As for the Marshals, they'd have to storm the Citydisk Ships that are both mobile population center and city destroyer weapons for the Ruavu Grun.
>>48186212
I was thinking more in material terms. Both Centauri and Solnhofen are in Tempestus - were you thinking that their homeworlds would be attacked/threatened/bypassed?
>>48186327
Most likely they'd hit both, only to receive a bloody nose because of just how fortified Legion Homeworlds are, not to mention that the Ruavu Grun are not experienced in fighting Space Marines.
>>48185366
That was me, thanks for the appreciation.
I could try and edit the colour scheme I made a bit more if you want? I can't really do anything for the aquila, though.
>>48186703
Yeah, I didn't figure the Aquila could be changed. Yeah, if you wanna throw something together with more gold I will gladly look. At minimum I'll use it for a successor chapter, once I get my internet back
>>48186751
>>48186885
The aquila can be turned into the Imperial eagle aquila, but tere's obviously no option for lightning bolt aquila.
>>48186903
>>48186917
And of course I can always just turn the aquila gold instead of silver, if you want.
>>48186929
>>48186945
And in this one I reversed the gold and the blue, which might have overdone it.
Still, here's a few attempts to include more gold.
>>48186903
I think this one is my favorite. The gold collar is sort of like a torc, which fits perfectly. I'm save it and really give it a look next to my present scheme; thanks! May I ask why you dislike the current design though? Just curious.
>>48187051
I've always disliked the halved/quartered designs. They're hard to paint IRL and I, personally, just think they're ugly.
>>48187093
Ah, I gotcha. I definitely see where you're coming from. I didn't take into account the painting cause I don't actually play the game. But I definitely think your designs capture what I want from their appearance, which is the green of forests, the deep blue of night, and the color of lightning in said night. Also the sort of noble aspect of gold. I appreciate it! Just gotta get some internet so I can update the designs.
>>48187184
Here's another one for you, with the design you like. The only thing I changed, other than adding some weapons and a cloak/loin cloth, was his upper arms are blue instead of green.
>>48187280
I like the change to the arms. This design might work well with a larger variety of cloak colors too
>>48187093
May I ask how you feel about the other Legion colour schemes? I'm more of a words and punctuation guy, so I've never felt particularly confident saying what's good or bad visual art.
>>48187371
I don't actually know what most of the other Legion's colour schemes even are, so I'll take a look at them and get back to you.
>>48187366
Well that's really easy to do, actually. I could get you a couple of different cloak colours in a fw minutes. I just chose that one because it's a relatively neutral colour and the hex code for it was on my screen.
On a more narrative level, I have been thinking about Ullanor.Brace yourselves.
Writing out the Pathorum Xenocide helped me to figure out more about Hektor and how he approaches big campaigns. The "place of decision" was a bit of a throwaway in the Legion description, but it really came through in the Kopt Dara battles. I think that the Ullanor Crusade ought to follow a similar pattern. Rather than Horus's strategy of striking straight at the throneworld because that's where the enemy is, Hektor would want to bring the Orks to a place of his choosing and systematically destroy them.
Thankfully, he has Rogerius Merrill to scout out the Ullanor Empire and find the ideal system for that battle. Let's call it Megiddo for fairly obvious reasons. The rough plan would be for the Emperor and Hektor to invade Megiddo and essentially "call out" the greenskins. The Heralds and Custodes, supported by elite regiments from the Imperial Army, fight a long holding action, aiming to draw more and more Orks into the battle. Once Hektor estimates that the tipping point has been realised and the greatest strength of Ullanor is concentrated at Megiddo, he calls three other Legions into action.
The Silver Cataphracts and Lifebringers drop at Megiddo itself to turn the tide of battle in favour of the Imperials. Alexandri's men are experts at the attrition and elimination style required here, and Johannes Vrach's knowledge of bioweapons is invaluable in defeating the Orks.
Just as important are the Iron Rangers. They don't attack at Megiddo, but instead deploy in Chapter strength throughout the Ullanor Empire, rampaging through Orkish worlds aiming to kill the few boyz who haven't made it to the biggest fight their empire's ever seen.
Does this work? Am I missing anything? I can see already that we might end up with the Triumph of Megiddo instead of the Triumph of Ullanor, but that wouldn't be such a bad thing.
>>48187602
Cool, thanks.
>>48187093
Same here. None of the canon legions have halved or quartered designs, and they're all the better for it.
>>48187602
Sure! My ideas were sky blue and dark red. Black would probably work too
>>48185295
I find myself thinking of Ork food now. Do they truly get many carbs from Photosynthesis or is it the Squigs & Fungus beer? I assume that's still the same.
>>48187371
>>48187602
Okay, so, most Legions have 1, if even that, picture of their colour schemes so it can be somewhat hard to judge, but...
>Thunder Kings: You already know my opinions.
>Steel Marshals: It's quartered/checkered so that already makes me dislike it. Combine that with the fact that there's another white-red legion and that white-red has little to do with steel... I'm not a fan.
>Justicars: No pictures, hard to judge. Black and white doesn't sound like it would match up very well with their heraldry/symbol, but whatever.
>War Scribes: I rather like it, actually. Grey is a little overused amongs the Legions but it looks good on them.
>Void Angels: The colour scheme is perhaps a bit bright for something with Void in it's name, but the colours aren't bad or anything. Not what I would have chosen, but still good. Maybe darken them up a bit?
>Stone Men: They only have a singular picture of them, and it has a tabard covering most of the armour, but from what I can see it's pretty good.
>Silver Cataphracts: Like I said, grey is perhaps a bit overused. But considering their name it makes sense for them. I would perhaps go with a slightly whiter shade of grey, but I have no real complaints witth them. The light blue doesn't stand out very much, but I assume that was on purpose. The one picture of them has a tabard on, which makes it slightly hard to judge.
>Scale Bearers: Not a huge fan of their symbol/heraldry. They're colour scheme is very similar to that of the Salamanders, but still different. I'd try to liven it up a bit more, personally, but they're fine as they are now.
>Eyes of the Emperor: Their colours are shared with the Thunder Kings and doesn't mesh particulalry well with their symbol/heraldry. Nothing ultimately wrong with it, though I'd choose something else if I was making them. Maybe try to make it a bit more... exciting to look at? Either that or even more plain and simple, considering they're supposed to be monks.
Will be continued.
>>48187702
Can do, bud.
Continued from >>48187871
>The Entombed: Another grey Legion. Their colour scheme isn't bad, and I rather like it, but it is somewhat boring to look at. No, scratch that. It's really boring to look at. It's practically all one colour. If you don't want to change the colours, you've got to do something to make it interesting to look at, even if that is just altering the shade of grey on some areas.
>Sons of Fire: Meh, it's about what I expected. If you want something really interesting, do something similar to the Celebrants colour scheme, just darker.
>Lions Rampant: Colour schemed is halved, and the two colours are dissimilar enough from eachother to not sort of blend, but too similar from each other to really contrast. I don't like it very much.
>Iron Rangers: They look like rancid shit, with all those browns aand greens. Which is gerat if they're Nurgle followers, not so great otherwise. When you're dealing with colours like brown and green, you egnerally want them to either be vibrant or very subdued, bright or dark. The in between areas can make something look horrible, especially if there's too much of it going on. I generally think you should just 'tone down' these guys. Make their colour scheme less busy looking, with less... I'll be blunt, ugly colours. Also, what does brown and green have to do with iron?
>Heralds of Hektor: They have 3 different colour schemes on their page, all of which look... fine, I guess. I might need to get back to these guys later.
>Eternal Zealots: They have ne picture of themselves, which has a tabard/robe on. From what I can see they look fine.
>Crimson Teeth: They have no pictures of themselves, their colours is TBD and they're page is apparently pending for deletion. I can't say anything about them, nor am I sure I need to.
>Black Augars: Not the most interesting colour scheme, but if they're supposed to be stealthy it works. I suggest livening them up a bit, at the very least make their features easier to see.
Done.
>>48187943
>>48188096
>>48188140
>>48187871
>>48188089
If you have any interesting ideas for colour schemes for these Legions, we'd love to see them.
And something more appropriate for 30k era Marines.
>>48188089
Oh shit, I did frget one.
>Life Bringers: The other white-red Legion, though considering they're Spess Mehreen medics/nurses it makes sense for them. A bit bright, maybe, but the colurs are fine. I kind of want to see what they look like after falling to Chaos, as that would really help me decide whether I liek their colour scheme or not.
>>48188186
Maybe some other time, but I'm actually somewhat tired of painting stuff today. Sorry.
>>48188096
Mm, turquoise. That's an interesting choice, better than I would have figured.
>>48188140
Ehh. Sky blue still doesn't work. Damn.
>>48188310
The wwebsite I use to get my hexcodes calld teh colour darkskyblue, so that's why I chose it.
Sorry about the light sky blue, though.
>>48188587
>>48188228
I'm making so many typos today... fuck.
Also, I may or may not be interested in writing some stuff about the Mechanicum/Mechanicus in this.
>>48188089
The Black Augurs aren't stealthy, they're outrageously evil.Well, by the time of the Heresy at least.
They originally had a more varied colour scheme, but I slowly cut it back to what it is now because it always felt too busy.
>>48188614
I know, I did read at least a little bit about them. Their colour scheme could still use a least a little bit of variance too it, though. I can barely make out the details.
>>48188624
Also, the infobox says their colour scheme is "Black, with gold trim and yellow highlights" while the picture has them as black with some purple.
I assume this is what you meant when you said you continuously reduced the colour scheme?
>>48188624
I feel like that's more a failing of the Space Marine painter I used for the mock up. I'll probably think of a new scheme tomorrow, but here's some models I saw a while back that are similar to the idea I had but with even less variance.
>>48188710
Correct, though I don't ever remember saying they were yellow highlights. Originally it was black, gold, and white. The black, gold, and purple. Then just black and purple. There was no elegant way to make them pop, look good, stay thematic, and not just be Black Legion colour schemes.
>>48188714
Those marines actually look pretty good, and I can see what you want from them now. Maybe I can take a shot at making something that looks good?
>>48188724
Shit, I meant to say white and accidentally wrote yellow.
>>48188759
Go ahead man.
That said, I always kind of intended them to be super customized individually. There aren't very many Black Augurs, and every one of them puts a lot of personal touches on their gear. Lots of sorcerous runes, nasty talismans, and various other villainous odds and ends. Think about the Legion upgrade kits that Forge World puts out for their HH stuff, but for the entire Legion.
It's another thing the painter doesn't really do justice.
>>48188593
>Also, I may or may not be interested in writing some stuff about the Mechanicum/Mechanicus in this.
Feel free to take a swing. There's some material already established, but still quite a lot of room for development.
>>48188791
How's this?
>>48188906
Obviously the left-shoulder symbol would vary depending upon the particular marine, and the helmet sstripe likely wouldn't be universal.
But I think I did aa pretty good job of making the Marines from >>48188714
>>48188587
Brennus is having some issues posting to 4chan but asked me to pass on that he appreciates the efforts with sky blue and that he still likes the turquoise.
>>48188998
More typos. Yay...
>>48189028
Cool, thanks.
>>48187632
I see no problems here.
I think there would eventually be a fight at Ullanor, because it is the capital of the Orks, and it's going to get there eventually. But the campaign could be won at Megiddo.
>>48188840
I guess I'll just... list a few ideas I had for the Mechanicum/s, mostly Post-Heresy.
>A Tech-priest/Skitarii is actually blessed by the power of the Omnissiah and becomes a̶n̶ ̶A̶d̶m̶e̶c̶h̶ ̶L̶i̶v̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶S̶a̶i̶n̶t̶ a Tech Saint... or something.
>The Dark Mechanicus, or at least a splinter sect of it, are trying to build the Machine God/a new Chaos God within the Warp/Soul Forges/a secret Dark Mechanicus base.
>During the Great Crusade a Forge World with hyper advanced technolgy had been discovered - they'd also been discovered to have been taken over by the Necrons/a C'tan Shard (of the Void Dragon, maybe?) and get exterminated through great effort.>The Admech manages to dig up an STC fragment containing the Internet, only to discovered it is riddled with Slaaneshi corruption - especially this one part of it called /d/...
>>48189296
I think all of these work, actually. A Tech Saint might put an end to disputes over doctrine around M32/33, the Dark Mechanicus building a super-ultra-mega-titan (or whatever form they give to their Machine God) is great, and there's plenty of Forge Worlds getting purged during the Great Crusade.Except for the internet, of course. That is triple-Heresy.
>>48189317
Yay! I did good!
Pat me on the head Senpai!
>>48189317
>the Dark Mechanicus building a super-ultra-mega-titan (or whatever form they give to their Machine God) is great
I thought we already did that with the Folly of Man?
>>48189393
The what of the who now?
M-my idea isn't unique? Oh no, what will senpai think now?!
>>48189393
Did we? I only really remember Folly as a throwaway in Abdul Al'Sherar's story.
>>48189393
It's not like we couldn't use another one.
>>48189422
A Hybrid of Daemon and Titan built on Mars by the Dark Mechanicum. Killed by the greatest knight of the age during the liberation of Mars in the scouring.
>>48189437
...ah, okay.
So it was the building of a mega Daemon Engine that was done before, not the attempted construction of a Chaos Machine God.
>>48189432
Voltron taught me that where there's one giant fighting robot there's usually another two.BattleTech taught me that Voltron was under-doing things.
>>48189463
That applies recursively you know.
>>48189482
This would explain the continued popularity of mecha entertainment. Sadly I was only able to secure a one to one expansion for Void Angels, but doubling across alternate universes every two years will work out for me in the long run.
>>48189521
So, can somebody give me a rundown of what IRL cultures/civilizations the different Space Marien chapters/legions and Imperial Army/Guard/Navy regiments are based upon?
>>48189734
are you looking for something in particular?
A lot aren't based on cultures at all, so unless you want to be pointed in the direction of the wiki, you may want to specify what you're looking for.
>>48189734
The Legions are mostly pastiche rather than strictly based on a particular culture.
For the IA, it's:
Ardito Highwatch: Italian Alpini
Auron Infantries: Australian Diggers
Carlisian Shock Troops: 'Merica
Chelob Hammerers: (sci-fi people)
Ciban Chasseurs: French NATO forces
Dolsene Rifles: Israeli Defence Force
Elsinor Favored Sons: not sure
Exiran Armored Mercenaries: Holy Roman Empire
Fischetti Numeri: Italian Mafia
Gethsemane Regiments: not sure
Glasgan Fatalis: Highlanders
Haeltoth Starguard: (sci-fi people)
Jeolian Siege/Tunnel Army: not sure
Markian Corps: Napoleonic France
Motroit Enforcers: Robocop
Narakan Corps: (sci-fi people)
Rosskan Strelky: Russian Imperial Army
Skoptsi Redeemers: not sure
Vaartes Fated; (sci-fi people)
Vulpis Canem: not sure
>>48189745
They aren't? You're more creative than GW then.
I was thinking I'd try to make a chapter/regiment/whatever based on Spain, I just wanted to know if
>There was already an army based on Spain
and if there wasn't
>what chapter/regiment/whatever would be 'appropriate' to have my Spanish army descended from.
Plus, I generally just like knowing fantasy and sci-fi cultural equivalents.
>>48189787
Spain is awesome. By all means, make a regimental pattern based on Spanish history. Make six if you want.
>>48189787
As for descent - basically, with the Imperial Army, it's more a matter of saying that they come from this world, it was conquered in the Great Crusade at this point, and then giving some examples of famous regiments and personalities. The Carlisians are a good example:
https://1d4chan.org/wiki/The_Carlisian_Shock_Troops
If you want to make Spanish-style Loyalist Chapters, they'd probably be descended from the Steel Marshals (https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Steel_Marshals) or Void Angels (https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Void_Angels).
>>48189201
I want to amend this statement. I see no problems, but I think it needs more. I'll let you know when I think of it.
>>48189769
Gethsamane and Vulpis are also pastiche rather than specific cultures.
>>48189875
>it needs more
Sure. I'll start working on the outline on the wiki, we can always spice it up as creativity strikes.
>>48189851
why not Spanish themed Entombed?
>>48189909
No particular reason, I was just giving what I thought were the most likely progenitors.
>>48189787
>They aren't? You're more creative than GW then.
I wouldn't say that, it's more that we started by creating tactical and strategic ideas first and then inserted cultures and ideals to fit. A few of our legions started as something completely different from their current state.
Out of curiosity, what period of Spanish history are you basing your idea?
>>48189909
How would the Entombed fit into a Spanish setting?
>>48189920
I was thinking either the Punic Wars or the Reconquista.
>>48189940
Astartes obsessed with death and skulls meets hispanic 'dios de la muertos' aztecas/mayan cultural themes
also fundementalist cult vibes from the Entombed fit the spanish inquisition and general catholic shit no?
Hey, I'm the Admech/Clour scheme guy. I'm back.
I've been thinking, what would a Tech Saint even be like?
>>48190138
>Colour scheme
Nice to see that I'm still making typos.
>>48190138
Someone like Arkhan Land or Piccolo Dello Moravec, who are practically Tech Saints to the Mechanicum.
>>48190138
Bio-mechanical angels.
>>48190154
I know who Arkhan Land is, btu I've never heard of Moravec before.
>>48190155
Want to expand on that...?
>>48190201
>>48190138
>>48190201
He was the Primus of the Brotherhood of Singularitarianism, and prophesied the coming of the Emperor. It's thanks to him that the Mechanicum came to believe the Emperor was the Omnissiah. He also believed that a technological singularity, the creation of a greater-than-human intelligence was possible and that the Emperor might be that being.
>>48190327
>the creation of a greater-than-human intelligence was possible and that the Emperor might be that being.
laughing_science_vampires.jpg
>>48190352
Let's be honest, they wouldn't have been laughing had they met the Emperor before he became a skeleton wired to a golden toilet.
>>48190358
I'm pretty sure they'd consider the Noosphere more intelligent, though given its an aggregate quantum bio-computer that incorporates billions of minds into it it's hard to compete.
They'd have probably asked him if he wanted to join. If he's as right as he'd probably proclaim himself to be he'd instantly be able to win over the entire system.
>>48190138
>what would a Tech Saint even be like?
I think prophecy is a key part of their bag of tricks. The character would also need to demonstrate a higher level of communion with the machine spirits. I'm not sure that there's anything else essential to the role.
>>48189769
>Markian Corps: Napoleonic France
Napoleonic France AND Marine Corps!
