This may seem like bait, but honestly, I am sincerely asking who is better than this guy as a manager?
anyone that is not retired
Bump. I genuinely want to know, lads.
epl babby that bullied the refs and media
2 CLs in 20 years is not good enough
Mourinho easily.
Hitzfeld.
he had more resources then anyone else on top of match fixing and what not. Pep and jose are better managers and simeone is a better tactician as well.
He knew what was coming and quickly abandoned ship in 2013 before he could be outed as the fraud that he is.
>>69267994
No one.
he is for now, until Pep wins 3,4 Preamier Leagues and 2-3 CLs with CIty.
>>69268053
How is he when compared to, >poop, Ancelotti, >mouyes, Simeone, Heynckes, Klopp, >pardiola, and even Poch?
Heynckes
Paisley
3>2
Ernst Happel and Marcello Lippi
>>69267994
>2 cls in decades with the most powerful and refballled englel team
he's a fraud
>>69267994
Paisley, Mourinho, Guardiola
>>69268234
But isn't >poop only effective in Barca? I know it's unfair to judge him over UCL wins, but with a Bayern team that was THAT stacked, shouldn't he win at least one with them?
>>69267994
Jorge Jesus
>>69267994
Hey, what the fuck?
United and that damned flag?
Shankly
>>69268053
>>69268191
Who won more CLs in that time? No one. He competed for the CL when it was won by more than just the same three teams every year.
He also won the Cup Winners' Cup when he first turned up at United against Barca.
And of course at Aberdeen (!), between toppling the dominant Old Firm to win 3 league titles, he also won the Cup Winners' Cup beating Bayern in the semis and Real Madrid in the final. Then they flew back to Scotland a couple days later to beat Rangers in the Scottish Cup final.
>>69268123
doesnt coach anymore
>>69268376
>i cant name 4 ppl from the barca/real bench coz im a peenoy futbol fan go azkals xD
>>69268363
i thought kelvin crucified him
>>69268415
>Who won more CLs in that time?
mourinho, poop and del bosque won the same amount of cl while he was manager, and they didn't need almost 30 years
His cl record is abysmal
>>69268520
Ancelotti as well, plus he won a third the year after Ferguson retired
Guy Roux
>>69268462
Motherfucker, I am a kano, as are you by your idioms.
Get out of my threads. There can only be ONE /sp/ 'flip' football poster, and it ain't you.
You can have /cric/ or /bet/ or something.
>>69268415
>same three teams every year
He retired before Bayern, Barca, and Halal tho. Who were those three teams? Milan, and...?
>>69268520
You're arguing that his record is abysmal by offering up 3 managers with the same record?
1) Pep's CL is irrelevant because he had Messi. Any average manager can walk into that Barca team and win the CL. See Enrique
2) Though the standard of Premier League can certainly be questioned, it's demand can't. It is a physically draining league with a constanty high injury rate and no mid-season break. Fergie is the only manager in the PL era that has been able to compete on both the domestic and European front. The CL has been won 4 times by English teams in the PL era. Liverpool finished 5th in the league when they won it in 2005 and Chelsea finished 6th in 2012. Fergie's United was the only team to win the PL and CL in the same season. And he did it twice. And one of those was part of an unprecedented treble - the first of the CL era in ANY country.
>>69268520
wouldnt really call it abysmal since the most any manager has is 3. and thats like 2 people in the history of the competition.
plus, for almost half of fergies united career united were either
>unable to qualify for europe either to do shitness unrelated to ferguson or because liverpool fans keked some pastardos at Heysel
or
>unable to qualify because they needed to win the league to get in, unlike in the world where Poop and Mou were "born" into. Poop would not have even qualified for his record breaking 08-09 season since they finished 3rd and Real won the league in 08.
i would say that the manner in which he won them(one lucky comeback and a john terry slip) is more relevant of an argument.
>>69267994
Beckenbauer.
>>69268585
My sides
Even AJAfags don't rate him this high
>win the league with some absolute dogtier shit team
>also win the SPL with Aberdeen
goat
>>69268586
No, you're a Kano. You already denied your Flipness by claiming you're part Burger. Use a proxy, I am the true football Flip. Tang ina mo.
Lel. But, desu, it's nice to see someone else not obsessed with apehoop with that flag.
>>69268734
>its the czech republic autist.
Fuck every single czech person ever.
>>69268678
>Pep's CL is irrelevant because he had Messi
Fergie had Ronaldo
>>69268712
He gave 40 years of his life for this club and won the title
Plus he stole hundreds of cones on the freeway for training, that's dedication
You won't see Poop or José do that
>>69268755
Cech>Meme Howard errytime.
>>69268763
>comparing Ronaldo to Messi
>>69268771
>40 years
You're forgetting he played for the club before managing it, it's more like 50 years total
>>69267994
No one. A man like Fergie will never come again, as United fades into irrelevance people will truly understand there has never been any true pedigree at United... it was all Fergie.
>>69268763
It's more on Messi had Iniesta and Xavi, desu. I mean look at him with the Argies.
>>69268803
But muh Busby.
>>69268794
he was player-manager when he arrived in the 1960s and he left the club for good in 2005
Fergie ranting after WINNING the Scottish Cup final with Aberdeen against Rangers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoSiBq2Q0MU at 2:20
>>69268734
I think there are 3 of us. An English Hammer fan, 2 Kano United fans. The fun part is watching Hammer try to convince people he is really English.
Brian Clough
>>69268687
This. Plus he qualified for 3 finals in a row and faced arguably one of the best Barcelona teams of all time in 2 of them. Plus that Paul Scholes 'Offside' goal against Porto.
>>69268971
B-b-but I'm a Bayern bandwagoner. I just got triggered by someone posting on Facebook (yes, mock me as a pleb normie, sure) that he was the best manager of all time.
>>69268971
>>69269029
I bet that Hammer's gonna say that he's in Angeles banging some chicks who don't even understand half the things he says.
People keep going on about his Man Utd career, but look what he did with Aberdeen and even St. Mirren! He was the best in the world!
>>69268678
>Pep's CL is irrelevant
funny because he completely raped fergie in both cl finals. And funnier you don't even mention del bosque or mourinho
Also, reminder that he had ronaldo for his second cl, otherwise he would have only won it once in 30 years lel
Winning 2 cl in 30 years with the biggest and richest club in the world is absolutely nothing but an embarrassment
>Any average manager can walk into that Barca team and win the CL
of course, unlike united who are this small and poor amateur club playing with part time dentists
>Fergie's United was the only team to win the PL and CL in the same season
big deal, every time barcelona has won the cl they also won the liga. Plenty of other clubs have done it too, like bayern, porto, milan
Face it, ferguson was refballed beyond belief in the eplel so his domestic record is practically meaningless, and during 30 years every time he competed in europe, where neither him nor united have influence, he was slapped around except for 2 times
>2 out of 30 with the richest and biggest club in the world
top keks his record is shit and the football his team played was shit too. The end
Ancelotti and Mourinho
Say like for example, Tuchel, had the same resources that he had with Dortmund, would he have done better than Fergie?
>>69269067
You realise United were refballed out of at least 4 champions league trophies you idiot? Those are facts
>>69268687
>most any manager has is 3
in how many years? because it took ferguson almost 30 and ronaldo to win it more than once. That's how ''''''''''''good'''''''''' as a manager he was
>Poop would not have even qualified for his record breaking 08-09 season since they finished 3rd and Real won the league in 08
so poop's sextuple shouldn't be counted because liga has 3 cl spots? lel
poop was born into a barcelona that hadn't won shit in two seasons (with messi, iniesta, xavi, etc) and had finished 15 points from #1 and only 3 points from #4 and #5. If anything this makes his achievements more impressive
>>69269096
But Ancelotti does shit with leagues, doesn't he? Or is this just an overhyped meme?
Fergie made United the richest team in the world so money's not an argument. He earned the money they spent
Pep is not even in the discussion. The fact he failed to even make a champions league final with the best team in the world removes him from the discussion
>>69269179
>that hadn't won shit in two seasons
Two whole seasons, wow!
Ferguson is the biggest manager in history, he made United into a force.
John wooden
>>69269179
>hadn't won in two years
Haha fucking hell. What a big achievement.
I would have won everything he did and more. He's a fraud
>>69269221
They had prime Ronaldinho in those two years, so others could argue that managers before Poop were, kinda, a shit.
>>69269189
>Or is this just an overhyped meme?
How new are you?
>>69268021
Fpbp
hello
>>69269259
07-08 new, desu. Genuine questions here, lad.
kek
Only Ancelotti has won more champions leagues.
The European Cup doesn't count. No one cared about it - it was worth less than the league cup
>>69267994
Only manager to achieve the treble in possibly the most difficult football league.
>>69269189
>>69269259
>>69269284
Fuck. It was this bad? He even lost to fucking Montpellier.
>>69269212
>The fact he failed to even make a champions league final with the best team in the world removes him from the discussion
he didn't fail, he made the finals twice with the best team in the world and both times humiliated ferguson and his shit-on-a-stick ''''''football''''' lel
>>69269221
I guess you missed the 'any manager would win everything with messi' my comment was aimed at. Turns out it's false if messi (and iniesta, xavi, puyol, etc) had been there without winning shit for two years
>>69269329
I was talking about Bayern Munich. You know the team that won the treble and dominated Europe?
And Pep failed with them completely
>>69269379
How much would Heyncke's Bayern BTFO Poop's latest Bayern, mr. Coming Home?
>>69269293
bullshit
European cups meant something at the time because there were only the champions in C1
there were plenty of good teams which played C2 and C3
Objectively the greatest manager to ever grace English football.
Of all time generally though, is subjective because there's a few contenders. Still, he's up there, and anyone who denies this with "muh refball!" is a bitter crybaby ABU faggot. 20 times you fucking losers.
>>69269067
>Winning 2 cl in 30 years with the biggest and richest club in the world is absolutely nothing but an embarrassment
But you're judging United's wins by their standards today. The modern Manchester United are nothing like the United of the early 90s. Fergie turned the club into the global institution it is today. They were second bottom of the league before Ferguson turned up. And had a European ban thanks to Liverpool.
The guy evolved and found ways to consistently get the better of his rivals throughout the 80s, 90s, 00s, and 10s. He is the unquestionable GOAT.
>>69269179
They were fucking European Champions 2 years before he turned up.
>>69269270
Not even Liverpool's greatest manager.
>>69269314
By buying the league
>>69270632
*with their own money
>>69267994
BUILD THE WALL
>>69268415
>Who won more CLs in that time?
Ancelotti won 3. Mourinho and Guardiola won 2 each in a shorter timeframe than Ferguson won his 2 (03-11 vs 99-08).
>>69267994
Brian Clough
Otto Rehhagel
Sven Goran Erikson
Ottmar Hitzfeld
>>69269314
The Premier League wasn't the most difficult league in 1999.
>>69267994
who cares....
how do you prepare adobado ?
>>69269674
>found ways
Having the most expensive team was the usual way.
>>69274969
When Ancelotti won his third, Fergie had already retired.
No one won more CLs in Fergie's era than Fergie. It's also worth noting that Fergie didn't hop around Europe's elite clubs spending a fortune on a team that only has to last him 3 years. It's much easier to win titles when you have no responsibility to the future of the club you're at. None of Ancelotti, Mou or Guardiola have built and rebuilt a side. It's why, despite winning 3 league titles there, no one really considers Guardiola's time at Bayern to be a overwhelming success.
>>69275078
He continued to beat Chelsea and Man City when they spent far more money than him.
With Aberdeen he was dwarfed by the financial powers of the Old Firm but still toppled them, winning 3 league titles, Scottish Cups and the CWC.
>>69269179
>because it took ferguson almost 30 and ronaldo to win it more than once
kek the united team that competed in the cl in the last years of fergusons tenure was abysmal even the team he won it with
>>69269314
wew
It's been done like three times since already. Samuel Eto'o won it back to back as a player with two different teams.
The only reason it's the only treble that's hyped is muh English media muh jingoism
>>69275778
His job at Aberdeen was impressive, but he was never really dwarfed financially in the Premier League except at the very beginning (late 80s) and the immediate post-Abramovich years (when Chelsea won back-to-back titles)
He's good at consistency over a long period of time but his teams never really hit the heights the other big clubs in Europe did
>>69277276
So he won 7 PL titles in seasons where he spent less than his competitors.
Looks impressive to me.
>>69276708
>30 years only 2 cl
>b-but the team was shit in his last season
lel what about the other 20+ seasons? And if that team was shit it was only his fault. He was supposedly the best manager in the world in the biggest and richest club in the world yet he can't build up a proper squad to compete in europe? A FRAUD IS WHAT HE IS
Everybody shits on ancelotti for only winning a couple leagues in decades, then the same applies to this old fart that can't do shit in europe while managing the biggest club in the world
>>69269716
yes
>>69277446
Yes, but the gap was relatively small. It's more like Barca beating Real Madrid than Dortmund beating Bayern.
>>69277610
Those 2007, 2008 gaps aren't marginal.
The point of this conversation chain anyway was that Fergie "bought the league" and that's how he achieved so much. That data shows that most of the time he was spending less than his competitors but beating them most of the time anyway.
He was also challenging on the European front whilst winning PL titles - something no other manager or club has been able to do in the PL period.
>>69277722
>something no other manager or club has been able to do in the PL period.
chelsea did
>>69277722
Chelsea has been doing that since Abramovich and Mourinho showed up.
>>69277770
Maybe I used the wrong words - what I meant was that Chelsea have never won the CL whilst also winning the PL. Whereas Fergie did it twice. One of which was part of an unprecedented treble.
The year Chelsea won the CL they finished 6th.
>>69267994
No one, SAF is the GOAT manager, single-handedly knocked Liverpool off their perch, I also remember when he said he wouldn't sell Real a virus, the man was based as fuck, wish he had won more silverware in the CL.
>>69275733
This
I'll give credit to Mou for taking non top tier teams and winning CLs with them, but bouncing around big money teams with the best players in the world to win titles isn't that impressive. Poop is on the same level as Kevin Durant
>>69267994
>2 European Cups in 27 years managing the world's biggest club
Yea, really "great" manager.
>>69277952
>I also remember when he said he wouldn't sell Real a virus
the year before he sold ronaldo to them?
>>69277952
his disregard of midfield cost him time and time again in europe and left manure stuck in the 90's with le pacey wingers meme
he was a great man manager but completely dreadful in tactics
>>69269639
>And had a European ban thanks to Liverpool.
Typical Man Untied fan -doesn't actually have a clue about football and just follows Sky.
The European ban did not affect United because they never finished in a position high enough to qualify for Europe. They only teams affected were Liverpool, Everton and Arsenal. Ferguson is shite. He dominated domestic football with a financial monopoly and in 27 years fluked 2 CLs.
Rafa Benitez got to 2 CL finals quicker with Liverpool than Alex Ferguson with Manchester United. This despite Rafa joinning Liverpool 20 years after Ferguson and only having a fraction of the money.
Alex Ferguson is a joke.
To further add to my point here >>69277927, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool have collectively reached the CL final (in the PL era) a total number of 5 times. Not once did any of them play that CL final whilst finishing 1st in the Premier League. In 2005, Liverpool finished 5th. In 2006, Arsenal finished 2nd. In 2007, Liverpool finished 3rd. In 2008, Chelsea finished 2nd. In 2012, Chelsea finished 6th.
Ferguson reached the CL final 4 times, and every time he did it by also finishing 1st in the Premier. League - 1999, 2008, 2009, 2011.
It's extremely hard to strike the balance between domestic and European success when managing in PL which is an inherently demanding league. No one has come close to matching Fergie's pedigree for finding that balance.
ABUs are still completely butthurt, even after he's retired. What a man.
>>69267994
>2 champions league in 20 years
LOL
>>69278160
>butthurt
The thread was made by a guy admiring Ferguson. People are just responding with their opinions and you're claiming it's butthurt because it disagrees with your view.
>>69278197
some might call him a specialist in european failure
>>69278199
>proving my point
>>69278081
> completely dreadful in tactics
He is British
What did you expect?
>>69278223
Unless you define voicing an opinion as butthurt, nobody is butthurt.
>>69278247
Literally SEETHING
>>69278141
Are you comparing Championship manager, Rafa Benitez, to Sir Alex Ferguson?
The European ban that Liverpool fans so kindly bestowed on the rest of England indirectly affected every top flight club in England. The league, and every club wih any European ambition, were set back because players stopped coming to England, and many of England's best players left the country (many even going to Scotland) so they could play European football.
Did you think it was a coincidence that after years of English clubs having regular success in the European Cup, before the Heysel ban, that it wasn't until 1999 that another English club would win it again?
>fergie
>27 years
>13 titles
>2 european cups
>Paisley
>9 years
>6 titles
>3 european cups
hmmmmmmm
>>69278297
>Are you comparing Championship manager, Rafa Benitez, to Sir Alex Ferguson?
Rafa Benitez:
2005-2007 - 2 Champions League Finals
Alex Ferguson
1986 - 2007 - 1 Champions League Final
Benitez did in 2 seasons what Ferguson needed to do in 20 despite having far less money.
>The European ban that Liverpool fans so kindly bestowed on the rest of England indirectly affected every top flight club in England.
No, it affected Liverpool, Everton and Arsenal. Liverpool were the only team truly affected though since Everton/Arsenal were never capable of winning the European Cup.
>many of England's best players left the country
That had been happening for decades before. Keegan went abroad for more money as did many players.
>Did you think it was a coincidence that after years of English clubs having regular success in the European Cup
It was due to the fact that in the 1980s, there were managers like Paisely and Clough, not fucking Alex Ferguson and Arsene Wenger.
>>69277952
>single-handedly knocked Liverpool off their perch
They did it to themselves, really. Unless you're suggesting that Ferguson tricked them into hiring a series of incompetent managers, then selling their club to idiots who promptly bankrupted the whole thing.
>I also remember when he said he wouldn't sell Real a virus
Was that before he sold Beckham to Real or before he sold Ronaldo to Real?
>>69278081
He still won 13 (fucking thirteen) domestic titles in ~25 years which is huge, he mastered what was needed to dominate the league which was obviously his #1 priority, sadly he retired when he was starting to get the grip of other european styles.
Just check United's status now ffs, he literally carried a team with Darren fucking Fletcher and Carrick as midfield to an EPL title, he deserves respect.
>>69278544
>he mastered what was needed to dominate the league
Yea money
>>69278409
>It was due to the fact that in the 1980s, there were managers like Paisely and Clough, not fucking Alex Ferguson and Arsene Wenger.
And what about Tony Barton? I'll forgive you for not knowing who he is. He was player-manager who won the European Cup with Aston Villa in 1982. He had an otherwise unremarkable managerial career.
I guess it didn't take being a great manager to win the European Cup after all. Especially with the competition not being nearly as competitive as it has been in the CL era. Some teams used to defend their European Cups quite comfortably, year after year. But in 25 years of the CL, not a single side has defended it.
>>69278015
The declaration of intention is what matters here, in this sport if the player wants to leave he'll end up leaving anyway.
>>69278417
I was suggesting that he made the epl his bitch, bullying refs, dominating economically their rivals and knowing exactly what was needed to defeat every single opponent on the pitch depending on their meassure, 13 domestic titles should have some value.
Just because he underperformed in Europe doesn't mean he didn't put United on the map, it's like when some say Messi isn't the GOAT for not winning titles with the NT, sometimes GOATs don't win everything consistently.
>>69278602
Please see >>69277276.
Fergie usually spent less than his competitors but won anyway.
Some clubs like Liverpool have managed to spend vast sums of money with no return on their investments in the shape of a PL win. And they've had to watch little Leicester show them how it's done without a fraction of their spending. So clearly money isn't everything. As Fergie already showed at Aberdeen.
>>69278544
>Darren fucking Fletcher
excuse me? what a moronic comment. fletcher was one of the best defensive midfielders in the world around 2008-11 before he got ill. carrick was good as well. dont be so fucking retarded.
>>69278698
Your image doesn't even take into account wage budget. Wages have proven time and time again to be the decisie factor in success since higher wages = better players = success.
Spending money on transfers means nothing prescisely because you can "do a Liverpool" buy lots of shit players because you don't have the wages to attract the very best.
>>69278762
>this whole post
lol
>>69278698
>Some clubs like Liverpool have managed to spend vast sums of money with no return on their investments in the shape of a PL win.
This has always been stunning to me. One of the 3 richest teams has been the champion in every single PL season (except the last one with Leicester). Liverpool were in the top 3 for 5 straight years and didn't win once, and I assume they were the richest or second-richest from 1990 to 1992. They had to beat the odds to *not* win the title. Even today, their wage bill has been the 5th-highest in the league for the past 7 seasons, but they've consistently finished 6th or lower in every one of those seasons except for 2014.
I just don't get it. It's like they don't even want to win.
Remember when he triggered Rafa so badly that Liverpol ended up losing the title?
>>69278881
No. I remember Sky saying this though.
>>69278799
Usually, more expensive players tend to demand higher wages anyway. "Doing a Liverpool" is something that no other Premier League club really does consistently, because Liverpool is in a unique position where they have the money to buy and pay top players (even now, they're still richer than Juventus), but they can't actually offer any chance of success.
>sad cunts trying to shit on fergie's european record
literally no one cared about the european cup up until the late 90s, hence why utter joke clubs like red star belgrade, psv, steaue bucharest, ajax and porto were able to win in it in the early years of fergie at man united. it was a meme cup for meme clubs. big clubs only cared about the league
people only started taking it seriously when it became the champions league.
what manager has gotten to more semi-finals and finals of the champions league? no one.
>>69278911
>Liverpool is in a unique position where they have the money to buy and pay top players
But they can't pay what their rivals pay. It's as simple as that.
>>69278911
*So top players don't want to join them because they're not quite rich enough to pull a Man City/Chelsea/PSG and offer insane amounts of money to a ton of guys at once. This leaves them stuck overpaying for 2nd-tier guys (Lovren, Carroll, Lallana) or players who might be great one day (Suarez in 2011, Firmino, Mane).
>>69278819
>this revisionist moron
lol
>>69278938
lol
>>69278849
Bottling up mentality. Bad transfer model. The whole moneyball concept just doesn't work in football. If they had bought quality over quantity in the recent years, maybe they could have realistically competed for the title. But they keep buying young players that maybe turn out to be good. Then when that happens, they sell them to another club. It's stupid but I hate Liverpool so I hope they continue making bad decisions.
name one other manager who took a third division club to consecutive european titles in 5 years
/thread
>>69278762
Are you deluded, anon?
>>69279016
the true GOAT
>>69278949
They can pay roughly the same as Arsenal, but Sanchez still chose Arsenal over them. And Liverpool can certainly pay more than Spurs can, yet guys like Alli, Eriksen, and Dempsey turned down Liverpool in favor of Spurs. There's a lot more to it than just money. Juventus, Dortmund, and Liverpool can all offer roughly the same in terms of wages and transfer fees. But ask any player to rank those 3 in order of which club he'd like to play for and Liverpool will always be last.
>>69278819
>you now remember utd fans unionically claiming utd wouldve beaten barca if fletcher wasnt suspended
>>69279006
Quality players don't want to play for Liverpool. The whole "moneyball, muh young players, muh potential" line from FSG is just an excuse.
>>69279023
>Arsenal, Spurs
Have they been more succesful than Liverpool though?
I'm not claiming that Liverpool don't fuck up a lot, I'm just saying they don't have the wages of United/City/Chelsea/Real Madrid/Barca/PSG/Bayern etc.
>>69279023
>yet guys like Alli, Eriksen, and Dempsey turned down Liverpool in favor of Spurs.
things that never happened
>>69279059
>The whole "moneyball, muh young players, muh potential" line from FSG is just an excuse.
It's not. They have an entire analysis department and committee devoted to this nonsense.
>>69279065
Alli literally met with Brendan Rodgers the night before joining Tottenham
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3403566/Brendan-Rodgers-reveals-close-came-signing-Dele-Alli-Liverpool-starlet-chose-Tottenham.html
Couldn't find the source for Eriksen, but Siggurdson is practically the same guy so close enough imo
http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/382920/Spurs-Gylfi-Sigurdsson-s-glad-he-turned-down-Liverpool
>>69269067
Loving each one of your delicious tears you buttflustered faggot.
>w-w-what a cheat! he c-cheated!! refball! Reeeee
>muh second and third hokages are BADASSES for being hokage. don't mean nufin that there was a first hokage.
This is the drivel that is essentially coming from your mouth. Lmao. >spain.
haha did some cunt seriously call rafa a better manager than ferguson ITT
please tell me that was a joke
>>69279063
Arsenal are clearly a better bet for any player, consistent CL qualification and a team that always seems to be on the brink of challenging for the title is a heck of a lot better than sporadic Europa League qualification and "we beat Real Madrid 4-0 back in 2009!". Also, both Arsenal and Spurs have finished above Liverpool in 6 out of the last 7 seasons.
>>69279140
>can't bring himself to admit the bitter truth that Rafa got to 2 CL finals in 3 seasons while it took Ferguson 20 seasons to do the same with far more money
kek
>>69278982
what manager has gotten to more semi-finals and finals of the champions league?
answer this question please
>>69279156
now tell me what rafa achieved in the league
go on lad
>>69279105
>Alli literally met with Brendan Rodgers the night before joining Tottenham
yeah then the club wouldnt sign off on the transfer fee
>>69279084
Do they really? Their baseball team, Boston, has basically been run like Chelsea since they bought it about 15 years ago, and it's won them 4 titles. I wonder why they don't try that same strategy with Liverpool, they certainly have the money. I know FFP theoretically limits them, but can't they just work around that the way that PSG and Man City did?
>>69279018
you're the fucking deluded one if you can't appreciate how good darren fletcher was pre-illness
to suggest that he wasn't good enough for that team is just a complete joke. you tried to make it sound as if he was fucking kleberson or something.
>>69279181
Liverpool highest points total on 2 occasions?
There was no way he could compete with United/Chelsea with the money they had.
Before Rafa, the idea of Liverpool finishing above Arsenal was unthinkable. They he did it 4 times.
>>69279221
yeah because liverpool was such a sinking ship before he arrived right?
>>69279208
>can't they just work around that the way that PSG and Man City did?
Liverpool can't attract the mega players. They make shit decisions permanently as well.
They're double handicapped by better rivals and internal stupidity.
>>69279234
Yes it was. That's why Houllier was sacked.
Liverpool were complete shit before Rafa. If you had said to Liverpool fans, the club would become one of the most feared teams in Champions League football and consistently finish above Arsenal, they would have laughed. But that's what happened.
You forget how little Rafa had to spend. He had to buy players like Crouch when Chelsea/United were buying the cream of the crop.
>>69279283
>the club would become one of the most feared teams in Champions League football
HAHAHA
liverpool weren't 'complete shite'. they weren't facing relegation like united before fergie.
if rafa was so good he would have won the league in 2009. it was in his hands and he choked it away. then this so called great manager got fucking sacked. you're a deluded fool.
>>69279159
ancelotti has one less semi but one more final win
>>69279342
that's a long way to say "nobody", anon
>>69279322
>the club would become one of the most feared teams in Champions League football
They got to 2 Champions League finals, 2 semi-finals and beat Barcelona, Real Madrid, Chelsea, Arsenal, Milan, Juventus, Inter. Not many teams had a better record.
>then this so called great manager got fucking sacked.
By Gerrard/Carragher conspiring. Since then Liverpool have done nothing.
>if rafa was so good he would have won the league in 2009
It was a miracle they were even in it considering how little resources they had compared to United/Chelsea.
It's perculiar you don't seem to recognise that Rafa overachieved. You keep comparing Liverpool to their rivals as if they have the pulling ability.
>>69279388
ask me again in may
>>69279388
It seems kind of irrelevant though. Nobody in their right mind would take one less trophy in exchange for "but we reached the semifinals lots of times!".
>>69279322
>weren't facing relegation like united before fergie
>before fergie
umm ferguson didn't win fuck all of significance in his first 7 years at united and was a game away from getting the sack as they actually were hovering above relegation at one point
>>69279209
>you now remember that united fans claimed that darren fletcher was world class
Fletcher was a 5/10 across all stats with a great work rate and that's it, that's the very definition of average, and a system baby at that as he would have only worked in United and under Ferguson, he was literally United's version of Gareth Barry, and Carrick had 1 great game every 7 played, with 6 being mediocre at best. Ferguson was such a good manager that he convinced you lot that those two were genuine world class, up this this very day.
>>69279416
so basically, what you're saying is, liverpool are smaller than united and chelsea. keep blaming 'resources' and 'spending' though when rafa literally outspent ferguson throughout his entire tenure.
04/05
rafa: £42m
fergie: £27m
05/06:
rafa: £28m
fergie: £20m
06/07:
rafa: £28m
fergie: £13m
07/08
rafa: £65m
fergie: £50m
08/09
rafa: £40m
fergie: £35m
09/10
rafa: £40m
fergie: £25m
and a good manager wouldn't have two of their greatest legends conspire against them. if that happened under ferguson they'd be out the door.
>>69279468
united were literally in 20th place before atkinson got sacked, sort your head out you mong
can't believe you deluded tosspots got me typing this out at 3:30 am
>>69279551
he was literally easily top 10 in his position(defensive midfield), so yes he quite clearly was world class going by any sane definition.
stop being such a revisionist moron.
>>69278197
Mou won with Milan and twice with Porto in a 12 year span. That's pretty good, tbhfamalam.
Plus he's got 10-20 years to add to his managerial accomplishments.
Paisley?
Guardiola?
Mourinho?
Sacchi?
Trapattoni?
I don't think they are better but they are on the same level.
>>69279701
It's not revisionism you dunce, it's your shitty red tinted glasses that won't let you see reality, Fletcher on any other team would have been a bench warmer at best, he overperformed probably because he shared some celtic scottish meme magic with Fergie or because he threatened to heem his face if he didn't perform at 110% every game.
Sacchi and Clough are the only ones in GOAT contention.
>>69279809
ok, so he was a great player but it doesnt count because he was overperforming, and was only good for manchester united(the biggest club in the world)? even though he was great for man utd, the reality is that he was actually shit. is that what you're saying? do you even read the utter tripe that you type?
imagine being as bitter as you are towards a football club in a different country to yourself for no reason. absolutely tragic behaviour.
>>69267994
Sami Hyypia is objectively a better manager. check out his track record.
>>69279937
Pay attention, I would never, even if that could save a thousand lives, say that he was a great player, he overperformed on a very specific role under a very specific manager, and he along with Carrick got overrun and trampled consistently by superior midfields.
And don't be childish, you are the one that sounds assblasted because you can't handle different opinions to yours.
Bob Paisley desu.
Only managed for nine years but in that time he won:
>6 Leagues
>3 European Cups
>1 UEFA Cup
>3 League Cups
>6 Community Shields
All in an era when the same teams didn't win shit constantly.
If he hadn't retired he'd be considered the GOAT.
>>69268415
Bob Paisley won three in four years you scrub.
>>69267994
FRAUD
R
A
U
D
Liverpool fan here, trust me Rafa is an overrated autist
Him alienating Xabi Alonso consigned Liverpool to possibly forever second-tier European status (things have never been the same since he got sold. Aguero was going to come be Michael Owen 2.0 but went to City instead, Torres may not have left, no more need for dart throwing for transfers, etc.)
His tunnel vision with Lucas and Kuyt probably cost Liverpool a league title(we love our water carriers at this club)
Also assumed a ton of credit for Gerrard's heroics
To be fair his strategy for CL games was usually pretty effective (only at Liverpool though apparently) and he brought the best out of Torres
Klopp is way more sensible
>>69280763
>BORUSSIA LIVERPOOL
Klopp confirmed as the second coming of Bob Paisley.
>>69267994
>>69279433
Fergie's record shows consistency though. Ancelotti is anything but consistent.
"Sir" Alex is a fucking fraud who simply managed the only club with money before every other club had money.
As soon as Roman came along and spunked his billions on Chelsea what happened? Oh, suddenly United's dominance wavers. What happened as soon as City got bought by Oil Sheikhs? Oh, suddenly United aren't dominant at all.
What happens once TV rights explode and everyone has money? What do you know, United are as shite as everyone else.
>>69283816
Fergie won 5 titles in his last 7 seasons competing against Chelsea and Man City.
The 2 seasons he didn't win, he finished 1 point behind Chelsea in 2010 and finished level on points with City in 2012 losing on goal difference.
>Won the premier league thirteen times while being a raging alcoholic.
Top that, cunts
>>69284076
>while being a raging alcoholic.
he was scottish
>>69267994
2 euro wins were last minute luckball, he never ever had a team in 20 years which dominated europe, never had a team where you would say they were the best in europe.
he bullied ref, which he couldnt do in europe and dominated domestically, a prem-baby
plus a racist, bad loser, 'typical germans'
>>69268415
just accept his CL record is abysmal and stop riding his dick. he did extremely well in the league during a down period for english football and translated that success to when other clubs started doing well so he did good, but just accept he was shit in the CL and fuck off
>>69282654
This is our season
>>69284274
It's a very simple question. During Fergie's time, who had a better CL record than he did?
Because if he underachieved as much as you say, then surely someone would have been able to do better than him?
No one did better than him - which suggests he was par for the course in Europe.
>>69284237
3 CL finals in 4 years.
>>69278849
people are going to say MUH MONEYBALL and it's correct to a certain extent, but the last set of owners really fucked up >us badly. the whole moneyball thing didn't help but we where not in a great position anyways, the last owners refusing to put money into the club to rebuild after they sold the few good players we had (xabi alonso, mascherano), all the good CB's got old/retired and torres was broken. the new owners seem to have figured out moneyball doesn't work the same as it does in baseball now though and hopefully give klopp more freedom to spend how he wants
>>69284315
rafa benetiz at liverpool outperformed fergie in the CL by a country mile as people in this thread have already pointed out but you seem to want to ignore. pep at barca, mourinho at various teams. they all did better than him but every manure dickrider in this thread has shouted LOL THATS WRONG FOR THIS COMPLICATED AND SUBJECTIVE REASON
>>69284387
>rafa benetiz at liverpool outperformed fergie in the CL by a country mile
By winning fewer CL titles than Fergie? And by featuring in fewer finals and semi finals than Fergie?
Top kek.
>this delusion
>>69284408
>an objective fact is delusion
>>69284425
>it's an objective fact because I say so even though reality completely contradicts my opinion!
Absolute delusion.
>>69284551
>a managed who won 2 cl's and appeared in 4 in 27 years has a better CL record than a man who won 1 and appeared in 2 finals in 6 years
>>69268053
2 CL's both due to the other team shitting the bed at the LAST minute and gifting the win away
>Buyern shitting the bed in stoppage time
>Slippy T
Could have easily been 0 CL's in 20 years if that bit of luck went the other way kek
>>69280763
Irrelevant trophies in an irrelevant time
>>69284596
>>69279638
I like how this was ignored haha.
Rafa is a Championship tier manager. Same level as RDM
>>69284714
Rafa has been a CL manager long before and after Liverpool. After being sacked by Liverpool, he has been sacked 2 more times by CL clubs. Now he's managing in the Championship.
Use your arbitrary 6 year window if you like. It doesn't change the fact that SAF has won the CL more than Rafa. Has appeared in more finals than Rafa. And has appeared in more semi finals than Rafa.
>>69284748
And Ancelotti would have one less CL if Ramos hadn't scored a last minute equaliser.
Pep would have one less CL if Chelsea had been awarded a penalty they deserved in the 2009 semi final.
Mou would have one less CL if a legitimate Paul Scholes goal hadn't been ruled out in the 2004 QF versus Man Utd.
The CL is usually won by fine margins.
>>69279912
>Clough
Spent his last season getting relegated.
