/pol/ I need help!
I've always been right wing. The people on the left, I've always seen as "the other team" or the "opponent". Only now have I actually begun to ask: What are leftists?
I was reading up on the news lately that Obama is visiting the shrine in Hiroshima of the nuclear bomb, re-igniting the debate of whether or not the US should apologize for nuking Japan. I was reading through the comments, and one person, a foreign student living in Japan, had visited the shrine himself and encountered the Japanese who themselves were astonish "as to the idea that the US should apologize at all, and that it was a reasonable thing to do during wartime".
This made me ask myself, where did this debate originate at all, if not from the Japanese? Immediately I remembered of leftists and the explanation became clear: Of course leftists would want the US to apologize, same reason why they were the ones to argue that blacks are oppressed minorities and that white people are evil.
But then I re-examined the situation; the leftist are absolutely wrong. Related to the nuking of Hiroshima, few if any Japanese think the US should apologize, and why should they? It was war!
It then dawned on me of why the leftists want the US to apologize: its not because of what the US did, its because of what the US is: white, Christian, patriarchy. Of course I don't mean that everyone in the US are white male Christians, but thats how the leftists see the US as. And they hate the US for it. Same reason for any situation: Leftists want to protect minorities not because they care for minorities but because they hate the majority. What they do is determined by hatred, not love.
So then it made me re-examine the question: what are leftists? Are they parasites? Are they a phenomena of people that transcend borders and ideology? Are leftists something more than "the opposition"?
They are parasites and the by product of a successful prosperous nation, they would not exist without the culture/nation they hate. They have a sheltered viewpoint of the world because they never have had to actually fight or struggle for ANYTHING. I came to this realization during my high school years, most of them are not even interested in politics or history at ALL and that's part of the reason for their idiotic ideology. Whenever you try to debate them they just backdown and say they aren't interested in politics or pull the race card literally 99% of the time and they same the exact same thing word by word, it's so pathetic and disgusting I view them strictly as cockroaches with a hive mind mentality and they are the main reason I switched from libertarian to more authoritarian.
They are moochers. Too lazy to create capital on their own and want everything handed to them in life.
>>73644303
Read Atlas Shrugged to understand, OP
>>73643244
Leftism is a reproductive strategy that adapts to resource abundance and random predation. They refer to it in evolutionary biology as r strategy, and its five main traits are:
>promiscuity
>low investment, single parenting
>lack of in-group preferences
>anti-competitiveness
>early sexual activity
See this presentation by Molymoo:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8N3FF_3KvU
>>73644205
I think they're the reason why civilizations constant fall, no matter how powerful that civilization becomes. Leftists are the product of decadence. The biggest leftist I know, comes from a small, all white town in New Jersey. The rest are women.
>>73643244
Why is the republican party the one of nominating the weirdos? The democrats speak to weirdos for votes and that's fine. That's their platform. But the republicans claim they want an old timey society and pass guys like nixon raygun bush ten times and drumpf. In 50 years they will nominate the nephilim
>>73643244
This is a worthy thread.
I've always seen leftists as a result of limiting factors. In biology, when populations grow too large, resources become scarce and members of the population die until an equilibrium is reached again.
In a similar way, the societies that grow too large all tend towards leftist policies (if I'm wrong, someone correct me). More members of society do not contribute to it and expect more from it, production decreases, and the society loses efficiency. Judging by this analogue, it seems to me that there must be some "tipping point" where, even if natural resources are not scarce, the resource of human labour/critical thought becomes so scarce that society collapses.
Anyone have thoughts about this?
>>73643244
>What are Leftists?
They are nigger cucks, low energy and degenerate. Humiliating!
>>73644631
Its a bit scary and depressing how mechanical this is. Is civilization destined to always all with the rise of these groups? What could be the solution?
I think Japan might have it right. They out of all countries managed to advance their society quickly from pre-industrial to become an Eastern competitor to Western nations.
After the war, two of their major cities were devastated by nukes, and they suffered an economic crisis. Yet now, in an age of globalism, capitalism, progressivism Japan remains fully Japanese with one of the world's strongest economies and can quickly remilitarize if needed.
The Japanese are honestly incredible. There is something about them that they've been doing extremely right. Maybe its their religion? Shintoism? Buddhism? Or their lack of it? If any of these, it would have to be Shintoism because they're plenty of atheist nations that are the prima-cucks (Sweden) and uncucked (Czechia) while there are good (Bhutan) bad (South East Asia) Buddhist countries.
>>73643244
Read Ted Kaczynski. They are mentally ill, be it because they are over-socialized or because they have feelings of inferiority.
>>73644369
I've heard that's more like babbys first cautionary tale. Or is it worth a read?
>>73645486
It's not necessarily their religion that keeps them strong. It's traditionalism, which is distinctly different from religion. Shintoism is just very closely tied with their traditions. I lived in Japan for 10 years, and a lot of Japanese people aren't "religious" in the Islamic or Mormon sense. But they are one of the most traditional people on Earth. They have such an adherence to their past and past culture and place so much importance on this that it keeps their society strong.
>>73645279
Replaced size with decadence and I'll agree with you. History tells us that when a society becomes too decadent, they start to abandon the founding values that built that society.
Every society is the result of some system. A small social system that was established onto a small village. Thanks to that system, that society prospered.
Lets examine the Romans. They started off as a small village near a river. There were 3 traits the early Romans had: a taste for war, a respect for religion and a desire for law.
A system is built in relation to its environment. Overtime, two things can happen to a functioning society: (1) the system is altered, or (2) the environment changes.
Without responding effectively to these two threats, a society no matter how high of success they achieve, will survive for long.
>>73643244
Bill Whittle did a great piece on why the A-bombs were necessary and justified.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x12q9wz_pjtv-jon-stewart-war-criminals-the-true-story-of-the-atomic-bombs-bill-whittle_news
It is a little over 15 minutes, but well worth the watch.
My grandfather fought in WWII in the pacific and I remember during a school project I was supposed to interview him, and I asked him whether he felt the A-bombs were justified. It was the first and only time I've seen him look surprised and disgusted. He couldn't fathom that some Americans thought more Americans should have died in that war, so they could feel morally superior about it in the future.
>>73643244
It's just virtue signaling.
They don't care about the Japanese. They just want to look more progressive and kind than anyone else.
>>73645924
It is worth a read. The only reason you hear so much bad shit about it is because the book, like Trump, triggers a lot of vocal liberals.
It's a very good representation of individual empowerment and it's a very powerful book. Almost Nietzschean in its words.
>>73645924
it's ayn rand having an autistic rant in novel form about how liberals want free shit
it's an alright read but don't expect any amazing political philosophy
The cycle repeats over and over, the problem is we're long overdue for a massive cull event be it war, a natural disaster or disease
>Hard times make hard people
>Hard people make soft times
>Soft times make soft people
>Soft people make hard times
>>73645924
Its extremely worth it, thats why the left hates it so much.
Expect something like this, but better:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRCfLY53mSA
Well we're just people who feel a little differently on what's best for our country and whatever I guess. I mean leftist ranges from southern democrats to the cucks. It's pretty wide open.
>>73645924
>>73646185
If you want similar ideals about Political philosophy in a better story format read some Robert Heinlein. Probably not Starship Troopers, though it is an interesting read. But more things like Stranger in a Strange Land, Time enough for Love, and The Cat who walks through walls.
Time enough for Love probably has some of the most interesting ideas. Some of it is kinda wierd though too, so if you have delicated sensibilities regarding sexuality I would not read it.
"It always appeared to us that, atomic bomb or no atomic bomb, the Japanese were already on the verge of collapse." - General Henry H. "Hap" Arnold, Commanding General of the U.S. Army Air Forces under President Truman
"I had been conscious of depression and so I voiced to (Sec. Of War Stimson) my grave misgivings, first on the basis of my belief that Japan was already defeated and that dropping the bomb was completely unnecessary, and secondly because I thought that our country should avoid shocking world opinion by the use of a weapon whose employment was, I thought, no longer mandatory as a measure to save American lives. It was my belief that Japan was, at this very moment, seeking a way to surrender with a minimum loss of 'face.'" - General Dwight D. Eisenhower
"Japan was at the moment seeking some way to surrender with minimum loss of 'face' It wasn't necessary to hit them with that awful thing." - General Dwight D. Eisenhower
"It is my opinion that the use of this barbarous weapon at Hiroshima and Nagasaki was of no material assistance in our war against Japan. The Japanese were already defeated and ready to surrender. My own feeling was that in being the first to use it, we had adopted an ethical standard common to the barbarians of the Dark Ages. I was taught not to make war in that fashion, and wars cannot be won by destroying woman and children." - Admiral William D. Leahy, former Chair of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
"I am absolutely convinced that had we said they could keep the emperor, together with the threat of an atomic bomb, they would have accepted, and we would never have had to drop the bomb." - John McCloy
"P.M. [Churchill] & I ate alone. Discussed Manhattan (it is a success). Decided to tell Stalin about it. Stalin had told P.M. of telegram from Jap Emperor asking for peace." - President Harry S. Truman, diary entry, July 18, 1945
"Some of my conclusions may invoke scorn and even ridicule... "For example, I offer my belief that the existence of the first atomic bombs may have prolonged - rather than shortened - World War II by influencing Secretary of War Henry L. Stimson and President Harry S. Truman to ignore an opportunity to negotiate a surrender that would have ended the killing in the Pacific in May or June of 1945... "And I have come to view the Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombings that August as an American tragedy that should be viewed as a moral atrocity." -Stewart L. Udall, US Congressman and author of "Myths of August"
"Certainly prior to 31 December 1945, and in all probability prior to 1 November 1945, Japan would have surrendered even if the atomic bombs had not been dropped, even if Russia had not entered the war, and even if no invasion had been planned or contemplated." -U.S. Strategic Bombing Survey's 1946 study
"Careful scholarly treatment of the records and manuscripts opened over the past few years has greatly enhanced our understanding of why Truman administration used atomic weapons against Japan. Experts continue to disagree on some issues, but critical questions have been answered. The consensus among scholars is the that the bomb was not needed to avoid an invasion of Japan... It is clear that alternatives to the bomb existed and that Truman and his advisers knew it." - J. Samuel Walker, Chief Historian, U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission
>>73646156
>Almost Nietzschean
kill yourself
>>73645279
I absolutely LOVE the meta way you analyse this. It's how I try to explain everything ''logically''. If we exclude everything like subversion, memes, propaganda, uneducated thoughts etc, then what really IS a leftist.
I think they are truly just the unfortunate really. They are the poor and the minority, the people that would constantly get laughed at.
I mean, I /know/ the kind of ''nerd'' that dwells here. We laugh at how /pol/ is probably just meeky skinny trash but that's just not true. We were bullies at school. We picked on those who played magic but we've been picked on by bigger than us too. We've given and received. I think liberal are merely conditioned to receive and that's because as you just explained, mother nature made them this way.
The question is, why is there SO many of them now and so few of us?
The only logical conclusion I've reached so far is just tin foil tier; chemicals in water and foods.
>>73643244
Leftists=Marxists
read up on MARXISM
'leftism' didn't really exist in the sense that we know it before marxism swept europe and then the world
leftists are always 'victims' just as the marxist were the victims because they were the workers who believed the upper class has taken too much from them.
Yuri Bezmenov on youtube explains leftists very well even though his interview is from the 80's it's the exacy same template of leftists just a bit more degenerate
>>73646458
Atlas Shrugged's story format is the best mix of sci-fi and existentialist drama. It feels like LOST at times and you can definitely see Watchmen took a lot of pages from that book.
>>73646529
>>73646568
Try watching the video I linked above, it gives a good rejoinder to your position.
>>73646107
I'm a leftist. Ask me anything but shitposters will be ignored.
>>73646752
Ok, I haven't actually read any Ayn Rand stuff, just going by word of mouth. Which might contribute to negative reviews of her work because it is politically unpalatable for lefties.
>>73643244
Thinking about this disturbs me. Are we still in pre-1984 era? Is THIS 1984? Have we already passed the point of no return? Is it better to say fuck it and ride the train until it crashes or to try to hold off what may be inevitable?
>>73646771
My position? I posted direct quotes from contemporary US officials and politicians.
Ted is the final redpill in regards to leftism.
Their ENTIRE ideology is founded on the anger and self-hatred of being inferior.
This is present in all leftists but only truly visible in the extremists like SJW and commies. Their goal is always to erase the concept of good and bad, because they are mad about being considered 'bad' in some form. They can't conceive themselves of becoming 'good' through their own work so they'd rather turn 'bad' and 'good' equal. That's why you've got this pathetic attempt at 'relativism' pushed, or communism in the fields of economics.
>>73644205
don't go over the weak side, maintain your individuality. we were supposed to dethrone tyrants, not hail them
>>73646891
Why don't you hold minorities to the same standards you hold whites?
>>73646891
do you know anything about marxism ? and i don't mean the wiki definition i mean actually understand it ?
>>73646939
You have to read it brosef. I would say it's one of the best if not THE best book to represent /pol/'s ideals. Plus it's an interesting and engaging sci-fi character story.
>>73646771
The first thing he says is that the Americans warned the Japanese that a bomb was coming. This is flat-out wrong.
http://blog.nuclearsecrecy.com/2013/04/26/a-day-too-late/
>>73646891
Do you think positions of power should be based on merit or your ethnicity?
>>73647219
I do, the word leftist is a broad term. We don't hold all the exact same views.
>>73647290
I know some of the tenets and philosophy, I became a leftist independently from my own education, knowledge and experience. Why do you ask?
>>73647413
Obviously merit, see >>73647483
Atlas Shrugged is like the prequel to Elysium
>>73646891
If companies only receive money from consumers who willing purchase their goods or services and not from corporatism (bailouts, 0% interest loans from the federal reserve), do they deserve to keep that money?
>>73647183
This is starting to make sense. But what causes leftists to have those feelings of self-inferiority?
>>73647893
Well they need to get taxed, what exactly are you referring to?
>>73647973
I'm a leftist and inferiority is not something I often feel.
>>73647183
Cool image, I am going to start spamming it whenever I see leftists fucking shit up on social media and such.
>>73648016
Yah everybody's got to get taxed. It's more of a question about how you feel about rich people. Do think that they deserve that money?
>>73643244
They are the result of preventing the natural order of survival-of-the-fittest. Weak, cuckold-mentality beta-males should have died off naturally, but our society is advanced enough to keep these invalids alive.
>>73648444
A lot of them do, but they need to be taxed at a progressive rate and they need to be scrutinized carefully because of all the power they have in our society.
>>73648377
>realize it was made by a terrorist
why do right-wingers have to be equally retarded as the left?
Ever notice leftists have a certain look to them? It's not usually as obvious as pic related, more like certain facial features or mannerisms. I've started to pick up on it subconsciously. They also tend to be incredibly conformist for all their supposed "uniqueness".
>>73647183
Makes sense. Considering that many fight against the white male, the one group of people who has stayed at the top of the social ladder for such a long time.
Also most of the black men who are liberals do brag about fucking their superiors, whilst saying that they rebel against the white man and despises him, for he set back the black subhuman race.
Many Amerindian Mexicans also go against the white man, saying that they do the jobs the white man does not want to do. Imagine if the slaves told Lincoln to put them back in chains because their slavemasters don't want to do work?
Women feel "sexually objectified" in society as they are very prone to insecurity, being more emotional. All of said groups are easily offended too, hinting that they are insecure about their race, religion, gender, or heritage.
>>73648648
Low-energy! Disgusting.
>>73643244
They want America to look weak. Simple as that.
They think that by making America look weak, they can "soften us up" for the coming proletarian/socialist revolution.
However, what they don't realize is that we have powerful external enemies who would invariably shape any revolution that crops up. Enemies like Russia, for example.
>>73646458
>>73646752
I recently picked up Brave New World myself. I heard it kinda runs parallel to 1984, but is in many ways a more accurate prediction of the world today.
>>73648898
Ted is an anarcho-primitivist you retard. He just hates leftism as much as we do and likes to call bullshit everywhere he sees it.
>>73649171
Lol it's one thing to agree with a politician, but to start using parroting his specific style of phrasing is fucking cult-like. You guys are so fuckin sad.
>>73649297
1984's predictions come truer and truer. Brave New World is just a prediction of the world before 1984 happens. Atlas Shrugged is also a dystopian story, and it rings truest out of all of them.
>>73648804
Sounds kind of like what a reasonable leftist would say. So if our government has even more power over society, do you think it should have transparency and the same scrutiny?
Are state governments more connected to the needs of the people actually living there?
>>73649393
>le 4chinz is serious business
>>73649192
Also this. All this shit originated from Soviet Union's propaganda and intelligence agencies. People like McCarthy were 100% correct about there being tons of communist subversives in certain key positions of America.
>>73643244
You must be at least 18 years of age to post here.
If you are out of highschool and still use this level of rhetoric and prose I seriously worry about our educational system.
tl;dr overusing rhetorical questions in the manner of your OP makes you look like a highschool freshman who just took their firdt writing course
>>73649539
I think you don't understand that there are legitimately people on /pol/ who are obsessed with trump and genuinely agree with him 100%. They really do idolize him, almost to a level of religious reverence. It's weird.
>>73649481
I mean of course they should have the same transparency and scrutiny. Yes I believe they are, but there are several things that should be handled on the national scale.
>>73649664
>>73649790
T H I S
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S
>>73649664
this is 4chinz, not an English class. I had a lot of thoughts I wanted to write down and I had trouble organizing them, so I opted just to jot down everything that came to mind, throwing structure out the window.
>>73646694
>The question is, why is there SO many of them now and so few of us?
Inbred ideologies and dependency on society (to "receive" as you put it) are learned characteristics, and I can't in good conscience say they're intrinsic to the average human, even in this day and age.
A proper ideology concerns itself with both receiving and giving, and I have a feeling that liberals substitute radical protests/social upheaval as a roundabout way of giving back to society (by, in their eyes, improving it).
We're not so different, though. We see problems in society and want to eliminate them to make society better; but this requires societal revision. Given the chance, I'm sure any of our Utopias would look drastically different from the democratic system we have today.
That said, we're fringe group because, as much as the liberals are degenerate, they do support each other (even if it's often at the cost of groupthink); we don't tend to do that. That's why I called your thread a worthy one--it asks a question we never ask, and in doing so it points to a fundamental flaw in our own politically-right society.
We expect certain qualities in ourselves that contrast the liberals: we are strong, angry, proud, and cynical--warriors of a sort in the fight against the sensational left. In a big way, we're used to being loners, at least when it comes to expressing our political ideologies (just listen to /pol/lacks talk about hiding their power levels and you'll get a good sense of this). Even when we're together, we call each other faggots every time we post, and insults fly left and right with names like "amerifat", "canadacuck", and "britbong" being thrown around.
There's no kind of camaraderie here, and no sense than anything beyond our hatred for the left unites us. But that isn't the case. We all have a great deal in common; I've seen it between posters.
The problem is getting /pol/ to fully appreciate that united we stand, while divided we fall.
>>73647483
You're a classical leftist, not a real (((modern))) leftist.
>>73650430
No, I believe we should use more public funds for schools, hospitals and all types of infrastructure. I believe in high minimum wage, universal healthcare and universal higher education.
>>73650430
higher*
>>73650430
I don't know what you mean by modern leftists. The SJWs you're referring to are a minority of leftists in my experiences with leftists. They get a lot of attention on the internet and the media but it's manufactured outrage, those people really are pretty rare.
>>73647356
No he tells the audience that they had been warning the Japanese about the already ongoing strategic bombing campaign, with the LeMay leaflets. Which is true. He also explains how it would be foolish for the US to reveal it's new strategic weapon to the Japanese because of how expensive and time consuming it was to make.
>>73646891
Why do you support globalism? Almost every leftist I encounter has expressed views that more or less align with what the globalist corporations and elite want, despite the leftists claiming to be against such entities. So you rally against them, but turn a blind eye when they fund your movements? Because globalism is a very dangerous thing that threatens the many cultural identities and nations of the world, with a goal of installing a one world government run by the top elite who want to enslave and/or exterminate us.
>>73643244
poisnoed by the jew
>>73650736
>The SJWs you're referring to are a minority of leftists in my experiences with leftists.
That's nice. They're not in mine.
>>73650619
>higher*
Classical automatically implies higher. It was sarcasm.
>>73650588
>more public funds for schools, hospitals, and all types of infrastructure
We tried that here. We have propaganda machines for education, healthcare CEOs drinking up all the money given to hospitals, and the mafia running infrastructure in Ontario and Quebec.
>I believe in high minimum wage, universal health care, and universal higher education
All of these things are useless if no one makes use of them. I speak from experience when I say that the majority of university students, though "better educated", took degrees in easy things and are still incapable of contributing anything other than regurgitated talking points. I've met some excellent academics, but they all worked incredibly hard and developed a sense of autonomy; the majority of university students simply don't do this.
Also, higher minimum wage and universal healthcare are memes. Higher minimum wage is worthless if buyers don't exercise discrepancy when buying (Ex. I'll buy the $500 iphone that breaks more easily instead of the $80 smartphone that doesn't, or I'll go shopping for prepackaged expensive foods instead of buying the raw products and cooking myself a meal--why can't I buy as much food!?). Meanwhile, universal healthcare in Canada means that while you do get treated for some pretty basic diseases, anything more serious will cost big money, but thanks for large waitlists (because it's universal, remember), chances are you won't even have to worry about getting treated since you'll likely die before you're called in anyway.
>>73645279
The only problem now is the fact that it would take a really big "happening" to reach tipping point. Many people don't care about fighting a tyrannical/constitution infringing government as we have luxuries goods that keep people shut.
>>73643244
Slave morals. They hate victors they hate strength and will self-flagelate to prove it.
>>73643244
american right v left is a retarded dichotomy that comes from your busted two-party system
>I'm a liberal so I believe in equality for all I mean unless you want to own a gun to defend yourself, be judged on your own merits and not quotas, not to be taxed to fuck and back or to exercise free speech or something dont be ridiculous
>I'm a conservative so I believe in a small government keeping out of the citizens lives I mean other than the trillion dollar military industrial complex, the trillion dollar prison industrial complex, the war on drugs and gays trying to get married dont be ridiculous
ps america was 100% in the wrong to drop the nukes since Japan was going to surrender, just not give up their emperor which wasn't good enough for the US, but you wont learn that in clapistan history books
death to america
>>73647215
You libertarian cucks are just another flavor of the same paradigm that enables the left to flourish. You wouldn't even be having your point of view if not for the state you hate so fyucking much.
S O M A L I A
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>>73643244
The USA committed a war crime, intentionally slaughtering tens of thousands of civilian men, women and children.
Apologizing isn't about Japan. It's about us.
You make mistakes. You admit them. You apologize. You fix them.
It's about being a man.
>>73653349
I mean who cares if the average Somali's IQ is like 20 it's obviously the fault of the lack of state lol
>>73653511
No mistakes were made. We saved possibly millions of Japanese lives, and more importantly possibly hundreds of thousands of American lives.
I get you want to feel morally superior, but American lives take precedence over your feelings.
>>73654761
Killing women and children is wrong. We did so intentionally. Therefore we did wrong.
I am morally superior to you.
>>73654932
We bombed directly on military targets anon. We knew it would have collateral damage, but that doesn't mean we didn't strike military targets. If japan puts their war factories and military bases directly within and integrated with their own cities whom is to blame?
see my above video to learn some more about it.>>73646107
>>73655391
>within and integrated with their own cities whom is to blame?
The people who intentionally killed over a hundred thousand innocent civilians.
It was done with the purpose of killing tens of thousands of women and children.
That is wrong. The end.
>>73655585
You are too myopic to even see what your worldview creates. You would make a world where the wicked who hide behind innocent civilians have and advantage and those who actually care about the lives of innocent civilians suffer.
>>73645924
It's garbage. If you want to read a good individualist, read Stirner.
>>73647183
>that one German poster trying to shill for Ted
I thought we already have a discussion on why he is full of shit
>>73655916
He's right. The imperial japs were cruel bastards.
>>73655585
He's also right. It doesn't justify America melting their skin off with radiation.
America was wrong to bomb civilians but right to set a precedent against any future countries planning on attacking it.
>what are leftists
Idiots that hate patriots.
Greedy angry and hateful idiots that want to "level the playing field" by forcing industries paying female athletes as much as male athletes.
>>73656471
If you haven't watched the video I linked above, you should give it a watch. It is about 15 minutes or so.
>>73646107
>>73643244
Leftists are anti capitalist.
>>73650321
>>73646092
>>73645279
>>73644205
>>73643244
this is a really great thread you guys.
I'm gonna keep this little gem.
>>73646107
Just because it is the pragmatic choice does not make it the moral one
>>73643244
You're an autist. No worries
>>73658138
The Japanese refused to surrender. The Japanese resistance increased the closer we got to mainland Japan. The Japanese built their military facilities interspersed throughout their own cities. The Japanese created the situation. We are under no obligation to lose more American lives because of the choices of the Japanese.
>>73658138
would you rather nuke the innocents of a country that refuses to concede or draw out the war, killing more of your own people?
>>73658529
Nuking innocents wasn't even our goal anon. All the cities we bombed had extensive military production facilities and barracks interspersed throughout the city.
Watch for more info. It is about 15 minutes.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x12q9wz_pjtv-jon-stewart-war-criminals-the-true-story-of-the-atomic-bombs-bill-whittle_news
>>73646712
Those Yuri Bezmenov videos are absolutely required viewing for anyone getting into this.
I re watch them occassionally myself.
it's teh Leftists
>>73646315
UUOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
>>73643244
you need to look into r/K selection theory. then you will understand just what are the "leftists"
>>73658481
>>73658529
I don't even disagree that America was probably justified in doing so. But it was still a lesser evil, an evil nonetheless. I would have probably made the same choice, but I won't lie to myself so I can sleep well at night
>>73661122
What do you think we are lying to ourselves about? If you watch the video those are some of the facts that I relied on to come to my conclusion.
So what do you think I am lying to myself about?
>>73661370
That it was the morally right choice?
We can psycho-pathologise leftists until the cows come home; the fact is that they're not going away and that leftism itself is a highly memetically adaptive and virile parasite which shows no sign of slowing, only getting more aggressive.
I've started to think that leftism is unkillable and is basically stamped somewhere hidden onto our DNA in a way that modernity has managed to tease it out and create a feedback loop of aggrieved status signalling and chaos. They've done studies of monkeys and when one monkey is given more food than the others, the other foodless monkeys instantly attack him and punish him. This is leftism.
>>73661602
If you haven't already watch the video above I linked. It doesn't seem like too hard of a moral choice to me.
Our goal wasn't to destroy as many civilians as possible, with the atomic bombs. It was to demonstrate that we had a new incredibly powerful weapon that would strike fear, despair, and ultimately resignation into the Japanese hearts.
Americans killed more civilians with our carpet bombing of cities than we did with the atomic bombs.
If our goal was to maximize civilian death to bring an end to the war, millions more of Japanese civilians would have died.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x12q9wz_pjtv-jon-stewart-war-criminals-the-true-story-of-the-atomic-bombs-bill-whittle_news
Watch the video if you have 15 minutes of free time. It will give you a different perspective.
>>73662018
I did and all he has convinced me it was the lesser evil but still an evil. Also the presenter seem to not understand what is Victor's Justice
>>73663141
So presumably your issue is with the death of civilians. Is there an acceptable level of civilian death? Is there an upper limit on the number of lives of Americans that would need to be lost to minimize Civilian death in Japan? If it is a fact that Japanese built their barracks and war factories within their cities and not separate and apart, does this affect the number of Americans that needed to die to prevent more deaths of Japanese civilians?
Look I'm not pretending that the war was glorious or anything. War is hell. And there is a reason that all nations try to avoid it. But while you don't try to target civilians, you also don't risk hundreds of thousands of lives of your own country men to avoid that at all cost.
By that mindset even one civilian death would have be an evil act and a war crime.
>>73663610
>By that mindset even one civilian death would have be an evil act and a war crime.
Yes senpai, war is fucked up and people make terrible decisions. The best of us can only choose the lesser evils. But let not pretend the victors are morally superior
>>73664994
It isn't about superiority, it is about not being morally culpable for justified actions one takes for their country.
