Should the United States get rid of the death sentence? After all, it is cheaper to imprison people for life than to execute them.
>>80984417
And what will that achieve? Look at Franco's Spain they had some really brutal execution methods (forgot name) as a result crime was laughably low now look at Spain today first thing that comes to mind is heroin among other desu so no I'd say harsher punishment make crime a very risky venture
>>80984417
http://talkobamato.me/synthesize.py?speech_key=09d9baf7a3f324db0ddb1c49f2da667a
>>80984417
How does it work out to be more expensive?
Fighting appeals or something?
>>80985292
Then why do states with the death penalty pretty much all have more crime?
If the threat of life in prison isn't scary, then getting killed after waiting for 40 years of appeals isn't scary either. Criminals are more scared of getting killed tomorrow by another criminal. After all, if they thought they were going to get caught, they wouldn't be committing the crime at all; they don't think they're going to be punished at all.
The death sentence needs to be fixed so scumbags aren't sitting on the bench for years. One appeal, limit the time to gather evidence to 6 months, and that's it. The death sentence is really just a lifetime sentence with a chance of getting out early.
It's only cheaper because a death sentence means imprisonment for most of a life and lots of appeals.
If death sentence appealing was not different than life sentence, then death sentence would not be more expensive
>>80985549
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/costs-death-penalty
>>80985549
Basically, the U.S. justice system is laughably bad at finding the actual guy who did it, and wrongful convictions are extremely common. Something like 1 in 25 are later proven beyond all doubt to be innocent. And those are just the ones we found DNA proof for or something similar.
As a result, you get multiple levels of appears for a death sentence (since once carried out, it can't be reversed) to minimize that.
The thing is, you can't really make much money in prison, so the government has to fund both the defense (because of the right to an attorney) and fund the prosecution, and pay the judge, jury, and pay for the incarceration time. PLUS, in the 1-25 times they are let go, the government has to pay out millions.
>>80985549
Because the facilities, upkeep, employees are so ridiculously over the top.
All you actually need is a pit, a gun, a bullet and a man that can shoot straight. You could even go for a robot soon enough.
>cheaper
Bullets are dirt cheap
>>80985896
>we shouldn't be absolutely sure we have the right guy before killing them
You guys assign way too much forethought to criminal actions. Very few people that commit murder are Danny Ocean, methodically plotting their crime. It's an impulse crime. The death penalty, or any other possible punishment, hardly factors into their thinking.
>>80984417
keep death sentence
eliminate lengthy bureaucratic process
the act of actually killing someone is very inexpensive
>>80984417
The cost of a single bullet is around 30 cents.
The cost of 2 meters of rope is around 40 cents and it can be reused.
>>80984417
No, but we should make the death sentence easier to apply.
If your behavior is so heinous that you are sentenced to death, then a firing squad should just take you outside the courtroom and shoot you immediately after sentencing is complete.
No appeals, no sitting in jail, no tax dollars wasted -- just five bullets straight to the crook's dome as soon as the judge hands down the sentence.
>>80986213
How do you know it doesn't factor in because they know how unlikely it is they would ever really be executed? If it was a real threat, it would have more weight.
>>80986338
>>80986109
>>80986140
see
>>80986067
>But what about people we know beyond all doubt they did it! Like video tapes of it!
So you mean virtually never? Okay, fine.
>>80985549
>Fighting appeals or something?
Yes. It takes years to actually kill someone once they are sentenced.
I think the DP needs to be at least reserved for cases where the evidence is overwhelming and incontrovertible (i.e. someone is on camera torturing someone to death), and the crime is heinous, such as high treason, murder, or being black.
>>80985710
They have death penalty because of rampant crime, not backward.
I find that the comparison that the OP made is a stupid one.
If you want to argue about the cost of having the death penalty you should compare the cost of having the death penalty to the cost of getting RID of the death penalty; not compare the death penalty to a different punishment.
If we got rid of the death penalty how would that change the legal system? Would it cost us money or save us money? An argument could be made either way. The death penalty saves money in some ways like when a suspect pleads guilty in order to avoid the possibility of the death sentence. That saves tons of police work, court costs, etc.
My personal opinion is to be against the death penalty for moral reasons.
>>80984417
It barely has one. And there is no 'United Sates gets rid of', it is a State's decision, not a federal one. Please stop this pushing of a narrative towards a single federal State. Even if you are a shill.
>>80984417
I's afraid of the dark
>>80986464
Because extended prison sentences don't prevent crime either. At least not in the way you think they do. Its not the deterrent factor that reduces crime, its when younger males are sentenced such that they aren't released from jail until after their 25 birthday, when the probability of future criminal activity significantly decreases.
Most crime is perpetrated by those under 25 who give little thought to the future anyway. In the midst of a criminal impulse they aren't going to stop and say "maybe I shouldn't do that because I could go to jail for a long time."
>>80984417
We waste so much money on other menial shit like the defense of Europe and Asia as well as welfare and food stamps.
But you want to cut the Death sentence because it's cheaper? What's that gonna have, like a 25ยข tax cut on my yearly taxes?
Yeah nah you're a moral fag.
>>80985549
hyper-expensive death serums for the sake of being "humane"
>>80986758
>Britbongs
The Federal Government can charge someone with a crime. It's will be "United States v. Mike Jones." The federal government DOES practice the death penalty. They also could pass national legislation to ban it, regardless of state law.
>>80986960
The death penalty actually costs us about twice per year what food stamps cost us.
$50,000-$90,000 per year per death row inmate, times the 3,000 people on death row.
That's considerably more than the $70 million per year on food stamps.
>>80985710
I don't know man I'm not an expert I just look at what has worked in the past and put one and one together it worked in those countries why can't it work here? And what can we learn from them?
>>80987462
Crime everywhere in the world was low in that era.
Why don't you try looking at more than one single anecdote before you try to voice an opinion? Not trying to be rude.
Personally, the liberal hypocrisy of wanting to get rid of the death penalty while simultaneously promoting abortion sickens me. They want to say that a serial killer or rapist has a right to life while saying that an unborn child, the epitome of innocence, has no such right.
Also, the death penalty is a matter of justice and has eternal repercussions. Whatever side you are on, cost should not be a deciding factor in the fate of someones life.
>>80987421
We spend more than 70m a year on food stamps. The bigger waste in the budget is the subsidies we give to multinational farming corporations to produce sugar and corn.
>>80984417
the death sentence is understandable, but how can people get 200 years of prison time?
you guys need to fix that retarded shit
>>80987623
http://www.fns.usda.gov/sites/default/files/pd/SNAPsummary.pdf
But no, keep pretending you know what you're talking about.
>>80987239
>regardless of state law
then the constitution is dead
the constitution should be the only binding federal piece of legislation
give me an example of the federal government practicing the death penalty in a state where the dead penalty isn't a punishment
>>80987831
We have minimum sentencing for crime. When the DA charges someone with multiple crime they committed they can add up to 200 years in some cases.
What you're asking is to ignore the multiple crimes they committed?
>>80987868
National legislation to ban the death penalty would be in the form of an amendment to the constitution.
>>80986482
You don't have to use a bullet for every case. Keep the current situation for folk with a decent life history and don't seem like sworn killers.
For the subhuman scum do the bullet as a fast track solution.
I'd also go one further and say that if you commit crimes with sentences greater than your life expectancy then you get a bullet too. What's the point of keeping something caged up for no reason whatsoever. All at the expense of the taxpayer - the victim.
>>80984417
No but it should shorten the appeals process massively.
5 years should be the maximum time allowed to be on death row. Where it is an open and shut case (CCTV of the crime) get rid of them within the month.
Oh, and they should only get a choice between hanging and the firing squad.
>>80987597
Maybe I was mistaken and it wasn't just a few countries after all apologies I love history I'm just not that into post ww2 but why was crime low back then? Life quality is higher then it was then so that's out of the window so what exactly made post ww2 so low crime and please ppl don't start with 50's nostalgia or retarded nig/Jew arguments stick to facts or neutral opinions
>>80988092
And that is done by the States, which only further proves my original point that the United States is not a centralized system.
>>80988009
>What you're asking is to ignore the multiple crimes they committed?
no, but laws in european countries sentence them to the punishment of the heaviest crime I think
how can one be sentenced to 200 years in prison? life sentence should be the biggest, 200 years is the same as if he was sentenced to 150 or 100
so if one does some crimes for which he will be sentenced to 100 years, he might aswell do other shit to get himself to 200, or even more?
>it's broken, so let's just get rid of it
I thought that was Republican logic? Why do Dems think this way on the death penalty?
>>80987868
I really don't think you understand the United States. The Constitution doesn't at all disallow further federal law at all. What you're thinking is the Federalist v. Anti- Federalist papers and even then not many anti federalist was calling for simply the Constitution as the federal law.
It's pretty hard to just Google that shit, but I'm versed in the basics of the US Criminal Justice system and there isn't any thought of "Did the State he commit a crime in practice the death penalty?" in a Federal Prosecutors mind. They don't care.
>>80988092
>>80988441
What, why in the hell does if have to be an amendment to the Constitution?
>>80988518
Because they've done something so bad that they've pissed off the prosecutor so much that they asked for consecutive sentencing and the judge have found their acts to be so degenerate to society that they agree.
The vast majority of sentencing is done concurrently.
>>80989042
My point is that the United States was designed in such a way so that each state runs, in effect, as a miniature country within a larger union. The Constitution binds these in single principals, and any amendment to which must be done by the States themselves. Further legislation can be passed beyond that due to representation from each State, but the underlying principal is still there.
The United States still exists somewhat in this fashion, or according to it, since they practice autonomy on such issue as punishment. Whether something is a 'crime' or not is not my point. My original point was against the notion that people seem to be obsessed with; that the United States is somehow the United State, with the States themselves having seemingly irreverent and petty influence upon the actual running of the country.
This is a narrative that I find has been mainly pushed by the left, who seem to be, ironically, against the notion that States can decide on their own way of life. Presumably because they reject that some chose to live in a way counter to theirs.
>>80989969
That's mostly correct, but the Federalist papers give a lot of power to the Federal government itself. You're certainly an anti federalist, but you're a few years late to that debate.
I don't see much of that, the left are enjoying their state's rights to legalize Marijuana.
>>80984417
>After all, it is cheaper to imprison people for life
than to execute them.
Bullets and ditches are cheap though.
>>80984417
Actually im in favor of the Death Penalty for even more crimes than its already used for.
I DONT think we should keep people in jail for the rest of their life. What does that accomplish for them.
In fact I dont think we should be holding anybody for years on end either. What does it do to somebody's life to go to jail for 20 years? It doesnt kill them but it doesnt leave them a life.
And I think there should be a strict limit of 2 appeals for it. After that it doesnt matter whether you did it or not, we all make mistakes and that includes the state.
Killing people isnt a sin, if there's a good reason for it. Murdering them is a problem though, capital punishment isnt murder.
>>80984417
Instead of jailing them for live or executing them I suggest we force them to a lifetime of unpaid forced labor.
>>80992600
>thread dies when I make a post
every fucking time
>>80993554
I know this feel
I dont believe the justice system is about punishment at all.
Its about fixing a problem that is plaguing society. Be it one person or many.
Did the make an honest mistake, can they be rehabilitated? These things dont take long to find out... few years at the most.
After that point what do you do with them?
Put them in a reserved penal colony where members of like kind can fight it out or live a mutually rough life but remain free in day to day activities?
Or just do them the favor of putting them down. So they wont be a danger to society any longer?
Would be great if we had an isolated expanse to toss people who really wanted to live but weren't able to coexist in our society (New York City in "escape from new york"). But nobody seems to want to accept that idea.
Execution is easy. People die, maybe if they didnt do the things they did they would have lived longer. If they were falsely accused... well people also die in accidents too. Best not to stretch it out for too long.
>>80984417
You know what's even cheaper? Throwing them out of helicopters.
>>80986876
I don't care about whether they're the devil incarnate. Tax payers waste millions on keeping human trash alive even after it's killed someone.
Take it out back and burn it.
>>80992600
yo thats a good ideea but notnin the usa tho
think about it
>mostly black prison population
>forced labour
nigs already think that they are being jalied becauze the crackas wanna enslave them legally
this would just give them confirmation
Give them fewer appeals, and shoot them instead of using a lethal injection.
>>80984417
>After all, it is cheaper to imprison people for life than to execute them.
Liberal lie.
It's cheaper to just have a firing squad.
>>80993800
I think the Death Penalty should be applicable to these crimes:
* Rape
* Murder
* Operating a Ponzi or Pyramid Scheme
2 Strikes rule of pretty much any white collar crime, and money crimes dictate restitution as a public debt
I wish we could have death penalties in Mexico... :(
?
Cheaper?
