Reminder that the myth of the early Roman emperors and the Roman and Greek Gods and heroes being all blonde and blue eyed is WE WUZ KANGZ nigger tier garbage. You can clearly see in these galleries of well preserved Roman and Greek frescoes that most of them had olive skin and dark hair and dark eyes. Not typical features associated with Nordics:
http://www.theoi.com/GalleryF1.html
http://www.theoi.com/GalleryZ2.html
http://www.theoi.com/GalleryZ3.html
http://www.theoi.com/GalleryZ4.html
I don't know why there's even a doubt about this. Nordic people can't stand the climate of the mediterranean. They aren't fucking adapted to that area.
>>80966184
no shit, moron, blonde hair and blue eyes came exclusively from the Nordic race.
>>80966184
EXCELLENT AND BASED FRATELLO
>>80966184
The romans are the ultimate fucking cucks.
They blatantly copy and pasted greeces culture onto theirs and called themselves romans, sure they took over the known world but those fucking savages capitulated the greeks, the very people they sought to be.
i wish they wouldve fucked off, because if greece wouldve stayed a superpower, who knows how advanced the world would be today.
Fuck you shitaly, im glad your ancestors got BTFO by muzzies and germans
>>80966346
Tell that to all the idiots shaming those with brown hair and eyes, unwilling to admit they're speaking down to the true descendants of those kings and queens they admire so.
>>80966640
leave it to americans to have a meme vision of history, no wonder you're all #shoahmissiles
>>80966184
fuck you eggplant, your great grandmother fucked a nigger
>>80966184
But the early rulers and founders of the Latin civilizations were White.
How do you think you came to speak an Indo-Aryan language?
Those came from the blond invaders from the north east in pre-historic times. You got proto--Slav'd.
>>80966640
>american education
>>80967670
>Ukranian steppe
>"north-east"
>implying they weren't mixing with the locals since Corded Ware
>implying there weren't different routes to western Europe
>implying the patricians of early Rome didn't mix with the Etruscan rulers
>>80967772
>>80967533
please point out any illogical fallacies my friends
>>80966184
>perseus, jason, theseus, hercules, achilles
all greeks and none of them actual people
The only people who claim they were blonde hair blue eyes are those trying to promote the Aryan race.
>>80967987
>illogical fallacies
stop making your compatriots look even dumber than their current reputation
you have a meme vision of history because you pick unrelated simplistic shit and paste it together to fit your meme narrative
>>80967567
>Sweden
HAHAHAHAHA. SUCK MY DICK KEKBOY.
>>80966346
this
i assumed they looked like george clooney
or lighter if they came from northern italy
>>80966640
Breh, Rome was the one who brought advanced civilization to far flung places. Greece was too busy fucking around and being city states.
>>80966184
Not every white person is Nordic..
>>80966184
Why does that matter? I barely see anyone claiming that the eary mediterranean civilizations were ruled by "Aryans" or "Nordics" on /pol/ anymore, but that's just me, I don't visit these threads very often because they are stupid. It's all about actual politics and happenings now.
>>80966184
Of course you don't have to be blonde haired and blue eyed to be white.
European Mitochondrial Haplotype Identified in Ancient Phoenician Remains from Carthage, North Africa
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0155046
>>80966184
They look pretty Nordic to me
I love hearing that X ancient civilization was black. Africans haven't done a single damn thing in their own enormous shithole, but they expect you to believe that they were fucking precursors.
>>80968990
There were black Pharaohs, even outside of the 25th dynasty. King tut was at least 1/4 black.
>>80966184
Wh would ireland care about this?
>>80967881
The people of the Pontic steppe where the same pastoralist warriors who came from Central Asia and invaded into all of Europe and Scandinavia. They also moved into Iran and northern Pakistan and as far East as China.
Your stupid greentext replies only vindicate what I'm saying.
Etruscans themselves were Indo-European speakers who therefore must have at some point been in contact and assimilated with the blond invaders from the north.
Western Europe contains traces of these northeastern genes, all the way to Iberia, meaning, this was a profound episode of demographic change in Europe. And genetic evidence suggests these genes are transferred paternally, meaning your brown women got enriched by the steppe warriors, kek.
Which is a good thing, because you emerged from being docile, farming brown cucks into a proud empire of rigid martial tradition and solid institutions which form the backbone of modern civilization.
Improve your bait, a few facial potraits from ancient mosaics don't prove you statement.
>>80966346
The "Nordic race" is a hybrid population consists of very old Middle Eastern farmers, some ancient hunter gatherer DNA and more recent Siberian Indo-Aryan-speaking warrior nomads who are responsible for the blond coloration.
You need to learn some basic pre-history.
>>80969488
X2B?
>>80969334
point is that they didn't come from north-east Europe
>Etruscans themselves were Indo-European speakers
not a single credible scholar thinks this
moreover, their DNA suggests they were overwhelmingly brown eyed and with only partial skin depigmentation, they would've looked likely darker than modern southern Euros
stay eternally resentful, snowmonkey
>>80968110
what was i wrong about shitaly?
please, educate me :-DD
>>80969700
Cool chart bro, thanks
>>80966184
yep, even in there own countries they keep getting skin cancer, they wouldn't survive two generations in the Mediterranean.
Too bad the future of today's Romans is totally fucked. They will all be niggers soon.
>>80969707
I am not here to educate you.
I suggest you actually looking up the state of Greece right before the Roman conquest or the opinion of many Roman patricians on Greek culture at the time.
Moreover, many Greek influences in Rome came indirectly through the Etruscans.
>>80968657
the occasional stormfag (typically american) will popup from time to time, they also claim Egypt and Mesopotamia, so literal WE WUZ
>>80969881
>that pic
I am cancer, destroyer of cells
>>80969315
>>80968150
you're full of shit dude
why do you talk about things you are ignorant about?
>>80968794
a single mtDNA is too little to draw conclusions, perhaps it was someone they imported from the med islands, Sardinia has a fair frequency of U5 I think
what's more interesting, talking about mtDNA, is this http://www.nature.com/articles/srep25501
>>80970516
and then this
They also tried to do the same thing for the great minds behind the Italian Renaissance, claiming most of them were blonde and blue eyed descendants of Nordic Germanics 'n shiet despite the eye and hair color of the majority of them never being recorded. I can believe that they were majority light eyed maybe, since northern Italians and Tuscans are pretty light eyed on average and that's where the achievement during the Renaissance was mostly concentrated in.
Germanics have a massive inferiority complex towards south Euros due to them lacking in cultural and historical contributions before the Age of Enlightenment.
>>80966640
Literally what.
I'm Greek and even I recognize the Romans took the greek cultural base and emerged with an inherently superior way of life.
>>80969657
W-what?
>point is that they didn't come from north-east Europe
Well, they came from central Asia more specifically, and then into northern, western and southern Europe. The proliferation of both R1a and R1b genes is the most poignant illustration of this.
Your map is a little backwards and dated.
>moreover, their DNA suggests they were overwhelmingly brown eyed and with only partial skin depigmentation, they would've looked likely darker than modern southern Euros
Depends which sample you are referring to... has there been any genetic testing done on pre-Roman Etruscan corpses? First I've heard of it.
Of course, the prevailing genetic type on the Italian peninsula is the ancient Middle Eastern Farmer genes from the Neolithic. Indeed they were brown but relatively fair skinned.
But you got enriched by the Indo-Aryan people, as did most of Europe at the time. Latin originates in the area of Latium, so that means there were Indo-Aryan populations in those areas in Italy before Roman times.
And Rome has had contact with "Celtic" peoples who were the Indo-Aryans in fact, since the beginning of your history.
Face it Gian-Luigi, you are a hybrid people, speaking an Indo-Aryan language, like everyone around you.
>>80971117
Mean to respond to this>>80969700
>>80970721
>>80970516
Freaking Alexander the Great at it again.
That smug face of him, uhh
>>80971117
Forgot image.
>>80966184
Except the people you have to attack to say that's not the case are historians and notable commentators throughout the ages, so your argument has to be that it's a conspiracy that spans thousands of years by many nationalities.
>>80971117
>Well, they came from central Asia more specifically, and then into northern, western and southern Europe. The proliferation of both R1a and R1b genes is the most poignant illustration of this.
well if you are going to go back this much as far as Y-DNA R*, sure, but then you lose the cultural aspect of things
>Depends which sample you are referring to... has there been any genetic testing done on pre-Roman Etruscan corpses? First I've heard of it.
I was referring to the overwhelmingly R1b bearing Yamnaya peoples(see pic related), the ones who actually spread IE culture west, as testified by the huge presence of R1b compared to R1a, which seems to be a more eastern branch.
Every single European got enriched by the Aryans, point is that by the time of early Rome, they would've already mixed, they were already "Italic" in race i.e that particular mix of aryan related ancestry and neolithic ancestry. I hope you realize those IE speaking peoples colonized much of the peninsula from Venetia to Sicily, they weren't special in Iron age Italy.
Of course we are hybrid, but we're hybrids from the bronze age, like the vast majority of Europeans.
Oh, also, don't forget that the "aryans" carried almost half of their ancestry from the caucasus, a population highly related to neolithic Iran. This if you want to go back that much.
>>80971009
I'd have to disagree with that. Rome was unsustainable economically, more barbaric (the Colosseum for example), produced less scientific achievements, and was in a recession for like 70% of its existence (the early republic and the rule of the 5 emperors being the notable exceptions). I don't think they improved upon Hellenistic culture at all.
Reminiscence Italy is a much brighter period in time. They did in fact improve upon byzantine culture.
>>80972047
>produced less scientific achievements
Really? I don't think so, friend. The only thing they were lacking in compared to the ancient Greeks was philosophy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_technology
>>80971944
>well if you are going to go back this much as far as Y-DNA R*, sure, but then you lose the cultural aspect of things
Well, language and religion seem to be the most important factors defining culture and the R1 people are characterized by these two things culturally.
>I was referring to the overwhelmingly R1b bearing Yamnaya peoples(see pic related), the ones who actually spread IE culture west, as testified by the huge presence of R1b compared to R1a, which seems to be a more eastern branch.
R1b and R1a had the same origin, they are just separated in time. Think of them as two waves of migration. R1b was the first expansion of these Indo-Aryans into Europe (hence their prevalence in the West) and R1a was a more recent stage of the invasion (probably Corded Ware).
I like to think of R1b generally as the "Celts" and the R1a people as the Germans and proto-Slavs.
I'm not sure if blondism was present in R1b as it is obviously in R1a, but does it matter? That's just one gene failing to operate correctly because it was selected for.
>Every single European got enriched by the Aryans, point is that by the time of early Rome, they would've already mixed, they were already "Italic" in race i.e that particular mix of aryan related ancestry and neolithic ancestry
That sounds plausible since the late R1bs arrived in the late Neolithic. So the Italic type was already firmly established.
>
Oh, also, don't forget that the "aryans" carried almost half of their ancestry from the caucasus, a population highly related to neolithic Iran. This if you want to go back that much.
I suspect presence of this type in Iran and Pakistan is due to back-flow of genes due to environmental reasons or conquest.
>>80966346
It can literally be traced back to ancient peoples living in what is modern Ukraine
>>80972707
>The only thing they were lacking in compared to the ancient Greeks was philosophy
>most of the roman achievements were lost
Reminder that after christcuck fanatics burned down the Alexandria library, most of the Greek achievements were lost as well, yet Greeks still had more impact overall in the field of science.
Rome's most notable feat was that it improved a lot upon engineering, like the sewer system and whatnot. However it didn't lay any foundations, it was mostly streamlining upon already existing concepts. In other sciences like math, physics, astronomy etc, the difference is even more pronounced.
And one more thing concerning my first point about the Alexandria library, there is evidence that ancient Greece was FAR more advanced than what we previously thought. They even invented the first prototype computer.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antikythera_mechanism
>>80973029
>R1b and R1a had the same origin, they are just separated in time. Think of them as two waves of migration. R1b was the first expansion of these Indo-Aryans into Europe (hence their prevalence in the West) and R1a was a more recent stage of the invasion (probably Corded Ware).
>I like to think of R1b generally as the "Celts" and the R1a people as the Germans and proto-Slavs.
>I'm not sure if blondism was present in R1b as it is obviously in R1a, but does it matter? That's just one gene failing to operate correctly because it was selected for.
does make sense but especially when we talk about phenotype, things seems fairly separated i.e the R1a bearing people from the eastern steppe seemed to be pretty fair looking, with confirmed blondism and fair features(i.e Andronovo culture)
the western ones almost seem to have been more influenced in this by the, I assume, darker caucasian ones
both are autosomally very much alike indeed
>I suspect presence of this type in Iran and Pakistan is due to back-flow of genes due to environmental reasons or conquest.
the back flow certainly seems to be a thing, but recently we've got DNA from neolithic Iran(J* peoples fundamentally), so much older than the aryan expansion, and said neolithic Iranians seem to be very related to the caucasian hunter gatherers that last year were confirmed as being a big part of the aryans ancestry
