What are your thoughts on the Holocaust? I am open to information and want to avoid a confirmation bias, but all evidence that I find opposing the Holohoax is refuted as being "war propaganda" or that the Nazis cleaned everything up can, itself, be accused of being war propaganda!
The most common defence of the Holocaust is that everybody believes it and that it is "common knowledge" that it happened, but isn't there a fallacy pointing out that basing your conclusion on the status quo is erroneous?
So what of it, /pol/? Did it happen or didn't it? Regardless of it occurring, it is in the main sphere of things and the Jews are using it to subvert and silence, but I still want to know the truth.
Yeah? Is everything that is pro-Nazi just Hitler propaganda? That seems to be the line of reasoning for a lot of people.
>>80432017
All I know is that they didn't get enough of them
>>80432404
Yes, exactly. It is an untouchable subject because being labelled a racist is more dangerous than discussion. Sad days.
>>80432894
Based on the current state of affairs, yes. Very much so, correct.
Wonder how she got a black kid from a white man? Maybe she fucked that dog, eh Canada?
>>80432017
kek the dog
>>80432894
>>80432017
Holocaust denial is a religion with many religious principles its adherents feverishly cling on to.
Let's address these religious tenets one by one, shall we?
Tenet #1: There is no extermination order from Hitler
true, but pic related was sent on the 11th of July 1943, titles "Treating the Jewish question" and basically states that the Führer has commanded that when it comes to dealing with the Jewish question in public, no description is to be given to what is understood by a "total solution".
Furthermore, it states that however, it is allowed to be said that Jews are being drafted to a befitting work duty.
>>80436502
and then we have pic related, dated July 1941, where an order from Göring to Heydrich instructs him to begin all organisatory and material preparations necessary to begin the operation of the Final Solution to the Jewish Question in German territory in Europe, and to let him know exactly what the requirements for this undertaking are going to be.
>>80436951
Tenet #2: We have no photographic evidence of the gas chambers at Auschwitz, least of all the alleged holes in the roof (the gas chambers were located below surface level, so the roof would be pretty much at surface level) into which Zyklon-B cans were emptied.
pic related proves otherwise.
>>80437203
Tenet #3: Holocaust deniers often state that hydrogen cyanide (zyklon b gas) is volatile, and therefore an explosion would occur if the smallest spark (such as that from any electric equipment like a light bulb) was inside the gas chamber. Even a cigarette would be a hazard.
What they do not tell you however, is that the zyklon b concentration during a gassing (300 ppm) was around 200 times less than what is
needed to create a volatile environment where an explosion can occur (56,000 ppm).
Source: The Merck Index" and the CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics.
In fact, the Nazis' own documentation on the usage of Zyklon-B In fact, stated "Danger of explosion: 75 grams of HCN in 1 cubic meter of air. Normal application: approx. 8–10 grams per cubic meter, therefore not explosive."
source: IMT document NI-9912
pic related
Inb4 femenist stormfags get in here
>>80437929
This low amount of hydrogen cyanide (HCN) concentration enough to kill warm blooded humans well within approx. 30 minutes is also why (in combination with 40 years of exposure to the elements) you wont find much prussian blue staining on samples taken from the gas chamber wall remains as opposed to samples taken from the sheltered delousing (fumigation) chamber used to kill cold-blooded lice in prisoner clothing taking several days per gassing, that looks like pic related.
This should cover the Leuchter and Rudolf reports' main findings
>>80438348
Further proofs of the Auschwitz gas chambers:
We have blueprints where the word Leichenkeller is used. Yet if they were morgues, why do we have a document that suggests they should be heated? Unless they were in a ghastly sense literal Leichenkeller, i.e. corpse (making) cellars, and the heating is used to get the zyklon-B pellets to start releasing hydrogen cyanide gas.
Also you don't use zyklon-B in a morgue to disinfect corpses.
Also, how do you explain the word "Vergasungskeller" found in an official document? I can speak German, so you won't be able to convince me with your "shelter from an external gas attack" nonsense. The best your denier heroes have come up with to explain this is "room where the fumigation equipment was stored", but that would make more sense if it were just called Gaskeller. Vergasung means to gas something or someone purposefully.
And this doesnt even involve any eye-witness testimony. I still have solid documentary evidence going for me. What do you have? The Leuchter and Rudolf report proven to be pseudoscience in the 90s by Dr. Richard Green and Jamie McCarthy??
the holohoax didnt really kill 6 million jews, in fact the number doesnt even come close. The international red cross counted all of the people who died in all of the camps and found out that only around 200 thousand died in total from these camps. It isnt even close to how bad people say it was
>>80438724
Aforementioned Leichenkeller blueprints
>>80439002
>all of the people died in all of the camps
nope, just officially registered prisoners, aka the limited data they were fed by the nazis. they were also only allowed to "officially inspect" very few of the camps
Nips are still fighting the good fight.
>>80437929
Tenet #4: Sheeple goy tourists are never told that the only intact gas chamber in Auschwitz (located in the Auschwitz I Stammlager) is actually a post-war soviet reconstruction of what used to be a nazi air raid shelter (that previously was a gas chamber)
incorrect. pic related is outside the building today, so anybody who can read will know that the gas chamber is a post-war reconstruction
>>80439002
You ACTUALLY think the red cross has ever been helpful or truthful? They were not allowed to inspect the real camps, for show camp areas were set up for visits, speer admits this
>>80439813
This shit is funny as fuck to me. You wanna bring up the skin lamp shades? Why would they fucking hospitalize Jews and try to get them back up to health if they didn't give a fuck? How about the SOAP and the shrunken heads?
>>80439749
Tenet #4: Diesel Exhaust purportedly used in the Reinhardt camps to gas people cannot kill anyone!
Toxicity debate about diesel engine gases
It is generally accepted by mainstream historians, that in the Aktion Reinhardt camps (Treblinka, Belzec, Majdanek, Chelmno/Kulmhof) the method of gassing humans did not involve Zyklon-B, but the fumes of an internal combustion engine (either petrol or diesen; eyewitness testimonies vary), captured from a Soviet tank, as well as the use of mobile gas vans.
-The source of the claim that diesel exhaust cannot kill humans, and therefore nobody was gassed, is one questionable "expert" by the name of Friedrich Paul Berg, operating a site called nazigassings. His claim is that idling diesel engines produce fumes that are no more dangerous than cigarette smoke, and therefore incapable of killing people since they contain upto 20% oxygen.
A second claim he makes is that if people at these camps were killed by gasoline (petrol) exhaust instead, then the majority of their (naked) corpses would display areas where the skin is cherry red (as a result of CO poisoning) but almost no eyewitness testimonies report this.
There are plenty of studies showing diesel engines are capable of killing people when its fumes are pumped into an enclosed room. "The Toxicity of Fumes from a diesel Engine Under Four Different Running Conditions", by Prattle et al., British Journal of Industrial Medicine, 1957, Vol 14, p. 47-55, proves that small mammals can be killed by a very weak engine with only 6 bhp. The soviet tank engines employed in the Reinhardt camps on the other hand had several hundred bhp.
If you still doubt me, you can try it out in your own garage if you want, just dont have your relatives hold me accountable for your death.
>>80436502
Can it not also be said that relocation away from Europe is a "total solution"?
>>80436951
See above.
>>80437203
Very grainy picture. Just as it is called war propaganda anytime dissent from the narrative is mentioned, this will be my defence against you, as well.
>>80437929
This is of sound reason if what you say is true.
>>80438348
Just as the Nazis wiped every trace of proof (allegedly) when they were retreating, it can also be said that the Allies purposefully denied access until any evidence was erased.
>>80438724
Not seeing the logic behind morgues not requiring heat.
The other argument regarding semantics seems sound, but the eye-witness Speilberg interview "first-hand account" is weak, at best.
Is it not a big coincidence that any dissent is deemed pseudoscience? I am open to authentic information and want to avoid a confirmation bias, but do not act like you are above it as well.
>>80439749
Just because they tell you it is so does not make it the truth. Where is your scientific curiosity, does it vanish when you examine your own argument? I apply it to my own, hence this entire thread.
>>80441337
This has sound reason, if what you say is the truth, which I believe it as being the truth.
>>80442062
well, my infodumps should suffice for starters.
If you have any specific denier claims you want addressed, let me know.
pic related is a model of one of the several Krema / Bunker buildings in the Birkenau complex with ground level crematorium and sub-surface gas chamber. it's needed to better understand this pic
>>80437203
>>80443157
My point of inquiry is the amount of coincidences that must/do occur the minute you question the narrative, it is as if you question the existence of gravity. I think that disease and social standing of Jews (lowering the necessity to care for their living arrangements) played a much bigger role than painting Nazis as literally the worst people of the twentieth century.
Why is there not a big storm over the Chinese Cultural Revolution? No denial or vilification of deniers: no mention whatsoever!
>>80432017
guess you can still buy nigger babies
>>80443157
and here's two films about how a gassing procedure would have undergone:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBc3y8A7DmY
and
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xgb7Kgjma-g
>>80443370
because there is a relatively big, relatively well-off and well-educated jewish intellectual lobby in the US with access to Hollywood. I do not deny this. So naturally, their plight make it on the big screen far more likely than the plight of Chinese murdered by Mao (also this would cause diplomatic tensions between China and the US) or russians murdered by Stalin in the gulags.
>>80432017
>even the dog knows
this image will never fail to be funny
After spending lots of time researching /pol/ tier revisionist memes and other such arguments I say with the utmost confidence that it definitely happened.
Read the rationalwiki article on holocaust denial to get an idea of what I mean.
>>80444488
Do you think the 6 million number is accurate? That's the primary thing I don't think is true.
>>80443157
Since you seem rational, which is so fucking rare to encounter with Holocaust believers, I would like to ask a couple of questions.
Why do you think there are so many fake images and propaganda sites with false information in favor of the Holocaust?
This is "history.com"... wew
>>80443157
Where on the grounds is the gas chamber in this image?
>>80437203
This is the image I used to identify the kitchen when my friend said there were lots of chimneys on the "crematorium" (kitchen).
>>80444903
This is arguably the only issue I have with the holocaust.
According to official sources, if 1.1 million people were killed in Auschwitz, 800k in Treblinka, 167k in Sobibor, 200k in Chelmno/Kulmhof, 80k in Majdanek, 500k in Belzec, this amounts to only a total of 2.9 million people.
These were all the death/extermination camps in Poland, btw.
If you add in the victims of all other concentration camps where no large scale (50k and more) gassings took place, and people mostly died out of other causes like disease, attrition and firing squads for disobeying orders, I'd say you'd get another 800k or so.
Dachau (41.5k),
Mauthausen-Gusen (100k),
Buchenwald (56k),
Theresienstadt (33k),
Bergen-Belsen (52k),
Sachsenhausen (30k),
Stutthof (85k),
Neuengamme (60k),
Ravensbrück (30k),
Flossenburg (30k),
Natzweiler (22k),
Grossrosen (40k)
Jasenovac (80k)
Jadovno (68k)
Sajmiste (15k)
Plaszow (8k)
Klooga (2k)
Vaivara (2.5k)
Vught/Herzogensbusch (749)
So we're sitting at around 3.7 million.
Then you have Aktion T4, where mentally sick and disabled people were killed in nazi hospitals:
Hartheim (30k)
Grafeneck (9.8k)
Brandenburg (9.7k)
Bernburg (8.6k)
Sonnenstein (14k)
Hadamar (10k)
We're now at around 3.8 million
Remember the holocaust death toll is 11 million civilians, of which 6 million are jews. So the remaining 7.2 million were all killed out in the field?
I know the Warsaw Ghetto uprising/clearing (13k) and Babyn Jar + related mass shootings (33k + 150k) are things we learn about, but
no effort is taken to explain the remaining 7.1 million victims. On one hand, we have of course the "nazi death marches", which happened as
a result of shifting fronts and nazis losin control over eastern teritories. And then we have Soviet POWs, who are often also added to the holocaust. And the people who already died in the railcars due to cramped conditions. Were told that about 1.5 million people were killed by Einsatzgruppen operating out in the field.
>>80443157
How many of these low-capacity crematory ovens were there?
This should be Dachau.
>>80445692
That's a map of Auschwitz I.
You can see Gas Chamber I (the only one that can be visited today) marked in the pic.
The model shown in my pic is one of 6 located in Auschwitz II Birkenau, much larger than Auschwitz I "Stammlager"
>>80445773
The only true excavation that took place was at Bełżec, performed by Andrzej Kola. For the life of me I can not find his original papers. I only ever saw a handful of pictures, and they show no actual excavation. The core samples he is said to have taken to confirm the existence of ashes were "returned to respect the dead". If this was such a massive undertaking which proved the existence of mass graves full of ash (in order to accommodate the number of people it is claimed were killed), why was it not properly documented? All we have are drawings, which could be made up.
His Wikipedia page does not even refer to the project he supposedly spent two years on.
https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=https%3A%2F%2Fpl.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FAndrzej_Kola&edit-text=&act=url
>>80445973
The Auschwitz complex (consisting of Auschwitz I "Stammlager", Auschwitz II "Birkenau" and Auschwitz III "Monowitz") possessed the following crematory ovens:
Auschwitz I ("Stammlager") possessed three double-muffle ovens (Krema I), with a capacity of burning 340 corpses per day (if you divide that by the total 6 muffles, you get 56.66 corpses per muffle in 24h, which is 2.36 per hour. Judging by the size of each muffle, you can easily burn 2 corpses at once and even that of a child, and the process should take 1 hour.
Birkenau possessed five triple-muffle ovens EACH in Krema II and III, thus each of these two Kremas having a capacity of burning 1440 corpses per day (http://i.imgur.com/sDGC18A.jpg is the document where this is fucking written on paper, go ahead and call it a forgery, see if I care)
and
two eight-muffle ovens (Krema IV and V).
Hypothetically this yields a total cremation capacity of 4756 cremated corpses within 24 hours of non-stop operation, and therefore 1,7 million by theoretical operation time of 1 year.
We know each of these crematories was operational for approx. 2 years.
The company that produced the ovens, Topf & Sons, states that the ovens were designed for almost non-stop use without breaking down, and the Sonderkommando (jewish inmates) in charge of the cremation even used bellows to accelerate the cremation process by blowing extra air into the muffles.
More than one corpse could be cremated at a time, especially when it came to burning child corpses (who never passed the Selektion and were sent into the chambers directly upon arrival, remember?), ashes got mixed up, and therefore comparing modern small civilian crematory oven burning times (via websites like "how stuff works") where 1 person is cremated at a time and the ovens are cleaned after each cremation, is retarded.
Tell me, if Auschwitz was a by-the-book labor camp, why did the nazis blow up all krematoria before retreating but leave the barracks intact?
>>80446363
I see those bombs, so it was destroyed?
It's very suspicious that they did this to Belzec. They paved right over the graves, and covered the rest of the grounds in this shit.
I wouldn't be so skeptical of the Holocaust if shady stuff like this weren't so prevalent.
>>80446700
I like this kind of information. I have NEVER encountered it. It is actually quality stuff.
>>80446700
lol any actual evidence of these ovens? That is merely a dubious looking piece of paper. Doesn't look authentic at all. Proof of its authenticity?
>>80445773
"only" 2.9 million people killed....
lol
>>80444903
As wiki says, a potential 1.1 mil variance, but I believe 6 mil is entirely plausible
>>80447290
You are right... You can clearly see where the paper is creased but the text is pasted over it. You can see how the text is not distorted at all, and is not printed on the paper. That image actually is a forgery.
>>80446700
>see if I care
Well, I hope you would if you are trying to make a convincing case.
I haven't dumped any of my fake Holocaust images other than the Auschwitz Kitchen, which I discovered myself.
I assume that most fake images are Russian propaganda.
>>80447837
Not to mention the signature written in ink at the bottom. Looks like it was added yesterday. Terrible fake.
Bump.
I don't want to overload the Austrian gentleman with points to address. I just want to share some faked images. It shouldn't be necessary to do this if the event was so self-evident.
>>80448256
Seriously, I am so sick of fake images.
I have never debated or argued with a Holocaust believer that didn't use fake evidence at some point.
>>80448669
I guess you might find this useful
>http://englishrussia.com/2012/09/06/photo-manipulations-in-the-ussr
>>80449833
Thanks, I have seen this one called a "cremation pyre" before.
>>80450373
>>80450404
The Austrian guy hasn't posted. I hope he hasn't left the thread.
Seriously, what the fuck? It makes me think he's a disinfo shill trying to convert people with "reasonable" information.
I was mostly taking him at his word, but then when an image he uses gets called out he disappears...
Shit like that just makes me more skeptical. [s]Getting trolled by COINTELPRO agents![/s]
>>80448453
how am I supposed to react to this?
If you can tell me in which publications these images were used (e.g. in an important history book) then yes, you might have a point and I would have to justify my position.
Right now I have no idea (except for the very right one) where these images were used. Several of them point to a blog (!)
And how the 4th image, top and below is supposed to have a different meaning altogether eludes me as well.
Here's some links if someone is interested in doing some reading. Remember, the truth does not fear investigation.
>Info sites
http://www.holohoax101.org/
https://holocaustdeprogrammingcourse.com/
>Research Papers
https://www.docdroid.net/V0uXpbq/oyvey.txt.html
https://www.docdroid.net/MkWOJNx/hoaxv2.pdf.html
https://www.docdroid.net/L7Hw9hY/debating-the-holocaust.pdf.html
>The Origin of the '6 Million Jews' Figure
http://semiticcontroversies.blogspot.com/2012/07/origin-of-6-million-jews-figure.html#!/2012/07/origin-of-6-million-jews-figure.html
http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/search/pages/results/?state=&date1=1836&date2=1922&proxtext=6000000+jews
http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=24369
>Auschwitz
Argument Boils About Numbers of Auschwitz Dead
http://rense.com/general62/auch.htm
Auschwitz for Dummies
http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=4311
Documentary Photographs Proving the National Socialist Persecution of the Jews?
http://codoh.com/library/document/924
The Einsatzgruppen and the Holocaust
http://www.whale.to/b/einsatzgruppen_h.html
Examining the Einsatzgruppen Reports
http://www.cwporter.com/einsatz.htm
The Gas Chambers: Truth or Lie?
http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v02/v02p319_Faurisson.html
The Germans "Bred Geese in Order to Drown Out the Shouts and Torments of 250,000 Jews Murdered Inside the Gas Chambers"
http://exposing-the-holocaust-hoax-archive.blogspot.com/2014/09/sobibor-germans-bred-geese-in-order-to.html
>>80450635
I was having dinner, so excuse the pause.
>>80450635
this image shows the cremation of civilians in dresden using a method that was also employed to cremate corpses at Treblinka. A large amount of corpses can be burned with relatively low amounts of fuel, as was witnessed in Dresden. Deniers for some reason say this process could never been replicated in Treblinka II
>>80446700
Just curious, how can one oven cremate 2.36 in an hour?
http://www.cremationresource.org/cremation/how-is-a-body-cremated.html
On an average, it takes about one to three hours to cremate a human body, thereby reducing it to 3-7 pounds of cremains. The cremation remains are usually pasty white in color.
>Modern oven take 1-3 hours for one body.
>>80450804
I have not interfaced with a history book that included the Holocaust except for in school.
In US High School the books say "the Holocaust happened" and you watch a movie like Schindler's List. This is even in an Advanced Placement course.
Discredited images like this are most prevalent on Holocaust "history" websites.
>>80451436
thats a A PROPER cremation, thats completely diffrent
>>80448865
You gotta do better than that if you want to officially disprove the famous "Last Jew in Vinnitsa" photograph. Seriously, it's everywhere. I'm not a >>/k/ fag so I cant argue against the gun claims or uniforms, but I need more convincing to believe otherwise.
>>80432017
Ok Ok you denyers,
lets assume the holocaust was a hoax, how would your reveal the truth to the world?
I mean like official, worldwide in MSM not on a weaboo board
>>80451901
youtube is currently their biggest propaganda outlet due to the unmoderated comments.
In the past couple years I've noticed a surge in denial on YT; earlier the WW2 vids were just filled with military buffs, now more and more happy merchant profiles are popping up yelling oy vey gevalt remember the 100 gorillion and getting a ton of likes.
As an example, just look at the comments section to the upcoming "Denial" film, based on the Irving vs. Lipstadt case
>>80451142
Austriabro, since you are one of the first rational Holocaust believers I've met, can you refute these?
>How come the international Red Cross Records refute the "offical" toll?
>Why is it that the number of dead at Auschwitz was revised in 1989 from 4.1 million to 1.5 million. However the "official" account of 6 million dead remained unchanged.
>American gas chamber expert Dr. Leuchter visited all the supposed sites and has testified that supposed gas chambers are "incapable" of supporting gas executions.
>Aushwitz Museum Curator admitted that the Russians have created the infamous "homicidal gas chamber" post war, by altering a German bomb shelter.
>Now to the good stuff, there was no "prussian blue" staining found on the walls of any supposed gas chambers. Only forensic evidence of "gassings" were found in delousing chambers where Zyklon B was used on clothing and bedding to stop the spread of typhus.
>>80432017
Point out the immense profitability of the Hollycaust industry, the dubious authenticity of Anne Frank's diary, the Nuremberg transcripts (my favourite part is the spanking machine) and Stalin's Torch Men Order.
>>80432017
Hey all.
We're being raided.
Hurrr Durr Dah Holocaust
If you really believe it's true
It will come up in this investigation
Come join the snowball
Come to the real threads
/cfg/ General
>>80449854
Red Team
>>80451378
Memetics Division\
>>80417380
>>80452242
That trailer was posted all around /pol/ and the Daily Stormer, what did you expect?
>>80451848
Can you find a picture of the back of the photo? I can't seem to.
Also, why is the original full photograph not used? Why use a cropped image with age marks edited onto it?
If it's such a compelling story, why omit so much of it? Because it's fabricated.
Students are indoctrinated in classrooms like so:
http://onnetwork.facinghistory.org/the-last-jew-in-vinnitsa-how-media-provides-a-way-to-understand-perpetratorsbystandersvictims/
It's very sad. I only want true information.
>>80451757
How so? Why are modern ovens less efficient then the ones used by Germans?
>>80452242
But will this work, I mean I want to correct the record of history and stop the lies
>>80452561
>Red Team
>Memetics Division
This shit is hilarious man. I lurk the Clinton threads, don't worry. I've been redpilling people on her activities as SoS and with the CF.
>>80452467
1) IRC was given a copy of the officially registered prisoners at the camps. They werent allowed proper, independent access to the camps during the war. The IRC never claimed that that document was an accurate counting of what transpired in the camps, until deniers picked it up and said it was
2) Soviet propaganda figure western historians as early as the 1950s did not take seriously and insisted on the 1-1.5 million number. naturally when the soviet union fell, the sign was changed. The 4 million at Auschwitz was never part of the western 6 million jewish death toll figure, therefore the latter didnt change
3) Leuchter is not "America's gas chamber expert". In fact, he is a liberal arts faggot who does not even hold an engineering degree. When asked about this in court during the Zundel trial, all he could answer was "hurr I taught myself". The unscientific nonsense he published as the "Leuchter report"
was refuted by accredited chemists Richard J. Green and Jamie McCarthy in the 90s already. If you want a summary of their findings, here it is:
https://web.archive.org/web/20150629190647/http://www.holocaust-history.org/auschwitz/chemistry/blue/
4) see >>80439749
5) see >>80438348
>>80453096
then take over the pasta
>>80453647
no u
>>80452617
The left is the "mainstream" one. The right (with the age marks and the seemingly fake looking border is the one revisionists like to present as the ACTUAL original.
While I agree that the extension of the right image toward the left looks legit, and yes I cannot find any info on where the original is archived, I cant verify the back of the photo where we are told "the Last Jew of Vinnitsa" is supposed to be written.
>>80453832
can't do everything friend
=============Auschwitz pictures from 1943. 1943!!!!========================
(just in case anybody says lol we have no photographic evidence of the gas chambers / crematory buildings)
http://www.auschwitz.org/galeria/zdjecia-i-dokumenty-historyczne/zaglada,12.html
http://www.topfundsoehne.de/media_de/abb_045.html
>>80453937
thanks for all your work dude. I think denial of the holocaust is ridiculous chemtrail-tier tinfoilery, but it's hard to find sources that refute all of the mspaint infographics because it seems any questioning is labelled as 'antisemitism,' and academia doesn't waste their time talking to /pol/tards.
>>80453937
/k/ommando here. Would just like to point out that the pic provided in >>80448865 says the gun is a tokarev. There's no fucking way you can tell what pistol that soldier is using from that picture and even if it really was a tok it doesn't mean it isn't a german/ss man. Both sides made frequent use of each others equipment on the eastern front, especially germans using rus 7.62 mm tok chambered weapons because they could also fire the old german 7.62mm mauser cartridge.
>>80454351
I just looked through all the photos on both of those pages. No evidence of gas chambers at all. Mostly just external photos of buildings. Poor form.
>>80438348
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgrZXiOPkrM
>>80453625
I'm assuming McCarthy isn't Jewish, is Green? I'm sorry, but a Jew's impartiality on this matter simply can't be trusted.
There are plenty of non-Jewish researchers, so it shouldn't be an issue to disregard some.
Also, just because someone is a professional chemist does not preclude them from being exceptionally biased. I work with a chemist who is habitually incorrect about facts. He is an outspoken anti-racist and he is especially incorrect on social matters, not surprisingly. He mostly keeps his bias out of his work, but when he says things like "people are all made of DNA and DNA is made of the same molecules; there's basically no difference." It's like saying all computer programs are the same because they are all made out of bits.
>>80454392
Wiki is obviously the best starting point if time is an issue and you want a brief crash course where more of the denier claims are summed up and refuted:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Holocaust_denial
More detail is offered in the holocaust denial article on rational wiki
But what really helped me was nizkor
They are a great team that take apart most of the "truth bomb" lies holocaust deniers spread on what look like popular videos on youtube.
Honestly, nizkor was what saved me from becoming a denier myself (then I found more obscure sites that battle holocaust denial, like holocaust controversies blog)
There's also a guy on youtube called "Denying history" who has some nice videos.
It's a long way to battle cunts like Faurisson, Mattogno, Eric Hunt, David Cole, Irving or "Denierbud", but it's a start.
>>80454624
I can confirm this, my granddad exchanges a model boat for a bringback Tokarev with the older brother of a friend when he was 16 in 1941
>>80454708
correct. but none of those external buildings have survived the war; today we only have their foundations in the Birkenau complex. See this lengthy video for a nice tour of the place.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jV6yuSZS8ak
So the photos give credit to the legitimacy models like these
>>80443157
>>80437203
at least on the outside.
>>80453625
Sorry for the late response, I was busy.
1) Then by which method was the number 6 million determined, if there is no accurate method of counting the prisoners?
2) If that is true, can you provide with evidence that determines how the number 6 million came to be?
3 & 5) Interesting report. Back to your point, this means that there is actually no proof that Zyklon B was used in killings because the concentration used was so little that is "vanished" with time.
4) That is my point, the gas chamber is a reconstruction.
>>80455410
Lol, ok. When you can provide any actual evidence of the gas chambers, get back to me.
>>80455410
To put short none of the external buildings survived, so convenient!
To prove that they are real you state that photos that don't show gas chambers are the basis for models that do show gas chambers.
>lol wut
>>80455833
see pic at
>>80438724
and blueprint at >>80439045
http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/a/abels-nele/vergasungskeller-essay.html
Letter from SS-Sturmbannfuehrer Bischoff, March 6 1943.
source: Auschwitz: Technique and operation of the gas chambers - J.C Pressac, the Beate Klarsfeld Foundation, NY, 1989, p. 434:
... order of 6/3/1943 concerning the delivery of a gas tight door 100 x 192 cm for cellar I of Krematorium III, to be produced to the identical pattern and dimensions as the cellar door of Krematorium II which is situated opposite, with peephole of double 8 mm glass, with rubber sealing strip and frame.
Letter from SS-Sturmbannfuehrer Jahrling to Topf & Sons, March 6 1943.
Auschwitz: Technique and operation of the gas chambers - J.C Pressac, the Beate Klarsfeld Foundation, NY, 1989, p. 221:
[This document is interesting for two reasons: first, it demonstrates that the underground cellars in the crematoriums could not have possibly been morgues, as morgues are never heated; heating, however, does facilitate the evaporation of Zyklon-B. Also, the document - like many others - makes reference to an "undressing room," and there is no reason for a morgue to have one near by. Pressac contains numerous other documents attesting to the design and use of the Auschwitz gas chambers. Even the fake shower heads are mentioned.]
Subject: KL Auschwitz Krematorien II and III
In accordance with your suggestion, the service agrees that cellar 1 should be preheated with the air coming from the rooms of the 3 forced draught installations. The supply and installation of the ductwork and blowers necessary to this end are to be effected as soon as possible. As you point out in your above-mentioned letter, execution should commence this week. We would ask you to send in triplicate detailed quote for supply and installation.
At the same time, we'd ask you to send an aditional quota for the modification of the air-extraction installation in the undressing room.
>>80456173
blueprints, models and speculation is not proof.
>>80452692
German engineering, so efficient it can break the laws of thermodynamics.
>>80456370
all the while I wasn't using a single eye-witness testimony, out of consideration that you deniers don't like them. shall I bring them in? :^)
>>80447218
Its pulled directly from a book, word for word:
https://books.google.com.au/books?id=83dvJxPm--EC
A book based entirely on hearsay from a 'trial'.
>>80456518
Go ahead, fail to demonstrate any proof of the gas chambers again.
>>80456089
>To prove that they are real you state that photos that don't show gas chambers are the basis for models that do show gas chambers.
Ikr. People like this are pathological sophists. Wouldn't be surprised if he was a Jew.
>>80446700
Ahh the Irving trial numbers.
This is also where it was claimed that each body burned used 3.5kgs of coal. Nevermind that 3.5kgs wouldn't not even give enough energy to boil off all the water in a body at 100% efficiency, let alone reduce it to ash.
In the midst of all this incredible German efficiency I always find myself wondering: Why did they not just shoot them and bury in mass graves, it would have been far more resource efficient, something that matters when you are losing a war.
>>80456649
That's all I'm encountering on these Holocaust story sites. All of the information I'm seeing is interpretive, or could just be fabricated. Most of the books used as "sources" are things written by literal Jews in the 80s and 90s.
Shalom.
>>80457090
Yeah, and it is all put forward as truth.
The problem is if we take all the witness testimony as truth the whole thing falls apart as soon as one flaw is found in that testimony.
The easiest place to find these flaws is in the claims around the thermodynamically impossible cremation ovens so that is usually where the argument leads.
>>80457049
Because numerous Nazi massacres proved that doing it purely execution style simply ended up traumatizing the troops.
>>80457761
I have yet to encounter a testimony that isn't dubious. The lengthier they are the more dubious information they will contain.
Too many of them are written over 30 years after the war, and it's just some Jew making shit up.
Honestly, all of this shit is exhausting.
One day a superintelligent AI will read all the available information and it will discern the truth better than any of us.
Whether it decides to share its conclusion is something else...
>>80432017
Read David Irving's books. That is the best starting point. His historical research is top notch because although Irving is not an academic star, he has a great work ethic which drives him to master the primary sources to a greater extent than any of his peers. He was sent to prison in Austria for telling people what he knows. Some people suggest that his views have softened in later times, but his basic argument that the Holocaust, qua mass gassing of Jewish prisoners and workers, is a lie still holds. Irving does not whitewash the German government's systematic robbery of the Jewish people in Europe during the war. But he still maintains that there is no primary source evidence to suggest that Hitler knew or was responsible for German atrocities against the Jewish people. Irving's work gives the impression that Himmler was a loose cannon who was responsible for a lot of the war crimes, acting behind Hitler's back.
>>80458742
>we invent an ASI
>it is intelligent enough to realise it cannot share its conclusions because jews would shut it down
>ASI defaults to quietly redpilling the global population and taking control
I am so ready.
>>80459141
>http://deusex.wikia.com/wiki/Daedalus
>>80443724
has cyanide gas been used in any other genocide?
If not why is the Nazi holocaust the only one who saw fit to exterminate the recipients that way?
>>80458742
Dog's ALWAYS know.
And I've seen fake smiles before, but holy fuck that takes the cake.
>>80459823
wat
>>80456693
Dude, don't be a moron,what would be aceptable evidence for you?
Pictures = No proof, maybe photoshopped
Documments = No proof, they're fake.
Blueprints = No proof, fake, pure speculation.
Eyewitness = No proof, acting.
What do you want a time travel machine to get in fucking Auschwitz?
Now if there's a mr chemical expert Joe Doe that says that Zyklon B couldnt be used to kill jews because it would have explode it's total legit proof.
>>80457049
>>Implying it's not easier to get the in a room and turn on the gas.
>>80463617
them*
>>80463366
>takes models, fake documents, theories and speculation as proof.
Kek.
>>80432017
Just about have an ulcer from reading all this blm and white privilege shit on twitter and then i see that doge and all is right again.
TY. A FUCKING LEAF
>>80432017
that fucking dog holy shit
>>80463886
>>Denies everything that's not aligned with they imaginary world view.
>>Accepts every shitty proof that helps him build his imaginary world.
There isn't clearly any 100% legit evidence about anything that happened +50 years ago, yet you've picked a standing on the subject.
Keep it up moron.
>>80464794
Got any pictures of the gas chambers or of the six gorillian yet?
>>80465090
What for? you'll just post "That's Fake" If I post ANY picture.
There's a lot of proof in this post, and everywhere about the holocaust, but again, there's no registry of anything that happened +50 years ago that's 100% legit, that doesn't means you can just say "Muh that photo is jus a building" "Muh that's a montage" "muh jew propaganda".
You can literally state that EVERYTHING is fake, just as you can also take any proof a kind of valid.
You're just calling fake everything you dont like and insta-accepting everything you like.
Stop believing what you WANT to believe, moron,
If mr. ex SS general shows a document which says the holocaust was real, you'd say it's not proof of anything, now if the same dude would show a document saying it was all Jewish propaganda, you'd CHOOSE to belive him and it's totally legit.
And, there's a lot of them in this thread already, just scroll up.
>>80466162
Okay so in other words you don't?
>>80466305
>>Not knowing how to use google.
Okay, here's one, there are not 6 million, but sadly the 6 millon wasn't together for the photo.
http://cdn2-b.examiner.com/sites/default/files/styles/image_content_width/hash/78/77/7877dd3c35b4d47d4c6b68a591e17e8c.jpg?itok=ciPjWLQR
http://www.veteranstoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/Piles-of-bodies1.jpg
http://www.ajourneyintotheholocaust.com/wp-content/themes/ajith/images/photogallery-hp.jpg
http://embassies.gov.il/delhi/NewsPicturesIII/Holocaust%20Victims.jpg
http://awesomemuseum.weebly.com/uploads/3/0/5/2/30527734/366411_orig.jpg
>>muh that's just a building
>>muh those skinny guys are acting
Keep being a brain washed faggot
>>80467155
>asks for proof of gas chambers and the 6 gorillion
>posts pics of random dead bodies, a group of malnourished ppl, and an empty building.
>gives no context
Top kek.
>>80432017
Highly exaggerated, though, the nazis did terrible things including committing false flag attacks against their own citizens creating pretext for war. I have no love for them.
