This is primarily a meta-argument about how the email scandal accusations are framed.
When Colin Powell stepped up in 2004 the state department didn't have email at all. He used a private mail account through dial up on his personal laptop in his office to do all his emailing in part to show other people how awesome email is and make the case for adopting it.
In his autobiography he talks with pride about successfully making the case to get funding that allowed him to purchase 44,000 internet capable computers so that every person at state could have one:
http://www.politicususa.com/2015/03...il-scandal.html
It's a rather important bit of perspective to realize that when Clinton stepped up in 2008 email was still a rather new thing at State ( it takes awhile to get funding and install 44,000 computers ) and that prior to its adoption all the business done on email was done on private accounts out of band. For example, Powell's demo email account only connected with staff who also had private email accounts since the .gov email system didn't exist yet. People who frame this as if the state department IT was run like a James Bond movie are misinformed. Deliberately so since talking up the maturity/security of their IT allows detractors to make Clinton's actions look more significant/subversive.
Another bit of misleading framing is the implication or claim that Clintons' server was set up after she was appointed SoS. In reality the Clinton family server was set up by Bill after he stepped down around 2001ish. Hillary had her blackberry hooked up to it all during the primary. Setting up a secure email server is a significant endeavor for the layman. By claiming it was done after she stepped up you make listeners suspicious and prime them to accept a devious motive. The truth that she just kept on using the setup she'd been using, otoh, flows much more naturally into Hillary's stated reason, convenience. All her shit was there and why mess with what works? You can juggle two mail boxes ok but juggling two calendars completely defeats the purpose of a calendar. Again, she used it in place of a non-classified .gov email. When she had to use the secure system she went to the secure building and handed over her wireless devices to security to get in and sit at a special secure terminal like everyone else. She hated it just like everyone else. Lastly, her own emails show her asking IT to hook up her blackberry to a .gov account and them saying they couldn't do it.. ( http://www.cbsnews.com/news/emails-...ure-smartphone/ ). This information is also left out or actively lied about by people pushing a nefarious motives narrative since attempt to use the State system while maintaining the functionality of her system undermines their entire premise.
The last major false frame of the email scandal is the idea that criminal prosecution is something that routinely happens when people mess up with secure material. You get a lot of hyperbolic claims about how much trouble a regular Joe would be if they'd done that. Also a shit ton of quoting snippets of legal statutes and torturing the definition of the word "deliberately". If security agencies criminally prosecuted people for honest mistakes then people would never self report or cooperate with security audits for fear of jail. It is more important that breaches be promptly and honestly reported than to jail people for mistakes. They will fuck you up if you deliberately sell data or deliberately post it to wiki leaks sure. But if you are operating in good faith then jail isn't a realistic outcome even if you "deliberately" took some work home with you the night you got mugged and someone stole your backpack. You didn't intend for the data to get away so that's not the right kind of "deliberately" to get anti-espionage statutes thrown at you.
A minor frame used in all three major frames is trying to make this an elitist thing. Asserting that nobody else uses personal emails when it was actually a common practice or that she is avoiding punishment others would face when in reality punishment would be the exception rather than the rule.
So as you can see, what she did really is entirely defensible. Of course /pol/ will deny it though.
Honestly it's tough to argue against that. Government IT really is terrible.
Of course /pol/ ignores real arguments lol.
>>79962250
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iid4cgR4xVE
>>79964209
Why would you link to this?
FUCK YOU AND FUCK THE OP.
>>79962250
Bend and twist how you want faggot, the fact is had she been anyone else she would have been charged.
FUCK YOU
>>79964209
I don't like that lying bitch either but this guy aught to stop being so condescending.
>>79964672
You watched that crap?
The second I saw is stupid face I killed the browser window.
Why the fuck does that faggot think people want to look at his stupid fucking face?
The fagggot that linked that shit needs a beating.
>>79964350
>Presents arguments
>Shill
Typical /pol/
>>79962250
>>79962303
>>79962369
>>79962398
>>79962715
>>79963953
So if she was using the setup she was using all along, then why would she delete all the emails to cover her tracks? Why would she destroy federal records if she was innocent? And you cant argue that her yearly security checks/briefings probably had tons of warning as to the handling of classified information. So this bitch is either complicililty retarded or guilty of everything. Choose one shillbot
>>79962250
Hilary is using an organization called Correct The Record for online shilling.
The current shilling campaign is called Barrier Breakers, and has as its stated goal:
>Correct The Record will invest more than $1 million into Barrier Breakers 2016 activities, including the more than tripling of its digital operation to engage in online messaging both for Secretary Clinton and to push back against attackers on social media platforms...
>http://correctrecord.org/barrier-breakers-2016-a-project-of-correct-the-record/
>>79965054
No one cares about how much Hillary lies.
It is fucking depressing.
>>79964904
>Presenting valid argumebts
>MUST BE A PAID SHILL!
never change /pol/. This is legitimately making me feel Hillary is the right choice. If accusations of SHILL is all anyone can come up with to refute this argument.
>>79965182
This is the most depressing thing I can think of:
Clinton/Obama 2016
There are no laws or rules that prevent him from serving as VP, despite serving two consecutive terms as President. If she ends up ever being assassinated or indicted and convicted, he will then become president and get a de-facto third term.
>>79962303
>she'd just kept using the setup she had
I like how you just brush over this like it's nothing
It's literally illegal
A federal court has told these fucks you can use a private server, but it has to be on record with the government
>Noone listens to my arguments
Because they suck and you suck dicks
>>79962303
>The truth that she just kept on using the setup she'd been using, otoh, flows much more naturally into Hillary's stated reason, convenience.
She stated that she wanted to use a single device for convenience and if she had to do it over again would have used two devices. The truth was she was always using multiple devices.
> she used it in place of a non-classified .gov email. When she had to use the secure system she went to the secure building and handed over her wireless devices to security to get in and sit at a special secure terminal like everyone else.
There were several incidents of classified information having been handled over her personal email server, detailed yesterday in the non-indictment indictment.
> Lastly, her own emails show her asking IT to hook up her blackberry to a .gov account and them saying they couldn't do it.. ( http://www.cbsnews.com/news/emails-...ure-smartphone/ ). This information is also left out or actively lied about by people pushing a nefarious motives narrative since attempt to use the State system while maintaining the functionality of her system undermines their entire premise.
When you have a legal obligation to do something, and you can't find facilitation to do it the way you prefer, the correct course of action is not to then behave outside the law to suit your preference.
>>79962369
>But if you are operating in good faith then jail isn't a realistic outcome even if you "deliberately" took some work home with you the night you got mugged and someone stole your backpack.
Democrats presume that good faith on Clinton's part. No one else does.
>>79962398
>Asserting that nobody else uses personal emails when it was actually a common practice or that she is avoiding punishment others would face when in reality punishment would be the exception rather than the rule.
Punishment clearly becomes more of an exception the higher up you go. Can we talk about what Bill was doing on the plane to Sex Slave Island now?
>>79962250
>the state department didn't have email at all.
>2008 email was still a rather new thing at State
what a load of bullshit.
every federal agency had email at this point.
t.former fed
>>79962250
Hi correct the record!
>the state department didn't have email at all. He used a private mail account through dial up on his personal laptop in his office to do all his emailing in part to show other people how awesome email is and make the case for adopting it.
So you mean that Powell didn't have an established system, unlike Clinton who walked into office with an IT staff and architecture in place?
>The truth that she just kept on using the setup she'd been using, otoh, flows much more naturally into Hillary's stated reason, convenience. All her shit was there and why mess with what works?
Oh goodie she ignored regulation because it was convenient for her. I wonder what she'll ignore if she takes office
>Lastly, her own emails show her asking IT to hook up her blackberry to a .gov account and them saying they couldn't do it.
Bratty old woman stomps her feet and refuses to upgrade to the 21st century
Just stop. I could go on but each of your points just make Shilldawg look worse
>>79965512
No he wouldnt, it would skip him over
ITT: We're supposed to pretend that the State Department didn't have official e-mail servers.
I've been working for the federal government since 2002, and I've had an official government e-mail address since the beginning.
Eat shit and die shill.
>>79962369
You also failed to take reasonable steps to protect that data which would fall under negligence. You could even argue that with the extent of the 102 emails and the FBI stated possibility that it was certain the server had been compromised by 'foreign actors', wouldnt you say that she was grossly negligent in her handling of this information.
Furthermore, she needs to be stripped of all her security clearances, immediately. Its a reasonable punishment and its the same punishment they would give to the average joe
>>79965754
Im sorry, but I've looked in to it quite a bit and it seems my assertion is accurate. Do you have a link to any information to the contrary. Ive looked in to it but as it isint a common event in american politics, im having trouble finding material
>>79965192
Yes, within the laws she is not guilty of criminal intent.
Even so, this campaign had turned into calling out the establishment at every turn. People are tired of the zero accountability that politicians have, and of all the laws strung up to provide them free ground to continue.
It may not be illegal, but it is morality bankrupt and wrong to insinuate she is totally in the right.
>>79962250
>When Colin Powell stepped up in 2004 the state department didn't have email at all.
That's patently false. The State Department in 2004 had, and always has since its inception, SCIFs with terminals on SIPRnet & JWICS. This included email addresses for cleared staff.
>>79966091
MOST laws dont care about your intent. Interesting how she finds the ones that make exception for it and violates the shit out of them and then claims "it wasnt my intention"
>>79966074
The constitution bars it
>but it says elected
Elected would be construed to mean ascending to the office
It would be more likely that hilary would appoint him to be a justice. Even libs would be revolted at him running for vice president
>>79964786
This is my opinion and if you disagree I guess you are one those losers that I targeted in this video. Please, kill yourself.
>>79966091
>she is not guilty of criminal intent
You haven't even read the statutes fuckwit
There is one that requires intent, and there is one that is abundantly more common that has nothing to do with intent
Gross negligence is the standard and is mutually exclusive with intent
>>79966264
Even then, I have reservations. She clearly had intended to side step the Freedom of Information Act, something that is dubious as hell.
The major problem is that it is incredibly hard to prove intent to go against the United states - that she acted on ill will to the country
>>79966449
He wouldnt make it past confirmation unless the dems can take a majority of the senate. After the meeting with Bill and say the DOJ doesnt move forward on Hillary, then Lynch can kiss her Justice appointment goodbye as well cause she wont make it past confirmation either.
>>79966544
Why should I kill myself, you are the one that fucking sucks.
>>79962250
I WANT TO SHIT ON YOUR FAGGOT FACE YOU FUCKING FAGGOT
>>79966665
>assuming dems take a majority
No shit, which goes to show how more unlikely vice president would be
>>79966449
>Even libs would be revolted at him running for vice president
Liberals have been agitating for repealing the 22nd amendment since 2000.
>>79962398
So she did all these things, and still broke the law. Ignorance of the law is not an excuse.
>>79966846
Enough would
The point is that it wouldn't happen unless they repealed the amendment
And we know that won't happen either, at least projecting our current climate forward
>>79966779
who types shit like this?
>>79966679
As I stated: this is MY opinion. If you can't handle it - you are weak and should get of the internet. This conversation is OVER.
>>79962715
Do you get paid for each individual post or for each thread you post in?
>>79962715
Also, if she was "framed" then why were all of her talking points up until the present utter Bullshit ?
She sure is innocent, golly gee. Let's go get drunk. Let's pay no attention to who'll make the world a worse place.
>Although we did not find clear evidence that Secretary Clinton or her colleagues intended to violate laws governing the handling of classified information, there is evidence that they were extremely careless in their handling of very sensitive, highly classified information.
>extremely careless
>For example, seven e-mail chains concern matters that were classified at the Top Secret/Special Access Program level when they were sent and received. These chains involved Secretary Clinton both sending e-mails about those matters and receiving e-mails from others about the same matters. There is evidence to support a conclusion that any reasonable person in Secretary Clinton’s position, or in the position of those government employees with whom she was corresponding about these matters, should have known that an unclassified system was no place for that conversation. In addition to this highly sensitive information, we also found information that was properly classified as Secret by the U.S. Intelligence Community at the time it was discussed on e-mail (that is, excluding the later “up-classified” e-mails).
>Top Secret
>The highest security classification. "Top Secret shall be applied to information, the unauthorized disclosure of which reasonably could be expected to cause exceptionally grave damage to the national security that the original classification authority is able to identify or describe."
>exceptionally grave damage to the national security
Hillary Clinton
Extremely Careless
>>79965192
>This is legitimately making me feel Hillary is the right choice.
Yeah, as if you weren't voting for her from the very beginning, or if you ever had any doubts, nice try though.
Regarding the emails, it's closed case anyway now, so who cares. The fact still stands that America as we know today will cease to exist under her rule, for the worst.
>>79966628
If she wants to go with that, it still makes bashing her a breeze
>it was not my intent
So you were too stupid to know better as SoS on how to handle sensitive material, why the hell should the voters give you a promotion?
>it was my intent
Go to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200 millon
Former Network Admin who worked for the federal government here. This is completely false. During the period of time in which Hillary committed these crimes, every government employee, including knuckle dragging infantrymen in the military, had secure email accounts.
I had to regularly teach people how to use them, and verify they took online classes about THIS EXACT SCENARIO before they could get access to their email.
This whole thread is just some COINTELPRO shit, and now that i posted this, if enough people seem to reject the premise of the OP for me, the forum will be slid.
>>79967521
Best outcome indeed.
I would have loved to watch her go down - this may be even better than any of us realize
>>79962250
>tell people to remove classified headings from documents
Illegal
>send these documents over the Internet on a home server
Illegal
>share this information with people who don't have a clearance
Illegal
>refuse to release all 60,000 emails to the government because of the foia, delete 30 k and don't release despite the law being you have to release them all
Illegal
Refute this please. I know you won't because you're a shill. I can't believe you people could actively defend a criminal who has contributed to so much death and destruction in the world.
>head of state department, convince us gov to sign a bill allowing manufactures to sell bombs to Saudia Arabia
>Saudia Arabia is now under human rights abuse allegations for bombing and killing 6,000 civilians in Yemen
Now try to explain that shill. Once again you'll ignore it because it's true.
>>79962250
So because some nigger wanted e-mail in 2004 that means 12 years later this cunt violating security protocols and breaking the law is okay?
https://m.reddit.com/r/news/comments/4rd6ou/fbi_recommends_no_charges_against_hillary_clinton/d50ppd4
Source
>>79962250
>hillary really is innocent
>>79969119
>>79969198
>>79969241
>>79969286
>>79968854
This is the source of the OP argument
>>79969328
>>79962250
>>79965192
Go ahead and kill yourself
>>79962250
Try to prove hillary staged benghazi > fail > try to find out deleted emails to cover up her benghazi death squad>fail> try to show she mishandled emails about her benghazi death squad> fail > begun hearings for the FBI involved in the case because they didn't give you the answers you wanted to hear>
Grasping at literal straws 2 years later
>>79969465
>>79962250
she's in politics and no one is innocent
proceed
>>79967956
Citations on all your made up alligations. Republicans would have been all over her if that was the case bit none of what you said was true. They've been trying for 2 years to find her guilty and still haven't
>>79962250
I don't like Hillary at all, but let's be honest the email "controversy" thing is grasping at straws. There isn't really a controversy, it was a poorly done smear.
What should be made an issue is how she takes money from big banks. Why isn't Trump using this more than the stupid emails? The fact that he isn't funded by wall street.
>>79967122
Look at this faggot get so threatened he tries to control other people
>>79962250
I was in IT in the military.
Everyone understands how classification works. Everyone. Some people do all their work in secret stuff. When they screw up, and their last name isn't Clinton, they're in trouble. We leak like a sieve because bureaucrats are lazy and sloppy and in some cases actively working for other governments, not because holders of master's degrees could not work out the idea that secret internet never touches non-classified internet.
Secrets predate electricity.
This woman has extensive university and postgraduate training and either couldn't comprehend it or didn't care. If she's "innocent" then our laws are meaningless and our government is illegitimate and impotent.
I don't think that shills can comprehend that you're not talking to Rick Wilson's anime fans. I did this for a living and there is no gray area.
>>79967529
underrated post.
What do you think would happen if this poster did the same thing, but with only a single TS cleared email on his personal device, AND had gotten caught?
Go ahead, I'll wait for the answer. I'd like the OP to answer this one if he can.
>>79967529
2 seconds of Google says what's you're saying is false for the state department
>>79964904
the only way for Hillary to break any barriers is to name names and take the people's side for once in her life, call out Soros, call out Rothschild, jail them, spill the beans on the scams, tell people whats up,
at this point I'm assuming she's really a man because any woman would have enough compassion to treat people well if she was given enough power to
xx79965192
get lost cornball
let the adults speak
>>79965733
>I wonder what she'll ignore if she takes office
you don't need to wonder, the consistent theme is disregard for the lives and wellbeing of Americans
>>79962250
>>79962303
>>79962369
>>79962398
>>79962715
>>79963953
>>79964893
Just leaving this here desu
Also see https://twitter.com/hashtag/MoreTrustedThanHillary
>>79970010
>>79970153
>>79970222
>>79970247
... how is kikebook and twitter not flooded with these, they would look really good on hillarys social media.
>>79970625
She didn't get caught though the entire time she was employed. This is all after the fact because no ts data was leaked. For fucks sake even inter office Christmas emails get marked as classified
>>79965873
I'll bet Hillary uses an iphone to handle classified data because it looks cooler
>>79969863
Kek just look it up. You didn't provide sources either. But here take a freebie
>http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/9374490.html
>http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2015/apr/20/reince-priebus/hillary-clinton-took-money-kings-four-countries-go/
>http://foreignpolicy.com/2016/03/25/civilian-casualties-war-crimes-saudi-arabia-yemen-war/
You are defending a war monger
>>79965192
>""""""""""""""""""valid"""""""""""""""""" arguments
>>79971668
/THREAD
>>79969863
>Republicans would have been all over her if that was the case bit none of what you said was true.
sorry boss man, we've moved beyond parties in this sphere, no divisive crapola when it comes to enforcing the law and protecting the lives of innocent Americans
>>79962250
Thank you for correcting the record.
>>79971780
>>79971888
>>79971749
That's funny since Republicans have been the only ones pushing this for 2 years. It was suppose to be about benghazi and now it's about emails
>>79970561
>our laws are meaningless and our government is illegitimate and impotent.
this is an unfortunate truth
>>79971968
>>79971982
>That's funny since Republicans have been the only ones pushing this for 2 years.
I'm pushing it and I helped get Kennedy elected so fuck off and die scumbag
it's nothing to do with emails, it about blatant disregard for the lives of Americans and being too obvious about being a criminal scumbag
nobody can stand this woman but a scant group of democrats who only read newspapers and believe me we have a list of them and they're being explained the situation each and every one
it really irks me when they tell me this woman has done good things for the people of this nation
she's a fucking politician, if she did anything good for the people of this nation she would have been shot dead a long time ago
>>79971668
/Thread
>>79971668
Nixon did nothing wrong
He used to be Comey's boss, fyi
>>79972385
Nixon tried to get the DNC convention plans.
I can, today, read the entire DNC convention plans, thanks to Guccifer 2.
"Oh, it's the coverup" says the liberals.
What coverup?
You convinced me OP I am now a #HillaryArtillery
My family got frauded out of millions while Hillary was secretary of my state.
My father set up numerous amount of cables through her office, which is paid by our taxes to handle fraudulent matters. Long story short her office ignored every single one and the guy that robbed my family of millions got away scott free, the same way she got away scott free of her pathological negligence and uncaringness.
The incident set me off in a way that you would assume it would. I descented into madness getting crippled physically and mentally to the point I lost my voice and can only be my real self on this decadent shithole.
Do you understand how hard it is to yearn for someone to love but can't because there's a tear in the fabric of our society in my mind that grows bigger and bigger by the day?
God willingly she can't win.
>>79962250
FILTHY FUCKING JEWISH MOTHER FUCKERS!!!!
>>79962250
thank you for #correctingtherecord
your mental gymnastics were not wasted on me i am definitely a hilldawg super fan now
>>79971982
Yes it is funny how corrupt the democratic party is.
>>79971780
>>79973043
Haha. Great knowing I killed the shill with some truth.
Bern in hell heretic
>>79972036
>what did he do that Hillary didnt?
He had the testicular fortitude to serve voluntarily in our armed forces. That means he is bound mutually by the military code of justice and common law. Sad really.
>>79972596
>no reasonable prosecutor
I told this to my retired defense attorney father and he said he knows plenty of unreasonable prosecutors who wouldnt mind making a name for themselves
>>79962250
ALL ABOARD THE SHILLINGTON EXPRESS!
>TOOOOOOOOT TOOOOOOOOOOOT
>>79965512
This will happen soon. Democrats have been taking cues from Latin American/European Socialists and Soviet Communists.
>>79967033
>>79965054
Though to be fair, in that press conference they did say not all the emails had classified markings on it. Some still had it, and she's a liar, but yea. She's a fucking idiot.
>>79962250
>meta-argument
Please kill yourself desu
>>79965754
>>79966074
Actually he would be able to serve for a maximum 2 years. Each president (following FDR) is allowed a Maximum of 10 years as president. Consecutively or not.
>>79965192
Yet you just ignored another anons facts that she showed incompetence and is still guilty for trying to cover her corrupt actions... If you accidentally hit and kill a man with your car, that is one thing. But trying to dismember and hide the body is another, and Hillary did that.
>>79962250
>Hillary
>Innocent
That bitch is guilty as sin
>>79983942
How so?
Doubles say she's guilty.
>>79986736
Not guilty.
>>79986736
>>79987266
Balls
>>79987333
>>79987266
Well done.
