How do we bring manufacturing jobs back to the west?
>>79554766
i can report this thread
They aren't coming back.
You know how farming used to be 30% of jobs in the early 20th century, and now it's 1-3%?
That's manufacturing's fate with automation.
>>79554766
Trade tariffs
>>79554884
If by automation you mean sweat shops in Asia
>>79554766
No more trade with the outside world other than oil and minerals.
>>79554766
>reduce labour protection and hiring laws to become a exception safety net and not the norm
>reduce environmental regulation and bureaucracy
>simplify tax codes
>get rid of minimum wage
>>79555052
Shut you fucking mouth bitch. Manufacturering jobs are all going to be replaced by robots.
>>79554766
Remove this you cunt, nobody wants to look at this cheap sluts flesh.
importation tarrifs
taxes for companies that outsource
eliminate the international carbon tax
repeal nafta
FUCKING DONE
>>79554766
End the major trade agreements like NAFTA and TPP. Raise our tariffs and make owning a company not based and run in America to expensive. This will force people who want to make money in the us to hire people here and make goods here that or pay through the nose to make them elsewhere and ship them back. It will be chaos for a few years but after that things will get drastically better.
Start civil wars in the cities, force people to move out to the countryside. Build houses. Build factories. Make weapons.
>>79555121
Okay and why would any of this make company x want to spend more to manufacturer stuff at home than abroad?
>>79554973
Too bad lobbyists make good money for politicians :S
This, a million times! China and Germany would go to shit.
>>79554766
>How do we bring manufacturing jobs back to the west?
As long as people want bigger cars, bigger houses, bigger meals, better electronics, cheaper food and better clothes etc the manufacturing jobs won't come back.
>>79554884
Farms got more efficient, although animal-based requires relatively little later, plant farming still requires a shitload of farmhands to pick shit.
Manufacturing was sent overseas to sweatshops.
>>79554766
Nigga do you really want that shit?
Nigga, come to the US and work in a box factory, spend 8 hours glueing boxes together. Do it. Then tell me you want that shit.
>>79554766
how do we bring blacksmith jobs back?
All companies doing business in America must buy and use American made products.
>>79554766
Protectionism
>>79555208
>faggot detected
>>79554766
They won't. It's over. We need to just all nuke each other before the globalists win.
>>79555287
Well that's kind of the problem. We're now at the point that many people are starting to not care about their own countries when it comes to making a buck.
>>79555159
And every car will fly and self drive. Automation is the narrative globalist use to make morons like you feel like being de-industrialized is inevitable.
Look at all this "Automation" at the apple sweat shop in china
>The economy used to be heavily based on agriculture
>Then the economy used to be heavily based on manufacturing
>Then the economy was heavily based on banking, investment, and money lending
>Now the millennial generation gets jobs doing nothing but making coffee and blogging about music
>The year is 2036
>YOU GUYS. HOW WILL WE EVER BRING BLOGGING JOBS BACK TO THE WEST????
We automate all the manufacturing and become self sufficient
>>79555208
Are you stupid? Gay?
By working harder you lazy fuck
>they took our jurbs
>>79555343
Better than spending eight hours selling useless overpriced junk to idiots for minimum wage.
>>79555343
And this is part of the problem too, and is an issue with farming/ranching as well. No one wants their kid to be picking lettuce. People are super spoiled in America at this point that anything blue-collar related is seen as a mortal sin outside of rural areas.
Source: Lived in Los Angeles for most of my life and now in Rural Sierras for last 2 years.
>>79554766
We have a lot of manufacturing jobs coming back to USA becuase of our extremely low domestic energy prices from unconventional oil&gas (fracking, horizontal drilling etc).
They are good high paying jobs, but use a lot of automation so there are far less jobs than there were previously.
>>79555583
then go make a machine that sells junk
All of you unskilled, uneducated need to accept your role in the food chain and work for garbage wages. Trump will get the market ready for those jobs through deregulation.
>>79554766
literally import taxes
>>79555466
You're an idiot. There are no jobs and the jobs that do exist don't pay enough to pay for your home
>>79554766
>tariffs on imports of finished goods
>cut down on legal immigration
>reform the VISA system
>build the wall
>put country of origin labeling on all goods(Chamber of Commerce has lobbied for years against this)
>take focus away from 4 year college for unqualified people(no more affirmative action for enrollment in universities public and private)
>>79555287
You make manufacturing at home more competitive. All things being equal manufacturing at home is more appealing as it reduces supply chain costs.
>>79555465
Foolish little bitch. Google has self driving cars now. Instead of being a little nigger, why don't you become a robot maker or a robot repairer before those jobs are replaced by robots? this is the way of the future. Globalism is the future. We will all be one people, on our iPhones, eating mcdonalds, shopping online and listening to the new Beyoncé album. GET OVER IT.
>>79555287
The point of making those changes is to not be more expensive to produce in your country.
It's more efficient to produce your products near the people that will buy them, so it at least should not be expensive enough to motivate the company to leave the country.
Also developed countries have more security, stability and IP protection laws, and those are added in the overall cost.
>>79554766
3D Printing and cybernetics
>>79555343
I work in a factory. It's actually quite fulfilling to end the day seeing how much stuff you've made. I'm also in the best shape of my life since each day is pretty much an endurance run as I work on the fastest line in the plant.
>>79555625
>literally 1/4 of the population should be peasant landserfs
>mind-crushing ignorance and poverty
romanticizing about farm life is absolutely pleb-tier economic heresey. Before they automated farming life was shit for 95% of the population and people starved.
>>79555864
>3D Printing and cybernetics
good post Hue
did you by chance attend college in America?
>>79555343
For $20 an hour with benefits
Yes nigga they would be beating off applicants with sticks.
Or we can not have trade tariffs and stick with Chinese "Automation" pic related
>>79554766
Become an isolationist country again
>>79555208
Ah salami lickum brother, I agree she should be fully covered from head to toe
It is degenerate otherwise!
>>79554766
Tax Chinese imports more.
Stop subsidizing mail from China to USA with American tax dollars (can you fuckign believe it?).
>>79555699
The kraut jew with the gigantic trade surplus shows us his greedy head once more
>>79555343
they make the literal retards do that here anon
>>79555820
>$0.50 has been added to your account
You don't.
Unless you want to destroy capitalism.
Fine business owners that outsource labor overseas.
![american-apparel-white-power-wash-tshirt-with-us-flag-product-4-5008546-560535268[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/pQPEO9y.jpg "american-apparel-white-power-wash-tshirt-with-us-flag-product-4-5008546-560535268[1].jpg")
Social engineering. Convince consumers that people will think they are uncool if they buy foreign made goods.
Bring back customer service jobs too. I don't want to talk to pajeet on the phone holy shit
Jesus, do you want them to bring back the Spinning Jenny as well. Mass manufacturing is a stage you go through during industrialisation before you can become an advanced nation.
Why do you tards want to go backwards. Our shit-for-brains working class should just be shown how to wipe arses and maintain robots. Why invest trillions in manufacturing when you can just get brown people to dig your coal up for nothing?
It's more cost effective to just pay those fucking idiots in the North and Wales to live on benefits than to try and train them to do an adult 21st century job.
>>79555241
Even in some hypothetical situation where this actually happened, all that would mean is that corporation would invest more and fast track automation. Kind of what's happening now with fast food kiosks because of the 15 min wage threat.
Plentiful, well paying manufacturing jobs are gone and they aren't coming back, stop wasting your precious brain lightening thinking aboot it.
>>79555820
This level of autism is impressive, how do you even know how to use a keyboard?
>>79555052
>sweat shops in Asia
asians are pretty much robots
maybe even lower
>>79555820
>can't even make a basic argument without being a cunt
God I love stupid people like you. Entertaining as hell.
>>79555650
They already have dozens of them and millions of retards willing to do the same job a machine can do cheaper. The point is 80% of humanity is useless and we are reaching the point where someone will need to do something about that 80%. Its the 80/20 rule.
>>79554766
have the lowest taxes on the planet and spend only 75% of revenues per year.
why do we have to fund so much pork like "Klan Watch". There are 10 Klansmen per state on,average yet we give billions to black groups to patrol their neighborhoods. I personally have never seen any black any where patrolling for any thing. Except maybe a dime bag.
>>79555961
No dear friend, I did not.
>>79555705
>>79556145
Removing the biggest job sector is progress goy
>>79555465
It takes about a day to make an iPhone and about $175 to produce it in China. Meanwhile these chinks are offing themselves left and right over the stress of the job.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foxconn_suicides
>In response to the suicides, Foxconn substantially increased wages for its Shenzhen factory workforce,[44] installed suicide-prevention netting,[45] brought in Buddhist monks to conduct prayer sessions inside the factory,[36] and asked employees to sign no-suicide pledges.[46] Workers were also forced to sign a legally binding document guaranteeing that they and their descendants would not sue the company as a result of unexpected death, self-injury, or suicide.
But this is just how it goes in a """global economy""".
>>79555121
>get rid of minimum wage
What's the rationale behind this?
>>79554766
KILL THE UNIONS
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>>79555465
>industry wont be completely automated and cars wont drive themselves
>>79556172
>Unironically posts on /pol/
>calls others autistic
You guys are delusional. Can't wait to check up on you fucking CHILDREN when Hillary wipes the floor with trump.
>>79555820
Chinese Automation pic related
>>79556221
congrats that the shitstorm hit you before it hit us
at least now you have a clear conscience on what you can do to save your country
>>79556331
Paying people their worth rather than an arbitrary amount set by politicians who have never run a business.
Case in point, fast food workers don't deserve $15 an hour for flipping burgers, regardless of cost of living.
>>79554766
Fair trade credits. Small biz get's them.
>>79556205
pay em welfare, just make it enough to maintain their existence.
then point to them as an example of why education and birth control are important.
>>79556387
You mean before or after the waves of crime and the floods of illegals that will cripple the nation, destroy our economy, and propel us into a third world hell from which we wont even have the weapons we need to escape.
>>79556000
Not even trips can help this one. If you become totally isolated you are limited by the wealth that's is inside your country. There will always be places with people working for less, or countries caring less for the environment and bureaucracy, or consumer and labor rights that will create even cheaper products.
Not only the companies will leave your country but the population that wants cheap products will do too.
>>79555902
Who said that a shitload of people should be farmers/ranchers? What I'm saying is NO ONE wants to be one and we shit on people who are regularly. And then we shit on the mexicans who will do it for cheap. And then we shit on farmers/ranchers again when prices shoot up for food because we don't want to use mexicans. Then farmers/ranchers point to labor cost.
>>79554766
a lot of tariffs for every product the country can produce
>>79554766
tariffs high enough to make it not worth outsourcing. duh
>>79556331
IT would be a true free market. Employers could offer better services by having more people on staff and getting more done. The workers are free to accept the job or not. The free market determines whether the particular wage is too or not.
The problem with no minimum wage is or welfare system. That makes people think wages should be higher because the handouts are better than minimum wages.
>>79556375
Nope it wont....Small manufactures will not be able to afford massive robots that need constant repairs. If you tax jews at the border they will bring the jobs back and hire Americans on our terms. Our market is the most important in the world they will do what we say.
Globalism is asking for monopolies the one weakness in capitalism
>>79554766
It's tricky and possibly pointless while there are still developing countries with weak currencies that enable you to save so much money by manufacturing overseas.
I think the trick is marketing goods manufactured in <country> as premium goods (and thusly worth spending enough to cover the costs of factory wages in first world countries). For example people still buy German cars despite the higher price because they're viewed as exceptionally high quality, and the only reason we manage to manufacture anything for export in NZ is that we've somehow turned "made in NZ" into a selling point.
>>79556636
wage is too low or not*
>>79556509
I hardly think I'll be able to do something, even though I graduated as a civil engineer, I ended up becoming a public servant.
>>79555465
apple (foxconn) has halved their workforce due to automation since 2014.
>>79554766
I really really like that image
>>79555406
is shit.
>>79555465
>Globalism
>automation
Pick one nerd
When you can deploy an automatic iphone factory on American soil you have no need for other countries' cheap labour. The only foreign part of the supply chain will be the raw material extraction
Automation will kill globalism dead
>>79554766
Help Trump win
>>79554973
Great way to fuck over all domestic consumers. Economy's sure going to boom when shit you used to be able to buy for $10 now costs $100.
>>79556708
companies that cannot afford automation will cease to exist as automation will make products cheaper.
>>79554766
end nafta
>>79554766
WW3, blow up all of the East / Second World and all the industry returns to wonderful USA & Canada again.
Also, Mexico & South America needs to be bombed too.
>>79555208
Get off the internet, Muhammed
>>79556631
Well you also have to cut taxes and restructure labor laws a wee-bit. All in all it's possible but it won't bring back all the jobs. It's still worth it though even if we can only get 10-20 million manufacturing jobs that would largely eliminate unemployment. America is big enough and strong enough to be self sustainable and not dependent on foreign goods with a few exceptions when it comes to raw minerals most of which we could probably get from Australia if we wanted to make a decent trade partnership with them.
>>79556163
Well whats next? Are we just gonna be complacent with our crappy retail jobs?
>>79556739
I took a college class my final semester with a shitload of exchange student Brazilian engineers (I'm an Electrical Engineer).
You should've came here to study. I heard the government gives you free edu because the country is in shambles and they need educated people.
>>79556946
>used to be able to buy for $10 now costs $100
Nice exaggeration. Prices will increase but not to anywhere near that extent. Hell, the cost of an American produced iPhone would only be a little less than $100 more on the consumer end.
>>79556387
Oh sweet little redditor, have we made you angry? I'm waiting for some *tips Fedora*
>>79556331
Low wage jobs should be for apprentices, young people and students. People starting their professional life that are more worried about collecting some experience than a pay check.
But with so many good jobs gone, more and more people that should not be working for a low wage are. (older people, heads of family). So there is this "need"for a minimum wage so this people that should not be at that job be able to support their needs.But if you bring back good jobs, the low paying jobs go back to whom should have them, and you get more young, inexperienced people that are not worth 15 an hour, get any job for what they are worth.
>>79556387
If you want Hillary to win, you deserve what you'll get if she does.
>>79555820
You're talking about capitalism, not globalism.
>>79556753
I do business with china. All of my inventory is made there. the big guys might be automating what they can but the medium and small factories will not be able to get specialized expensive robots.
>>79556946
>>79556952
>>79556893
>>79556375
Every globalist shill is a fucking leaf
You know what I think is a new low with sending jobs overseas for Amurrika?
We now send chicken MEAT all the way to CHINA to get processed then sent ALL the way back to the USA. Somehow its fucking cheaper to do that rather then keeping everything in the u.s. and now you fuckers are eatting shit touched by chinese regulation.
>>79556952
You'd like to think so, but that isn't necessarily the case. Every minute of down time is a unit not being produced for sale, and robots break quite often.
The factory where I work has just brought in a robot for a new line for safety reasons rather than production, as it will be handling glass with raw edges. However, the robot won't be able to differentiate between damaged and undamaged glass before it sets it.
>>79556893
https://www.stratfor.com/weekly/rise-manufacturing-marks-fall-globalization
Pretty much true but future manufacturing won't have much low skilled jobs associated with it
All the high school drop outs on /pol/ who think daddy Trump is going to magically give them a high paying job for turning a screwdriver are delusional
>>79557224
Globalization is a natural consequence of capitalism. Hillary has experience and is the most qualified for president. Trump is low in the polls and can't keep his racist, anti srmetic mouth shut.
>>79556952
Do you know how specialized robotics are? Only high reward manufacturing uses robots
>>79554839
first post faggot post
>>79554766
muh DIK
>>79557369
Those little yellow bastards have been pissing in your coke for years.
>>79554766
Elect Donald Trump.
>>79557471
>Hillary has experience and is the most qualified for president
>racist, anti srmetic mouth shut.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dY77j6uBHI
Angry little jew detected. Show me one example of Trump being racist or anti semetic.
Pro tip: you can't.
>>79557338
Did you even read my post you double nigger?
Globalism is obsolete. Robots can do everything poo in loos do for free, within your nation.
If anything we are heading near enough autarky with some trade deals in Africa for raw materials.
>>79557096
It's not really free, it's paid by taxpayer money after all, and to get access to public colleges you have to pass a really hard exam. For fields like engineering and medicine you end up disputing with a lot of people.
Private colleges here in Brazil are kinda shitty, though, most employers don't take their certificates seriously.
>>79557134
>cost of an American produced iPhone would only be a little less than $100 more on the consumer end.
Sauce on this.
>>79557338
>I don't understand comparative advantage
>>79555208
allah ahkbar
>>79557607
>audio recording of her laughing about getting a rapist off the hook
sauce?
>>79557708
>Private colleges here in Brazil are kinda shitty, though, most employers don't take their certificates seriously
don't you have some sort of nationwide accreditation board that verifies that the proper material has been learned before you call yourself a professional in your major?
here we have ABET
>>79557338
Free trade isn't globalist you fucking retard, it helps the economy. You are actually anti American if you support trade tarrifs.
All empirical evidence has shown that tariffs result in a net loss of jobs, but I wouldn't expect a retarded trumpfag to know that.
>>79557134
It would also greatly help if the corporate tax rate was lowered.
>>79557832
there isn't a sauce
it's taken out of context
that said, I fucking hate Shillary but her job was to defend they ""child rapist"" because that's what lawyers do
>>79557690
Trump is a flip flopping little bitch. He had called all Latinos rapists and says he wants to deport them. He has also tweeted an anti Semitic tweet towards Hillary.
>open newspaper
>shitstorm because one major business owner pretty much broke every possible work law
>paying people the absolute minimum possible
>unpaid overtime through the roof
>80+ hours workweeks
>forcing them to spend 1/4th of their paycheck in his store or getting fired
>forcing managers to buy up with their own money stock that's going to expire or not sell enough
>reusing expired food
>insane mobbing
>covered up suicides and a stress related death
>week before a article on how local buisness owners have trouble finding qualified workforce
FREE MARKET
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>>79555299
T. First world country with manufacturing jobs
>>79557134
But that would still result in fewer iPhones purchased. Which would result in less business for iPhone sellers, the apps market would take a hit, as would iPhone accessories.
Fucking trumpfags are just as bad as leftists. Never looking past the first step of any plan.
>>79557704
You just living a fantasy of the future you think will happen.
>>79557732
I understand that leafs come into every thread and spew there opinions like diarrhea...You elected a gay, ski instructor PM because he promised free weed...No one gives a shit about your political opinions....How many times a day to you need to hear this?
>>79557941
>He had called all Latinos rapists and says he wants to deport them
No he didn't and you know it. There's a difference between illegal immigrants and legal immigrants.
Again: show me trump saying something anti semetic or racist (you can't)
>>79557931
>this matters
Lawyers are not always well regarded and tend to run for office quite a bit. This is a common tactic and it's pretty indefensible because it's not targeting you or me, it's targeting the muh feels crowd.
You want to hurt Trump with the right? Make him seem unprincipled. Want to hurt Hillary with the left? Make her seem heartless.
>tfw people are falling for the "bringing manufacturing jobs back" meme
>>79556636
Enjoy borderline mass starvation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_law_of_wages
>>79558110
>>79558088
>>79557876
You have an argument against these you retarded trumpfag?
Regardless of how, make the west more attractive to the rich to invest in (obviously).
Create tax shelters.
Reduce if not abolish corporate tax and all other counterintuitive taxes such as carbon taxes and etc...
Ban labour unions and remove minimum wage.
Stop subsidies
Hate saying this, but invest more in infrastructure. You might say that asia shitholes that have taken our manufacturing jobs have shit-tier infrastructure, that is not completely true. Sure, shitholes like China spend billions investing in highways and stuff in the middle of nowhere to stimulate the economy with jobs etc... But other than that, most of the modern manufacturing giants like China, Malaysia etc... are sufficient infrastructure when it comes to ports, roads, trains, airports etc... While the west has relatively good infrastructure, it still needs a lot more investment, especially the US.
>>79558088
And you're a golem...You are parroting Friedman and he was fucking wrong..I was actually alive for the Free market vs protectionism debate. Friedman was wrong on every issue and the protectionist were right.
>>79557854
Only for Law Schools, unfortunately. Med students must work as interns for two years to get their license, but it's not really an exam.
I never had much trouble finding a job since my engineering certificate was from one of these government colleges, but I agree that such exam would lower this huge bias towards public schools.
This slow automation seems like a disaster waiting to happen since it will just put millions of poors worldwide out of work, but most people won't care because their slightly higher skilled jobs won't be affected.
At least if someone created general AI which was able to automate more high-level jobs, people would be more forced to adapt to a labourless world.
>>79558110
We are getting the free weed though ayyy lmao
Since Trudeau came in its also never been easier to get tail as a Canadian
>How can American 'men' even compete?
>>79558251
Is that why engineers and doctors make minimum wage?
Fucking dipshit
>>79558254
Manufacturing price does not effect price of goods... The price of goods are set by the supply and demand curve. So when an industry first moves to china and they start dumping their cheaply made goods into our market they survive because of manufacturing prices but once all of the competition goes out of business the supply falls and the prices go back to what they were pre-Chinese plant
>>79558254
I'm not even a Trump fag but I would rather starve than vote Hillary. Giving a traitor, and con-artist the presidency will result in the end of America. We are already crumbling and all liberals will do is preside over our destruction while pushing their fake tolerance agenda.
>>79557941
>not understanding their vs they're
>>79558302
Where is your proofs you fucking dipshit?
Mine's incoming- in the form of actual numbers and hard evidence, not just words.
>>79558216
no I agree that the tactics do work if this story makes the news, as they know how to spin it certain ways
but I personally think it's wrong to assume she's in the wrong over a recording like this
>>79558502
No. America is strong enough to survive 4 years of Hillary. In that time, the right can reform itself to be competitive.
What conservatives cannot survive is an orange meme man poisoning conservative politics for an entire generation.
>>79558617
Friedman's core argument was that inflation would counter balance cheap labor. If they out sold us their currency would inflate and our goods would still be competitive. He said the only way for us to lose manufacturing was if China out innovated us, which they didn't they just devalued their currency
>>79556979
Who is she ? I've seen her a couple of times already.
>>79558499
And then new businesses in that market can be started???
>>79558784
>it's a "let's attack him as a character because I can't understand policies" post
>>79555052
>implying asians are real people
>>79554766
Are mods homosexuals?
>>79558325
We have a Fundamentals of Engineering (FE) exam that you must take through your engineering board in order to call yourself an engineer.
So whether you went to MIT, or North Dakota, as long as you pass that exam, all engineers are on the same level when it comes to civil responsibility.
>>79557941
Is this why you're a virgin anon? You can't stop sperging out?
>>79558829
Which is why he reccomended against tarrifs, because the market will fix itself.
Study after study has shown that tariffs cause reduced economic growth to the country imposing them. A few of examples:
The essay on Free Trade at The Concise Encyclopedia of Economics looks at the issue of international trade policy. In the essay, Alan Blinder states that "one study estimated that in 1984 U.S. consumers paid $42,000 annually for each textile job that was preserved by import quotas, a sum that greatly exceeded the average earnings of a textile worker. That same study estimated that restricting foreign imports cost $105,000 annually for each automobile worker's job that was saved, $420,000 for each job in TV manufacturing, and $750,000 for every job saved in the steel industry."
In the year 2000 President Bush raised tariffs on imported steel goods between 8 and 30 percent. The Mackinac Center for Public Policy cites a study which indicates that the tariff will reduce U.S. national income by between 0.5 to 1.4 billion dollars. The study estimates that less than 10,000 jobs in the steel industry will be saved by the measure at a cost of over $400,000 per job saved. For every job saved by this measure, 8 will be lost.
The cost of protecting these jobs is not unique to the steel industry or to the United States. The National Center For Policy Analysis estimates that in 1994 tariffs cost the U.S. economy 32.3 billion dollars or $170,000 for every job saved. Tariffs in Europe cost European consumers $70,000 per job saved while Japanese consumers lost $600,000 per job saved through Japanese tariffs.
>>79558446
No that's the exact opposite. Minimum wage laws prevent businesses from using their monopsony's power to buy labor at the lowest price they want, lest the laborers starve.
Doctors and such professionals have a monopoly on the services they provide through accreditation and certification organizations that limit their competition. So you either purchase their labor services at whatever price they demand or you stay stick, injured, and die. This is why health care is so expensive.
In both cases there is no functional bargain. Leverage is entirely asymmetric between supply and demand, and the demand curve itself is horribly inelastic.
>>79559204
>stick
*sick
>>79558873
YOU DONT GET IT. The average American is retarded, and is swayed almost exclusively by character attacks and moral arguments. That's why the right keeps losing- very few conservatives are willing to stoop that low. But the left isnt- Obama has shit policies, but he got reelected because he painted Romney as an evil man while Romney said Obama was an okay person, just not good at his job.
If we want to sway more voters, we need someone likable.
How's it going to feel when Clinton cucks the shit out you Trump dickriders? (Pic related: it's me)
>>79558784
The choose Hillary or Trump. Those are my options nothing on gods earth will make me vote Hillary so my path is clear.
>>79559263
>If we want to sway more voters, we need someone likable.
Trump is way more likeable than Hillary. The only people who like Hillary have no fucking clue who they're voting for, they just want the first female president so they can be all "We did it guys! we stopped sexism!" and because they're too easily triggered by Trump's truth bombs so they don't want him in charge in case he hurts somebody's precious little feelings.
>>79559204
No, competition prevents businesses from paying the lowest possible price for labor.
And the only reasons doctors have a monopoly is because the government has made accreditation by certain organizations as a barrier to entry. Minimum wage would work fine if the government fucked off out of the economy.
>>79558872
That's fucking retarded..New businesses would start if we kept our manufacturing sector. Their is no real arguement for globalism. Its just bullshit claims about price increases, when manufacturing cost have little effect on the price of goods. Thats set by supply and demand
>>79556946
>everything costs £10
>nobody has any money because of no jobs
>taxes go up for social welfare
>everything costs £100
>everyone is on a comfortable income
>taxes go down for social welfare
>>79559263
>If we want to sway more voters, we need someone likable.
But Romney is likable. The whole contention against Trump aside, I don't think he's got a mean bone in his body.
Likeable obviously isn't the answer.
>>79559388
Fucking tablet auto correct. Piece of Chinese junk.
>>79559508
No, he isn't. He needs to be charming- not just full of swagger and toughness. The average American needs to see him as someone who could live in their neighborhood and share a beer with, not some orange wall Street turbocuck
>>79559056
It doesn't fix its self...When you have dictators controlling most of the cash flow they won't exchange the money into their currency and inflate it they will dump it off shores buying up property...Like china is in Australia and Canada...And if that doesn't work they will just cheat and devalue it.
How do you make the arguement that the economy will fix itself 20 years later when we witnessed the opposite happen?
>>79559655
Romney is the typical out-of-touch, bible thumping moron that is the last thing the repub things if they want to win any sort of popular vote.
>>79559056
>>79559522
Holy shit. Would you just look at the data you mouth breather?
>>79559758
That doesn't mean tariffs are the answer, look at the data.
>>79559784
Your kike economic arguement doesn't work in 2016 we have 30 years of data.
>>79559676
What about him is not likeable? As long as you're not an asshole who attacks him based on falsified information and rumours started by leftie shills, he's pretty kind hearted.
You only have this image of him being an angry tough guy because the media and interviewers purposely bring bullshit to the table to push his buttons, so he has to shut them down without taking any shit.
You watch an interview with him and somebody who's not just trying to bait him into saying shit that can be used against him and you'll see the real Trump.
>>79559866
I literally just posted and linked three studies that show the economic cost of tariffs. Are you going to counter me opposing studies, or keep being stupid?
>>79560060
I have read hundreds of articles on both sides of this issue and was their for the live debates in the 80's and 90's...You are parroting one side because you dont know the other sides arguments...
Answer my fucking side of the arguement....Why didn't inflation keep manufacturing in the United States?
>>79559973
Right, I agree, I don't think he's a bad guy. But we need someone who anyone can like-even the left. To an extent, Trump is more smug than we need. Essentially we want a Republican Obama.
>>79559763
I don't agree with his policies, and it seems you don't either, but that's not what we're talking about here. The other anon said something about likeability, and Romney is quite likeable as a person.
>>79559520
But all business will always compete on operating efficiency by rent seeking the absolute lowest labor prices possible to obtain a cost advantage over their competitors and gain market-share and/or merge with and acquire weaker firms.
This can be seen in actions by produce farmers hiring illegals to harvest in the fields or tech firms exploiting the H1-B visa program to obtain surplus pools of labor to extract income concessions from desperate/marginal workers who are in no position to bargain.
There is always going that level of industry-wide race to the bottom pressure and without any minimum wages, there will be no limit to that bottom except mass starvation/malnutrition.
>>79560236
probably because corporate taxes, or other forms of governor intervention. And I don't give a shit about articles you've claimed to have read, or which debates you've seen. Unless you can post hard evidence showing the economic benefit of tariffs, you aren't worth arguing with
>>79560060
>>79560300
He's only likable to the right. The next Republican candidate needs to tone down religion, look good, and blast the fuck out of the Democrats on a moral and character basis.
>>79556822
Why though? What are the negative aspects?
>>79560401
Regulations and taxes were part of the equation..Unless they out innovated us their currency was suppose to inflate and keep our manufacturing competitive. Why didn't the core principle of the free traders arguement happen?
What was OP's picture?
>>79560401
We know the economic benefit of tariffs jobs stay in the USA.
>>79560571
A girl sitting on a counter top in lingerie.
>>79560401
How cheap goods are, are pretty irrelevant when you don't have a job
>>79560339
Right, but you have it backwards. Corporations don't only compete in their pricing, they also compete in their acquisition of human capital.
If firm A is hiring engineers at $1, and firm B is hiring at $1.50, then firm B will be able to acquire more engineers at a high skill. Unless they collude on fixing wages, which is illegal, then competition will also drive wages up.
>>79560652
AT THE COST OF OTHER JOBS, HOLY SHIT.
Sure, manufacturing jobs may come back, but the cost of products go up. People then buy fewer products. The people who sell products then have to fire workers because of reduced demand for products. In the studies I linked, one found that approximately 8 jobs were lost in other sectors by saving 1 job in a single sector.
>>79560511
The repub base is religious, and with Romney being a mormon, he did tone down religion since most people (even other christians) think mormons are ridiculous.
>>79560789
Its fucking infuriating..They made claims thirty years ago...None of it happened and then they only taught the next generation one side one economic theory .
>>79560569
POST PROOFS OR FUCK OFF
>>79560799
I can
a) open a factory in the west and pay fair wages and enforce health and safety laws
Or
b) open a sweatshop in China, make my workers live in a box and have 20 more chinks waiting to fill the space each industrial accident makes
Globalist are purley motivated by profit and not the health and well being of the nation
>>79560789
>>79561037
>>79560992
The increased cost of products makes people lose their jobs in other sectors you fucking retards.
>>79561080
Those people in China, what do you think they would be doing if they couldn't work in sweatshops?
>>79561037
Tariffs do not work to achieve the intended purpose. There is no debate about this in virtually every economic school of thought. Get out of here with your protectionist commie garbage.
>>79561258
Thank you based leaf. Trump is playing the alt right the same way shillary is playing the left.
>>79561177
I work near the largest ship building construction hall in Europe, it's been empty for 6 months now
>>79561247
Why would the well being of the Chinese be my concern in Great Britain?
>>79561177
Nobody gives a shit about that which is not seen. Who cares about those other jobs that don't exist? Look at how prosperous those factory workers are! Look at the bustling factories! Look!
>>79561258
What's wrong with balancing the trade deficit though? Using tariffs to bring parity and go no further seems like a reasonable thing to do.
>>79561177
Do you have any evidence that costs of goods decrease when manufacturing cost were lowered.. Do you have any evidence that lets say steel cost less without the first world producing it and adding to the supply of global steel.
>>79554766
Devalue your currency. It's exactly how China got all the manufacturing jobs. Kinda hard for us being the petro dollar and all.
>>79561438
Listen. To. Me. I understand that your shipping yards are empty. But by not placing tariffs, your government saved more jobs across every other sector.
Youre only looking at this one specific aspect of your economy, instead of the whole thing.
>>79561541
I see Germanys economy has totally tanked relying on Internet steel to automotive production lines?
Oh wait, no it hasn't
>>79554766
Robots
>>79561611
I have evidence that placing a tariff on a good increases the price of that good.
>>79561247
How is this my problem? China should be able to take care of itself. They're a (very) big boy now.
>>79561834
But the arguement against tariffs was that our producers would stay competitive due to inflation and adding china's steel to the global market would reduce the cost of steel.
In what way does removing Pittsburgh's 75 billion dollars worth of steel from the steel supply lower steel prices?
>>79561942
I thought his argument was that tariffs create sweatshops, which are bad. I misunderstood the point he was trying to make about China, my mistake.
>implying the UK isn't now prime ground for manufacturing
>>79561696
Our industry is now service based, how can the Working class north be expected to move to London and wear suits and sit in an office when for generations they have been the greatest tradesmen in the world?
No, the slip into the lower class. They become reliant on social hand outs, they turn from our greatest asset to our greatest burden.
I understand that we can never compete with Chinese steel on a global market, but what I'm saying is mimic the Germans internal production lines. Turn that expensive steel into something Inherently more valuable. The Germans do it with cars, we can do it with Ships and aviation.
>>79561834
How do we get reciprocity then? Clearly, China is far less reliant on American made products than America is on Chinese made products. There needs to be a way to balance it out, or China will simply corner the market and drive our supply chain out of the picture, which isn't good either.
>>79562094
You don't understand the point. If American companies sell steel at the global market price, then tariffs would not be necessary. But because they cannot, the government decided to artificially INCREASE the price of steel imports to Americans by adding tariffs.
>>79561605
Because that still doesn't negate the problems that tariffs create, it just reduces it because you're applying tariffs to a smaller number of goods.
If a good is being imported, that means it is cheaper to import that good than it is to produce it at home. Artificially raising the prices of imported steel, let's say, to higher than the price of the domestic steel (which would incentivize people to produce and buy at home) means people have to spend more money on the same amount of steel as before, and have less money to spend on other goods as a result. All it does is impose mroe cost where there shouldn't be any.
Consider an extreme example to highlight the point. Suppose that some farmers in Greenland want to start up a banana industry. They have to build greenhouses galore, power them, import fertilizers, etc. Their bananas go on the market for $20/lb, as compared to $1/lb imported Mexican bananas. The Greenland farmers lobby the government to impose a tariff raising the price of Mexican bananas to $21/lb, so that Greenland bananas will be chepaer. Do you suppose that Greenland's economy is better off when consumers are spending $19 more on bananas than they were before, and subsequently $19 fewer dollars on cars, bread, newspapers, etc.?
>>79554766
But i don't want to double the price of everything i buy.
>>79562314
>You don't understand the point. If American companies sell steel at the global market price
That is not what is happening...China is cheating and devaluing their currency making it impossible to compete.
>>79562314
Then don't sell steel, turn that steel into quality goods, make it more desirable with quality American engineering and be damned with the slight profits producing the same goods would yield using Chinese steel, for the jobs you have created for your own country men is immeasurably more valuable
>>79562368
But the difference is food can be grown many times from the same source, where as there is a finite amount of steel.
An impractical set up to grow bananas has nothing to do with the labor used to produce them. China is driving prices lower by paying their labor less, not by being any more efficient at producing said goods.
>>79562151
They'll soon return to fishing soft lad. There are cities in the north literally built on fishing.
>>79562301
I don't know, but tariffs hurt the placer by making the cost go up for native consumers, and the placee by not allowing them to export as much. So two countries having tariffs is worse than one country having them is worse than no countries having them.
If China can outproduce us in manufacturing, there are other economic sectors people could switch to, or inflation would fix the imbalance. If China would continually devalue there currency, to compensate, prices would still readjust.
>>79562314
A communist government is artificially DECREASING the price of steel we are talking about fighting back and artificially Increasing the global price to what it should be....By doing that the steel supply would who even know how much the steel supply would increase if America and Europe where producing it dropping the price significantly lower then they are today
>>79562544
RIGHT. but to make that profitable for Americans, you have to reduce the price of Americans purchasing steel by dropping the fucking tariffs
>>79562744
Fishing is just one of the many industries our country can build a strong Export economy from
>>79562772
China is on the other side of the world. Britain is right next to yurope.
Import resources > manufacture > sell
Shipping fees are getting expensive with oil going up yo,
Last time i checked, China doesn't have any plans for sustainable energy.
>>79562909
As a taffy i'm hoping we'll reopen the mines
>>79562544
You are only looking at that which is seen. For every dollar that is spent on American steel, there is one less dollar spent on other American products that are actually competitive. For every new job created for an American steelworker, there is one less job created for someone else in a competitive industry.
Tariffs ignore the fundamental concept of comparative advantage. They think they can achieve something for nothing. TANSTAAFL.
>>79562695
>paying their labor less
>not by being any more efficient
How do you propose to measure production efficiency without accounting for labor costs? What sort of fairytale economics do you subscribe to?
>>79562419
This is unsustainable. They are setting themselves up for failure, and giving everyone else the benefit of cheap steel. It's a win for all importing countries, not a loss.
>>79560799
Ah, I see where our disagreement lies.
You are more optimistic that the labor supply will be small enough that workers will be able to set their own prices rather than suffer a take it or leave it offer from firms.
I am not so inclined, that is all, especially with regards to the available work already offered at the legal minimum level.
We are passed the era of peak labor in my view where permanent worker slack will persist. Even though we are reaching full official employment (though with many underemployed/working multiple jobs), inflation is still chronically low to include wages. The future looks like Japan's lost decade.
http://seekingalpha.com/article/3979806-full-employment-versus-labor-slack-fed-hike-june
>>79563000
Checkd. Also mister leaf can we be friends?
>>79563000
>>79562901
I've not actually mentioned Tariffs, I'm talking about having a nationalised production line from raw material to finished product within our own borders.
The only way I can see of competition with the 3rd world is by using our only advantage against them, the quality of our products. Artificially handicapping them is merely a temporary solution
>>79563247
You'll soon be a single country with your beaner friends.
>>79562977
What about the Pot Noodle mines?
>>79563000
>They are setting themselves up for failure,
And in the mean time we have lost half of our manufacturing and most of our industrial jobs.
Why are we letting a communist government bring down everyone in the world? Because taxing cheaters is bad...Said only kike Friedman ever.
>>79561048
so you literally have no argument
>>79563218
I think people would have more options if the government did not legislatively support oligopolies and monopolies. Checking that article out now though
>>79562977
They can suck out a lot of the energy 99% cheaper using fracking.
Dont know how your mines come back from that.
Metallurgical coal will still have a decent market, what grade is the stuff near you?
>>79563457
>what grade is the stuff near you?
Chicken and Mushroom I think
>>79563375
Their government will collapse if they maintain this, and they will be worse off than before. And nobody will try to do this shit again, because of the effects of has. Expect mass starvation in China if they don't stop.
>>79563391
No, I showed that tariffs hurt the economy and that dipshit just kept talking about irrelevant bullshit instead of posting anything to counter my initial assertion that tariffs hurt the economy.
>>79563247
Certainly, Mr. Burger. If only more burgers shared your view, your country would be great again in no time.
>>79563285
>nationalized production
What possesses you to think this would be more competitive than production on the open market?
>>79563375
>lost half of our manufacturing
And gained jobs in other sectors. What is so difficult about this to understand? If an industry is no longer competitive with others, then it should not be propped up at everybody else's expense. Greenland banana farmers should not force all of Greenland's consumers to spend more money just so they can stay in business. That is literally crony capitalism, using government power to protect select private interests.
>>79563564
who gives a shit if China fails..Why are we letting them suck our manufacturing and industry out of our country
>>79563727
Its artificiality noncompetitive. all of those new job sectors would still exist but we would also have manufacturing and industry.
>>79563856
Free market/people not keeping their hands out of the cookie jar when they said they would.
>>79563727
You do realize the plan is to add tariffs at the rate of currency manipulation to combat cheaters
>>79563000
>How do you propose to measure production efficiency without accounting for labor costs?
It's just one aspect of the goods being produced, and not a measure of efficiency as a whole. If they are going to corner the market by dumping slave labor produced goods, there should indeed be recompense to defend our own market. It's not that cheap shit is evil, it's that domestic production is what keeps money and ideas flowing.
Take a look at pretty much any African country. They have cheap labor too, but they also have no means of production. Therefore, they are poor AND they don't have stuff to buy.
>>79563727
>>nationalized production
>What possesses you to think this would be more competitive than production on the open market?
The production chain can be streamlined from start to finish and without the need for tariffing foreign imports. If the production line is nationalised we won't have the issue of profit driven factories trying to source cheaper materials at the cost of British workers.
>>79554884
>automation is significant
>>79555466
The economy is still heavily based on manufacturing. Where did all your shit come from?
>>79564008
IT DOES NOT MATTER AT WHAT RATE TARIFFS ARE ADDED.
Because they will bring no NET benefit. They will save a few manufacturing jobs, at the cost of MORE jobs in other sectors. Tariffs demonstrably INCREASE overall unemployment.
>>79563457
Prime Welsh Coal.
>>79564326
This is why we call you golems...You hear the word tariff and you immediate go into your pre programmed kike defense....The plan is to add a tax at the exact rate that China has devalued their currency. If you have some other solution to this problem let me know.
>>79563691
No no you're right I wasn't following the whole conversation so I take it back
But Mr. 48r+ Tariff is answering every question and response
I need to study this myself, as a third party peer, both of you are bouncing off making stronger cases for yourselves, I don't know who is misinterpreting what data or if any of you are even wrong
>>79564326
If you have tariffs on a deficit its good mane.
>>79564057
All factories are profit driven. All of them. The only reason national production makes sense is because it is unprofitable for companies to produce in given country. Likely due to corporate/income taxes, which are used to prop up inefficient welfare states.
Sure, if you want to maintain a welfare state, then nationalization kind of makes sense. But it will NEVER be as efficient or economically beneficial as a free market
>>79564600
Again the plan is not to add a tariff to say steel..The plan is to add a tariff to Chinese steel at the exact rate they manipulated their currency...
We are telling china they will sell their goods to us at the appropriate market price.
>>79564326
>Oy vey muh tariffs!
>Its like anuddah shoah!
>Muh economy, muh poor shekel sector, them bastid goyim are ruining it just to have money to raise their Nazi nuclear families
>>79564914
Please give this thread the respect it deserves
>>79554766
By keeping the population poor
>>79564600
I believe that pure profit is of secondary importance. Have a strong and productive working class not sapping the welfare of the state is far more important to the nation as a whole and should be put before the profits of a Company.
But I believe our differences are more ideological than anything. I agree that tariffs are bad for the economy and only serve to drive up the prices of domestics goods, I guess it's possible to use them in moderation to nurture a growing industry but when do you make that cut off
>>79563856
>Its artificiality noncompetitive
On the consumer (ie. importer) side, it doesn't matter whether the prices are low because of monetary shenanigans or truly efficient production. The end result is that the good is cheaper to buy than anywhere else. This means that extra money that you have left over can be spent on more of the same good than before, or on something else entirely.
>>79564008
Again, whether you set your tariffs low or high, there will be no benefits economy-wide, only low or high negative consequences. It will only benefit those in the protected industry, and harm everyone else in the country.
>>79564051
> it's that domestic production is what keeps money and ideas flowing
And domestic production hasn't stopped, it has only shifted to sectors with comparative advantage.
>>79564057
And instead you will have factories that produce more expensive goods (because there is no way they will be able to compete with foreign goods) AND had to be built at the taxpayer's expense.
