Are you pro-choice or pro-life, and why?
I am pro-choice. I don't want retards dumb enough to get pregnant at age 13 to reproduce
>>79060986
Pro choice.
We need some sort of population control for those who can't afford, or simply don't want to reproduce.
There are potential ethical or moral reasons to oppose abortion, but fetuses or embryos aren't sentient.
Pro-Life, because I believe god made every life scared.
>>79060986
Pro choice. You can't force someone to carry a baby to term, especially in the case of rape. That's fucked up. What we can do is make sure people have access to birth control, plan B, and that abortions are rare and are carried out as early into a pregnancy as possible. It sucks that a baby doesn't get to live, but it's better than the alternative.
>>79060986
>2016
>Not being pro-eugenics
Pro-life. I believe that human beings are special and have an innate right to be valued, respected, and to receive ethical treatment from fertilization until natural death.
>>79060986
literally everyone on /pol/ should be pro choice
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=st49UflCFQc
I think abortion should be allowed so there's no underground coathanger clinics but it should be stigmatized heavily and not fucking promoted
>>79061279
I think the mothers need to be killed, along with the baby.
>>79061656
I completely agree with your sentiment, but the mother also deserves those innate rights. What about in the case of a severely addicted pregnant woman who can't stop using drugs and will harm the child? Do you force them into treatment and keep them there against their will until the baby is born? What about in the case that a pregnancy would be harmful to the mother?
>>79061725
Can you think of a reason why abortions shouldn't be allowed, without using "muh religion", or "muh feelings"?
>>79060986
Killed two of her own children to become... Literally who?
A female comedian? Those words don't even compute together
>>79060986
>helped her correct an "irresponsible" decision with a "thoughtful" one
>aborting kids is now thoughtful
Honestly though, I am pro-choice but only under limited circumstances such as rape, danger of life for the mother or severe birth defects. Abortion shouldn't be a convenience.
>>79060986
pro-choice in the case of rapes. It should be illegal if you consented to sex, since consenting to sex is consenting to raising a child. It's not a religious position, I just want people to have to answer for their own fucking decisions.
>>79061329
>Pro-Life, because I believe god made every life scared.
Except for all the babies He aborts (miscarriages)
pro life, but don't consider abortion it the worst "crime/sin" ever and definitely think it's justified if the woman's life is in danger
>>79061513
I remember reading that the closing of orphanages plus roe v wade led to a sharp decline in violent crime around the 1990s due to less unwanted children and growing up in poverty.
Not sure if that's true or not, but the influx of the drug trade in the 1970s-1980s along with the mistreatment of war vets certainly led to a rise in crime during that era.
TL;DR if a child is unwanted, it's probably best to give them up for adoption, but it's better to abort than to bring an unwanted child into the world and have them show up on /pol/ and shitpost.
>>79061656
what would you do in the case where a mother wants to abort to the point she hunger strikes or some such?
i.e. do the rights of the fetus outweigh the mother enough to force her to have the baby?
>>79060986
pro life, but all niggers and spics should be removed from the planet.
makes sense about Chelsea though. you could always tell she was drowning something horrible in her past booze and bbc.
kinda sad now that I've seen some stuff with her dad. no wonder her dad hates her.
>>79061968
Shit, actually >>79061965 is correct. Nobody wants to raise a potato-baby, so that should be legal too.
Killing millions of God's children because people dont want to be adults
Pro choice, nonwhites are the biggest recipients for abortions anyways and I have no issues with the edgelord stance.
>>79060986
Pro-Choice.
Kids are either obnoxious, screeching brats or they're being bullied by the brats and look constantly terrified. Either way they just crowd up what would otherwise be pretty nice places like beaches and parks.
>>79060986
pro choice. while i would never wish anyone i know to have an abortion it's the only option policy-wise.
>>79061513
/rape
Meme tier, that's basically zero of abortions
Real abortions are
>slut doesn't take birth control because she think underclass Chad will love her more if she has a baby
>underclass Chad says he will love her only if she kills baby and forcibly drives her to abortion clinic and waits outside
>underclass Chad leaves slut for other slut he's been fucking on the side
>Also pregnant
I'm pro-death.
But since murder is outlawed at the moment, I don't see murder of a forming human being being acceptable. Once sperm and egg meet, it's a new unique life, whether it's convenient or not.
>>79061851
after 4 weeks the fetus has a heartbeat, in 12 it resembles a human
>>79061689
>and not fucking promoted
You want to promote "not fucking" as a means to reduce abortion? Best of luck, pilgrim.
Pro choice. I hate pro-choice people, but lower crime due to fewer poors/nonwhites is a good benefit.
>>79061329
This.
A lot of people bring up the case that abortion should be okay for when a woman is raped and a baby is conceived in the process. Rape is fucking horrible, anyone who says otherwise should go take a bat to the face for their idiocy. It sucks that a woman had a person violently push their intentions onto them without their consent, but it doesn't give the woman the right to murder the kid who was conceived in the process. Giving the kid up for adoption is the best solution. There's many families out there that aren't able to have kids for possibly medical reasons and to give them a child for whom they can take care of and the child is given parents who will take care of them, you just turned a violent and horrible thing that happened to you into a precious gift of life and charity for multiple people.
If the kid is conceived out of incest-rape, the parents/family members need to be arrested and charged for life, but the kid should still be given up for adoption and not told about it's parentage.
Sex is meant for people whom are married and whom are ready to have kids. Sex outside marriage is unstable, and not good for any kid possibly conceived out of wedlock.
>>79061968
>since consenting to sex is consenting to raising a child
no its not, it's the result of unprotected sex.
>>79061841
>>79061841
>What about in the case of a severely addicted pregnant woman who can't stop using drugs and will harm the child? Do you force them into treatment and keep them there against their will until the baby is born?
Isn't that what the law already does? Aren't all addicts forced into treatment if they're discovered in possession of illegal drugs?
>What about in the case that a pregnancy would be harmful to the mother?
Doctors should try to save both patients. Usually if a woman has a problem with a pregnancy she will miscarry. The human body is great at fixing itself without medical intervention. It'd be very rare where a woman actually has to have an abortion to save her life during a pregnancy.
Pro choice. Niggers-n-spics disproportionately make use of abortion services in Murika, it is good to slow down the rate that America is getting mongrelized, and its already bad.
>>79062392
Rape-babies are cursed, it's better for them to be aborted, they'll just grow up and do more bad things
Why do pro-lifers are such as cucks? They, tax payers, want to feed many niglets and then be killed in the future?
>implying anybody on /pol has ever had sexually relations.
>>79062392
Not that guy but I agree completely. People are so quick with "but it might have a hard life". So it's better to kill it?
Crime rates dropped precipitously after Roe v. Wade (SCOTUS ruled that a woman has a privacy right to her body, ergo abortions pre-viability) had time to take effect. As a practical consideration, abortion is a net positive for society, I fully support it.
Even thought it is the ending of a "life," simple existence of a "life" does not confer rights. A dog is life, but it doesn't have rights. A fetus is life, but it doesn't supersede the woman's right to control her body, I guess. An act can be both constitutional and reprehensible.
>>79062392
Good luck trying to enforce parental culpability for their childrens' horrible actions.
![Better.Call.Saul.[S02E06].1080p.DD5.1.LostFilm.[qqss44].mkv_snapshot_28.17_[2016.03.26_20.15.03].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/rtuihm6.jpg "Better.Call.Saul.[S02E06].1080p.DD5.1.LostFilm.[qqss44].mkv_snapshot_28.17_[2016.03.26_20.15.03].jpg")
Pro-life but I don't talk about it because it's 99.9% undesirables aborting their offspring and the kids would have lived in misery anyway.
>>79062509
As a recovering alcoholic I can say being forced into treatment will do nothing unless you actually want to get sober. You might be sober for a while but you'll always fall off the wagon unless you want to get sober and stay sober.
It's not some sort of magical fix.
>>79062392
With that point of view, you should have been aborted.
>>79062063
>what would you do in the case where a mother wants to abort to the point she hunger strikes or some such?
Man, you guys are creating such weird scenarios. What if a pregnant woman hunger strikes when she is carrying a nine month old fetus and is a week or two from giving birth? I can ask you guys these same tricky questions.
>i.e. do the rights of the fetus outweigh the mother enough to force her to have the baby?
I don't see it as forcing someone to give birth. I see it as banning medical personnel from killing healthy fetuses. Pregnant women don't abort their own kids, they go pay someone money to do it. Why should someone in the medical field be allowed to kill a healthy fetus? What is the medical benefit involved from the perspective of the abortion provider?
>>79060986
Since this revolting cunt keeps getting threads made about her teenage abortions, it's worth noting that in addition to being a Jew she's mentioned multiple times that she "dated" (fucked) black guys throughout high school... right around the time she had the abortion. Puts things in a different context, no?
>>79060986
Pro-choice in America because niggers.
Pro-life in Europe because muslims don't get abortions.
>>79062899
>>79062950
Kek, I actually knew someone who's mother beat her stomach relentlessly during pregnancy. If someone doesn't want the baby but can't get an abortion, usually the child ends up suffering greatly.
Half of his body simply doesn't work.
>>79061329
>I believe god made every life scared.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FO66RqN0YOk
you fucking tool
>>79060986
Pro choice
BUT
>BUT
No with taxpayer money
>>79062084
Is that what happened to the Amakalites in the Canaan Valley?
Samuel 15:2–3"
3 Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction1 all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’ ”
Deuteronomy 2:34
34 And we captured all his cities at that time and devoted to destruction2 every city, men, women, and children. We left no survivors.
Deuteronomy 20:16
But in the cities of these peoples that the Lord your God is giving you for an inheritance, you shall save alive nothing that breathes, 17 but you shall devote them to complete destruction,1 the Hittites and the Amorites, the Canaanites and the Perizzites, the Hivites and the Jebusites, as the Lord your God has commanded.
>>79060986
should be mandatory for low income families
>>79062899
>using skywalker fallacies
>>79060986
Pro-Choice, it kills thousands of nigger-babies plus you should'nt force anyone to have a retarded child with 4 legs.
>>79062280
>4 weeks the fetus has a heartbeat
No, it doesn't have heart yet. It only has a pulsing lump on an artery
>>79062950
These tricky scenarios are important to bring up on both sides of the aisle. As a person who's pro-life, I can understand some abortion procedures because I knew about a woman who was in her third trimester and her baby ended up getting a medical problem and died inside of her. Basically this woman was lugging around a corpse inside her belly so getting an abortion to get it out of her is pretty reasonable.
>>79063289
It's also kind of a bad argument because that's saying a murderers life is just as sacred as an innocent persons life.
Was Stalin's life sacred? What about Mao's, or Pol Pot's?
>>79063484
Most abortions in Europe. Canada, Aus and NZ are done by whites though.
>>79060986
I'm neither, fetuses aren't human and women don't deserve freedom
>Inb4 edgy
>>79063336
>no survivors
>>79062682
You're wrong dude. Crime rates rose after abortion was legalized mainly due to the crack-cocaine epidemic.
Lots of things affect crime rates. I would say enforcement of the law is way more important. For example if cops decide to stop arresting people for marijuana and ticket them instead then the crime rate for marijuana will go down, despite the fact that plenty of people are still using it.
Pro-lifers are niggerloving cucks - they are fine with those niglets being covered with their tax money.
>>79063307
We have a winner
Pro-choice with limitations.
Pro choice to a certain extent.
Late term and partial birth abortions should be illegal.
If you are to stupid to make a decision before then you should be forced to carry to term and put the kid up for adoption.
>>79060986
So is her life the joke?
I dont get this kind of humor.
>>79063289
>"Religious people have been murdered, so God himself isn't pro-life".
>Another video of Carlin shows him stating pro-lifers are "anti-woman"
George Carlin is a fucking joke, and I am astonished people on this board consider him "red-pilled".
>>79063307
I'd argue against this, because plenty of children who grow up with shitty parents end up being leeches on society.
>>79063820
Because one day, when youre older than 20, youll realise that you can be right 9/10 and then be wrong once, but that doesnt make you wrong on all other counts.
>>79060986
I'm pro choice because people need to learn to fuck off and mind their own business. Whether or not a woman wants to have an aborition is nobody else's business. Opposing opinions can get fucked.
>>79061725
when you kill the baby you kill the mother.
>>79063513
>As a person who's pro-life, I can understand some abortion procedures because I knew about a woman who was in her third trimester and her baby ended up getting a medical problem and died inside of her. Basically this woman was lugging around a corpse inside her belly so getting an abortion to get it out of her is pretty reasonable.
That wouldn't be an abortion. Abortion is a medical procedure that intentionally causes embryonic/fetal demise.
I'm pro choice, but if you have more than a certain amount of abortions in your lifetime it should come with a manditory tubal ligation. Careless fucking should warrant some sort of punishment.
>>79060986
Pro-life. Never heard an argument against a fetus being a person that didn't also apply to a subset of born people. Mostly it's arguing about how it should be ok to kill people to preserve degenerate behavior, which is abhorrent to me.
>>79063016
>Pro-life in Europe because muslims don't get abortions.
Muslims are allowed to get abortions in the Quran, but they treat Muslim women like cattle, they have no rights.
>>79063820
I think Carlin was generally just a contrarian à la everything is bullshit. That was kinda is shtick.
>>79062950
The 'weird scenarios' are to highlight the absurdity in declaring abortion murder.
>What is the medical benefit involved from the perspective of the abortion provider?
no risk of dying in child birth I suppose? Are you against all cosmetic surgeries too?
>>79060986
Pro life. A fetus is a blank slate, but a woman that would kill her own child is already damaged goods.
>>79063649
I know, I was thinking about the US.
>>79063929
Too bad Carlin is wrong on a lot of accounts.
>the two points I mentioned earlier
>thinks nationalism or pride in one's race is stupid
>believes women are smarter and more competent than men
>thinks religious people are harmful for society
>>79063728
Not that guy, but he stated it took a while for the difference to be noticed.
Particularly, that being dubbed 'generation x' was the first generation under roe v wade to 'come to term' to the peak age of danger and violence (teenager through young adult), and there were far less Xers compared to the previous generation.
Someone born in the mid-late 1970s won't be out robbing liquor stores at age 5, it took a good decade and then some for those children to grow into the 'danger zone' of age where a lot of problems manifest (starting in the teen years).
By the 1990s, violent crimes had dropped.
I was the guy that said he wasn't sure whether it's 1:1 fact or not, but I can see the pattern and unlike you, I understood previous anon's statement about delayed effect.
>>79063307
>subsidised abortion
>once-off taxpayer cost
>non-subsidised abortion
>prime risk group can't afford it
>permanent taxpayer costs for the life of the retard/unwanted child criminal/uneducated welfare muncher/etc.
I know where you're coming from 細佬, but the logic says you're wrong.
The point of sex is reproduction. Just because some people have a different view on sex because it makes them feel good etc, doesn't negate the fact that the whole purpose of sex is reproduction.
You think a woman has the right to kill her child because she doesn't think the point of sex is for reproduction?
>>79063289
I don't give a rats ass what that cowardly hippie thinks about anything
>>79063728
Sorry I forgot to include evidence.
http://pricetheory.uchicago.edu/levitt/Papers/DonohueLevittTheImpactOfLegalized2001.pdf
>>79062392
It's such a small percentage that it's negligible
>>79064274
>thinks nationalism or pride in one's race is stupid
It is. You can be proud of your country at the olympics, but being proud of Newton's accomplishments is retarded.
>believes women are smarter and more competent than men
If you were famous and got all the free pussy you could handle, youd say the same.
>thinks religious people are harmful for society
Are you living under a rock?
The fuck do you think Muslims are?
Atheists?
>>79061841
>doing drugs that will harm the baby is evil and demands action
>kill the baby
You've just admitted fetuses should be protected while simultaneously advocating for their murder.
>Half of people think banning abortion is a 9 month violation of a woman's rights to bodily autonomy
>half of people think abortion is genocide
Since personhood is fundamentally axiomatic, we can never objectively decide when human rights are granted. If one side of the gray area is temporary non-fatal restriction of a portion of bodily autonomy due to your own actions, and the other side of the gray area is mass killing of children, wouldn't the moral choice clearly be to outlaw abortion?
The only arguments against this AFAIK are:
>killing isn't inherently immoral if it's for the good of the society
>includes the "most abortions are minorities" argument
which is an interesting point but clearly opposes the American ideal of individual liberty
>rape isn't a willful action of the mother
>(the famous pianist argument)
I'd say because the mother was NOT responsible for the scenario and her liberties are being infringed, she does not have a moral obligation to bear the child and therefore shouldn't have a legal one.
>life of the mother
clear case of life vs life. Context matters, so any legislation that values the life of the fetus over the mother 100% of the time will be wrong at least occasionally (the mother will usually be more valuable) . That makes this a clear exception.
>incest
Incest can be consensual. Nonconsensual incest is already covered by rape exception.
Incest has marginally higher chances of deformities or disabilities, but we allow dwarves, people with Down's Syndrome, or any other genetic disorder to reproduce.
Incest is clearly not an exception.
How does this make you feel?
>>79060986
I'm pro late-term abortion for shitskins
I think abortion should be limited to a few weeks for whites.
>>79061968
>since consenting to sex is consenting to raising a child
you probably walk around with that "I have never been fucked" look on your face blissfully unaware. dont you?
>>79060986
I'm pro baby life. You're pro baby murder?
>>79064165
Why isn't killing semen as bad then?
Pro choice all the way.
>>79064360
but thats just like your opinion man
pro-life for white people
pro-abortion and genocide for non-whites and especially jewish
>>79060986
I am prolife but I don't use it as a litmus as to who I will vote for.
I just use it to judge women.
If a woman is pro home I assume she is a whore. If he has had an abortion she is a murder. I treat them accordingly.
Abortion is a great indicator of a woman's worth.
Also, eugenics for the poor isn't a bad thing for society. It's just bad for the individual
>>79064165
>a woman that would kill her own child
Isn't that against the law already?
>>79064790
what edgey faggotry is this?
if you have more than 1 abortion, you should be forced to get tied up and prevent your slutty choices from wasting money
Im not so much pro-choice as i am pro-abortion. I think there should me mandatory abortions unless you can prove you can take care of a fucking kid, financially or otherwise.
Then all the riffraff dies out in 1 generation.
>>79064502
>fetuses should be protected while simultaneously advocating for their murder.
Can't murder what isn't a living being.
Are you guys being deliberately retarded?
>>79064502
>mass killing of children
Abortion isn't "killing" any living being.
>>79060986
Im pro-life, because murder is murder. Liberals are pretty fucked up. They advocate for the life of murders by day and murder their own offspring by night. Its almost like they are actively trying to destroy the human race.
I say if pro-choice is going to be a thing. Women should have their uterus removed so no future children can be murdered by said female, as her right to procreate is revoked.
>>79065057
>if you have more than 1 abortion, you should be forced to get tied up and prevent your slutty choices from wasting money
Is this part of the Pro-Life position or are you just Pro-Torture-Women?
>>79060986
Proabortion keep the crime rate and the population low. Single mothers should not be allowed to have children.
>>79065568
>Women should have their uterus removed
Why not have a giant letter A carved into their foreheads? Then you could be as bad as the witch-burners.
>>79060986
Pro choice. "Murder" is a low price to pay for civic peace. Unwanted people commit more crime and drain more resources. This leads to war. Ergo best to keep the population numbers down and ensure stability.
There should be some sort of reward for abortion, it helps keep the population down and provides stem cells
>>79062493
Imagine playing Russian roulette with a huge-ass (100 round) revolver, except you point the gun at a third party instead of yourself
>10 bullets out of 100 chambers
If I kill my friend, it's my responsibility because it was unprotected and dangerous
>1 bullet out of 100 chambers
We used protection by taking 9 of the bullets out, therefore I'm not responsible for the death of my friend
The only way you would not have responsibility for his death would be to not play the game at all, or to use 100% reliable protection meaning using 0 bullets. That's analogous to abstinence or castration, because anything else has a chance of failure.
Responsibility for the pregnancy always falls on the people who made it happen. That means the consenting parents, even if they tried to use protection.
>>79065317
Can you present a compelling argument against a fetus having personhood that doesn't also apply to some subset of born persons? I've been searching and legitimately can't find one.
>>79065876
Not really trying to give them a social stigma. I just dont see that they should have the right to breed after proving them selves unfit mothers. Whats more unfit than actively murdering your own offspring?
>>79066146
>murder
It aint a life till it pops out the puss m8
>>79066340
>double homicide
Yeah, its only not life when she didnt have drunk sex with a hobo.
>>79066340
But why? What does something's location have to do with personhood?
>>79066076
entirely dependent on the mother for survival
>>79066727
You mean like anyone under the age of 5? That can't be the best you have?
>>79066880
>entirely
I am pro choice. But i find abortion morally reprehensible.
>>79067008
So, parasites are not life then?
>>79060986
Pro-choice because most aborted babies are black/spic.
>>79060986
Pro choice. Also having all available testing and aborting anything with detectable birth defects that will render a child unable to function in society should be encouraged/commended. Giving birth to retards is extremely selfish.
>>79060986
Know it sounds kinda communist but I think you should be required to have certain amounts of children based on income or else heavy taxes and poor niggers won't be able to breed.
>>79062392
You are a horrible person for believing in god.
>>79066607
It hasn't took its first breath at that point
>>79067008
... Do you even have kids? My infant daughter is "entirely" dependent on my wife. If it weren't for her, it'd be up to advances in nutrition/technology. Surrogacy is a thing too. And growing an embryo/fetus outside the mother is technically possible, though, little research is done here for obvious ethical reasons you're somehow overlooking. Additionally, comatose people are "entirely" dependent on their caretakers. That's not a reasonable/logical criteria for personhood. Did you even think for 10 seconds?
>>79061329
No you don't. You post here.
>>79067534
Neither have babies in water births. Weird way to decide, very arbitrary. Probably technological workaround to this as well.
>>79067172
that wasnt the claim I was making. I was differentiating between fetus and baby. The point is that a fetus can't be removed from the mother without killing it. And since you bring it up if the fetus wasnt part of the reproductive cycle it would indeed be a parasite by definition.
Maybe this will prompt scientists to develop a way for a fetus to develop outside of the woman's womb ending this shitty annoying debate on abortion once and for fucking all.
>>79067726
>Posting on a christian board
>Cant believe in god.
Come again?
>>79065212
>>79065317
Half the country disagrees with you. I'll say it again.
>>Since personhood is fundamentally axiomatic, we can never objectively decide when human rights are granted. If one side of the gray area is temporary non-fatal restriction of a portion of bodily autonomy due to your own actions, and the other side of the gray area is mass killing of children, wouldn't the moral choice clearly be to outlaw abortion?
>>personhood is fundamentally axiomatic
>>we can never objectively decide where personhood begins
There is no belief that holds more weight than others. Fingers? Heart? Brain? Heartbeat? Movement? Birth? Ability to reason? Able to survive on its own?
What separates unborn from born? Traveling through the vaginal passage? That's an extremely odd thing to define personhood by. Any objective, observable point in development sounds arbitrary on its own. Why is your arbitrary point better than the other 300 million Americans or 7 billion humans?
The ambiguity can't be objectively resolved. Instead of arguing over the ambiguity, we need to consider the implications. If abortion is allowed, nearly half of people will think we are routinely murdering children. If abortions aren't allowed, nearly half of people will think we're temporarily restricting a small part of bodily autonomy (she can still go where she wants, eat what she wants, do what she wants, etc.).
One side is the clear victor.
Ultimately this is a consequence of an overreaching federal government, and we wouldn't even be having this 50/50 problem if states were just allowed to outlaw it if they so desired.
Pro choice/ don't give a fuck.
You only have rights when you exit the womb
>>79067604
My point more exactly was that you cant remove a fetus from mother without it dying see >>79067864
>>79067835
Not the same, its entered the world in that case
>>79064368
Nice arguments, Chad.
I'm even okay with late late term abortions. Only militant Christians care about this stuff
>>79067921
This board aint christian m8
>>79060986
>I don't want retards dumb enough to get pregnant at age 13 to reproduce
They're going to reproduce anyway, especially since abortion means they never have to learn responsibility.
Pro-abortion. The more abortions the better. It cuts the crime rate and welfare and is good for society. and it makes girls more willing to have casual sex.
>>79068013
Why can't you? Technological limitations? We likely could with a small, fertilized embryo. Why that point as the criteria for life? Not only are you wrong in your statements of ehat is possible, you're being entirely arbitrary.
Exactly. Abortions are a good way to fight white genocide
>>79067864
And there are many parasites which can not be removed from the host body with out killing it. So by your definition, parasites are not life.
Ill mention again, double homicide. You sick people delude your selves when its convenient for you, so you have no guilt, but its still a murder.
>>79068234
>hates mudslimes and jews
>hates degenerates in all forms
>christian general up most of the time.
>Votes Trump
It it was more christian, the Vatican would stream the popes masses every sunday.
>>79060986
I'm always against women choosing anything
Pro choice
1. Pro lifers are usually fundie cuckservatives, not real right wingers
2. The US is a shit place to have/raise a child
3. It keeps girls childfree longer, which means better dating pool as you grow older. You'll start to know the value of childless women when you're in your 30's
4. Means you can maintain an irresponsible and hedonistic bachelor lifestyle that the US is built for
5. Disproportionately most who are aborted are black
6. Abortion has lowered the crime rate with all the extra unwanted black ghetto babies not existing (seriously)
Pro-choice for deformities and rape babies, but women don't need another way to avoid responsibility.
>>79067604
Comatose people should be allowed to live for as long as their income/insurance/family covers it and not a day longer.
>>79068077
Why is it not the same? Your criteria for personhood is "out of a vagina, or breathing, whichever". Makes no sense, is that honestly what you think?
>>79068544
>all those green texts.
>Believes in the sanctity of human life.
I wonder how many times you posted those "nuke the kabaa" threads.
Most millennials decided abortion was a non issue long ago. Only cuckservatives and nigger lovers care about this issue.
>>79063491
>pulsing lump on an artery
dont you mean a pulse
>>79068787
Is that an argument about their personhood or for how it should be handled, based on when you think it's ok to kill people? Pretty sure people existed before money.
>>79068830
>nuke
What a great way to ruin perfectly good land. I personally would just deport them all back to their deserts and put a ban on any of the entering the country. They will take car of the rest. Thats all they know how to do.
>>79060986
I am somewhere in the middle.
Abortion should be illegal once the fetus has formed higher brain function and women who have had more than two abortions should be sterilized .
>>79068845
This
"American Christianity" is degenerate as fuck too.
>>79066032
>Responsibility for the pregnancy always falls on the people who made it happen.
of course but that doesn't mean everyone is having sex purely for children. Even married couples have sex for recreation.
and false equivalence comparing childbirth to playing what is already a suicidal game
>>79068794
By took its first breath, i just meant entered the world, i wasnt thinking of water births when i said that
>As a Jewish woman, I believe that our tradition calls us to support not only the right, but the ability of every person to make their own decisions about their body, family, and future in consultation with their loved ones without political interference or economic coercion. We are commanded by our faith to “pursue justice” and not to stand idly by while “stumbling blocks” are put in the way of those in need. Quality health care is an essential need and no one should be allowed to place a woman’s moral autonomy, health, economic security, or well-being at risk. In the context of this latest threat, our particular Jewish values compel us to advocate for universal access to comprehensive health care. This is why the National Council of Jewish Women, an organization that has always supported a woman’s right to choose and, more specifically, staunchly supports Planned Parenthood for the comprehensive, quality care it provides.
http://forward.com/sisterhood/318446/why-supporting-planned-parenthood-is-a-jewish-issue/
Supporting abortion is what the Jews want.
>>79060986
I'm pro-abortion, but not pro-choice (i.e. women's right to chose). give her an IQ and basic fitness test, if it's below a certain score, approve it since she's willing. if she's white, fit and the fetus is fit, chain her to a hospital bed until its born and then give it to one of the thousands of white childless couples that want to adopt. fuck feminism, fuck jews.
>>79068982
Pretty sure no one lived very long in a coma before money.
>>79069105
>Jesus will send you to burn for eternity in atrocious pain because you scrolled past a shitty picture
whew, great religion you've got there, I can totally see why it's still 100% relevant today
>>79060986
Iam pro abortion because I don't want the people that choose abortions to reproduce.
>>79060986
I'm pro life due to the problem of other minds. I can't be sure that other people are conscious however I arbitrarily believe that they because to believe otherwise is to admit that I am completely alone. There is no method to prove that one is conscious so I rely on a biological definition of human life which a human zygote fulfills. If I was pro-choice I would also be pro-euthanasia and pro-eugenics. While I disagree with Peter Sanger I can't refute his logic(he basically believes that children up to the age of 3 should be able to be euthanize because they lack a concept of self).
>>79069253
>Supporting abortion is what the Jews want.
>You
>getting jobs is what the whites want
>Blacks
Good logic both of you
>>79060986
I'm generally pro-choice in that I think restricting abortion is dumb as fuck and solely the domain of Christcucks and people on /pol/ who just want to be contrarian because they're afraid of ever being on the same side as a liberal on certain issues.
The problem is that abortion is being increasingly seen by degenerates as a mulligan: you forget to use protection, well no problem. Get an abortion and it's back to fucking random strangers in the club the next night. Something needs to be done about the increased pushing, and acceptance, of degeneracy. Ban abortion and these retards are just going to be pushing out more children that they're incapable of raising because they can't get away from the booze, partying and MDMA long enough to actually give a shit about their children.
>>79069218
Can you give expand on that though? I don't see why something's location determines personhood. Two human babies/fetuses, identical in every way, but one's inside a person, so they no longer have rights? What if we could put them back in, ok to end them? This isn't reasonable.
>>79069328
>>79069161
Yet you're saying sex is not already a procreational game
I am pro choice because reality.
I personally really like cats and would love to save them all but the reality is even if I were to go full on cat hoarder and stash hundreds of them in my house, there would still be endless numbers of them running free. As they will continue to breed far beyond the point that their environment can sustain them a lot of them will die. As such it makes sense that their population has to be kept in check.
It's no different for humanity. We need population control too. Why not let that take the form of people who won't raise their children correctly anyway?
Also all retard babies should die via abortion or post birth euthanasia.
>>79069263
Likely not, you're not arguing about personhood though, you're arguing about what action you think should be taken. Likely you're basing this off their personhood, but you haven't explained how that fits into it at all. Are you saying they're not a person, ok to kill" or "they're a person, but from a certain moral standpoint, killing them is acceptable." Discussing the former, not the latter.
>>79070281
I am saying they do not deserve to live if they are 100% a burden on society. Same goes for retard babies.
>>79070386
Thank you for your intellectual honesty. I wholeheartedly agree that ending the lives of people is acceptable in certain circumstances. That's a far more interesting and nuanced conversation. Since we're discussing the unborn, and you mention the mentally/physically handicapped being a burden. Is your criteria for keeping people around based on the net benefit to humanity? How do we objectively decide whether or not a person is valuable enough to be kept alive? This expands far beyond abortion, but I'm interested in your perspective.
>>79070973
An interesting point is that a free economy tells exactly what you contribute.
A baby, child, or student will still be a net burden to the economy. Economically speaking, children are investments.
Actually, a fetus is a smaller economic negative than a born child, particularly pubescent children with massive calorie needs who usually contribute zero or very little to the economy.
>>79060986
Question for pro-choice-ers
There are numerous kinds of contraceptives available for both male and females to prevent pregnancy, there are also numerous services available to help with a complicated pregnancy, and then there are also numerous services available in the event of an unwanted child. All these options, all these choices, and yet abortions have to remain on the table. Why?
What does is it mean when persons, who given all the choices to prevent a pregnancy, still end up getting pregnant? Is society to blame for not educating people well enough about options available?
Abortions are probably one of the most complicated procedures that can be done to a woman's reproductive system. Why should that option to stop a pregnancy be the one with less restrictions? Why should this dangerous medical procedure be the one deregulated?
Regardless of whether or not a fetus is a living being, it always true that the nature of a fetus is to become one. Laws as they are now respect that intent by providing certain protection to pregnant women. But if abortions have federal precedence what does that say about those protections?
A drunk driver hits a young woman. She dies. It turns out she was pregnant. But it also turns out she was on her way to get an abortion. When the driver goes to trail should the fact that she was pregnant have any relevance in the case? Does the abortion negate all those protection? What's the legal ramifications of a deregulated procedure that can instantly put a stop to several other higher laws? If the woman was going to get an abortion anyway why should the driver be charged for killing a pregnant woman? The intent of the abortion just makes her out to be a woman. Is that justice?
Of all the options, all the choices available and yet Pro-choice-ers want to keep the most expensive one, the most life threatening one, and the most legally destructive one. Why?
(posted off the top of my head)
>>79060986
This is a morally ambiguous issue (gray area on what counts as life) and there aren't any rational arguments for either side, since this is the case, by default I'll take the option requiring the least government intervention. Allow it.
As the free market dictates.
>>79070973
I am not necessarily suggesting that people need to be a significant benefit to society so much as when it's a guaranteed loss we should cut the cord. I'm also not suggesting that we outright euthanize them. They should be allowed to die "naturally".
As far as abortion goes, a fetus is not really worth all that much. Sure you can argue for potential but compared to a fully trained and functional adult a child has no skills and costs a lot to mold into something useful. The net loss to society for an abortion is pretty minimal.
Retards are a guaranteed net loss. Why pour millions into raising a downsy baby that at best can sack groceries less efficiently than any Mexican you pick up off the street. There is no chance they will ever be of more value to society than it costs to keep them alive.
>>79073026
>A drunk driver hits a young woman. She dies. It turns out she was pregnant. But it also turns out she was on her way to get an abortion. When the driver goes to trail should the fact that she was pregnant have any relevance in the case? Does the abortion negate all those protection? What's the legal ramifications of a deregulated procedure that can instantly put a stop to several other higher laws? If the woman was going to get an abortion anyway why should the driver be charged for killing a pregnant woman? The intent of the abortion just makes her out to be a woman. Is that justice?
This is a fairly loaded question. I mean realistically if someone gets hit by a car and the driver is at fault, the punishment should be the same whether the victim was white, black, pregnant, trans, a police officer, a nun, or a blind deaf mute. What's next, vehicular manslaughter becomes a hate crime depending on a victim?
fucken hell
first /pol/ thread i go on today and it's already a warzone
>>79073347
I was with you up until the end... Shouldn't we avoid doing things that are morally ambiguous? "Pushing this button will either kill a person or make their lives easier, we're not sure, so may as well let people press it, right?" Some pascal's logic should help your decision, even though it says nothing about the issue at hand.
>>79068544
>that wasnt the claim I was making. I was differentiating between fetus and baby
how do you reply twice and not even read the comment
>>79068285
Embryo isnt a fetus. Still not talking about the definition of life. Even bacteria are life. You said personhood.
>>79073421
You make several assertions, but don't provide any criteria for making them. What makes a fetus, comatose/handicap person, objectively, worth enough to keep alive? Likely, by whatever criteria you're using, there are persons in those categories that make them more "valuable" than yourself. I say this because you probably haven't given much thought about what is a net gain/loss to society.
>>79074653
For your first sentence, are you arguing that an embryo is a person but not a fetus, by your own criteria? And, clearly, I meant human life, as in personhood. Nobody can reasonably argue that those cells aren't alive (ie, life), so my intention was clear. Splitting hairs and being intellectually dishonest aren't arguments.
>>79060986
I am against abortion UNLESS the child is a product of rape, incest, or if it has genetic defects
>>79061329
You are pro White death, direct murders by spics & niggers that aren't aborted and stolen life, money paid to support spics & niggers, which takes time that represents life and life is finite, and quality of life from more spics & niggers in the world.
>>79073708
>I mean realistically if someone gets hit by a car and the driver is at fault, the punishment should be the same whether the victim was white, black, pregnant, trans, a police officer, a nun, or a blind deaf mute. What's next, vehicular manslaughter becomes a hate crime depending on a victim?
So if the victim was a child then the driver should be charged the same as if child was a dog or a lawn ornament? You're saying the state at which a the victim was in has no bearing on the case what so ever? You're saying that if a person assaults another it shouldn't matter if the victim was handicapped, mentally disabled, or even physically restrained by some third element, the assailant should be sentenced all the same without any regard to those factors? Is that what you think is fair? If somebody has an advantage over you and use that to amplify the damage done to you then their trial shouldn't consider that at all? How is that justified?
ITT: cucks making strawman arguments so that they can justify having an extra 50 million jamals running around the country
just admit that you like seeing bbc in your wife and we can finally see your point
>>79073741
to be expected with manlets deciding things and talking out their ass on the internet
Of course the obvious problem with only allowing abortion in cases such as rape is it will require the courts to reach a verdict on whether or not the woman in question was actually raped before the woman is allowed to go through with it. This would often (if not almost always) lead to the fetus going beyond the currently legally abort-able age.
Not to mention that we would almost certainly see an increase in rape allegations.
It doesn't take much thought to realize that just allowing a woman to have control over her own body regardless of the circumstances is the best option.
>>79075344
>For your first sentence, are you arguing that an embryo is a person
no...?
>>79078014
Then what was the point of the statement? Your last rebuttal didn't bother to refute the points I made. I totally understand if you or nobody what want to engage me. I just think every pro-choice person who is pro-choice because they don't think the unborn are persons are as willfully ignorant as people who believe in YEC, deny evolution, or climate change. I want to be shown that they are rational, logical and have perfectly good reasons for believing that, instead of thinking of them as idiots. You're really making the pro-choice camp look bad.
Pic related is pretty much how I feel
>>79080783
This is basically why right wingers have such a hard time with this issue. The tosh about "saving the lives of children" is just that.
>>79060986
Yes, goy. Choose to have blonde trannies only.
Or do not have any kids if the zionazi option isn't possible, Goy.
But WAIT.
With the right contacts at MT Sinai Beth Israel hospital in jew york YOU CAN have your little tanned blonde transexual kid.
ALL HAIL YHWH
>>79079189
embryo isnt a fetus was referring to the difference in being able to remove/insert to womb.
What (I thought) was in question was why one should consider fetuses differently than newborns. My point was that they can't be removed from the mother and live, ergo they are not the same level of life as newborns.
>>79060986
20 MILLION NIGLETS GETS KILLED IN ABORTIONS
YES SAVE THEM
GOOD GOY
>>79062280
>12 weeks looks like human
Subjective, could look like a chimp too
Why are humans given such a pass? Don't take me to be a vegan, I enjoy eating steaks just like normal people. However, if it were a rat that were pregnant, you wouldn't think twice about killing it fetus. So why do we afford the exception to humans?
>>79060986
Pro-choice. Why? Fetuses can't feel pain so they are less than animals. If we slaughter animals then it should be okay to slaughter fetuses too. Doesn't mean I don't think the woman getting the abortion isn't a fucking retard and should be euthanized as well though.
>>79081990
Gotcha, thanks for clarifying, but I outlined earlier that 1) that's incorrect for early/late pregnancy and 2) that's only true in the middle of pregnancy due to technological limitations. If you still want to stick by your original statements about when the unborn are a person you have to recognize that 1) they have personhood, lose it for about 3 months, then get it back and 2) personhood is a moving target, limited by our technology's capability of keeping people alive. I'm trying to outline what you actually believe, and this right here, sounds like nonsense to me.
>>79060986
Pro choice.
Having children is a choice, no matter what you believe.
As someone currently getting fucked in the ass by child support by someone who claimed to be on birth control and didn't want any more kids, single mothers should be shit in the head.
>>79083035
I never claimed any level of fetus/embryo has personhood. Merely was claiming that fetus and embryo are not entirely comparable when discussing the ability to transfer them in/out of womb.
Even if you could transplant fetuses safely I dont see what real bearing that has on how you consider fetuses as having rights or not.
Pro-life morally, but pro-choice legally.
You can't give people certain rights and then take them away decades later, so abortion is here to stay. However I find the actual act reprehensible, and having experienced a miscarriage I have come to believe that life does begin at conception.
>>79083391
Exactly, but these are the cases that logically follow based on the criteria you've laid out. Those are the edge cases I'm asking you to cover.
Within your own working definitions, that's important because it means they're no longer "entitely" dependent on the mother, which means they're no different than someone who is already born. Again, this is following the criteria you've laid out, which isn't reasonable to me.
>>79084044
1st world standards cannot be provided for 7,000,000,000 with the resources available on our planet.
You want more people, driving down the standard of living, because...?
>>79084044
The bottom line of my belief is that you should be able to do what you want with your own body. As long as a fetus is (physically) dependent on you I dont agree that it is its own separate lifeform.
So if you could transplant them safely I could agree in theory to making it illegal to abort in place of transplant, but then the question becomes why bother and who pays for the child.
>>79084548
That's not an argument for or against personhood, see earlier comments discussing this.
To your second, I'm a natalist. I believe the exponential technological and quality of life growth humanity has seen is directly linked to exponential population growth. My wife and I are pumping out as many kids as biologically possible as well as foster parenting. Trying to setup humanity's future as best we can. Feel free to let your genes and ideologies be surpassed by mine in future generations though.
Pro-choice
Not a fan of abortion and I wouldn't get one unless the kid was retarded but the women that get them shouldn't be carrying to term anyways. Either for health or being a dumb slut.
Her children are dead.
No wonder she is such a cunt.
Pro-choice. Most women who have abortions shouldn't be passing on their genes anyway. (white trash, ghetto nigs, etc.)
>>79084993
Right, and I'm explaining to you how that doesn't cover the aforementioned cases, and, again, by your reasoning, you're calling fetuses people both now, and with future technology. So at this point you have two options 1) be ok with killing innocent people or 2) expand your criteria. As of now you're not being logically coherent.
This is unrelated, but there are lines and lines of rich prefect families who will pay thousands of dollars to adopt babies. Look up adoption sites to read their profiles. Adopting is hard because of the limited quantity of newborn babies, so if these adoption agencies could grow babies on farms they totally would. Checkout reviews too. This is why I foster parent, adoption is a competition to get scammed by religious organization under the pretense of helping innocent orphan babies.
dont worry all the dead babies get to eat at your soul in purgatory jesus dont take kindly to abortions but make sure you kill as many babies as possible and you might make it to the larder with chris farley
>>79085870
How am I calling fetuses people?
>>79060986
I'm pro-stop fucking if you shouldn't have kids. I'm anti-ending a life because you are irresponsible.
I am pro life for white babies and pro death all other babes
>>79085841
This, but I think that if the woman is just getting an abortion because "lol condumbs are fukken gay" then she should be forcibly sterilized. Then she can use her uterus like the semen sump pump that it is without killing children and being a burden on the tax payers.
Pro-choice, a human's value comes from it's self awareness, not it's mere existence. Fetuses, especially early ones can barely be considered above reproductive cells, and on top of that only undesirables abort their children anyway so it's a great form of voluntary eugenics
>>79086209
This.
>>79086064
Again, the unborn aren't "entirely" dependent on their mother in early or late development in the same way kids under 5 aren't and the only reason that's not true for the entire pregnancy/development is due strictly to technological limitations.
>>79061329
>believes god made every life sacred
>on a Somali slave trade board full of self hating niggers
>>79086407
No you are definitely wrong about that one mate.
>>79060986
Pro choice, but only in extreme circumstances like horrible birth defects in the child, rape, and well that's pretty much it.
Abortion isn't to be used as a form of contraception. It can be a dangerous medical procedure with many down falls physically, and mentally.
Put them up for adoption if you don't want them, or don't be stupid enough to get pregnant in the first place.
Pro life? Pro choice?
I'm neutral. I condemn anyone that has an abortion but I don't advocate making it illegal.
>>79062280
At what stage does it have consciousness, though?
We pull the plug on people in vegetative states because they aren't actually experiencing anything, they're just empty shells with beating hearts.
Why is it wrong to kill something that has no real existence?
>>79060986
I'm pro-choice but abortion shouldn't be treated as a form of contraception.
Pro Life except in cases of rape or when a life is in danger.
For multiple reasons. I believe Humans are special and should be valued. And I want my race to survive, and most people who abort their kids are white.
>>79086582
Then explain how I am wrong? There's a full 3 months when an unborn baby could live outside the mother. Shit, there are cases where women get induced to abort and the baby fuckin lives and gets adopted. On top of that, are you positive there will never be technological changes that allow life outside the womb further?
I'm most certainly not wrong. How do you think pregnancy works? You think the baby comes out as soon as it can live on its own and no later? The hell are they teaching you kids today?
>>79087130
Black women are five times more likely to abort than white women in the usa
>majority of abortions are done on nigger women and spics
>the overwhelming majority of white abortions are done for Democrat voting women who would have otherwise raised up more shitty liberals
I cannot find myself believing abortion is bad because my enemies are the ones who make the most use of it. Literally the only ones I see defending it are god-squadders who hold the Bible as more important than the Constitution.
>>79060986
>abortion is thoughtful
What does that say about her? It says that she's on such a low tier, that murdering her children was was a better choice for them, than raising them.
Ironically, this women's rights activist (which are human rights!) has proven that modern feminism is only for the lowest human scum.
>>79060986
Pro choice but only for the first trimester, after that they should be charged with murder.
pro-choice
[spoiler]for fathers[/spoiler]
>>79060986
Pro-life because murder is murder. Also, the pagan Romans rightly or wrongly accused Carthage of child sacrifice as a way to delegitimize them and as another pretext for war with them. Today, it's our highest value. (((Cultural Marxism)))at work.
>>79060986
Yes, goys!! Kill your offspring!! It is your right! Yes!!
>>79087237
You are claiming that just because you could hypothetically in the future develop technology to remove fetuses (safely) they are equal to a toddler
More to the point you are trying to make the comparison between fetus and toddler valid by claiming that they can be transplanted in the same way which is obviously not true but even if it were, they dont consume resources in the same way so its moot.
>>79062392
>rape is fucking horrible
A lot of rape victims orgasm during the "traumatic" event. Some admit that they liked it. Others, still, will consider marital rape a thing, or even worse, trivialize rape until touching a drunk slut's leg is considered Hitler-tier.
I was "raped" when I was a kid. I don't really remember it now, and feel no trauma about it. The gravity of rape is exaggerated. Go back to Tumblr.
>>79061965
Literally this.
/thread
>>79061329
if the flag wasn't there I'd still know this was American.
>>79064511
>Red Skull: The Early Years
>>79060986
Condomless sex? No
Life or death? Up to the mother
Rape? The child should be given birth, but society is to raise the child and not for the rape survivor to raise it since society hasn't put a stop to rape.
Birth defects? Child should be frozen until a cure has been created then thawed and cured.
Pro-choice
--> Because childbirth is exclusively a woman's natural right. It's ethically wrong to take away rights, especially natural rights from anyone without exceptionally good cause
--> Because it's a right protected by the U.S.Constitution. I'm a true patriot. I'm not one of you traitors who claims he respects the Constitution then tries to gut it or wipes his ass with it.
--> Because when states dictate childbirth it's fucked up. Hitler outlawed abortion. Stalin outlawed abortion. Mao outlawed abortion. Now China forces women to have abortions. It's the kind of thing you expect from tyrants and despots. Only communists want the state to control abortion.
--> Because when a woman's right to decide for herself to bear a child is respected, it's a sign that true personal liberty is valued by society.
>>79088351
Only if your criteria is whether or not they are "entirely dependent on the mother". This is the case given the criteria you outlined. And that's only half my point.
The hell isn't true about babies born preterm? You are saying, a fetus the day or a week or a month before it's born isn't a person. I'm trying to figure out why you think they aren't a person because the reality is that they are not so different from a newborn infant.
You're either trolling, or a dumbass, honestly. Unless you're going to put together a reasonable response that's logically sound, don't bother responding.
We keep going around and I keep outlining why your definition of personhood encompasses entities you claim aren't people, and rather than ackowlwdge what I'm saying you either deny reality or keep your circular logic.
Jesus, all you've done is further convince me that there aren't any reasonable arguments that fetuses aren't people, and everyone who thinks so is clearly as unreasonable as yourself.
>>79060986
Well, she's likely to be going through a third if I have anything to do with it.
I'm pro-abortion. Fuck unwanted kids.
>>79060986
Pro-life.
Only dumbasses support abortion because it enables corruption and urbanism. Population growth is the only thing that can force urban areas to grow and change. When you start killing kids in order to get a "better population", all you're really doing is killing children so that you can also fuck over the few that survive. Moscow and other big cities are what you get with abortion: corruption and decay.
Also, quit shillling these threads daily you faggot urbanite.
>>79085021
>My wife and I are pumping out as many kids as biologically possible as well as foster parenting. Trying to setup humanity's future as best we can. Feel free to let your genes and ideologies be surpassed by mine in future generations though.
Yes, you and every other degenerate shitskin on the planet.
I would rather produce and raise one or two worthwhile human beings than a dozen crackheads because "MUH DICK GENES".
>>79060986
L U R K
M O A R
>>79090817
We're white, redpilled, make decent money, and have a solid support network. I think my kids have a pretty good shot.
>>79090465
I feel like you are only really reading half of what I am saying and filling in the gaps yourself.
You were asking to differentiate newborns and fetuses dependency on the mother is the difference. Both in method and difficulty if you are going to argue transplants.
>>79090817
which is why your bloodline will die out
>implying your kids won't be gay or convinced their gay
>>79060986
Don't care.
>>79060986
Prolife for Whites
Prochoice for non-whites
>>79091418
>>79091577
>implying all 12 dozen of your bastards won't end up in jail and/or shot
>implying my two properly raised children won't go on to have stable families while representing yours in a courtroom
>>79091513
Right, because you're hardly saying anything, and also because there's edge cases you aren't covering.
You're entirely wrong about dependency on the mother. See earlier comments on failed abortions, newborns, surrogacy. You'd know this if you had a kid... or thought about it for more than 5 seconds. Method and difficulty are moving targets, and difficulty is subjective. Not a reasonable response.
>>79060986
Abortion is basically socially-accepted eugenics.
I have no strong stance on this subject but I do believe something is morally wrong when you need to use different terms instead of calling it by its name "abortion", if you're pro-choice.
>Women's right to choose over her own body
>Reproductive rights
>Women's health
>Family planning
All names for killing a baby.
On the other side I think most people that abort, are trash that shouldn't have children at all anyway.
>>79092021
>implying if they don't have a Mexican sounding last name, they'll be alright
>implying white privilege meme is just a fad
you're already doomed because you can only afford to raise 1-2 kids
>>79092673
I guess you cant convince me there is no difference between a newborn and a fetus then.
>>79060986
Jesus Christ, she ages like a fucking banana.
>>79093177
I appreciate your responses.
The difference being where they are located... take a 39week fetus, fully capable of thought, eating, breathing, etc, it's in a woman. You're saying not a person, because it's dependent on the mother.
Take that identical fetus, put it on the floor of my living room. You're saying this is somehow less dependent on the mother despite being physically identical to the aforementioned fetus, with the only difference being where it is located.
Why it's the location the determining factor? This doesn't impact dependency at all. I don't understand how you can't say it's the same thing when it is quite literally the same thing. If this is the case for your reasoning, I don't find it compelling at all, and neither should you.
