https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/06/19/guns-in-america-for-every-criminal-killed-in-self-defense-34-innocent-people-die/
Is there a rebuttal?
>>79043743
Yeah. Not all instances of guns used for self-defense end with a shot criminal.
Sounds like a bullshit statistic to me
>>79043743
Niggers
>>79043743
illegal gun owners commit the most murder
>>79043743
>(((WASHINGTON POST)))
>(((WASHINGTON POST)))
>(((WASHINGTON POST)))
>(((WASHINGTON POST)))
Niggers on the corner getting shot are not innocent.
I thought this was obvious.
>>79043743
>Is there a rebuttal?
1 person alive and 34 people dead is better than 35 people dead.
Take away the guns.
Now it's 35 people dead.
>>79043743
So the people whose right to defend themselves they want to diminish actually use their weapons less deadly than criminals? Astounding.
Also do the innocent people include those who commit suicide?
>>79043743
>Any rebuttal?
Blacks aren't people.
>>79043743
>let's take flesh and blood people capable of being there own guiding lights, round them into numbers, and divide them by averages
>implying they care about people
Stats are not human experience
I hate this planet
>>79043743
Definitely. The number of dead criminals would be higher if upstanding citizens would exercise their 2nd amendment right..
Dont be so fucking retarded..
>>79043743
The fact that there are more suicides than homicides indicates something else to me
>>79043743
For every drunk that dies in a single vehicle accident thousands of other innocent men women and children die in drunk driver caused accidents
#BanAssaultBeers
>>79043743
Yeah - tell them to remove suicides from their statistics.
>implying suicides are innocent
>>79043743
This article is fucking kek.
Only a "justifiable homicide" counts as a firearm being used to stop a criminal.
Don't mention how many criminals get shot, treated for wounds, and survive. Or how many are simply stopped by the presentation of an armed threat.
How many CC vids show store owners pulling out a gun, were the criminals don't try to flee?
>if the one dude that defended himself didn't have a gun, those 34 people would still be alive
>>79043743
Yeah, give everyone a gun and and allow them to open carry. That number changes to 2:1
>>79043743
They certainly were innocent of possessing firearms to defend their lives.
>>79043743
The majority of defensive gun uses do not result in any shots being fired at all, and even when the criminal is shot, he often survives.
>>79043743
Who killed those 34 people? Were they criminals or victims? Were their deaths suicide or crime? If they had a gun could they have saved themselves? Answer my questions and I will answer yours.
>>79045874
1 post by OP sage and hide thread this is bait and OP is a shill faggot.
>>79043920
>>79044106
thats a wrap boys. pack it in.
>innocent lives lost
>implying suicide isn't a crime
>>79043743
How are 34 people dying a justification to remove the 1 person's ability to defend themselves?
>>79043743
SHALL
NOT
BE
INFRINGED
also,
>1 post by this ID
fuck off shit head
ONE
N
E
POST
O
S
T
BY
Y
THIS
H
I
S
ID
D
>>79043743
I don't think so OP. You've posted an article from the Washington Post. As a result you've set a few things in motion:
1. /pol/ has been BTFO
2. you really made me think
3. /pol/ and I will never recover
4. i'm pondering how white man can even compare
5. i've given up my affinity for Trump and am now #ShillforHill
>>79043920
FPBP
Most gunshot wounds in self defense aren't fatal as well
>counting suicides
TOP JEJ
Yo what's up anons
I didn't mean this post as /pol/ BTFO thing
I'm pro gun
I just want to hear what you guys have to say
>>79043743
>innocent
That's not what you would call gang members.
>>79046951
They're counting suicides as if the gun told people to shoot themselves. If guns were evil and made people want to kill themselves then the US would have one of the highest suicides rates in the world, which it doesn't.
Why do gun control fags even live here? If you want to live in a gun free country move someplace where the right to have a gun isn't protected by the country's constitution.
most crimes prevented you can't even record because criminal decided not to perform it.
>>79047092
did you not see pic related
they're explicitly discounting suicides
>>79043743
>for-every-criminal-killed
since when is killing the criminal the only way to stop them?
fucking blatant disinformation
Yeah, there's a good rebuttal.
*ahem*
SHALL
>>79043743
300,000 self-defense uses per year
~32,000 actual gun deaths per year
~60% are suicides
~7,000 actual gun homicides per year
~80% are gang-related
Washingberg Post is essentially arguing guns don't work for self-defense because we don't just shoot niggers on sight.
>>79043743
>Is there a rebuttal?
It is my right to own and carry, that is the only explanation I need and the only one you are entitled to.
Any other considerations or points raised are made null by this fact.
>>79047866
can i get a source on that?
Still no correlation between gun ownership and homicide.
>Is there a rebuttal?
All gang related shootings are totally innocent.
He dindu muffin. He a good boy.
http://content.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,149199,00.html
>>79043743
This isn't true. There are more reliable statistics, I.E. not from the biased washington post, showing that guns are used 30-40 times more often for self-defense than to kill an innocent person. One study even showed that they were used 80 times more often for self-defense.
You can create a statistic for anything you want. If someone wanted to prove that the moon was made entirely 100% from cheese, they would go put a piece of cheese on the moon, then they would cherrypick that .000000001% of the moon's surface that has cheese on it, then they would come back to earth and go "WELL THERE YA GO EVERYONE THE MOON IS MADE OF CHEESE, THIS IS SCIENCE".
This doesn't mean all statistics are garbage, but you need to get your information from a source that goes by the scientific method, and isn't just looking for the solution they want to find.
>>79047652
My freedom loving brother
Theres about 40 posters itt.
So i'll volunteer to die for you guys.
>>79048013
Also, FBI crime stats are public domain and you can browse them
>>79048013
That was actually the wrong infographic. Oh well, still useful. Here's the one I meant to post
>>79043743
The vast majority of self defensive gun usage is "brandishment" or just showing that you have a gun, not to mention the instances where the gun is fired but nobody is killed.
This is taking like 1/10th of all self-defensive uses and acting like it's the complete picture.
>>79043743
>1 in 35 innocent people is successfully able to defend themselves
>wants to make it zero instead
Kill yourself.
>>79043920
34 people need to git gud
>>79043743
The 34 innocents were killed by criminals that were NOT shot and killed in self defence.
>>79047424
So, you really think criminals would not break the law to get a gun?
>>79043743
>34 innocent people die
>innocent
>>79043743
Niggers are not innocent.
>>79049168
this, desupai.
32/34 of those murders are lequan shootin trayboone for control over some shitty drug corner in balitmore
>tfw the wire is real
>>79043743
Of those 34, how many are suicides and how many are nigger thugs killing other nigger thugs?
>murder happens a lot so self-defense is worthless
Really makes you think..............
>>79048591
thanks anon
>>79043920
>tried telling this to a female on kikebook one time
>completely ignores the response and says "when does the right to life become more important than the right to own assault rifles"
and thats whi i dont comment on normiebook anymore
you can use the same argument for automobiles
also the problem can be solved with firearm education
Pretty sure that the minimum estimatrd number of self defense with a gun instances is about 1 million a year
>>79043920
I'm all for gun rights, but the comparison in the OP is, in this respect at least, a valid one. It's true that not all uses of a gun in self-defense end with a dead criminal, but the same could be said for uses of a gun in a crime.
>>79050179
You have to realize they're not counting any kind of non-lethal self defense in those stats.
>>79050179
the absolute smallest estimate from extremely anti-gun sources is about 50k per year. still far more than annual gun homicides.
>>79044506
>>79046220
>>79046639
>>79047092
As >>79047424 already pointed out, they haven't counted suicides. I guess you can't expect people on /pol/ to read.
>>79050257
They're also not counting non-lethal gun crimes.
>>79043743
Does it include suicides as part of the """"innocent victims""""?
>>79050879
Are there reliable stats tracking gun involvement in crimes other than murders?
>>79043743
Remember innocent before proven guilty means:
>If a police officer shoots and kills a suspect, that person is still counted as "innocent" as they weren't found guilty under a court of law.
STATISTICS. ARE. EASILY. MANIPULATED.
>>79051196
I don't know, but does it make sense to compare all gun self-defense with only lethal gun crime?
>>79050879
is there any evidence that these crimes wouldnt have taken place if firearms werent available? is there any evidence that these firearms were legally obtained before used in a crime? no? then what good would more gun control have done to prevent them?
>>79047424
Why even count the suicides at all except for fear mongering?
What does the MEANS of suicide matter?
Should we ban rope? razor blades? Tylenol and vodka? High buildings? Cars and garages? Fucker wants to off himself, that's a shame, but the weapon of choice is hardly responsible.
>>79051323
Sure, because the point is showing that guns have a use in preventing people from being hurt or killed.
>>79050003
I bet she supports abortion.
>>79051324
>>79051596
I'm not for gun control, guys. I'm for proper use of statistics.
If you only care about "showing guns have a use in preventing people from being hurt or killed," then there's no comparison to be made, you only need the self-defense statistics.
The author of the article is way off base in his claim that "the data suggest that overall, guns are used far more often for killing than self-defense," and his opinion on gun control is terrible, but I don't think the data itself or the comparison he's making are incorrect.
>>79044424
Stats are a sum of human experiences.
>>79043743
That makes sense. Law-abiding citizens don't go killing people needlessly.
>>79047424
That just means MORE people should be defending themselves.
The one defensive use doesn't have anything to do with the 34 criminal uses. It's not like the 1 defensive use CAUSED the 34 criminal uses. If anything it means we need MORE guns to lower the criminal homicides.
>>79052226
The subset of data is probably not incorrect but I don't see how the comparison is accurate, given that its only purpose is to try to support his point that you've said is off base.
>>79043743
And I'm sure those who died wish they had a gun to defend themselves with.
And how the fuck do you count stopped mass shootings?
Like the Über driver who stopped on in Chicago? Do you only count the Über driver or the innumerable amount of people the madman could have shot and killed?
>>79043743
Actually.
Blacks commit 60% of all murders
And 89% of black murders are black on black.
That means 53% of all murders in the US are black on black.
>>79043743
I
DON'T
CARE
